Re: Re: g_b Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition
hey! i think, the more these issues are thrashed out in forum like these, the more resolution is obtained... i think people who write on here, should do so without the fear that there are people out to like get at them. there are many facets of this issue that only come to light with the lived experience of the people concerned it is only when people actually are at liberty to discuss the issues that bother them, that others are able to make more informed choices... i grudgingly give credit to people on here who open up their lives for others to learn from.opening up to become vulnerable to criticism and ridicule is in my opinion a very courageous act. lets go easy on them and listen to what they have to say... its the least we can do for people who belong to this community. the bitchiness is all fun when yu are silent spectator... it gets very upsetting tho, when yu are at the receiving end... i will continue reading on this group... commenting from time to time i think ive learnt from people here more than i have from my personal interactions with other queer folk who ive known. i have learnt that we all live such terribly complex lives and its not always possible to pull out the begining and the end of every string. sigining out ryan Hyderabad Karna Mehta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Salil / Sumeet, Both of you are missing a vital point. The value system of a person that he has acquired in life from his parents, the society he has lived in and the environment. This value system is DIFFERENT for different person. It is this value system that makes people act differently to a given situation and be comfortable with their acts. Gays and marraige is the situation. Some marry and see nothing wrong with it and adjust with their wife and self. Others think that it is completely wrong. Who is to decide what is correct? To each his own. No point in pushing one's convictions down another's throat. Results in unnecessary fruitless arguments because each is going to be guided his value system. Think it over. Society will evolve and the issue will be resolved. Till then we can keep arguing. Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking Reply) will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. Post:- gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] (attachments are removed in the digest mode. You get one or two digest mails per day containing all emails, minus pictures/attachments) No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Rss feed: http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com/maillist.xml Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Classifieds for personal advertisements are back on www.gaybombay.info site. Please exercise restraint in the language of your personal advertisement. To post mates/freinds wanted log on to http://pub35.bravenet.com/classified/show.php?usernum=2998156902 Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: Re: g_b Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition
hi all, every debate has to have a end . either we shut up and dont debate or argue on this topic, or have a mutually agreed judge. the official advise of gay bombay counsellors is against marriage by gay men to straight women.this i gathered from some previous postings. why dont we take opinion of a jury of 5 women- not necessarily married to gays- and see what they recommend. if u read and hear in the media, or womens magazines, all are against gays marrying straight women. or some gays who r married can suggest a panel whose advise they wud heed to. bj --- Karna Mehta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ear Salil / Sumeet, Both of you are missing a vital point. The value system of a person that he has acquired in life from his parents, the society he has lived in and the environment. This value system is DIFFERENT for different person. It is this value system that makes people act differently to a given situation and be comfortable with their acts. Gays and marraige is the situation. Some marry and see nothing wrong with it and adjust with their wife and self. Others think that it is completely wrong. Who is to decide what is correct? To each his own. No point in pushing one's convictions down another's throat. Results in unnecessary fruitless arguments because each is going to be guided his value system. Think it over. Society will evolve and the issue will be resolved. Till then we can keep arguing. Get your own 800 number Voicemail, fax, email, and a lot more http://www.ureach.com/reg/tag On Tue, 28 Mar 2006, Salil ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Yes, Sumeet, I respect the tradition of marriage. It provides an anchor to life, makes the man familial, creates stability in society, and creates a mutual support system in old age. So now that we agree on all this, will you join me in wanting that gay marriage be allowed in india so that I can marry my partner soon enough ? He and I have waited for some years now, and it looks like this society which respects the tradition of marriage, doesn't want me to participate in that tradition just because I love a man and not a woman. Will you wish me an early marriage or none at all ? I am sure I and my partner will have a marriage that covers all the good points you mentioned about marriage. By the way, what happens if you tell your wife that you have been having sex with other men, and assuming she is financially independent, she separates from you, meets another man and gets remarried in the next 3 months ? You are