Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Bill Davidsen]

jdow wrote:

From: "Tim" 
Sent: Friday, 2009/December/25 18:28


Tim:

There are drivers to read ext3 on Windows.  If you use both systems,
you'll have to weigh up which is the most convenient.  Native file
systems on Linux, which supports your normal permissions and
ownership file details.  Or a pathetic-featured file system that
can be easily read by many different systems.



Antonio Olivares:


or a pathetic-featured file system that can be easily read by many
different systems.

 
I like this quote, but I have seen systems which this is not TRUE :(,

I help my students clean out their windows machines, and they had to
force shutdown(Pressing and holding power button, machine was not
responding had AV virus/spyware/trojan(you name it) ) and the NTFS
partition was cleanly unmounted and therefore not easily read :(


I have to point out that the /quite universal pathetic file system/ is
FAT, not NTFS.  Though both seem designed to support the:

  Windows deniable plausibility error:
  I cannot recall the contents of that file.

There are a great many number of systems, that one way or another, can
easily work with the FAT file system.  NTFS support is still limited.


There is a reason that FAT became the standard for flash memory drives
rather than the others. It writes to the drive one heck of a lot less
often than NTFX or ext(whatever). This can be important on a device with
lifetime write limitations.

You are exactly correct. Which is why I usually use either ext2 or put the 
journal file on another file system.


--
Bill Davidsen 
  "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from
the machinations of the wicked."  - from Slashdot

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB - jdow is back

[Robert G. (Doc) Savage]

On Fri, 2009-12-25 at 18:08 -0600, Aaron Konstam wrote:
> On Fri, 2009-12-25 at 15:28 -0800, jdow wrote:
> > Bleah - on the Amiga we were formatting them ourselves for real
> > operating systems. We even had a tool for low level formatting the
> > drives - any SCSI drive, actually.
> > 
> > {^_-}
> > 
> 
> [OT} Just today I was ruminating about what ever happened to jdow. And
> suddenly she appears.

I'll second that. Glad to see you back on the air Joanne. It's been "a
while."

--Doc Savage
  Fairview Heights, IL

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[jdow]

From: "Tim" 
Sent: Friday, 2009/December/25 18:28


Tim:

There are drivers to read ext3 on Windows.  If you use both systems,
you'll have to weigh up which is the most convenient.  Native file
systems on Linux, which supports your normal permissions and
ownership file details.  Or a pathetic-featured file system that
can be easily read by many different systems.



Antonio Olivares:


or a pathetic-featured file system that can be easily read by many
different systems.

 
I like this quote, but I have seen systems which this is not TRUE :(,

I help my students clean out their windows machines, and they had to
force shutdown(Pressing and holding power button, machine was not
responding had AV virus/spyware/trojan(you name it) ) and the NTFS
partition was cleanly unmounted and therefore not easily read :(


I have to point out that the /quite universal pathetic file system/ is
FAT, not NTFS.  Though both seem designed to support the:

  Windows deniable plausibility error:
  I cannot recall the contents of that file.

There are a great many number of systems, that one way or another, can
easily work with the FAT file system.  NTFS support is still limited.


There is a reason that FAT became the standard for flash memory drives
rather than the others. It writes to the drive one heck of a lot less
often than NTFX or ext(whatever). This can be important on a device with
lifetime write limitations.

{^_^}

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Matthew Saltzman]

On Fri, 2009-12-25 at 15:27 -0800, jdow wrote: 
> From: "TNWestTex" 
> Sent: Tuesday, 2009/December/22 13:16
> >
> >
> >
> > Steven Ringwald-3 wrote:
> >>
> >> On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:
> >>> My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
> >>> you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
> >>> What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
> >>> for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
> >>> remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
> >>> table.)
> >>
> >>> I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
> >>> drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
> >>> nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
> >>> still have a couple in storage somewhere...
> >>
> >>>
> >>> I believe you are talking about the IoMega Jaz drive...
> >>
> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iomega_Jaz
> >>
> >
> > Jaz at 1G was a latecomer, Iomega Bernoulli at 44M. several years before 
> > Zip
> > drives.

Concurrent with Jaz drives were 1.5 GB SyQuest SyJet drives.  Superior
technology, IIRC, bigger, faster, more reliable than Jaz.  I just took
one out of service in a home machine, though I haven't really used it in
quite a while.

> >
> > Robert McBroom
> 
> And they tripped an interesting chip bug in the Adaptec SCSI chips
> that we were using for the Microbotics hard disk controller for Amigas.
> That was a bastard to track down until somebody smuggled to me the
> Adaptec internal bugs tradeoff sheet for Rev C, D, and E of that chip.
> No, none of them had "no bugs". It was a tradeoff.
> 
> (Otherwise, at the time, that controller and some nice 300 Meg SCSI
> drives from a now defunct manufacturer in The Valley (San Fernando)
> made for the fastest read and write times on disk tests that anybody
> had published for ANY machine mortals could afford.)
> 
> {^_^}   (Yeah, I'm THAT Joanne Dow.)

Hi, Joanne--haven't seen you around in a while 8^).

-- 
Matthew Saltzman

Clemson University Math Sciences
mjs AT clemson DOT edu
http://www.math.clemson.edu/~mjs

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Tim]

Tim:
>> There are drivers to read ext3 on Windows.  If you use both systems,
>> you'll have to weigh up which is the most convenient.  Native file
>> systems on Linux, which supports your normal permissions and
>> ownership file details.  Or a pathetic-featured file system that
>> can be easily read by many different systems.


Antonio Olivares:
> 
> or a pathetic-featured file system that can be easily read by many
> different systems.
> 
>  
> I like this quote, but I have seen systems which this is not TRUE :(,
> I help my students clean out their windows machines, and they had to
> force shutdown(Pressing and holding power button, machine was not
> responding had AV virus/spyware/trojan(you name it) ) and the NTFS
> partition was cleanly unmounted and therefore not easily read :(

I have to point out that the /quite universal pathetic file system/ is
FAT, not NTFS.  Though both seem designed to support the:

   Windows deniable plausibility error:
   I cannot recall the contents of that file.

There are a great many number of systems, that one way or another, can
easily work with the FAT file system.  NTFS support is still limited.

And a seasoned greeting (I think I'll use oregano) back to you.  ;-)

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read messages from the public lists.



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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 25 December 2009, jdow wrote:
>From: "TNWestTex" 
>Sent: Tuesday, 2009/December/22 13:16
>
>> Steven Ringwald-3 wrote:
>>> On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:
 My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
 you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
 What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
 for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
 remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
 table.)

 I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
 drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
 nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
 still have a couple in storage somewhere...


 I believe you are talking about the IoMega Jaz drive...
>>>
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iomega_Jaz
>>
>> Jaz at 1G was a latecomer, Iomega Bernoulli at 44M. several years before
>> Zip
>> drives.
>>
>> Robert McBroom
>
>And they tripped an interesting chip bug in the Adaptec SCSI chips
>that we were using for the Microbotics hard disk controller for Amigas.
>That was a bastard to track down until somebody smuggled to me the
>Adaptec internal bugs tradeoff sheet for Rev C, D, and E of that chip.
>No, none of them had "no bugs". It was a tradeoff.
>
>(Otherwise, at the time, that controller and some nice 300 Meg SCSI
>drives from a now defunct manufacturer in The Valley (San Fernando)
>made for the fastest read and write times on disk tests that anybody
>had published for ANY machine mortals could afford.)
>
>{^_^}   (Yeah, I'm THAT Joanne Dow.)
>
How about the Trumpcard scsi controllers that had the terminators soldered in 
correctly, but the board traces actually made them backwards, with the 220 
ohmers tied to ground, and the 330's to 5 volts?  I cut the power & ground 
traces on 2 of them and reversed them with wire-wrapping wire.  Two slightly 
different models of that card, both had the same layout mistakes in the 
copper.

