Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Marcus Carr]

Joe Malin wrote:

> Well, I *finally* finished the new book for our next software
> release, so I can justifiably turn my attention to getting myself
> into structured docs.

Ah, some time to play... ;-)

> I am not going to go with DITA just yet. My plan is to convert my 
> existing unstructured docs to structure first, and then start the
> next round of docs in DITA. So, my first decision is what EDD to use.
> Should I develop an EDD myself from scratch, or start with the
> DocBook EDD? My only hesitation in using the DocBook EDD is that it
> will have a lot of elements that I don't want to use.

In my opinion, the last sentence hints that you already know the answer 
to your question. My long-standing belief is that if you try to 
structure your data in accordance with what tools you currently have at 
hand, you're focusing on the wrong issue. Your documents have an 
inherent structure, and you should respect and support it. There is a 
cost to every single XPath that you don't use, so something like DocBook 
can be a very expensive approach. If you cut it down, you'll often find 
that you're left with the right elements, but the names may not be what 
you'd choose yourself. Also, DocBook is very loosely structured, so you 
may want to tighten up the models - by the time you go through all of 
this, you may as well have just done the analysis yourself and started 
with the pre-existing (but implied) structure of your documents.

Although there may be good reasons for going to DITA, I've never had 
reason to do so, as I feel that the benefits gained from standardisation 
would quickly dry up as soon as you started customising. I'd be inclined 
to convert to DITA as a final process if you really had a need to mix 
and match modules, but I would probably choose a more descriptive syntax 
for data creation and management.

> Any advice, particularly from those who have gone the same route,
> would be much appreciated.

Fifteen years of SGML and XML consulting and publishing and pretty much 
as much involvement with FrameMaker for me. I'm also involved with the 
emerging field of XML Governance, partially because my company has seen 
so many substandard approaches taken to structuring data and the current 
inability to manage XML-based projects effectively.

> As you probably know, I have many years experience in software 
> development, so developing my own EDD is not an issue.

You're perfectly positioned to start this off right.


-- 
Regards,

Marcus Carr  email:  mcarr at allette.com.au
___
Allette Systems (Australia)  www:http://www.allette.com.au
___
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler."
- Einstein

Frame2000 still available?

[Klaus Daube]

   The only reference in Google i have found is this (in a Word file ):

   I-AUTHOR DELUXE FOR SUPER VCD V. 1.0 : OTIMO!! IBM FRAME2000 5.5:
   Coupled with Adobe FrameMaker+SGML and Softline International
   Incorporated (SII)FM6SGML, Frame2000 appears to the author as a
   single, seamless application.Frame2000 provides an authoring
   environment that combines the power and versatility of structured
   markup with the ease-of-use of desktop publishing and a natural user
   interface. Frame2000 provides an interactive authoring model; you see
   formatted results of your work as you make changes. Or, if you prefer,
   you can choose to switch back and forth between viewing your document
   with or without the tags and not take your hands off the keys.
   Frame2000 is designed to simplify and automate authoring tasks while
   providing immediate feedback.

   [SUPERCD   CAMPINAS - 05/05/2003  by SUPERCDCAMPINAS at YAHOO.COM.BR]

   On 7 Oct 2006 at 10:30, Steve Rickaby wrote:

   > At 17:04 -0600 6/10/06, Combs, Richard wrote:

   >

   > >Charles Grinnell wrote:

   > >

   > >> Anyone knows whether Frame2000 is still available for

   > >> purchase? Thanks in advance!

   > >

   > >Huh? What's a Frame2000?

   > >

   > >It's not a FrameMaker version -- those are (going back to mid-90s)

   > >5.5.6, 6, 7, 7.1, and 7.2.

   >

   > It is, or was, a plug-in. Found this in the archives, not sure if it
   helps...

   >

   > >  *  To: "Free Framers" 

   > >  *  Subject: FM 7.1 version p114

   > >  *  From: "Thomas Michanek"
   

   > >  *  Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 16:31:31 +0200

   > >  *  Cc: ,
   

   > >  *  Delivered-to:
   jeremyg-freeframers:org-ffarchiv at freeframers.org

   > >  *  Reply-to: "Thomas Michanek"
   

   > >  *  Sender: owner-framers at x

   > >

   > >[ The original message appeared on the FrameUsers mailing list.

   > >  This reply is sent only to the "Free Framers" mailing list.

   > >  If this reply is useful, consider copying it to FrameUsers. ]

   > >

   > >From: Dov Isaacs 

   > >> At 6/10/2004 11:28 PM, Dhanagopal, Kumar S wrote:

   > >> > I use FM7.1.b023 (on Win XP) on which I need to install a 3rd
   party

   > >> > plug-in called Frame2000. The vendor of this plug-in says that
   the

   > >> > plug-in works only with FM7.1.P114. According to Adobe Tech
   Support,

   > >> > FM7.1.P114 does not exist. The vendor of the plug-in insists
   that an

   > >> > upgrade/patch is available from Adobe.

   > >>

   > >> Please tell the developer of your plug-in that there is
   absolutely

   > >> no "upgrade/patch" available from Adobe or elsewhere from

   > >> FrameMaker 7.1 b023. That version is indeed the official English

   > >> released version of FrameMaker 7.1. There may be later builds for

   > >> other languages, but any differences are associated with
   localization,

   > >> not functionality or bug fixes.

   > >

   > >It's not often that I can say that Dov is wrong, but now it seems

   > >to be the case. There *is* indeed a version FM 7.1 p114, which can

   > >be delivered in two situations, A and B:

   > >

   >

   > [remainder not relevant to Frame2000]

   >

   > --

   > Steve

   >

   >

   

   Docu + Design Daube; Sch?racher 11; CH-8053 Z?rich

   Technical documentation & consultancy; On-line and paper

   Phone:  +41-44-422 86 25  FAX: +41-44-422 82 78

   E-mail: ddd at daube.ch  Web: www.daube.ch/

Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Ellen Lebelle]

Hi Joe,

I work for a small company and I did my own EDD - with the help of
many members on this list. I also "keep structure and presentation
completely separate, the first in the EDD  (i.e. 'if list level 2, set
para tag X') and the second in the template."

I did this as the DITA thing was gaining importance, but since I
started before, I created my own tags in terms that I understand.
(Wasn't that one of the selling points of xml - that you didn't have
to comply with standardized tags?) In the end I think my structure is
very DITA-like (because my mind just happens to work in the same way),
but the tags are not. And, many of the more complex things that go
into the DITA application are missing, so to convert into DITA would
be a challenge. Also, because I was learning as I was doing, there are
probably things that should be cleaned up in my EDD or made simpler.
But it works for us.

