Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
It really can be a useful thing! I've never had a problem with signing to someone that the cue I'm giving is their cue rather than their entrance. Steve P. On 22 Apr 2012, at 00:07, John Howell john.how...@vt.edu wrote: At 10:02 AM +0100 4/21/12, Steve Parker wrote: If i'm preparing music for a recording where the players are sight reading it is often useful to write in helpful cues then as conductor to cue the cues rather than the actual entrance. Hmmm. As a player this would confuse the pants off me. (It would not be a pretty sight!) A conductor's cues are for entrances, period. And a really well-delivered cue can easily bring someone in at the wrong place, since the more confident you look the more they will question whether their counting was off! John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
On 22 Apr 2012, at 09:54, Steve Parker wrote: It really can be a useful thing! I've never had a problem with signing to someone that the cue I'm giving is their cue rather than their entrance. Steve P. How do you show the musician difference between a cue and an entrance? Michael On 22 Apr 2012, at 00:07, John Howell john.how...@vt.edu wrote: At 10:02 AM +0100 4/21/12, Steve Parker wrote: If i'm preparing music for a recording where the players are sight reading it is often useful to write in helpful cues then as conductor to cue the cues rather than the actual entrance. Hmmm. As a player this would confuse the pants off me. (It would not be a pretty sight!) A conductor's cues are for entrances, period. And a really well-delivered cue can easily bring someone in at the wrong place, since the more confident you look the more they will question whether their counting was off! John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
I'm afraid I'm of the opinion that the conductor should see exactly what the performer sees and that if the cues are in the part, they should be in the score too. But, as a performer I would not thank a conductor for indicating the start of the cue to me, nor would I expect it, nor have I ever had it. I want a lead from the conductor on my entry, not on the flute's entry two bars earlier. I have never been cued by the conductor on a cue in the part, only on my own entry (that's when they bother giving a lead at all). Cheers, Lawrence On 22 Apr 2012, at 09:54, Steve Parker wrote: It really can be a useful thing! I've never had a problem with signing to someone that the cue I'm giving is their cue rather than their entrance. -- Lawrenceyates.co.uk ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
I'm talking a very specific situation: sight reading with the red light on! If I was cued a cue in Beethoven 6 I would thank no-one. I'm not talking about cueing to get the players in the right place - I expect the players to know where they are! - just a bit of reassurance that the ff they come in on is coming even though everything is at ppp currently.. Steve P. On 22 Apr 2012, at 11:01, Lawrence Yates yateslawre...@gmail.com wrote: I'm afraid I'm of the opinion that the conductor should see exactly what the performer sees and that if the cues are in the part, they should be in the score too. But, as a performer I would not thank a conductor for indicating the start of the cue to me, nor would I expect it, nor have I ever had it. I want a lead from the conductor on my entry, not on the flute's entry two bars earlier. I have never been cued by the conductor on a cue in the part, only on my own entry (that's when they bother giving a lead at all). Cheers, Lawrence On 22 Apr 2012, at 09:54, Steve Parker wrote: It really can be a useful thing! I've never had a problem with signing to someone that the cue I'm giving is their cue rather than their entrance. -- Lawrenceyates.co.uk ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
Well, if it works with you I can't argue with success! But we might be talking past each other. A cue (in conductor-speak) is a downbeat or upbeat designed to bring a person or a section in for a correct entrance, always prepared (but never over-prepared). That's also what orchestral musicians consider them to be. I try to give them when they're necessary or for safety; some conductors don't. But I will certainly prepare a person or a section for an entrance by either a hand gesture or, more often, simply clear eye contact. That's a trick I picked up watching Robert Shaw, who could be giving several warnings and cues simultaneously using his eyes, facial expression, or either hand very clearly and unambiguously. But the little notes in the parts that orient the player to what is going on in another part, while we CALL them cues, are more properly thought of as warnings. Like so much else in the English language, the same word has different meanings. I would never give an entrance cue to someone to indicate that it was their notated warning cue. And that's certainly not taught in any conducting class I've ever taken. And of course this leaves out the third understood meaning of the word cue: a cross-cue to be played if the designated instrument is not available. The old guys didn't worry about any of these things. They expected their musicians to be able to read and count! They didn't use bar numbering or rehearsal numbers/letters either. John At 8:54 AM +0100 4/22/12, Steve Parker wrote: It really can be a useful thing! I've never had a problem with signing to someone that the cue I'm giving is their cue rather than their entrance. Steve P. On 22 Apr 2012, at 00:07, John Howell john.how...@vt.edu wrote: At 10:02 AM +0100 4/21/12, Steve Parker wrote: If i'm preparing music for a recording where the players are sight reading it is often useful to write in helpful cues then as conductor to cue the cues rather than the actual entrance. Hmmm. As a player this would confuse the pants off me. (It would not be a pretty sight!) A conductor's cues are for entrances, period. And a really well-delivered cue can easily bring someone in at the wrong place, since the more confident you look the more they will question whether their counting was off! John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
