Re: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-thank you Sharyl
i have been on this site for at least 1 year, and think our people are willing to do what is necessary , but sometimes available funds are not there for the needed treatment and we have to make that hard decision. also, sometimes we have to stop and think about what is best for them. when my holding on to them and putting them thru painful treatments hurts them more than helps, it is time to stop. i had to make a decision for Shorty when he was having series strokes. he was 18 and the possibility of helping him was not there. he was screaming in pain and the kindest thing i could do for him was end his life. if you have never driven 60 miles at 90 miles a hour, lights flashing, trying to get to the vet er with him screaming all the way, it is may be hard to understand why i pts my precious boy. i did not get a ticket because i called 911 when i started out and told them the situation and they advised all law enforcement on my route. several highway patrol cars flashed their lights at me and the last one escorted me to the vet because i was now in a city. same situation with Shadow. he had a clot on his spine and screamed all the way to Columbia (about 200 miles ). he was also 18 and trying to do surgery at that age would have been more than he could take, plus it had been too long for him to regain use of his legs and bladder. i could not see making him continue that way. dorlis Alice Flowers aliceflow...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Finally a voice of reason and kindness...Can I afford to treat this way? No-I could have paid my 5 yr old car off in the last year's vet bills and I wouldn't be behind in my mortgage. Maybe it's menopause or empty nest syndrome...But I had a few yard sales, bought enough hay for my old horses for the winter. I still need to get some more Rimadyl for my arthritic dogs. I am still selling off stuff I don't need. I live at Walmart, BigLots and the dollar store, but I get top stuff for the cats and dogs to eat.I take peanut butter and jelly every day for lunch. I just so desperately want the last 2 to live...but if they were getting sick from the Interferon, I'd stop in a heartbeat-they come over and wait to take it. Giving antibiotics was a bigger hassle when they had URIs and Bartonella...Treating for ear mites was a pain too, but I did it-I guess I shouldn't have? If the Imulan proves to be a good treatment and enough vets use it-the price will eventually go down. I save money by doing the injections at home. I work full time, but I may have to go back to sewing in my spare time. I try and help with TNRing the ferals with a local group, network and donate food and litter to individual rescuers. Seems like the people willing to do the most-have the least. I just don't understand why people who are so adamantly against all the things this site promotes seem to ger off on bashing the people who are getting information from this site on treating their sick pets. Perhaps they can get the owners of this site to change their Mission Statement. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-Isn't the purpose of this site for progressive treatment?
as this is clearly directed at me, i'll respond just a little bit. the mission statement does not refer, i expect, to things with little or no scientific backing. for the information of those who don't know, i am very much an adherent of alternative treatments--as a person with disabilities myself, i use them to keep myself going. there's a huge difference between a vet who refuses to acknowledge the known advances in their field, which includes the need to retest FeLVs, how the virus is and isn't transmitted, etc, and those who care enough to listen to their clients, look into a treatment or protocol, and decide that there isn't enough evidence to recommend it. i lived and worked at a special-needs sanctuary, and at least one hundred of our FeLVs died during my time there, so any implication that i don't care for FeLVs or want to save them is both inaccurate and insulting. what i don't care for, however, is companies that prey upon people's fears and desperation. i would LOVE to find out that LCTI really helps with FeLVs, but i don't know that it does, because there is just not enough evidence. it's been around for years now, so it's not a new product, just new to imulan. had imulan's business and marketing practices been different, i would be more comfortable with seeing people spending a great deal of money on an unproven treatment. essentially, i don't want folks to be given false hope. if you think that's mean, i'm sorry. yes, this is my opinion. my considered opinion, after speaking with many many professionals, and using my own education and experience. MC -- Spay Neuter Your Neighbors! Maybe That'll Make The Difference MaryChristine Special-Needs Coordinator, Purebred Cat Breed Rescue (www.purebredcats.org) Member, SCAT (Special-Cat Action Team) ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-Isn't the purpose of this site for progressive treatment?