If you're just starting out with this now, you might want to take that
into consideration.

Ellen Lebelle (mailto: elebelle at kds.com)
Documentation Manager
KDS
Centre d'Affaires La Boursidi?re -- BP160
92357 Le Plessis Robinson -- France

Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Mike Feimster]

Hi Joe,

I had to make a similar decision a couple years ago. I went with the
home-grown approach. I already knew how to create a DTD and EDD, as well
as XSLT, etc. I figured by the time I learned DocBook, cut it down to a
manageable level, added any other customizations, I could have created
my own EDD/DTD.

Also, by creating my own schema, I could take advantage of the inherent
style in my unstructured documents.

Once in XML, it is easy to get to HTML using XSLT. You can also create
HTML Help without spending any money on tools. (If you're attending the
FrameMaker Chautauqua in Austin next month, I'm presenting a session on
this.)

Mike

-Original Message-
From:
framers-bounces+mike.feimster=acstechnologies.com at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+mike.feimster=acstechnologies.com at lists.frameuse
rs.com] On Behalf Of Joe Malin
Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 2:22 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Docbook versus Home-Grown

Hi!



Well, I *finally* finished the new book for our next software release,
so I can justifiably turn my attention to getting myself into structured
docs.



I am not going to go with DITA just yet. My plan is to convert my
existing unstructured docs to structure first, and then start the next
round of docs in DITA. So, my first decision is what EDD to use. Should
I develop an EDD myself from scratch, or start with the DocBook EDD? My
only hesitation in using the DocBook EDD is that it will have a lot of
elements that I don't want to use.



Any advice, particularly from those who have gone the same route, would
be much appreciated.



As you probably know, I have many years experience in software
development, so developing my own EDD is not an issue.



Joe




TuVox, Inc.


19050 Pruneridge Avenue Suite 150, Cupertino, CA 95014-0715

Joe Malin

Technical Writer

(408)625.1623

jmalin at tuvox.com

www.tuvox.com

The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not
necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc.



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Translation questions

[Karen Story]

Hi Alexandra,

To save money, we break our books into small files, and only hand off the files 
that have changed. This saves us a lot of money in translation costs, but it 
means that we have to do all the file integration and resolve missing fonts and 
a few other issues. Every so often we hand off the whole book, because the 
older sections get out of alignment with the translation memory. If your compay 
can afford it, it's best to always hand off everything to the vendor.

We hand off FrameMaker files, not mif files. 

* Can't translators take the latest mif files from you and use TRADOS to
identify what has changed?

Yes, but they will charge you for every word, even the words that were already 
translated. 

* What if the database from the translator is out-of-date? Can't they
build a new one based on new files?

Yes, but this costs money.

* Is there really a difference in this process (re:TRADOS) if we used
Word?

Don't use Word! The Frame to Mif to Trados and back process works just fine. 

--

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 12:12:13 -0400
From: "Alexandra Duffy" 
Subject: Translation questions
To: 
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain;   charset="us-ascii"

Hello,

FM 6.0 unstructured
ePro WWH 5.0

We recently translated our documentation set (two manuals, about 1,600
pages) into Spanish. This wasn't a very smooth process, but it was
accomplished by sending our .mif files to the translator, who uses
TRADOS. The translator was selected based on the lowest bid.
The translator did create the database files that are used for
facilitating future translation; however, once we got the files back
from them, there were so many errors and changes required that we
question the usefulness of the database files. Our Spanish FrameMaker
files are now significantly different from the files that they gave to
us.

Now we are moving on to the next version of our software, and facing
difficulties understanding how to mark what has changed since the last
version, and translate only the new/changed text. What we ended up doing
is comparing our English files in FrameMaker, and, using the CMP files,
added the new/changed text into the Spanish files, marked with a
Translation condition. This was a huge chore. I just KNOW that others do
not do it this way. The managers are not happy with the amount of time
this took, and we aren't happy because it was very tedious.

I have read the white paper about translation that is often mentioned,
but the process is still not clear to me. I don't really know what
TRADOS can do and how the translators use it with .mif files. (The PTBs
claim that TRADOS works *much better* with Word, and why do use
FrameMaker anyway?) I also know that many of you have switched to
structured FrameMaker to solve some translation issues (like these?) but
at the moment, switching to structured with our small, very busy dept.
is cost- and time-prohibitive.

If you are still using unstructured FrameMaker and translating your text
through several versions, I would like to know:

* What your companies do to mark text that has changed? How do you move
the translation up to the next version?
* Can't translators take the latest mif files from you and use TRADOS to
identify what has changed?
* What if the database from the translator is out-of-date? Can't they
build a new one based on new files?
* Is there really a difference in this process (re:TRADOS) if we used
Word?

I think we're making this way harder than it needs to be and would
appreciate your input.
Please, can you CC: aduffy at nemetschek.net, as I am on the digest.

Thanks,

Alexandra Duffy
Senior Technical Writer
Nemetschek NA

Camtasia

[Jennifer Randel]

Jim, 
I just went to the TechSmith site and found the answer to your
question...

~Jennifer  

-Original Message-
From:
framers-bounces+jennifer_randel=khsd.k12.ca.us at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+jennifer_randel=khsd.k12.ca.us at lists.frameusers.
com] On Behalf Of James Barrow
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:38 AM
To: framers at FrameUsers.com
Subject: Camtasia

Hmmm...is there a Camtasia list that I can join?  Let's see if I can get
away with posting a question here and on WWP :^)

Now that I've finished my documentation, my boss wants me to create
tutorials, so he purchased Camtasia.  Very nice application.

I listened to/looked at some of the tutorials that the previous tech
writer created and found them to be fairly good.  Although her voice
sounded like a transmission between StarFleet and the Enterprise, she
was able to run through an entire procedure without stopping.  How?
I'll never know.

I created two tutorials last week and basically had to split the various
step procedures into quarters.  More accurately, I had to split the
software screens I was talking about in quarters, talk about each
"quarter", while taking breaks between each.

Is this how most of you create tutorials?

- Jim

Columns in middle of chapter

[Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D.]

I'm sure there is a simple answer, but I have been unable to figure it out.

My client wants one section of a particular chapter to be in columns, 
instead of the full page width text of the rest of the chapter.  This 
section will extend over several pages, and will probably have things 
added and deleted as we continue editing the document.  They want the 
columns to flow like a newspaper - filling both columns on one page 
before moving on to the next.

