Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
No, Adobe does not care to make such a statement. Dov said he argued with them to do it and they didn't. If you have both and they don't cause a problem, why change? OTOH, if you're having some issues and you can't pin them down, why not uninstall Reader? On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 2:10 AM, Neeraj Jain wrote: > Dov, > > << > The fact that Adobe doesn't prohibit you from parallel installation of > Acrobat and Reader doesn't mean that such installations are recommended > or really useful. >>> > > What about listing the above as Caution, Important, or things to avoid on > the software downloads site? > > What you are saying, is that reflected in Adobe documentation? > > > _ > > Had there been a formula for success, it would have been stolen long back > > Regards, > NJ > http://www.neerajjain8.com > > > > > > From: Dov Isaacs > To: "dr_go...@pobox.com" > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Sent: Wed, 11 August, 2010 5:26:02 AM > Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Steve, > > Read the original thread. I am not going to repeat everything (and > it was quite a lot) that was discussed on this forum a few weeks ago, > especially related to engineering and testing discipline as far as > how PDF files are viewed and processed under what circumstances. > > But NO, there is nothing WRITTEN about this from Adobe. On the other > hand, you should trust what I am telling you based on my 21 years at > Adobe and my working with Acrobat and Reader since Release 1 of same > as well as having to debug workflows and PDF files during all that time. > > Quite frankly, the only time I had problems with anyone viewing a PDF > file that I produced on Acrobat-only systems (no Reader co-installed) > were with users who insisted on using St. Steve the Infallible's MacOS > Preview program's subset PDF viewing capabilities (or lack thereof). > > The fact that Adobe doesn't prohibit you from parallel installation of > Acrobat and Reader doesn't mean that such installations are recommended > or really useful. > > - Dov > > >> -----Original Message- >> From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com >> [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of >> Steve Johnson >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 11:10 AM >> To: Dov Isaacs >> Cc: Framers E-mail List >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster >> >> Show me in writing where Adobe says you should not install the same >> version of Reader and Acrobat on the same system. I cannot find it. >> It's not on the download page of either product, which is where it >> should be. All I can find is info saying you should not install two >> different versions of the same product. >> >> Even though you're an authority, all I have seen is unsupported >> statements like this saying "I heard that Adobe says you should not do >> this" but where is the statement against it saying why not? And if >> it's so dadgum important, why do the two products allow themselves to >> be installed side by side? >> >> For several versions now, you cannot run both Acrobat and Reader at >> the same time. I think you're right that Acrobat doesn't install >> Reader. I must have done the Reader install separately. >> >> The thing about wanting both Reader and Pro because of print/view >> differences is a few versions old but I remember there being >> situations in the past where viewing and printing with each product >> had differences. >> >> On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:33 PM, Dov Isaacs wrote: >> > Guy, >> > >> > See previous responses. Yes, there are UI differences between >> > Acrobat and Reader, but unless you are invoking rather complex >> > Javascript routines that invoke functions that are allowed in >> > Acrobat but not Reader, other than font issues (you should NEVER, >> > repeat NEVER, repeat once again NEVER generate PDF files with >> > unembedded fonts), you should not see any real differences between >> > rendering in Acrobat versus Reader - and the font issue itself >> > would mean that you need to run in a separate environment to gauge >> > the effects of unembedded fonts. >> > >> > - Dov >> > >> >> -Original Message- >> >> From: Guy K. Haas [mailto:g...@hiskeyboard.com] >> >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:57 AM >> >> To: Dov Isaacs >> >> Cc: Framers E-
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Hi Troy, You have indeed identified a very good and valid reason to want to test your PDF files under Reader as opposed to the full Adobe Acrobat product. Similar issues are use of sophisticated Javascript and forms capabilities in PDF files. However, I still believe and insist that if you try to test with Reader on the same physical and logical system on which you have created your PDF, you are seriously compromising your testing. Why? (1) If you have both Reader and Acrobat installed in parallel, only one of these two "owns" the .PDF extension for purposes of double-clicking in places such as Windows Explorer, browsers, and e-mail clients and it is not easy to do a switcherooni to cause one or the other of Reader or Acrobat to "own" the PDF extension. Except for the browser, the last installed "wins." Too easy to find yourself in the "wrong" client due to this. (2) The typical authoring system is much better endowed in terms of hardware and software resources than the typical client system (yes, I know that many technical writers end up with ancient, engineering hand-me-downs, but you'd be surprised how good those are compared to the typical enterprise client system which is often running on ancient hardware and much older software versions. Such clients are often running on memory and disk constrained systems with limited network access, only the system fonts installed (those provided with the OS), old e-mail clients versions, old browser versions, and ancient versions of Adobe Reader (7 or earlier). As such, you really should be running your PDF file testing in a "sandbox" with limited resources. This sandbox could take the form of old hand-me-down systems with the barest software configuration installed or perhaps even a virtualized system using VMWare or similar products. The latter solution doesn't simulate limited hardware resources, but it would allow you to have virtual limited software setups for a number of old versions of Reader and for that matter, other less-capable PDF "readers" from third parties that your documents' receivers may be using. And if you are really serious about this, you might also setup a not-quite-up-to-date Macintosh and test what happens when your PDF files are opened up with the MacOS Preview program (often not a very pretty site). - Dov From: Troy Fey [mailto:troy@opinicus.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 9:25 AM To: Dov Isaacs Cc: dr_go...@pobox.com; Framers E-mail List Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster Dov -- I save all your responses. Thanks for your continued support. I believe I have a justification for why one would have an installation of Adobe Reader co-existing with an installation of Adobe Acrobat. We've had to use Adobe Reader to verify the digital signature and mark-up capabilities were properly enabled by Adobe Acrobat. We've had several round-trip exercises with SMEs and our Tech Writer where these capabilities weren't properly enabled in the PDF. Mistakes happen, but because our Tech Writer didn't have a separate installation of Adobe Reader he failed to verify they were enabled before sending them out for review/signature and that lead to a lot of SME frustration. Please excuse my ignorance if this is already common knowledge, but it seemed to be relevant for this thread. Is there a way to emulate the limited capabilities of Adobe Reader within Acrobat? -- Troy Dov Isaacs wrote: Steve, Read the original thread. I am not going to repeat everything (and it was quite a lot) that was discussed on this forum a few weeks ago, especially related to engineering and testing discipline as far as how PDF files are viewed and processed under what circumstances. But NO, there is nothing WRITTEN about this from Adobe. On the other hand, you should trust what I am telling you based on my 21 years at Adobe and my working with Acrobat and Reader since Release 1 of same as well as having to debug workflows and PDF files during all that time. Quite frankly, the only time I had problems with anyone viewing a PDF file that I produced on Acrobat-only systems (no Reader co-installed) were with users who insisted on using St. Steve the Infallible's MacOS Preview program's subset PDF viewing capabilities (or lack thereof). The fact that Adobe doesn't prohibit you from parallel installation of Acrobat and Reader doesn't mean that such installations are recommended or really useful. - Dov ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Dov, << The fact that Adobe doesn't prohibit you from parallel installation of Acrobat and Reader doesn't mean that such installations are recommended or really useful. >> What about listing the above as Caution, Important, or things to avoid on the software downloads site? What you are saying, is that reflected in Adobe documentation? _ Had there been a formula for success, it would have been stolen long back Regards, NJ http://www.neerajjain8.com From: Dov Isaacs To: "dr_go...