We all struggle in trying to figure out what's best for our kitties. And every day, we have to make decisions that we hope are the right ones. All our kitties are different--some can handle more invasive treatments, but for other kitties, an injection, a transfusion, even a trip in a carrier to a vet would put so much stress on them that any treatment would likely be counterproductive. I do read about any new treatment possibilities. It was on this site that I first learned about immune regulin, and as it turned out, my own vet uses it with the FELV + cats he treats. For my Tucson, it seemed to do the trick on the 2 occasions that her white blood cell count went down dangerously low. Was it the immune regulin? I can't prove that but her count went right back up. That doesn't mean it would work for all other cats. And interferon, well I opted not to use. I'm sure it does help but for my Tucson and for the late great Romeo, the stress alone would have killed them. As for newer treatments, I do like some sort of basis for their purported success. I did talk to my vet about the newest and he did not recommend, at this time. But I'm not in the same situation as you--if I had 6 kitties who were dying before my eyes, I might have tried it. And there is nothing wrong w. putting down a kitty who is suffering. I have always regretted waiting a few days too long for my Romeo who it turned out had a huge lymphoma mass in his chest. But taking him to vet was incredibly stressful to him that I held off trying various things and talking to my vet. He was having trouble breathing and I should have taken him as soon as that started instead of waiting a few days Bottom line, each of our situations is so very different. I've learned a tremendous amount from this board and though I don't necessarily follow the regimens others do, I've learned enough about each option to make what I hope are informed decisions. That's what we're all here for. Conversations can sometimes get a bit rough but this is an awful disease that takes a lot out of each of us, emotionally and financially. We do the best we can and learn from each other. Christiane Biagi Cell: 914-720-6888 ti...@mindspring.com Volunteer-St. Bernard Parish Animal Shelter -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alice Flowers Sent: Friday, October 02, 2009 5:14 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-Isn't the purpose of this site for progressive treatment? I was directed to this site because of the Mission Statement being one of progressive treatments. I don't understand the negativity towards people who opt to treat their cats with newer treatments. If you don't want to treat, that's fine-it's just really mean to knock the people who are treating and have hope still. I did just lose 4 kitty brothers in the past 6 months-I only tried to transfuse one...forgive me for wanting him to live. The last one (at just a year old) did not get that, but he screamed out while he panic-ed and couldn't breathe due to all the fluid in his chest-forgive us for having him euthanized to spare him a few hours of agony. The fluid came bubbling out his nostrils after his last breath. We probably should have gone to the movies until he passed. Why are you on a site constantly harping at and about people who are trying the products that are listed on this site as showing promise.I don't get it at all-I know you care about your pets, why can't you allow us to care for ours? What I do know is my 2 remaining cats have so much energy now-they beg to play with the laser pointer, Rosie brings her favorite mousie for us to throw so she can play fetch-are they suffering?? Quite the opposite, these 2 are having fun finally! I haven't had a cat in over 12-15 years, then rescued these 6 kittens last year-I didn't have a clue-never even knew anyone with FeLV cats. Please forgive me for wanting to learn and try and treat the disease. I did not expect this site to have all the nasty cattiness (ha-ha) of some of the other sites when I read the website's opening page-have you read it? Here is a portion of it cut and pasted from the site: Our mission in presenting the information on these web pages is intended to help those whose feline babies are not responding to traditional veterinary methods of treating feline leukemia. People should be forewarned that many vets are skeptical and will resist using these newer treatments. We urge folks that encounter such opposition to seek out another vet that is willing to administer these medications as recommended below. In July of 1997, the Central States Veterinary Conference held in Kansas City, Missouri held discussions on these newer methods and were optimistic about their use in treating FeLV+ cats. For more details on the protocols for these drugs, please review the book, The 5 minute Veterinary Consultant
[Felvtalk] Just wondering-Isn't the purpose of this site for progressive treatment?