the one who will hear nasty and hurtful comments from society, not she. So whom are you really protecting by keeping your mouth shut - yourself or your wife ? You have said that in earlier days gay men were happy getting married, so what has changed now - how do you know that they were happy - who told you ? I say they were not happy but miserable - how do you know either way ? Regards Salil Sumeet Mehra [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition. People from different community may not agree on any other matters, but everyone agrees on the tradition to marry. This acceptance is not of few years ago but of many centuries ago. Since then there were people liking sex with same gender. But they all use to marry. Yes they were not treated indifferent, adhura or as gud/gay. Then suddenly what has made a change? They lived their part of life very well in those days. Then why not now? What is striking your heavens? They were never told that they could not marry a female and have their own family. The true and real reason of marriage is infact getting lost. Guys dont know the meaning of marriage. Marriage is an anchor, it does not let you stray. By changing the meaning of marriage, you guys will ruin the face of the world. Marriage makes a man responsible because he is family oriented. But guys who don not want to marry, how would they understand the importance of marriage? Some guys even say that one should not hide their likes for guys to his wife. But do they know that some things are good till they are in closet. All types of Truth is not for everyone. Some matter become more bitter if told and could ruin the life. By no means one can call this cheating because its not to harms anyones happiness. I care for their happiness so I hide it. If at all I disclose it and if she accepts it, then the anchor will be gone. Its human tendency, we become shameless when accepted. So guys grow up. How can one think only for his own benefits? How can one overlook the harm that can be caused to the society/world that we live in? Someone here told once that we get one life to live. So we need to live for our happiness. Then where do we differentiate ourselves from animals? Even animals live for themselves. They open their mouth and the food is gulped down in their stomach. But humans have hands, they
Re: Re: g_b Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition
KarnaWait for another decadeI am sure things will change out there...I wish they do...Here in US , i can see lots of indian guys staying togther as married couples , since years now...CheerosKarna Mehta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Salil / Sumeet,Both of you are missing a vital point.The value system of a person that he has acquired in life from his parents, thesociety he has lived in and the environment. This value system is DIFFERENT fordifferent person. It is this value system that makes people act differently to agiven situation and be comfortable with their acts.Gays and marraige is the situation.Some marry and see nothing wrong with it and adjust with their wife and self.Others think that it is completely wrong.Who is to decide what is correct?To each his own. No point in pushing one's convictions down another's throat.Results in unnecessary fruitless arguments because each is going to be guidedhis value system.Think it over.Society will evolve and the issue will be resolved. Till then we can keeparguing.Get your own "800" numberVoicemail, fax, email, and a lot morehttp://www.ureach.com/reg/tag On Tue, 28 Mar 2006, Salil ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Yes, Sumeet, I respect the tradition of marriage. It provides an anchor tolife, makes the man familial, creates stability in society, and creates a mutual support system inold age. So now that we agree on all this, will you join me in wanting that gay marriage be allowedin india so that I can marry my partner soon enough ? He and I have waited for some years now, and itlooks like this "society" which respects the tradition of marriage, doesn't want me toparticipate in that tradition just because I love a man and not a woman. Will you wish me an early marriageor none at all ? I am sure I and my partner will have a marriage that covers all the good points youmentioned about marriage. By the way, what happens if you tell your wife that you have been having sexwith other men, and assuming she is financially independent, she separates from you, meets anotherman and gets remarried in the next 3 months ? You are the one who will hear nasty and hurtfulcomments from "society", not she. So whom are you really protecting by keeping your mouth shut - yourselfor your wife ? You have said that in earlier days gay men were happy getting married, sowhat has changed now - how do you know that they were happy - who told you ? I say they were nothappy but miserable - how do you know either way ? Regards Salil Sumeet Mehra [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition. People from differentcommunity may not agree on any other matters, but everyone agrees on the tradition to marry. This acceptanceis not of few years ago but of many centuries ago. Since then there were people liking sex with samegender. But they all use to marry. Yes they were not treated indifferent, adhura or as gud/gay. Then suddenly what has made a change? They lived their part of life verywell in those days. Then why not now? What is striking your heavens? They were never told that theycould not marry a female and have their own family. The true and real reason of marriage is infact getting lost. Guysdon#8217;t