Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] thank you karen, sticking with my sanffle, no problem there. denise .. Sounds like this clinician is a dandy...wonder what he will prescibe for a horse that does't want to stop from the pain of the twisted wire bit? The Whoa-Mutha Special w/ 12 shanks??? Karen, .
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Jean Gayle [EMAIL PROTECTED] Oh Denise, besides he was selling the twisted wire bits ah ha! I remember when I had my big Charlie at the training stable and we had to buy every new concoction that came along and expensive ferriers, clinics etc. It really did not change how Charlie came along and was mostly fadism. If your horse is doing well, keep doing it! I will do some pictures, but isn't it impossible to send attachments to this list? Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of The Colonel's Daughter Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes Noble Book Stores
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Lori Albrough [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Denise - I disagree with the clinician. A 3 y.o. who is doing fine in a full cheek snaffle doesn't need a twisted wire bit! Use of a twisted-wire bit on a sensitive 3 year old mouth would be a travesty, IMHO. Right On, Lori! Good advice to heed, Denise. Sounds like this clinician is a dandy...wonder what he will prescibe for a horse that does't want to stop from the pain of the twisted wire bit? The Whoa-Mutha Special w/ 12 shanks??? Karen, in a much cooler Northern Nevada _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Mary Thurman [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This message is from: Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] i would love to hear whys, howcomes and facts on bits. what about the notion of low palates in fjords? Denise, We, too, had heard that Fjords have low palates. So, when we were training ours for western reining, I was concerned about Sindar being able to 'carry' a regular medium port western bit(since he had a rather'fine' head to begin with). When we sold him this summer he was happily 'carrying' a regular medium port, seven shank, western bit. Putting him 'into' this bit was the easiest transition I ever made. He took to it in just a couple of rides - the hardest part was teaching him how to 'spit it out'. He would hold the bit in his mouth with his tongue - could have used the bit without a headstall - so when unbridling time came, he had to learn how to release it without hitting it on his canine teeth. He actually HATED the Tom Thumb style swivel shanked snaffle bit I had him in last year - chewed and fussed at it all the time. Not so with the regular curb bit. I used the 'seven shank' bit(shanks are shaped like a number 7) to discourage him from trying to grab the shank in his lips. This is sometimes a problem with 'shanked' bits on Fjords, I guess because they are so 'mouthy'. This horse is currently being used as a hunter/jumper, so I assume he is back into some kind of snaffle bit, which he also did well in. Mary = Mary Thurman Raintree Farms [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] dear lori, thank you for the response to my humble questions on bits. that is exactly what i wanted; an answer and opinion from an experienced horse person, especially someone familiar with fjords. i think the clinician was'nt used to the slowness of my 3 yr. old fjord, as compared to a trained 1/4 horse. when i do his turns and loops in an arena at a trot and lope, he does just find for me. i am a beginner, so i don't really want his front end turning before his back end can catch up. i think i might be eating more sand than my stomach could handle! denise because i went to a clinic recently. the clinician recommended a twisted wire bit. it is for my three year old, quinn. he is in a full cheek snaffle and does just fine. Denise - I disagree with the clinician. A 3 y.o. who is doing fine in a full cheek snaffle doesn't need a twisted wire bit! twisted-wire bit on a sensitive 3 year old mouth would be a travesty, Lori Albrough
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Lori Albrough [EMAIL PROTECTED] This message is from: Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] because i went to a clinic recently. the clinician recommended a twisted wire bit. it is for my three year old, quinn. he is in a full cheek snaffle and does just fine. Denise - I disagree with the clinician. A 3 y.o. who is doing fine in a full cheek snaffle doesn't need a twisted wire bit! That bit is only going to cause problems. My preferred bit is a loose-ring jointed snaffle, or a loose-ring french link snaffle. Every horse should be able to be ridden in a plain old loose-ring snaffle. If the horse is not responsive enough, work on putting him in front of your leg, not on jangling the nerves in his mouth. Use of a twisted-wire bit on a sensitive 3 year old mouth would be a travesty, IMHO. Here's a quote on snaffle bits from Cherry Hill's book Making not Breaking - The First Year under Saddle (good book - recommended) The texture of the mouthpiece can be smooth, wavy, ribbed, ridged, or rough. For early training, a smooth mouthpiece is most appropriate. It slides through a horse's mouth uneventfully, so there are no surprises and he can react fluidly and without tension. In contract, an uneven surface bumps the horse's mouth as the bit moves from side to side. This can serve to get a horse's attention or make him afraid. If a horse is injured by a bit, he may avoid contact with it by getting behind the bit or tossing his head in an effort to escape contact. Textured mouthpieces, such as a slow twist (a thick mouthpiece with three or four twists), a scrub board (with built-up strips in the mouthpiece), a wire-wrap, or a twisted-wire snaffle are designed to lighten up a tough-mouthed horse and don't have a place in standard training of young horses. Lori Albrough
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] dear jean, i would love to see your bit collection someday. is there any chance of seeing some of it at this site? maybe you could scan some interesting ones, here and there? thanks for the info and references on bits. the reason i am asking is because i went to a clinic recently. the clinician recommended a twisted wire bit. it is for my three year old, quinn. he is in a full cheek snaffle and does just fine. gives and does'nt fight etc. i was wondering why? he explained that my horse did'nt move fast enough. the different bit would make him more responsive. i know this man is used to cutting and reining, quarter horses and not fjords. besides he was selling the twisted wire bits. thanks again, denise
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Denise's [EMAIL PROTECTED] listers, as for older green horses; i fully agree that it is a good idea to have a special class for them. does libby or turlock have such a class? a second subject i would like to hear more about is BITS. anyone out there with expertese (sp?) on different bits for horses in general and fjords in particular, i would love to hear whys, howcomes and facts on bits. why switch from a snaffle if it is doing the job? why use a kimberwick instead of a snaffle? when should you change? what about twisted wire bits? (not the malicious variety) what about the notion of low palates in fjords? sure would like to know more. thanks, denise delgado
