Re: A.I. - good or bad?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steven A White) Jean, This is a lot easier said than done. Before it was well documented that Impressive was the cause for HYPP, you could find yourself in a law suit for even suggesting to anyone that the stallion was the cause of this disease. It seems most associations would rather put up with the problem than go thru lengthy court battles trying to disqualify the stud. Steve White Waterloo, NE
RE: Secret Santa Idea
This message is from: Doug Knutsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi Cynthia - What is "Secret Santa?" Sounds intriguing, would you publish details? Thanks much. Peg Knutsen
Horse related accidents.
This message is from: Pat Wolfe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> There has been quite a bit of discussion on the subject if you should wear a hard hat or not. I would like to add a little more thaught to that by telling you of some of my experiences. This will be done by questions and answers. 1, How many years have you been working with horses? 28 2, How many horse related accidents have you had that caused body injury? 4. 3, How many could have been avoided if you had the experience that you have now? 3 4, How many carriage or sleigh accidents have you had? 2 5, How many riding accidents have you had? 1 6, How many draft accidents have you had? 1 7, How many of these happend when you were alone on the farm working the horses? 1 8, Where you unconscious the time you were alone? Yes 9, How long where you unconscious? 1 hour. 10. Do you remember anything about the accident? No 11, What is the first thing you remember? My wife standing over me bawling her eyes out wondering if I was going to live or not. 12, What is the next thing you remembered? The ambulance driver asking me what day it was. I can't remember my answer. 13, How was the ambulance ride?. Horrible. Every little bump felt like someone was stabbing me in the back with a knife. 14 What is the next thing you remember? In the emergency ward I remember asking the Dr. to take off the collar that they had on my neck because because it was aching like hell. His answer was. Mr. Wolfe we think you have a broken back or a broken neck and if we take this collar off you may be paralized for the rest of your life. That scared the hell out of me and I have never forgotten that moment. 15, How many hours where you in the emergency ward? 9 16, How many days where you in the hospital? 6 17, What were your injuries caused from that accident? Broken collar bone, broken ribs and the rest crack on the left side, bruised lung, smaller lung space and a concussion. 18, How much work time have you missed because of horse related accidents? 4 months. 19, Do you carry any accident insurance to cover you while you are off work? no 20, Where you wearing a hard hat when these accidents occurred? No 21, Are you wearing a hard hat now when you are working with the horses? Yes 22, Since you have been wearing a hard hat has it saved you from a head injury? Yes 23, What advise can you give too other horse owners. Keep safety in mind at all times and NEVER trust a horse, even the quiet ones. When there is an accident in a family it effects more than just the person that was injured. Pat
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #249
This message is from: "Mary Barsness" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Mike, You wrote the following regarding Vanya, >ANd from entering some stallion breeding reports into the database >yesterday I find yet another name as an owner of Vanja. Her owner as >listed on the report is Beth Anderson in Wisconsin. > Jane Sessions did sell Vanya. I believe it was to a women in Wisconsin. Mary Barsness> > >== > >
Fjords for children
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Duane White might like this story, as he considers his baby's first horse. We're also newcomers to the breed, so don't count me as an authority on this. I'll tell you our experiece. We own two mares with their two fillies. Viola, the 12-year-old mare, is so gentle anybody can sit on her. I have two children and a dozen + neices and nephews of all ages. They all ride Viola, with my sister Hannah or me at the halter. Viola was invited to a neighbor's Halloween party last month, and gave rides to 10 or so children, all dressed in scary, flappy clothes. It didn't bother Viola bit, and the moms had a great time taking photographs. Last week Onalee, our other mare, gained some unexpected credits as a child's horse. Every day we let the horses out to pasture, a quarter mile long. In the evening Hannah sometimes rides Viola back to the barn, bareback and with only a halter. So one night my nephew, Jacob (a small 12-yr-old) asks, "Hannah, can I get the horses in? I want to ride Viola." Hannah hesitated, as it was already pitch dark, and even old Viola sometimes gets frisky at night. But Jacob begged and Hannah gave in, handing him the halter along with some safety warnings. Well, Jacob got on the wrong horse. To Hannah's consternation he came riding up to the barn on Onalee, who is only three years old and green broke. Jacob was surprised, too. "The only thing I noticed," he said, "was when I got on her back she looked back and sniffed me." What surprised us most was that Jacob said Onalee walked slowly all the way in, as Viola and the fillies ran ahead to see who could get to the barn first. In the many times Hannah and I brought the horses in with Viola on halter, Onalee always ran to the barn at top speed. >From here on Jacob and Onalee will be inseparable, I think. Barbara Lyn Lapp Lapp Family Fjords Cassadaga, New York
