Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
KAYVEN RIESE wrote: Isn't what we are looking at here defamation of character?? Our beloved=20 Daemon is being accused of browser history stealing! Yes, an abuse. Interesting skimming the article though, if heavy on the math. Earlier, ref: From: Oliver Fromme o...@lurza.secnetix.de Message-id: 201002081220.o18ckxfl035...@lurza.secnetix.de On the bottom of this page ... http://www.freebsd.org/art.html . the text states that Marshall Kirk McKusick is the trademark holder for the BSD Daemon image. However, on another page (I don't have the URL right now) it says that Kirk owns the copyright of the daemon. I guess one of the web pages needs to be corrected, but I don't know which one. :-) I sent a send-pr cc'd Kirk Oliver so hopefully someone can correct. http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=143724 Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail plain text not quoted-printable, HTML or Base64 http://www.asciiribbon.org ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com writes:
I asked someone who registers trademarks as part of her job:
One can apply to register a trademark in {(my (Julian) brackets) at
least all of} Germany Britain America {etc}. She spoke of
an international form where one ticks the countries one
wants {to apply to}.
I recall there's initial recuring fees ( admin) on getting
renewing trademarks. So questions could be:
Has Kirk (or A.N.Other) registered it [which, what] as a
trademark ? In which countries ? When ? URLs please.
Have they already/ when will they expire
Whose crontab file reminder who Kirk ? to pay renewal
fees [to which countries] ?
There is no need to register a trademark. Kirk owns the *copyright* to
the image, which is valid world-wide at no cost. As the copyright
holder, Kirk gets to decide who is and isn't allowed to use the image
and for what purpose.
I'm tempted to say that those researchers' use of the daemon is a
shocking display of lack of respect for intellectual property, if I
didn't already know far too well that most scientists are not only
completely clueless about IP but do not even understand it when you
explain it to them.
DES
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Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
On Tue, Feb 09, 2010 at 01:27:16PM +0100, Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote:
Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com writes:
I asked someone who registers trademarks as part of her job:
One can apply to register a trademark in {(my (Julian) brackets) at
least all of} Germany Britain America {etc}. She spoke of
an international form where one ticks the countries one
wants {to apply to}.
I recall there's initial recuring fees ( admin) on getting
renewing trademarks. So questions could be:
Has Kirk (or A.N.Other) registered it [which, what] as a
trademark ? In which countries ? When ? URLs please.
Have they already/ when will they expire
Whose crontab file reminder who Kirk ? to pay renewal
fees [to which countries] ?
There is no need to register a trademark. Kirk owns the *copyright* to
the image, which is valid world-wide at no cost. As the copyright
holder, Kirk gets to decide who is and isn't allowed to use the image
and for what purpose.
There is no copyright in Germany.
But there is a protection for the author of arts (called Urheberrecht)
for simmilar purpose.
I'm not a lawyer, but there are many differences to copyright and I
think the main one is that the German system automatically protects
without the need to explicitly declare copyright.
E.g. there is not need to add copyright lines in sourcecode to prohibit
others to republish your code in Germany.
Many German authors use copyright only for international purpose or just
because they don't know better.
Another difference (to my knowledge) is that the author never looses his
right (though there are a few rules about age and inheritage) - no
matter how much it is spread.
The author can't even sell it, all he can do is sell the right to use it.
I'm tempted to say that those researchers' use of the daemon is a
shocking display of lack of respect for intellectual property, if I
didn't already know far too well that most scientists are not only
completely clueless about IP but do not even understand it when you
explain it to them.
This is one thing.
The other thing is that people use it as avatar pictures or other
completely unrelated purpose.
You can easily loose copyright and trademarks if you don't care about
it, but you don't loose your author rights.
Since this is a german magazine it doesn't matter if there is a copyright
stamp on it or not and it doesn't matter if it is widespread used or not.
They always need to get an agreement from the author - at least if they
publish the full art, which they did.
