Re: [Audyssey] Windows 7 and compatibility
Just tested winfrotz TTS on my windows 7 work machine, and it seems alright, along with the new MS Anna voice, so while still haven't figured out how come it won't work on my windows XP machines, no matter what I try, it does seem to work on my windows 7 machine. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message - From: "dark" To: Sent: Friday, January 01, 2010 1:09 PM Subject: [Audyssey] Windows 7 and compatibility Hi. well, as it looks like the netbook business will be problematic, I might considder a slimline laptop instead, however I'm concerned about program compatibility. Most audio games I've heard will run under windows 7, so that isn't a problem, niether will brouser based games be incompatible. however I'm concerned about the older If type stuff. will win frotz and wintads work under 7? and how about Dos console style programs such as fallthru, Eamon delux or world of legends? any thoughts would be much appreciated. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4735 (20100101) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4740 (20100103) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hello, The business, productivity, and AT programs which I have alpha and beta tested were typically in the multi-hundred to few thousand dollar range. For these products, beta testing has always been quite intensive; usually lasting at least six months and requiring considerable time commitments. In many cases, we use the solution on our business machines to give it real-world challenges. Whenever bugs crop up, we file detailed reports on how to specifically reproduce the bugs. When bugs are intermittent, we dig for them while still using the software normally. In other words, one of the things we do is try to crash the programs and report exactly on how we caused the crashes. I have done this through a private business, while working for a university, and as a private consumer. In all cases, this is what private alpha and beta testing consists of, and the developers always get their money's worth for the software. If we charged, it would cost significantly more for the service (the company which trained me now only alpha and beta tests for large corporations and charges for their services). It was in the late 90's when I worked with them and was taught. I never became as intense as they are, but I always use the principles they taught me. David Chittenden, MSc, CRC, MRCAA Email: dchitten...@gmail.com Philip Bennefall wrote: Hi David and Dark, I also think that the final price of the product has an impact on this decision. What you are essentially doing is paying the beta testers for their work, and so let's say that the game will sell for 25 or 30 dollars then that's probably a reasonable amount to give in return for testing which in turn would most certainly warrent a free copy. If, however, the game or product sells for $150 then I would argue that a free copy is too much payment in most cases. If the testers spend a year running the program over and over again then it probably is not, but in most cases I'd say that it is and then a price reduction would be in order instead. In short, one has to decide what one as a developer considers to be a reasonable amount to pay for testing and if this covers the cost of the game, give it out for free and if it does not cover it, give a reduction. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: "dark" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 12:25 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing No problem David. Like everything else, it's up to the developer, I was just pointing out that it was not a necessary condition of private testing that the developer has to give away 5 or 10 coppies of the game for free. It does seem reasonable with business software and the like, --- sinse A, the markit can stand it and B, the testing process itself wouldn't necessarily be enjoyable to the tester. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.431 / Virus Database: 270.14.124/2596 - Release Date: 01/01/10 09:20:00 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Netbooks and games
well I have no issue with hackentosh stuff being unsupported its not exactly using apple hardware really. At 11:03 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >There objection to the hackintosh is "We won't support it, or update it. you >will also be black listed for apple products. if you even ask them to go near >it.". So they rest easy on that note. >Now for windows running under or on mac hardware. It runs better then under pc >proven fact. > >At 01:41 PM 1/3/2010, you wrote: >>I heard about that. >>apple made a bit of fuss a bit late in the game to say they were not happy >>about it but it didn't stay up there for long, and my guess is they were >>annoyed enough to put up a small objection but not to much really. >>At 01:35 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >>>Just to clear a few things up. >>>With boot camp your second op is not running in virtual mode. It is running >>>under full system resources. So on the new mac's it would be like a regular >>>pc. >>>Now if you want the best of both worlds and ops. You can run them together >>>with the second op in the virtual world with either fusion or virtual box. >>>That lets them run side by side sharing resources. >>>Now we also have a third option with peroral for mac. it lets you install >>>and run the pc software under the mac op. The only bust here is not all >>>software will run that way but a lot will. >>>With this new mac op you can even install it on a pc. They call them >>>hackintoshes. >>>At 04:39 AM 1/3/2010, you wrote: Hi Shaun, These days with software like Boot Camp that's not altogether true. There are ways of having the best of both worlds. It is just that many Windows users don't know about them so they are afraid to invest in a Mac or Linux system believing as you do that they have to give up all their Windows games and favorite applications to go Mac or Linux. While it is certainly true the majority of software is specifically designed for Windows with the availability of virtual machines that is more an annoyance than a serious problem for a Mac or Linux user. For example, if you were to purchase a brand new Intel based MacBook with Mac OS 10.6you would get the standard Mac OS operating system complete with the VoiceOver screen reader, ITunes media player, Safari web browser, and all the rest of the common Mac applications. If you then wanted your Windows applications you can install Windows XP on that machine via Boot Camp and run Windows XP as a virtual machine. That way you can keep all your games, and other important Windows software too. Running Windows under a virtual machine is a tad bit slower than running it natively of course, but it is the best solution available to us currently. The upside though is you can still use Mac OS as your primary operating system and boot into Windows to access stuff you would otherwise not be able to use. With Linux these days there are multiple solutions to choose from. If you wanted to try out the base operating system without formatting your hard drive you can run Ubuntu Linux directly off the cd. It runs slower, but it does allow someone to run Linux without making any changes to Windows. Other solutions involve installing it to a USB thumb drive and booting from that, or you can just stick the Ubuntu cd in your computer and do a quick and easy multiboot setup from Windows directly. You can use a third-party solution such as VM Ware which allows you to install Windows as a virtual machine under Linux. Either way you decide to do it you can easily run both while not giving up anything in the process. Bottom line, there are ways to run Windows along side your operating system of choice to have the best of both worlds. It need not be a one or the other situation. Cheers! shaun everiss wrote: >hmmm i would, but since most stuff is windows based I can't. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. >>> >>>Tim >>>trouble >>>Verizon FIOS support tech >>>"Never offend people with style when you can offend them with substance." >>>--Sam Brown >>> >>>Blindeudora list owner. >>>To subscribe or info: http://www.freelists.org/webpage/blindeudora >>> >>> >>>--- >>>Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >>>If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >>>gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >>>You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at
Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games.
