[Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
On 5/3/2013 5:32 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello I know this has been discussed before but I can't recall the exact procedure, but I think it has to do with redefining the transposition for the alto sax staff, from diatonic to chromatic, although I can't remember whether it also involved changing the direction and the number of half-steps to transpose (i.e. moving the part up vs. moving it down), and then doing an octave transposition on the whole part if needed. -- David H. Bailey dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
Thanks for the reply, I also recall this kind of trick, but as the problem involves only a part of the score, the problem could be not so easily solved. The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Il 03/05/2013 12:15, David H. Bailey ha scritto: On 5/3/2013 5:32 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello I know this has been discussed before but I can't recall the exact procedure, but I think it has to do with redefining the transposition for the alto sax staff, from diatonic to chromatic, although I can't remember whether it also involved changing the direction and the number of half-steps to transpose (i.e. moving the part up vs. moving it down), and then doing an octave transposition on the whole part if needed. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
-Original Message- From: marcellon...@gmail.com The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Alto sax players prefer playing in sharps compared to playing in flats. FREE 3D MARINE AQUARIUM SCREENSAVER - Watch dolphins, sharks orcas on your desktop! Check it out at http://www.inbox.com/marineaquarium ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
Hmm, I'm not so sure, I play sax and don't like very much having to play lots of E# considering them natural F's... Il 03/05/2013 14:38, Phil Daley ha scritto: -Original Message- From: marcellon...@gmail.com The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Alto sax players prefer playing in sharps compared to playing in flats. FREE 3D MARINE AQUARIUM SCREENSAVER - Watch dolphins, sharks orcas on your desktop! Check it out at http://www.inbox.com/marineaquarium ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
True. But I wouldn't want to play Gb's instead of F#'s -Original Message- From: marcellon...@gmail.com Sent: Fri, 3 May 2013 14:49:05 +0200 To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments Hmm, I'm not so sure, I play sax and don't like very much having to play lots of E# considering them natural F's... Il 03/05/2013 14:38, Phil Daley ha scritto: -Original Message- From: marcellon...@gmail.com The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Alto sax players prefer playing in sharps compared to playing in flats. FREE 3D MARINE AQUARIUM SCREENSAVER - Watch dolphins, sharks orcas on your desktop! Check it out at http://www.inbox.com/marineaquarium ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale GET FREE SMILEYS FOR YOUR IM EMAIL - Learn more at http://www.inbox.com/smileys Works with AIM®, MSN® Messenger, Yahoo!® Messenger, ICQ®, Google Talk™ and most webmails ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
You can use a staff style to change the transposition for only the passage you need. I don't remember how the interval and key alter boxes work, but I remember that it is not exactly intuitive. You may have to look it up. Christopher On Fri May 3, at FridayMay 3 7:46 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Thanks for the reply, I also recall this kind of trick, but as the problem involves only a part of the score, the problem could be not so easily solved. The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Il 03/05/2013 12:15, David H. Bailey ha scritto: On 5/3/2013 5:32 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello I know this has been discussed before but I can't recall the exact procedure, but I think it has to do with redefining the transposition for the alto sax staff, from diatonic to chromatic, although I can't remember whether it also involved changing the direction and the number of half-steps to transpose (i.e. moving the part up vs. moving it down), and then doing an octave transposition on the whole part if needed. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
I'm sure there's a more elegant way to do this, but one quick and dirty trick is to give the Alto staff an independent key sig (in the staff attributes box in my version). Of course you have to remember it's independent and won't change key automatically like the other parts, but for only one or two key changes it's not a big problem. Entering the notes first then changing to independent key sig avoids the drudge of transposing. I once had all three Eb tenor horn players complain about too many sharps in a section of one of my pieces, even though they were only playing sustained notes. An independent key sig allowed me to choose any key I wanted and use accidentals, which they found much easier to play! :) Good luck Peter - Original Message - From: Marcello Noia marcellon...@gmail.com To: finale@shsu.edu Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:32 AM Subject: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.3272 / Virus Database: 3162/6292 - Release Date: 05/02/13 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