@pobox.com" Cc: Framers E-mail List Sent: Wed, 11 August, 2010 5:26:02 AM Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster Steve, Read the original thread. I am not going to repeat everything (and it was quite a lot) that was discussed on this forum a few weeks ago, especially related to engineering and testing discipline as far as how PDF files are viewed and processed under what circumstances. But NO, there is nothing WRITTEN about this from Adobe. On the other hand, you should trust what I am telling you based on my 21 years at Adobe and my working with Acrobat and Reader since Release 1 of same as well as having to debug workflows and PDF files during all that time. Quite frankly, the only time I had problems with anyone viewing a PDF file that I produced on Acrobat-only systems (no Reader co-installed) were with users who insisted on using St. Steve the Infallible's MacOS Preview program's subset PDF viewing capabilities (or lack thereof). The fact that Adobe doesn't prohibit you from parallel installation of Acrobat and Reader doesn't mean that such installations are recommended or really useful. - Dov > -Original Message- > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com >[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of > Steve Johnson > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 11:10 AM > To: Dov Isaacs > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Show me in writing where Adobe says you should not install the same > version of Reader and Acrobat on the same system. I cannot find it. > It's not on the download page of either product, which is where it > should be. All I can find is info saying you should not install two > different versions of the same product. > > Even though you're an authority, all I have seen is unsupported > statements like this saying "I heard that Adobe says you should not do > this" but where is the statement against it saying why not? And if > it's so dadgum important, why do the two products allow themselves to > be installed side by side? > > For several versions now, you cannot run both Acrobat and Reader at > the same time. I think you're right that Acrobat doesn't install > Reader. I must have done the Reader install separately. > > The thing about wanting both Reader and Pro because of print/view > differences is a few versions old but I remember there being > situations in the past where viewing and printing with each product > had differences. > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:33 PM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > > Guy, > > > > See previous responses. Yes, there are UI differences between > > Acrobat and Reader, but unless you are invoking rather complex > > Javascript routines that invoke functions that are allowed in > > Acrobat but not Reader, other than font issues (you should NEVER, > > repeat NEVER, repeat once again NEVER generate PDF files with > > unembedded fonts), you should not see any real differences between > > rendering in Acrobat versus Reader - and the font issue itself > > would mean that you need to run in a separate environment to gauge > > the effects of unembedded fonts. > > > >- Dov > > > >> -Original Message- > >> From: Guy K. Haas [mailto:g...@hiskeyboard.com] > >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:57 AM > >> To: Dov Isaacs > >> Cc: Framers E-mail List > >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > >> > >> But, Dov--- > >> > >> I have both installed so that when a reviewer runs into a problem, I can > >> "see it their way". The interfaces of the two are so different that > >> it's sometimes handy to be able to do this. > >> > >> Would it be any less "NOT RECOMMENDED" if one had the Reader on a > >> removable drive (such as a USB drive) and plugged it in only when needed? > >> > >> --Guy K. Haas > >>Software Exegete in Silicon Valley > >> > >> > >> On 7/25/2010 7:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > >> > Alt
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
> Umm Dov, I had the same reaction as you when I first saw them, I think. But > look at the date they were sent (25 July). These were the ones that were > sent back then. > > Technology is working to raise your blood pressure. Yep, looks like they were delayed from the server, though, because they were shown as new posts buried in my older threads in Gmail. Hooray technology! -- Bill Swallow Twitter: @techcommdood Blog: http://techcommdood.com LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/techcommdood ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
On 11/08/2010, at 11:56 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: Steve, Read the original thread. I am not going to repeat everything (and... Umm Dov, I had the same reaction as you when I first saw them, I think. But look at the date they were sent (25 July). These were the ones that were sent back then. Technology is working to raise your blood pressure. Alan -- Alan T Litchfield AlphaByte PO Box 141, Auckland, 1140 New Zealand http://www.alphabyte.co.nz http://www.alphabyte.co.nz/beatrice ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Steve, Read the original thread. I am not going to repeat everything (and it was quite a lot) that was discussed on this forum a few weeks ago, especially related to engineering and testing discipline as far as how PDF files are viewed and processed under what circumstances. But NO, there is nothing WRITTEN about this from Adobe. On the other hand, you should trust what I am telling you based on my 21 years at Adobe and my working with Acrobat and Reader since Release 1 of same as well as having to debug workflows and PDF files during all that time. Quite frankly, the only time I had problems with anyone viewing a PDF file that I produced on Acrobat-only systems (no Reader co-installed) were with users who insisted on using St. Steve the Infallible's MacOS Preview program's subset PDF viewing capabilities (or lack thereof). The fact that Adobe doesn't prohibit you from parallel installation of Acrobat and Reader doesn't mean that such installations are recommended or really useful. - Dov > -Original Message- > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of > Steve Johnson > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 11:10 AM > To: Dov Isaacs > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Show me in writing where Adobe says you should not install the same > version of Reader and Acrobat on the same system. I cannot find it. > It's not on the download page of either product, which is where it > should be. All I can find is info saying you should not install two > different versions of the same product. > > Even though you're an authority, all I have seen is unsupported > statements like this saying "I heard that Adobe says you should not do > this" but where is the statement against it saying why not? And if > it's so dadgum important, why do the two products allow themselves to > be installed side by side? > > For several versions now, you cannot run both Acrobat and Reader at > the same time. I think you're right that Acrobat doesn't install > Reader. I must have done the Reader install separately. > > The thing about wanting both Reader and Pro because of print/view > differences is a few versions old but I remember there being > situations in the past where viewing and printing with each product > had differences. > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:33 PM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > > Guy, > > > > See previous responses. Yes, there are UI differences between > > Acrobat and Reader, but unless you are invoking rather complex > > Javascript routines that invoke functions that are allowed in > > Acrobat but not Reader, other than font issues (you should NEVER, > > repeat NEVER, repeat once again NEVER generate PDF files with > > unembedded fonts), you should not see any real differences between > > rendering in Acrobat versus Reader - and the font issue itself > > would mean that you need to run in a separate environment to gauge > > the effects of unembedded fonts. > > > > - Dov > > > >> -Original Message- > >> From: Guy K. Haas [mailto:g...