I think you may have enjoyed the conversation I had with the trumpcard folks, 
who were more lawyers than techs.  The nerve of me, finding fault with one of 
their products. That was the wrong thing to say, and nothing could prevent 
that from pulling my trigger.  Even you may have learned a new word or 
genealogy reference from that one.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)

If the shoe fits, it's ugly.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB - jdow is back

[Aaron Konstam]

On Fri, 2009-12-25 at 15:28 -0800, jdow wrote:
> From: "Robert Nichols" 
> Sent: Tuesday, 2009/December/22 16:37
> 
> 
> > Mikkel wrote:
> >> On 12/21/2009 03:13 PM, Robert Nichols wrote:
> >>> Mikkel wrote:
>  Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
>  what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
>  has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
>  (Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
>  is another story.
> >>> Putting a filesystem on the entire, unpartitioned device is referred
> >>> to as "super floppy" or "superfloppy" format.  It's been around, and
> >>> supported, since the days of ZIP disks.
> >>>
> >> My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
> >> you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
> >> What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
> >> for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
> >> remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
> >> table.)
> > 
> > Probably true.  When I was looking for references to "super floppy"
> > format (formatting a larger drive in the manner of a floppy disk,
> > i.e. without partitioning) that came up as the time that term became
> > widely used.  Heck, I'm surprised I even recalled the name.
> 
> Bleah - on the Amiga we were formatting them ourselves for real
> operating systems. We even had a tool for low level formatting the
> drives - any SCSI drive, actually.
> 
> {^_-}
> 

[OT} Just today I was ruminating about what ever happened to jdow. And
suddenly she appears.
--
===
"Been through Hell? Whaddya bring back for me?" -- A. Brilliant
===
Aaron Konstam telephone: (210) 656-0355 e-mail: akons...@sbcglobal.net

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[jdow]

From: "Robert Nichols" 
Sent: Tuesday, 2009/December/22 16:37



Mikkel wrote:

On 12/21/2009 03:13 PM, Robert Nichols wrote:

Mikkel wrote:

Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
(Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
is another story.

Putting a filesystem on the entire, unpartitioned device is referred
to as "super floppy" or "superfloppy" format.  It's been around, and
supported, since the days of ZIP disks.


My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
table.)


Probably true.  When I was looking for references to "super floppy"
format (formatting a larger drive in the manner of a floppy disk,
i.e. without partitioning) that came up as the time that term became
widely used.  Heck, I'm surprised I even recalled the name.


Bleah - on the Amiga we were formatting them ourselves for real
operating systems. We even had a tool for low level formatting the
drives - any SCSI drive, actually.

{^_-}

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[jdow]

From: "TNWestTex" 
Sent: Tuesday, 2009/December/22 13:16




Steven Ringwald-3 wrote:


On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:

My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
table.)



I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
still have a couple in storage somewhere...




I believe you are talking about the IoMega Jaz drive...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iomega_Jaz



Jaz at 1G was a latecomer, Iomega Bernoulli at 44M. several years before 
Zip

drives.

Robert McBroom


And they tripped an interesting chip bug in the Adaptec SCSI chips
that we were using for the Microbotics hard disk controller for Amigas.
That was a bastard to track down until somebody smuggled to me the
Adaptec internal bugs tradeoff sheet for Rev C, D, and E of that chip.
No, none of them had "no bugs". It was a tradeoff.

(Otherwise, at the time, that controller and some nice 300 Meg SCSI
drives from a now defunct manufacturer in The Valley (San Fernando)
made for the fastest read and write times on disk tests that anybody
had published for ANY machine mortals could afford.)

{^_^}   (Yeah, I'm THAT Joanne Dow.) 


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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[jdow]

From: "Steven Ringwald" 
Sent: Monday, 2009/December/21 18:02



On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:

My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
table.)



I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
still have a couple in storage somewhere...




I believe you are talking about the IoMega Jaz drive...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iomega_Jaz

Steve


My faves from my Amiga days was the 3.5" Fujitsu Magneto Optical beasties.
They were hard sectored at 2048 bytes per sector for the large capacity
disks.

I had to hack the kernel some years ago to enable it to read these disks
(and the AmigaDOS AFS or SFS partitioning.)

Those babies were far nicer than any of the IOmega "stuff". (Yeah, we
have one of those around, too. For some of them we need a BeOs filesystem
to read them.  And, yes, we still have live Amigas and live BeBoxen
around here.)

{^_^}

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Antonio Olivares]

--- On Mon, 12/21/09, Tim  wrote:

> From: Tim 
> Subject: Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB
> To: "Community assistance, encouragement, and advice for using Fedora." 
> 
> Date: Monday, December 21, 2009, 5:10 AM
> Marcel Rieux
> >> OTOH, when I formatted, I wasn't so sure that ext3
> was much use on a
> >> USB drive. I still don't know.
>  
> Aaron Konstam:
> > In it is not muh use if you ever want to put it in a
> Wiindws machine.
> 
> There are drivers to read ext3 on Windows.  If you use
> both systems,
> you'll have to weigh up which is the most convenient. 
> Native file
> systems on Linux, which supports your normal permissions
> and ownership
> file details.  Or a pathetic-featured file system that
> can be easily
> read by many different systems.
> 
> -- 

This message was sent Monday, December 21, 2009 5:10 AM, kept the headers 
intact.  Today is December 25, 2009, Merry Christmas to all and to all a good 
late fedora list reply :)


or a pathetic-featured file system that can be easily read by many different 
systems.


I like this quote, but I have seen systems which this is not TRUE :(, I help  
my students clean out their windows machines, and they had to force 
shutdown(Pressing and holding power button, machine was not responding had AV 
virus/spyware/trojan(you name it) ) and the NTFS partition was cleanly 
unmounted and therefore not easily read :(

But I still like your quote :)

Regards,

Antonio 



  

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Robert Nichols]

Mikkel wrote:

On 12/21/2009 03:13 PM, Robert Nichols wrote:

Mikkel wrote:

Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
(Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
is another story.

Putting a filesystem on the entire, unpartitioned device is referred
to as "super floppy" or "superfloppy" format.  It's been around, and
supported, since the days of ZIP disks.


My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
table.)


Probably true.  When I was looking for references to "super floppy"
format (formatting a larger drive in the manner of a floppy disk,
i.e. without partitioning) that came up as the time that term became
widely used.  Heck, I'm surprised I even recalled the name.

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Do NOT delete it.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[TNWestTex]

Steven Ringwald-3 wrote:
> 
> On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:
>> My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
>> you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
>> What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
>> for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
>> remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
>> table.)
> 
>> I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
>> drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
>> nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
>> still have a couple in storage somewhere...
> 
>>
>> I believe you are talking about the IoMega Jaz drive...
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iomega_Jaz
> 

Jaz at 1G was a latecomer, Iomega Bernoulli at 44M. several years before Zip
drives.

Robert McBroom

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Sent from the Fedora List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Steven Ringwald]

On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:
> My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
> you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
> What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
> for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
> remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
> table.)

> I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
> drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
> nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
> still have a couple in storage somewhere...

>
> I believe you are talking about the IoMega Jaz drive...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iomega_Jaz

Steve
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Tim]

On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 23:26 +0100, Björn Persson wrote:
> File permissions are rarely useful on a removable disk that anyone can
> plug into their own computer where they are root. One exception is if
> you use it for backups, in which case ext3 on the removable disk
> preserves the permissions although it can't enforce them.