Christopher is right, as usual - this is the way to go. Set up a staff style with the transposition set to other and these numbers: interval=2 and Key alter= -9, Apply it to your Alto part when you change to the A major section. JB On May 3, 2013, at 8:06 AM, Christopher Smith wrote: You can use a staff style to change the transposition for only the passage you need. I don't remember how the interval and key alter boxes work, but I remember that it is not exactly intuitive. You may have to look it up. Christopher On Fri May 3, at FridayMay 3 7:46 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Thanks for the reply, I also recall this kind of trick, but as the problem involves only a part of the score, the problem could be not so easily solved. The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Il 03/05/2013 12:15, David H. Bailey ha scritto: On 5/3/2013 5:32 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello I know this has been discussed before but I can't recall the exact procedure, but I think it has to do with redefining the transposition for the alto sax staff, from diatonic to chromatic, although I can't remember whether it also involved changing the direction and the number of half-steps to transpose (i.e. moving the part up vs. moving it down), and then doing an octave transposition on the whole part if needed. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
Mny thanks! To all, of course Il 03/05/2013 15:27, John Blane ha scritto: Christopher is right, as usual - this is the way to go. Set up a staff style with the transposition set to other and these numbers: interval=2 and Key alter= -9, Apply it to your Alto part when you change to the A major section. JB On May 3, 2013, at 8:06 AM, Christopher Smith wrote: You can use a staff style to change the transposition for only the passage you need. I don't remember how the interval and key alter boxes work, but I remember that it is not exactly intuitive. You may have to look it up. Christopher On Fri May 3, at FridayMay 3 7:46 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Thanks for the reply, I also recall this kind of trick, but as the problem involves only a part of the score, the problem could be not so easily solved. The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Il 03/05/2013 12:15, David H. Bailey ha scritto: On 5/3/2013 5:32 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello I know this has been discussed before but I can't recall the exact procedure, but I think it has to do with redefining the transposition for the alto sax staff, from diatonic to chromatic, although I can't remember whether it also involved changing the direction and the number of half-steps to transpose (i.e. moving the part up vs. moving it down), and then doing an octave transposition on the whole part if needed. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
I have JABB V3 (the current version. I think the saxes and various basses are pretty good. Trumpets are horrendous -- sound more like a reed organ than a trumpet.. I have worked mostly with the individual trumpet sounds of the notation - keyswitch category. so maybe some of the other trumpet sounds are better. The trumpet harmon mute sound is good but I can't get any accents. The straight mute sound really isn't usable at all. Bucket is mediocre. Overall, there are basic problems with HP in this setting. The most annoying one for me is that HP doesn't observe the marcato accent (the upside down V) correctly. In big band, this will always be an indication of a sharp punch -- never a long note -- always separation. But HP plays it as a long note that is hardly separated at all. And I can't hear any difference between a passage with out slur and with slur. These aren't little nuances. They are essential qualities of big band style. I'd say the JABB set is a little better than MIDI playback, but without hours of tweaking, it is nothing like a realistic sound. That's the critical view. Now, for the supportive view. Even though it is nothing like the hype, I personally find it a good enough quality that it does help me hear things that I would have missed with MIDI playback -- not just bad notes, but weak viocings and phrasing. I have made numerous improvements to arrangements that, realistically, I never would have had time to make if I had to run it by a live band first. So despite its shortcomings, it is worth the money for me. My own mileage varies. Craig On 5/2/2013 10:22 PM, Girard Bowe wrote: And has anybody heard anything more atrocious than Finale's on-board Garritan sounds for brass? Does Garritan JABB sound any better? If so, how much tweaking is involved? Is there another jazz band sound option which doesn't cost an arm and a leg? Giz Richmond VA ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinWin 2011 - Transposing instruments