@hiskeyboard.com] > >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:57 AM > >> To: Dov Isaacs > >> Cc: Framers E-mail List > >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > >> > >> But, Dov--- > >> > >> I have both installed so that when a reviewer runs into a problem, I can > >> "see it their way". The interfaces of the two are so different that > >> it's sometimes handy to be able to do this. > >> > >> Would it be any less "NOT RECOMMENDED" if one had the Reader on a > >> removable drive (such as a USB drive) and plugged it in only when needed? > >> > >> --Guy K. Haas > >> Software Exegete in Silicon Valley > >> > >> > >> On 7/25/2010 7:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > >> > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > >> > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > >> > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > >> > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > >> > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > >> > symptoms described. > >> > > >> > - Dov > -- > > Steve Johnson, dr_go...@pobox.com > ___ ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Steve, Read the rest of the thread on the Framer's list (this was a few weeks ago). NO, Acrobat does not install Reader. Acrobat consists of a viewing/editing program and Distiller plus PDFMakers for various Office and other programs. I discussed why you don't need or want to test PDF files on the same system you created them on via Reader. - Dov > -Original Message- > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of > Steve Johnson > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:37 AM > To: Dov Isaacs > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Since when? Is that by design or by accident? Doesn't installing > Acrobat also install Reader? > > How many of my users have Acrobat installed? Of course I want Reader > installed so I can see PDFs like they do. > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > > symptoms described. > > > > - Dov > > > >> -Original Message- > >> From: Steve Johnson [mailto:chinask...@gmail.com] > >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:19 AM > >> To: Fei Min Lorente > >> Cc: Dov Isaacs; Framers E-mail List > >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > >> > >> You CAN have Reader and Acrobat at the same time. You CANNOT have two > >> Acrobats; IOW, two PDF creators. > >> > >> On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Fei Min Lorente > >> wrote: > >> > Thanks, Dov! I was experiencing the same problem as Alison, insofar as > >> > my browser would crash when I tried to look at a PDF in it (just > >> > clicking on a URL). We ended up working around it by setting the Acrobat > >> > internet preferences to not display PDF in browser. But now that you > >> > mention that you can't even have Reader and Acrobat installed at the > >> > same time, I noticed that I have Adobe Reader 9 as well as Adobe Acrobat > >> > 9 Pro. Our company pushed Reader 9 onto all our computers, so I'm not > >> > sure I can get rid of it, but at least now I know why I'm having that > >> > PDF in a browser problem. > >> > > >> > I posted this before, but just for completeness, I'm on Windows XP SP3 > >> > and using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. > >> > > >> > Fei Min Lorente > >> > > >> > -Original Message- > >> > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com > >> > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Dov Isaacs > >> > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 11:39 PM > >> > To: Framers E-mail List > >> > Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > >> > Importance: High > >> > > >> > I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!). > >> > In terms of Alison's original posting ... > >> > > >> > The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard > >> > Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or > >> > browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any > >> > normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe. > >> > > >> > I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9 > >> > with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF > >> > file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window. > >> > > >> > The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of > >> > the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page" > >> > (Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you > >> > click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow > >> > you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the > >> > web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you > >> > right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or > >> > "Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program > >> > preferences > >&
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Show me in writing where Adobe says you should not install the same version of Reader and Acrobat on the same system. I cannot find it. It's not on the download page of either product, which is where it should be. All I can find is info saying you should not install two different versions of the same product. Even though you're an authority, all I have seen is unsupported statements like this saying "I heard that Adobe says you should not do this" but where is the statement against it saying why not? And if it's so dadgum important, why do the two products allow themselves to be installed side by side? For several versions now, you cannot run both Acrobat and Reader at the same time. I think you're right that Acrobat doesn't install Reader. I must have done the Reader install separately. The thing about wanting both Reader and Pro because of print/view differences is a few versions old but I remember there being situations in the past where viewing and printing with each product had differences. On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 12:33 PM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > Guy, > > See previous responses. Yes, there are UI differences between > Acrobat and Reader, but unless you are invoking rather complex > Javascript routines that invoke functions that are allowed in > Acrobat but not Reader, other than font issues (you should NEVER, > repeat NEVER, repeat once again NEVER generate PDF files with > unembedded fonts), you should not see any real differences between > rendering in Acrobat versus Reader - and the font issue itself > would mean that you need to run in a separate environment to gauge > the effects of unembedded fonts. > > - Dov > >> -Original Message- >> From: Guy K. Haas [mailto:g...@hiskeyboard.com] >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:57 AM >> To: Dov Isaacs >> Cc: Framers E-mail List >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster >> >> But, Dov--- >> >> I have both installed so that when a reviewer runs into a problem, I can >> "see it their way". The interfaces of the two are so different that >> it's sometimes handy to be able to do this. >> >> Would it be any less "NOT RECOMMENDED" if one had the Reader on a >> removable drive (such as a USB drive) and plugged it in only when needed? >> >> --Guy K. Haas >> Software Exegete in Silicon Valley >> >> >> On 7/25/2010 7:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: >> > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously >> > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a >> > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality >> > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and >> > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the >> > symptoms described. >> > >> > - Dov >> > > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to framers as dr_go...