I was directed to this site because of the Mission Statement being one of progressive treatments. I don't understand the negativity towards people who opt to treat their cats with newer treatments. If you don't want to treat, that's fine-it's just really mean to knock the people who are treating and have hope still. I did just lose 4 kitty brothers in the past 6 months-I only tried to transfuse one...forgive me for wanting him to live. The last one (at just a year old) did not get that, but he screamed out while he panic-ed and couldn't breathe due to all the fluid in his chest-forgive us for having him euthanized to spare him a few hours of agony. The fluid came bubbling out his nostrils after his last breath. We probably should have gone to the movies until he passed. Why are you on a site constantly harping at and about people who are trying the products that are listed on this site as showing promise.I don't get it at all-I know you care about your pets, why can't you allow us to care for ours? What I do know is my 2 remaining cats have so much energy now-they beg to play with the laser pointer, Rosie brings her favorite mousie for us to throw so she can play fetch-are they suffering?? Quite the opposite, these 2 are having fun finally! I haven't had a cat in over 12-15 years, then rescued these 6 kittens last year-I didn't have a clue-never even knew anyone with FeLV cats. Please forgive me for wanting to learn and try and treat the disease. I did not expect this site to have all the nasty cattiness (ha-ha) of some of the other sites when I read the website's opening page-have you read it? Here is a portion of it cut and pasted from the site: Our mission in presenting the information on these web pages is intended to help those whose feline babies are not responding to traditional veterinary methods of treating feline leukemia. People should be forewarned that many vets are skeptical and will resist using these newer treatments. We urge folks that encounter such opposition to seek out another vet that is willing to administer these medications as recommended below. In July of 1997, the Central States Veterinary Conference held in Kansas City, Missouri held discussions on these newer methods and were optimistic about their use in treating FeLV+ cats. For more details on the protocols for these drugs, please review the book, The 5 minute Veterinary Consultant: Canine and Feline by Tilley and Smith 1997. Although we are not veterinarians, much of the information available here was written by veterinarians. Our sole purpose in presenting these pages is to educate people on newer, more effective treatments for feline leukemia. Ours is a not-for-profit endeavor, even though we may mention companies by name that sell some of these products. Veterinarians and researchers are encouraged to send comments and contributions for this site to me: James G. Wilson NOTICE: All materials at this website (including HTML pages, text pages, and images) are the property of the owner of this website. This includes external links to some Geocities sites, Fortunecity sites, and Prohosting sites. Under no circumstances are these pages to be copied, altered, or otherwise misrepresented. All other external links (including image links) are the property of those website owners. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-Isn't the purpose of this site for progressive treatment?
Alice, I understand that some of the recent posts could be construed as negative in tone for treating our FeLV+ babies. We each have our own approach and resources for dealing with the various stages of FeLV. I have limited financial resources. I do the best I can for my positives with OTC supplements. Others have the resources for some of the newer 'aids'. I read with interest the results they report hoping one day to have the funds to try them on my kitties. I consider FeLV to be a chronic condition and treat it as such just as I do with my CRF, CHF and HCM kitties. I started the year with 8 positives and now have 3 all just over 2 yrs old. Not a good yr but the 5 I lost were loved, cared for and lived a good life. I did syringe feed the sick ones and provided sub q fluids in addition to meds/supplements. We each do what we can. Don't let a few posts about not trying to help the sick ones lead you to believe that no one is trying or should be trying. Each post is just that persons opinion or personal experience. JMHO Sharyl --- On Fri, 10/2/09, Alice Flowers aliceflow...@sbcglobal.net wrote: From: Alice Flowers aliceflow...@sbcglobal.net Subject: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-Isn't the purpose of this site for progressive treatment? To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Friday, October 2, 2009, 5:14 PM I was directed to this site because of the Mission Statement being one of progressive treatments. I don't understand the negativity towards people who opt to treat their cats with newer treatments. If you don't want to treat, that's fine-it's just really mean to knock the people who are treating and have hope still. I did just lose 4 kitty brothers in the past 6 months-I only tried to transfuse one...forgive me for wanting him to live. The last one (at just a year old) did not get that, but he screamed out while he panic-ed and couldn't breathe due to all the fluid in his chest-forgive us