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Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Bernd Walter ti...@cicely7.cicely.de writes: There is no copyright in Germany. Yes, there is. Germany is signatory to the Berne convention. I'm not a lawyer, but there are many differences to copyright and I think the main one is that the German system automatically protects without the need to explicitly declare copyright. So does copyright. E.g. there is not need to add copyright lines in sourcecode to prohibit others to republish your code in Germany. It is not necessary anywhere in the world. It is still a good idea, just like it's a good idea to mark your laptop with indelible ink, even though stealing it is just as illegal if you don't. Another difference (to my knowledge) is that the author never looses his right (though there are a few rules about age and inheritage) - no matter how much it is spread. The same goes for copyright (author's lifetime + 70 years) The author can't even sell it, all he can do is sell the right to use it. I'm pretty sure there are provisions for work for hire. You can easily loose copyright and trademarks if you don't care about it, but you don't loose your author rights. You can *not* lose copyright through dilution, only trademarks. At worst, you might lose an infringement suit if the defendant can show that you knew about *that particular case* long before you filed suit, but it would not invalidate your copyright, nor would it diminish your standing in other suits against other infringers. DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - d...@des.no ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
On Tue, Feb 09, 2010 at 03:30:37PM +0100, Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: Bernd Walter ti...@cicely7.cicely.de writes: There is no copyright in Germany. Yes, there is. Germany is signatory to the Berne convention. Ah - I was misslead by a lawyer, but I think he wasn't refering to copyright as such, but was just making clear about the old US copyright, which is still in the head of many people. Thanks for clearification. I'm not a lawyer, but there are many differences to copyright and I think the main one is that the German system automatically protects without the need to explicitly declare copyright. So does copyright. E.g. there is not need to add copyright lines in sourcecode to prohibit others to republish your code in Germany. It is not necessary anywhere in the world. It is still a good idea, just like it's a good idea to mark your laptop with indelible ink, even though stealing it is just as illegal if you don't. Another difference (to my knowledge) is that the author never looses his right (though there are a few rules about age and inheritage) - no matter how much it is spread. The same goes for copyright (author's lifetime + 70 years) The author can't even sell it, all he can do is sell the right to use it. I'm pretty sure there are provisions for work for hire. You can easily loose copyright and trademarks if you don't care about it, but you don't loose your author rights. You can *not* lose copyright through dilution, only trademarks. At worst, you might lose an infringement suit if the defendant can show that you knew about *that particular case* long before you filed suit, but it would not invalidate your copyright, nor would it diminish your standing in other suits against other infringers. DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - d...@des.no ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org -- B.Walter be...@bwct.de http://www.bwct.de Modbus/TCP Ethernet I/O Baugruppen, ARM basierte FreeBSD Rechner uvm. ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: Bernd Walter writes: There is no copyright in Germany. Yes, there is. Germany is signatory to the Berne convention. That's correct, of course. I think what Bernd actually meant is that Copyright is not the same as the German Urheberrecht. They have a lot in common, but there are also a few differences. The author can't even sell it, all he can do is sell the right to use it. I'm pretty sure there are provisions for work for hire. That's true. When you work as an employee, the Urheber- recht is assigned to the employer (the work is created on behalf of the company). When doing contract work, it depends on the type and wording of the contract. Commonly the author retains the Urheberrecht but grants exclusive all-encompassing rights to the client. But Bernd is right that you cannot sell your Urheberrecht in Germany. You can't even give it away for free. That's why public domain software doesn't exist in Germany. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing b. M. Handelsregister: Registergericht Muenchen, HRA 74606, Geschäftsfuehrung: secnetix Verwaltungsgesellsch. mbH, Handelsregister: Registergericht Mün- chen, HRB 125758, Geschäftsführer: Maik Bachmann, Olaf Erb, Ralf Gebhart FreeBSD-Dienstleistungen, -Produkte und mehr: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd That's what I love about GUIs: They make simple tasks easier, and complex tasks impossible. -- John William Chambless ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Hi,
Reference:
From: =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= d...@des.no
Date: Tue, 09 Feb 2010 13:27:16 +0100
Message-id: 86eikuk317@ds4.des.no
=?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= wrote:
Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com writes:
I asked someone who registers trademarks as part of her job:
One can apply to register a trademark in {(my (Julian) brackets) at
least all of} Germany Britain America {etc}. She spoke of
an international form where one ticks the countries one
wants {to apply to}.
