Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
On Sun, 4 May 2008 18:03:55 -0500 (CDT) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] 1. created a file called .Xdefaults and put in it the one line XTerm*metaSendsEscape: true and then 2. Exited from X and restarted, then run the same test. At this point the Alt key is doing right. You could have just done: xrdb -merge ~/.Xdefaults No need to have restarted X11. [...] [...] [...] -- Thomas Adam -- It was the cruelest game I've ever played and it's played inside my head. -- Hush The Warmth, Gorky's Zygotic Mynci.
Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
On Mon, 5 May 2008, Sergey Vlasov wrote: On Sun, 4 May 2008 18:06:00 -0400 (EDT) Thomas Dickey wrote: There is a control sequence in xterm which can change this mode, but I'd be surprised if mc is using it. Recent libreadline (used by bash) sends this - you can observe it with 'strace -e write bash': write(2, \33[?1034h, 8) = 8 I did recall that - hadn't related it to mc... When xterm receives this sequence, it switches to 8-bit mode (*VT100.eightBitInput: true), where the Meta key sets the 0x80 bit of input characters instead of adding the ESC prefix. The konsole terminal emulator from KDE just ignores this sequence and continues to send the ESC prefix for Meta. yes - konsole doesn't implement the meta feature with or without the control sequence. Apparently this sequence comes from the 'smm' string in the terminfo database, which was added somewhere between the 211 and 222 releases of xterm (I do not see an explanation for this in xterm.log.html). It's in #216, added for completeness (since I'd added the control sequence at that point). I recall some discussion regarding readline, which turns on the feature if it exists (and commented that readline should have made it optional). There does not seem to be a way to disable this behavior through the libreadline config file (~/.inputrc). A possible workaround in ~/.Xresources: *VT100.altIsNotMeta:true *VT100.altSendsEscape: true *VT100.metaSendsEscape: true *VT100.Translations:#override \ MetaKeyPress: insert-seven-bit() Setting just metaSendsEscape: true is not enough in the common case when Meta and Alt are the same key - apparently in this case xterm treats this modifier key as Alt instead of Meta, even though the Meta translations work for it; and the code in input.c:Input() does not reset the eightbit flag in the alt_sends_esc case, like it does for meta_sends_esc, therefore the translation override is needed to prevent setting of the 0x80 bit in addition to the ESC prefix. -- Thomas E. Dickey http://invisible-island.net ftp://invisible-island.net
Re: FVWM: focus policy and nautilus desktop
On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:36 PM, Emilie Ann Phillips [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm trying for the first time using gnome with fvwm. Previously, I had my focus policy set to MouseFocus and had several key bindings for the root context. I've figured out that I need to change the key bindings to the desktop D context. The problem is that I don't get focus on the desktop unless I click on it. I've tried poking around at this a little bit more. It acts as if I can't apply any style to the desktop. I even tried applying the style !Unmanaged first and then using the Recapture command, but still didn't get any response from the desktop. Emilie
Re: FVWM: focus policy and nautilus desktop
On Wed, 30 Apr 2008 13:36:00 -0400 Emilie Ann Phillips [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm trying for the first time using gnome with fvwm. Previously, I had my focus policy set to MouseFocus and had several key bindings for the root context. I've figured out that I need to change the key bindings to the desktop D context. The problem is that I don't get focus on the desktop unless I click on it. Any suggestions? Are you sure you didn't mean to use PointerKey instead? -- Thomas Adam -- It was the cruelest game I've ever played and it's played inside my head. -- Hush The Warmth, Gorky's Zygotic Mynci.
FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
What do people here use (if anything) as a calendar/alarm/PIM application? I want something *much* lighter than, for example, Evolution as I have no need at all for E-Mail with it. -- Chris Green
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
On 05/05/2008, Chris G [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do people here use (if anything) as a calendar/alarm/PIM application? I want something *much* lighter than, for example, Evolution as I have no need at all for E-Mail with it. Sunbird? Orage? I just use remind/wyrd, personally. -- Thomas Adam
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
What do people here use (if anything) as a calendar/alarm/PIM application? I use remind together will a silly Qt3 app I wrote for popping up reminder messages: http://home.att.net/~Tom.Horsley/qtmess.html I want something *much* lighter than, for example, Evolution as I have no need at all for E-Mail with it. Heck, I want something lighter than evolution for everything, including email :-).