Wait - that was wrong (it got the right key sig but wrong transposition for Alto Sax) - make it interval=6, key alter -9 On May 3, 2013, at 8:35 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Mny thanks! To all, of course Il 03/05/2013 15:27, John Blane ha scritto: Christopher is right, as usual - this is the way to go. Set up a staff style with the transposition set to other and these numbers: interval=2 and Key alter= -9, Apply it to your Alto part when you change to the A major section. JB On May 3, 2013, at 8:06 AM, Christopher Smith wrote: You can use a staff style to change the transposition for only the passage you need. I don't remember how the interval and key alter boxes work, but I remember that it is not exactly intuitive. You may have to look it up. Christopher On Fri May 3, at FridayMay 3 7:46 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Thanks for the reply, I also recall this kind of trick, but as the problem involves only a part of the score, the problem could be not so easily solved. The alto player will have to deal with that wood of sharps! Il 03/05/2013 12:15, David H. Bailey ha scritto: On 5/3/2013 5:32 AM, Marcello Noia wrote: Hi, surely my problem has been discussed before but I cannot recall if a solution was found. I have a score in Db major where a section goes in A major. Applying the trasposition to the alto sax part, the result is Bb major F# major. Is it possible that the section in F# major could be displayed in Gb major? Selecting/deselecting the simplify key leaves things unchanged. Thank you Marcello I know this has been discussed before but I can't recall the exact procedure, but I think it has to do with redefining the transposition for the alto sax staff, from diatonic to chromatic, although I can't remember whether it also involved changing the direction and the number of half-steps to transpose (i.e. moving the part up vs. moving it down), and then doing an octave transposition on the whole part if needed. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
Hi Craig... How's your cimbasso? ;-) It does take a fair amount of processing to make any sound library work. What are you doing with respect to panning? That can help greatly. So can reverb--how are you routing it? Are you using the stereo stage feature of ARIA? How about EQ? Also--what are you listening on? Computer speakers or studio monitors, or something in between? It is absolutely essential to stagger attack times by a few ticks as well. HP does that to some extent, but perhaps not enough. People sometimes set out of the box expectations for sound libraries too high, which may lead to frustration. Perhaps if you bring your computer down to Franklin and buy me a couple pints of Guinness, we can discover some settings you like. ;-) Some of us either make two scores (one for print one for playback) or enter a lot of invisible markings on one score. Take a bit if time to experiment and I'll bet your frustration levels fall. Jim Sent from my iPhone, so please pardon all the typos. On May 3, 2013, at 10:04 AM, Craig Parmerlee cr...@parmerlee.com wrote: I have JABB V3 (the current version. I think the saxes and various basses are pretty good. Trumpets are horrendous -- sound more like a reed organ than a trumpet.. I have worked mostly with the individual trumpet sounds of the notation - keyswitch category. so maybe some of the other trumpet sounds are better. The trumpet harmon mute sound is good but I can't get any accents. The straight mute sound really isn't usable at all. Bucket is mediocre. Overall, there are basic problems with HP in this setting. The most annoying one for me is that HP doesn't observe the marcato accent (the upside down V) correctly. In big band, this will always be an indication of a sharp punch -- never a long note -- always separation. But HP plays it as a long note that is hardly separated at all. And I can't hear any difference between a passage with out slur and with slur. These aren't little nuances. They are essential qualities of big band style. I'd say the JABB set is a little better than MIDI playback, but without hours of tweaking, it is nothing like a realistic sound. That's the critical view. Now, for the supportive view. Even though it is nothing like the hype, I personally find it a good enough quality that it does help me hear things that I would have missed with MIDI playback -- not just bad notes, but weak viocings and phrasing. I have made numerous improvements to arrangements that, realistically, I never would have had time to make if I had to run it by a live band first. So despite its shortcomings, it is worth the money for me. My own mileage varies. Craig On 5/2/2013 10:22 PM, Girard Bowe wrote: And has anybody heard anything more atrocious than Finale's on-board Garritan sounds for brass? Does Garritan JABB sound any better? If so, how much tweaking is involved? Is there another jazz band sound option which doesn't cost an arm and a leg? Giz Richmond VA ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
Craig, I agree that these sounds improve the chance of catching orchestration and composition errors, but they do require the suspension of disbelief in order to interpret the results of Finale playback and imagine how a band will sound. When I wrote an arranging book for Garritan using these sounds, Gary found Robert Soggetti to massage the examples and render them more realistic. It is possible to do this with reasonably good results (he did), but I can only imagine the amount of work involved, and I don't believe it is done in Finale. Jim makes some good suggestions, balance and panning being more important to me than the staggering of attacks. Bass #2 is one of my basses, and it sounds quite accurate - perhaps improved in evenness, but in this case the attack is unrelenting - no nuance. I know I don't play like that. Trumpets are mostly unrealistic, trombones only slightly better (and all the samples sound better in massed unison than they do individually or in harmony). Saxes are subject to such variation from player to player, that the samples don't come close for me (except for the baritone). Woodwinds are better and percussion is OK. I guess I am suggesting that spending time and effort imagining what you want to hear and adjusting notation with real players is more rewarding than attempts to tweak machines into human behavior. Once a good performance level has been achieved with musicians, there are invigorating variations from performance to performance. Knowing there are people doing it makes all the difference. Modern conveniences lead us to abandon some of the effort we used to make to get face to face with other people, and I admit to the seduction of technology. It's there, everyone is using it, so we think that is the way things must be done. Rehearsals are better, and it's our job to convince players of their value - by writing well and directing them well. My 2c. Chuck On May 3, 2013, at 7:04 AM, Craig Parmerlee cr...