I've tried using a 2-column master page, but the columns need to 
start in the middle of a page, so I don't think that's going to work.

What am I missing?

Lisa

Frame 7.2 on Windows XP, in the Parallels environment on a MacBook Pro
-- 
---
Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D.   lisa at balbes.com  http://www.balbes.com/
Balbes Consultants  Scientific Writing/Editing since 1992
Author of:
"Nontraditional Careers for Chemists" published by Oxford University 
Press in September 2006
blog on Nontraditional Careers and Career Development for Chemists at 
http://balbes.com/wordpress/

Capturing Paragraph Tag change with a Variables

[Scott White]

I've looked through the book and I'm a little stumped.
How do you capture a change to the data assigned a specific paragraph tag so
you can search on that change?
I have a catalog that uses a certain paragraph tag "cellprice" to display
pricing for an item. The paragraph tag "cellitem" is used to identify the
unique item within a catalog that uses the "cellprice" tag. How can I assign
a variable to that so when the price changes from an update or manually
manipulated, I can find that change for the item? Can I export and/or print
a list of all items where the combination "cellprice and cellitem" tags have
changed by date?
Thanks for your help.

Frame 7.0 Mac OS 10 Tiger, Frame 7.2 Windows XP.
-- 
Scott White
Media Production Manager
Implentation Coordinator
AlaMark Technologies
210-704-8239
swhite at alamark.com

OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Sam Beard]

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241


-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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Columns in middle of chapter

[Bodvar Bjorgvinsson]

On 10/9/06, Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D.  wrote:
> I'm sure there is a simple answer, but I have been unable to figure it out.
>
> My client wants one section of a particular chapter to be in columns,
> instead of the full page width text of the rest of the chapter.  This
> section will extend over several pages, and will probably have things
> added and deleted as we continue editing the document.  They want the
> columns to flow like a newspaper - filling both columns on one page
> before moving on to the next.
>
> I've tried using a 2-column master page, but the columns need to
> start in the middle of a page, so I don't think that's going to work.
>
> What am I missing?

Nothing, I guess.

This is something that is not a concept that FrameMaker is built
around. It is built around more monotonous flowing of text and
contents. However there are ways to do this, but I know of none that
is in any way elegant. You will always have to control the shift by
hand. We have no "section break" here.

You will probably need two master pages, one as the one you have
already made, the straight 2-column page, and then another one with
three separate frames, the one in top in full width and two frames
below that one with the same width and space between them as in the
2-column frame. You would have to connect the frames to each other in
the right order.

Maybe you will need the third master page to close the columns with
two frames at the top to form the columns and one in full width at the
bottom.

Finally, you would have to tweak the frames (preferably on the master
page) when you have the final contents ready, so that the shifting is
on the right spot (start and end).

Clumsy, but the only way I know to do it.

HTH,

Bodvar Bjorgvinsson

OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Robert Stoker]

Tiger for the G5 will run OS 9 applications in Classic. Tiger for the 
Intel Mac does not run Classic applications. So, your G5 running Tiger 
should be fine, as the Apple rep said. We run FrameMaker 7.0 and 
occasionally Quark 4.1 on Tiger. We have not experienced any major 
problems.

Regards,
Robert Stoker
Seatech Publications, Inc.
Content Development,
FrameMaker Plug-ins, and
Product Information Management Systems
www.seatechpubs.com

> Ann,
>
>As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
> X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
> emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
> that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
> you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or 
> a
> tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
> there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
> and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's 
> genius
> bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
> out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!
>
> Sam Beard
> Technical Communications - Special Projects
> CTES - LP
> 936 521-2241
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com
> [mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
> Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
> To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
> Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger
>
> Hi All,
>
> I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
> purchased
> an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) 
> to
> run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
> applications
> on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
> which
> I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.
>
> So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
> any
> problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
> Tiger. I
> know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep 
> trying
> to
> sell me the software.
>
> So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with 
> Tiger.
>
> Thanks All
> Z
>
> **
> Ann Zdunczyk
> President
> a2z Publishing, Inc.
> Language Layout & Translation Consulting
> Phone: (336)922-1271
> Fax:   (336)922-4980
> Cell:  (336)456-4493
> http://www.a2z-pub.com
> **

Corrupted PDFs

[Gillian Flato]

Guys,

Frame 7.0 p495
Acrobat 7.0 Professional
on a network drive

I am having a problem where when I create a PDF, it becomes corrupted
and I can't delete or move it. I can open it, but that's it. But this
means that when I change the software, I can't rebuild the PDF so it's
critical. Any suggestions.


Thank you,



 

Gillian Flato

Technical Writer (Software)

nanometrics

1550 Buckeye Dr. 

Milpitas, CA. 95035

(408.435.9600 x 316

7  408.232.5911

* gflato  




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OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Michael O'Neill]

For what it's worth: 
I'm running 10.4.8 and still using some classic applications.  When
setting up the Mac, I had to install the Classic environment as well.

-Michael

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+moneill=meta-comm@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+moneill=meta-comm.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Sam Beard
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:03 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241


-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Peter Gold]

Hi, Ann:

I'm running FrameMaker 7.x under Classic on Tiger 10.4.8 on a Powerbook 
Titanium 667mHz, 1GB RAM with no Tiger-specific problems. I can't 
remember if the Tiger I installed on the new replacement hard drive 
included OS 9, or if I dragged a System Folder for OS 9.22 from a backup 
drive.

You should also take note that you can install Tiger (or other OS X 
flavor) AND OS 9.x (or other release) on the same drive and choose which 
one to start up with. You can also install and run OSs on external 
drives, and choose to start up from the external drive. You do this in 
OS X by:

* Apple Menu > System Preferences > Start-up Disk (choose a system 9 or 
X folder for start-up and restart)

OR

* As soon as you start an OS X computer, press Option, which presents 
the option to choose a start-up folder (OS 9 or X, if both are present 
on drives that are accessible to the computer.

In OS 9:

Apple Menu > Control Panels > Start Up Disk (choose...then restart.)

One great area of my ignorance is that I don't know which of the many 
new Macs do not support OS 9 and Classic. The geniuses at the Apple 
store can give you definitive information on this.

You can read a lot about this (and other stuff) in David Pogue's 
excellent and thorough "Mac OS X: The Missing Manual" (choose the cat 
version you need.) There's not much he overlooks explaining about common 
and obscure aspects of Mac-ing.