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
On Mon, May 05, 2008 at 04:43:40PM +, Tom Horsley wrote: What do people here use (if anything) as a calendar/alarm/PIM application? I use remind together will a silly Qt3 app I wrote for popping up reminder messages: http://home.att.net/~Tom.Horsley/qtmess.html I want something *much* lighter than, for example, Evolution as I have no need at all for E-Mail with it. Heck, I want something lighter than evolution for everything, including email :-). Yes, exactly, I use mutt via ssh. :-) I have realised that I need something *slightly* different from the standard calendar program. I need something that reminds me of things that I have to do on/before a certain date (small company tax payments, etc.) so I want a reminder, say, seven days before and then a repeating reminder until I tell the reminder program I have done what it's reminding me about. I did look at remind a while ago and decided it was too complex for what I wanted. I have been using reminderfox (Firefox addon) which *almost* does what I want but I can't tell it that I have 'done' an event. -- Chris Green
Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
Le Sun, 4 May 2008 22:05:34 +0100, Thomas Adam [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : On 04/05/2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [...] If you think this problem is cured in 2.4.25, I am glad to try it. But I bet it is not. The problem is as I said one of those weird problems that I But this doesn't have anything to do with FVWM. OK, I am not using Slackware, but neither can I reproduce it, and I can't say I am surprised. There is nothing inherently weird in starting a termina, typing in su and then for it to mangle your bindings. It's -possible- it's something to do with XTerm, such as settings for its resource for thing like: eightBitInput eightBitControl And you perhaps not having set: XTerm*metaSendsEscape: true In your ~/.Xdefaults --- but this would explain really why you see this when you su. -- Thomas Adam Another issue with su is that it can do some weird things with the path. Something like you have the root permissions but still the $PATH of the user that launched the su. Because of that, I always issue 'su -'. That give me the real root environment. -- Dominique Michel Mes 3 projets préférés auxquels je contribue: * FVWM-Crystal, le bureau basé sur FVWM: http://fvwm-crystal.org * AlsaPlayer, le lecteur audio avec contrôle de vitesse en continu: www.alsaplayer.org * L'overlay pour la MAO sous gentoo: http://proaudio.tuxfamily.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
On Sun, 4 May 2008 18:06:00 -0400 (EDT) Thomas Dickey wrote: There is a control sequence in xterm which can change this mode, but I'd be surprised if mc is using it. Recent libreadline (used by bash) sends this - you can observe it with 'strace -e write bash': write(2, \33[?1034h, 8) = 8 When xterm receives this sequence, it switches to 8-bit mode (*VT100.eightBitInput: true), where the Meta key sets the 0x80 bit of input characters instead of adding the ESC prefix. The konsole terminal emulator from KDE just ignores this sequence and continues to send the ESC prefix for Meta. Apparently this sequence comes from the 'smm' string in the terminfo database, which was added somewhere between the 211 and 222 releases of xterm (I do not see an explanation for this in xterm.log.html). There does not seem to be a way to disable this behavior through the libreadline config file (~/.inputrc). A possible workaround in ~/.Xresources: *VT100.altIsNotMeta:true *VT100.altSendsEscape: true *VT100.metaSendsEscape: true *VT100.Translations:#override \ MetaKeyPress: insert-seven-bit() Setting just metaSendsEscape: true is not enough in the common case when Meta and Alt are the same key - apparently in this case xterm treats this modifier key as Alt instead of Meta, even though the Meta translations work for it; and the code in input.c:Input() does not reset the eightbit flag in the alt_sends_esc case, like it does for meta_sends_esc, therefore the translation override is needed to prevent setting of the 0x80 bit in addition to the ESC prefix.
Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
On Mon, 5 May 2008, Thomas Dickey wrote: On Mon, 5 May 2008, Sergey Vlasov wrote: On Sun, 4 May 2008 18:06:00 -0400 (EDT) Thomas Dickey wrote: There is a control sequence in xterm which can change this mode, but I'd be surprised if mc is using it. Recent libreadline (used by bash) sends this - you can observe it with 'strace -e write bash': write(2, \33[?1034h, 8) = 8 I did recall that - hadn't related it to mc... When xterm receives this sequence, it switches to 8-bit mode (*VT100.eightBitInput: true), where the Meta key sets the 0x80 bit of input characters instead of adding the ESC prefix. The konsole terminal emulator from KDE just ignores this sequence and continues to send the ESC prefix for Meta. yes - konsole doesn't implement the meta feature with or without the control sequence. Apparently this sequence comes from the 'smm' string in the terminfo database, which was added somewhere between the 211 and 222 releases of xterm (I do not see an explanation for this in xterm.log.html). It's in #216, added for completeness (since I'd added the control sequence at that point). I recall some discussion regarding readline, which turns on the feature if it exists (and commented that readline should have made it optional). There does not seem to be a way to disable this behavior through the libreadline config file (~/.inputrc). A possible workaround in ~/.Xresources: *VT100.altIsNotMeta:true *VT100.altSendsEscape: true *VT100.metaSendsEscape: true *VT100.Translations:#override \ MetaKeyPress: insert-seven-bit() Setting just metaSendsEscape: true is not enough in the common case when Meta and Alt are the same key - apparently in this case xterm treats this modifier key as Alt instead of Meta, even though the Meta translations work for it; and the code in input.c:Input() does not reset the eightbit flag in the alt_sends_esc case, like it does for meta_sends_esc, therefore the translation override is needed to prevent setting of the 0x80 bit in addition to the ESC prefix. -- Thomas E. Dickey http://invisible-island.net ftp://invisible-island.net Thanks for all the attention to the keycodes problem. On this end, I do not have time to think deeply or to investigate more deeply until I get a stack of differential equations finals and then another stack of linear algebra finals graded (should be doing that right now, but this is more pleasant). However, this is what it looks like from here, reading the discussion in this thread: 1. apparently X has changed some of its defaults. Should they have done that? That is a very good question and I do not know the answer to things which are outside the scope of my work. 2. apparently KDE in reaction has changed some of its defaults, too, or has always coded their terminal support this way, possibly anticipating a problem which now has happened but the lightning struck somewhere else. Should they have taken this approach? That is a good question, too, is it not? 3. The MC mailing list (where I reported the same problem) thought it was not their issue. I can understand their attitude, but as I said in reaction to something that looked similar here, too, I do not think that this is the most constructive attitude which is possible. 4. FVWM has up to this point said it is not exactly an FVWM problem, either. 5. Me: It looks from this side as though there are a bunch of developers who are doing projects that in fact are interdependent and each relies on the other one doing things a certain way. But then project X changes the way that something was done, and projects Y and Z go off in some other direction or do not notice what project X did, which changes the outcome of what they are doing. Quite rightly, nobody would say that here is a bug in my project. Quite rightly, nobody would say that there is a bug in that other project, either, which is causing the problem. That would be a very irresponsible attitude. Note that I don't share that attitude, either. However, there is in fact a problem, and I do not believe that things like this can be straightened out unless there is more contact between the various groups of developers. for, the effect is a negative and frustrating user experience which I would think that none of us want. Our software is supposed to work, and smoothly, too. We are not supposed to let things like that happen. Leave that kind of screwups to the Great Monopolist, whose software does not seem to need to be attractive and pleasing. Solutions? My ad hoc solution was to create an .Xdefaults file which changes the default behavior of xterm. Ought this to be the universal solution? Not sure about that. Why did X use those new keyboard mappings? Could it be that the funny-looking characters ought to be printed, because some people want or need them? So this solution turns that off. As my wife would say, who
Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