Solveig II, Vanja, Sleipner
This message is from: "Mary Barsness" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Brian, Thanks so much for the information you had on Solveig. It is fun to know the personal history of your horse. I think I can clear up some confusion on the travels of Vanja. You wrote that she was sold to some people in Florida. I think that is an error. The man (Klaus VanZee) I bought my horses from had purchased them from your grandfather. I think he bought around 15 horses all at the same time. Solveig's mother ( Vanja) was pregnant when Klaus purchased her. When I purchased Solveig, her mother was listed as Johanna. Klaus thought the horse was Johanna. When I went to blood type Solveig, she didn't match. After some investigating and checking other mares for matches it was discovered that Solveigs mother was really named Vanja not Johanna. It turned out that non of the mares that Klaus purchased was Johanna. So I assume that a different horse went to Florida maybe Johanna). Anyway, I was just relieved we got it all straightened out. I must thank Mike May for all his effort in tracing Solveig's correct parents. After I went through this experience I thought that maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to reguire that foals get microchipped at an early age. I know everyone thinks they can tell their horses apart, but if you had a large herd, I can see how you might get confused. Anyway thanks again Brian for the information. Mary Barsness
PLEASE VISIT THIS SITE
This message is from: Wild Flower Fjord Farm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Dear fjord list, We are asking everyone to visit Horse 2000 home page. Our farm Wild Flower Fjord Farm is one of the farms that are posted on the site. To support this site we would like for everyone to take 5 minutes and discover the fjord page. It's a beginning and all your comments will be greatly appreciated. Please visit; www.horse2000.com All your support is greatly appreciated. Thank you all! Happy Fjording! Wild Flower Fjord Farm Send feed back to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: A.I.difficulty
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Brian wrote: >I want to caution everybody about arriving at premature conclusions >regarding the difficulty of A.I.ing Fjords. When I went through Colorado >State University (and took all the Equine Reproduction electives I could) >in vet school, nothing was said about special difficulty with Norwegian >Fjords. Well, Brian, I sure hope that they aren't any more difficult than other breeds for AI may be the only option I have up here in Alaska! I only know what my vet told me. I wonder if my vet, having taken the courses "After the fact" wasn't sort of realizing he'd goofed on some things in doing my mare, but it certainly seemed that the semen from this particular stallion wasn't very active. He also had tried AI with a couple other Fjord stallions for people up here, and thought he'd recieved dead or poor quality semen but that was also before he took the courses. Since then he's had great success up here AI-ing other breeds of horses I guess I sort of got a bad deal all around, as the Lady who was handling the stallion (she was leasing him from the owner at her breeding facility) and with whom I had the breeding contract refused to return any of the stud fee or even the deposit on the container! She hasn't even answered my registered letters, etc. So I was out a lot of money, and will be a lot more cautious should I ever try it again. Maybe it was partly the fault of the mare, partly the fault of the vet not doing things right, and partly the fault of the Stallion's semen not being viable, but it was a bad experience all around. I guess that I would just caution again anybody who is thinking of AI-ing their mare to 1) make sure the mare is healthy and capable of easily becoming pregnant, 2) be sure the Stallion they are considering has proven to be successful in breeding with shipped cooled semen, 3) have a good contract with honest people who will honor it, and 4) make sure your vet is experienced and has had success doing Artificial Insemination on HORSES (my vet had done a lot of cattle with success before he took the Equine courses) One thought just occurred to me: If some Fjord Stallions have sperm that is more viable when cooled and shipped than other stallions, then "long distance breeders" will be selecting them to breed to and we will be selecting for the trait of good semen viablity rather than other probably more important traits. In other words, it is conceivable (?) if a poor quality stallion should have semen with superior viability when shipped he would probably be the one more likely to be bred to AI because of his success getting mares in foal. Not a good thing! >we are not aware of any certain breed which is more difficult than any >other. There is a large amount of variability within breeds (i.e. some >stallions ship better than others), but not between breeds that I am >aware of. > Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska Where the sun is starting it's descent and it is only 2:45 pm. Gotta go out and move hay! ** Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Riding helmets/minor head trauma
