FrameMaker 12 released
On 1/17/2014 1:31 PM, Mike Wickham wrote: > I've also bought every FM upgrade since version 6, except for v10, > which offered no features that I needed. I will be buying the FM 12 > upgrade for sure. Oops... there was a typo in there. I am using FM 10. It was FM 11 that was the only version I skipped, due to lack of new features desirable to me. Mike Wickham
FrameMaker 12 released
After years with the same company, I'm just starting to re-invent myself as a contractor. So far no one has asked for work in FrameMaker. If they did, I'd have to consider my options. A thousand bucks is a big outlay. On the other hand, I'd probably want it for no more than a month or two, so locking in for a year doesn't look appealing either. And the point about having something that is mine and just keeps working is well-taken. So I would seriously consider an outright buy, high price notwithstanding, over a rental for a much longer term than I'd need, only to lose the investment. (Why rent when you can buy, right?) But given a choice, I'd just use other tools (OK, not Word). The book model of help delivery seems to be on the wane, and DITA is maturing nicely. . . On 2014-01-17 14:31, Mike Wickham wrote: > Syed, I think your math is right on. I can't understand why anyone > would pay more for a subscription that will render their software > useless the moment they stop paying. If they fall on hard times, the > perpetual license lets them at least keep working with their software > as long as they can keep a compatible operating system on an old > computer. > > If the issue is someone not being able to come up with the upgrade fee > all at once, and a monthly payment sounds more attractive, then they > should consider getting a short term bank loan (or put it on a credit > card) and pay the bank an even smaller monthly payment to buy the > perpetual license. > > And here's another thing, if a company thinks a monthly subscription > is a better to budget, they might also want to think about the resale > value of their company, should they ever want to sell it. A perpetual > license is an asset that can be resold and adds value to a company. A > subscription is future liability that reduces its value. If, as an > individual, they ever want to stop using FrameMaker, they can resell > their personal perpetual license and get some of their money back. Not > so with a subscription. > > I used to buy every upgrade of Creative Suite until it switched to the > Creative Cloud model. Now, CS6 is my last purchase in that line. I > won't pay big money for software that turns off completely if I stop > paying. I've also bought every FM upgrade since version 6, except for > v10, which offered no features that I needed. I will be buying the FM > 12 upgrade for sure. But I will be done buying if FM ever goes to the > subscription-only model. > > Those of you buying subscriptions are making it more and more likely > that the rest of us will lose the perpetual upgrade option in the near > future. If you look at how hard Adobe is trying to get people to buy > subscriptions, you will see that it is their desire to move FrameMaker > to that model. Let's not let them take away our choices. > > Mike > > On 1/17/2014 9:22 AM, Syed Zaeem Hosain (Syed.Hosain at aeris.net) wrote: >> Using an 18 month model, the software subscription for FrameMaker is: >> 18 * 29.99, which is $539.82. >> >> An upgrade is $399 for that same upgrade in that 18 month period, >> right? And then the license is perpetual (at least until Adobe >> abandons this model in the future entirely), so that version keep >> working once somebody stops upgrading (not so in the subscription >> case when cancelled). > > > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to framers as jowens at storm.ca. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jowens%40storm.ca > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
Re: FrameMaker 12 released
On 1/17/2014 1:31 PM, Mike Wickham wrote: I've also bought every FM upgrade since version 6, except for v10, which offered no features that I needed. I will be buying the FM 12 upgrade for sure. Oops... there was a typo in there. I am using FM 10. It was FM 11 that was the only version I skipped, due to lack of new features desirable to me. Mike Wickham ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FrameMaker 12 released
