Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
Am 05.07.12 18:04, schrieb Curtis Olson: > > > We !!!STRONGLY!!! encourage authors to use the GPL so that we can > incorporate their work into the overall project and distribute the work http://git.fgx.ch/flightgear/commit/?h=next&id=b14ddd40110e271efcd1416e9bf15d48d99c3123 Cheers, Yves -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
Ok, I see, just my misunderstanding of Gijs post when I read all other posts now ... I guess one of the best explanation comes from Brandano here. Sorry for the noise, I hate to participate in another license discussion. (I hate myself for this, not you.) ;-) -Yves Am 06.07.12 21:34, schrieb HB-GRAL: > Am 06.07.12 10:10, schrieb Gijs de Rooy: >> Nothing stops you from releasing that scenery under whatever license you'd >> like ( within the legal constraints ofourse), we just cannot include it in >> the official scenery. >> > > No. Official scenery can also incorporate resources with other licenses: > http://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html#GPLCompatibleLicenses > >>> In the licence they say: "The instrument folder and subfolders are GPL but >>> anything else is copyrighted. > " > > Empty phrase ... GPL doesn’t mean public domain and gpl RESPECTS all > copyrights! > > Cheers, Yves > > -- > Live Security Virtual Conference > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel > -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
Am 06.07.12 10:10, schrieb Gijs de Rooy: > Nothing stops you from releasing that scenery under whatever license you'd > like ( within the legal constraints ofourse), we just cannot include it in > the official scenery. > No. Official scenery can also incorporate resources with other licenses: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html#GPLCompatibleLicenses >> In the licence they say: "The instrument folder and subfolders are GPL but >> anything else is copyrighted. " Empty phrase ... GPL doesn’t mean public domain and gpl RESPECTS all copyrights! Cheers, Yves -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Yasim static friction?
Well, I am giving it a shot, but it seems it won't be that easy. See my other (long) mail sent on this topic :) Cheers, Vik On 07/06/2012 05:48 PM, Andy Ross wrote: > On 07/05/2012 02:41 PM, Viktor Radnai wrote: >> Thanks for that! So just to clarify -- this is a bug in Yasim code (or >> more like a missing feature) and I'm welcome to fix it?:) > > I'm just an absentee hacker, so I can't say what is or isn't > acceptable any more. But it seems like a sane enhancement to me. > > But broadly yes: it's free software. The whole point is to make it do > what you want. > > Andy > > -- > Live Security Virtual Conference > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel > -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Yasim static friction?
Hi there,
The rest of this mail will just deal with the gear friction issue for now.
Having looked at Gear.cpp I think I can understand the issue a bit
better. The method that calculates tire friction is Gear::calcFriction.
It looks like this:
float Gear::calcFriction(float wgt, float v) //used on solid ground
{
// How slow is stopped? 10 cm/second?
const float STOP = 0.1f;
const float iSTOP = 1.0f/STOP;
v = Math::abs(v);
if(v < STOP) return v*iSTOP * wgt * _sfric;
else return wgt * _dfric;
}
Note the constant in there that marks the point where static friction
starts to get used. Also note that the constant is multiplied by v, so
at zero speed, there is zero friction. This is perfectly fine on water,
but not on solid ground. It also explains what's happening -- the force
of the wind pushing against the plane will meet with no resistance until
it starts to equal v*iSTOP * wgt * _sfric and the plane will eventually
roll with that constant speed.
The reality is that on solid ground the force caused by static friction
will be equal to the force acting upon the wheel (the bearings
actually), up to a threshold of Fmax, when the wheel/bearing assembly
will unstick and start to rotate.
Right now it seems that to fix this, reality must be modelled in this
respect. If I take Andy's suggestion and just try to clamp the static
friction to an arbitary fixed value, then the force returned may or may
not be larger than the force pushing against the wheel, and the result
will be that the plane rocks with the (3 knot) wind while very slowly
turning into the wind, while stopped on tarmac...
The question is, where do I get the force acting upon the wheel?
To try to figure that out, I had to look into Model.cpp where I ran into
further difficulties:
// The landing gear
for(i=0; i<_gears.size(); i++) {
float force[3], contact[3];
Gear* g = (Gear*)_gears.get(i);
g->calcForce(&_body, s, lv, lrot);
g->getForce(force, contact);
_body.addForce(contact, force);
}
Here the forces created by fricion on all the gears are added up. So if
I was to keep the model stationary without any jitter, the sum of the
resistive forces from the gears must exactly equal the sum of the force
acting upon the gears. This is out of scope of just modifying Gear.cpp
and definitely out of my league for both the knowledge of C++ and the
Flightgear codebase.
Could someone please help me with this? Thanks in advance!
Cheers,
Vik
On 07/05/2012 09:34 PM, Andy Ross wrote:
> (Happened to be browsing in time to see a question)
>
> On 07/05/2012 06:21 AM, Viktor Radnai wrote:
>> I don't see any obvious properties to set to take the engine's
>> resistance to turning over, or the friction of the wheels into account
>> to stop these unrealistic things from happening. How should I go about
>> fixing them?
>
> That sounds right to me. Aircraft parked in gentle winds weren't really
> part of the original test regime. :)
>
> For the gear thing, see Gear.cpp:450 or so, and look at clamping the
> static friction coefficient to some minimum value (probably tunable).