This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I have a friend who finally had to give up training horses because of a head injury received in a car! Her seat belt wasn't enough. Due to her previous concussions in horse training accidents, her car head injury almost cost her her sanity. She still sees flashing lights and gets headaches, but was lucky this time. My mother, has had numerous TIA's, resulting in growing brain damage over time. She has slurred speech, considerable anxiety, memory loss, confusion and bursts into tears regularly, with the statement "You do not know what it is like not to have a mind." She is very aware of her disability, but can do nothing to correct it. Not fun! > >I wonder why nobody ever thought of making helmet compulsory in cars. > >Take care, Anton > > > > > Gail Russell Forestville CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Just saying "HI"
This message is from: "duane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> HI, Just signed on yesterday and am surprised at the number of responses. I think I am going to like this! Which brings me to my question. I have loved the look of Fjords for a long time and I own 9 horses myself so I'm definitely hooked. And I have heard about their gentle nature and since I am the proud dad of "Savannah" who is 20 months old, in the back of my head I keep thinking about that 1st pony for her. I'd love for her to have a Fjord and am looking for suggestions from Fjord owners as if this would be a good idea or not. Any info you have for me about their temperment etc. would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time. Sincerely, Duane White
Re: A.I.difficulty
This message is from: Anton Voorhoeve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I don't know about fresh semen but frozen semen I would advise to forget it. I had 40 straws of top quality frozen semen from Holland producing only two foals. Vet's expertise is one problem but the life span of frozen semen is less than fresh semen. I bought a stallion and now four mares out of six are pregnant and one customer's. GAIL RUSSELL wrote: > This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Exactly how difficult is A.I? My understanding is that success rate depends > on a vet (or owner inseminator) who has some experience at it? I once tried > to A.I. a Scottish Highland cow. Well, it was easy with a Jersey cow - > probably from long lines of dairy A.I. cows. But the wild Scottish - no > way! Impossible to recognize her heat cycle, and she wasn't thrilled with > the palpation, etc. Eventually had to give up having > > > >This has only been done in one case that I know of. Most of the shipping > >is done within the US/Canada. It really isn't used that much. > > > >Mike > > > > > Gail Russell > Forestville CA > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Riding helmets/minor head trauma
This message is from: Anton Voorhoeve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi, this is Anton Voorhoeve from Fjord Horses of Narnia Right on Cathy: This wearing a helmet can't be repeated often enough. Minor head trauma is minor for the doctor, I know, I have been a doctor for almost 25 years and have seen lots of tragic preventable head injuries. "Minor" means we don't have to send the patient to the neuro-surgeon or the hospital, so it's a minor problem for the doctor. "Go home, rest and observation". Even the smallest bang of the head can result in "very minor" problems like chronic headaches! I have had several patients who's existence has become marginal after a minor head injury. When it is possibly more serious and Ray is not what is required but a CT scan, think of the cost and time spent in the hospital when you should have been feeding your horses. At our camp everyone wears a helmet, only once did a young girl fall off and was kicked right on the helmet, she probably would have died and with the helmet had nothing wrong. That was worth all the hassle with helmets. So read Cathy Koshman's letter if you haven't already. And, if you feel you still like to go without because it feels good and you are willing to risk your brain for it, think (while you still can) about the people who have to live with you after your injury not to speak of the enormous cost for treatment and rehabilitation. I wonder why nobody ever thought of making helmet compulsory in cars. Take care, Anton