Keeping ownership, permissions, and contexts, is useful for simple
back-ups.  And avoids the usual problem with FAT stored files, where
everything becomes executable.  Keeping ownership is also useful to
protect against accidents when a removeable drive is moved around boxes,
and several users use it.  Sure, root can mangle anything, but it makes
it harder for the wrong user to stuff up the wrong personal files.

Simple FAT storage losing ownership is useful for transferring file from
box to box, where user "tim" has different UIDs from one box to the
next.  That's a situation I try to avoid, but other people repeatedly
get snagged on, as they recreate users on a new box, but in a different
order.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Tim]

On Mon, 2009-12-21 at 15:29 -0600, Mikkel wrote:
> My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
> you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
> What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
> for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
> remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
> table.)

Pre-formatted Mac Zip discs had the Mac filing system on them.  But I
rarely saw them on sale, so users probably bought Windows preformatted
ones, and went with it, or reformatted them.

I imagine using partition 4 was so that it wasn't a primary partition,
and would get a drive letter after your existing primary partitions, so
not to shuffle important drive letters about.  Gawd, but I'm so glad I
don't have to deal with that crap ever again, though Linux's drive
renumbering is almost as bad.  At least it's only a one-time set-up
problem, not an ongoing problem - once mounted on the tree, applications
don't care what the drive actually is.  Compared to Windows, where it
can be a right pain to have to deal with a drive being E today, F
tomorrow, E later on...
> 
> I also remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP
> drives, but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have
> nearly as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I
> still have a couple in storage somewhere...

And do you still have punch cards being used as bookmarks?  ;-)  I found
a few more of mine earlier this year.  Haven't managed to find a
pristine one, though.  Hmm, maybe I should get some calling cards made
up that have that design to them.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Björn Persson]

Mikkel wrote:
> You can format a drive without a partition table, and still
> format/use it. I am not sure if it would get automatically mounted,
> but it does work.

I've got a USB stick here that was sold with a PDF book on it. To my surprise 
it had no partition table, just a FAT32 filesystem directly on the device. 
Fedora automounts it just fine, and Windows too.

Björn Persson


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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Björn Persson]

Tim wrote:
> There are drivers to read ext3 on Windows.  If you use both systems,
> you'll have to weigh up which is the most convenient.  Native file
> systems on Linux, which supports your normal permissions and ownership
> file details.  Or a pathetic-featured file system that can be easily
> read by many different systems.

File permissions are rarely useful on a removable disk that anyone can plug 
into their own computer where they are root. One exception is if you use it 
for backups, in which case ext3 on the removable disk preserves the 
permissions although it can't enforce them.

Björn Persson


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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/21/2009 03:13 PM, Robert Nichols wrote:
> Mikkel wrote:
>> Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
>> what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
>> has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
>> (Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
>> is another story.
> 
> Putting a filesystem on the entire, unpartitioned device is referred
> to as "super floppy" or "superfloppy" format.  It's been around, and
> supported, since the days of ZIP disks.
> 
My experience with ZIP disks was that if they came formatted, or if
you used the Omega formatting tools, they always had one partition.
What partition was an indication of what system they were formatted
for. Windows was partition 4, Linux was partition 1, and I don't
remember what MAC used. (It might not have used a DOS-type partition
table.)

I am not sure how far back the ability goes, but I suspect you could
do the same thing with the disk packs attached to mainframes. I also
remember removable platter SCSI drives that pre-dated ZIP drives,
but I can not remember what they were called. The didn't have nearly
as much capacity, and the cartridges were larger. I think I still
have a couple in storage somewhere... (I really NEED to clean house!!!)

Mikkel
-- 

  Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons,
for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup!



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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Robert Nichols]

Mikkel wrote:

On 12/20/2009 09:00 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:

You're right, my hasty extrapolations were wrong. But I don't believe
you can get a Flash drive working that will be listed only as /dev/sdb
any more than you can have a HD working with only /dev/sda. I have no
idea about arrays, I'm talking about standard desktops with one drive.


Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
(Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
is another story.


Putting a filesystem on the entire, unpartitioned device is referred
to as "super floppy" or "superfloppy" format.  It's been around, and
supported, since the days of ZIP disks.

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Do NOT delete it.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Bill Davidsen]

Marcel Rieux wrote:

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 9:40 PM, Bill Davidsen 

If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.


Whatever gave you that idea?


As I said, I right clicked on the drive, chose Format and now there's
an sdb1 partition and no other. I never created it otherwise.

I assume "right click" implies you did this with some GUI tool which did what it 
thought you should do instead of what you asked it to do. I have no experience 
using such, and what experience I have with others using them is only when 
people ask "what did this do?" When it works I don't hear about it. ;-)


Can't really help with GUI tools, sorry.


A file system is on a device, partitions are devices too. Try "ls -l
/dev/sda*" and look at the first letter, all block devices.


You're right, my hasty extrapolations were wrong. But I don't believe
you can get a Flash drive working that will be listed only as /dev/sdb
any more than you can have a HD working with only /dev/sda. I have no
idea about arrays, I'm talking about standard desktops with one drive.

Or, so do I think, cause I've always created  / and /home partitions with Linux.


As I'm sure others will tell you, sure you can.
  mke2fs /dev/sdb
  {tell it yes, do what you asked}
  mkdir -p /tmp/sdb && mount /dev/sdb /tmp/sdb
  df

--
Bill Davidsen 
  "We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from
the machinations of the wicked."  - from Slashdot

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Bill Davidsen]

Marcel Rieux wrote:

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 8:36 PM, Mikkel  wrote:

On 12/20/2009 06:46 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:

If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.


You can format a drive without a partition table, and still
format/use it. I am not sure if it would get automatically mounted,
but it does work. A partition table, and partition will NOT be
created for you. Also, you can have a drive with one partition
without that partition being partition 1. ZIP disks were famous for
this. For a log time, DOS formatted ZIP disks used partition 4.


The man page does say:

e2fsck - check a Linux ext2/ext3/ext4 file system

A file system is not a device. So, the filesystem -- here sdb1 -- must
be specified.


Note: I answered Bill Davidsen first.


You
can use an entire drive, or a partition on a drive, as a tar
archive. (tar -cvf /dev/sdb /home/mikkel)


Then, I have no idea where the /sdb1 partition comes from. I also have
a lost and found directory on that drive.

A thumb drive comes with a single partition, and reformatting that partition as 
ext3 still leaves the partition table intact. The operative word in what I wrote 
is "can" do it either way, what you have is fine, but if you had no partitions 
that wouldn't mean that the drive was unusable.


Since the mount point is "BK" it's likely that somehow you used that as a label 
for putting the ext filesystem on the partition.


As for using the whole drive to hold a tar:
  tar cf /dev/sda /home
works, although
  tar cf - /home | gzip -8 >/dev/sda
lets you put more on the media. I would not guess if the CPU time to compress is 
more or less than the write time for the uncompressed data.


Since you have room for everything, I would suggest that rsync is a good 
solution, it will back up only what changes. Archives are nice but you are 
likely to want to pull an individual file out from time to time.