@pobox.com. > > Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dr_gonzo%40pobox.com > > Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. > -- Steve Johnson, dr_go...@pobox.com ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Since when? Is that by design or by accident? Doesn't installing Acrobat also install Reader? How many of my users have Acrobat installed? Of course I want Reader installed so I can see PDFs like they do. On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > symptoms described. > > - Dov > >> -Original Message- >> From: Steve Johnson [mailto:chinask...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:19 AM >> To: Fei Min Lorente >> Cc: Dov Isaacs; Framers E-mail List >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster >> >> You CAN have Reader and Acrobat at the same time. You CANNOT have two >> Acrobats; IOW, two PDF creators. >> >> On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Fei Min Lorente >> wrote: >> > Thanks, Dov! I was experiencing the same problem as Alison, insofar as >> > my browser would crash when I tried to look at a PDF in it (just >> > clicking on a URL). We ended up working around it by setting the Acrobat >> > internet preferences to not display PDF in browser. But now that you >> > mention that you can't even have Reader and Acrobat installed at the >> > same time, I noticed that I have Adobe Reader 9 as well as Adobe Acrobat >> > 9 Pro. Our company pushed Reader 9 onto all our computers, so I'm not >> > sure I can get rid of it, but at least now I know why I'm having that >> > PDF in a browser problem. >> > >> > I posted this before, but just for completeness, I'm on Windows XP SP3 >> > and using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. >> > >> > Fei Min Lorente >> > >> > -Original Message- >> > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com >> > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Dov Isaacs >> > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 11:39 PM >> > To: Framers E-mail List >> > Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster >> > Importance: High >> > >> > I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!). >> > In terms of Alison's original posting ... >> > >> > The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard >> > Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or >> > browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any >> > normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe. >> > >> > I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9 >> > with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF >> > file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window. >> > >> > The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of >> > the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page" >> > (Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you >> > click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow >> > you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the >> > web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you >> > right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or >> > "Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program >> > preferences >> > which contravene this behaviour. >> > >> > Any attempt to try diagnosing what's happening on your system would be >> > at best wild speculation but it would almost seem like there might be >> > "competing" PDF readers/processors concurrently installed on your >> > system. >> > Be aware that Adobe does not support concurrent installation of multiple >> > >> > versions of Acrobat on a single system (such as Acrobat 8 and Acrobat 9 >> > installed at the same time). Adobe does not recommend concurrent >> > installation of the same versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system >> > (such as Acrobat 9 and Reader installed at the same time) or even worse >> > differing versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system (such as >> > Acrobat 9 and Reader 8 installed at the same time). Even more so, we >> > certainly cannot vouch for what will happen if you have Acrobat or >> &g
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Adobe has never understood how corporate IT departments work, and I've come to realize that Adobe doesn't understand how corporations handle multiple installations of Adobe products across a business network. Adobe is focused solely on one installation on one computer handled by one person who has all the rights to do everything. This is a complaint I've had about FM for years and years, and the same goes for Acrobat. My IT department gets so frustrated with Adobe technical support that Adobe is only called if the problem seems unsolvable, and generally the advice we get from Adobe is worthless. My IT department doesn't check for prior installations nor do they remove old programs. IT simply installs new programs based on whatever version of software they happen to have. If Adobe does not want different versions of Acrobat on the same computer, Adobe's installer should delete the old versions. If it's not kosher to have, say, Reader and Acrobat Pro Extended on the same computer, Adobe's installer should take care of the problem. We have computers with different versions of Acrobat and Reader installed. It's not at all unusual. We've got 100s of installations here. If problems occur that cannot be solved, one either learns to live with the problems or IT will wipe the hard drive and install their current "footprint". That's a very heavy handed approach, but it's all about time and money. IT will only put so much time towards "fixing" computer software, then they simply "wipe it" and start again. Sorry, I can't do much. It's not my computer, it is the corporation's computer on the corporation's network. I'm just allowed to use the computer and network to do my job. Don't get me wrong, I love Adobe products and I use TCS2 and Illustrator daily. PDFs have simply become the norm for our business communications. But, I do wish Adobe would get some clue as to how business networks and IT departments work, and get away from Adobe's "single computer - single administrator" mindset. Richard ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Hi Tori, > Dov, we use this feature for 'testing' PDFs in which we have enabled > Acrobat Reader rights. We have a lot of clients who simply will not > spend the money to get Acrobat, so either we give them Reader-enabled > PDFs or they send us <> hardcopy edits. No idea why, but > sometimes that rights-enabling doesn't 'stick', and we've > sent a client > a PDF they could not add edits to. So now we always open the > saved PDF > in Reader to double-check it can indeed be edited in Reader (on a > separate computer that hasn't got Acrobat, I hasten to add). You can also open the PDF in Acrobat Professional and check the properties. If commenting in Adobe Reader is enabled, the settings in the properties dialog are greyed out and cannot be changed. The Security tab lists the limitations. You do not need to check this in Adobe Reader. Best regards Winfried ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Acrobat 9 a disaster
Just to thanks all who replied to my post. I must've been having one of
those Fridays, as part of the mystery is now solved.
I am working on a windows machine running XPPro 2002 SP3. When installing
Acrobat 9 (v.9.3.3-CPSID_83708), I removed all prior instances of Acrobat
and Acrobat Reader as required. However, I did leave Acrobat.com and an old
version of the Mars plug-in. I have since removed the old Mars plug-in. I
also run PitStop Professsional (08 update 5) as a plug-in for my print
productions.
The problem with my links comes from LiveCycle Designer (not Acrobat). I had
set up a link in the form as a button with a javascript click event as
follows:
xfa.host.gotoURL("http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html";,
false); - this produced the pdfised version of the web page when clicked -
as if I had selected 'open weblink as a new document'. Links set up as
hypertext links work as expected - opening a new browser window. (Phew).
Browser crashing is still a problem when trying to open pdfs within the
browser. - Browsers IE 7.0.5730.11, Firefox 3.0.15, Safari 3.0.4 (523.15) so
I will try a reinstall.