HTH

Regards,

Peter Gold
KnowHow ProServices
> -Original Message-
> From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com
> [mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
> Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
> To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
> Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger
>
> Hi All,
>
> I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
> purchased
> an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
> run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
> applications
> on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
> which
> I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.
>
> So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
> any
> problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
> Tiger. I
> know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
> to
> sell me the software.
>
> So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.
>
> Thanks All
> Z
>
>   

OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Michael O'Neill]

I'm running this on a Mac Mini with a G4 proc.  

It's been a long time since I set it up, but as best as I can remember,
I installed the Classic environment as part of the initial setup and
configuration of Tiger.  This required the use of a "Classic"
environment disk (again, if I remember correctly).

When I try to open a Classic (OS9) application, the Classic environment
opens automatically within OS X and the application I originally tried
to open runs within this.  I don't boot to Classic or do any dual
booting shenanigans.

In the System Preferences, there is a "Classic" icon under "System" that
allows me to set various Classic options, including starting when
logging in, warning before starting Classic, various memory usage
settings for Classic, and more.  

OS 9/Classic does NOT appear as an option when under Startup Disk
preferences.

Sorry I can't provide too many details.  It's been a long time since I
initially set it up and I use Classic less and less frequently every
week that passes.  At least I know that in at least my circumstance,
Classic does work on Tiger.

-Michael



-Original Message-
From: Sam Beard [mailto:sam.be...@ctes.com] 
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 4:49 PM
To: Michael O'Neill; swhite at alamark.com
Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Michael and Scott,

   This is intriguing to me. My understanding was that Classic, and
therefore OS 9, wouldn't run on any of the later machines, particularly
any Intel-based machines. Are either of you running one of these? What
machines are you running? Are you running OS 9 in emulation of some sort
or as a stand-alone OS, that you can choose upon start-up?
   In other words, more details, please! ;-P

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241

Scott White wrote:

We run Tiger and you have to take an OS9 disc and load it as well.
However, the Macs that run both windows and OS10 run Frame for the PC
just fine. We are using it here. FYI.

And Michael O'Neill wrote:

For what it's worth: 
I'm running 10.4.8 and still using some classic applications.  When
setting up the Mac, I had to install the Classic environment as well.

-Michael

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+moneill=meta-comm@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+moneill=meta-comm.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Sam Beard
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:03 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com 
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241


-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Scott White]

We run Tiger and you have to take an OS9 disc and load it as well. However,
the Macs that run both windows and OS10 run Frame for the PC just fine. We
are using it here. FYI.
-- 
Scott White
Media Production Manager
Implentation Coordinator
AlaMark Technologies
210-704-8239
swhite at alamark.com


> From: Sam Beard 
> Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 13:03:07 -0700
> To: 
> Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger
> 
> Ann,
> 
>As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
> X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
> emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
> that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
> you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
> tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
> there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
> and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
> bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
> out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!
> 
> Sam Beard
> Technical Communications - Special Projects
> CTES - LP
> 936 521-2241
>  
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com
> [mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
> Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
> To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
> Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
> purchased
> an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
> run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
> applications
> on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
> which
> I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.
> 
> So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
> any
> problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
> Tiger. I
> know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
> to
> sell me the software.
> 
> So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.
> 
> Thanks All
> Z
> 
> **
> Ann Zdunczyk
> President
> a2z Publishing, Inc.
> Language Layout & Translation Consulting
> Phone: (336)922-1271
> Fax:   (336)922-4980
> Cell:  (336)456-4493
> http://www.a2z-pub.com
> **
> 
> ___
> 
> 
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as sam.beard at ctes.com.
> 
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
> 
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/sam.beard%40ctes.com
> 
> Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
> ___
> 
> 
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as swhite at alamark.com.
> 
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
> 
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit 
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> 
> Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Sam Beard]

Michael and Scott,

   This is intriguing to me. My understanding was that Classic, and
therefore OS 9, wouldn't run on any of the later machines, particularly
any Intel-based machines. Are either of you running one of these? What
machines are you running? Are you running OS 9 in emulation of some sort
or as a stand-alone OS, that you can choose upon start-up?
   In other words, more details, please! ;-P

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241

Scott White wrote:

We run Tiger and you have to take an OS9 disc and load it as well.
However, the Macs that run both windows and OS10 run Frame for the PC
just fine. We are using it here. FYI.

And Michael O'Neill wrote:

For what it's worth: 
I'm running 10.4.8 and still using some classic applications.  When
setting up the Mac, I had to install the Classic environment as well.

-Michael

-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+moneill=meta-comm@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+moneill=meta-comm.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Sam Beard
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:03 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com 
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241


-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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Columns in middle of chapter

[Daniel Emory]

--- "Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D."  wrote:
> My client wants one section of a particular chapter
> to be in columns, instead of the full page width
text of the rest of the chapter.  This 
> section will extend over several pages, and will
> probably have things added and deleted as we
continue editing the document.  They want the 
> columns to flow like a newspaper - filling both
> columns on one page before moving on to the next.

There is a viable way to do this in FrameMaker. 

First, your Left and Right master pages must both be
converted from a single-column page layout to a
2-column layout.

Second, to make it work, you must have two sets of
paragraph formats which at differ in a single setting
within the Pagination pane of the Paragraph Designer,
namely:

1. the paragraph formats for the ordinary
single-column content are all set to "Across All
Columns":, 

2. The paragraph formats for the 2-column content are
set to " In Column".

Take note also that you'll need to define 1- and
2-column paragraph formats for graphic and table
anchors if the 2-column text contains graphics or
tables. 

With this setup: 

Each time you switch from a 1-column paragraph style
to a 2- column paragraph style, lines of 2-column text
are produced. Then, switching back to a 1-column
paragraph style will cause the lines of 2-column text
above it to be balanced out within the two columns,
and the text below will resume the 1-column layout 

You can switch back and forth between 1- and 2-column
text multiple times within a single page, thus you can
begin and end the 2-column text anywhere within the
same page, or you can start the 2-column text anywhere
on a beginning page, and end the 2-column text
anywhere on a succeeding page.

This solution works best when:

A. Single-column text appears at the top of a page,
and either fills the page or is followed by 2-column
text which fills the rest of the page, or

B. The 2-column text appears at the top of a page, and
either fills the page, or is followed by 1-column text
which fills the rest of the page.

If, as you state, there are likely to be subsequent
edits which cause both the 1-column text and the
2-column text to shrink or grow in size, you may find
it necessary to manually force page breaks more often
that usual in order to keep the 2-column text
coherent. This, however, should not be much of a
problem if all the 2-column text is in one solid,
multi-page block that is preceded and/or followed by
solid blocks of single-column text. 