Here's an ls:


ls -al /media/BK/
total 208
drwx--.  5 marcel marcel   4096 2009-12-20 20:58 .
drwxr-xr-x.  3 root root   4096 2009-12-20 22:07 ..
drwx--.  2 root root  16384 2009-11-25 02:06 lost+found
drwxrwxr-x. 16 marcel marcel   4096 2009-12-18 00:53 bk
-rw-rw-r--.  1 marcel marcel 172509 2009-12-20 20:58
screenshot_pref_applications_firefox.jpg
drwx--.  4 marcel marcel   4096 2009-12-10 01:58 .Trash-500




--
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the machinations of the wicked."  - from Slashdot

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/21/2009 12:16 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 12:19 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
>> Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
>> what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
>> has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
>> (Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
>> is another story.
> 
> Possible, if I ever reformat the drive, I'll remove all traces of
> partition with fdisk before.
> 
[r...@x86 extensions]# mke2fs /dev/sdg
mke2fs 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
/dev/sdg is entire device, not just one partition!
Proceed anyway? (y,n) y
Filesystem label=
OS type: Linux
Block size=1024 (log=0)
Fragment size=1024 (log=0)
15680 inodes, 62720 blocks
3136 blocks (5.00%) reserved for the super user
First data block=1
Maximum filesystem blocks=64225280
8 block groups
8192 blocks per group, 8192 fragments per group
1960 inodes per group
Superblock backups stored on blocks:
8193, 24577, 40961, 57345

Writing inode tables: done
Writing superblocks and filesystem accounting information: done

This filesystem will be automatically checked every 34 mounts or
180 days, whichever comes first.  Use tune2fs -c or -i to override.

[r...@x86 extensions]# e2label /dev/sdg test

[r...@x86 extensions]# mount | grep /dev/sdg
/dev/sdg on /media/test type ext2 (rw,nosuid,nodev,uhelper=devkit)

Mikkel
-- 

  Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons,
for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup!



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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 12:19 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> On 12/20/2009 09:00 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>>
>> You're right, my hasty extrapolations were wrong. But I don't believe
>> you can get a Flash drive working that will be listed only as /dev/sdb
>> any more than you can have a HD working with only /dev/sda. I have no
>> idea about arrays, I'm talking about standard desktops with one drive.
>>
> Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
> what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
> has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
> (Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
> is another story.

Possible, if I ever reformat the drive, I'll remove all traces of
partition with fdisk before.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/20/2009 09:00 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> 
> You're right, my hasty extrapolations were wrong. But I don't believe
> you can get a Flash drive working that will be listed only as /dev/sdb
> any more than you can have a HD working with only /dev/sda. I have no
> idea about arrays, I'm talking about standard desktops with one drive.
> 
Under Linux, you can do both. While you will be asked if that is
what you really want to do, the tools are happy to let you. Mount
has no problems mounting /dev/sda if you have formatted /dev/sda.
(Apposed to formatting /dev/sda1). Windows may not like it, but that
is another story.

Mikkel
-- 

  Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons,
for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup!



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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/20/2009 09:20 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> 
> Then, I have no idea where the /sdb1 partition comes from. I also have
> a lost and found directory on that drive.
> 
You said it was formatted for windows before - most sticks that come
formatted for windows have a partition for the FAT wile system. So
it was probably already there, and you re-formatted it.

Mikkel
-- 

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 4:30 AM, Chris Smart  wrote:

> The only other thing I have to say is that when you copy your tarball
> to the stick, make sure you run:
> sync
>
> and then do a checksum comparison.

For the time being, I only have ~1.7 GB of data to back-up. So I copy
the whole /home directory, except the video directory, which are
videos that I can find on the net anytime and are not important.

I'll have to learn how to do incremental back-ups with rdiff or
rsync... God knows.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Tim]

Marcel Rieux
>> OTOH, when I formatted, I wasn't so sure that ext3 was much use on a
>> USB drive. I still don't know.
 
Aaron Konstam:
> In it is not muh use if you ever want to put it in a Wiindws machine.

There are drivers to read ext3 on Windows.  If you use both systems,
you'll have to weigh up which is the most convenient.  Native file
systems on Linux, which supports your normal permissions and ownership
file details.  Or a pathetic-featured file system that can be easily
read by many different systems.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Aaron Konstam]

On Sun, 2009-12-20 at 18:27 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote: 
> On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 5:11 PM, Aaron Konstam  wrote:
> 
> > I think there is another problem with having pen drives formatted ext3
> > or ext4. Pen drives can only tolerate a finite number of writes before
> > they crap out. Any format that involves journaling will increase the
> > number of writes to the pen drive and hasten its failure.
> 
> The journal's size is not very large I suppose. And I also suppose
> that, like all other data, it is shifted from one place to another in
> other to have an equilibrium, not some sectors being written thousands
> of times and some other never.
> 
> OTOH, when I formatted, I wasn't so sure that ext3 was much use on a
> USB drive. I still don't know.
> 
In it is not muh use if you ever want to put it in a Wiindws machine.
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Wolfgang S. Rupprecht]

Aaron Konstam  writes:
> I think there is another problem with having pen drives formatted ext3
> or ext4. Pen drives can only tolerate a finite number of writes before
> they crap out. Any format that involves journaling will increase the
> number of writes to the pen drive and hasten its failure.

I don't know if the problem is that bad in practice.  Ted Ts'o has page
about ext4 on SSD's and it sounds like wear is a concern, but in
practice the media lasts longer than you'll want to use it for other
reasons.

   http://thunk.org/tytso/blog/2009/03/01/ssds-journaling-and-noatimerelatime/

-wolfgang
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Chris Smart]

2009/12/21 Marcel Rieux :
>> su -c "fdisk -l /dev/sdb"
>
> Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
> 120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
> Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
> Disk identifier: 0xX
>
>   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
> /dev/sdb1               1        1198     3951100   83  Linux

Right, so your USB stick is partitioned with a single partition.

>> mount |grep sdb
>
> /dev/sdb1 on /media/BK type ext3 (rw,nosuid,nodev,uhelper=devkit)

So that partition is mounted to /media/BK and it is formatted as ext3.
It looks good to me.

The only other thing I have to say is that when you copy your tarball
to the stick, make sure you run:
sync

and then do a checksum comparison. If they are both the same, then you
can safely unmount it and you shouldn't have any problems on your F12
box. If you do, then something else is going on on that side, perhaps
an overclocked CPU or something.

-c

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 10:32 PM, Chris Smart  wrote:
> 2009/12/21 Marcel Rieux :
>>
>> Then, I have no idea where the /sdb1 partition comes from. I also have
>> a lost and found directory on that drive.
>
> I'm pretty sure that your USB stick currently has a MBR partition
> table on it (there's nothing wrong with that).
>
> Can you post this?
>
> su -c "fdisk -l /dev/sdb"

Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
Disk identifier: 0xX

   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1   11198 3951100   83  Linux

> mount |grep sdb

/dev/sdb1 on /media/BK type ext3 (rw,nosuid,nodev,uhelper=devkit)

> The lost and found directory is because it is formatted ext.

I thought so.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Chris Smart]

2009/12/21 Marcel Rieux :
>
> Then, I have no idea where the /sdb1 partition comes from. I also have
> a lost and found directory on that drive.

I'm pretty sure that your USB stick currently has a MBR partition
table on it (there's nothing wrong with that).

Can you post this?

su -c "fdisk -l /dev/sdb"
mount |grep sdb

The lost and found directory is because it is formatted ext.

-c

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 8:36 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> On 12/20/2009 06:46 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>>
>> If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
>> on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
>> you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.
>>
> You can format a drive without a partition table, and still
> format/use it. I am not sure if it would get automatically mounted,
> but it does work. A partition table, and partition will NOT be
> created for you. Also, you can have a drive with one partition
> without that partition being partition 1. ZIP disks were famous for
> this. For a log time, DOS formatted ZIP disks used partition 4.
>
>> The man page does say:
>>
>> e2fsck - check a Linux ext2/ext3/ext4 file system
>>
>> A file system is not a device. So, the filesystem -- here sdb1 -- must
>> be specified.

Note: I answered Bill Davidsen first.