>
> For the engine, you can likewise add some fixed negative torque value
> near PistonEngine.cpp:214 to model internal resistance (currently the
> code only models output power).
>
> Andy
>
> --
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Yasim static friction?
On 07/05/2012 02:41 PM, Viktor Radnai wrote: > Thanks for that! So just to clarify -- this is a bug in Yasim code (or > more like a missing feature) and I'm welcome to fix it?:) I'm just an absentee hacker, so I can't say what is or isn't acceptable any more. But it seems like a sane enhancement to me. But broadly yes: it's free software. The whole point is to make it do what you want. Andy -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
On Fri, 6 Jul 2012 00:26:48 -0700 (PDT), Michael wrote in message <1341559608.65675.yahoomailclas...@web140205.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>: > My last comment to this subject. > I've got permission to distribute some swiss sceneries as GPL but > only after asking back. Obviously I had to, as the author said first > that it needs to remain Freeware.- ..he's _wrong_, I can help you explain the GPL to him. ..briefly, "freeware" is not compatible with the GPL, and the GPL is a valid commercial license, you _can_ sell GPL binaries as long as you offer the GPL sources too. > Now that's only possible because > he bent back a little. But many won't or can't do and hence we will > lose stuff. > > As for old aircrafts etc. I think anyway only the best should be > included in the standard releases.- .._totally_ different question from "GPL or non-GPL." > Now, there are example planes of X-plane that use SASL with Lua > scripts for instruments. In the licence they say: "The instrument > folder and subfolders are GPL but anything else is copyrighted. ..that statement in X-plane's license is false, either because of a geniune mis-understanding of the GPL, or, simply intentional anti-GPL FUD. The _only_ legal teeth in the GPL, is the owner's copyrights, and copyright law enforcement, which scares Microsoft enough to spend US$ 106 Million in Q3 2003 on anti-GPL ligigation, and just US$ 5 Million on their Wintendo virus "war", in the same Q3 of 2003. _Neat_ search facilities in http://groklaw.net/ ;o) > Neat and simple, we're really dragging an old lead foot! ..aaaye. ;o) -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
The only one issue I can see with the GPL being used for artwork is that it precludes us from using a large body of data that is licensed on terms not compatible with the GPL. Some maps and textures are only available on other kinds of permissive licenses, that however require other restrictions like attribution of credits to the original authors, and the GPL explicitly forbids that. However this does not mean that you can't make, for example, a scenery file derived from them to be used with Flightgear or other application. You just can't have that scenery included in the default flightgear distribution, or hosted on the flighgear servers. This is because the FlightGear official policy is to only distribute GPL or GPL compatible content. Nothing would however stop a 3rd party from setting up his own server, operating for example on Creative Commons. As for original content, not derived from 3rd party licensed data, it can be released on multiple licenses at the author's discretion. GPL does NOT surrender the copyright, indeed GPL works because the copyright exists on the original item. > Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2012 00:26:48 -0700 > From: scrat_h...@yahoo.com > To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later > > My last comment to this subject. > I've got permission to distribute some swiss sceneries as GPL but only after > asking back. Obviously I had to, as the author said first that it needs to > remain Freeware.- > Now that's only possible because he bent back a little. But many > won't or can't do and hence we will lose stuff. > > As for old aircrafts etc. I think anyway only the best should be included in > the standard releases.- > > Now, there are example planes of X-plane that use SASL with Lua scripts for > instruments. In the licence they say: "The instrument folder and subfolders > are GPL but anything else is copyrighted. > > Neat and simple, we're really dragging an old lead foot! > > > -- > Live Security Virtual Conference > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
Nothing stops you from releasing that scenery under whatever license you'd like ( within the legal constraints ofourse), we just cannot include it in the official scenery. All those freeware/payware packages that are available for the commercial simulators are just that, addons. The fact that FlightGear has a central scenery and aircraft repo is really a big plus, but distributing stuff outside those repos due to licensing, different opinions or the desire to gain more credit for it, is not weird and definitely not unique. Gijs > Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2012 00:26:48 -0700 > From: scrat_h...@yahoo.com > To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later > > My last comment to this subject. > I've got permission to distribute some swiss sceneries as GPL but only after > asking back. Obviously I had to, as the author said first that it needs to > remain Freeware.- > Now that's only possible because he bent back a little. But many > won't or can't do and hence we will lose stuff. > > As for old aircrafts etc. I think anyway only the best should be included in > the standard releases.- > > Now, there are example planes of X-plane that use SASL with Lua scripts for > instruments. In the licence they say: "The instrument folder and subfolders > are GPL but anything else is copyrighted. > > Neat and simple, we're really dragging an old lead foot! > > > -- > Live Security Virtual Conference > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] scenery licence for 2.8 and later
My last comment to this subject. I've got permission to distribute some swiss sceneries as GPL but only after asking back. Obviously I had to, as the author said first that it needs to remain Freeware.- Now that's only possible because he bent back a little. But many won't or can't do and hence we will lose stuff. As for old aircrafts etc. I think anyway only the best should be included in the standard releases.- Now, there are example planes of X-plane that use SASL with Lua scripts for instruments. In the licence they say: "The instrument folder and subfolders are GPL but anything else is copyrighted. Neat and simple, we're really dragging an old lead foot! -- Live Security Virtual Conference Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