Dan Emory & Associates
FrameMaker/FrameMaker+SGML Document Design & Database Publishing

OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Ann Zdunczyk]

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9 applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology, which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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Re: Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Marcus Carr]

Joe Malin wrote:


Well, I *finally* finished the new book for our next software
release, so I can justifiably turn my attention to getting myself
into structured docs.


Ah, some time to play... ;-)

I am not going to go with DITA just yet. My plan is to convert my 
existing unstructured docs to structure first, and then start the

next round of docs in DITA. So, my first decision is what EDD to use.
Should I develop an EDD myself from scratch, or start with the
DocBook EDD? My only hesitation in using the DocBook EDD is that it
will have a lot of elements that I don't want to use.


In my opinion, the last sentence hints that you already know the answer 
to your question. My long-standing belief is that if you try to 
structure your data in accordance with what tools you currently have at 
hand, you're focusing on the wrong issue. Your documents have an 
inherent structure, and you should respect and support it. There is a 
cost to every single XPath that you don't use, so something like DocBook 
can be a very expensive approach. If you cut it down, you'll often find 
that you're left with the right elements, but the names may not be what 
you'd choose yourself. Also, DocBook is very loosely structured, so you 
may want to tighten up the models - by the time you go through all of 
this, you may as well have just done the analysis yourself and started 
with the pre-existing (but implied) structure of your documents.


Although there may be good reasons for going to DITA, I've never had 
reason to do so, as I feel that the benefits gained from standardisation 
would quickly dry up as soon as you started customising. I'd be inclined 
to convert to DITA as a final process if you really had a need to mix 
and match modules, but I would probably choose a more descriptive syntax 
for data creation and management.



Any advice, particularly from those who have gone the same route,
would be much appreciated.


Fifteen years of SGML and XML consulting and publishing and pretty much 
as much involvement with FrameMaker for me. I'm also involved with the 
emerging field of XML Governance, partially because my company has seen 
so many substandard approaches taken to structuring data and the current 
inability to manage XML-based projects effectively.


As you probably know, I have many years experience in software 
development, so developing my own EDD is not an issue.


You're perfectly positioned to start this off right.


--
Regards,

Marcus Carr  email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
___
Allette Systems (Australia)  www:http://www.allette.com.au
___
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler."
   - Einstein
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RE: Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Lynne A. Price]

At 03:21 PM 10/8/2006, Joe Malin wrote:

I don't mind writing an EDD from the ground up. What I want to avoid is
producing an EDD that is off-track from easy conversion to DocBook XML.
My overall goal is to convert my unstructured FM to structured FM and
then to XML on the way to HTML. Obviously this will be a long project.


Joe,
  Sounds like you want to create an EDD that is compatible with DocBook 
without being overwhelmed with the number of elements and attributes in 
DocBook. What I do in this situation is:


1) Make a list of all the DocBook elements. One way to do so is to create 
an EDD from DocBook with no r/w rules and from this EDD generate a list of 
all Tag elements.


2) Turn each entry in the list into a drop rule (or generate the list in 
this form to begin with):


   element "x" drop;
   element "y" drop;
   element "z" drop;

3) Review the list and decide which DocBook elements you want to keep. 
Comment out the corresponding rules:


   element "x" drop;
   /* element "y" drop; */
   element "z" drop;

4) Do something similar with attributes.

5) Create a new EDD using the drop rules. FM will not create element 
definitions for the elements you have dropped. Furthermore, it will remove 
mention of them from the general rules of the elements you are retaining. 
The result should be a manageable EDD. You can still use the DocBook DTD.


--Lynne





Lynne A. Price
Text Structure Consulting, Inc.
Specializing in structured FrameMaker consulting, application development, 
and training

[EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.txstruct.com
voice/fax: (510) 583-1505 cell phone: (510) 421-2284  



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RE: Frame2000 still available?

[Klaus Daube]

   The only reference in Google i have found is this (in a Word file ):

   I-AUTHOR DELUXE FOR SUPER VCD V. 1.0 : OTIMO!! IBM FRAME2000 5.5:
   Coupled with Adobe FrameMaker+SGML and Softline International
   Incorporated (SII)FM6SGML, Frame2000 appears to the author as a
   single, seamless application.Frame2000 provides an authoring
   environment that combines the power and versatility of structured
   markup with the ease-of-use of desktop publishing and a natural user
   interface. Frame2000 provides an interactive authoring model; you see
   formatted results of your work as you make changes. Or, if you prefer,
   you can choose to switch back and forth between viewing your document
   with or without the tags and not take your hands off the keys.
   Frame2000 is designed to simplify and automate authoring tasks while
   providing immediate feedback.

   [SUPERCD   CAMPINAS - 05/05/2003  by [EMAIL PROTECTED]

   On 7 Oct 2006 at 10:30, Steve Rickaby wrote:

   > At 17:04 -0600 6/10/06, Combs, Richard wrote:

   >

   > >Charles Grinnell wrote:

   > >

   > >> Anyone knows whether Frame2000 is still available for

   > >> purchase? Thanks in advance!

   > >

   > >Huh? What's a Frame2000?

   > >

   > >It's not a FrameMaker version -- those are (going back to mid-90s)

   > >5.5.6, 6, 7, 7.1, and 7.2.

   >

   > It is, or was, a plug-in. Found this in the archives, not sure if it
   helps...

   >

   > >  *  To: "Free Framers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   > >  *  Subject: FM 7.1 version p114

   > >  *  From: "Thomas Michanek"
   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   > >  *  Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2004 16:31:31 +0200

   > >  *  Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   > >  *  Delivered-to:
   jeremyg-freeframers:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

   > >  *  Reply-to: "Thomas Michanek"
   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   > >  *  Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

   > >

   > >[ The original message appeared on the FrameUsers mailing list.

   > >  This reply is sent only to the "Free Framers" mailing list.

   > >  If this reply is useful, consider copying it to FrameUsers. ]

   > >

   > >From: Dov Isaacs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   > >> At 6/10/2004 11:28 PM, Dhanagopal, Kumar S wrote:

   > >> > I use FM7.1.b023 (on Win XP) on which I need to install a 3rd
   party

   > >> > plug-in called Frame2000. The vendor of this plug-in says that
   the

   > >> > plug-in works only with FM7.1.P114. According to Adobe Tech
   Support,

   > >> > FM7.1.P114 does not exist. The vendor of the plug-in insists
   that an

   > >> > upgrade/patch is available from Adobe.