> You
> can use an entire drive, or a partition on a drive, as a tar
> archive. (tar -cvf /dev/sdb /home/mikkel)

Then, I have no idea where the /sdb1 partition comes from. I also have
a lost and found directory on that drive.

Here's an ls:


ls -al /media/BK/
total 208
drwx--.  5 marcel marcel   4096 2009-12-20 20:58 .
drwxr-xr-x.  3 root root   4096 2009-12-20 22:07 ..
drwx--.  2 root root  16384 2009-11-25 02:06 lost+found
drwxrwxr-x. 16 marcel marcel   4096 2009-12-18 00:53 bk
-rw-rw-r--.  1 marcel marcel 172509 2009-12-20 20:58
screenshot_pref_applications_firefox.jpg
drwx--.  4 marcel marcel   4096 2009-12-10 01:58 .Trash-500

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Chris Smart]

2009/12/21 Marcel Rieux :

> You're right, my hasty extrapolations were wrong. But I don't believe
> you can get a Flash drive working that will be listed only as /dev/sdb
> any more than you can have a HD working with only /dev/sda. I have no
> idea about arrays, I'm talking about standard desktops with one drive.

You can.

ch...@localhost ~ $ sudo mkfs.ext2 -L usbstick /dev/sdc
mke2fs 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
/dev/sdc is entire device, not just one partition!
Proceed anyway? (y,n) y
[formats away]

ch...@localhost ~ $ ls -l /dev/sdc*
brw-rw. 1 root disk 8, 32 2009-12-21 14:18 /dev/sdc

ch...@localhost ~ $ df -h |grep usb
/dev/sdc  3.8G  7.7M  3.6G   1% /media/usbstick

-c

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 9:40 PM, Bill Davidsen 
>> If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
>> on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
>> you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.
>>
> Whatever gave you that idea?

As I said, I right clicked on the drive, chose Format and now there's
an sdb1 partition and no other. I never created it otherwise.

> A file system is on a device, partitions are devices too. Try "ls -l
> /dev/sda*" and look at the first letter, all block devices.

You're right, my hasty extrapolations were wrong. But I don't believe
you can get a Flash drive working that will be listed only as /dev/sdb
any more than you can have a HD working with only /dev/sda. I have no
idea about arrays, I'm talking about standard desktops with one drive.

Or, so do I think, cause I've always created  / and /home partitions with Linux.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Bill Davidsen]

Marcel Rieux wrote:

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 5:40 PM, Mikkel  wrote:

On 12/20/2009 02:29 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:

Now that i know it's a 4GB drive, I wouldn't format it ext3, but since
it's already formatted ext3 and I don't plan to use it  to exchange
data, I'll leave it as it is.

But, as I said. I still have this problem:

e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb

The superblock could not be read or does not describe a correct ext2
filesystem.  If the device is valid and it really contains an ext2
filesystem (and not swap or ufs or something else), then the superblock
is corrupt, and you might try running e2fsck with an alternate
superblock: e2fsck -b 8193 


Dumb question
did you format /dev/sdb or /dev/sdb1?


If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.

Whatever gave you that idea? If you drop a filesystem on the whole drive and 
then mount the whole drive, it works fine (at least with tools which assume what 
you say is what you want). You can use whole drives as members of raid arrays, 
someone tests that on the raid mailing list regularly. ;-)


The requirement is that you use it where you made it.


I remember you
saying you have a partition on the drive, so I suspect you will have
better luck running "e2fsck -c /dev/sdb1".


The man page does say:

e2fsck - check a Linux ext2/ext3/ext4 file system

A file system is not a device. So, the filesystem -- here sdb1 -- must
be specified.

A file system is on a device, partitions are devices too. Try "ls -l /dev/sda*" 
and look at the first letter, all block devices.



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the machinations of the wicked."  - from Slashdot

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/20/2009 06:46 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> 
> If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
> on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
> you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.
> 
You can format a drive without a partition table, and still
format/use it. I am not sure if it would get automatically mounted,
but it does work. A partition table, and partition will NOT be
created for you. Also, you can have a drive with one partition
without that partition being partition 1. ZIP disks were famous for
this. For a log time, DOS formatted ZIP disks used partition 4.

> The man page does say:
> 
> e2fsck - check a Linux ext2/ext3/ext4 file system
> 
> A file system is not a device. So, the filesystem -- here sdb1 -- must
> be specified.
> 
Nope - A file system is created on a device. Both /dev/sdb and
/dev/sdb1 are devices. For that matter, a device is also a file. You
can use an entire drive, or a partition on a drive, as a tar
archive. (tar -cvf /dev/sdb /home/mikkel)

Remember - under UNIX type systems, everything is a file - that
includes devices. That is why commands like cp and cat work on
drives, as well as what most people consider files.

Mikkel
-- 

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for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup!



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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 5:40 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> On 12/20/2009 02:29 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>>
>> Now that i know it's a 4GB drive, I wouldn't format it ext3, but since
>> it's already formatted ext3 and I don't plan to use it  to exchange
>> data, I'll leave it as it is.
>>
>> But, as I said. I still have this problem:
>>
>> e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
>> e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
>> e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
>> e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb
>>
>> The superblock could not be read or does not describe a correct ext2
>> filesystem.  If the device is valid and it really contains an ext2
>> filesystem (and not swap or ufs or something else), then the superblock
>> is corrupt, and you might try running e2fsck with an alternate
>> superblock: e2fsck -b 8193 
>>
> Dumb question
> did you format /dev/sdb or /dev/sdb1?

If you remember well, I said I formatted the drive by right clicking
on the icon.  If you format sdb, an sdb1 partition will be created. If
you don't have a partition, the drive can't be used.

> I remember you
> saying you have a partition on the drive, so I suspect you will have
> better luck running "e2fsck -c /dev/sdb1".

The man page does say:

e2fsck - check a Linux ext2/ext3/ext4 file system

A file system is not a device. So, the filesystem -- here sdb1 -- must
be specified.

Which, according to .bash_history, I did yesterday (I know from other
commands around it). If the drive is mounted or if you're not root,
messages explain the problem.

Why it didn't work is beyond me.

For now, I'll say "case closed".

Thanks for your dumb comment!

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Chris Smart]

2009/12/21 Chris Smart :
>
> That's because you are trying to check the file system on the device,
> not the partition. Robert Nichols already pointed out that you need to
> be running that against /dev/sdb1 (where "1" is the first primary
> partition).
>

P.S. You might want to start the process again if you formatted /dev/sdb, too.

If fdisk is too complicated, you can achieve the same result with
parted (replace '/dev/sdX' with your CORRECT device, i.e. /dev/sdb):

su -c 'parted /dev/sdX mklabel msdos'
su -c 'parted /dev/sdX mkpartfs primary ext2 0% 100%'

This will prompt to confirm the actions, if you don't want it to
prompt, pass the "-s" (script) option after the "parted" command.

-c

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Chris Smart]

2009/12/21 Marcel Rieux :
>
> But, as I said. I still have this problem:
>
> e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
> e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
> e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
> e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb
>

That's because you are trying to check the file system on the device,
not the partition. Robert Nichols already pointed out that you need to
be running that against /dev/sdb1 (where "1" is the first primary
partition).

-c

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 5:11 PM, Aaron Konstam  wrote:

> I think there is another problem with having pen drives formatted ext3
> or ext4. Pen drives can only tolerate a finite number of writes before
> they crap out. Any format that involves journaling will increase the
> number of writes to the pen drive and hasten its failure.

The journal's size is not very large I suppose. And I also suppose
that, like all other data, it is shifted from one place to another in
other to have an equilibrium, not some sectors being written thousands
of times and some other never.