I recall there's initial recuring fees ( admin) on getting
renewing trademarks. So questions could be:
Has Kirk (or A.N.Other) registered it [which, what] as a
trademark ? In which countries ? When ? URLs please.
Have they already/ when will they expire
Whose crontab file reminder who Kirk ? to pay renewal
fees [to which countries] ?
There is no need to register a trademark. Kirk owns the *copyright* to
the image, which is valid world-wide at no cost. As the copyright
holder, Kirk gets to decide who is and isn't allowed to use the image
and for what purpose.
I'm tempted to say that those researchers' use of the daemon is a
shocking display of lack of respect for intellectual property, if I
didn't already know far too well that most scientists are not only
completely clueless about IP but do not even understand it when you
explain it to them.
DES
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Cheers,
Julian
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Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Hi, Sorry, for my last post, editing error jhs@ -- =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= wrote: There is no need to register a trademark. Agreed, probably no Need, but there might be some benefit to some commercial interests. Kirk owns the *copyright* to the image, which is valid world-wide at no cost. As the copyright holder, Kirk gets to decide who is and isn't allowed to use the image and for what purpose. Yes. I assume copyright could preempt a trade mark ( free avoids renewal hastle ) ... (but if image re-rendered / similar ? ) There's Linux trademarks in Germany (so prob. in others countries), Aktenzeichen/__WiedergabeMarkenform__Klassen_Aktenzustand_Anmelder Registernummer_der_Marke__/Inhaber 2050271Deutsch___Wort9,_42___Akte_Haaga,___ ___Linux_Bildmarke___Vernichtet___Dirk_ ___Distribution___73434 ___-_DLD__Aalen 2088936LINUX_Wortmarke___9___MarkeTorvalds, _eingetragen__Linus,___ __Santa __Clara __Calif.,US 395190185__SUSE__Wort/___9,_42___MarkeSUSE_ ___Green_Bildmarke___eingetragen__Linux ___Chameleon__products_ ___GraphicGmbH_ __90409 __Nuernberg Maybe its a statistical thing ? More Linux people companies, willing to pay for a badging/ marketing angle. Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail plain text not quoted-printable, HTML or Base64 http://www.asciiribbon.org ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav d...@des.no writes: There is no need to register a trademark. Agreed, probably no Need, but there might be some benefit to some commercial interests. In this particular case? I'd say it's just a waste of money. There's Linux trademarks in Germany (so prob. in others countries), [SUSE chameleon] SUSE is a German company - or was, before they were acquired by Novell, but they still have offices in Germany and do business there. I imagine Novell have registered their various trademarks in all countries in which they do business; I also imagine it costs them millions of dollars a year. Besides, there is a huge difference between a logo for a specific *commercial* product from a specific company on the one hand, and a mascot for a whole family of free-as-in-beer-and-speech systems with no single identifiable owner on the other. DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - d...@des.no ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
On Tue, 9 Feb 2010, Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: Bernd Walter ti...@cicely7.cicely.de writes: You can *not* lose copyright through dilution, only trademarks. At worst, you might lose an infringement suit if the defendant can show that you knew about *that particular case* long before you filed suit, but it would not invalidate your copyright, nor would it diminish your standing in other suits against other infringers. Isn't what we are looking at here defamation of character?? Our beloved Daemon is being accused of browser history stealing! DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - d...@des.no ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org *--* Kayven Riese, BSCS, MS (Physiology and Biophysics) (415) 902 5513 cellular http://kayve.net Webmaster http://ChessYoga.org *--*___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Ruben de Groot mai...@bzerk.org wrote: On Fri, Feb 05, 2010 at 08:05:10PM +0100, Julian H. Stacey typed: PS an undefended trade mark loses its right to further defence or some such, (I'm not a lawyer). It's not a trade mark, is it? It's copyrighted. That's a whole other set of laws. On the bottom of this page ... http://www.freebsd.org/art.html .. the text states that Marshall Kirk McKusick is the trademark holder for the BSD Daemon image. However, on another page (I don't have the URL right now) it says that Kirk owns the copyright of the daemon. I guess one of the web pages needs to be corrected, but I don't know which one. :-) Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing b. M. Handelsregister: Registergericht Muenchen, HRA 74606, Geschäftsfuehrung: secnetix Verwaltungsgesellsch. mbH, Handelsregister: Registergericht Mün- chen, HRB 125758, Geschäftsführer: Maik Bachmann, Olaf Erb, Ralf Gebhart FreeBSD-Dienstleistungen, -Produkte und mehr: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd A language that doesn't have everything is actually easier to program in than some that do. -- Dennis M. Ritchie ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Oliver Fromme wrote:
Ruben de Groot mai...@bzerk.org wrote:
On Fri, Feb 05, 2010 at 08:05:10PM +0100, Julian H. Stacey typed:
PS an undefended trade mark loses its right to further defence or some
such,
(I'm not a lawyer).