Hello Everyone, FYI, response from Curtis at MM, A very helpful support person and answered my question. Thank you for contacting MakeMusic. I believe I have found a solution for your whole rest positioning problem. This will have the whole rest in the default position in the score, and will make it able to be moved in the part. To do so, change the Staff Style assigned to the score to the Blank Notation: All Layers. Then edit that staff style and check Display rests in empty measures and change the Alternate Notation to Blank Notation with Rests and uncheck everything in the other layers. You can then create a whole rest in layer 2 in the part and position it wherever you would like to. Please feel free to respond to this case if you have any further questions about this issue. Curtis W. MakeMusic Customer Support Thanks everyone for your suggestions. Greg Home Office: 604.420.2679 Cell: 604.612.9204 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
Yes, I don't mean giving a grand gesture to cue the cue.. just a nod that we're 'there'. I would be unable to do this if player's cues were not also in front of me. I suppose I've just developed a feel in scoring for the places where regrouping or reassurance may be needed. This is not the same as say cueing entrances with a youth orchestra. ...why oh why does my phone insist on replacing 'cueing' with 'curing'.. 'Curing the trombones' . . ! ;-) Steve P. On 22 Apr 2012, at 17:43, John Howell john.how...@vt.edu wrote: Well, if it works with you I can't argue with success! But we might be talking past each other. A cue (in conductor-speak) is a downbeat or upbeat designed to bring a person or a section in for a correct entrance, always prepared (but never over-prepared). That's also what orchestral musicians consider them to be. I try to give them when they're necessary or for safety; some conductors don't. But I will certainly prepare a person or a section for an entrance by either a hand gesture or, more often, simply clear eye contact. That's a trick I picked up watching Robert Shaw, who could be giving several warnings and cues simultaneously using his eyes, facial expression, or either hand very clearly and unambiguously. But the little notes in the parts that orient the player to what is going on in another part, while we CALL them cues, are more properly thought of as warnings. Like so much else in the English language, the same word has different meanings. I would never give an entrance cue to someone to indicate that it was their notated warning cue. And that's certainly not taught in any conducting class I've ever taken. And of course this leaves out the third understood meaning of the word cue: a cross-cue to be played if the designated instrument is not available. The old guys didn't worry about any of these things. They expected their musicians to be able to read and count! They didn't use bar numbering or rehearsal numbers/letters either. John At 8:54 AM +0100 4/22/12, Steve Parker wrote: It really can be a useful thing! I've never had a problem with signing to someone that the cue I'm giving is their cue rather than their entrance. Steve P. On 22 Apr 2012, at 00:07, John Howell john.how...@vt.edu wrote: At 10:02 AM +0100 4/21/12, Steve Parker wrote: If i'm preparing music for a recording where the players are sight reading it is often useful to write in helpful cues then as conductor to cue the cues rather than the actual entrance. Hmmm. As a player this would confuse the pants off me. (It would not be a pretty sight!) A conductor's cues are for entrances, period. And a really well-delivered cue can easily bring someone in at the wrong place, since the more confident you look the more they will question whether their counting was off! John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
This is the situation that started this thread - needing the staff style to hide a cue in the score. JB Sent from my iPhone using my thumbs w/out a spellchecker On Apr 21, 2012, at 12:44 AM, Christopher Smith christopher.sm...@videotron.ca wrote: We haven't mentioned this yet, but cues that are designed ONLY to help the player know what is happening before an entrance (never meant to be played) should never be visible to the conductor. In a professional or orchestral situation, these are by far the more common type of cue. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
We haven't mentioned this yet, but cues that are designed ONLY to help the player know what is happening before an entrance (never meant to be played) should never be visible to the conductor. Even this depends.. If i'm preparing music for a recording where the players are sight reading it is often useful to write in helpful cues then as conductor to cue the cues rather than the actual entrance. Steve P. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation (linked parts)