OTOH, when I formatted, I wasn't so sure that ext3 was much use on a
USB drive. I still don't know.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/20/2009 02:29 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> 
> Now that i know it's a 4GB drive, I wouldn't format it ext3, but since
> it's already formatted ext3 and I don't plan to use it  to exchange
> data, I'll leave it as it is.
> 
> But, as I said. I still have this problem:
> 
> e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
> e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
> e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
> e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb
> 
> The superblock could not be read or does not describe a correct ext2
> filesystem.  If the device is valid and it really contains an ext2
> filesystem (and not swap or ufs or something else), then the superblock
> is corrupt, and you might try running e2fsck with an alternate
> superblock: e2fsck -b 8193 
> 
Dumb question - did you format /dev/sdb or /dev/sdb1? I remember you
saying you have a partition on the drive, so I suspect you will have
better luck running "e2fsck -c /dev/sdb1".

Mikkel
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Aaron Konstam]

On Sun, 2009-12-20 at 15:29 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote: 
> On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 9:54 AM, Aaron Konstam  wrote:
> > On Sat, 2009-12-19 at 20:58 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote:
> >> On Saturday 19 December 2009, Aaron Konstam wrote:
> >> >On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:
> >> >> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> >> >> > On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> > > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> >> [...]
> >> >I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
> >> >the pen drive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
> >> >according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
> >> >about it.
> >> >
> >> Huh?  In that case, why not 'd'elete that 1st 4Gb partition and make a new
> >> one 'n' that uses all the drive?  And the 't' to set it to type 83, then
> >> write that table to it with a 'w', exit fdisk, and mke2fs /dev/sdX1, where 
> >> X
> >> is the same letter used for fdisk.  Voila! 8Gb unless it truly is a broken
> >> bit of tom-foolery.
> >>
> > The flash drive could be re-partitioned but to make its file type ext3
> > instead of Fat32 restricts what OS-s can read it.
> 
> Now that i know it's a 4GB drive, I wouldn't format it ext3, but since
> it's already formatted ext3 and I don't plan to use it  to exchange
> data, I'll leave it as it is.
I think there is another problem with having pen drives formatted ext3
or ext4. Pen drives can only tolerate a finite number of writes before
they crap out. Any format that involves journaling will increase the
number of writes to the pen drive and hasten its failure.
--
===
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muddy paw prints on the hood of my car.
===
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 9:54 AM, Aaron Konstam  wrote:
> On Sat, 2009-12-19 at 20:58 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> On Saturday 19 December 2009, Aaron Konstam wrote:
>> >On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>> >> > On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
>> >> > > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>> [...]
>> >I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
>> >the pen drive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
>> >according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
>> >about it.
>> >
>> Huh?  In that case, why not 'd'elete that 1st 4Gb partition and make a new
>> one 'n' that uses all the drive?  And the 't' to set it to type 83, then
>> write that table to it with a 'w', exit fdisk, and mke2fs /dev/sdX1, where X
>> is the same letter used for fdisk.  Voila! 8Gb unless it truly is a broken
>> bit of tom-foolery.
>>
> The flash drive could be re-partitioned but to make its file type ext3
> instead of Fat32 restricts what OS-s can read it.

Now that i know it's a 4GB drive, I wouldn't format it ext3, but since
it's already formatted ext3 and I don't plan to use it  to exchange
data, I'll leave it as it is.

But, as I said. I still have this problem:

e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb

The superblock could not be read or does not describe a correct ext2
filesystem.  If the device is valid and it really contains an ext2
filesystem (and not swap or ufs or something else), then the superblock
is corrupt, and you might try running e2fsck with an alternate
superblock: e2fsck -b 8193 

===

I would like very much to run a e2fsck on the drive. I picked this
drive in a bin were 8GB 4GB and 2GB drives... packages were mixed, all
selling for the same price, if I remember well. (Yes, that's Future
Shop's way.) Maybe it was just a packaging problem and all drives were
really 4GB, but maybe there's another problem. So, I would like to
check reliability.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Aaron Konstam]

On Sat, 2009-12-19 at 20:58 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: 
> On Saturday 19 December 2009, Aaron Konstam wrote:
> >On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:
> >> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> >> > On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> >> > > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> [...]
> >I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
> >the pen drive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
> >according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
> >about it.
> >
> Huh?  In that case, why not 'd'elete that 1st 4Gb partition and make a new 
> one 'n' that uses all the drive?  And the 't' to set it to type 83, then 
> write that table to it with a 'w', exit fdisk, and mke2fs /dev/sdX1, where X 
> is the same letter used for fdisk.  Voila! 8Gb unless it truly is a broken 
> bit of tom-foolery.
> 
The flash drive could be re-partitioned but to make its file type ext3
instead of Fat32 restricts what OS-s can read it. 
> 
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===
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Robert Nichols]

Marcel Rieux wrote:

On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 6:09 PM, Marcel Rieux  wrote:

I had and still have problems with e2fsck:

e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb


I did the change with fdisk:

Command (m for help): p

Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x04030201

   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1   11198 3951100   83  Linux

but 2efsck still complains.


You should be running e2fsck on the partition (/dev/sdb1), not the
entire drive (/dev/sdb).

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 10:24 PM, Barry  wrote:

> Could this problem be related to the U3 software that comes preloaded on
> these?
>
> http://www.kingston.com/flash/dt_u3.asp

Please! The capacity problem has been settled: it's a 4 GB drive that
was in a 8GB packaging. See:

https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-list/2009-December/msg01862.html

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Barry]

On Sat, 19 Dec 2009 20:58 -0500, "Gene Heskett"
 wrote:
> On Saturday 19 December 2009, Aaron Konstam wrote:
> >On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:
> >> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> >> > On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> >> > > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> [...]
> >I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
> >the pen drive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
> >according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
> >about it.
> >
> Huh?  In that case, why not 'd'elete that 1st 4Gb partition and make a
> new 
> one 'n' that uses all the drive?  And the 't' to set it to type 83, then 
> write that table to it with a 'w', exit fdisk, and mke2fs /dev/sdX1,
> where X 
> is the same letter used for fdisk.  Voila! 8Gb unless it truly is a
> broken 
> bit of tom-foolery.
> 
> -- 
> Cheers, Gene

Could this problem be related to the U3 software that comes preloaded on
these? 

http://www.kingston.com/flash/dt_u3.asp

I had a 8 gig sandisk cruzer that wouldn't show all the capacity, but I
don't remember if the shortage was that drastic. Sandisk offers a
removal tool that gave me back the missing space, but you need to run it
with windows and I'm not sure it would work on a different brand.  

http://www.sandisk.com/Assets/u3/launchpadremoval.exe

Barry

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 19 December 2009, Aaron Konstam wrote:
>On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:
>> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>> > On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
>> > > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
[...]
>I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
>the pen drive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
>according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
>about it.
>
Huh?  In that case, why not 'd'elete that 1st 4Gb partition and make a new 
one 'n' that uses all the drive?  And the 't' to set it to type 83, then 
write that table to it with a 'w', exit fdisk, and mke2fs /dev/sdX1, where X 
is the same letter used for fdisk.  Voila! 8Gb unless it truly is a broken 
bit of tom-foolery.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 6:09 PM, Marcel Rieux  wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 4:31 AM, Robert G. (Doc) Savage
>  wrote:
>
>> Are you quite certain yours is an 8 GB device??
>
> Arrrgh! Since you asked, I thought I'd check.. and it's indeed a 4 GB!
>
> I bought this drive at Future Shop, more commonly known as Future
> Shark. The price, $10 (CAN) seemed really unbelievable for an 8GB
> drive, mainly ~2 years ago, but it now appears inside the package was
> a 4GB drive.
>
> It's still a good price but then often acts weirdly. For some time, I
> had the capacity reading at 17 GB with also a reading of about twice
> what was written on it.
>
> I had and still have problems with e2fsck:
>
> e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
> e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
> e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
> e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb

I did the change with fdisk:

Command (m for help): p

Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x04030201

   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1   11198 3951100   83  Linux

but 2efsck still complains.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Bill Davidsen]

Aaron Konstam wrote:
On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote: 

On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:

On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:

On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:

I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.

