Re: Handbook Jail Chapter rewrite available for critique

2013-03-19 Thread Jov
useful doc,greate job!

find a mybe copy/past mistake in 16.7.1:


 *exec.stop*   This is the normal script used to *start *the jail.


should be:
*exec.stop*   This is the normal script used to *stop *the jail.

regards,

2013/3/19 Fbsd8 fb...@a1poweruser.com

 To all interested parties;

 I have completed the final draft of the total rewrite of FreeBSD's
 handbook Chapter 16 on Jails.

 Before submitting my work for submission to the documentation group for
 insertion in the handbook I am looking for critique of the work to find
 errors in concept, wrong use of words, or anything to make it better.

 All feedback welcomed.

 Use this URL to access it  
 http://www.jails.a1poweruser.**com/http://www.jails.a1poweruser.com/


 Thank You.

 __**_
 freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
 http://lists.freebsd.org/**mailman/listinfo/freebsd-**currenthttp://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
 To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscribe@**
 freebsd.org freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org




-- 
Jov
blog: http:amutu.com/blog http://amutu.com/blog
___
freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org

Re: Handbook Jail Chapter rewrite available for critique

2013-03-18 Thread Isaac (.ike) Levy
Pretty heavy cross-posting here, could you perhaps reign this in to the 
freebsd-jail@ list, where it can be discussed in-context?  This will help keep 
the noise down.

On Mar 18, 2013, at 12:57 PM, Fbsd8 wrote:

 To all interested parties;
 
 I have completed the final draft of the total rewrite of FreeBSD's handbook 
 Chapter 16 on Jails.
 
 Before submitting my work for submission to the documentation group for 
 insertion in the handbook I am looking for critique of the work to find 
 errors in concept, wrong use of words, or anything to make it better.
 
 All feedback welcomed.
 
 Use this URL to access it  http://www.jails.a1poweruser.com/
 
 
 Thank You.

Wow, overall that's really quite cool.

- Do you have a rough timeframe for when you want feedback?  (I would like to 
give this the time it deserves).

--
Feedback right off the bat, (please tell me if I'm off track here):

- After a short skim- I do not believe the qjail utilities referenced are 
appropriate for the FreeBSD handbook.  There are many 3rd party approaches to 
handling/managing jails, some of them with quite long histories and loyal user 
bases- it is impractical and not appropriate to try to cover any/all of them 
here.

- The Jail Cell vocabulary is a serious departure- and may create some 
confusion- I'll read thoroughly to get your context right.  In what I 
understand to be the majority of uses, it's confusing to think of the hardware 
host as the 'jail' and the jailed instance as the 'cell'.

- The references and history cite some works, but do not cite the original (and 
possibly most important) document on jailing, 
http://docs.freebsd.org/44doc/papers/jail/jail.ps.gz

- There are a number of common lexical errors right off the bat, (There instead 
of Their), etc…

--
I look foreword to reading this on my subway commute this week-

Best,
.ike


___
freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org


Re: Handbook Jail Chapter rewrite available for critique

2013-03-18 Thread Robert Huff

Isaac (.ike) Levy writes:

  Pretty heavy cross-posting here, could you perhaps reign this in
  to the freebsd-jail@ list, where it can be discussed in-context?
  This will help keep the noise down.

It will also keep down the signal from people who use or are
interested in jails, but do not (and do not plan to) subscribe to
that list.

Respectfully,


Robert Huff

___
freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org


Re: Handbook Jail Chapter rewrite available for critique

2013-03-18 Thread Andreas Nilsson
On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 6:45 PM, Robert Huff roberth...@rcn.com wrote:


 Isaac (.ike) Levy writes:

   Pretty heavy cross-posting here, could you perhaps reign this in
   to the freebsd-jail@ list, where it can be discussed in-context?
   This will help keep the noise down.

 It will also keep down the signal from people who use or are
 interested in jails, but do not (and do not plan to) subscribe to
 that list.

Respectfully,


 Robert Huff


Great! There really was a need to modernize the handbook with regards to
jails. Since I'm not a native English speaker I'll leave grammar and
spelling for those who are ;)

My first impressions are along the lines:
To much scripts, to few examples/scenarios. Our users are smart, show them
what can be accomplished with high-level config, leave minutiae to some
part of the appendix.

Also the exclusion of zfs and vnet is surprising, as those really make
jails shine, imo ( although jails really need to be thought about the
gray area visa-vi networking in rc-scripts that vnet provides ). How
about the resource control, which further makes jails really spiffy.

I would have preferred top-level separation of the different methods, ie
after the introduction there was one track manual, one for old-school
rc-, one for new-school rc- and one for jail.conf-style jails.


More specifically I agree with Isaac Levy's, especially in regards to the
jail cell terminology:

16.1 Synopsis: the term jail cell is used, long before being defined.

16.2 Introduction: Mentioning jail cells in a historic contest is imho a
blatant lie ( they were never known as such ). As far as I know, no
official documentation has called them cells, either. That does not mean
that it's not an appropriate term, though. As a contrast there is Solaris
vocabulary of zones ( cells ) and global zone ( jail system ). In this
regard I prefer the solaris one.
Most importantly, a large chunk of 16.2 would imo fit much better as a
history-appendix. Current and new users don't need to know and consider
the limitations of earlier implementations. The generations talked about
could perhaps be quantified with a release version :)

There are, as stated by Isaac Levy, many (good) utils for managing jails.
Why the focus on qjail? I also think that most of the strong points of
jails are rendered moot without, in order, zfs and vimage. Linux jails
might also interest quite a few people.

Best regards
Andreas
___
freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org