Ali
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Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
But, Dov--- I have both installed so that when a reviewer runs into a problem, I can "see it their way". The interfaces of the two are so different that it's sometimes handy to be able to do this. Would it be any less "NOT RECOMMENDED" if one had the Reader on a removable drive (such as a USB drive) and plugged it in only when needed? --Guy K. Haas Software Exegete in Silicon Valley On 7/25/2010 7:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the symptoms described. - Dov ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
You CAN have Reader and Acrobat at the same time. You CANNOT have two Acrobats; IOW, two PDF creators. On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Fei Min Lorente wrote: > Thanks, Dov! I was experiencing the same problem as Alison, insofar as > my browser would crash when I tried to look at a PDF in it (just > clicking on a URL). We ended up working around it by setting the Acrobat > internet preferences to not display PDF in browser. But now that you > mention that you can't even have Reader and Acrobat installed at the > same time, I noticed that I have Adobe Reader 9 as well as Adobe Acrobat > 9 Pro. Our company pushed Reader 9 onto all our computers, so I'm not > sure I can get rid of it, but at least now I know why I'm having that > PDF in a browser problem. > > I posted this before, but just for completeness, I'm on Windows XP SP3 > and using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. > > Fei Min Lorente > > -Original Message- > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Dov Isaacs > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 11:39 PM > To: Framers E-mail List > Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > Importance: High > > I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!). > In terms of Alison's original posting ... > > The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard > Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or > browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any > normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe. > > I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9 > with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF > file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window. > > The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of > the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page" > (Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you > click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow > you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the > web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you > right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or > "Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program > preferences > which contravene this behaviour. > > Any attempt to try diagnosing what's happening on your system would be > at best wild speculation but it would almost seem like there might be > "competing" PDF readers/processors concurrently installed on your > system. > Be aware that Adobe does not support concurrent installation of multiple > > versions of Acrobat on a single system (such as Acrobat 8 and Acrobat 9 > installed at the same time). Adobe does not recommend concurrent > installation of the same versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system > (such as Acrobat 9 and Reader installed at the same time) or even worse > differing versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system (such as > Acrobat 9 and Reader 8 installed at the same time). Even more so, we > certainly cannot vouch for what will happen if you have Acrobat or > Reader > plus some other third party PDF reader or creator concurrently > installed. > If you even have an inkling of how these programs integrate with drivers > > and the browser(s) under Window, you will understand the chaos that such > mixtures of programs may engender to your system. > > So, as a start, I would look at ALL the software installed on your > system > and assure that there is only ONE, repeat only ONE PDF processing > program > on your computer. If your system is "clean" in this regard, you might > try > totally uninstalling any remaining version of Acrobat / Reader on your > system and then run a registry cleaner utility program to assure that > fragments of some previously installed "stuff" is truly eradicated from > your system. Then after rebooting, try installing Acrobat 9 from scratch > > and see if that makes a difference. > > If that doesn't help, please advise. Likewise, if this does resolve you > problem, likewise let us know. Good luck! > > - Dov > > >> -Original Message- >> From: Alan T Litchfield >> Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 1:36 PM >> To: dr_go...@pobox.com >> Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison White >> >> hmm yes. >> >> No point in complaining here. There are a few Adobe people but they >> would have interest mostly in FrameMaker, except Dov. >> >> I might also suggest you get in touch with Ado
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
In terms of the ability to "see PDFs like they do," having Adobe Reader on the same system as Adobe Acrobat is not going to assist you. In terms of proper engineering and QA discipline, such testing should occur on a system that has only the operating system installed, no "extra fonts" installed, and Adobe Reader set with all default options. Otherwise, your tests are somewhat polluted by your environment. Dov, we use this feature for 'testing' PDFs in which we have enabled Acrobat Reader rights. We have a lot of clients who simply will not spend the money to get Acrobat, so either we give them Reader-enabled PDFs or they send us <> hardcopy edits. No idea why, but sometimes that rights-enabling doesn't 'stick', and we've sent a client a PDF they could not add edits to. So now we always open the saved PDF in Reader to double-check it can indeed be edited in Reader (on a separate computer that hasn't got Acrobat, I hasten to add). tori ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Guy, See previous responses. Yes, there are UI differences between Acrobat and Reader, but unless you are invoking rather complex Javascript routines that invoke functions that are allowed in Acrobat but not Reader, other than font issues (you should NEVER, repeat NEVER, repeat once again NEVER generate PDF files with unembedded fonts), you should not see any real differences between rendering in Acrobat versus Reader - and the font issue itself would mean that you need to run in a separate environment to gauge the effects of unembedded fonts. - Dov > -Original Message- > From: Guy K. Haas [mailto:g...@hiskeyboard.com] > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:57 AM > To: Dov Isaacs > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > But, Dov--- > > I have both installed so that when a reviewer runs into a problem, I can > "see it their way". The interfaces of the two are so different that > it's sometimes handy to be able to do this. > > Would it be any less "NOT RECOMMENDED" if one had the Reader on a > removable drive (such as a USB drive) and plugged it in only when needed? > > --Guy K. Haas >Software Exegete in Silicon Valley > > > On 7/25/2010 7:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > > symptoms described. > > > > - Dov > ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Art, Please see my the reply I just sent to a another response along the same line. I know of know of no way to make such a "portable app" for better or worse. I'm not saying there isn't, I'm just not aware of it. - Dov > -Original Message- > From: Art Campbell [mailto:art.campb...@gmail.com] > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:55 AM > To: Dov Isaacs > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Dov, > > Although this takes the thread off-topic a bit, is there any way to > configure Reader to be a "portable" ap that runs from a thumb drive? > > I certainly don't disagree with your advice about not having Reader on > an Acrobat system, but for many of us that isn't possible -- for > example, if you work in a typical office, you probably use Acrobat as > your default PDF product, but you still have to have the capability to > test those PDFs in Reader. But if you only have one system. > > Cheers, > Art > > Art Campbell > art.campb...