Any way around this?


You reformatted the existing partition. So it is the same size as
the FAT32 partition. If you want to use the entire drive, you will
need to re-partition it. You will probably want to use gparted for
this. You have the choice of creating a second partition, expanding
the existing partition to use the full drive, or deleting the
current partition, and creating a new one.

Ar first sight, your suggestion made a lot of sense but I checked the
drive with gparted and it sees only one partition.

See: http://cjoint.com/data/mtd0lzbfUF.htm

Thanks for your answer!

Mikkel,

Have you tried looking at your drive with good ol' fdisk at a root
command prompt? If your Kingston is like my Vebatim, the output should
look much like this:

# fdisk -l /dev/sdb

Disk /dev/sdb: 8086 MB, 8086618112 bytes
249 heads, 62 sectors/track, 1023 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 15438 * 512 = 7904256 bytes

   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1   *   11023 7896506   83  Linux

The key part to look for is the "8086 MB". If your 8 GB thumb drive only
shows something like 3.7 GB under fdisk, it's borked up internally and
you're done.

I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
the pen ddrive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
about it. 


I don't know what you think you see here:
  Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
  120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
  Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
  Disk identifier: 0x04030201

 Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
  /dev/sdb1   11198 3951100b  W95 FAT32

But the total size (see first line) is 4GB, and it is all in the partition (see 
last line). I have no idea what 4GB you think you see that isn't partitioned, 
and fdisk only allows you to see the partition table, not if an area is 
"formatted in any way" since the contents of partitions or non-partition areas 
of the drive are not examined.


I like fdisk, it isn't very smart and doesn't pretend to be, what it does it 
does correctly.


Other than looking at the /var/log/messages for an HPA message, I would say this 
is a 4GB drive.


--
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the machinations of the wicked."  - from Slashdot

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 4:31 AM, Robert G. (Doc) Savage
 wrote:

> Are you quite certain yours is an 8 GB device??

Arrrgh! Since you asked, I thought I'd check.. and it's indeed a 4 GB!

I bought this drive at Future Shop, more commonly known as Future
Shark. The price, $10 (CAN) seemed really unbelievable for an 8GB
drive, mainly ~2 years ago, but it now appears inside the package was
a 4GB drive.

It's still a good price but then often acts weirdly. For some time, I
had the capacity reading at 17 GB with also a reading of about twice
what was written on it.

I had and still have problems with e2fsck:

e2fsck -c /dev/sdb
e2fsck 1.41.9 (22-Aug-2009)
e2fsck: Superblock invalid, trying backup blocks...
e2fsck: Bad magic number in super-block while trying to open /dev/sdb

The superblock could not be read or does not describe a correct ext2
filesystem.  If the device is valid and it really contains an ext2
filesystem (and not swap or ufs or something else), then the superblock
is corrupt, and you might try running e2fsck with an alternate
superblock: e2fsck -b 8193 

==

Wouldn't it be a good thing if I used fdisk to change -- what is it
called? -- the label co that everything matches?

Last word on Future Shop: BEWARE. They sell junk and crap. I once
bought 50 Mitsumi CDs from them and half of the pile ended as
coasters. Of course, I'd never buy a computer there, but it seems you
end up being ripped off even on the small stuff.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Aaron Konstam]

On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 23:25 -0600, Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote: 
> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> > On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> > > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> > >> I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
> > >> formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
> > >> and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.
> > >>
> > >> Any way around this?
> > >>
> > > You reformatted the existing partition. So it is the same size as
> > > the FAT32 partition. If you want to use the entire drive, you will
> > > need to re-partition it. You will probably want to use gparted for
> > > this. You have the choice of creating a second partition, expanding
> > > the existing partition to use the full drive, or deleting the
> > > current partition, and creating a new one.
> > 
> > Ar first sight, your suggestion made a lot of sense but I checked the
> > drive with gparted and it sees only one partition.
> > 
> > See: http://cjoint.com/data/mtd0lzbfUF.htm
> > 
> > Thanks for your answer!
> 
> Mikkel,
> 
> Have you tried looking at your drive with good ol' fdisk at a root
> command prompt? If your Kingston is like my Vebatim, the output should
> look much like this:
> 
> # fdisk -l /dev/sdb
> 
> Disk /dev/sdb: 8086 MB, 8086618112 bytes
> 249 heads, 62 sectors/track, 1023 cylinders
> Units = cylinders of 15438 * 512 = 7904256 bytes
> 
>Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
> /dev/sdb1   *   11023 7896506   83  Linux
> 
> The key part to look for is the "8086 MB". If your 8 GB thumb drive only
> shows something like 3.7 GB under fdisk, it's borked up internally and
> you're done.
I thing borked is too pessimistic an analysis. There is a 4GB area on
the pen ddrive that is not partitioned nor is it formatted in any way,
according to fdisk. I wold just ignore the 4GB area and don;r worry
about it. 
> 
> Otherwise, use fdisk's letter commands ("m" for menu) to delete all old
> and create one new max partition of type 83 and "w"rite the new
> partition table back to the drive. Then use mke2fs to format that new
> partition.
> 
> --Doc Savage
>   Fairview Heights, IL
> 
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savings in yeast!!
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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Timothy Murphy]

Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:

>> Just a side note.
>> At least where I lives, in Asia South countries, we found some bogus
>> China made USB flash disk, which claims a certain size when being
>> plugged into the Windows the 1st time. Then when we want to re-partition
>> or trying to fill it up to its declared capacity, the ugly head arise.
>> Kingston and Sandisk are the most targeted brands for these fake.

> That's interesting. Forgeries like that are not well known here in North
> America. It could certainly be a plausible explanation for Marcel's
> trouble. Thanks for sharing this information.

Yes, I bought one on eBay a year or so ago, from Hong Kong.
It claims to be 8GB, but only has 1GB.
It was very cheap, so I didn't complain.

-- 
Timothy Murphy  
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Robert G. (Doc) Savage]

On Sat, 2009-12-19 at 18:57 +0800, Dedhi Sujatmiko wrote:
> Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:
> >
> > Are you quite certain yours is an 8 GB device??
> >
> >   
> >> Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
> >> 120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
> >> Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
> >> 
> >
> > This says it's a 4 GB device (plus or minus).
> 
> Just a side note.
> At least where I lives, in Asia South countries, we found some bogus 
> China made USB flash disk, which claims a certain size when being 
> plugged into the Windows the 1st time. Then when we want to re-partition 
> or trying to fill it up to its declared capacity, the ugly head arise. 
> Kingston and Sandisk are the most targeted brands for these fake.

Dehdi,

That's interesting. Forgeries like that are not well known here in North
America. It could certainly be a plausible explanation for Marcel's
trouble. Thanks for sharing this information.

--Doc Savage
  Fairview Heights, IL

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Dedhi Sujatmiko]

Robert G. (Doc) Savage wrote:


Are you quite certain yours is an 8 GB device??

  

Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes



This says it's a 4 GB device (plus or minus).


Just a side note.
At least where I lives, in Asia South countries, we found some bogus 
China made USB flash disk, which claims a certain size when being 
plugged into the Windows the 1st time. Then when we want to re-partition 
or trying to fill it up to its declared capacity, the ugly head arise. 
Kingston and Sandisk are the most targeted brands for these fake.


