Re: Re.: eBay PowerBooks

[Illovox Media]

on 7/15/03 8:51 AM, macnifico at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> So, yes, they do investigate, although they are so swamped with work
> that most of the time they are unable to write back.

Investigations "swamped with work..."  That says it all.

R


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Re: Ebay Powerbooks

[Bruce Johnson]

Joaquim Carvalho wrote:

I did find half a dozen or so that seemed suspicious, but as someone 
pointed out, requesting escrow is a sure way to weed out someone who 
doesn't intend to send you the product.


Many honest sellers do not accept Escrow.
Too bad, those are honest sellers I won't deal with. I'd rather it be 
their loss than mine. Caveat Emptor.

ALMOST ALL GOOD DEALS for NEWER Powerbooks are scams. The ones that are
not have prices close to the ones you find in a retail shop.
These are not 'good' deals...they're 'unbelievable' deals.

'Too good to be true' deals.

'Good deals' are a refurbished iBook at Smalldog for $200 less than 
retail, or a 1-year old powerbook sold for $350 less by a now-starving 
recent graduate.

Good deals are not a 17" powerbook for $2000...

Like any con since the time Ogg was conned out of extra rocks by Igg the 
con-caveman, the inherent greed of the mark is their downfall and the 
con-man's profit.

Just think.

People are successfully selling powerbooks at or near retail 
prices...why would this person wish to sell to you at such an enormous 
discount?

If these were legitimate sales, this person could ask, for example, 
$2800 or $3000 for a new 17" Powerbook instead of $2000 and make nearly 
$1000 more!

No, the point of these people asking such a low price is to engage your 
greed to the detriment of your brain, to satisfy that ages-old human 
impulse to get something for nothing, to get 'lucky' for once.

To produce that flood of adrenaline we get when we think we're going to 
get such a good deal that we're blinded and don't look at it rationally.

Like, you know, maybe *this time* that gentleman in Nigeria really does 
have $48 million in his bank he wishes to move discreetly out of the 
country.

(I have read accounts of people who got swindled in these Nigerian scams 
where they actually say "I knew these were a scam, but it was such a lot 
of money, I was willing to take a chance on it being real this time."

'Take a chance'...think about it, as if it were a gamble they could win.)

It's the same ingrained instinct that produces gambling as a universal 
feature in human cultures...we all do it, and until it's not ingrained 
anymore, con artists will flourish.

--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs



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Re: Ebay Powerbooks

[Joaquim Carvalho]

On Tue, 2003-07-15 at 13:59, Steve Kidd wrote:

> But with all this chatter about how most of the Powerbooks on Ebay are 
> scams, I decided to take a look for myself. After reviewing more than 
> 100 Powerbook listings, I've found four that were obvious scams.

The real problem are the non obvious ones...

> I did find half a dozen or so that seemed suspicious, but as someone 
> pointed out, requesting escrow is a sure way to weed out someone who 
> doesn't intend to send you the product.

Many honest sellers do not accept Escrow.

>  I, for one, don't have any 
> problems with paying escrow fees when I'm sending $2,000 to someone I 
> don't know in a foreign country (That would be the US for me).

Same for me.

> But by and large, the vast majority were people who seemed to be making 
> honest transactions. One guy even suggested that you drop by to pick up 
> the machine, if you felt unsure.
>  The really sad thing that I did notice 
> though, was people bidding up the price on auctions so high that they 
> might as well buy at a retail used/refurbished store. Foolish.

I'll be more precise then:

ALMOST ALL GOOD DEALS for NEWER Powerbooks are scams. The ones that are
not have prices close to the ones you find in a retail shop.

Joaquim


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Re. : eBay PowerBooks

[macnifico]

==0

The really sad thing that I did notice 
though, was people bidding up the price on auctions so high that they 
might as well buy at a retail used/refurbished store. Foolish.

Cheers - Steve K

===0

Steve:

Some of us live where there are no Apple Stores, no Macs at all, in fact.
So "retail used/refurbished" is a reasonable price to pay when you are 
in Wintel territory, as I am.
But the Mac OS is so easy to use, that I've been able to sell dozens of 
Mac PB's easily, and made a few MacAddicts along the way.
Best regards.
Hugo Diaz
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Living in Reynosa, Tamaulipas, Mexico.

--

"The only thing we knew for sure about Henry Porter is that his name
wasn't Henry Porter"
Bob Dylan, "Brownsville Girl"


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Re.: eBay PowerBooks

[macnifico]

==0

I contacted ebay fraud office and told them about these scams but they have
done nothing. Best of luck.
Chris

==0

Recently I got one of those scam e-mails.