@gmail.com > "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 > Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson > No disclaimers apply. > DoD 358 > > > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 10:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > > symptoms described. > > > > - Dov ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Installing Acrobat does NOT install Reader. Adobe Reader is a program that is a subset of Adobe Acrobat simply for displaying PDF files plus providing support for a number of other PDF file operations. Installing Adobe Acrobat installs a "viewer" (the program called "Acrobat") which is a superset of the functions of Adobe Reader. It also installs PDF creation software including Acrobat Distiller (a legacy method of producing PDF by converting PostScript to PDF) and the PDFMaker modules for other applications including Microsoft Office. In terms of the ability to "see PDFs like they do," having Adobe Reader on the same system as Adobe Acrobat is not going to assist you. In terms of proper engineering and QA discipline, such testing should occur on a system that has only the operating system installed, no "extra fonts" installed, and Adobe Reader set with all default options. Otherwise, your tests are somewhat polluted by your environment. FWIW, in my many years of experience in creating PDF files and distributing them around the world, I never once found a need to test the files with Reader. With only one exception have any recipients of my PDF files ever had any problems and that exception has been when the recipients tried to view the PDF files with the MacOS Preview application. (MacOS Preview is known to be a fairly poor PDF viewer not fully and properly implementing the PDF specification although it "loads" quickly!) - Dov > -Original Message- > From: Steve Johnson [mailto:chinask...@gmail.com] > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:37 AM > To: Dov Isaacs > Cc: Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Since when? Is that by design or by accident? Doesn't installing > Acrobat also install Reader? > > How many of my users have Acrobat installed? Of course I want Reader > installed so I can see PDFs like they do. > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > > symptoms described. > > > > - Dov ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Dov, Although this takes the thread off-topic a bit, is there any way to configure Reader to be a "portable" ap that runs from a thumb drive? I certainly don't disagree with your advice about not having Reader on an Acrobat system, but for many of us that isn't possible -- for example, if you work in a typical office, you probably use Acrobat as your default PDF product, but you still have to have the capability to test those PDFs in Reader. But if you only have one system. Cheers, Art Art Campbell art.campb...@gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 10:23 AM, Dov Isaacs wrote: > Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously > (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a > number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality > to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and > Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the > symptoms described. > > - Dov > >> -Original Message- >> From: Steve Johnson [mailto:chinask...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:19 AM >> To: Fei Min Lorente >> Cc: Dov Isaacs; Framers E-mail List >> Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster >> >> You CAN have Reader and Acrobat at the same time. You CANNOT have two >> Acrobats; IOW, two PDF creators. >> >> On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Fei Min Lorente >> wrote: >> > Thanks, Dov! I was experiencing the same problem as Alison, insofar as >> > my browser would crash when I tried to look at a PDF in it (just >> > clicking on a URL). We ended up working around it by setting the Acrobat >> > internet preferences to not display PDF in browser. But now that you >> > mention that you can't even have Reader and Acrobat installed at the >> > same time, I noticed that I have Adobe Reader 9 as well as Adobe Acrobat >> > 9 Pro. Our company pushed Reader 9 onto all our computers, so I'm not >> > sure I can get rid of it, but at least now I know why I'm having that >> > PDF in a browser problem. >> > >> > I posted this before, but just for completeness, I'm on Windows XP SP3 >> > and using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. >> > >> > Fei Min Lorente >> > >> > -Original Message- >> > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com >> > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Dov Isaacs >> > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 11:39 PM >> > To: Framers E-mail List >> > Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster >> > Importance: High >> > >> > I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!). >> > In terms of Alison's original posting ... >> > >> > The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard >> > Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or >> > browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any >> > normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe. >> > >> > I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9 >> > with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF >> > file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window. >> > >> > The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of >> > the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page" >> > (Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you >> > click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow >> > you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the >> > web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you >> > right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or >> > "Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program >> > preferences >> > which contravene this behaviour. >> > >> > Any attempt to try diagnosing what's happening on your system would be >> > at best wild speculation but it would almost seem like there might be >> > "competing" PDF readers/processors concurrently installed on your >> > system. >> > Be aware that Adobe does not sup
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Although you CAN have both Reader and Acrobat installed simultaneously (assuming the same version), it is very strongly NOT RECOMMENDED for a number of very good reasons. It certainly does not add any functionality to one's system. Having said that, I will add that having both Reader and Acrobat of the same version on a system is most unlikely to cause the symptoms described. - Dov > -Original Message- > From: Steve Johnson [mailto:chinask...@gmail.com] > Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:19 AM > To: Fei Min Lorente > Cc: Dov Isaacs; Framers E-mail List > Subject: Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > You CAN have Reader and Acrobat at the same time. You CANNOT have two > Acrobats; IOW, two PDF creators. > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Fei Min Lorente > wrote: > > Thanks, Dov! I was experiencing the same problem as Alison, insofar as > > my browser would crash when I tried to look at a PDF in it (just > > clicking on a URL). We ended up working around it by setting the Acrobat > > internet preferences to not display PDF in browser. But now that you > > mention that you can't even have Reader and Acrobat installed at the > > same time, I noticed that I have Adobe Reader 9 as well as Adobe Acrobat > > 9 Pro. Our company pushed Reader 9 onto all our computers, so I'm not > > sure I can get rid of it, but at least now I know why I'm having that > > PDF in a browser problem. > > > > I posted this before, but just for completeness, I'm on Windows XP SP3 > > and using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. > > > > Fei Min Lorente > > > > -Original Message- > > From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com > > [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Dov Isaacs > > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 11:39 PM > > To: Framers E-mail List > > Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster > > Importance: High > > > > I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!). > > In terms of Alison's original posting ... > > > > The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard > > Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or > > browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any > > normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe. > > > > I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9 > > with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF > > file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window. > > > > The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of > > the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page" > > (Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you > > click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow > > you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the > > web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you > > right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or > > "Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program > > preferences > > which contravene this behaviour. > > > > Any attempt to try diagnosing what's happening on your system would be > > at best wild speculation but it would almost seem like there might be > > "competing" PDF readers/processors concurrently installed on your > > system. > > Be aware that Adobe does not support concurrent installation of multiple > > > > versions of Acrobat on a single system (such as Acrobat 8 and Acrobat 9 > > installed at the same time). Adobe does not recommend concurrent > > installation of the same versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system > > (such as Acrobat 9 and Reader installed at the same time) or even worse > > differing versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system (such as > > Acrobat 9 and Reader 8 installed at the same time). Even more so, we > > certainly cannot vouch for what will happen if you have Acrobat or > > Reader > > plus some other third party PDF reader or creator concurrently > > installed. > > If you even have an inkling of how these programs integrate with drivers > > > > and the browser(s) under Window, you will understand the chaos that such > > mixtures of programs may engender to your system. > > > > So, as a start, I would look at ALL the software installed on your > > system > > and assure that there is only ONE, repeat only ONE PDF processing > > program > > on your comput