know the meaning of marriage. Marriage is an anchor, it does not let you stray. By changing themeaning of marriage, you guys will ruin the face of the world. Marriage makes a man responsible because he is family oriented. But guys whodon not want to marry, how would they understand the importance of marriage? Some guys even say that one should not hide their likes for guys to hiswife. But do they know that some things are good till they are in closet. All types of Truth is not for everyone. Some matter become more bitter iftold and could ruin the life. By no means one can call this cheating because it#8217;s not to harmsanyone#8217;s happiness. I care for their happiness so I hide it. If at all I disclose it and if she accepts it,then the anchor will be gone. Its human tendency, we become shameless when accepted. So guys grow up. How can one think only for his own benefits? How can oneoverlook the harm that can be caused to the society/world that we live in? Someone here told once that we get one life to live. So we need to live forour happiness. Then where do we differentiate ourselves from animals? Even animals live for themselves. They open their mouth and the food isgulped down in their stomach. But humans have hands, they collect it and share it with theirfamily. Family, often heard word, but mostly ignored by certain guys in this list. Now even you guys willbe in need to change the meaning of family. I read a mail of one guy, don know his name. He stated that the day his bfallows him to go for adoption he will adopt a child. I think he is still in his fantasies. He doesnot know the legal proceedings of adoption. Alice Please come out of your wonderland! He
Re: Re: g_b Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition
Dear Salil / Sumeet, Both of you are missing a vital point. The value system of a person that he has acquired in life from his parents, the society he has lived in and the environment. This value system is DIFFERENT for different person. It is this value system that makes people act differently to a given situation and be comfortable with their acts. Gays and marraige is the situation. Some marry and see nothing wrong with it and adjust with their wife and self. Others think that it is completely wrong. Who is to decide what is correct? To each his own. No point in pushing one's convictions down another's throat. Results in unnecessary fruitless arguments because each is going to be guided his value system. Think it over. Society will evolve and the issue will be resolved. Till then we can keep arguing. Get your own 800 number Voicemail, fax, email, and a lot more http://www.ureach.com/reg/tag On Tue, 28 Mar 2006, Salil ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Yes, Sumeet, I respect the tradition of marriage. It provides an anchor to life, makes the man familial, creates stability in society, and creates a mutual support system in old age. So now that we agree on all this, will you join me in wanting that gay marriage be allowed in india so that I can marry my partner soon enough ? He and I have waited for some years now, and it looks like this society which respects the tradition of marriage, doesn't want me to participate in that tradition just because I love a man and not a woman. Will you wish me an early marriage or none at all ? I am sure I and my partner will have a marriage that covers all the good points you mentioned about marriage. By the way, what happens if you tell your wife that you have been having sex with other men, and assuming she is financially independent, she separates from you, meets another man and gets remarried in the next 3 months ? You are the one who will hear nasty and hurtful comments from society, not she. So whom are you really protecting by keeping your mouth shut - yourself or your wife ? You have said that in earlier days gay men were happy getting married, so what has changed now - how do you know that they were happy - who told you ? I say they were not happy but miserable - how do you know either way ? Regards Salil Sumeet Mehra [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition. People from different community may not agree on any other matters, but everyone agrees on the tradition to marry. This acceptance is not of few years ago but of many centuries ago. Since then there were people liking sex with same gender. But they all use to marry. Yes they were not treated indifferent, adhura or as gud/gay. Then suddenly what has made a change? They lived their part of life very well in those days. Then why not now? What is striking your heavens? They were never told that they could not marry a female and have their own family. The true and real reason of marriage is infact getting lost. Guys don#8217;t know the meaning of marriage. Marriage is an anchor, it does not let you stray. By changing the meaning of marriage, you guys will ruin the face of the world. Marriage makes a man responsible because he is family oriented. But guys who don not want to marry, how would they understand the importance of marriage? Some guys even say that one should not hide their likes for guys to his wife. But do they know that some things are good till they are in closet. All types of Truth is not for everyone. Some matter become more bitter if told and could ruin the life. By no means one can call this cheating because it#8217;s not to harms anyone#8217;s happiness. I care for their happiness so I hide it. If at all I disclose it and if she accepts it, then the anchor will be gone. Its human tendency, we become shameless when accepted. So guys grow up. How can one think only