Intro from an old timer.
This message is from: Nancy Lehnert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello everyone! My name is Nancy Lehnert, sometimes better known as Nancy's Fjord Horses! I am new to the mailing list but have been reading the E-mails for a few days and love the conversations. It is wonderful! I've been an equine enthusiast all my life and have raised horses since 1964. I was introduced to the wonderful world of the Fjords when I met my late husband, Jim Clow in 1974 and they have been a part of my life ever since! Lucky me! Guess that makes me one of the "old timers" of this breed in the States?! Lou Thiesen and I joined up about eight years ago and his work enhances the operation with his horsemanship as well as his carriage building abilities. Just ask Dave McWethy about the quality of his Thiesen Carriage. Lou was asked to be the driving clinician for the Kansas Equifest in Feb. That's where we met Steve McIlree and Cynthia Madden who were kind enough to drive "Tank" for the demos. Needless to say, Tank was wonderful to work with and stole the show!!! Note to Brian Jacobson: I enjoyed meeting your folks when they were still in Colorado and we were back from Wyoming for a visit. Jim had purchased his first Fjord mare in 1964 from Art and Betty Pfister in Aspen, CO when Jim still lived in Old Snowmass. I am glad you have carried on your father's good work of breeding the Fjord horses and I appreciate your imput to this mailing list. Jim and I lived in Buffalo, Wyoming bordering the Purdy Ranch. Gene Bauer bought many of Bob Purdy's horses. I met Gene in Montana when he was visiting David Parker who had imported the stallion Ask ( a son of Grabb). I was standing the stallion King Gjestar whom Gene had raised. That was one of the first Fjord Horse Playdays in the country. We are so fortunate to have so many more shows, fairs, exhibitions and evaluations now. One of the other historic Firsts was the 1984 Fjord Gathering in Hood River, Oregon. Jon Hegdal, who was head of the Norgesfjordhestlag, visited for the event. Fjord owners from Canada, Washington, Wyoming, Alaska, Idaho, and Oregon came and many with horses. Everyone demonstrated something with their horses-- riding, packing, driving, plowing etc. None of us had seen so many Fjords in one place together before! It was wonderful. I still get the awe struck feeling when seeing the horses at shows today. Traveling to the Fjord shows in Norway and The Netherlands, was a very good learning experience for me. Paying close attention to the judging of hundreds of Fjord horses gives one a better "eye" to judge horses. What helped the most was being able to speak with the judges and breeders in The Netherlands and ask questions about the pedigrees as well as the faults or strong points of the horses. I imported horses from The Netherlands in 1987 hoping to add to the gene pool in the States. The stallion Glengard (a Bjorgard son) was one of those. He sired the mare NFH Dokka who achieved a First Place Blue ribbon for conformation and movement at the NFHR Evaluation. ( The day after being evaluated, Dokka didn't show well at halter because she was so worried about an upset foal she knew outside the ring that she didn't want to stand like a "statue pony." Yes, she has a very strong mothering instinct! ) As Carol R. says, there isn't the "perfect" horse and even in this mare, there was still room for improvement. So I asked David Klove, a Norwegian Judge, who saw the mare, what I should look for in the stallion I would breed to her. He told me she needed one with "more bone, better movement in the front legs and a little bit shorter back." That's what I went looking for. Having noted bloodlines from Norway I admired, I next purchased a Ramstad son MVF Ravel out of Froya. Both sire and dam had been evaluated by the Norwegian judges and received good marks. I next had a very competent Equine Vet assess the young stallion for the standard teeth and testicles but more stringently for conformation and movement since no evaluations were going on at that time. Ravel was next unofficially evaluated and approved by Jon Hegdal when Jon was with the film crew documenting the Fjords in the USA. The response of Heather Mason, an AHSA r-rated judge, (who also raises Warmbloods and competes at Dressage shows at Grand Prix level) after having seen a video of Ravel in motion stated " I love his movement!" As far as Evaluations go, I believe in them whole heartedly! I believe that a stallion's value is not just in what he is, but more importantly, in his potency to produce offspring as good or better than he himself or the mares he breeds. Bob VanBon once told me that a very good stallion in Holland was gelded because his offspring were not of good quality. One of Ravel's two year old fillies placed First in a large halter class at Libby, Montana last year. The nick between Dokka and Ravel had worked well... The filly had inherited her sire's good front legs and movem
Re: Intro to the list
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Lori Albrough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I became interested in Fjords back in 1986 or 87. > Marsha Jo Hannah had just recently bought Nansy and was posting to > rec.equestrian about her (Nansy's) wonderful qualities. I was intrigued. > Here was a compact, hardy, thrifty, smart, trainable, kind, > loaded-with-character, all-around type of horse. I searched for more > info -- not much was available -- but at some point I found a picture of > a Fjord. It was BEE-YOU-TEA-FULL, and I was sold. I'm flattered! Although I'm a little perplexed about the time-line. I got Nansy in the fall of 1986, but didn't get involved with rec.equestrian right away. More like 1989, as best I can recall However, that does point out that there are many ways to "promote" Fjords. I'm not a breeder; I don't show; I rarely ride in public places. But, I talk (a lot) about my critters online, and over the years, I've answered questions from whomever expressed interest. There are at least 3 Fjord owners nearby who've told me that it's all my fault. ;-) Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 30 mi SSE of San Francisco, Calif. ---