Syed, I think your math is right on. I can't understand why anyone would pay more for a subscription that will render their software useless the moment they stop paying. If they fall on hard times, the perpetual license lets them at least keep working with their software as long as they can keep a compatible operating system on an old computer. If the issue is someone not being able to come up with the upgrade fee all at once, and a monthly payment sounds more attractive, then they should consider getting a short term bank loan (or put it on a credit card) and pay the bank an even smaller monthly payment to buy the perpetual license. And here's another thing, if a company thinks a monthly subscription is a better to budget, they might also want to think about the resale value of their company, should they ever want to sell it. A perpetual license is an asset that can be resold and adds value to a company. A subscription is future liability that reduces its value. If, as an individual, they ever want to stop using FrameMaker, they can resell their personal perpetual license and get some of their money back. Not so with a subscription. I used to buy every upgrade of Creative Suite until it switched to the Creative Cloud model. Now, CS6 is my last purchase in that line. I won't pay big money for software that turns off completely if I stop paying. I've also bought every FM upgrade since version 6, except for v10, which offered no features that I needed. I will be buying the FM 12 upgrade for sure. But I will be done buying if FM ever goes to the subscription-only model. Those of you buying subscriptions are making it more and more likely that the rest of us will lose the perpetual upgrade option in the near future. If you look at how hard Adobe is trying to get people to buy subscriptions, you will see that it is their desire to move FrameMaker to that model. Let's not let them take away our choices. Mike On 1/17/2014 9:22 AM, Syed Zaeem Hosain (Syed.Hosain at aeris.net) wrote: > Using an 18 month model, the software subscription for FrameMaker is: 18 * > 29.99, which is $539.82. > > An upgrade is $399 for that same upgrade in that 18 month period, right? And > then the license is perpetual (at least until Adobe abandons this model in > the future entirely), so that version keep working once somebody stops > upgrading (not so in the subscription case when cancelled).
Framemaker 12
I upgraded to Framemaker 12 and tested it for XHTML and epub output for a fairly complicated document that would choke Madcap Flare. It worked great. Although the cost for upgrade is high, technical publishing software does not have a huge user base and tends to be expensive. For instance, I owned Flare up until last Fall and paid about a thousand dollars a year for the maintenance contract. The software was buggy for tables, vector graphics, and sometimes with simple imports. Webworks epublisher is expensive in its yearly contract. So compared with other alternatives, Framemaker is not particularly expensive and I have found it a lot more stable than the alternatives.
Re: FrameMaker 12 released
After years with the same company, I'm just starting to re-invent myself as a contractor. So far no one has asked for work in FrameMaker. If they did, I'd have to consider my options. A thousand bucks is a big outlay. On the other hand, I'd probably want it for no more than a month or two, so locking in for a year doesn't look appealing either. And the point about having something that is mine and just keeps working is well-taken. So I would seriously consider an outright buy, high price notwithstanding, over a rental for a much longer term than I'd need, only to lose the investment. (Why rent when you can buy, right?) But given a choice, I'd just use other tools (OK, not Word). The book model of help delivery seems to be on the wane, and DITA is maturing nicely. . . On 2014-01-17 14:31, Mike Wickham wrote: Syed, I think your math is right on. I can't understand why anyone would pay more for a subscription that will render their software useless the moment they stop paying. If they fall on hard times, the perpetual license lets them at least keep working with their software as long as they can keep a compatible operating system on an old computer. If the issue is someone not being able to come up with the upgrade fee all at once, and a monthly payment sounds more attractive, then they should consider getting a short term bank loan (or put it on a credit card) and pay the bank an even smaller monthly payment to buy the perpetual license. And here's another thing, if a company thinks a monthly subscription is a better to budget, they might also want to think about the resale value of their company, should they ever want to sell it. A perpetual license is an asset that can be resold and adds value to a company. A subscription is future liability that reduces its value. If, as an individual, they ever want to stop using FrameMaker, they can resell their personal perpetual license and get some of their money back. Not so with a subscription. I used to buy every upgrade of Creative Suite until it switched to the Creative Cloud model. Now, CS6 is my last purchase in that line. I won't pay big money for software that turns off completely if I stop paying. I've also bought every FM upgrade since version 6, except for v10, which offered no features that I needed. I will be buying the FM 12 upgrade for sure. But I will be done buying if FM ever goes to the subscription-only model. Those of you buying subscriptions are making it more and more likely that the rest of us will lose the perpetual upgrade option in the near future. If you look at how hard Adobe is trying to get people to buy subscriptions, you will see that it is their desire to move FrameMaker to that model. Let's not let them take away our choices. Mike On 1/17/2014 9:22 AM, Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net) wrote: Using an 18 month model, the software subscription for FrameMaker is: 18 * 29.99, which is $539.82. An upgrade is $399 for that same upgrade in that 18 month period, right? And then the license is perpetual (at least until Adobe abandons this model in the future entirely), so that version keep working once somebody stops upgrading (not so in the subscription case when cancelled). ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as jow...@storm.ca. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jowens%40storm.ca Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FrameMaker 12 released
Syed, I think your math is right on. I can't understand why anyone would pay more for a subscription that will render their software useless the moment they stop paying. If they fall on hard times, the perpetual license lets them at least keep working with their software as long as they can keep a compatible operating system on an old computer. If the issue is someone not being able to come up with the upgrade fee all at once, and a monthly payment sounds more attractive, then they should consider getting a short term bank loan (or put it on a credit card) and pay the bank an even smaller monthly payment to buy the perpetual license. And here's another thing, if a company thinks a monthly subscription is a better to budget, they might also want to think about the resale value of their company, should they ever want to sell it. A perpetual license is an asset that can be resold and adds value to a company. A subscription is future liability that reduces its value. If, as an individual, they ever want to stop using FrameMaker, they can resell their personal perpetual license and get some of their money back. Not so with a subscription. I used to buy every upgrade of Creative Suite until it switched to the Creative Cloud model. Now, CS6 is my last purchase in that line. I won't pay big money for software that turns off completely if I stop paying. I've also bought every FM upgrade since version 6, except for v10, which offered no features that I needed. I will be buying the FM 12 upgrade for sure. But I will be done buying if FM ever goes to the subscription-only model. Those of you buying subscriptions are making it more and more likely that the rest of us will lose the perpetual upgrade option in the near future. If you look at how hard Adobe is trying to get people to buy subscriptions, you will see that it is their desire to move FrameMaker to that model. Let's not let them take away our choices. Mike On 1/17/2014 9:22 AM, Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net) wrote: Using an 18 month model, the software subscription for FrameMaker is: 18 * 29.99, which is $539.82. An upgrade is $399 for that same upgrade in that 18 month period, right? And then the license is perpetual (at least until Adobe abandons this model in the future entirely), so that version keep working once somebody stops upgrading (not so in the subscription case when cancelled). ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Build nr of FM-12 as released
Hello friends, Can anyone of the Early Adopters tell me the build nr of the released FM-12 ? I only know the last beta/BM build: 329 (12.0.0.329). And if you have access to the files: what is the date/size of the two files fmdlg.dll, fmres.dll ? Thank You for your help Klaus Daube ~~ Docu + Design Daube; Sch?racher 11; CH-8053 Z?rich Technical documentation & consultancy; On-line and paper F: +41-44-422 86 25 E: ddd at daube.ch W: www.daube.ch
RE: FrameMaker 12 released
Maxwell Hoffman said: > >Here, I used 2 years as a duration model. Although it would probably be > >longer and more expensive, since upgrades for FrameMaker don't seem to > >occur every year now. Else I would have gotten at least one - sigh - during > >my 2 years "license upgrade" contract that expired before FM 12 was released. > Syed, FYI -- FrameMaker 12 is the third release to come out in approximately > an 18 month cycle. For those who are regular users of FrameMaker and who are > considering the subscription, take into account that you get a new full point > release at no extra charge, and with no SW maintenance fees. Overall, for > many people it does come out more economical. Hmmm ... maybe for some people. For me, at least, the math does not work - but please do correct me if the calculations below are wrong! Using an 18 month model, the software subscription for FrameMaker is: 18 * 29.99, which is $539.82. An upgrade is $399 for that same upgrade in that 18 month period, right? And then the license is perpetual (at least until Adobe abandons this model in the future entirely), so that version keep working once somebody stops upgrading (not so in the subscription case when cancelled). And, for my single license case, since Adobe will not allow me to get the software upgrade license