Re: A.I. - good or bad?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (jean gayle) >This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (BRIAN C JACOBSEN) > >Hi Brian, it seems to me and probably quite clear to others, that if an organization sets its principles and rules on the contract. ie Any stallion found to produce crippled or deformed or bad genes, (you find the professional terms) then it is the signers responsibility for putting themselves in a position where the stallion will no longer be rated or approved by the association if such happens. Oner is responsible then. easier on all. Jean G. Jean Gayle --- A Subscriber at Techline
Re: A.I.difficulty
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (jean gayle) Be wary of the vet who hasnt and says he can. Many do not know that the usual pipette used can kill the semen. Jean G >This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Exactly how difficult is A.I? My understanding is that success rate depends >on a vet (or owner inseminator) who has some experience at it? I once tried >to A.I. a Scottish Highland cow. Well, it was easy with a Jersey cow - >probably from long lines of dairy A.I. cows. But the wild Scottish - no >way! Impossible to recognize her heat cycle, and she wasn't thrilled with >the palpation, etc. Eventually had to give up having >> >>This has only been done in one case that I know of. Most of the shipping >>is done within the US/Canada. It really isn't used that much. >> >>Mike >> >> >Gail Russell >Forestville CA >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Jean Gayle --- A Subscriber at Techline
Re: A.I.difficulty
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (BRIAN C JACOBSEN) Jean Ernst wrote: >...when my vet took a course in Equine Reproduction at Colorado State University he >talked to the experts about my mare, and they just shook their heads when he said it >was a Fjord. I want to caution everybody about arriving at premature conclusions regarding the difficulty of A.I.ing Fjords. When I went through Colorado State University (and took all the Equine Reproduction electives I could) in vet school, nothing was said about special difficulty with Norwegian Fjords. In fact, to my knowledge, then (six years ago) as well as now, we are not aware of any certain breed which is more difficult than any other. There is a large amount of variability within breeds (i.e. some stallions ship better than others), but not between breeds that I am aware of. Maybe what Jean relayed is new information, but what is it based on? There are only 15 Fjord stallions with an A.I. license (as of the latest list in the Herald), and none are even very close to Colorado. Maybe the veterinarians at CSU have worked with one or two Fjord stallions, or several Fjord mares, but in either case that would only be a very small sample - dangerous to base any assumptions on. Also, don't confuse the dismal results so far obtained with FROZEN semen from overseas with just cooled semen like would be used within the US (and Canada). The freezing and thawing process has a long way to go before it will work well in horses. On the other hand, many many mares are successfully inseminated with cooled semen. Please don't misconstrue what I am asserting here. This is by no means any kind of attack on Jean or any mare or stallion owner who has tried A.I. It's just that, as we have just been discussing on the list, I feel Artificial Insemination will be an important tool in the future of the Fjord Horse in North America, and I would hate to learn that it was especially difficult in Fjords. If we find out it is, then so be it. But let's not jump to conclusions based on too small of a sample for a valid conclusion. Jean also wrote: >I think that before anyone decides to breed their mare using A.I they had better make >sure their vet has the proper knowledge and experience and an ultrasound machine, >and that the stallion they are considering has had good success with the technique. >Anybody can get a permit to Ship A.I. but it is a lot more than collecting the semen, >putting it in a cooler and shipping. Excellent advice Jean! That recommendation will be included in the A.I. Information material that will soon be available from the NFHR. And she wrote: >Timing of insemination of the mare is very important, requiring lots of ultrasounds, etc, and of consequently lots of vet bills. We may do things differently than others, but the charges when we A.I. a mare in our clinic are usually under $250. Most mare owners could not even ship their mares halfway to wherever the semen came from for that amount. Whenever possible, we keep the mares in the clinic while the whole process is going on. This does save a fair amount for the owners on farm call charges. Would any stallion owners who have shipped semen be willing to comment on what kind of results they have had? Mike, can you tell us how many horses are registered that were a result of A.I. breedings? Brian Jacobsen, DVM ___ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
A.I. - good or bad?