   > >>

   > >> Please tell the developer of your plug-in that there is
   absolutely

   > >> no "upgrade/patch" available from Adobe or elsewhere from

   > >> FrameMaker 7.1 b023. That version is indeed the official English

   > >> released version of FrameMaker 7.1. There may be later builds for

   > >> other languages, but any differences are associated with
   localization,

   > >> not functionality or bug fixes.

   > >

   > >It's not often that I can say that Dov is wrong, but now it seems

   > >to be the case. There *is* indeed a version FM 7.1 p114, which can

   > >be delivered in two situations, A and B:

   > >

   >

   > [remainder not relevant to Frame2000]

   >

   > --

   > Steve

   >

   >

   

   Docu + Design Daube; Schäracher 11; CH-8053 Zürich

   Technical documentation & consultancy; On-line and paper

   Phone:  +41-44-422 86 25  FAX: +41-44-422 82 78

   E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  Web: www.daube.ch/
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Re: Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Ellen Lebelle]

Hi Joe,

I work for a small company and I did my own EDD - with the help of
many members on this list. I also "keep structure and presentation
completely separate, the first in the EDD  (i.e. 'if list level 2, set
para tag X') and the second in the template."

I did this as the DITA thing was gaining importance, but since I
started before, I created my own tags in terms that I understand.
(Wasn't that one of the selling points of xml - that you didn't have
to comply with standardized tags?) In the end I think my structure is
very DITA-like (because my mind just happens to work in the same way),
but the tags are not. And, many of the more complex things that go
into the DITA application are missing, so to convert into DITA would
be a challenge. Also, because I was learning as I was doing, there are
probably things that should be cleaned up in my EDD or made simpler.
But it works for us.

If you're just starting out with this now, you might want to take that
into consideration.

Ellen Lebelle (mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED])
Documentation Manager
KDS
Centre d'Affaires La Boursidière -- BP160
92357 Le Plessis Robinson -- France
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RE: Docbook versus Home-Grown

[Mike Feimster]

Hi Joe,

I had to make a similar decision a couple years ago. I went with the
home-grown approach. I already knew how to create a DTD and EDD, as well
as XSLT, etc. I figured by the time I learned DocBook, cut it down to a
manageable level, added any other customizations, I could have created
my own EDD/DTD.

Also, by creating my own schema, I could take advantage of the inherent
style in my unstructured documents.

Once in XML, it is easy to get to HTML using XSLT. You can also create
HTML Help without spending any money on tools. (If you're attending the
FrameMaker Chautauqua in Austin next month, I'm presenting a session on
this.)

Mike

-Original Message-
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
rs.com] On Behalf Of Joe Malin
Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 2:22 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Docbook versus Home-Grown

Hi!

 

Well, I *finally* finished the new book for our next software release,
so I can justifiably turn my attention to getting myself into structured
docs.

 

I am not going to go with DITA just yet. My plan is to convert my
existing unstructured docs to structure first, and then start the next
round of docs in DITA. So, my first decision is what EDD to use. Should
I develop an EDD myself from scratch, or start with the DocBook EDD? My
only hesitation in using the DocBook EDD is that it will have a lot of
elements that I don't want to use.

 

Any advice, particularly from those who have gone the same route, would
be much appreciated.

 

As you probably know, I have many years experience in software
development, so developing my own EDD is not an issue.

 

Joe

 


TuVox, Inc.


19050 Pruneridge Avenue Suite 150, Cupertino, CA 95014-0715

Joe Malin

Technical Writer

(408)625.1623

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

www.tuvox.com

The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not
necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc.

 

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Re: Translation questions

[Karen Story]

Hi Alexandra,

To save money, we break our books into small files, and only hand off the files 
that have changed. This saves us a lot of money in translation costs, but it 
means that we have to do all the file integration and resolve missing fonts and 
a few other issues. Every so often we hand off the whole book, because the 
older sections get out of alignment with the translation memory. If your compay 
can afford it, it's best to always hand off everything to the vendor.

We hand off FrameMaker files, not mif files. 

* Can't translators take the latest mif files from you and use TRADOS to
identify what has changed?

Yes, but they will charge you for every word, even the words that were already 
translated. 

* What if the database from the translator is out-of-date? Can't they
build a new one based on new files?

Yes, but this costs money.

* Is there really a difference in this process (re:TRADOS) if we used
Word?

Don't use Word! The Frame to Mif to Trados and back process works just fine. 

--

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 12:12:13 -0400
From: "Alexandra Duffy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Translation questions
To: 
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;   charset="us-ascii"

Hello,

FM 6.0 unstructured
ePro WWH 5.0

We recently translated our documentation set (two manuals, about 1,600
pages) into Spanish. This wasn't a very smooth process, but it was
accomplished by sending our .mif files to the translator, who uses
TRADOS. The translator was selected based on the lowest bid.
The translator did create the database files that are used for
facilitating future translation; however, once we got the files back
from them, there were so many errors and changes required that we
question the usefulness of the database files. Our Spanish FrameMaker
files are now significantly different from the files that they gave to
us.

Now we are moving on to the next version of our software, and facing
difficulties understanding how to mark what has changed since the last
version, and translate only the new/changed text. What we ended up doing
is comparing our English files in FrameMaker, and, using the CMP files,
added the new/changed text into the Spanish files, marked with a
Translation condition. This was a huge chore. I just KNOW that others do
not do it this way. The managers are not happy with the amount of time
this took, and we aren't happy because it was very tedious.

I have read the white paper about translation that is often mentioned,
but the process is still not clear to me. I don't really know what
TRADOS can do and how the translators use it with .mif files. (The PTBs
claim that TRADOS works *much better* with Word, and why do use
FrameMaker anyway?) I also know that many of you have switched to
structured FrameMaker to solve some translation issues (like these?) but
at the moment, switching to structured with our small, very busy dept.
is cost- and time-prohibitive.

If you are still using unstructured FrameMaker and translating your text
through several versions, I would like to know:

* What your companies do to mark text that has changed? How do you move
the translation up to the next version?
* Can't translators take the latest mif files from you and use TRADOS to
identify what has changed?
* What if the database from the translator is out-of-date? Can't they
build a new one based on new files?
* Is there really a difference in this process (re:TRADOS) if we used
Word?

I think we're making this way harder than it needs to be and would
appreciate your input.
Please, can you CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED], as I am on the digest.

Thanks,

Alexandra Duffy
Senior Technical Writer
Nemetschek NA
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RE: Camtasia

[Jennifer Randel]

Jim, 
I just went to the TechSmith site and found the answer to your
question...