I have both ten and eleven. I've tried them both with the same result. Nutrition Improve your career health. Click now to study nutrition! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/c?cp=7OsnQGkKrjZnardE2kVuZQAAJz2jaNpB6CPeiffPNfNRseoUAAYAAADNAAASQwA= --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Netbooks and games
There objection to the hackintosh is "We won't support it, or update it. you will also be black listed for apple products. if you even ask them to go near it.". So they rest easy on that note. Now for windows running under or on mac hardware. It runs better then under pc proven fact. At 01:41 PM 1/3/2010, you wrote: I heard about that. apple made a bit of fuss a bit late in the game to say they were not happy about it but it didn't stay up there for long, and my guess is they were annoyed enough to put up a small objection but not to much really. At 01:35 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >Just to clear a few things up. >With boot camp your second op is not running in virtual mode. It is running under full system resources. So on the new mac's it would be like a regular pc. >Now if you want the best of both worlds and ops. You can run them together with the second op in the virtual world with either fusion or virtual box. That lets them run side by side sharing resources. >Now we also have a third option with peroral for mac. it lets you install and run the pc software under the mac op. The only bust here is not all software will run that way but a lot will. >With this new mac op you can even install it on a pc. They call them hackintoshes. >At 04:39 AM 1/3/2010, you wrote: >>Hi Shaun, >>These days with software like Boot Camp that's not altogether true. There are ways of having the best of both worlds. It is just that many Windows users don't know about them so they are afraid to invest in a Mac or Linux system believing as you do that they have to give up all their Windows games and favorite applications to go Mac or Linux. While it is certainly true the majority of software is specifically designed for Windows with the availability of virtual machines that is more an annoyance than a serious problem for a Mac or Linux user. >>For example, if you were to purchase a brand new Intel based MacBook with Mac OS 10.6you would get the standard Mac OS operating system complete with the VoiceOver screen reader, ITunes media player, Safari web browser, and all the rest of the common Mac applications. If you then wanted your Windows applications you can install Windows XP on that machine via Boot Camp and run Windows XP as a virtual machine. That way you can keep all your games, and other important Windows software too. Running Windows under a virtual machine is a tad bit slower than running it natively of course, but it is the best solution available to us currently. The upside though is you can still use Mac OS as your primary operating system and boot into Windows to access stuff you would otherwise not be able to use. >>With Linux these days there are multiple solutions to choose from. If >>you wanted to try out the base operating system without formatting your hard drive you can run Ubuntu Linux directly off the cd. It runs slower, but it does allow someone to run Linux without making any changes to Windows. Other solutions involve installing it to a USB thumb drive and booting from that, or you can just stick the Ubuntu cd in your computer and do a quick and easy multiboot setup from Windows directly. You can use a third-party solution such as VM Ware which allows you to install Windows as a virtual machine under Linux. Either way you decide to do it you can easily run both while not giving up anything in the process. Bottom line, there are ways to run Windows along side your operating system of choice to have the best of both worlds. It need not be a one or the other situation. >> >>Cheers! >> >> >> >>shaun everiss wrote: >>>hmmm i would, but since most stuff is windows based I can't. >> >> >>--- >>Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >>If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >>You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >>If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >>please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > >Tim >trouble >Verizon FIOS support tech >"Never offend people with style when you can offend them with substance." >--Sam Brown > >Blindeudora list owner. >To subscribe or info: http://www.freelists.org/webpage/blindeudora > > >--- >Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the
Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games.