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (BRIAN C JACOBSEN) Hi Steve! Good to hear from you! It's been a while since you have posted a message. You bring a very timely warning about the possible dangers of A.I. Without the proper motivation for using it, it can very definitely be bad for a breed. Your illustration using the Quarter Horses is a good example. Here are two more examples; The popular show horses right now have huge, muscular bodies set on tiny little feet and legs because some people think that looks nice. Also, the mouths of some QHs are being ruined because one of the most popular stallions throws many foals with parrot mouth (undershot jaw) - yet his offspring continue to win at shows and more and more people are breeding their mares to him via A.I. The interesting thing is, at the same time, the everyday backyard QH or the team roping or team penning or barrel racing QHs, in general, are sound horses with good minds. This reveals that there is a schism between the show animals and the "using" animals. Why is one segment going to pot while the other continues to have decent horses? Because one segment bases it's breeding decisions largely on performance ability and soundness, while the other bases them solely on what somebody thinks looks nice. This illustration brings me to the first point that can be drawn out of Steve's post; A.I. is a tool. It can be used for the good or bad of a breed. If just left up to the vagaries of human fancy, the use of A.I. will invariably decrease the quality of a breed. Why? Because there is often a difference between the most well-rounded, sound-of-body-and-mind horse vs. the flashiest, biggest, loudest, most impressive-looking horse. And which are most people naturally drawn to? The biggest flashiest one. But which is best for the breed? Usually, the good-in-many-aspects-but-outstanding-in-none horse. So how can a Breed Society or Registry (or whatever governing body is in place) ensure that the animals it oversees are headed in a good direction? There must be a plan. It has been said that "If you fail to plan, you plan to fail". By extension, "If you fail to plan for the good of a breed, you plan for the failure of the breed". The show Quarter Horse industry is failing to plan for the good of the breed, and when someone attempts to use those horses for some kind of performance (trail riding, team penning, etc), in general, the horses fail. The "using" QH segment is following a loosely organized plan, and those horses are remaining decent. If we Fjord Horse owners, on the other hand, will follow a well-thought-out, well-organized plan, we can succeed where the other breeds are failing and keep the quality of our horses high. The dairy industry is a good example of this planning. Though it is true that much of the genetic diversity has been removed from dairy cows, it can be argued persuasively that it has been for the best of the industry. Dairy breeders have aggressively selected for the cows and bulls who consistently outproduce what came before them and reproduce these qualities in their offspring. At the same time, they have not sacrificed the qualities that are necessary for the well-being of the cows. Good feet and legs, for example, are heavily stressed. Udder quality is another important goal; Even if a cow set world records for milk production, if her udder did not hold up for more than a year or two, producers would stop using her genetics. The winners in dairy shows are based not only on the cow herself, but also on carefully measured performance criteria, and the same performance criteria applied to several generations of her offspring. Call it the ultimate Evaluation if you want to. Which brings me to the next important point: If it can't be measured, it can't be improved. That statement isn't original with me of course, and I don't know who to attribute it to. I think everyone agrees that Evaluations are important, so I won't dwell on this point. But let me say that, similar to what Steve asserted, A.I. without Evaluations will not lead to continual improvement of our breed. However, A.I. with Evaluations will. History shows we don't need to be overly concerned about the loss of genetic diversity in the Fjord Horse. See Mike May's 11-17-98 post for one example. Another is that, even though the breeding in Norway and Holland has not been based on A.I. in the past, it is in effect a very similar system. They have a small number of stallions licensed to breed many mares. And it has worked well for years. The fear that only a handful of Fjord stallions would be used if A.I. became widely available in this country is unlikely to be realized because we have so many different uses and personal preferences. It would take more than just a few stallions to satisfy all these different uses and preferences. The concern about the decrease in genetic diversity leav
Re: safety concerns
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Regarding Riding Helmets, We use them here for riding and driving. Three years ago when my husband had a heart valve replaced, his Dr. said "this man must have no accidents!". Since then, we insist that persons that come to ride, wear helmets (we have extras). We take our Fjords to a friends ranch to roundup cattle and the helmets go there too, even is it does look silly, however, the ranch owner wears hers also! Haven't worn mine at an ADS show yet, but I have been assured that they are permitted. Regards, Bernadine Karns Nottawa Crossing Fjords Michigan