~Jennifer  

-Original Message-
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
com] On Behalf Of James Barrow
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:38 AM
To: framers@FrameUsers.com
Subject: Camtasia

Hmmm...is there a Camtasia list that I can join?  Let's see if I can get
away with posting a question here and on WWP :^)

Now that I've finished my documentation, my boss wants me to create
tutorials, so he purchased Camtasia.  Very nice application.

I listened to/looked at some of the tutorials that the previous tech
writer created and found them to be fairly good.  Although her voice
sounded like a transmission between StarFleet and the Enterprise, she
was able to run through an entire procedure without stopping.  How?
I'll never know.

I created two tutorials last week and basically had to split the various
step procedures into quarters.  More accurately, I had to split the
software screens I was talking about in quarters, talk about each
"quarter", while taking breaks between each.

Is this how most of you create tutorials?

- Jim
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Columns in middle of chapter

[Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D.]

I'm sure there is a simple answer, but I have been unable to figure it out.

My client wants one section of a particular chapter to be in columns, 
instead of the full page width text of the rest of the chapter.  This 
section will extend over several pages, and will probably have things 
added and deleted as we continue editing the document.  They want the 
columns to flow like a newspaper - filling both columns on one page 
before moving on to the next.


I've tried using a 2-column master page, but the columns need to 
start in the middle of a page, so I don't think that's going to work.


What am I missing?

Lisa

Frame 7.2 on Windows XP, in the Parallels environment on a MacBook Pro
--
---
Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D.   [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.balbes.com/
Balbes Consultants  Scientific Writing/Editing since 1992
Author of:
"Nontraditional Careers for Chemists" published by Oxford University 
Press in September 2006
blog on Nontraditional Careers and Career Development for Chemists at 
http://balbes.com/wordpress/

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Capturing Paragraph Tag change with a Variables

[Scott White]

I've looked through the book and I'm a little stumped.
How do you capture a change to the data assigned a specific paragraph tag so
you can search on that change?
I have a catalog that uses a certain paragraph tag "cellprice" to display
pricing for an item. The paragraph tag "cellitem" is used to identify the
unique item within a catalog that uses the "cellprice" tag. How can I assign
a variable to that so when the price changes from an update or manually
manipulated, I can find that change for the item? Can I export and/or print
a list of all items where the combination "cellprice and cellitem" tags have
changed by date?
Thanks for your help.

Frame 7.0 Mac OS 10 Tiger, Frame 7.2 Windows XP.
-- 
Scott White
Media Production Manager
Implentation Coordinator
AlaMark Technologies
210-704-8239
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Sam Beard]

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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Re: Columns in middle of chapter

[Bodvar Bjorgvinsson]

On 10/9/06, Lisa M. Balbes, Ph.D. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

I'm sure there is a simple answer, but I have been unable to figure it out.

My client wants one section of a particular chapter to be in columns,
instead of the full page width text of the rest of the chapter.  This
section will extend over several pages, and will probably have things
added and deleted as we continue editing the document.  They want the
columns to flow like a newspaper - filling both columns on one page
before moving on to the next.

I've tried using a 2-column master page, but the columns need to
start in the middle of a page, so I don't think that's going to work.

What am I missing?


Nothing, I guess.

This is something that is not a concept that FrameMaker is built
around. It is built around more monotonous flowing of text and
contents. However there are ways to do this, but I know of none that
is in any way elegant. You will always have to control the shift by
hand. We have no "section break" here.

You will probably need two master pages, one as the one you have
already made, the straight 2-column page, and then another one with
three separate frames, the one in top in full width and two frames
below that one with the same width and space between them as in the
2-column frame. You would have to connect the frames to each other in
the right order.

Maybe you will need the third master page to close the columns with
two frames at the top to form the columns and one in full width at the
bottom.

Finally, you would have to tweak the frames (preferably on the master
page) when you have the final contents ready, so that the shifting is
on the right spot (start and end).

Clumsy, but the only way I know to do it.

HTH,

Bodvar Bjorgvinsson
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OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Robert Stoker]

Tiger for the G5 will run OS 9 applications in Classic. Tiger for the 
Intel Mac does not run Classic applications. So, your G5 running Tiger 
should be fine, as the Apple rep said. We run FrameMaker 7.0 and 
occasionally Quark 4.1 on Tiger. We have not experienced any major 
problems.


Regards,
Robert Stoker
Seatech Publications, Inc.
Content Development,
FrameMaker Plug-ins, and
Product Information Management Systems
www.seatechpubs.com


Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or 
a

tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's 
genius

bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241


-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces+sam.beard=ctes.com at lists.frameusers.com] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com; framers at omsys.com
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) 
to

run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep 
trying

to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with 
Tiger.


Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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Corrupted PDFs

[Gillian Flato]

Guys,
 
Frame 7.0 p495
Acrobat 7.0 Professional
on a network drive
 
I am having a problem where when I create a PDF, it becomes corrupted
and I can't delete or move it. I can open it, but that's it. But this
means that when I change the software, I can't rebuild the PDF so it's
critical. Any suggestions.
 

Thank you,

 

 

Gillian Flato

Technical Writer (Software)

nanometrics

1550 Buckeye Dr. 

Milpitas, CA. 95035

(408.435.9600 x 316

7  408.232.5911

* gflato mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 

 


This message (including any attachments) may contain confidential information 
intended for a specific individual and purpose. If you are not the intended 
recipient, delete this message. If you are not the intended recipient, 
disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action based on this message 
is strictly prohibited.
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RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Michael O'Neill]

For what it's worth: 
I'm running 10.4.8 and still using some classic applications.  When
setting up the Mac, I had to install the Classic environment as well.
  