i myself have had problems like this, and i am running windows xp, have 3 gb cpu, 2 gb ram, and running jaws 10. i am not sure however if its jaws or the game beeing laggy, as i noticed it most when there were more people on lastnight. best regards dallas - Original Message - From: "Hayden Presley" To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 3:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games. Which version of JAWS do you have on your machine? -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Ryan Conroy Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 10:49 AM To: gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games. I'm running Windows XP, and I have a GIG and a half of ram. Criminal Lawyer Criminal Lawyers - Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/c?cp=uoE3V07xUnTjTqxa_R40VwAAJz2jaN pB6CPeiffPNfNRseoUAAYAAADNAAAiFgA= --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] successful downloading
Not able to be unzipped is not a reason for not being able to be downloaded that I'm aware of. --- In God we trust! - Original Message - From: "Shirley Starblanket" To: Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 6:51 AM Subject: [Audyssey] successful downloading Hey all. I was successful in downloading some games from Jim's website. I can't, however, download any from Draconus Entertainment. Probably because they don't unzip. Happy New Year! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
true. I do have my games I test but don't run them all the time. Actually right now its mid summer here. running games? I can test if I need to but it does not cool right down these days. At 04:06 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >Hi David and Dark, > >I also think that the final price of the product has an impact on this >decision. What you are essentially doing is paying the beta testers for their >work, and so let's say that the game will sell for 25 or 30 dollars then >that's probably a reasonable amount to give in return for testing which in >turn would most certainly warrent a free copy. If, however, the game or >product sells for $150 then I would argue that a free copy is too much payment >in most cases. If the testers spend a year running the program over and over >again then it probably is not, but in most cases I'd say that it is and then a >price reduction would be in order instead. > >In short, one has to decide what one as a developer considers to be a >reasonable amount to pay for testing and if this covers the cost of the game, >give it out for free and if it does not cover it, give a reduction. > >Kind regards, > >Philip Bennefall >- Original Message - From: "dark" >To: "Gamers Discussion list" >Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 12:25 PM >Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing > > >>No problem David. >> >>Like everything else, it's up to the developer, I was just pointing out that >>it was not a necessary condition of private testing that the developer has >>to give away 5 or 10 coppies of the game for free. >> >>It does seem reasonable with business software and the like, --- sinse A, >>the markit can stand it and B, the testing process itself wouldn't >>necessarily be enjoyable to the tester. >> >>Beware the grue! >> >>Dark. >> >> >>--- >>Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >>If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >>You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >>If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >>please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > > > > > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 8.5.431 / Virus Database: 270.14.124/2596 - Release Date: 01/01/10 >09:20:00 > > >--- >Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] question playstation
Hello Listers, I bought the MLB baseball game for playstation 2. How do you set it up and play it? it is the 2009 version. I remember when EA made the baseball game I still have the instructions some ware. Do you set it up the same way? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Michael Skype ID: Mikeameli Windows Live Messenger ID: mikeam...@earthlink.net e-mail mikeam...@earthlink.net "And so my fellow americans ask not! What your country can do for you? Ask! What you can do for your country" --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Netbooks and games
I heard about that. apple made a bit of fuss a bit late in the game to say they were not happy about it but it didn't stay up there for long, and my guess is they were annoyed enough to put up a small objection but not to much really. At 01:35 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >Just to clear a few things up. >With boot camp your second op is not running in virtual mode. It is running >under full system resources. So on the new mac's it would be like a regular pc. >Now if you want the best of both worlds and ops. You can run them together >with the second op in the virtual world with either fusion or virtual box. >That lets them run side by side sharing resources. >Now we also have a third option with peroral for mac. it lets you install and >run the pc software under the mac op. The only bust here is not all software >will run that way but a lot will. >With this new mac op you can even install it on a pc. They call them >hackintoshes. >At 04:39 AM 1/3/2010, you wrote: >>Hi Shaun, >>These days with software like Boot Camp that's not altogether true. There are >>ways of having the best of both worlds. It is just that many Windows users >>don't know about them so they are afraid to invest in a Mac or Linux system >>believing as you do that they have to give up all their Windows games and >>favorite applications to go Mac or Linux. While it is certainly true the >>majority of software is specifically designed for Windows with the >>availability of virtual machines that is more an annoyance than a serious >>problem for a Mac or Linux user. >>For example, if you were to purchase a brand new Intel based MacBook with Mac >>OS 10.6you would get the standard Mac OS operating system complete with the >>VoiceOver screen reader, ITunes media player, Safari web browser, and all the >>rest of the common Mac applications. If you then wanted your Windows >>applications you can install Windows XP on that machine via Boot Camp and run >>Windows XP as a virtual machine. That way you can keep all your games, and >>other important Windows software too. Running Windows under a virtual machine >>is a tad bit slower than running it natively of course, but it is the best >>solution available to us currently. The upside though is you can still use >>Mac OS as your primary operating system and boot into Windows to access >>stuff you would otherwise not be able to use. >>With Linux these days there are multiple solutions to choose from. If >>you wanted to try out the base operating system without formatting your hard >>drive you can run Ubuntu Linux directly off the cd. It runs slower, but it >>does allow someone to run Linux without making any changes to Windows. Other >>solutions involve installing it to a USB thumb drive and booting from that, >>or you can just stick the Ubuntu cd in your computer and do a quick and easy >>multiboot setup from Windows directly. You can use a third-party solution >>such as VM Ware which allows you to install Windows as a virtual machine >>under Linux. Either way you decide to do it you can easily run both while not >>giving up anything in the process. Bottom line, there are ways to run Windows >>along side your operating system of choice to have the best of both worlds. >>It need not be a one or the other situation. >> >>Cheers! >> >> >> >>shaun everiss wrote: >>>hmmm i would, but since most stuff is windows based I can't. >> >> >>--- >>Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >>If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >>You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >>If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >>please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > >Tim >trouble >Verizon FIOS support tech >"Never offend people with style when you can offend them with substance." >--Sam Brown > >Blindeudora list owner. >To subscribe or info: http://www.freelists.org/webpage/blindeudora > > >--- >Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@a