Re: A.I.difficulty
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Well, I tried A.I. with my mare up here in Alaska with no success. One problem might have been her age (19), but when my vet took a course in Equine Reproduction at Colorado State University he talked to the experts about my mare, and they just shook their heads when he said it was a Fjord. They responded that Fjords are one of the most difficult breeds to use A.I with due to the sensitivity of the Fjord sperm. Special extenders often have to be developed to keep the sperm viable and the semen doesn't ship well. The problem we had was exactly that: the semen arrrived with very little or no motility, etc. Perhaps some of the stallion owners on the list that have successfully bred mares using cooled shipped semen would comment on this? Timing of insemination of the mare is very important, requiring lots of ultrasounds, etc, and of consequently lots of vet bills. We have one stallion here in Alaska now, and altho he is OK, and a nice horse, He was not my first choice or even second or third choice. So what to do? If other Stallion owners have had really good success with Shipping semen long distances, then I may try it again in the future with my now 3 year old, Anvil's Adel. I think that before anyone decides to breed their mare using A.I they had better make sure their vet has the proper knowledge and experience and an ultrasound machine, and that the stallion they are considering has had good success with the technique. Anybody can get a permit to Ship A.I. but it is a lot more than collecting the semen, putting it in a cooler and shipping. Jean in Fairbanks, alaska. +20 today, 6 hours daylight, sun comes up at 9:35 AM. At 08:29 AM 11/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Exactly how difficult is A.I? My understanding is that success rate depends >on a vet (or owner inseminator) who has some experience at it? I once tried >to A.I. a Scottish Highland cow. Well, it was easy with a Jersey cow - >probably from long lines of dairy A.I. cows. But the wild Scottish - no >way! Impossible to recognize her heat cycle, and she wasn't thrilled with >the palpation, etc. Eventually had to give up having >> >>This has only been done in one case that I know of. Most of the shipping >>is done within the US/Canada. It really isn't used that much. >> >>Mike >> >> >Gail Russell >Forestville CA >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > ** Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: A.I.difficulty
This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Exactly how difficult is A.I? My understanding is that success rate depends on a vet (or owner inseminator) who has some experience at it? I once tried to A.I. a Scottish Highland cow. Well, it was easy with a Jersey cow - probably from long lines of dairy A.I. cows. But the wild Scottish - no way! Impossible to recognize her heat cycle, and she wasn't thrilled with the palpation, etc. Eventually had to give up having > >This has only been done in one case that I know of. Most of the shipping >is done within the US/Canada. It really isn't used that much. > >Mike > > Gail Russell Forestville CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Riding helmets/minor head trauma
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 11/18/98 6:59:07 Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << They are not fashionable, they are hot, they create helmet hair etc, etc, but many of the head injuries we treat these days are not the folks that lie unconscious for days all scraped up and bloodied after major trauma. >> Always here. Nobody rides my horses without one. Here's a brief story that had, luckily, a semi-happy ending. Before I got married, I ran an in-home daycare business, as I could not find proper child care for my own son. There was one child who was far and away the sweetest, most compassionate child I worked with. His name is Nathan. He was always sweet to my son, and accepted and included him in everything, without making Raymond feel different. I got married, stopped doing daycare, moved to New Mexico and back. I wanted to have my property all set up with my horses, barn, etc. before I invited Nathan to visit. Last March he was riding home from a school function on his bicycle. It was a "Bike Rodeo" where they learn safety tips. They were doing construction in our town and had rerouted commercial traffic onto residential streets. In a no-fault accident, Nathan was hit on his way home, thrown into the air and landed on his head. He was in a coma for a week, and we all thought he would die. He DID come out of his coma, with some memory loss, and loss of function on his right side. But if he hadn't been wearing his helmet, he'd be dead now. He has regained his wonderful sense of humour, compassion and joie de vivre. I bless that beat up, squashed helmet for saving his life. Pamela Remembering my uneducated days of riding my horse on the beach in Malibu, bareback, hair blowing in the wind, and thinking how damned lucky I was to not have a bad fall!!!