for having him euthanized to spare him a few hours of agony. The fluid came bubbling out his nostrils after his last breath. We probably should have gone to the movies until he passed. Why are you on a site constantly harping at and about people who are trying the products that are listed on this site as showing promise.I don't get it at all-I know you care about your pets, why can't you allow us to care for ours? What I do know is my 2 remaining cats have so much energy now-they beg to play with the laser pointer, Rosie brings her favorite mousie for us to throw so she can play fetch-are they suffering?? Quite the opposite, these 2 are having fun finally! I haven't had a cat in over 12-15 years, then rescued these 6 kittens last year-I didn't have a clue-never even knew anyone with FeLV cats. Please forgive me for wanting to learn and try and treat the disease. I did not expect this site to have all the nasty cattiness (ha-ha) of some of the other sites when I read the website's opening page-have you read it? Here is a portion of it cut and pasted from the site: Our mission in presenting the information on these web pages is intended to help those whose feline babies are not responding to traditional veterinary methods of treating feline leukemia. People should be forewarned that many vets are skeptical and will resist using these newer treatments. We urge folks that encounter such opposition to seek out another vet that is willing to administer these medications as recommended below. In July of 1997, the Central States Veterinary Conference held in Kansas City, Missouri held discussions on these newer methods and were optimistic about their use in treating FeLV+ cats. For more details on the protocols for these drugs, please review the book, The 5 minute Veterinary Consultant: Canine and Feline by Tilley and Smith 1997. Although we are not veterinarians, much of the information available here was written by veterinarians. Our sole purpose in presenting these pages is to educate people on newer, more effective treatments for feline leukemia. Ours is a not-for-profit endeavor, even though we may mention companies by name that sell some of these products. Veterinarians and researchers are encouraged to send comments and contributions for this site to me: James G. Wilson NOTICE: All materials at this website (including HTML pages, text pages, and images) are the property of the owner of this website. This includes external links to some Geocities sites, Fortunecity sites, and Prohosting sites. Under no circumstances are these pages to be copied, altered, or otherwise misrepresented. All other external links (including image links) are the property of those website owners. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Just wondering-thank you Sharyl
Finally a voice of reason and kindness...Can I afford to treat this way? No-I could have paid my 5 yr old car off in the last year's vet bills and I wouldn't be behind in my mortgage. Maybe it's menopause or empty nest syndrome...But I had a few yard sales, bought enough hay for my old horses for the winter. I still need to get some more Rimadyl for my arthritic dogs. I am still selling off stuff I don't need. I live at Walmart, BigLots and the dollar store, but I get top stuff for the cats and dogs to eat.I take peanut butter and jelly every day for lunch. I just so desperately want the last 2 to live...but if they were getting sick from the Interferon, I'd stop in a heartbeat-they come over and wait to take it. Giving antibiotics was a bigger hassle when they had URIs and Bartonella...Treating for ear mites was a pain too, but I did it-I guess I shouldn't have? If the Imulan proves to be a good treatment and enough vets use it-the price will eventually go down. I save money by doing the injections at home. I work full time, but I may have to go back to sewing in my spare time. I try and help with TNRing the ferals with a local group, network and donate food and litter to individual rescuers. Seems like the people willing to do the most-have the least. I just don't understand why people who are so adamantly against all the things this site promotes seem to ger off on bashing the people who are getting information from this site on treating their sick pets. Perhaps they can get the owners of this site to change their Mission Statement. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: Just wondering-Elizabeth
Hey Elizabeth, Hope all is going well with you. We're safely in Florida right now, and enjoying our trip. I'll have to tell you all about it when we get back. As far as vitamin C goes, I have not used it on my kitties yet, but if I did have an immune compromised kitty again, I would after doing the research. I can't remember the article on vitamin C, but it was a good one. If I run across it, I will forward it to you. I know that too high doses of Vitamin C can acidify the urinary tract, which isn't good. I think that FeLV symptomatic kitties don't produce enough, but I can't remember if that's exactly what I read. I would resend your email with a different subject line because I think people skipped over it thinking it was something personal for one particular person. You should get more replies from people who use Mega C or the like. Take care and talk to you soon! :) Wendy --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please forgive my ignorance - but I am new to the list. I hear a lot about giving supplements to cats - vitamin C, in particular. What is the benefit of this for FeVL+ cats? Since cats, unlike humans, synthesize and produce their own vitamin C - are FeVL+ cats unable to continue to produce it? What is the added benefit and what is the dosage? Although vitamin C is a water soluble vitamin - what is the upper limit of this vitamin that is considered toxic? What are the recommended allowances of the various vitamins for cats and what are the vitamins they require? Where can I find reputable resource material? Thank you for your time and your patience. elizabeth __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: Just wondering-Elizabeth
