Re: [Flexradio] FMT Results
AMEN! Fm KA4SNM -Original Message- From: flexradio-boun...@flex-radio.biz [mailto:flexradio-boun...@flex-radio.biz] On Behalf Of William H. Fite Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 3:47 PM To: K0DAN Cc: FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz; Jeff Singer Subject: Re: [Flexradio] FMT Results Like a lot of other material in this general area, things have been written, on Connie's site and others, that are easily understood by people who already understand them. In >30 years of teaching graduate students and directing their research, I have found this an extremely common phenomenon. "It seems perfectly clear to me, Dr. Fite." "Well, of course it does. You wrote it." The more education and experience one has, the more difficult it becomes to recall what parts of the early stages were hard to grasp and why. But the responsibility for clear communication resides, by definition, with the transmitter, not with the receiver, a point lost on too many otherwise friendly and eager-to-be-helpful experts. If more people are to become involved in FMTs, experienced FMT-ers are going to have to write, "OK, now here is what you do first. Then do this. Then this. Then this." Instead, volunteers, with every intention of being helpful and with every conviction that they are providing clear and straightforward instructions produce something reminiscent of Chief Bellison explaining an equipment failure to Captain De Vriess in* The Caine Mutiny*: *"The port bandersnatch got fouled in the starboard rath when we tried to galumph the cutting cable so as not to trip the snozzle again. I had to unshackle the doppelganger and bend on two snarks instead so we could launch in a hurry."* Entertaining...but not helpful. On Sun, Apr 17, 2011 at 1:40 PM, K0DAN wrote: > Has anyone written a white paper on the tools/techniques for getting best > results in an FMT? > > 73 > > dan > k0dan > > - Original Message - From: "Jeff Singer" > > To: > Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 11:38 AM > Subject: [Flexradio] FMT Results > > > > Tough FMT. I was having trouble calibrating my 5000 to my satisfaction >> before the test and bailed out of participating. >> Had something else to do that was pretty important. >> >> Just saw the results and it appears that Doppler was terrible which >> probably >> explains my calibration problem. Scores were mostly poor. >> >> Tom, you can use the Flex scope or phase display to estimate signals to >> tenths of a Hz. >> >> See all results at: >> http://www.b4h.net/fmt/fmtresults201104.php >> >> Jeff K0OD >> >> >> ___ >> FlexRadio Systems Mailing List >> FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >> Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >> Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: >> http://www.flexradio.com/ >> > > > ___ > FlexRadio Systems Mailing List > FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz > http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz > Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ > Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: > http://www.flexradio.com/ > ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] FMT Results
Like a lot of other material in this general area, things have been written, on Connie's site and others, that are easily understood by people who already understand them. In >30 years of teaching graduate students and directing their research, I have found this an extremely common phenomenon. "It seems perfectly clear to me, Dr. Fite." "Well, of course it does. You wrote it." The more education and experience one has, the more difficult it becomes to recall what parts of the early stages were hard to grasp and why. But the responsibility for clear communication resides, by definition, with the transmitter, not with the receiver, a point lost on too many otherwise friendly and eager-to-be-helpful experts. If more people are to become involved in FMTs, experienced FMT-ers are going to have to write, "OK, now here is what you do first. Then do this. Then this. Then this." Instead, volunteers, with every intention of being helpful and with every conviction that they are providing clear and straightforward instructions produce something reminiscent of Chief Bellison explaining an equipment failure to Captain De Vriess in* The Caine Mutiny*: *"The port bandersnatch got fouled in the starboard rath when we tried to galumph the cutting cable so as not to trip the snozzle again. I had to unshackle the doppelganger and bend on two snarks instead so we could launch in a hurry."* Entertaining...but not helpful. On Sun, Apr 17, 2011 at 1:40 PM, K0DAN wrote: > Has anyone written a white paper on the tools/techniques for getting best > results in an FMT? > > 73 > > dan > k0dan > > - Original Message - From: "Jeff Singer" > > To: > Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 11:38 AM > Subject: [Flexradio] FMT Results > > > > Tough FMT. I was having trouble calibrating my 5000 to my satisfaction >> before the test and bailed out of participating. >> Had something else to do that was pretty important. >> >> Just saw the results and it appears that Doppler was terrible which >> probably >> explains my calibration problem. Scores were mostly poor. >> >> Tom, you can use the Flex scope or phase display to estimate signals to >> tenths of a Hz. >> >> See all results at: >> http://www.b4h.net/fmt/fmtresults201104.php >> >> Jeff K0OD >> >> >> ___ >> FlexRadio Systems Mailing List >> FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >> Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >> Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: >> http://www.flexradio.com/ >> > > > ___ > FlexRadio Systems Mailing List > FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz > http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz > Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ > Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: > http://www.flexradio.com/ > ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] FMT Results