Equine Affair
This message is from: Mary Thurman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> When reading a recent post concerning the Equine Affair, I believe, someone mentioned John Lyons doing a demonstration of his training method using a Fjord. Someone else asked how it went. There was no response. I, too, would like to know how it went with the Fjord. It seems that some of these methods developed for horses which are primarily riding horses do not always work exactly the same on Fjords. Some minor adjustments seem to be needed to accomodate the Fjord's different personality. Case in point: I took a two-year-old Fjord mare to one of Buck Branaman's colt starting clinics several years ago. The outcome was not at all what I had expected. He certainly did not "whisper" to this horse! She was highly offended at having a rope or flag waved in her face and took the "fight" rather than the "flight" mode. Sometime during the clinic, I believe maybe the third day, she had enough and "went for him" - right up over the back of his horse. He was not pleased. After the clinic I had a horse that really was not "started", although I could ride her. The problem was that she hated people carrying ropes or flags ( or anything she thought was a flag) around her. Even a halter rope swung at the wrong time, or the sound made by someone popping a horse with one, would send her off. Not a good experience. We have since used the Wil Howe method on our horses with sucess. We do have to make allowances for the fact that a Fjord is not a flight animal necessarily, but a "trot off, turn, take a look" animal. With this in mind the method works well for us. Let us know how the John Lyons demo went. We're curious. Mary, in soggy Washington. == Mary Thurman Raintree Farms [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Riding helmets/minor head trauma
This message is from: Cathy Koshman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Oh no - you hit one of my soapbox topics:>:>:>Oh please folks, wear helmets at all times - every time you are in a cart or on a horse. They are not fashionable, they are hot, they create helmet hair etc, etc, but many of the head injuries we treat these days are not the folks that lie unconscious for days all scraped up and bloodied after major trauma. They are people who had what you would call a relatively minor head bang (like a fall off a horse) and who find themselves unable to concentrate, having difficulty with temper flare ups, unable to think through problems, unable to really enjoy their former sports because of dizziness or headaches, unable to manage their time and families, unable to think about several things at once, unable to remember important appointments, unable to perform to the best of their ability at their former jobs, unable to express emotion, unable to follow maps or find their way in a forest. With the patients I work with as a neurophysical therapist, I've spent a lot of time in cognitive groups, attention training groups, helping them learn to hike, kayak or ride all over again or replacing the sports they love with another sport that will be just ok. It is a really long, exhausting road back, usually takes at least three years and a lot of tears. Nothing is ever the same as it was. Without being able to drive cars (seizures), being often unable to resume former work and needing to go back to college and retrain, people these days are needing approximately 2 million dollars for the whole rehab process. Our brains are the consistency of toothpaste with lots of interface areas between white and grey matter. It is shearing at these interface zones that creates the head trauma. I truly believe that unless you want a complete lifestyle change (which may not include fjords)don't mind struggling at all your daily activities and have two million dollars you should wear a helmet at all times.