anyway, there is no extra SW maintenance fee anyway (although I would think that the volume license holders who are allowed to get the upgrade license maintenance, would not be paying the $399 fee to upgrade, so it is even lower than the subscription model fee for them). My intuition says that Adobe will only get _new_ FrameMaker sign-ups, and from some people who use versions _prior_ to 10 and do not want to pay the full $999 to "upgrade", for the subscription model. So, to me, the cost for people currently on version 11 does not seem to be lower to switch - again, please correct me if my math is wrong here. Z -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net) Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 4:22 PM To: Robert Lauriston; Framers Subject: RE: FrameMaker 12 released I don't plan to do the subscription model for FrameMaker 12 either. It does not make sense for me - even if I were continuing with FrameMaker. It only makes _some_ sense for new users of FrameMaker, or folks still on versions _prior_ to version 10, where the "upgrade" cost of $999 is the same as full price. For example, after two years, the cost (24 * $29.99 = $719.76) is _much_ higher than the cost of a single upgrade to FM 12 from FM 11. And, after three years, it would be more than the list price of a full license. Here, I used 2 years as a duration model. Although it would probably be longer and more expensive, since upgrades for FrameMaker don't seem to occur every year now. Else I would have gotten at least one - sigh - during my 2 years "license upgrade" contract that expired before FM 12 was released. Z ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as mhoff...@adobe.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mhoffman%40adobe.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FrameMaker 12 released
Maxwell Hoffman said: > >Here, I used 2 years as a duration model. Although it would probably be > >longer and more expensive, since upgrades for FrameMaker don't seem to > >occur every year now. Else I would have gotten at least one - sigh - during > >my 2 years "license upgrade" contract that expired before FM 12 was released. > Syed, FYI -- FrameMaker 12 is the third release to come out in approximately > an 18 month cycle. For those who are regular users of FrameMaker and who are > considering the subscription, take into account that you get a new full point > release at no extra charge, and with no SW maintenance fees. Overall, for > many people it does come out more economical. Hmmm ... maybe for some people. For me, at least, the math does not work - but please do correct me if the calculations below are wrong! Using an 18 month model, the software subscription for FrameMaker is: 18 * 29.99, which is $539.82. An upgrade is $399 for that same upgrade in that 18 month period, right? And then the license is perpetual (at least until Adobe abandons this model in the future entirely), so that version keep working once somebody stops upgrading (not so in the subscription case when cancelled). And, for my single license case, since Adobe will not allow me to get the software upgrade license anyway, there is no extra SW maintenance fee anyway (although I would think that the volume license holders who are allowed to get the upgrade license maintenance, would not be paying the $399 fee to upgrade, so it is even lower than the subscription model fee for them). My intuition says that Adobe will only get _new_ FrameMaker sign-ups, and from some people who use versions _prior_ to 10 and do not want to pay the full $999 to "upgrade", for the subscription model. So, to me, the cost for people currently on version 11 does not seem to be lower to switch - again, please correct me if my math is wrong here. Z -Original Message- From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net) Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 4:22 PM To: Robert Lauriston; Framers Subject: RE: FrameMaker 12 released I don't plan to do the subscription model for FrameMaker 12 either. It does not make sense for me - even if I were continuing with FrameMaker. It only makes _some_ sense for new users of FrameMaker, or folks still on versions _prior_ to version 10, where the "upgrade" cost of $999 is the same as full price. For example, after two years, the cost (24 * $29.99 = $719.76) is _much_ higher than the cost of a single upgrade to FM 12 from FM 11. And, after three years, it would be more than the list price of a full license. Here, I used 2 years as a duration model. Although it would probably be longer and more expensive, since upgrades for FrameMaker don't seem to occur every year now. Else I would have gotten at least one - sigh - during my 2 years "license upgrade" contract that expired before FM 12 was released. Z ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as mhoffman at adobe.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mhoffman%40adobe.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FrameMaker 12 Launch: Early reviews of Tech Comm Suite 5 and FM 12