Re: Temperament vs Character
This message is from: "Amy K. White" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 11:37 AM 5/4/98 -0400, you wrote: I am sure this particular Fjord character of will influences some >of the other breed character that make the Fjord so endearing, Sue, I thought that your post was very insightful and a good way to look at differences in "temperament". One of the helpful things about this list for me, a newcomer to Fjords, has been the discussion of the Fjord character and temperament. When I began working with our gelding last year, I'm sorry to say I described him to several people as "stubborn". (My other horses are Thoroughbreds and an Arab, so the hot-blooded temperament is what I'm used to.) I have come to view his personality much differently now, especially after this list started. Thank you, Sue, and many of you for sharing your your methods and philosophies that are so helpful in training Fjords. Amy White Omaha, Nebraska >
Temperament vs Character
This message is from: Sam & Sue Banks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> In discussing Evaluations, people mentioned temperament, character along with misbehavior and aggression. Since I am not sure how the words 'temperament' and 'character' are being used, I thought I would put forth my understanding and I hope that those more knowledgeable can clarify these words better for me. Temperament can be used two ways in the dog world. One can just be a general term-a descriptive "good' or 'bad' temperament. The second way is more specific- there are temperament tests for puppies, similar to the tests used on humans (Myers-Briggs for example) to help categorize the puppy so that a breeder can suggest the best temperament to fit the new owner's expectations and needs. A super obedience prospect pup would likely be too lively and inventive for a pet owner, for instance. So in my mind, temperaments are not good or bad in themselves, but can be good or bad depending on the outlook of the persons around the animal. Dealing with certain human temperaments frustates me, and likewise I am sure I drive some people nuts, but just because we are different does not mean we are bad. I think the combination of certain temperaments plus the enviornment that the animal is raised in make those combinations dangerous and 'bad' for humans. Most experienced professional horseman feel that a dominant horse will make the best performance horse, of course once you have trained it properly. But a dominant horse can become agressive and dangerous in the wrong hands, as we have all seen. Pat Parelli writes something like this- "what is a thrill for me might be a chill for you." Different temperaments appeal to different people, and, like dogs, different temperaments can be suitable for different horse uses. And different people expect different 'behavior' from their horses, so their horses may be 'good' to them but 'bad' to me, and this is training, not inherent temperament. So in my mind, a stallion that misbehaves should not be severely penalized for his behavior and labeled as having a bad temperament immediately. The quality of the offspring are used to see whether he has a useful temperament to pass on- as someone mentioned on the list, she had seen an undesireable temperament passed on by a stallion into his foals despite proper handling of the foals. Character defines all the animals in the breed- I want Fjord character, not Morgan, Thoroughbred or Quarter Horse character in my Fjords. I love the imagery of character in the proposed Standard Published in the Herald. Sometimes only images can describe things that defy words. I just have to comment about one aspect of Fjord character, I often hear 'stubborn' and 'willful' and this is such a negative slant. I prefer to call my horses opinionated and strong willed and I respect these traits and use them. How can I put this? When you talk with another person who has strong feelings and opinions on a subject, but you disagree and start telling them they are wrong, all you get is a fight, hurt feelings and shutdown of communication. But if you can respect their opinion, and calmly show them your ideas, often you can 'agree to disagree', sometimes they can understand your point of view, and at least you can respect each other's point of view without anyone feeling wrong. So my horses are willing to share their opinion easily with me, and then I know where I am with them and I plan how to convince them that my opinion is a good one. If I want to argue, my Fjords are more than willing to fight for their opinions, so I don't argue and fight, I just 'wait', and asking with my legs aids, for instance, until they make it their choice to listen. So I "talk" with my aids and I "listen" to them with for their reaction, and we communicate. I have had 2 other experienced horsepeople try to "help" me at different points (and I did ask for help since I had never started a horse by myself, although I have ridden 30 years). Anyway, they tried 'muscling' my young Fjord like they would other horses (breeds with more flight than fight reactions), all they got was an uncooperative Fjord. The horse learned nothing except resistance, and they said -the filly- had an attitude problem! I might take longer to teach it, but the horse knows I don't fight (where the horse could win a fight) and I don't quit until the horse makes my idea their choice. I have a willing partner when I am done, the horse learns new stuff easier, I don't get in fights so I don't get scared or hurt by my horses and I am very careful not to abuse or misuse the trust my horses have given me. I for one LOVE this Fjord character especially when combined with Natural Horsemanship methods. I am sure this particular Fjord character of will influences some of the other breed character that make the Fjord so endearing, but I have been too wordy already. Sue Banks, Virginia, USA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #44