for his own benefits? How can one overlook the harm that can be caused to the society/world that we live in? Someone here told once that we get one life to live. So we need to live for our happiness. Then where do we differentiate ourselves from animals? Even animals live for themselves. They open their mouth and the food is gulped down in their stomach. But humans have hands, they collect it and share it with their family. Family, often heard word, but mostly ignored by certain guys in this list. Now even you guys will be in need to change the meaning of family. I read a mail of one guy, don know his name. He stated that the day his bf allows him to go for adoption he will adopt a child. I think he is still in his fantasies. He does not know the legal proceedings of adoption. Alice Please come out of your wonderland! He thinks the orphanage people are waiting for him. The day he will arrive and it will be their
Re: g_b Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition
Yes, Sumeet, I respect the tradition of marriage. It provides an anchor to life, makes the man familial, creates stability in society, and creates a mutual support system in old age. So now that we agree on all this, will you joinme inwanting that gay marriage be allowed in india so thatI can marry my partner soon enough ? He and Ihave waited for some years now, and it looks like this "society" which respects the tradition of marriage, doesn't want me to participate in that tradition just because I love a man and not a woman. Will you wish me an early marriage or none at all ? I am sure I and my partner will have a marriage that covers all the good points you mentioned about marriage. By the way, what happens if you tell your wife that you have been having sex with other men, and assuming she is financially independent, she separates from you, meets another man and gets remarriedin the next 3 months? You are the one who will hear nasty and hurtfulcomments from"society", not she. So whom are you really protecting by keeping your mouth shut - yourself or your wife ? You have said that in earlier days gay men were happy getting married, so what has changed now - how do you know that theywere happy - who told you ? I say they were not happy but miserable - how do you know either way ?Regards SalilSumeet Mehra [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Marriage is a world-wide accepted tradition. People from different community may not agree on any other matters, but everyone agrees on the tradition to marry. This acceptance is not of few years ago but of many centuries ago. Since then there were people liking sex with same gender. But they all use to marry. Yes they were not treated indifferent, adhura or as gud/gay. Then suddenly what has made a change? They lived their part of life very well in those days. Then why not now? What is striking your heavens? They were never told that they could not marry a female and have their own family. The true and real reason of marriage is infact getting lost. Guys dont know the meaning of marriage. Marriage is an anchor, it does not let you stray. By changing the meaning of marriage, you guys will ruin the face of the world. Marriage makes a man responsible because he is family oriented. But guys who don not want to marry, how would they understand the importance of marriage? Some guys even say that one should not hide their likes for guys to his wife. But do they know that some things are good till they are in closet. All types of Truth is not for everyone. Some matter become more bitter if told and could ruin the life. By no means one can call this cheating because its not to harms anyones happiness. I care for their happiness so I hide it. If at all I disclose it and if she accepts it, then the anchor will be gone. Its human tendency, we become shameless when accepted. So guys grow up. How can one think only for his own benefits? How can one overlook the harm that can be caused to the society/world that we live in? Someone here told once that we get one life to live. So we need to live for our happiness. Then where do we differentiate ourselves from animals? Even animals live for themselves. They open their mouth and the food is gulped down in their stomach. But humans have hands, they collect it and share it with their family. Family, often heard word, but mostly ignored by certain guys in this list. Now even you guys will be in need to change the meaning of family. I read a mail of one guy, don know his name. He stated that the day his bf allows him to go for adoption he will adopt a child. I think he is still in his fantasies. He does not know the legal proceedings of adoption. Alice Please come out of your wonderland! He thinks the orphanage people are waiting for him. The day he will arrive and it will be their pleasure to hand him a child. He does not know that even Miss Universe crowned Sushmits Sen was dragged to the court. Probably one more issue to fight for gay rights to adopt a child. I think this is the only the way left out to make difference. I think that we are simply getting loud to gain public attention and sympathy. Jiyo cricket on Yahoo! India cricket Yahoo! Messenger Mobile Stay in touch with your buddies all the time. Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking Reply) will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. Post:- gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] (attachments are removed in the digest mode. You get one or two digest mails per day containing all emails, minus pictures/attachments) No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:-
