Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
On 22.09.2004 4:02 Uhr, David W. Fenton wrote The ability to import text to a text block from a Word processor, keeping the formatting intact, would be a big help, too. That will never happen, because Mac and PC have two completely different standards for object embedding and data interchange between applications. Well, it would be possible using RTF, no? Works in other programs. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
On 21.09.2004 18:02 Uhr, Ryan Beard wrote Thanks for all of the responses. I should have noted that I want this all in one document so I can make a booklet on my large format printer. And I do want the convenience of just printing one document and being done with it. As I said, if your printer is a PS printer it is pretty easy. Is it worth it to make a feature request to Finale to make text block improvements? I know Finale isn't a word processor, but in the emerging world of desktop publishing, I think it would serve them well to improve the way the program handles text. I'm not expecting a spell checker or anything fancy, but asking for the tabs to jump to a fixed distance doesn't seem like much to me. Anyone agree? Although I can see that this would help in some situations, I don't think I want MakeMusic spend too much time on this. To really be useful they would have to add a real word processor, with layout functions. Personally I would rather see other things improved before this is done. YMMV However, what I would like to see is support for PDF embedding on the Mac. This is where OS X is headding, and I think a lot of the programming is already included in the System itself. That would make embedding TOCs very easy. Create your TOC in Word, Quark or whatever you like, and include it as PDF inside the Finale Doc. Johannes Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
On 21.09.2004 20:08 Uhr, James Bailey wrote I imagine the easiest way to create this would be to print a .ps rather than a .pdf. The .ps should import directly into finale. In your print dialog, in the output option, select postscript, and that will save a file that finale can import. I imagine this would be the easiest way to solve this problem. Finale can import EPS, but not PS. The problem with this is that it will only print correctly if you either have a PS printer, or make a PDF first and print that to your non-PS printer. Printing directly from Finale with embedded EPS graphics to a non PS printer will only print the low-res Preview. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
Johannes Gebauer wrote: On 21.09.2004 18:02 Uhr, Ryan Beard wrote Thanks for all of the responses. I should have noted that I want this all in one document so I can make a booklet on my large format printer. And I do want the convenience of just printing one document and being done with it. As I said, if your printer is a PS printer it is pretty easy. Is it worth it to make a feature request to Finale to make text block improvements? I know Finale isn't a word processor, but in the emerging world of desktop publishing, I think it would serve them well to improve the way the program handles text. I'm not expecting a spell checker or anything fancy, but asking for the tabs to jump to a fixed distance doesn't seem like much to me. Anyone agree? Although I can see that this would help in some situations, I don't think I want MakeMusic spend too much time on this. To really be useful they would have to add a real word processor, with layout functions. Personally I would rather see other things improved before this is done. YMMV However, what I would like to see is support for PDF embedding on the Mac. This is where OS X is headding, and I think a lot of the programming is already included in the System itself. That would make embedding TOCs very easy. Create your TOC in Word, Quark or whatever you like, and include it as PDF inside the Finale Doc. Johannes Johannes I would think they could buy the code for including text handling and formatting. And while PDF embedding may be possible under OSx, it isn't part of the Windows environment so I would rather see text handling (even if it only included the ability to import RTF documents and display/print them as they were created) included before PDF embedding. That old Windows/Mac thing again! -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
On 22 Sep 2004 at 12:04, Johannes Gebauer wrote: On 22.09.2004 4:02 Uhr, David W. Fenton wrote The ability to import text to a text block from a Word processor, keeping the formatting intact, would be a big help, too. That will never happen, because Mac and PC have two completely different standards for object embedding and data interchange between applications. Well, it would be possible using RTF, no? Works in other programs. What, exactly, would interpret the RTF? Would it be editable once imported? If so, what would handle the editing? These are not at all trivial questions. -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
Ryan Beard wrote: Hello Listers and Lurkers, Im working on a song cycle for a client. He wants a table of contents with dot leaders to appear at the front of the collection. I know Finales Text Block tool is pretty primitive, but can it handle something like this? Is there away to make the tab a fixed distance rather than a set number of spaces so things will at least align properly? I think Ive looked into every text block setting Finale offers, and nothing seems to get me what I want. Ive made a nice looking ToC in MS Word. Id rather import that into Finale since all the work is done and the alignment is what I want. However, Ive encountered some problems here as well. This is my procedure: From MS Word, I use OS Xs print dialog to make a PDF file. I open that PDF in Preview (OS Xs default graphics viewer), export that as a TIFF, and finally import the TIFF into Finale. But MS Words resolution is set at 72dpi, so when I print the TIFF from Finale, it looks like bad dot matrix output! Ive downloaded the trial version of Graphic Converter (dont know a URL...), but that doesnt seem to help either, since the original from Word is only 72dpi. Here are my