Lots of info at Connie's website www.k5cm.com . For best results, find a way to disable the Doppler error during the test :-) Jerry W4UK At 01:40 PM 4/17/2011, K0DAN wrote: Has anyone written a white paper on the tools/techniques for getting best results in an FMT? 73 dan k0dan - Original Message - From: "Jeff Singer" To: Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 11:38 AM Subject: [Flexradio] FMT Results Tough FMT. I was having trouble calibrating my 5000 to my satisfaction before the test and bailed out of participating. Had something else to do that was pretty important. Just saw the results and it appears that Doppler was terrible which probably explains my calibration problem. Scores were mostly poor. Tom, you can use the Flex scope or phase display to estimate signals to tenths of a Hz. See all results at: http://www.b4h.net/fmt/fmtresults201104.php Jeff K0OD ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] FMT Results
Has anyone written a white paper on the tools/techniques for getting best results in an FMT? 73 dan k0dan - Original Message - From: "Jeff Singer" To: Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 11:38 AM Subject: [Flexradio] FMT Results Tough FMT. I was having trouble calibrating my 5000 to my satisfaction before the test and bailed out of participating. Had something else to do that was pretty important. Just saw the results and it appears that Doppler was terrible which probably explains my calibration problem. Scores were mostly poor. Tom, you can use the Flex scope or phase display to estimate signals to tenths of a Hz. See all results at: http://www.b4h.net/fmt/fmtresults201104.php Jeff K0OD ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/ ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
[Flexradio] FMT Results
Tough FMT. I was having trouble calibrating my 5000 to my satisfaction before the test and bailed out of participating. Had something else to do that was pretty important. Just saw the results and it appears that Doppler was terrible which probably explains my calibration problem. Scores were mostly poor. Tom, you can use the Flex scope or phase display to estimate signals to tenths of a Hz. See all results at: http://www.b4h.net/fmt/fmtresults201104.php Jeff K0OD ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
[Flexradio] FMT Results
Almost doesn't seem fair using a Flex 1500. I messed up on the 40M portion. Had the rig in USB the whole while without giving it much thought. I was >10Hz on all of those tests. I did considerably better on the 80M portion. I placed PSDR in DSB and zoomed the panafall display to 2X, right clicked the mouse and held the crosshairs over the transmitted signal and submitted the displayed freq. Results on 80 were as follow: *K5CM 80 (>1 to <=5 Hz)* *W8KSE 80 (<=1 Hz) **W6OQI 80 (<=1 Hz) *Had I used the same technique on 40M, I would have done much better. I can't wait for the next FMT now. ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] FMT results
On Mon, Nov 15, 2010 at 11:51 AM, Brian Lloyd wrote: > I just went through the results of last Thursday morning's (UTC) ARRL > Frequency Measurement test. I went through and noted who ran Flex radios. > From what I saw, the Flexers did pretty well, with most posting errors of > less than 1Hz. Participants running Flex radios or copies of Flex radios > (one had a home-brew SDR-1000) that I saw were: > > K0HJ > K0OD > K3TUF > K6HLH > KC2LFI > NJ0U > NO5K > W5GW > W5PDB > W5SXD > W7JDE > W8AC > W9ZB > --and-- > WB6RQN > Seems I missed Fred, W2VQS with a Flex 3000. That means there were 15 Flex radios. -- Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL 3191 Western Dr. Cameron Park, CA 95682 br...@lloyd.com +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica) +1.931.492.6776 (USA) (+1.931.4.WB6RQN) ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
[Flexradio] FMT results
I just went through the results of last Thursday morning's (UTC) ARRL Frequency Measurement test. I went through and noted who ran Flex radios. >From what I saw, the Flexers did pretty well, with most posting errors of less than 1Hz. Participants running Flex radios or copies of Flex radios (one had a home-brew SDR-1000) that I saw were: K0HJ K0OD K3TUF K6HLH KC2LFI NJ0U NO5K W5GW W5PDB W5SXD W7JDE W8AC W9ZB --and-- WB6RQN That is 14 participants out of 114. That is better than 12% of the participants were running Flex kit. As for myself, my errors corresponded to what I expected knowing the errors in the DDS frequency. If we can figure out the error in the DDS and the error in the software NCO for the IF, we should be able to improve accuracy. Of course, if you measure and plot the frequency vs. time, you see that the ionosphere was making measurement very difficult. I saw peak-to-peak frequency variations of almost 1Hz in some cases. Anyway, lots of fun. Congratulations to everyone who participated. (BTW, I used the plots of my data points as part of a math lesson this morning where the students are studying mean, median, and mode. Who says Amateur Radio isn't relevant!) -- Brian Lloyd, WB6RQN/J79BPL 3191 Western Dr. Cameron Park, CA 95682 br...@lloyd.com +1.767.617.1365 (Dominica) +1.931.492.6776 (USA) (+1.931.4.WB6RQN) ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kc.flexradio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flexradio.com/