i use 2 staff styles for linked parts (explained below), and more when clef changes are needed for the cues (more complicated...). you would need to adjust according to your needs, but basically: layer 1 - leave empty for default rests to appear in SC layer 2 - can be used for a 2nd cue line if ever needed, otherwise empty layer 3 - non-cue rests needed in PT layer 4 - cues 1) cues in SC (s-metatool) alt notation - blank with rests - apply to layer 1, show ONLY expressions - other layers show nothing - all layers show nothing 2) cues in PT (p-metatool) de-select alt notation create the cues (make any adjustments to the cue notes and layer 3 rests with the score transposed), complete with instrument names etc. and once COMPLETELY finished, apply the s-metatool in the score. then in the part you will need to use the context menu to apply the p-metatool to Apply Staff Style To / Current Part/Score ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
At 10:02 AM +0100 4/21/12, Steve Parker wrote: If i'm preparing music for a recording where the players are sight reading it is often useful to write in helpful cues then as conductor to cue the cues rather than the actual entrance. Hmmm. As a player this would confuse the pants off me. (It would not be a pretty sight!) A conductor's cues are for entrances, period. And a really well-delivered cue can easily bring someone in at the wrong place, since the more confident you look the more they will question whether their counting was off! John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
At 1:44 AM -0400 4/21/12, Christopher Smith wrote: We haven't mentioned this yet, but cues that are designed ONLY to help the player know what is happening before an entrance (never meant to be played) should never be visible to the conductor. In a professional or orchestral situation, these are by far the more common type of cue. Absolutely agree. The conductor has no NEED to see those. John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
Hello Everyone, I'm currently working with a score with linked parts. I'm creating cues in Layer 4 and then applying (in the score) the Staff Style blank notation with rests. This works fine until you create a REAL whole rest in the part and vertically reposition the rest. The whole rest is then moved in the score as well, which I don't want. Any suggestions? Many thanks, Greg Home Office: 604.420.2679 Cell: 604.612.9204 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
Re-define the staff style to NOT show notes in other layers On Apr 20, 2012, at 3:00 PM, Greg Hamilton wrote: Hello Everyone, I'm currently working with a score with linked parts. I'm creating cues in Layer 4 and then applying (in the score) the Staff Style blank notation with rests. This works fine until you create a REAL whole rest in the part and vertically reposition the rest. The whole rest is then moved in the score as well, which I don't want. Any suggestions? Many thanks, Greg Home Office: 604.420.2679 Cell: 604.612.9204 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
That's a good solution, until there is a bar where the cue occurs along with real notes to be played. I put in the rests as expressions. Christopher On Fri Apr 20, at FridayApr 20 4:18 PM, John Blane wrote: Re-define the staff style to NOT show notes in other layers On Apr 20, 2012, at 3:00 PM, Greg Hamilton wrote: Hello Everyone, I'm currently working with a score with linked parts. I'm creating cues in Layer 4 and then applying (in the score) the Staff Style blank notation with rests. This works fine until you create a REAL whole rest in the part and vertically reposition the rest. The whole rest is then moved in the score as well, which I don't want. Any suggestions? Many thanks, Greg Home Office: 604.420.2679 Cell: 604.612.9204 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
Chris, in this scenario, would you even be using the staff style? On Apr 20, 2012, at 4:21 PM, Christopher Smith wrote: That's a good solution, until there is a bar where the cue occurs along with real notes to be played. I put in the rests as expressions. Christopher On Fri Apr 20, at FridayApr 20 4:18 PM, John Blane wrote: Re-define the staff style to NOT show notes in other layers On Apr 20, 2012, at 3:00 PM, Greg Hamilton wrote: Hello Everyone, I'm currently working with a score with linked parts. I'm creating cues in Layer 4 and then applying (in the score) the Staff Style blank notation with rests. This works fine until you create a REAL whole rest in the part and vertically reposition the rest. The whole rest is then moved in the score as well, which I don't want. Any suggestions? Many thanks, Greg Home Office: 604.420.2679 Cell: 604.612.9204 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