questions: 1) Can Finales Text Block tool do what I want it to do with dot leaders, tabs, alignment, etc? 2) Can MS Words resolution be changed so that my graphic importing method works? I think 300dpi would do. 3) Is it worth buying the full version of Graphic Converter to accomplish this task? 4) Is there something else I could do? Ive thought about several workarounds, namely multiple text blocks for the ToC one for the titles and one for the numbers, and possibly another for the dot leaders. The other workaround is to keep the ToC in Word, and just re-feed the pages to the printer. Id REALLY like to have all this info in one document since the song cycle is probably going to reach 200 pages, and might be in two volumes (which would require a 2nd ToC!). Someone please help! Finale won't do what you want, but if it's a separate page, why not just print it in MSWord? I do that all the time for my title pages, tables of contents and any explanatory notes for a work that are more than a single paragraph. There's no need to incorporate that into the Finale file at all. Use the proper tool for the job. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
On 21.09.2004 12:12 Uhr, dhbailey wrote Finale won't do what you want, but if it's a separate page, why not just print it in MSWord? I do that all the time for my title pages, tables of contents and any explanatory notes for a work that are more than a single paragraph. There's no need to incorporate that into the Finale file at all. Use the proper tool for the job. I agree that this should be done in a Wordprocessor or Layout app. However, there are situations where it is more convenient to still keep it in the Finale file. Especially if you, like me, have everything set up so that printing out a score is simply a click away (I have a large format laser, and I just have to print both sides and staple, the idea of having to print one page from Word would make the whole thing impossible). There are two ways to do this. One way is to create an EPS file of the table-of-contents-page in word, and insert this in Finale (using the graphic tool). You will have to keep the EPS file with your Finale file (the graphic does not get embedded in the Finale file, Finale merely keeps a reference to the EPS). I have done this many times. However, this only works if you have a PS printer. If you do, then this is a really good way to do it. If you haven't got a PS printer, you could do the same by creating a hi-res TIFF (not sure whether you can do this from Word, but I am sure you can with some TIFF-printer). However, this means you will not have the best quality for printing, and it also will take ages to print. Alternatively, use the EPS way and create a PDF from Finale. This PDF should print in high quality on any printer (from Acroabat or Reader, or Preview). Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
Ryan Beard wrote: Im working on a song cycle for a client. He wants a table of contents with dot leaders to appear at the front of the collection. I know Finales Text Block tool is pretty primitive, but can it handle something like this? Is there away to make the tab a fixed distance rather than a set number of spaces so things will at least align properly? For the heck of it, I've played around with this, and I would answer your question, yes, and no. The no is that Finale will not automatically handle dot leaders the way you describe. The yes is that you can incorporate into your use of the text-block tool some of the techiniques that were used when books (and music books) were printed with handset type. In setting a page of a table of contents, a printer would set the text, then inset a solid line of dots of the necessary width, then set the page number. To properly align the dots, he would include a spacer of appropriate width. Now these spacers are not immediately available, but there is a way to get the same effect in a text block. Assume you have a line in the TOC, and using four spaces between the end of the line, and the first dot leader is too short, but five spaces is too long. To get the right distance, type five spaces, and in the text block editor, select one of the five spaces by click and drag, and change the point size of that space to a smaller value. By experimenting, you can get the correct value to make the dots align vertically. Note that this technique does not work the other way. That is, you cannot type four spaces and change one of the spaces to a larger point size. The reason is that the characters have a fixed ratio of height to width, and if you increase the width, you also increase the height. In the text tool, the default line spacing is determined by the tallest character in the line, so the wider character being also higher this will cause the spaciing between the line and the one above and the one below to be increased, too. Reducing the character operates the same way, that is, the narrower character is also shorter, but this is not noticeable because the other characters on the line are still the original height. I have seen another technique used in some books set with handset type, where it appears from the fact that the TOC listing, the page numbers, and the leaders do not exactly align, that the three groups were set in different, with the dot leaders perhaps being a solid block. This, too, can be approximated in Finale by typing the TOC as two or three separate text blocks, with the content descriptions, leaders, and page numbers all residing in columnar frames. Alternatively, a similar effect can be achieved by typing the descriptions in a left justified column on the left side of a text block, and and page numbers in a right justified column at the right side of the page. You can create a second text block, narrower in width, containing your dot leaders, and place that text block on top of the text block containing the descriptions and page numbers. This techique can also be used with box drawing fonts to create borders. I have used both the typesetting methods above, and the Dave Bailey's suggestion of doing the TOC in a word processing document. The way I decide which to use is how I plan to print the item out. If I want to print a booklet, using Finale's page ranges, I use the text blocks as described above. If I'm not concerned about being able to use the booklet printing facilities in Finale, I'm more likely to use the word processing method. ns ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