@parmerlee.com wrote: I have JABB V3 (the current version. I think the saxes and various basses are pretty good. Trumpets are horrendous -- sound more like a reed organ than a trumpet.. I have worked mostly with the individual trumpet sounds of the notation - keyswitch category. so maybe some of the other trumpet sounds are better. The trumpet harmon mute sound is good but I can't get any accents. The straight mute sound really isn't usable at all. Bucket is mediocre. Overall, there are basic problems with HP in this setting. The most annoying one for me is that HP doesn't observe the marcato accent (the upside down V) correctly. In big band, this will always be an indication of a sharp punch -- never a long note -- always separation. But HP plays it as a long note that is hardly separated at all. And I can't hear any difference between a passage with out slur and with slur. These aren't little nuances. They are essential qualities of big band style. I'd say the JABB set is a little better than MIDI playback, but without hours of tweaking, it is nothing like a realistic sound. That's the critical view. Now, for the supportive view. Even though it is nothing like the hype, I personally find it a good enough quality that it does help me hear things that I would have missed with MIDI playback -- not just bad notes, but weak viocings and phrasing. I have made numerous improvements to arrangements that, realistically, I never would have had time to make if I had to run it by a live band first. So despite its shortcomings, it is worth the money for me. My own mileage varies. Craig On 5/2/2013 10:22 PM, Girard Bowe wrote: And has anybody heard anything more atrocious than Finale's on-board Garritan sounds for brass? Does Garritan JABB sound any better? If so, how much tweaking is involved? Is there another jazz band sound option which doesn't cost an arm and a leg? Giz Richmond VA ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 8831 SE 12th Ave. Portland, OR 97202-7097 land line: (503) 954-2107 cell phone: (360) 201-3434 www.chuckisraelsjazz.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
Craig, The articulation playback is determined locally by the articulation definition. Open up the articulation definition window, find Playback Effect, choose Change Duration from the dropdown menu, and make both Top and Bottom 50% (or more, if you like your marcatos extra fat like Montreal Smoked Meat). If Change Attack or Change Key Velocity are already edited, it will make the note louder, too. These are never set this way in the Finale Defaults, which is a miscalculation on their part. Go ahead and change them in your default file. Christopher On Fri May 3, at FridayMay 3 10:04 AM, Craig Parmerlee wrote: I have JABB V3 (the current version. I think the saxes and various basses are pretty good. Trumpets are horrendous -- sound more like a reed organ than a trumpet.. I have worked mostly with the individual trumpet sounds of the notation - keyswitch category. so maybe some of the other trumpet sounds are better. The trumpet harmon mute sound is good but I can't get any accents. The straight mute sound really isn't usable at all. Bucket is mediocre. Overall, there are basic problems with HP in this setting. The most annoying one for me is that HP doesn't observe the marcato accent (the upside down V) correctly. In big band, this will always be an indication of a sharp punch -- never a long note -- always separation. But HP plays it as a long note that is hardly separated at all. And I can't hear any difference between a passage with out slur and with slur. These aren't little nuances. They are essential qualities of big band style. I'd say the JABB set is a little better than MIDI playback, but without hours of tweaking, it is nothing like a realistic sound. That's the critical view. Now, for the supportive view. Even though it is nothing like the hype, I personally find it a good enough quality that it does help me hear things that I would have missed with MIDI playback -- not just bad notes, but weak viocings and phrasing. I have made numerous improvements to arrangements that, realistically, I never would have had time to make if I had to run it by a live band first. So despite its shortcomings, it is worth the money for me. My own mileage varies. Craig On 5/2/2013 10:22 PM, Girard Bowe wrote: And has anybody heard anything more atrocious than Finale's on-board Garritan sounds for brass? Does Garritan JABB sound any better? If so, how much tweaking is involved? Is there another jazz band sound option which doesn't cost an arm and a leg? Giz Richmond VA ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