Re: [Audyssey] The beta team
oh and by the way, like everyone else I read what I want and enter it if I can. I am in the line just like everyone else. I'd have liked to get in the test team for q9 but i at first didn't want to bother and then the team filled up. You should also know that testing is not the be all, end all. there may be gaps betwene projects, or they may be stopped canciled and cued. Its like the video game project with jaffar. As far as I know its in coding so I am in the cue. What do I have to lose? Well posting my picture and some info potentually to the net. Ok no big deal in the scheme of things, its not like I have had to send my credit card number. Just know that its not as rosy as you may think, its good while it lasts but you need to wait for these sorts of things. At 12:13 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >Hello all > >One big problem I want to menzion here is, that I and my friend tryed to get >into a beta-team. >We couldn't enter, and we didn't receive an ansver about it. >That's a problem in my eyes, because we were interested in testing it, and >so I think the minimum would be to get an ansver from the developer saying >that the team is already created. >I don't know, but I feel that sometimes some people can come easily into the >team, and others are trying and trying and couldn't do it. >. > >So I think that nobody should be prefered. >Everyone should have the possibility to enter the team. > >Regards >Claudio > > >--- >Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] The beta team
well I currently don't have much in the way of an offline carrier. I have always liked to test and such and try to get into every project. These game projects are good things and I will continue to do them however these are not usually earning me cash. Yes free games are all well and good but its not earning me cash. I eventually want to try for one of the main screen reader dev test teams. since thats where most of the stuff is or some major big project or something. Maybe some support work. I'll always find time for this sort of stuff though. At 12:13 a.m. 4/01/2010, you wrote: >Hello all > >One big problem I want to menzion here is, that I and my friend tryed to get >into a beta-team. >We couldn't enter, and we didn't receive an ansver about it. >That's a problem in my eyes, because we were interested in testing it, and >so I think the minimum would be to get an ansver from the developer saying >that the team is already created. >I don't know, but I feel that sometimes some people can come easily into the >team, and others are trying and trying and couldn't do it. >. > >So I think that nobody should be prefered. >Everyone should have the possibility to enter the team. > >Regards >Claudio > > >--- >Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. >If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, >please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games.
Which version of JAWS do you have on your machine? -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Ryan Conroy Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 10:49 AM To: gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games. I'm running Windows XP, and I have a GIG and a half of ram. Criminal Lawyer Criminal Lawyers - Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/c?cp=uoE3V07xUnTjTqxa_R40VwAAJz2jaN pB6CPeiffPNfNRseoUAAYAAADNAAAiFgA= --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] successful downloading
What do you mean, they don't unzip? There standard setup packages in the form of exe files. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Shirley Starblanket Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 10:51 AM To: gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] successful downloading Hey all. I was successful in downloading some games from Jim's website. I can't, however, download any from Draconus Entertainment. Probably because they don't unzip. Happy New Year! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] successful downloading
Hey all. I was successful in downloading some games from Jim's website. I can't, however, download any from Draconus Entertainment. Probably because they don't unzip. Happy New Year! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Question on Monopoly from RS games.
I'm running Windows XP, and I have a GIG and a half of ram. Criminal Lawyer Criminal Lawyers - Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/c?cp=uoE3V07xUnTjTqxa_R40VwAAJz2jaNpB6CPeiffPNfNRseoUAAYAAADNAAAiFgA= --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] About Sarah
I must say I look forward to playing this new Sarah. I just got a new pc, so I just look forward to playing all of the GMA Game engine games, once I get my key replacements. - Original Message - From: "Phil Vlasak" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Abour Sarah Hi Ryan, It is hard to predict when testing is finished. I am going through the new features in the Sarah game and making sure they all work as expected. Then I will be sending the beta to a limited group of people. If after a while, and no major bugs are found, then I release it to the public. I have been discussing the items I am adding on my PCS games list, so those people know a lot more of what to expect. Sorry I can't be more definite but bugs can take from a minute to a day to fix. Smiles, Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi David and Dark, I also think that the final price of the product has an impact on this decision. What you are essentially doing is paying the beta testers for their work, and so let's say that the game will sell for 25 or 30 dollars then that's probably a reasonable amount to give in return for testing which in turn would most certainly warrent a free copy. If, however, the game or product sells for $150 then I would argue that a free copy is too much payment in most cases. If the testers spend a year running the program over and over again then it probably is not, but in most cases I'd say that it is and then a price reduction would be in order instead. In short, one has to decide what one as a developer considers to be a reasonable amount to pay for testing and if this covers the cost of the game, give it out for free and if it does not cover it, give a reduction. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: "dark" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 12:25 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing No problem David. Like everything else, it's up to the developer, I was just pointing out that it was not a necessary condition of private testing that the developer has to give away 5 or 10 coppies of the game for free. It does seem reasonable with business software and the like, --- sinse A, the markit can stand it and B, the testing process itself wouldn't necessarily be enjoyable to the tester. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.431 / Virus Database: 270.14.124/2596 - Release Date: 01/01/10 09:20:00 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] The beta team