On Mon, May 05, 2008 at 01:29:58PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 5 May 2008, Thomas Dickey wrote: On Mon, 5 May 2008, Sergey Vlasov wrote: On Sun, 4 May 2008 18:06:00 -0400 (EDT) Thomas Dickey wrote: There is a control sequence in xterm which can change this mode, but I'd be surprised if mc is using it. Recent libreadline (used by bash) sends this - you can observe it with 'strace -e write bash': write(2, \33[?1034h, 8) = 8 I did recall that - hadn't related it to mc... When xterm receives this sequence, it switches to 8-bit mode (*VT100.eightBitInput: true), where the Meta key sets the 0x80 bit of input characters instead of adding the ESC prefix. The konsole terminal emulator from KDE just ignores this sequence and continues to send the ESC prefix for Meta. yes - konsole doesn't implement the meta feature with or without the control sequence. Apparently this sequence comes from the 'smm' string in the terminfo database, which was added somewhere between the 211 and 222 releases of xterm (I do not see an explanation for this in xterm.log.html). It's in #216, added for completeness (since I'd added the control sequence at that point). I recall some discussion regarding readline, which turns on the feature if it exists (and commented that readline should have made it optional). There does not seem to be a way to disable this behavior through the libreadline config file (~/.inputrc). A possible workaround in ~/.Xresources: *VT100.altIsNotMeta:true *VT100.altSendsEscape: true *VT100.metaSendsEscape: true *VT100.Translations:#override \ MetaKeyPress: insert-seven-bit() Setting just metaSendsEscape: true is not enough in the common case when Meta and Alt are the same key - apparently in this case xterm treats this modifier key as Alt instead of Meta, even though the Meta translations work for it; and the code in input.c:Input() does not reset the eightbit flag in the alt_sends_esc case, like it does for meta_sends_esc, therefore the translation override is needed to prevent setting of the 0x80 bit in addition to the ESC prefix. -- Thomas E. Dickey http://invisible-island.net ftp://invisible-island.net Thanks for all the attention to the keycodes problem. On this end, I do not have time to think deeply or to investigate more deeply until I get a stack of differential equations finals and then another stack of linear algebra finals graded (should be doing that right now, but this is more pleasant). However, this is what it looks like from here, reading the discussion in this thread: 1. apparently X has changed some of its defaults. Should they have done that? That is a very good question and I do not know the answer to things which are outside the scope of my work. Not exactly: I noticed that xterm was (essentially the only terminal) implementing the meta feature as described in the terminfo document. But there was no way to turn it on/off. So I added a new control (escape) sequence so that applications could use that feature properly. However, it turns out that readline has some (15 years) code that turns on the feature if you tell it that it's there. It was discussed on gnu.bash.bug at the beginning of February 2007. (the same thread's on bug-ncurses). The terminal description tells what the terminal can do - it's up to the application running in the terminal to make effective use of the information. I pointed that out last year, got no response from bash's maintainer. 2. apparently KDE in reaction has changed some of its defaults, too, or has always coded their terminal support this way, possibly anticipating a problem which now has happened but the lightning struck somewhere else. Should they have taken this approach? That is a good question, too, is it not? KDE's terminal konsole implements what is essentially a part of the meta feature. (Call it about 1/4). And since there's no escape sequence to turn it on/off, we don't have to worry about what its effect is. 3. The MC mailing list (where I reported the same problem) thought it was not their issue. I can understand their attitude, but as I said in reaction to something that looked similar here, too, I do not think that this is the most constructive attitude which is possible. I didn't notice the comment on MC's list (which I do read), but noticed it here. -- Thomas E. Dickey [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://invisible-island.net ftp://invisible-island.net signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
What do people here use (if anything) as a calendar/alarm/PIM application? I have realised that I need something *slightly* different from the standard calendar program. I need something that reminds me of things that I have to do on/before a certain date (small company tax payments, etc.) so I want a reminder, say, seven days before and then a repeating reminder until I tell the reminder program I have done what it's reminding me about. I did look at remind a while ago and decided it was too complex for what I wanted. I have been using reminderfox (Firefox addon) which *almost* does what I want but I can't tell it that I have 'done' an event. iCal can do this. Mark an entry as a TODO, and it will keep coming back every day until checked off as done.
Re: FVWM: My previous mail seems not to have bounced, so here is the problem
On Mon, 5 May 2008, Thomas Dickey wrote: It was discussed on gnu.bash.bug at the beginning of February 2007. (the same thread's on bug-ncurses). minor correction - most of the thread's in April 2007. -- Thomas E. Dickey http://invisible-island.net ftp://invisible-island.net
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
... I want a reminder, say, seven days before and then a repeating reminder until I tell the reminder program I have done what it's reminding me about. iCal can do this. Mark an entry as a TODO, and it will keep coming back every day until checked off as done. POSIX, or MacOSX-specific? Certainly not MacOSX-specific, since I'm running it on Red Hat 9 Linux here at the office and I also run it on FreeBSD at home. I have no idea what, if anything, POSIX may have to say about the matter. There may be more than one calendar application claiming the same name. This one was written in Tcl/Tk by Sanjay Ghemawat [EMAIL PROTECTED] and was somewhat of an orphan as long ago as Red Hat 6.2 (which is where I first found it). BTW the FVWM list (and I think most other open-source help lists) prefers to keep discussions on the list, so that others who may have the same question, currently or when searching the archives in the future, can also find the answer.