It's not a trade mark, is it? It's copyrighted. That's a whole other set
of laws.
On the bottom of this page ...
http://www.freebsd.org/art.html
Nice page :-)
. the text states that Marshall Kirk McKusick is the
trademark holder for the BSD Daemon image.
However, on another page (I don't have the URL right
now) it says that Kirk owns the copyright of the daemon.
I guess one of the web pages needs to be corrected,
but I don't know which one. :-)
Best regards
Oliver
I asked someone who registers trademarks as part of her job:
One can apply to register a trademark in {(my (Julian) brackets) at
least all of} Germany Britain America {etc}. She spoke of
an international form where one ticks the countries one
wants {to apply to}.
I recall there's initial recuring fees ( admin) on getting
renewing trademarks. So questions could be:
Has Kirk (or A.N.Other) registered it [which, what] as a
trademark ? In which countries ? When ? URLs please.
Have they already/ when will they expire
Whose crontab file reminder who Kirk ? to pay renewal
fees [to which countries] ?
I guess if Kirk didn't/ doesn't want that [future] bother, it's the sort of
thing [Free]BSD Foundation might handle ? (Assuming that [Free] bit
doesn't provoke Net Open Dragon PC etc BSD who also use the BSD daemon.
Occasionaly (eg with Disney graphics ?) one sees some mark under
the graphic. Might it be wise to have a tiny C. symbol or other
text under the graphic's feet ? (A question for a trademark specialist,
Bcc'd :-)
Editing an ASCII readable copyright string into eg a .gif image is
probably not a bad idea too.
Kirk wrote Fri, 05 Feb 2010 11:19:39 -0800 (20:19 CET)
I have gotten word from the authors that they are aware of the
problem and are correcting it (e.g., taking out the daemon).
Mon Feb 8 20:48:01 CET 2010 (TZ=GMT+01:00)
http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf
Page 4
BSD graphic is no longer present, replaced by word Attacker.