Hi Willem, Claudio and others, This is very true. While a beta applicant may feel that his or her own application should warrent an immediate inclusion in the team, this may not always be the case and what one has to consider is, while the applicant has only their own application to worry about in this case the developer may have 40. In the case of Bgt, for example, I received many excellent applications and yet I had to accept some and reject some. I was not able to respond personally to everyone, or I would still be doing it to this day. This is not showing any disrespect on my part, as I did post a message saying that the beta application submissions were now closed and that those who were chosen would be contacted within one or two days. This, I think, is all that I could really do while still keeping things practical. Kind regards, Philip Bennefall - Original Message - From: "Willem" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 3:03 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] The beta team Hi Claudio and Milos. A private team usually has a limmited number of testers and I am sure every one who applied for a beta team didn't get in at some point. Sometimes the developer posts a news item on their website or on this list, but personally replying to each respondant isn't practical. Some people also want to have reasons why they are not on the team, arguing with the developer, when all that happens is that the team is full. Remember that you don't have any right to the game and the developer has no obligation to anyone, especially with a beta. - Original Message - From: "Claudio Zeni" To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 1:13 PM Subject: [Audyssey] The beta team Hello all One big problem I want to menzion here is, that I and my friend tryed to get into a beta-team. We couldn't enter, and we didn't receive an ansver about it. That's a problem in my eyes, because we were interested in testing it, and so I think the minimum would be to get an ansver from the developer saying that the team is already created. I don't know, but I feel that sometimes some people can come easily into the team, and others are trying and trying and couldn't do it. . So I think that nobody should be prefered. Everyone should have the possibility to enter the team. Regards Claudio --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.431 / Virus Database: 270.14.124/2596 - Release Date: 01/01/10 09:20:00 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] The beta team
Hi Claudio and Milos. A private team usually has a limmited number of testers and I am sure every one who applied for a beta team didn't get in at some point. Sometimes the developer posts a news item on their website or on this list, but personally replying to each respondant isn't practical. Some people also want to have reasons why they are not on the team, arguing with the developer, when all that happens is that the team is full. Remember that you don't have any right to the game and the developer has no obligation to anyone, especially with a beta. - Original Message - From: "Claudio Zeni" To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 1:13 PM Subject: [Audyssey] The beta team Hello all One big problem I want to menzion here is, that I and my friend tryed to get into a beta-team. We couldn't enter, and we didn't receive an ansver about it. That's a problem in my eyes, because we were interested in testing it, and so I think the minimum would be to get an ansver from the developer saying that the team is already created. I don't know, but I feel that sometimes some people can come easily into the team, and others are trying and trying and couldn't do it. . So I think that nobody should be prefered. Everyone should have the possibility to enter the team. Regards Claudio --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] The beta team
Yes, I was having the same situation. I was not among the testers, don't know why, and didn't receive the answer about the thing. Milos Przic msn: milos.pr...@gmail.com skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: "Claudio Zeni" To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 12:13 PM Subject: [Audyssey] The beta team Hello all One big problem I want to menzion here is, that I and my friend tryed to get into a beta-team. We couldn't enter, and we didn't receive an ansver about it. That's a problem in my eyes, because we were interested in testing it, and so I think the minimum would be to get an ansver from the developer saying that the team is already created. I don't know, but I feel that sometimes some people can come easily into the team, and others are trying and trying and couldn't do it. . So I think that nobody should be prefered. Everyone should have the possibility to enter the team. Regards Claudio --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4738 (20100102) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4738 (20100102) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Abour Sarah
Hi Ryan, It is hard to predict when testing is finished. I am going through the new features in the Sarah game and making sure they all work as expected. Then I will be sending the beta to a limited group of people. If after a while, and no major bugs are found, then I release it to the public. I have been discussing the items I am adding on my PCS games list, so those people know a lot more of what to expect. Sorry I can't be more definite but bugs can take from a minute to a day to fix. Smiles, Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Netbooks and games
Just to clear a few things up. With boot camp your second op is not running in virtual mode. It is running under full system resources. So on the new mac's it would be like a regular pc. Now if you want the best of both worlds and ops. You can run them together with the second op in the virtual world with either fusion or virtual box. That lets them run side by side sharing resources. Now we also have a third option with peroral for mac. it lets you install and run the pc software under the mac op. The only bust here is not all software will run that way but a lot will. With this new mac op you can even install it on a pc. They call them hackintoshes. At 04:39 AM 1/3/2010, you wrote: Hi Shaun, These days with software like Boot Camp that's not altogether true. There are ways of having the best of both worlds. It is just that many Windows users don't know about them so they are afraid to invest in a Mac or Linux system believing as you do that they have to give up all their Windows games and favorite applications to go Mac or Linux. While it is certainly true the majority of software is specifically designed for Windows with the availability of virtual machines that is more an annoyance than a serious problem for a Mac or Linux user. For example, if you were to purchase a brand new Intel based MacBook with Mac OS 10.6you would get the standard Mac OS operating system complete with the VoiceOver screen reader, ITunes media player, Safari web browser, and all the rest of the common Mac applications. If you then wanted your Windows applications you can install Windows XP on that machine via Boot Camp and run Windows XP as a virtual machine. That way you can keep all your games, and other important Windows software too. Running Windows under a virtual machine is a tad bit slower than running it natively of course, but it is the best solution available to us currently. The upside though is you can still use Mac OS as your primary operating system and boot into Windows to access stuff you would otherwise not be able to use. With Linux these days there are multiple solutions to choose from. If you wanted to try out the base operating system without formatting your hard drive you can run Ubuntu Linux directly off the cd. It runs slower, but it does allow someone to run Linux without making any changes to Windows. Other solutions involve installing it to a USB thumb drive and booting from that, or you can just stick the Ubuntu cd in your computer and do a quick and easy multiboot setup from Windows directly. You can use a third-party solution such as VM Ware which allows you to install Windows as a virtual machine under Linux. Either way you decide to do it you can easily run both while not giving up anything in the process. Bottom line, there are ways to run Windows along side your operating system of choice to have the best of both worlds. It need not be a one or the other situation. Cheers! shaun everiss wrote: hmmm i would, but since most stuff is windows based I can't. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. Tim trouble Verizon FIOS support tech "Never offend people with style when you can offend them with substance." --Sam Brown Blindeudora list owner. To subscribe or info: http://www.freelists.org/webpage/blindeudora --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi tom. I wasn't in anyway suggesting giving away public copies of the game. As has already been said, public copies should be restricted to demo content only, and for the purposes of testing the general running and mechanics of the game. If you've got a game which employs vastly different enemies and mechanics throughout, so that the last level is vastly different to the first, then indeed private testing does make sense as you will need people to play the private version. there are stil other options than giving away free coppies though such as reductions in price. # Essentially it just depends upon how complete your private beta is. Beware the grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Thomas Ward" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 10:41 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing Hi Dark, Actually, that is standard practice in the mainstream business world. One way a company gets private testers is by giving them a free product for their help, or give them a rather big discount so that he/she gets a good deal out of the testing process. Plus you can't really fully test a product unless you actually give them a fully working and registered product before final release to evaluate it. It is one thing to give say 10 people a fully functional product for free for testing purposes, and quite another to give everyone a free copy for testing purposes and then ask for money for it after testing is over. Many People will keep the test version you gave them and forgo paying for the 1.0 upgrade. So it isn't exactly financially feasible or realistic to give everyone a fully functional product and demand money for it after you determine testing is complete. So in a case like that it is better to give a private test team 10 copies of the full product to test, and sell it once the final product is determined to be ready for sale. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
I see the truth of all that Tom, however as you said yourself, i don't think Mota is a particularly typical testing process at all for games. Even apart from the pretty major money issue you mention, there was the fact that the original alchemy game had features x y z, that you then produced your own game which got shot down by the evil lawyers of doom, and now we're onto a third project under the same banner but essentially a different game. When i think of all the Monti and mota versions i've played, features have gone in and out like nobody's business due to all these changes. I think if Monti had just been firmly and squarely released as it should have been, all these shinanigans would've sorted themselves out. Hopefully any games Philip, yourself, or indeed anybody else developes in future will be free of all these swings and roundabouts. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi Munawar. that's true, however I stil don't think giving away the software is a mandatory requirement of private testing. I've certainly been in situations where getting a given private test build to work has taken some shinanigans, but I stil never particularly see this as a problem myself or requiring compensation, sinse I'll get a hopefully interesting game to play out of it. Beware the grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Munawar Bijani" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 4:08 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing Hi Dark, Private testing is more rigorous than public testing and requires a lot more time. You're testing prereleased software so at times you're the first test subject and may have to go through a lot just to get the software working. For this reason, I feel that private testers deserve some compensation, and since game development doesn't allow for monitary compensation until the project is released, giving them a free copy is the best way to go. If you only have a handful of testers, it's not much money you're losing; in fact, private testers help you since they often times put the program through paces you never thought of, which saves you from having to release several patches when the program is publicly released. Munawar A. Bijani blog: http://munawar0009.blogspot.com http://www.bpcprograms.com Follow on Twitter for blog updates: http://www.twitter.com/munawar0009 -- From: "dark" Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 8:20 PM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing I Disagree with david that just because you have a private testing team they should automatically get a copy of the software, especially in a field like accessible games where every sale helps. Testing is a way for non-programmers to contribute to accessible games developement, not a way to grab free coppies of the software, - especially as it's hoped the testing process will in itself be fun for the players (all the games testing programs I've been involved in certainly have been), in fact if the testing process isn't fun, then the developer certainly! has work to do, ;D. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi Munawar. Personally, i don't mind successive ptches at all, indeed the patches for entombed which A, fixed bugs, and B, redressed a good few balancing issues inherent in the first version of the game were a very good thing indeed. I'd have actually been slightly disappointed myself if the public beta was left as a buggy, unfair version of the game. though maybe this depends upon game type, sinse obviously an rpg has more statistics to muck about with and attempt to correctly balance than an action game. just a personal opinion again. Beware the grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Munawar Bijani" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 4:03 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing Hi, Public testing is good since it lets you test the game on a wide range of configurations. I've seen the best results when a build is privately tested first, and then when considered stable, released for public evaluation. This is the practice I employ and it has worked well. As far as the element of surprise, you don't have to release the entire game as public testing software; just lock it to the demo. Your goal is to make sure that the overall framework runs on your general target audience's computers. As for releasing successive patches, that's up to you. The best thing to do is wait. If there's a bug, don't fix it right away and release a patch because this will just annoy people; every time they turn around there's another update. This is what you have to be careful with in public testing. It's okay for private testing since that's their job, but remember that public testers are your future customers as well as your unofficial testers--they're trying the game because they're interested in it, not solely for the purpose of testing it. Munawar A. Bijani blog: http://munawar0009.blogspot.com http://www.bpcprograms.com Follow on Twitter for blog updates: http://www.twitter.com/munawar0009 -- --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