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Thanks, Dov! I was experiencing the same problem as Alison, insofar as my browser would crash when I tried to look at a PDF in it (just clicking on a URL). We ended up working around it by setting the Acrobat internet preferences to not display PDF in browser. But now that you mention that you can't even have Reader and Acrobat installed at the same time, I noticed that I have Adobe Reader 9 as well as Adobe Acrobat 9 Pro. Our company pushed Reader 9 onto all our computers, so I'm not sure I can get rid of it, but at least now I know why I'm having that PDF in a browser problem. I posted this before, but just for completeness, I'm on Windows XP SP3 and using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. Fei Min Lorente -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Dov Isaacs Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 11:39 PM To: Framers E-mail List Subject: RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster Importance: High I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!). In terms of Alison's original posting ... The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe. I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9 with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window. The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page" (Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or "Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program preferences which contravene this behaviour. Any attempt to try diagnosing what's happening on your system would be at best wild speculation but it would almost seem like there might be "competing" PDF readers/processors concurrently installed on your system. Be aware that Adobe does not support concurrent installation of multiple versions of Acrobat on a single system (such as Acrobat 8 and Acrobat 9 installed at the same time). Adobe does not recommend concurrent installation of the same versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system (such as Acrobat 9 and Reader installed at the same time) or even worse differing versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system (such as Acrobat 9 and Reader 8 installed at the same time). Even more so, we certainly cannot vouch for what will happen if you have Acrobat or Reader plus some other third party PDF reader or creator concurrently installed. If you even have an inkling of how these programs integrate with drivers and the browser(s) under Window, you will understand the chaos that such mixtures of programs may engender to your system. So, as a start, I would look at ALL the software installed on your system and assure that there is only ONE, repeat only ONE PDF processing program on your computer. If your system is "clean" in this regard, you might try totally uninstalling any remaining version of Acrobat / Reader on your system and then run a registry cleaner utility program to assure that fragments of some previously installed "stuff" is truly eradicated from your system. Then after rebooting, try installing Acrobat 9 from scratch and see if that makes a difference. If that doesn't help, please advise. Likewise, if this does resolve you problem, likewise let us know. Good luck! - Dov > -Original Message- > From: Alan T Litchfield > Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 1:36 PM > To: dr_go...@pobox.com > Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison White > > hmm yes. > > No point in complaining here. There are a few Adobe people but they > would have interest mostly in FrameMaker, except Dov. > > I might also suggest you get in touch with Adobe Customer care if you > have a corporate license. Oh and don't expect anyone here to forward > your complaint for you. > > Cheers > Alan > > On 24/07/2010, at 1:34 AM, Steve Johnson wrote: > > > You should post this on the Adobe forum. > > > > In the paragraph "With Acrobat 9, I cannot..." have you tried > > distilling using Acrobat 6 or 7 compatibility? > > > > On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 3:19 AM, Alison White > > wrote: > >> I've just upgraded to Acrobat 9 and regret the decision. Not sure how to >
RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
I heard my name used in vain (if not on-line!).
In terms of Alison's original posting ...
The symptoms you describe with regards to Acrobat 9 are not standard
Acrobat 9 behaviour. You did not post exactly what Windows and/or
browser versions you are using, but we currently are unaware of any
normal situation that would yield the symptoms you describe.
I open PDF files in browser windows on a regular basis with Acrobat 9
with no problems whatsoever. Likewise, when I click on a URL in a PDF
file while in Acrobat 9, I get to the website in a browser window.
The only way you can get what you describe as a "PDFised version of
the web page" would be if you opened invoked "Create PDF=>From Web Page"
(Shift-CTRL-O) and that PDF would not be in a browser window. When you
click on a URL, Acrobat 9 normally prompts you as to whether to allow
you to open the web page (via a browser) or to block the access to the
web site. It NEVER creates a PDF file via clicking on a URL unless you
right-click on a URL and explicitly choose "Append to Document" or
"Open Weblink as New Document." There are no options or program preferences
which contravene this behaviour.
Any attempt to try diagnosing what's happening on your system would be
at best wild speculation but it would almost seem like there might be
"competing" PDF readers/processors concurrently installed on your system.
Be aware that Adobe does not support concurrent installation of multiple
versions of Acrobat on a single system (such as Acrobat 8 and Acrobat 9
installed at the same time). Adobe does not recommend concurrent
installation of the same versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system
(such as Acrobat 9 and Reader installed at the same time) or even worse
differing versions of both Reader and Acrobat on a system (such as
Acrobat 9 and Reader 8 installed at the same time). Even more so, we
certainly cannot vouch for what will happen if you have Acrobat or Reader
plus some other third party PDF reader or creator concurrently installed.
If you even have an inkling of how these programs integrate with drivers
and the browser(s) under Window, you will understand the chaos that such
mixtures of programs may engender to your system.
So, as a start, I would look at ALL the software installed on your system
and assure that there is only ONE, repeat only ONE PDF processing program
on your computer. If your system is "clean" in this regard, you might try
totally uninstalling any remaining version of Acrobat / Reader on your
system and then run a registry cleaner utility program to assure that
fragments of some previously installed "stuff" is truly eradicated from
your system. Then after rebooting, try installing Acrobat 9 from scratch
and see if that makes a difference.
If that doesn't help, please advise. Likewise, if this does resolve you
problem, likewise let us know. Good luck!
- Dov
> -Original Message-
> From: Alan T Litchfield
> Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 1:36 PM
> To: dr_go...@pobox.com
> Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com; Alison White
>
> hmm yes.
>
> No point in complaining here. There are a few Adobe people but they
> would have interest mostly in FrameMaker, except Dov.
>
> I might also suggest you get in touch with Adobe Customer care if you
> have a corporate license. Oh and don't expect anyone here to forward
> your complaint for you.
>
> Cheers
> Alan
>
> On 24/07/2010, at 1:34 AM, Steve Johnson wrote:
>
> > You should post this on the Adobe forum.
> >
> > In the paragraph "With Acrobat 9, I cannot..." have you tried
> > distilling using Acrobat 6 or 7 compatibility?
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 3:19 AM, Alison White
> > wrote:
> >> I've just upgraded to Acrobat 9 and regret the decision. Not sure how to
> >> post my complaints, so {sorry}. If you can on-forward, I'd be grateful.