This message is from: Arthur Rivoire <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi - This message is from Carol at Beaver Dam Farm, Nova Scotia We had a great day yesterday. Sold three horses, and had an exquisite filly born out of Maryke (daughter of Hjerter-Knaeght) and Gjest . . . of course. We only have one stallion. The filly was born in the hour between 7 pm & 8 pm. I'd been communing with her at 6:45, consoling her as I knew she was very unhappy and uncomfortable. Then, Tracy, our stable manager, burst in our door at 8:15 screaming that we'd had a filly, and the baby was on her feet. --- She's a tall, sweet filly with a dished face, and already I can see that she has nice markings. Her dorsal stripe down the mane is very, very dark. And the mane is unusually long. We've named her BDF Phoebe. It's our "P" year. One of the horses sold yesterday is a gelding named BDF Jubilee Canada (Gjest x Maryke), and he was sent here by his Maryland owner to be sold. He arrived April 12th, and sold 21 days later. "Jubie" will be going to boarding school with his new owner, 13 year old Anna. The other two horses sold will be going to Newfoundland . . . of all places. Now that's truly . . .THE END OF THE EARTH. You can't go any further. It's even got it's own TIME ZONE -- a half an hour later than we are, and we're an hour later than Maine. --- I was feeling so good about these nice happenings, that I had a lovely, dreamless sleep. However, this morning I got really stressed out as I glanced at our current Sales List, and discovered that I only have ONE HORSE LEFT TO SELL. This is not good as I have five trainers lined up for this summer, and Driving Guests coming with the intention of buying horses. So, if any of you out there have a horse (a good Fjordhorse) that you wish to sell, I could help you. I'm particularly interested in taking on horses with European backgrounds . . .but only because I'm more familiar with those bloodllines. However, if it's a quality Fjord with no serious behavior or conformational problems, I'd be happy to talk with you. So, if any of you think I could help you out, please give me a call, or email. We have a truck going down to the States within the month. Transportation is not anywhere near as much as you'd think, and there's no duty or quarantine either into Canada or out. We've got lots of happy customers more than willing to talk with you, so if you'd like references, let us know. Oh, one more thing. It's really been some week. This past Wednesday, Holly, our Solar daughter, had a wonderful colt. He's big, brave, and friendly. Also, rather splendid looking. We named him BDF Polestar. Best regards, Carol >
Re: stray mane hairs
This message is from: "the Sessoms'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> This message is from: "Dave McWethy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Meredith, I'm glad you address the question of where those long stray white hairs come from the day after you trim a mane. Where were those hairs when you were trimming the mane? This is one of the central mysteries about Fjords. <<< Dave ... it's spooky isn't it?:-o Meredith Sessoms Soddy-Daisy, Tennessee USA <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - Dorina - NFR Aagot - - - Fjords - Caper - Carly - Crickett - - - Labradors
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #44
This message is from: DBLDAYFARM <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a big welcome to Lori Albrough...nice to meet you... I also have a daughter of Gjest. small world. I live in Utah, USA. My mare Johanna is a nine year old and I have owned her a little over one year. Have not had much time to do a lot with her, but pans are to drive her as she has already been trained, for now I just love her and ride when I can. Luwana Day
Re:
This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 07:17 PM 5/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >This message is from: "Jon A. Ofjord" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Mike, > >Thanks for all the good information on evaluations and your work on the >NFHR home page. > >Congratulations to Niki! > Thanks Jon
Re: Evaluations
This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 04:15 PM 5/3/98 -0700, you wrote: >This message is from: "the Sessoms'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Thanks a bunch, Mike, for putting the Conformation and Performance >Evaluation Program info on a NFHR web page . That answers a lot of my >questions. > Your welcome, hopefully it will be of use to others as well. Thanks to Dave & Pam McWethy for the idea too. === Norwegian Fjord Horse Registry http://www.nfhr.com Mike May, Registrar mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Webster, NY, USA (Suburb of Rochester) Voice 716-872-4114 FAX 716-787-0497 ===