As i said Sean, entombed did actually have private testing back when the basic systems were being setup. None of the private versions I played were actually particularly playable games, though Jason did stick in a surprise or two to keep us on our toes. That's the model I stil think is best, private testing at first, then public. beware the grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "shaun everiss" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 2:31 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing well you could do what tom has done. half and half. We get public betas every so often but only stable ones really. otherwise private testing. Now something like entombed from public all the way sounds good but it depends on the game. Entombed for example is a world where public testing would probably be more suited to see what needs going in since it will eventually become bigger than it is now. Most of the major issues in the engine are done and now only content issues happen and most of these are done in fact I have not seen many bug reports released over the last bit and none this week which is a good sign. Ofcause the disadvantage with public is you can't offer any bonuses, ie free games, discounts, etc to your testers because everyone would want one. Unless you had a prepays system like blindadreneline has though hmph well. At 12:33 p.m. 3/01/2010, you wrote: Hi all, I just wanted to put a question out. What are your opinions of private testing with a dedicated team versus publicly released betas that everyone can try out? I have a new game in development now, and I am considering whether to make a public beta available similar to what Thomas Ward and Jason Alan have done. I see some pros and cons with private testing, though: Pros: 1. Easier to manage. Since you have only a few people who are testing the game you do not need to answer the same questions or receive the same bug reports numerous times. 2. The element of surprise. With a private team, very few people know about the development and so it comes as more of a nice surprise when something new is released, where as in the case when everyone knows pretty much everything that is going on it's hardly unexpected when a game finally is released. In the worst case, some people may even have gotten tired of the game after playing the betas! Cons: 1. Limited testing=more possible bugs. If you have a smaller team you are not as likely to catch every single bug before the product goes to release. This can result in some pretty rapid patch releases (1.0.1, 1.0.2, 1.1, etc) right after 1.0 has been put out and this obviously doesn't look too good. 2. Nagging. If everyone knows about the game while it is being developed, I fear that some people would be sending emails asking when the next version is out or wanting to know why this or that feature that they suggested hasn't been implemented. This is of course a very broad generalization and I do not in any way wish to insinuate that a lot of people do this, but there are a few cases and it might make it annoying for the developer to see the project all the way to the end. If no one except the private testing team knows about the game, then you will not get any public comments before you go 1.0 and then you are obviosly prepared to take them. On the other hand, of course, more public suggestions means more good possible ideas for the developer to work with. Thoughts, anyone? Kind regards, Philip Bennefall --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamer
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
No problem David. Like everything else, it's up to the developer, I was just pointing out that it was not a necessary condition of private testing that the developer has to give away 5 or 10 coppies of the game for free. It does seem reasonable with business software and the like, --- sinse A, the markit can stand it and B, the testing process itself wouldn't necessarily be enjoyable to the tester. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] The beta team
Hello all One big problem I want to menzion here is, that I and my friend tryed to get into a beta-team. We couldn't enter, and we didn't receive an ansver about it. That's a problem in my eyes, because we were interested in testing it, and so I think the minimum would be to get an ansver from the developer saying that the team is already created. I don't know, but I feel that sometimes some people can come easily into the team, and others are trying and trying and couldn't do it. . So I think that nobody should be prefered. Everyone should have the possibility to enter the team. Regards Claudio --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi David, Most accessible game developers follow the same moddel. It is generally understood if you test a game for a game developer you usually get a free game out of the process. So it is pretty much expected by this community. David Chittenden wrote: Hello Dark, I have never been involved in private beta of accessible games. For the business and productivity software which I have tested, receiving a copy of the software is standard practice. Then again, there is a lot involved in such forms of beta testing. I just assumed that private game testing followed the same model. I sincerely apologize for my incorrect understanding. David Chittenden, MSc, CRC, MRCAA Email: dchitten...@gmail.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi Dark, Actually, that is standard practice in the mainstream business world. One way a company gets private testers is by giving them a free product for their help, or give them a rather big discount so that he/she gets a good deal out of the testing process. Plus you can't really fully test a product unless you actually give them a fully working and registered product before final release to evaluate it. It is one thing to give say 10 people a fully functional product for free for testing purposes, and quite another to give everyone a free copy for testing purposes and then ask for money for it after testing is over. Many People will keep the test version you gave them and forgo paying for the 1.0 upgrade. So it isn't exactly financially feasible or realistic to give everyone a fully functional product and demand money for it after you determine testing is complete. So in a case like that it is better to give a private test team 10 copies of the full product to test, and sell it once the final product is determined to be ready for sale. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] games we'd like to play: fan commander