> >>
> >> With Acrobat 9, I cannot open a pdf inside any mainstream browser without
> >> it
> >> (Acrobat + browser) failing completely (zilch). To get anything to happen I
> >> have to set browser preferences to not open Acrobat in the browser.
> >>
> >> Then, within my pdfs, my www.links don't open a default browser window
> >> anymore (as expected) - instead I get a long-winded pdfised version of the
> >> web page (definitely NOT required)!!!
> >>
> >> What the ? is going on?
> >>
> >> I'm not sure how to complain - but this is really NOT GOOD - I am about to
> >> abandon ANY idea of pdf, including LIVECYCLE FORMS, as a viable enterprise
> >> option.
> >>
> >> Back to 8 with ABSOLUTELY NO LINKS TO AN UPGARDE OFFERED.
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Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
hmm yes.
No point in complaining here. There are a few Adobe people but they
would have interest mostly in FrameMaker, except Dov.
I might also suggest you get in touch with Adobe Customer care if you
have a corporate license. Oh and don't expect anyone here to forward
your complaint for you.
Cheers
Alan
On 24/07/2010, at 1:34 AM, Steve Johnson wrote:
You should post this on the Adobe forum.
In the paragraph "With Acrobat 9, I cannot..." have you tried
distilling using Acrobat 6 or 7 compatibility?
On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 3:19 AM, Alison White
wrote:
I've just upgraded to Acrobat 9 and regret the decision. Not sure
how to
post my complaints, so {sorry}. If you can on-forward, I'd be
grateful.
With Acrobat 9, I cannot open a pdf inside any mainstream browser
without it
(Acrobat + browser) failing completely (zilch). To get anything to
happen I
have to set browser preferences to not open Acrobat in the browser.
Then, within my pdfs, my www.links don't open a default browser
window
anymore (as expected) - instead I get a long-winded pdfised version
of the
web page (definitely NOT required)!!!
What the ? is going on?
I'm not sure how to complain - but this is really NOT GOOD - I am
about to
abandon ANY idea of pdf, including LIVECYCLE FORMS, as a viable
enterprise
option.
Back to 8 with ABSOLUTELY NO LINKS TO AN UPGARDE OFFERED.
___
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Re: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
You should post this on the Adobe forum.
In the paragraph "With Acrobat 9, I cannot..." have you tried
distilling using Acrobat 6 or 7 compatibility?
On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 3:19 AM, Alison White wrote:
> I've just upgraded to Acrobat 9 and regret the decision. Not sure how to
> post my complaints, so {sorry}. If you can on-forward, I'd be grateful.
>
>
>
> With Acrobat 9, I cannot open a pdf inside any mainstream browser without it
> (Acrobat + browser) failing completely (zilch). To get anything to happen I
> have to set browser preferences to not open Acrobat in the browser.
>
>
>
> Then, within my pdfs, my www.links don't open a default browser window
> anymore (as expected) - instead I get a long-winded pdfised version of the
> web page (definitely NOT required)!!!
>
>
>
> What the ? is going on?
>
>
>
> I'm not sure how to complain - but this is really NOT GOOD - I am about to
> abandon ANY idea of pdf, including LIVECYCLE FORMS, as a viable enterprise
> option.
>
>
>
> Back to 8 with ABSOLUTELY NO LINKS TO AN UPGARDE OFFERED.
>
>
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to framers as dr_go...@pobox.com.
>
> Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com
> or visit
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>
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> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>
--
Steve Johnson, dr_go...@pobox.com
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RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Hi Alison:
I had the same problem with trying to see PDF files in my browser when I
upgraded to Acrobat 9. I'm using Firefox 3.6.4 and IE 8. My IT guy tried
a few things then got around the problem by opening PDFs in Acrobat,
separately from the browser window. So I think I had things set up the
way Richard Combs suggested, but now I don't, and it's working. That is,
I don't want my PDFs to display in the browser, so I'm okay. I take it
that you do?
I don't have any www links in my PDFs, so I can't help you there.
I haven't gotten around to complaining to Adobe, but if you'd like to
start that process, you can go here:
http://www.adobe.com/support/contact/. Good luck!
Fei Min
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Alison White
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 4:19 AM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
I've just upgraded to Acrobat 9 and regret the decision. Not sure how to
post my complaints, so {sorry}. If you can on-forward, I'd be grateful.
With Acrobat 9, I cannot open a pdf inside any mainstream browser
without it
(Acrobat + browser) failing completely (zilch). To get anything to
happen I
have to set browser preferences to not open Acrobat in the browser.
Then, within my pdfs, my www.links don't open a default browser window
anymore (as expected) - instead I get a long-winded pdfised version of
the
web page (definitely NOT required)!!!
What the ? is going on?
I'm not sure how to complain - but this is really NOT GOOD - I am about
to
abandon ANY idea of pdf, including LIVECYCLE FORMS, as a viable
enterprise
option.
Back to 8 with ABSOLUTELY NO LINKS TO AN UPGARDE OFFERED.
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RE: Acrobat 9 - a disaster
Alison White wrote:
> I've just upgraded to Acrobat 9 and regret the decision. Not sure how to
> post my complaints, so {sorry}. If you can on-forward, I'd be grateful.
On-forward? To anyone in particular?
> With Acrobat 9, I cannot open a pdf inside any mainstream browser without
> it
> (Acrobat + browser) failing completely (zilch). To get anything to happen I
> have to set browser preferences to not open Acrobat in the browser.
Go to Edit > Preferences. In the Internet category, make sure Display PDF in
browser is checked.
> Then, within my pdfs, my www.links don't open a default browser window
> anymore (as expected) - instead I get a long-winded pdfised version of the
> web page (definitely NOT required)!!!
Sounds like it's converting the web page to PDF, as if you'd right-clicked the
link and selected Open Weblink as New Document. I'm not sure how (or even if)
that could become the default behavior; I don't see any preference setting for
it. Maybe somebody else knows.
Could it be a property of the link? How are the links created?
> What the ? is going on?
>
>
>
> I'm not sure how to complain - but this is really NOT GOOD - I am about to
> abandon ANY idea of pdf, including LIVECYCLE FORMS, as a viable enterprise
> option.
Help > Online Support would be the place to start.
> Back to 8 with ABSOLUTELY NO LINKS TO AN UPGARDE OFFERED.
Sorry, I don't understand.
Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-903-6372
--
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