Hey, come to think of it, there are no cimbasso sounds on the Garritan libraries. How could they have missed that? :) I'm not doing many of the things you mentioned. I am using a little reverb, but I got frustrated when I couldn't control that from Aria. The Aria player has a tab for effects with the Ambiance and Convolution reverbs there. I couldn't get either of those to work. But if I go into the Finale MIDI menu for VST effects, I could bring up Ambiance directly and that works, but I don't think it saves those settings. -- Exploring further I found that the Aria reverb does work OK. I just wasn't using the sends. So that is a big improvement because it appears to save these reverb settings in the MUS file. I do use smallish studio-quality Yamaha monitors. I looked at the Finale mixer and somehow there were lots of different pan settings -- seemingly random. I'll try setting those more like what you'd expect to hear from the stage. I am not intentionally using stereo stage but I see it was set as I added instruments. I'll play with that and the panning controls. I don't doubt that can make a big difference. I was doing live sound for an outdoor concert last summer -- a concert band. I used one main stereo pair behind the conductor and then supplemented with a few section mics (basses, percussion, etc). I had trouble getting the saxophones into the mix. They were at the far left. I had normally used a mono mix because the audience does not sit in the middle of the ideal stereo field. However, as an experiment, I did just a little bit of stereo separation and the saxes appeared like magic. So I'll play with this a bit. The nice thing is that if these settings are saved with in the MUS file, once I get one arrangement sounding good, I can clone that file for my next project for the same ensemble. I am really confused about the interaction between Aria and the Finale mixer window. They do not appear linked, but they both seem to have an effect. So maybe I am working at cross-purposes by using both windows. Should I just set the Finale mixer to middle vales for volume and pan and then do all adjustments in Aria, or vice versa? I am getting the feeling that it is best to work entirely in the Aria app and ignore the Finale mixer window. Is that correct? Thanks for the suggestions, and if you write a piece for either double-bell euph or cimbasso, I'm your man. I have two double-bell euphs, so maybe we can do a piece featuring two euphs and 4 bells. On 5/3/2013 10:35 AM, Williams, Jim wrote: Hi Craig... How's your cimbasso? ;-) It does take a fair amount of processing to make any sound library work. What are you doing with respect to panning? That can help greatly. So can reverb--how are you routing it? Are you using the stereo stage feature of ARIA? How about EQ? Also--what are you listening on? Computer speakers or studio monitors, or something in between? It is absolutely essential to stagger attack times by a few ticks as well. HP does that to some extent, but perhaps not enough. People sometimes set out of the box expectations for sound libraries too high, which may lead to frustration. Perhaps if you bring your computer down to Franklin and buy me a couple pints of Guinness, we can discover some settings you like. ;-) Some of us either make two scores (one for print one for playback) or enter a lot of invisible markings on one score. Take a bit if time to experiment and I'll bet your frustration levels fall. Jim ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
Thanks for the suggestion. But I can't get out of the starting gate. Where is this articulation definition window? Is that in document options, somewhere in HP settings or somewhere else? I can't find any reference to it in the documentation. On 5/3/2013 11:18 AM, Christopher Smith wrote: Craig, The articulation playback is determined locally by the articulation definition. Open up the articulation definition window, find Playback Effect, choose Change Duration from the dropdown menu, and make both Top and Bottom 50% (or more, if you like your marcatos extra fat like Montreal Smoked Meat). If Change Attack or Change Key Velocity are already edited, it will make the note louder, too. These are never set this way in the Finale Defaults, which is a miscalculation on their part. Go ahead and change them in your default file. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Aria mixer behavior
As I am digging deeper into trying to get a realistic playback, I am struggling with the Aria mixer. I expected the fader levels to be static, like an un-motorized control surface. I want the dynamics to adjust up and down with the dynamic expressions I have entered in the score. But what I am seeing is peculiar behavior where several of my instruments are sending the faders up and down, seemingly at random places that correspond to nothing in particular in my score. It is acting as if I am using it as a plug-in to Sonar or some other DAW. I don't want those faders to move once I have set them. Any idea what might be going on here? FWIW, I set the Finale mixer faders all to max and then closed that window so I could work entirely in Aria. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds
Craig, If you engage the articulation tool you can right click on the selection box over the note and call up the edit articulation definition dialogue where you find the various parameters to edit: Symbols, Symbol Options, Playback Effect, Positioning, etc. The playback effect is where you can experiment with various effects. I've tried using these things and find my patience is kind of tested. I am not very patient! Ha! You might have found it already, though. Michael mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl http://oregonmts.com/mathew/ From: Craig Parmerlee cr...@parmerlee.com To: finale@shsu.edu Cc: Christopher Smith christopher.sm...@videotron.ca Sent: Friday, May 3, 2013 9:21 AM Subject: Re: [Finale] Garritan question - Big Band brass sounds Thanks for the suggestion. But I can't get out of the starting gate. Where is this articulation definition window? Is that in document options, somewhere in HP settings or somewhere else? I can't find any reference to it in the documentation. On 5/3/2013 11:18 AM, Christopher Smith wrote: Craig, The articulation playback is determined locally by the articulation definition. Open up the articulation definition window, find Playback Effect, choose Change Duration from the dropdown menu, and make both Top and Bottom 50% (or more, if you like your marcatos extra fat like Montreal Smoked Meat). If Change Attack or Change Key Velocity are already edited, it will make the note louder, too. These are never set this way in the Finale Defaults, which is a miscalculation on their part. Go ahead and change them in your default file. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Aria mixer behavior
I posted this on another thread, but maybe it deserves its own thread. I am looking for practical advice on how Aria (i.e. the Garritan sounds) relates to the normal Finale mixer window. It appears to me that if I use the faders on either one, they have an effect, but they are not linked. So it is probably a mistake to use both. Same situation for the pan controls. So I am moving forward on the assumption that I should not use the Finale mixer window at all. I have set the Finale faders all to the same level, set all the pans to dead center, and then closed that Finale window, never to be used again. Is that the right approach? But that still leaves a problem regarding the Aria faders. I expected the fader levels to be static, like an un-motorized control surface. I want the volume to adjust up and down during playback based only on the dynamic expressions I have entered in the score. I expect to set the Aria faders once for my starting ensemble balance, and then rely entirely on the score's dynamic expressions during playback. But what I am seeing is peculiar behavior where several of my instruments are sending the Aria faders up and down, seemingly at random places that correspond to nothing in particular in my score. It is acting as if I am using Aria as a plug-in to Sonar or some other DAW. I don't want those faders to move once I have set them. Any idea what might be going on here? Basically it is unusable as it currently exists because my Aria faders keep jumping around on me. Thanks, Craig ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Aria mixer behavior
This post on another forum suggests that you should never use the pan or fader controls on the ARIA player. http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/showthread.php/102602-Finale-Garritan-Aria-faders-reset-on-play I created a new default score from scratch (using the wizard, and then assigning all the JABB instruments myself.) I don't really see any relationship between the ARIA mixer settings and the Finale mixer settings. But if I never touch the ARIA mixer, it seems to work consistently, except that the Finale pan doesn't seem to have a very strong effect. I can never get the pan to put a voice ENTIRELY to one side or another. So from what I can surmise, you use the Aria player to assign instruments and to set up the reverb sends, but nothing else (unless you are tweaking the sound of a particular sample (EQ, etc.). Is that how others do it? On 5/3/2013 6:31 PM, Craig Parmerlee wrote: I posted this on another thread, but maybe it deserves its own thread. I am looking for practical advice on how Aria (i.e. the Garritan sounds) relates to the normal Finale mixer window. It appears to me that if I use the faders on either one, they have an effect, but they are not linked. So it is probably a mistake to use both. Same situation for the pan controls. So I am moving forward on the assumption that I should not use the Finale mixer window at all. I have set the Finale faders all to the same level, set all the pans to dead center, and then closed that Finale window, never to be used again. Is that the right approach? But that still leaves a problem regarding the Aria faders. I expected the fader levels to be static, like an un-motorized control surface. I want the volume to adjust up and down during playback based only on the dynamic expressions I have entered in the score. I expect to set the Aria faders once for my starting ensemble balance, and then rely entirely on the score's dynamic expressions during playback. But what I am seeing is peculiar behavior where several of my instruments are sending the Aria faders up and down, seemingly at random places that correspond to nothing in particular in my score. It is acting as if I am using Aria as a plug-in to Sonar or some other DAW. I don't want those faders to move once I have set them. Any idea what might be going on here? Basically it is unusable as it currently exists because my Aria faders keep jumping around on me. Thanks, Craig ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