Firefox graphic is no longer present, replaced by word Victim
Cheers,
Julian
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Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
On Fri, Feb 05, 2010 at 08:05:10PM +0100, Julian H. Stacey typed: PS an undefended trade mark loses its right to further defence or some such, (I'm not a lawyer). It's not a trade mark, is it? It's copyrighted. That's a whole other set of laws. Ruben ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Hi Kirk, Christoph, Hackers, Julian H. Stacey wrote: Kirk McKusick wrote: Thanks for the pointer. As you note, the damage (or benefit :-) is done. Still I have sent an email to the editor at Spiegel notifying them of my copyright in the hopes that they will at least ask in the future. Kirk McKusick Good idea. You might want to contact authors of that PDF paper too. In case, as my browser still is fails on URL I posted earlier: http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf I'll send you an off list copy of what I downloaded earlier at 2nd Feb 18:14 TZ=GMT+01:00. National German TV (WDR was showing the BSD Daemon graphic in close up, as part of that PDF report, just now, about 19:10 GMT+02:00 Fri 5th Feb. They quoted http://www.aktuelle-stunde.de/ I clicked to http://www.wdr.de/tv/aks/sendungsbeitraege/2010/kw05/0205/angeklickt.jsp Big Browser is watching you! Freitag, 05. Februar 2010, 18.50 - 19.30 Uhr Kein Versprecher, sondern wie es scheint, zunehmend ein Problem. Irgendwie wussten wir es ja schon immer: Wer sich viel in sozialen Netzwerken wie Facebook, SchuelerVZ, Xing, Stayfriends und Co. aufhält, der gibt so oder so schon eine Menge von und über sich preis, bewusst in der Regel. Aber wer hätte gedacht, dass man beim Ansteuern anderer Netzseiten zum gläsernen Surfer werden könnte? Genau das kann aber passieren, sagen Forscher in einer Studie. Wer sich viel in sozialen Netzwerken aufhält, muss damit rechnen, künftig beim Surfen erkannt zu werden. Jörg Schieb erklärt uns nun, was das bedeutet, wie das funktioniert und worum es eigentlich geht. Haben Sie Fragen oder Anregungen? Dann schicken Sie uns eine E-Mail. angekli...@wdr.de The BSD symbol was used IMO totaly out of all context on the TV clip. Though the Firefox symbol has more relevance. Kirk, you may want to remind the chaps in Wien/Vienna Uni who wrote the report, that the copyright on that symbol is yours, as report was written in English, no problem for you to do that. If you want to write the TV company: I'm British, I merely read German, don't write it well, There's numerous native German speakers on this list can translate to German much better than I ever could. I suspect this may be front edge of a wave, so it's perhaps worth trying to ensure the BSD daemon is not riding that wave. The more so, as if others realise this is about data harvesting, there was another German court ruling about data harvesting recently http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/free/scam_fees.html BSD being seen with harvesting not so good. PS an undefended trade mark loses its right to further defence or some such, (I'm not a lawyer). =-=-=-= From:Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com Date:Tue, 02 Feb 2010 19:30:29 +0100 To: Christoph Kukulies k...@kukulies.org Subject: Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com Organization: http://www.berklix.com BSD Unix Linux Consultancy, Munich Germany Christoph Kukulies wrote: Look here: http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-51396-2.html ( Well spotted Christoph ! ) For those that don't read German, tracing back, Text article starts here http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,675395,00.html That is in German, (some might like a translator web, eg http://babelfish.org ) I did read the german article (but skipped graphics). Key paragraph: Es ist ein Horrorszenario für Datenschützer, was Thorsten Holz, Gilbert Wondracek, Engin Kirda und Christopher Kruegel in ihrem 15-seitigen Aufsatz beschreiben ( PDF-Datei hier, 803 KB): Die Experten vom Isec-Forschungslabor für IT-Sicherheit, einer Kooperation der Technischen Universität Wien, dem Institute Eurcom und der University of California, dokumentieren einen technisch eher simplen Angriff, der eine seit zehn Jahren bekannte Sicherheitslücke ausnutzt. In key para there I could click download sonda-TR.pdf (though now I can't seem to redownload http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf ) A 15 page article in Engish. Page 4 uses the Firefox BSD logos. I havent read that English [yet], but with it, any interested here can now read form own opinions if it seems fair to use the Daemon logo, especially cc'd copyright holder of BSD daemon holder: Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com IMO The German article by weekly magazine Spiegel.de didnt really seem to have anything to do with BSD, they just copied the graphics. Personaly my 2c: Initial reaction was I'd be a happier if a generic PC graphic had been used in the spiegel.de web, but maybe its the price of fame, I guess tests were done using BSD, Spiegel