Rapor
This message is from: Pat Wolfe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> There is an old saying around here that goes like this. The way to a man's heart is through his stomach. That also goes for horses. I have a bag of carrots in the feed room at all times. Felix gets at least 10 carrots a day and we have a wonderful RAPOR. PAT
Re: A.I. necessary; permit fee
This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 10:09 PM 11/17/98 -0600, you wrote: >This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steven A White) > >Before we jump into using artificial insemination in this breed, I >believe there are a few things we should consider. I don't feel that >A.I. is really good for a breed. Good for some breeders maybe, but not >the breed. I think it is a little late to stop the "Jumping into" Steve. The NFHR has allowed the use of AI & shipping of semen for probably 10 years now at least. A "Semen Transport permit" is required for the stallion and special paperwork is required also. DNA typing is required of the sire, dam & foal regardless of the sex. With AI even geldings have to be DNA typed. This is so we know the semen was only used for the intended mare it was shipped for. >I was reading an article on A.I. just the other night and one of the >pro's it listed for using A.I. was that it increases the gene pool. This >is not the case. The dairy industry has used these techniques much >longer than the equine industry. Now it is estimated that over 90% of >all Holstein cows can be traced back to just 3 bulls. Where is the >genetic diversity there? I think that is probably the case with Fjords already. If you go back far enough you will come to 1 of about 3 stallions I believe. >One benefit I could see with Fjords would be to introduce stallions from >over seas. We could get a little Old World genetics into our New World >horses and vice versa. This has only been done in one case that I know of. Most of the shipping is done within the US/Canada. It really isn't used that much. Mike === Norwegian Fjord Horse Registry Mike May, Registrar Voice 716-872-4114 FAX 716-787-0497 http://www.nfhr.com mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re. matching mares to stallions
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The responsibility for the end result of any breeding is that of the person choosing to breed. There are literally thousands of genetic possibilities existing in the union of two animals. If you were familiar with all the horses in both animals pedigrees for say 3 or 4 generations you might bealble to predict color inheritability with a certain degree of authority and narrow your chances of certain things, but you'd have to have knowledge of how certain characteristics were inherited ie. recessive genes, simple recessive , dominant etc. And there might always be something lurking within the genes of those horses you were not aware of (a bad bite for example).So simply looking at two individuals won't gaurentee any kind of success. If you could predict success before hand there wouldn't be any need for evaluations. As far as I know noone has ever been sued by a mare owner because the outcome was inferior, but I may be wrong as we live in very litigious times. The best available way to insure tilting the scales of success in your favour is to breed only the best horses. Trying to breed the faults out of inferior horses is a recipe for disaster, trying to strengthen a weakness in a correct animal(and all Fjords have some weaknesses, (perfection does not exist conformationally in nature)by choosing an animal without a similar weakness is time tested although still no gaurentee. In other species people use line breeding(a pedigree that has the same stallion or mare show up on both sides sometimes more than once, very common in Morgan pedigrees) or in-breeding(ie father to daughter, mother to son etc.) to help predict the outcome, but we do not line breed Fjords which helps insure that no single trait becomes magnified and ingrained in a certain line. Perhaps if you are a novice or are unfamiliar with Fjords you should get educated before you undertake the step of breeding them. I spent 20 years trying to learn all there was to know about breeding dogs I had some small measure of success (some nice home-bred Champions), but more than anything it served to show me how little I really knew. Because horses only produce one off-spring a year it readily became apparent to me that I would need the remainder of my life to get a handle on breeding Fjords. In the meantime I will breed only the best horses, I will try and educate any potential buyers to the weaknesses in animals to help them make informed choices when and if they go to breed and I will carefully contemplate the mating of my own animals by asking if I think this will produce something worthwhile. I do not believe a quality mare left open for a season is a sin. I do however believe that I do not want a field full of unbroke horses because I produced so many I did not have time to train them. In the last 10 years I have viewed literally hundreds of sale tapes of horses of different breeds all represented on tape as perfect examples of the breed most not young, and not broke to do much of anything except trot loose around a field and all being offered at top dollar prices,and it has led me to the sad conclusion that most of us have lots to learn. I'm sorry if this seems a harsh indictment of the horse breeding industry, but I cringe at the cavalier attitude prevalent when it comes to breeding animals in this country. Sincerely Vivian Creigh