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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Tim]

On Sat, 2009-12-19 at 01:02 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> Very weird: it still sees the partition as FAT32, even though I
> formatted it ext3.

When you prep a disc, you specify the partition types that you want, and
formatting tools may format the partition with the same file system
type, by default.  But you can format a partition with a different file
system type, and that won't change the description in the partition.  

Probably not a problem, but can surprise you if you reformat, and you
end up with a file system type that you didn't expect.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Robert G. (Doc) Savage]

On Sat, 2009-12-19 at 01:02 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Robert G. (Doc) Savage
>  wrote:
> > Have you tried looking at your drive with good ol' fdisk at a root
> > command prompt? If your Kingston is like my Vebatim, the output should
> > look much like this:
> >
> > # fdisk -l /dev/sdb
> >
> > Disk /dev/sdb: 8086 MB, 8086618112 bytes
> > 249 heads, 62 sectors/track, 1023 cylinders
> > Units = cylinders of 15438 * 512 = 7904256 bytes
> >
> >   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
> > /dev/sdb1   *   11023 7896506   83  Linux
> 
> fdisk -l /dev/sdb
> 
> Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
> 120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
> Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
> Disk identifier: 0x04030201
> 
>Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
> /dev/sdb1   11198 3951100b  W95 FAT32
> ==
> 
> Very weird: it still sees the partition as FAT32, even though I
> formatted it ext3.
> 
> > Otherwise, use fdisk's letter commands ("m" for menu) to delete all old
> > and create one new max partition of type 83 and "w"rite the new
> > partition table back to the drive. Then use mke2fs to format that new
> > partition.
> 
> Yes, maybe this could work. I'll see tomorrow.
> 
> Sleep time.

Marcel,

(Apologies about your name. Yes, it was late.)

Regardless of what filesystem you install in /dev/sdb1, the current
partition table in this device is coded to identify it as fat32:

> /dev/sdb1   11198 3951100b  W95 FAT32

When you repartition this device using fdisk, you'll want to change its
system id from "b W95 FAT32" to "83 Linux" with the "t" command.

Are you quite certain yours is an 8 GB device??

> Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
> 120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
> Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes

This says it's a 4 GB device (plus or minus). You now have both gparted
and fdisk in agreement on that point. This means everything else you've
seen and done is correct, and the formatted capacity of this device will
be about 3.7 GB in both fat32 and ext3. (Note that you'll want to use
the "-m 0" option with mke2fs to create an ext2 filesystem (ext3 with
"j" option) with zero space reserved for the root user.)

Get to know fdisk. Even though it's not a GUI, it's very powerful. Used
with care, like a surgeon's scalpel, it can be a very precise tool. It's
the best tool for you to use in this situation.

HTH

--Doc Savage
  Fairview Heights, IL

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Robert G. (Doc) Savage
 wrote:
>
> On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>> On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
>> > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>> >> I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
>> >> formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
>> >> and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.
>> >>
>> >> Any way around this?
>> >>
>> > You reformatted the existing partition. So it is the same size as
>> > the FAT32 partition. If you want to use the entire drive, you will
>> > need to re-partition it. You will probably want to use gparted for
>> > this. You have the choice of creating a second partition, expanding
>> > the existing partition to use the full drive, or deleting the
>> > current partition, and creating a new one.
>>
>> Ar first sight, your suggestion made a lot of sense but I checked the
>> drive with gparted and it sees only one partition.
>>
>> See: http://cjoint.com/data/mtd0lzbfUF.htm
>>
>> Thanks for your answer!
>
> Mikkel,
>
> Have you tried looking at your drive with good ol' fdisk at a root
> command prompt? If your Kingston is like my Vebatim, the output should
> look much like this:
>
> # fdisk -l /dev/sdb
>
> Disk /dev/sdb: 8086 MB, 8086618112 bytes
> 249 heads, 62 sectors/track, 1023 cylinders
> Units = cylinders of 15438 * 512 = 7904256 bytes
>
>   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
> /dev/sdb1   *           1        1023     7896506   83  Linux

fdisk -l /dev/sdb

Disk /dev/sdb: 4045 MB, 4045930496 bytes
120 heads, 55 sectors/track, 1197 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 6600 * 512 = 3379200 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x04030201

   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1   11198 3951100b  W95 FAT32
==

Very weird: it still sees the partition as FAT32, even though I
formatted it ext3.

> Otherwise, use fdisk's letter commands ("m" for menu) to delete all old
> and create one new max partition of type 83 and "w"rite the new
> partition table back to the drive. Then use mke2fs to format that new
> partition.

Yes, maybe this could work. I'll see tomorrow.

Sleep time.

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Robert G. (Doc) Savage]

On Fri, 2009-12-18 at 21:58 -0500, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> > On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> >> I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
> >> formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
> >> and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.
> >>
> >> Any way around this?
> >>
> > You reformatted the existing partition. So it is the same size as
> > the FAT32 partition. If you want to use the entire drive, you will
> > need to re-partition it. You will probably want to use gparted for
> > this. You have the choice of creating a second partition, expanding
> > the existing partition to use the full drive, or deleting the
> > current partition, and creating a new one.
> 
> Ar first sight, your suggestion made a lot of sense but I checked the
> drive with gparted and it sees only one partition.
> 
> See: http://cjoint.com/data/mtd0lzbfUF.htm
> 
> Thanks for your answer!

Mikkel,

Have you tried looking at your drive with good ol' fdisk at a root
command prompt? If your Kingston is like my Vebatim, the output should
look much like this:

# fdisk -l /dev/sdb

Disk /dev/sdb: 8086 MB, 8086618112 bytes
249 heads, 62 sectors/track, 1023 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 15438 * 512 = 7904256 bytes

   Device Boot  Start End  Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1   *   11023 7896506   83  Linux

The key part to look for is the "8086 MB". If your 8 GB thumb drive only
shows something like 3.7 GB under fdisk, it's borked up internally and
you're done.

Otherwise, use fdisk's letter commands ("m" for menu) to delete all old
and create one new max partition of type 83 and "w"rite the new
partition table back to the drive. Then use mke2fs to format that new
partition.

--Doc Savage
  Fairview Heights, IL

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Mikkel  wrote:
> On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
>> I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
>> formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
>> and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.
>>
>> Any way around this?
>>
> You reformatted the existing partition. So it is the same size as
> the FAT32 partition. If you want to use the entire drive, you will
> need to re-partition it. You will probably want to use gparted for
> this. You have the choice of creating a second partition, expanding
> the existing partition to use the full drive, or deleting the
> current partition, and creating a new one.

Ar first sight, your suggestion made a lot of sense but I checked the
drive with gparted and it sees only one partition.

See: http://cjoint.com/data/mtd0lzbfUF.htm

Thanks for your answer!

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Re: 8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Mikkel]

On 12/18/2009 01:59 PM, Marcel Rieux wrote:
> I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
> formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
> and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.
> 
> Any way around this?
> 
You reformatted the existing partition. So it is the same size as
the FAT32 partition. If you want to use the entire drive, you will
need to re-partition it. You will probably want to use gparted for
this. You have the choice of creating a second partition, expanding
the existing partition to use the full drive, or deleting the
current partition, and creating a new one.

Mikkel
-- 

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for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup!



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8 GB Flash drive formatted at 3.7 GB

[Marcel Rieux]

I have a Kingston Data Traveler 8GB Flash drive that was previously
formatted FAT32. I reformatted it ext3 simply by clicking on the icon
and choosing "Format", but it still has only 3.7 GB available.

Any way around this?

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