Green Horses
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well, one of the things that frustrates me, in the show world, is when they limit the age of a horse to 5 in the green horse class, I have a 10 year old green horse, that is coming along, but I'm forced to show her in the open classes, which she is not ready for.(If I choose to show her) This forces us to have our horses primed and ready before age 5 for full competition. and limits those of us who buy a green aged horse. I have seen a few shows with Aged Green horse classes, and also The ASHA allows any age Green horse (as long as it meets the requirements for green horse). Don't quote me on this rule, I thought I read it!. Anyone have a ASHA handbook handy? Michele Noonan In The Bitteroot Valley, where we got 15 minutes of rain today YIPPEE
Re: Green Horses
This message is from: Jean Gayle [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cheers Betsy and a good lesson for all of us. Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of The Colonel's Daughter Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes Noble Book Stores
Green Horses
This message is from: Michael Betsy Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hello -my name is Betsy Scott and I have been a lurker way too long. I feel compelled to respond to the green horse issue this week. Michael and I bought a yearling filly from Beaver Dam Farm in Nova Scotia in 1997. After searching our area for the perfect horse, we decided on the athletic type and contacted Carol 1 month later owned our first fjord altho we had to wait 4 long months for her to arrive. Miss Naveta was to be my horse as Michael had no background in horses whatsoever. As many of you know, I am now confined to a wheelchair and can no longer ride or drive - my dream of the perfect fjord didn't go according to plan but it did turn out. Because of my health problems, Michael had to take over Naveta's training and care. A green rider/driver can make it with a young horse - Michael Naveta are proof of that. Believe me, it takes a lot of sweat equity but it pays off in the end. First you start with a well bred, healthy horse that has been taught manners (very important to buy from a breeder that imprints teaches ground manners). You don't let a young horse stand around - you work with them play with their minds as well. You work with them, day after day after day until you have created that special bond. Carol told me you have to walk 100 miles behind a horse ground driving before you hook them up and she was right. Michael walked miles every day during one of the coldest winters on record. 5 months later he hooked her up and we have never had a bad moment since. We were very fortunate to be in the barn of an old friend that has shown judged horses all over the world. He took Michael under his wing and guided him through Naveta's training, watching and advising every step of the way. Without his help, it would have been a difficult task. We joined our local driving club, attended clinics every chance we could, read books, asked questions, watched other people drive. All Michael's work paid off as we have had many good times with Naveta she has had a very successful show career for a youngster. Michael was completely new to horses but was dedicated to making something of this mare. As a 2 yr old, she won her novice driving class at Blue Earth. As a 3 yr old, she went to her first ADS show and brought home 5 ribbons, 3 of them red. At the same show, they were invited to represent the pony division in the Concours d'Elegance Class. As a 4 yr old, they won open reinsmanship at another ADS show. This year Naveta will be 5 and should be looking her best as she is shown to her new phaeton. Michael is proof that a green horn with the proper guidance and will to succeed, can train show a horse successfully. It takes time patience but you can do it. You can't do it alone, you need help to do it right. Our thanks to Carol for sharing The Little Princess with us. It was the best decision we ever made. Betsy Scott
Re: Green horses green owners
This message is from: Lynn Mohr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Joel, enjoyed your post. I am currently in the process of breaking apair of brothers, 2 and 3 last summer. I also have a mare 14.1 and about 1200 lbs plus. She is calm and has never given me any trouble when driving. I don't believe she has ever been driven double. I want to hitch her with one of the geldings to break them, but I'm not sure how she will act. If she spooks it seems it would make the situation worse and really spook the gelding. Got any suggestions?
Green horses green owners
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] There is a reason that some fjords cost more than others besides pedigrees. Training. Training takes time. Time is money. I have been told by many people interested in purchasing a horse from me that I want too much for a horse they wish to purchase. They know where there is another for sale that less expensive. One either pays now or later. I have a horse that is trained, they buy one that isn't trained then one of 2 things happens. There is a wreck the horse is sold to someone else or not used, or they end up paying someone to train the horse. It is much to teach rather than unteach. Fjords don't have innate abilities to know what to do when being driven or ridden. They must be trained. Training takes time. Time is money. Is there an echo in here? I applaud the Merkles for posting what they did. I'm sure it wasn't easy to do that. I agree with those that use an older horse to train the young ones. Before I hook a green horse to a cart the horse has been ground driven in a corral with harness with some weight some noise. They are used to having the tugs on their legs, used to the noise the chains make, used to me being RIGHT behind them messing with their legs, the chains. The lines have been all over them, between their legs, hitting them. They understand the concept of whoa. They also turn when asked. First time on the cart is scary. For those of us fortunate enough to have an older horse, the experience of driving a team, it is much easier. Let me preface this by saying I try not to get into this situation but it has happened. When one gets into a runaway situation if there is room I like to let them run, then keep them running until they are so tired they can't run anymore, then run some more. I would hazard a guess that many will disagree however I have found that they may think twice about running if they have been made to run long after the thrill of it has passed. I know up above I said it is easier to teach than unteach (if that is even a word). Remember when hooking, hook the neck yoke first then the tugs. When unhooking, unhook the tugs first then the neck yoke. I have carried on a long time here. I hope it makes sense to you. Bye Joel Harman Brass Ring Ranch Mosier OR ___ Why pay more to get Web access? Try Juno for FREE -- then it's just $9.95/month if you act NOW! Get your free software today: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