Dear sir, i saw that you bidd on Apple iBook 900MHz and i want to offer you the same one for a lower price of 580$.Check my feedback for seriosity (id: ladxxx).If you are interesed mail me on [EMAIL PROTECTED](Names changed to protect the innocent)

I reported it to eBay after checking that the "seller" had a great 
record of selling dolls and "bric-a-brac", low-cost items, and finding 
the spelling was like a 14 year old using big words, or a foreigner that 
doesn't write English very well. (This was for an Apple 900MHZ PB).
Although eBay clearly states that the investigations are confidential 
and you may not receive any more e-mails from them,

eBay's SafeHarbor Department usually reviews all reports of spam within 
24 hours. Please keep in mind that the action taken based on your report
is confidential.  For privacy reasons, we will not be able to keep you 
informed of any developments; however, we pledge to quickly examine your
report and apply our guidelines fairly.



in this particular case I received this e-mail, which I quote:

Hello,

The recent email sent from this account was the result of an 
unauthorized account takeover. The password was guessed or discovered 
and then used to send email like the message you received. 
Unfortunately, we were not made aware of this activity until after the 
email had been sent. We are now in the process of getting the account 
restored to its true owner.

Let me suggest a few ways this takeover could have occurred.

First, if the user had a relatively simple password or password hint 

So, yes, they do investigate, although they are so swamped with work 
that most of the time they are unable to write back.

As I said before, being a member since '96, and having successfully 
completed more than a 900 transactions, I have found that the Mac crowd 
there is like the Mac crowd here: Honest and helpful. Of course, 
whenever an item goes above $400, I insist in an escrow service, and I 
have been following Chris tips for years.

Best regards.
Hugo Diaz
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
macnifico at eBay (535 positive feedback)
--

"The only thing we knew for sure about Henry Porter is that his name
wasn't Henry Porter"
Bob Dylan, "Brownsville Girl"


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Re: Ebay powerbooks

[Malcolm Cornelius]

> 3. suggest you will pay in cash and collect the item (again even if you
> don't intend to, this will flush out the fraudsters who will immediately say
> it is not possible. You can do this even if the item is overseas by saying
> something like "I will be in your country on a business trip next week could
> I drop by and collect it...")

I can't believe that anyone in UK WOULDN'T do this for anything of any
serious value - there's nowhere much more than a few hours travelling away
after all, unless you live in Cornwall and buy from someone in Scotland I
suppose !

I see complaints about this all the time and wonder how many people send
1000 GBP plus to someone they've never met via a classified ad in the
newspaper ?  Not many - so why should EBay be treated any differently ?

Btw I wouldn't ever accept escrow as several friend have been ripped off by
bad buyers using escrow.

One thing that few people have mentioned is contacting the local trading
standards - I had a suspect auction on Freeserve and they were very helpful.

Best wishes

Malcolm Cornelius - The Powerbook Fanatic
www.pbfanatic.co.uk

MSN Messenger - [EMAIL PROTECTED]  ICQ - 47738640


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Re: Ebay Powerbooks

[Steve Kidd]

On Tuesday, July 15, 2003, at 03:50 AM, Illovox Media wrote:

Well, Ryan, that's four accounts to the negative as well as positive.  
And I
can report a 1400 I bought out of CA had a past police are interested
in...hard fact.  EBAY did nothing.  NOTHING.  In fact, neither did the
police...
If you're keeping count, you can add me to the positive side. I've been 
buying and selling on Ebay since early on, and I've only had one bad 
experience, and that was with a buyer. Ebay dealt with him promptly 
after I complained about him.

But with all this chatter about how most of the Powerbooks on Ebay are 
scams, I decided to take a look for myself. After reviewing more than 
100 Powerbook listings, I've found four that were obvious scams. One 
gentleman even offered to include the latest version of Windows XP - if 
that's not a clear indicator, I don't know what would be.

I did find half a dozen or so that seemed suspicious, but as someone 
pointed out, requesting escrow is a sure way to weed out someone who 
doesn't intend to send you the product. I, for one, don't have any 
problems with paying escrow fees when I'm sending $2,000 to someone I 
don't know in a foreign country (That would be the US for me).

But by and large, the vast majority were people who seemed to be making 
honest transactions. One guy even suggested that you drop by to pick up 
the machine, if you felt unsure. The really sad thing that I did notice 
though, was people bidding up the price on auctions so high that they 
might as well buy at a retail used/refurbished store. Foolish.

Cheers - Steve K.

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Re: Ebay Powerbooks

[Illovox Media]

Well, Ryan, that's four accounts to the negative as well as positive.  And I
can report a 1400 I bought out of CA had a past police are interested
in...hard fact.  EBAY did nothing.  NOTHING.  In fact, neither did the
police...

on 7/15/03 3:00 AM, Tom Burke at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I would have to agree with Chris. I reported the 'Buy Information...'
> items to ebay UK, and they didn't seem to be too bothered. Although I
> would concede that in those cases, the item description is strictly
> correct and no ostensible fraud is taking place.
> 
> Like many others I've bought a number of items from ebay UK, including
> 3 powerbooks (2 Lombards & 1 Pismo) and a PowerMac G4 ( in the last 18
> months my family have switched almost completely to macs, though only
> to s/hand ones) and all my rtransactions have gone well. The only issue
> I've had with ebay Macs has occurred recently - Derbyshire constabulary
> took a statement from me about the Powermac which I bought last
> November, and examined it & took serial numbers. So that one may have a
> murky past.
> 
> Tom Burke


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Re: Ebay powerbooks

[Illovox Media]

Ya see, Ryan?  That's two of us now seeing the same thing.  So you've had
groovy experiences there.  So have I.  Doesn't mean crooks aren't all over
the thing.