actually that thought did came to mind a few times on the pkb group... - Original Message - From: "shaun everiss" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 3:25 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] games we'd like to play: fan commander lol. actually having something like that would actually rock. At 11:37 a.m. 3/01/2010, you wrote: enspired by the discussion of NetBooks and games. so all these note takers, the pac mate, hte braille note, etc... keep calling you weird things. loud idiot, revving sun, bla bla bla. all because you're a pc... with a CPu requiring a fan. take control of a pc's fan. many difficulties ranging from Word Processor junkey to music lover to the most hard, heavy gamer. take note of the CPU's temperature and adjust your self without going nuts. phisical things come into play such as external temperature, and the angle the user is holding the unit at. if you run too high, blades will get damaged, and to decrease load you need to send overheat warnings to the display. if you run too slow, let's just say someone got their pc for pc needs, not for making it play a combination of a heater and a frying pan. the question is can you do it in extreme noises EG techno music or explosions? many pc's to pick, many difficulties, and a very light requirements of 50 gig harddrive and at least 3.5 gigs of ram with a 0 price tag make this a musthave for any person from a pc newbie to a total geek! knowledge of pc workings recommended but not required. - Peter Mahach piterm...@gmail.com msn: pitermac...@hotmail.com skype (not very often): pitermach twitter: http://www.twitter.com/pitermach webpage: http://pmsworld.tmantv.net __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4333 (20090813) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4333 (20090813) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4333 (20090813) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Public betas vs private testing
Hi Philip, I think you pretty much covered all the major pros and cons of private vs public testing so I really can't add too much to that part of the discussion. However, what I may be able to add here is the benefit of my experience with private verses public testing. As far as public testing goes I've had mixed feelings about it. When I originally started USA games back in 2004 I began with a free game called Star Trek Final Conflict. During the testing of STFC the experience was very positive, was fun for everyone, and I got lots of helpful end user feedback and suggestions. However, that was for the most part a low pressure project so the community was pretty cool about it. However, the problem with public testing for me really began in 2006 soon after I agreed to take over some game projects James North had been working on where money had already changed hands creating a very heated and stressful situation. Over the passed three years nagging has been my number one problem with public testing. I often get requests like when is the next beta coming out, why didn't I add this or that suggestion, why don't I stop fooling around and get the game done, and so on. A few, not all, tend to think because they paid in advance for this game that I must add the features they suggest, and get the game done according to some time table they themselves think would be reasonable. This, of course, has not been a pleasant experience for me at all. However, i contribute most of this to the fact money had already changed hands before I took over the project, and now some people believe I owe them whatever they want when they want it. However, no matter how bad the negative feedback has been there have been a lot of positives that have come out of public testing. I've found bugs faster, tested it on a wider range of systems, and got a lot of suggestions that could be added while the game was being designed from scratch. I found out what people did and didn't like about my games allowing me to tailer the game to what the majority of people wanted. This undoubtedly has resulted in a much better product in the long run. As far as private testing goes I've had some mixed results with that as well. Some people just join in order hoping to get a free game out of it which means they don't do a lot of testing and aren't really working for your best interests. Some are honestly trying to help, but miss things or don't encounter bugs that might show up on a different system. The worst problem I've had is a couple of private testers that were doing a good job testing, but they were bad mouthing and having personal issues with the other testers. In the end I had to kick them off the test team to restore peace and order to the list. On the positive side private testing really helped me get the game engine written, tested the early stages of MOTA, when the game and the engine really wasn't ready for public consumption. There were several bugs in the engine I know of, some popped up on some testers machines, and not others. By using the test team first I managed to get through allot of stability issues and bugs so by the time I released the first public beta many of the bugs and serious problems had been resolved. The other related advantage is how the test team views the project verses the public. In a game's early development the developer may change his/her mind many times and drastically change certain elements of the game such as adding some and removing others here and there. A test team understands this is an early test release so won't complain to much if you add something new or yank something old out of the game. As I've recently discovered with the public betas of MOTA sometimes the public takes a completely different view and screams for that feature to get immediately returned to the game even though the developer may have reasons not to restore that feature to the game at that time. This happened to me not to long ago when I decided to disable the save/load game feature in the demo, and people screamed bloody murder over it. My attempts to explain that the game was only a demo, not a full registered game, fell on deaf ears. They had the feature in the previous release and now they want it back. This wouldn't have happened if I would have disabled that feature from the start, or was using a private test team. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Netbooks and games
Hi Shaun, These days with software like Boot Camp that's not altogether true. There are ways of having the best of both worlds. It is just that many Windows users don't know about them so they are afraid to invest in a Mac or Linux system believing as you do that they have to give up all their Windows games and favorite applications to go Mac or Linux. While it is certainly true the majority of software is specifically designed for Windows with the availability of virtual machines that is more an annoyance than a serious problem for a Mac or Linux user. For example, if you were to purchase a brand new Intel based MacBook with Mac OS 10.6you would get the standard Mac OS operating system complete with the VoiceOver screen reader, ITunes media player, Safari web browser, and all the rest of the common Mac applications. If you then wanted your Windows applications you can install Windows XP on that machine via Boot Camp and run Windows XP as a virtual machine. That way you can keep all your games, and other important Windows software too. Running Windows under a virtual machine is a tad bit slower than running it natively of course, but it is the best solution available to us currently. The upside though is you can still use Mac OS as your primary operating system and boot into Windows to access stuff you would otherwise not be able to use. With Linux these days there are multiple solutions to choose from. If you wanted to try out the base operating system without formatting your hard drive you can run Ubuntu Linux directly off the cd. It runs slower, but it does allow someone to run Linux without making any changes to Windows. Other solutions involve installing it to a USB thumb drive and booting from that, or you can just stick the Ubuntu cd in your computer and do a quick and easy multiboot setup from Windows directly. You can use a third-party solution such as VM Ware which allows you to install Windows as a virtual machine under Linux. Either way you decide to do it you can easily run both while not giving up anything in the process. Bottom line, there are ways to run Windows along side your operating system of choice to have the best of both worlds. It need not be a one or the other situation. Cheers! shaun everiss wrote: hmmm i would, but since most stuff is windows based I can't. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