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
On Mon, May 05, 2008 at 01:48:53PM -0700, Perry Hutchison wrote: ... I want a reminder, say, seven days before and then a repeating reminder until I tell the reminder program I have done what it's reminding me about. iCal can do this. Mark an entry as a TODO, and it will keep coming back every day until checked off as done. POSIX, or MacOSX-specific? Certainly not MacOSX-specific, since I'm running it on Red Hat 9 Linux here at the office and I also run it on FreeBSD at home. I have no idea what, if anything, POSIX may have to say about the matter. There may be more than one calendar application claiming the same name. This one was written in Tcl/Tk by Sanjay Ghemawat [EMAIL PROTECTED] and was somewhat of an orphan as long ago as Red Hat 6.2 (which is where I first found it). BTW the FVWM list (and I think most other open-source help lists) prefers to keep discussions on the list, so that others who may have the same question, currently or when searching the archives in the future, can also find the answer. I'm the OP, I searched for iCal with Google and there are indeed two iCals, one is the well known (and current) Apple iCal and the other is the one referred to above which has been a bit of an orphan for a while but does have a few people working on it. Re my original question I have found that ReminderFox now has the ability I want - it'll keep reminding me about an upcoming regular event until I mark it as complete but will still remind me again the next time the event becomes due. So I'll probably stay with ReminderFox. -- Chris Green
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
On Mon, 5 May 2008, Perry Hutchison wrote: ... I want a reminder, say, seven days before and then a repeating reminder until I tell the reminder program I have done what it's reminding me about. iCal can do this. Mark an entry as a TODO, and it will keep coming back every day until checked off as done. POSIX, or MacOSX-specific? Certainly not MacOSX-specific, since I'm running it on Red Hat 9 Linux here at the office and I also run it on FreeBSD at home. I have no idea what, if anything, POSIX may have to say about the matter. iwhatever is usually Apple. I'll readjust... There may be more than one calendar application claiming the same name. This one was written in Tcl/Tk by Sanjay Ghemawat [EMAIL PROTECTED] and was somewhat of an orphan as long ago as Red Hat 6.2 (which is where I first found it). Right, not this one then: http://www.apple.com/support/ical/ BTW the FVWM list (and I think most other open-source help lists) prefers to keep discussions on the list, so that others who may have the same question, currently or when searching the archives in the future, can also find the answer. Sorry, auto-typed the N response to Pine's Reply to all? question. I'll be more careful. Don't suppose you know a way to make it by default reply to the list when it's there, and to the sender only if it's not? -- -eben [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://royalty.mine.nu:81 It can be shown that for any nutty theory, beyond-the-fringe political view or strange religion there exists a proponent on the Net. The proof is left as an exercise for your kill-file. -- Bertil Jonell
Re: FVWM: I want to send in a question about something, and the mail registration system completely weirds me out.
I'm behind a corporate Exchange Server which seems to have changed recently to converting everything it sees to HTML. How embarrassing. I'm also behind a corporate Exchange Server, which I access using fetchmail (via ssl/imap) for incoming and nail (via smtp) for outgoing. It does not currently convert anything, but I seem to recall having had a similar problem a few years ago, following an upgrade. It can be fixed, provided the server administrators are sufficiently motivated, but I have no clue what they had to do to get it to behave itself.
Re: FVWM: I want to send in a question about something, and the mail registration system completely weirds me out.
-Original Message- From: Perry Hutchison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Espen, Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: fvwm@fvwm.org I'm behind a corporate Exchange Server which seems to have changed recently to converting everything it sees to HTML. How embarrassing. I'm also behind a corporate Exchange Server, which I access using fetchmail (via ssl/imap) for incoming and nail (via smtp) for outgoing. It does not currently convert anything, but I seem to recall having had a similar problem a few years ago, following an upgrade. It can be fixed, provided the server administrators are sufficiently motivated, but I have no clue what they had to do to get it to behave itself. I was using fetchmail until they cut off imap and pop. Now it's Perl via OWA/WEBDAV. I'm sure our administrators are motivated. Just not in the way I'd like.
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
I searched for iCal with Google and there are indeed two iCals, one is the well known (and current) Apple iCal and the other is the one referred to above which has been a bit of an orphan for a while but does have a few people working on it. I can't get tcl/tk(/c) ical to compile run anymore, so ive partially created a pure tcl that's .calendar/user.tcl compatible. Presently, it can display most of .calendar but not alter it.
Re: FVWM: Alarm/calendar applications that work well in fvwm?
I can't get tcl/tk(/c) ical to compile run anymore ... [This is getting OT for FVWM, but I'm not aware of a support list for Sanjay Ghemawat's ical.] Which OS/version are you using? It works for me on Red Hat 9, RHEL4 (with a bit of tweaking), and FreeBSD 6.1. I haven't tried it on FreeBSD 7.0 yet.
FVWM: Shape regression in 2.5.25
Hi All, I just updated to fvwm-2.5.25 this morning, and I find that my oclock window gets 'messed up': oclock -transparent -geometry 75x75-0+150 -fg '#202040' -bd '#202040' Then leave it running for a little bit (say 20 mins). After this the hands aren't visible clearly anymore! Needless to say I had oclock running for weeks on 2.5.23 with no problems. I'm using xorg-server-1.4.0.90 on Gentoo (if that makes any difference), Thanks in advance, GI -- Linux *is* user-friendly. It's just not ignoramus-friendly or idiot-friendly. pgpV70qQXp0KC.pgp Description: PGP signature