Clarifying what I wrote: In setting a page of a table of contents, a printer would set the text, then inset a solid line of dots of the necessary width, then set the page number. The foundries which cast type also sold metal strips with dots at specific intervals along the strip, with the sizes of the dot, and placement on the strip appropriate to create the dot leader. Larger type sizes used larger dot on on the dot leader. ns ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
Haven't you considered converting all, your Finale and MS Word docs to PDF and printing from there? pdf allows you to impose your document any way you want or need, and you can choose whatever resolution you desire. Godofredo dhbailey wrote: Ryan Beard wrote: Hello Listers and Lurkers, Im working on a song cycle for a client. He wants a table of contents with dot leaders to appear at the front of the collection. I know Finales Text Block tool is pretty primitive, but can it handle something like this? Is there away to make the tab a fixed distance rather than a set number of spaces so things will at least align properly? I think Ive looked into every text block setting Finale offers, and nothing seems to get me what I want. Ive made a nice looking ToC in MS Word. Id rather import that into Finale since all the work is done and the alignment is what I want. However, Ive encountered some problems here as well. This is my procedure: From MS Word, I use OS Xs print dialog to make a PDF file. I open that PDF in Preview (OS Xs default graphics viewer), export that as a TIFF, and finally import the TIFF into Finale. But MS Words resolution is set at 72dpi, so when I print the TIFF from Finale, it looks like bad dot matrix output! Ive downloaded the trial version of Graphic Converter (dont know a URL...), but that doesnt seem to help either, since the original from Word is only 72dpi. Here are my questions: 1) Can Finales Text Block tool do what I want it to do with dot leaders, tabs, alignment, etc? 2) Can MS Words resolution be changed so that my graphic importing method works? I think 300dpi would do. 3) Is it worth buying the full version of Graphic Converter to accomplish this task? 4) Is there something else I could do? Ive thought about several workarounds, namely multiple text blocks for the ToC one for the titles and one for the numbers, and possibly another for the dot leaders. The other workaround is to keep the ToC in Word, and just re-feed the pages to the printer. Id REALLY like to have all this info in one document since the song cycle is probably going to reach 200 pages, and might be in two volumes (which would require a 2nd ToC!). Someone please help! Finale won't do what you want, but if it's a separate page, why not just print it in MSWord? I do that all the time for my title pages, tables of contents and any explanatory notes for a work that are more than a single paragraph. There's no need to incorporate that into the Finale file at all. Use the proper tool for the job. ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
Ryan Beard wrote: Thanks for all of the responses. I should have noted that I want this all in one document so I can make a booklet on my large format printer. And I do want the convenience of just printing one document and being done with it. Is it worth it to make a feature request to Finale to make text block improvements? I know Finale isn't a word processor, but in the emerging world of desktop publishing, I think it would serve them well to improve the way the program handles text. I'm not expecting a spell checker or anything fancy, but asking for the tabs to jump to a fixed distance doesn't seem like much to me. Anyone agree? Ryan It would be fantastic if MakeMusic would make huge improvements in their text block functions -- the ability to create a completely aligned table of contents with dot leaders just as you are trying to do would be wonderful! By all means, make the request! -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
The ability to import text to a text block from a Word processor, keeping the formatting intact, would be a big help, too. dhbailey wrote: It would be fantastic if MakeMusic would make huge improvements in their text block functions -- the ability to create a completely aligned table of contents with dot leaders just as you are trying to do would be wonderful! By all means, make the request! ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
I imagine the easiest way to create this would be to print a .ps rather than a .pdf. The .ps should import directly into finale. In your print dialog, in the output option, select postscript, and that will save a file that finale can import. I imagine this would be the easiest way to solve this problem. On 21.09.2004 9:02 Uhr, Ryan Beard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for all of the responses. I should have noted that I want this all in one document so I can make a booklet on my large format printer. And I do want the convenience of just printing one document and being done with it. Is it worth it to make a feature request to Finale to make text block improvements? I know Finale isn't a word processor, but in the emerging world of desktop publishing, I think it would serve them well to improve the way the program handles text. I'm not expecting a spell checker or anything fancy, but asking for the tabs to jump to a fixed distance doesn't seem like much to me. Anyone agree? Ryan ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] table of contents and MS Word
On 21 Sep 2004 at 14:49, Raymond Horton wrote: The ability to import text to a text block from a Word processor, keeping the formatting intact, would be a big help, too. That will never happen, because Mac and PC have two completely different standards for object embedding and data interchange between applications. -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