Thank you so much, Wendy. I've been trying to look up information on my own but I read a lot of conflicting things. I suspect people on this list have more knowledge and experience than most anyone around and so I'm really hoping for some good information even if it is anecdotal. If I thought it would help my kitty topaint myself blue and run naked through the front yard - you better believe I would do it! ;-) Have fun on your trip! Cat on keyboard -- gottago. In a message dated 6/7/2006 7:44:43 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hey Elizabeth,Hope all is going well with you. We're safely inFlorida right now, and enjoying our trip. I'll haveto tell you all about it when we get back. As far asvitamin C goes, I have not used it on my kitties yet,but if I did have an immune compromised kitty again, Iwould after doing the research. I can't remember thearticle on vitamin C, but it was a good one. If I runacross it, I will forward it to you. I know that toohigh doses of Vitamin C can acidify the urinary tract,which isn't good. I think that FeLV symptomatickitties don't produce enough, but I can't remember ifthat's exactly what I read. I would resend your emailwith a different subject line because I think peopleskipped over it thinking it was something personal forone particular person. You should get more repliesfrom people who use Mega C or the like. Take care andtalk to you soon!:)Wendy--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please forgive my ignorance - but I am new to the list. I hear a lot about giving supplements to cats - vitamin C, in particular. What is the benefit of this for FeVL+ cats? Since cats, unlike humans, synthesize and produce their own vitamin C - are FeVL+ cats unable to continue to produce it? What is the added benefit and what is the dosage? Although vitamin C is a water soluble vitamin - what is the upper limit of this vitamin that is considered toxic? What are the recommended allowances of the various vitamins for cats and what are the vitamins they require? Where can I find reputable resource material? Thank you for your time and your patience. elizabeth __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: Just wondering
I'm no tsure on the doses, but the purpose for the Vitamin C is to boost the immune system. Since FeLV is an immune disorder, you need to boost the system. I can tell you that you shouldn't give too much because they'll get the runs. Another good booster is Pet Tinic. There's another like it but I can't think of the name. I always used Pet Tinic. It's a blood builder. Loaded with antioxidants. www.drsfostersmith.com carries it. Terri in NJ (mostly lurking) =^..^= Terri, Siggie the Tomato Vampire, Guinevere, Sammi, Travis, Dori and 6 furangels: RuthieGirl, Samantha, Arielle, Gareth, Alec Salome' =^..^= Furkid Photos! http://mysite.verizon.net/vze7sgqa/My Personal Page: http://www.geocities.com/ruthiegirl1/terrispage.html?1083970447350Come check me out on MySpace at http://www.myspace.com/terricrazycatlady Earth and Family Safe Products! http://www.moreinfo247.com/9162990/VCLNice Offers! www.niceoffers.com/9162990 Buy Avon Online! http://www.youravon.com/theresabrown - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 05, 2006 11:06 PM Subject: Just wondering Please forgive my ignorance - but I am new to the list. I hear a lot about giving supplements to cats - vitamin C, in particular. What is the benefit of this for FeVL+ cats? Since cats, unlike humans, synthesize and producetheir own vitamin C - are FeVL+ cats unable to continue to produce it? What is the added benefit and what is the dosage? Although vitamin C is a water soluble vitamin - what is the upper limit of this vitamin that is considered toxic? What are the recommended allowances of the various vitaminsfor cats and what are the vitamins they require?Where can I find reputableresource material? Thank you for your time and your patience. elizabeth
Just wondering
Please forgive my ignorance - but I am new to the list. I hear a lot about giving supplements to cats - vitamin C, in particular. What is the benefit of this for FeVL+ cats? Since cats, unlike humans, synthesize and producetheir own vitamin C - are FeVL+ cats unable to continue to produce it? What is the added benefit and what is the dosage? Although vitamin C is a water soluble vitamin - what is the upper limit of this vitamin that is considered toxic? What are the recommended allowances of the various vitaminsfor cats and what are the vitamins they require?Where can I find reputableresource material? Thank you for your time and your patience. elizabeth