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
I have gotten word from the authors that they are aware of the problem and are correcting it (e.g., taking out the daemon). Kirk McKusick =-=-=-= From:Engin Kirda e...@iseclab.org Date:Wed, 3 Feb 2010 19:03:49 +0100 To: mckus...@mckusick.com Subject: BSD logo misuse Cc: Gilbert Wondracek gilb...@iseclab.org, Thorsten Holz t...@iseclab.org, Christopher Kruegel ch...@cs.ucsb.edu Kirk, I colleague from Symantec pointed out the discussion about the BSD logo that we have, apparently, misused in our paper without realizing that it was the BSD logo :-/ We'd like to apologize for this. It was not intentional. The PDF we put up is a technical report and we can easily correct this. We'll make sure that we do not use it in the camera-ready version of the published paper. Best regards, --Engin ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
On Tue, 2 Feb 2010 10:21, kuku@ wrote: Look here: http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-51396-2.html -- Christoph OH! no! someone quick get a Microsoft Solicitation! I mean solution -- jhell ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Christoph Kukulies wrote: Look here: http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-51396-2.html ( Well spotted Christoph ! ) For those that don't read German, tracing back, Text article starts here http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,675395,00.html That is in German, (some might like a translator web, eg http://babelfish.org ) I did read the german article (but skipped graphics). Key paragraph: Es ist ein Horrorszenario für Datenschützer, was Thorsten Holz, Gilbert Wondracek, Engin Kirda und Christopher Kruegel in ihrem 15-seitigen Aufsatz beschreiben ( PDF-Datei hier, 803 KB): Die Experten vom Isec-Forschungslabor für IT-Sicherheit, einer Kooperation der Technischen Universität Wien, dem Institute Eurcom und der University of California, dokumentieren einen technisch eher simplen Angriff, der eine seit zehn Jahren bekannte Sicherheitslücke ausnutzt. In key para there I could click download sonda-TR.pdf (though now I can't seem to redownload http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf ) A 15 page article in Engish. Page 4 uses the Firefox BSD logos. I havent read that English [yet], but with it, any interested here can now read form own opinions if it seems fair to use the Daemon logo, especially cc'd copyright holder of BSD daemon holder: Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com IMO The German article by weekly magazine Spiegel.de didnt really seem to have anything to do with BSD, they just copied the graphics. Personaly my 2c: Initial reaction was I'd be a happier if a generic PC graphic had been used in the spiegel.de web, but maybe its the price of fame, I guess tests were done using BSD, Spiegel thought it was nice colourful graphic. (Politicians never looked good on British TV Spitting Image programme, but they learnt it was better to look bad there, be talked about, than not seen, not recognised ignored). Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail plain text not quoted-printable, HTML or Base64 http://www.asciiribbon.org ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Thanks for the pointer. As you note, the damage (or benefit :-) is done. Still I have sent an email to the editor at Spiegel notifying them of my copyright in the hopes that they will at least ask in the future. Kirk McKusick =-=-=-= From:Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com Date:Tue, 02 Feb 2010 19:30:29 +0100 To: Christoph Kukulies k...@kukulies.org Subject: Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com Organization: http://www.berklix.com BSD Unix Linux Consultancy, Munich Germany Christoph Kukulies wrote: Look here: http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-51396-2.html ( Well spotted Christoph ! ) For those that don't read German, tracing back, Text article starts here http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,675395,00.html That is in German, (some might like a translator web, eg http://babelfish.org ) I did read the german article (but skipped graphics). Key paragraph: Es ist ein Horrorszenario für Datenschützer, was Thorsten Holz, Gilbert Wondracek, Engin Kirda und Christopher Kruegel in ihrem 15-seitigen Aufsatz beschreiben ( PDF-Datei hier, 803 KB): Die Experten vom Isec-Forschungslabor für IT-Sicherheit, einer Kooperation der Technischen Universität Wien, dem Institute Eurcom und der University of California, dokumentieren einen technisch eher simplen Angriff, der eine seit zehn Jahren bekannte Sicherheitslücke ausnutzt. In key para there I could click download sonda-TR.pdf (though now I can't seem to redownload http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf ) A 15 page article in Engish. Page 4 uses the Firefox BSD logos. I havent read that English [yet], but with it, any interested here can now read form own opinions if it seems fair to use the Daemon logo, especially cc'd copyright holder of BSD daemon holder: Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com IMO The German article by weekly magazine Spiegel.de didnt really seem to have anything to do with BSD, they just copied the graphics. Personaly my 2c: Initial reaction was I'd be a happier if a generic PC graphic had been used in the spiegel.de web, but maybe its the price of fame, I guess tests were done using BSD, Spiegel thought it was nice colourful graphic. (Politicians never looked good on British TV Spitting Image programme, but they learnt it was better to look bad there, be talked about, than not seen, not recognised ignored). Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail plain text not quoted-printable, HTML or Base64 http://www.asciiribbon.org ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Kirk McKusick wrote: Thanks for the pointer. As you note, the damage (or benefit :-) is done. Still I have sent an email to the editor at Spiegel notifying them of my copyright in the hopes that they will at least ask in the future. Kirk McKusick Good idea. You might want to contact authors of that PDF paper too. In case, as my browser still is fails on URL I posted earlier: http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf I'll send you an off list copy of what I downloaded earlier at 2nd Feb 18:14 TZ=GMT+01:00. =-=-=-= From:Julian H. Stacey j...@berklix.com Date:Tue, 02 Feb 2010 19:30:29 +0100 To: Christoph Kukulies k...@kukulies.org Subject: Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com Organization: http://www.berklix.com BSD Unix Linux Consultancy, Munich Germany Christoph Kukulies wrote: Look here: http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-51396-2.html ( Well spotted Christoph ! ) For those that don't read German, tracing back, Text article starts here http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/0,1518,675395,00.html That is in German, (some might like a translator web, eg http://babelfish.org ) I did read the german article (but skipped graphics). Key paragraph: Es ist ein Horrorszenario für Datenschützer, was Thorsten Holz, Gilbert Wondracek, Engin Kirda und Christopher Kruegel in ihrem 15-seitigen Aufsatz beschreiben ( PDF-Datei hier, 803 KB): Die Experten vom Isec-Forschungslabor für IT-Sicherheit, einer Kooperation der Technischen Universität Wien, dem Institute Eurcom und der University of California, dokumentieren einen technisch eher simplen Angriff, der eine seit zehn Jahren bekannte Sicherheitslücke ausnutzt. In key para there I could click download sonda-TR.pdf (though now I can't seem to redownload http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf ) A 15 page article in Engish. Page 4 uses the Firefox BSD logos. I havent read that English [yet], but with it, any interested here can now read form own opinions if it seems fair to use the Daemon logo, especially cc'd copyright holder of BSD daemon holder: Kirk McKusick mckus...@mckusick.com IMO The German article by weekly magazine Spiegel.de didnt really seem to have anything to do with BSD, they just copied the graphics. Personaly my 2c: Initial reaction was I'd be a happier if a generic PC graphic had been used in the spiegel.de web, but maybe its the price of fame, I guess tests were done using BSD, Spiegel thought it was nice colourful graphic. (Politicians never looked good on British TV Spitting Image programme, but they learnt it was better to look bad there, be talked about, than not seen, not recognised ignored). Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail plain text not quoted-printable, HTML or Base64 http://www.asciiribbon.org ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
On Tuesday, 2 February 2010 at 13:09:29 -0800, Kirk McKusick wrote: Thanks for the pointer. As you note, the damage (or benefit :-) is done. Still I have sent an email to the editor at Spiegel notifying them of my copyright in the hopes that they will at least ask in the future. FWIW, much as I dislike Der Spiegel, I think you targeted the wrong people. They clearly took it from the original paper (http://www.iseclab.org/papers/sonda-TR.pdf). The authors are Thorsten Holz, Gilbert Wondracek (both at the TU Wien), Engin Kirda (Eurecom, Sophia Antipolis) und Christopher Kruegel (UCSB), in case anybody knows any of them. Greg -- See complete headers for address and phone numbers. This message is digitally signed. If your Microsoft MUA reports problems, please read http://tinyurl.com/broken-mua pgp6QVedSuDRf.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: our little daemon abused as symbol of the evil
Hi, On 02 February 2010 pm 23:21:12 Christoph Kukulies wrote: Look here: http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-51396-2.html it reminds me of movies in which good guys use Apple, bad guys Windows. Erich ___ freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-hackers-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