-Michael

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Sam Beard
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:03 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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Re: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Scott White]

We run Tiger and you have to take an OS9 disc and load it as well. However,
the Macs that run both windows and OS10 run Frame for the PC just fine. We
are using it here. FYI.
-- 
Scott White
Media Production Manager
Implentation Coordinator
AlaMark Technologies
210-704-8239
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


> From: Sam Beard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 13:03:07 -0700
> To: 
> Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger
> 
> Ann,
> 
>As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
> X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
> emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
> that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
> you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
> tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
> there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
> and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
> bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
> out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!
> 
> Sam Beard
> Technical Communications - Special Projects
> CTES - LP
> 936 521-2241
>  
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
> To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
> purchased
> an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
> run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
> applications
> on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
> which
> I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.
> 
> So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
> any
> problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
> Tiger. I
> know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
> to
> sell me the software.
> 
> So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.
> 
> Thanks All
> Z
> 
> **
> Ann Zdunczyk
> President
> a2z Publishing, Inc.
> Language Layout & Translation Consulting
> Phone: (336)922-1271
> Fax:   (336)922-4980
> Cell:  (336)456-4493
> http://www.a2z-pub.com
> **
> 
> ___
> 
> 
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> 
> Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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> 
> Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
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Re: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Peter Gold]

Hi, Ann:

I'm running FrameMaker 7.x under Classic on Tiger 10.4.8 on a Powerbook 
Titanium 667mHz, 1GB RAM with no Tiger-specific problems. I can't 
remember if the Tiger I installed on the new replacement hard drive 
included OS 9, or if I dragged a System Folder for OS 9.22 from a backup 
drive.


You should also take note that you can install Tiger (or other OS X 
flavor) AND OS 9.x (or other release) on the same drive and choose which 
one to start up with. You can also install and run OSs on external 
drives, and choose to start up from the external drive. You do this in 
OS X by:


* Apple Menu > System Preferences > Start-up Disk (choose a system 9 or 
X folder for start-up and restart)


OR

* As soon as you start an OS X computer, press Option, which presents 
the option to choose a start-up folder (OS 9 or X, if both are present 
on drives that are accessible to the computer.


In OS 9:

Apple Menu > Control Panels > Start Up Disk (choose...then restart.)

One great area of my ignorance is that I don't know which of the many 
new Macs do not support OS 9 and Classic. The geniuses at the Apple 
store can give you definitive information on this.


You can read a lot about this (and other stuff) in David Pogue's 
excellent and thorough "Mac OS X: The Missing Manual" (choose the cat 
version you need.) There's not much he overlooks explaining about common 
and obscure aspects of Mac-ing.


HTH

Regards,

Peter Gold
KnowHow ProServices

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

  


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Shortcut keys stop working

[Paul Di Somma]

Hi guys,

Working in FM 7p492 on XP for about 2+ hours ... suddenly the shortcut
keys (that is, Cltr + C to copy and so forth)
stop working. Using the menu commands work fine. My fix is to restart
the machine, but I wondered if anyone has
experienced this and if they have a better fix.

thanks,
- Paul
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RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Sam Beard]

Michael and Scott,

   This is intriguing to me. My understanding was that Classic, and
therefore OS 9, wouldn't run on any of the later machines, particularly
any Intel-based machines. Are either of you running one of these? What
machines are you running? Are you running OS 9 in emulation of some sort
or as a stand-alone OS, that you can choose upon start-up?
   In other words, more details, please! ;-P

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241
 
Scott White wrote:

We run Tiger and you have to take an OS9 disc and load it as well.
However, the Macs that run both windows and OS10 run Frame for the PC
just fine. We are using it here. FYI.

And Michael O'Neill wrote:

For what it's worth: 
I'm running 10.4.8 and still using some classic applications.  When
setting up the Mac, I had to install the Classic environment as well.
  
-Michael

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Sam Beard
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:03 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

[Michael O'Neill]

I'm running this on a Mac Mini with a G4 proc.  

It's been a long time since I set it up, but as best as I can remember,
I installed the Classic environment as part of the initial setup and
configuration of Tiger.  This required the use of a "Classic"
environment disk (again, if I remember correctly).

When I try to open a Classic (OS9) application, the Classic environment
opens automatically within OS X and the application I originally tried
to open runs within this.  I don't boot to Classic or do any dual
booting shenanigans.

In the System Preferences, there is a "Classic" icon under "System" that
allows me to set various Classic options, including starting when
logging in, warning before starting Classic, various memory usage
settings for Classic, and more.  

OS 9/Classic does NOT appear as an option when under Startup Disk
preferences.

Sorry I can't provide too many details.  It's been a long time since I
initially set it up and I use Classic less and less frequently every
week that passes.  At least I know that in at least my circumstance,
Classic does work on Tiger.

-Michael



-Original Message-
From: Sam Beard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 4:49 PM
To: Michael O'Neill; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Michael and Scott,

   This is intriguing to me. My understanding was that Classic, and
therefore OS 9, wouldn't run on any of the later machines, particularly
any Intel-based machines. Are either of you running one of these? What
machines are you running? Are you running OS 9 in emulation of some sort
or as a stand-alone OS, that you can choose upon start-up?
   In other words, more details, please! ;-P

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241
 
Scott White wrote:

We run Tiger and you have to take an OS9 disc and load it as well.
However, the Macs that run both windows and OS10 run Frame for the PC
just fine. We are using it here. FYI.

And Michael O'Neill wrote:

For what it's worth: 
I'm running 10.4.8 and still using some classic applications.  When
setting up the Mac, I had to install the Classic environment as well.
  
-Michael

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Sam Beard
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:03 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Ann,

   As far as I'm aware, Tiger does NOT support OS 9 in any form. Mac OS
X up to somewhere around 10.3 or so WOULD run OS 9 apps in, basically,
emulation form in what was known as Classic. However, OS X 10.4 dropped
that provision, as far as I know. But, then again, if an Apple rep told
you this, it might be true. Was the rep one of the sales phone reps or a
tech support rep, either at an Apple store or via the phone support? If
there's an Apple store near you, you might consider dropping in there
and asking them about your situation. The people staffing Apple's genius
bar are pretty knowledgeable and, usually, more than willing to help
out, and NOT just because that's what they get paid for, either!

Sam Beard
Technical Communications - Special Projects
CTES - LP
936 521-2241
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ann Zdunczyk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 6:48 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OS 9 Applications on Tiger

Hi All,

I have a G5 running Panther that I purchased several years ago. A
purchased
an upgrade for one of my applications and it requires OS 10.4 (Tiger) to
run. I was told by the Apple rep that Tiger would run my OS 9
applications
on this machine just fine. Since I do not have the New Mac technology,
which
I understand will not run OS 9 appications, I should be OK.

So I am asking the people on this list that work on Macs if there are
any
problems that they have running into running OS 9 applications with
Tiger. I
know you all will tell me the UNVARNISHED truth rather than a rep trying
to
sell me the software.

So please let me know of any problems that you have run into with Tiger.

Thanks All
Z

**
Ann Zdunczyk
President
a2z Publishing, Inc.
Language Layout & Translation Consulting
Phone: (336)922-1271
Fax:   (336)922-4980
Cell:  (336)456-4493
http://www.a2z-pub.com
**

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