The link in Tweet below has link to some of the first reviews collected by TechWhirl: Early Reviews for #Adobe Tech Comm Suite 5 and FrameMaker 12 from TechWhirl - http://bit.ly/1cy87qc Maxwell Hoffmann | Product Evangelist | Adobe | p. 503.336.5952 | c. 503.805.3719 | mhoffman at adobe.com<mailto:mhoffman at adobe.com> http://twitter.com/maxwellhoffmann - http://www.linkedin.com/in/maxwellhoffmann blogs.adobe.com/techcomm Upcoming webinars http://adobe.ly/Pbz6xIRecorded webinars: http://adobe.ly/Pbdp0J -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.frameusers.com/pipermail/framers/attachments/20140117/9017c1ab/attachment.html>
FrameMaker 12 released
>Here, I used 2 years as a duration model. Although it would probably be longer >and more expensive, since upgrades for FrameMaker don't >seem to occur every year now. Else I would have gotten at least one - sigh - >during my 2 years "license upgrade" contract that expired before >FM 12 was released. >Syed, Syed, FYI -- FrameMaker 12 is the third release to come out in approximately an 18 month cycle. For those who are regular users of FrameMaker and who are considering the subscription, take into account that you get a new full point release at no extra charge, and with no SW maintenance fees. Overall, for many people it does come out more economical. Maxwell Hoffmann |? Product? Evangelist? |? Adobe? |? p. 503.336.5952? |? c. 503.805.3719? |? mhoffman at adobe.com http://twitter.com/maxwellhoffmann -? http://www.linkedin.com/in/maxwellhoffmann? blogs.adobe.com/techcomm Upcoming webinars http://adobe.ly/Pbz6xIRecorded webinars: http://adobe.ly/Pbdp0J -Original Message- From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Syed Zaeem Hosain (syed.hos...@aeris.net) Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 4:22 PM To: Robert Lauriston; Framers Subject: RE: FrameMaker 12 released I don't plan to do the subscription model for FrameMaker 12 either. It does not make sense for me - even if I were continuing with FrameMaker. It only makes _some_ sense for new users of FrameMaker, or folks still on versions _prior_ to version 10, where the "upgrade" cost of $999 is the same as full price. For example, after two years, the cost (24 * $29.99 = $719.76) is _much_ higher than the cost of a single upgrade to FM 12 from FM 11. And, after three years, it would be more than the list price of a full license. Here, I used 2 years as a duration model. Although it would probably be longer and more expensive, since upgrades for FrameMaker don't seem to occur every year now. Else I would have gotten at least one - sigh - during my 2 years "license upgrade" contract that expired before FM 12 was released. Z ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as mhoffman at adobe.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mhoffman%40adobe.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Build nr of FM-12 as released
Hello friends, Can anyone of the Early Adopters tell me the build nr of the released FM-12 ? I only know the last beta/BM build: 329 (12.0.0.329). And if you have access to the files: what is the date/size of the two files fmdlg.dll, fmres.dll ? Thank You for your help Klaus Daube ~~ Docu + Design Daube; Schäracher 11; CH-8053 Zürich Technical documentation & consultancy; On-line and paper F: +41-44-422 86 25 E: d...@daube.ch W: www.daube.ch ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FrameMaker 12 released
FYI -- some misunderstandings have occurred because the website uses the word "upgrade" next to FM7: it is full product price, because there is no real "upgrade" from SW that was released 12 years ago. Adobe did have an aggressive discount to upgrade from FM7 to FM11 over a year ago. We promoted it with a multi-part blog series that included videos to show FM7 methods vs. FM11. It was advertised as "your last chance" to upgrade. Not trying to shake any trees. Just being realistic about the options available to any of us on any SW that we purchased more than 5 years ago. Maxwell Hoffmann |? Product? Evangelist? |? Adobe? |? p. 503.336.5952? |? c. 503.805.3719? |? mhoffman at adobe.com http://twitter.com/maxwellhoffmann -? http://www.linkedin.com/in/maxwellhoffmann? blogs.adobe.com/techcomm Upcoming webinars http://adobe.ly/Pbz6xIRecorded webinars: http://adobe.ly/Pbdp0J -Original Message- From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Robert Lauriston Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:11 AM To: Framers Subject: Re: FrameMaker 12 released If you buy a subscription and don't renew at the end of the year, the license is invalid and FrameMaker stops working. If you buy the $1000 full version or a $400 or $600 upgrade, the license is perpetual. The only thing that expires is the support agreement. I don't see why anyone would abandon FrameMaker just because the upgrades are a bad value. ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as mhoffman at adobe.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mhoffman%40adobe.com Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