No, I wouldn't. With the cue in the same layer as the real music, it shows up correctly, even with voiced parts. If you don't want the cue to show in the score, you can hide it with a staff style there, and hide the rests if necessary. I have been conducting a lot of concert band music recently and enjoy the convention of little-used instruments being cued in other parts and the cue just noted in the score as [Bn.] or [Ob.] in the measure where it starts. Then I don't have to ask the band, Anyone have a bassoon cue? or pore through every part beforehand looking for cues. Christopher On 20-Apr-12, at 20-Apr-12 8:28 PM, John Blane wrote: Chris, in this scenario, would you even be using the staff style? On Apr 20, 2012, at 4:21 PM, Christopher Smith wrote: That's a good solution, until there is a bar where the cue occurs along with real notes to be played. I put in the rests as expressions. Christopher On Fri Apr 20, at FridayApr 20 4:18 PM, John Blane wrote: Re-define the staff style to NOT show notes in other layers On Apr 20, 2012, at 3:00 PM, Greg Hamilton wrote: Hello Everyone, I'm currently working with a score with linked parts. I'm creating cues in Layer 4 and then applying (in the score) the Staff Style blank notation with rests. This works fine until you create a REAL whole rest in the part and vertically reposition the rest. The whole rest is then moved in the score as well, which I don't want. Any suggestions? Many thanks, Greg Home Office: 604.420.2679 Cell: 604.612.9204 ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale John Blane Blane Music Preparation 1649 Huntington Ln. Highland Park, IL 60035 847 579-9900 847 579-9903 fax www.BlaneMusic.com j...@blanemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
At 9:27 PM -0400 4/20/12, Christopher Smith wrote: No, I wouldn't. With the cue in the same layer as the real music, it shows up correctly, even with voiced parts. If you don't want the cue to show in the score, you can hide it with a staff style there, and hide the rests if necessary. I have been conducting a lot of concert band music recently and enjoy the convention of little-used instruments being cued in other parts and the cue just noted in the score as [Bn.] or [Ob.] in the measure where it starts. Then I don't have to ask the band, Anyone have a bassoon cue? or pore through every part beforehand looking for cues. Christopher Same thing for me in concert band music. But does it really bother anyone to see the cues in your score? I've long agreed with David Bailey that the conductor should always see exactly what each player sees, and I can't think of a situation that I'd want it any different. In fact for a recent concert on which I guest conducted I mistakenly printed a concert pitch score instead of a transposed score, and reading it drove me nuts because I WANT to see what the players see. With a concert score I have to transpose an individual part so know what the player's really playing. I do realize that others disagree--especially those who are pianists. John -- John R. Howell, Assoc. Prof. of Music Virginia Tech Department of Music School of Performing Arts Cinema College of Liberal Arts Human Sciences 290 College Ave., Blacksburg, Virginia 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:john.how...@vt.edu) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html Machen Sie es, wie Sie wollen, machen Sie es nur schön. (Do it as you like, just make it beautiful!) --Johannes Brahms ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Whole Rests in Blank Notation
On Fri Apr 20, at FridayApr 20 10:40 PM, John Howell wrote: At 9:27 PM -0400 4/20/12, Christopher Smith wrote: No, I wouldn't. With the cue in the same layer as the real music, it shows up correctly, even with voiced parts. If you don't want the cue to show in the score, you can hide it with a staff style there, and hide the rests if necessary. I have been conducting a lot of concert band music recently and enjoy the convention of little-used instruments being cued in other parts and the cue just noted in the score as [Bn.] or [Ob.] in the measure where it starts. Then I don't have to ask the band, Anyone have a bassoon cue? or pore through every part beforehand looking for cues. Christopher Same thing for me in concert band music. But does it really bother anyone to see the cues in your score? I've long agreed with David Bailey that the conductor should always see exactly what each player sees, and I can't think of a situation that I'd want it any different. In fact for a recent concert on which I guest conducted I mistakenly printed a concert pitch score instead of a transposed score, and reading it drove me nuts because I WANT to see what the players see. With a concert score I have to transpose an individual part so know what the player's really playing. I do realize that others disagree--especially those who are pianists. John The reason I like seeing just the text note, rather than the whole cue in the score, is that it is easy to mistake small notes for regular notes at a distance and when there are lots of staves and even the regular-sized notes are rather small and I'm waving my arms around a lot. I can easily be confused as to whether an instrument is actually playing or not, and the score can look full when really I only have five or six instruments making sound. More and more, I am appreciating score layout conventions, as I am really starting to be able to hear what is going on more quickly in a conventionally laid out score. Unusual conventions take me just a little more time to get. I am in complete agreement with you about transposed scores. We haven't mentioned this yet, but cues that are designed ONLY to help the player know what is happening before an entrance (never meant to be played) should never be visible to the conductor. In a professional or orchestral situation, these are by far the more common type of cue. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