Why do you think the DOJ is investigating?

on 7/15/03 12:12 AM, Christopher Hack at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

> I have bought several powerbooks on ebay from here in the UK. There is a big
> scam (certainly with ebay in the UK ) where people list big ticket items
> including PowerBooks, and then offer to sell them outside the auction with
> lines in the advert like "contact me to buy this". Many of these seem to
> have a lot of positive feedback, but I have discovered they have either
> stolen someone else's ID (and you can identify this because you will find
> not much recent feedback), or they build up a feedback profile  by buying
> many cheap items.
> The giveaway sign seem to be no pictures of the actual powerbook - just
> pictures from the brochure.
> I would recommend:
> 1. contacting the seller and asking for a serial number and recent photos of
> the item
> 2. asking if they are prepared to use escrow (even if you don't plan to use
> it), I have found the fraudsters always find some reason why they cannot
> accept escrow.
> 3. suggest you will pay in cash and collect the item (again even if you
> don't intend to, this will flush out the fraudsters who will immediately say
> it is not possible. You can do this even if the item is overseas by saying
> something like "I will be in your country on a business trip next week could
> I drop by and collect it...")
> 
> I contacted ebay fraud office and told them about these scams but they have
> done nothing. Best of luck.
> 
> Chris
> 


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Re: Ebay Powerbooks

[Tom Burke]

On Tuesday, July 15, 2003, at 08:45 AM, G-Books wrote:

I would have to agree with Chris. I reported the 'Buy Information...' 
items to ebay UK, and they didn't seem to be too bothered. Although I 
would concede that in those cases, the item description is strictly 
correct and no ostensible fraud is taking place.

Like many others I've bought a number of items from ebay UK, including 
3 powerbooks (2 Lombards & 1 Pismo) and a PowerMac G4 ( in the last 18 
months my family have switched almost completely to macs, though only 
to s/hand ones) and all my rtransactions have gone well. The only issue 
I've had with ebay Macs has occurred recently - Derbyshire constabulary 
took a statement from me about the Powermac which I bought last 
November, and examined it & took serial numbers. So that one may have a 
murky past.

Tom Burke


Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2003 08:12:07 +0100
Subject: Ebay powerbooks
From: Christopher Hack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
In-Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
I have bought several powerbooks on ebay from here in the UK. There is 
a big
scam (certainly with ebay in the UK ) where people list big ticket 
items
including PowerBooks, and then offer to sell them outside the auction 
with
lines in the advert like "contact me to buy this". Many of these seem 
to
have a lot of positive feedback, but I have discovered they have either
stolen someone else's ID (and you can identify this because you will 
find
not much recent feedback), or they build up a feedback profile  by 
buying
many cheap items.
The giveaway sign seem to be no pictures of the actual powerbook - just
pictures from the brochure.
I would recommend:
1. contacting the seller and asking for a serial number and recent 
photos of
the item
2. asking if they are prepared to use escrow (even if you don't plan 
to use
it), I have found the fraudsters always find some reason why they 
cannot
accept escrow.
3. suggest you will pay in cash and collect the item (again even if you
don't intend to, this will flush out the fraudsters who will 
immediately say
it is not possible. You can do this even if the item is overseas by 
saying
something like "I will be in your country on a business trip next week 
could
I drop by and collect it...")

I contacted ebay fraud office and told them about these scams but they 
have
done nothing. Best of luck.

Chris


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Ebay powerbooks

[Christopher Hack]

I have bought several powerbooks on ebay from here in the UK. There is a big
scam (certainly with ebay in the UK ) where people list big ticket items
including PowerBooks, and then offer to sell them outside the auction with
lines in the advert like "contact me to buy this". Many of these seem to
have a lot of positive feedback, but I have discovered they have either
stolen someone else's ID (and you can identify this because you will find
not much recent feedback), or they build up a feedback profile  by buying
many cheap items. 
The giveaway sign seem to be no pictures of the actual powerbook - just
pictures from the brochure.
I would recommend:
1. contacting the seller and asking for a serial number and recent photos of
the item
2. asking if they are prepared to use escrow (even if you don't plan to use
it), I have found the fraudsters always find some reason why they cannot
accept escrow.
3. suggest you will pay in cash and collect the item (again even if you
don't intend to, this will flush out the fraudsters who will immediately say
it is not possible. You can do this even if the item is overseas by saying
something like "I will be in your country on a business trip next week could
I drop by and collect it...")

I contacted ebay fraud office and told them about these scams but they have
done nothing. Best of luck.

Chris


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