Re: gEDA-user: german article in the linux magazin online now
Dave N6NZ n...@arrl.net writes: Interesting comment, in that on another list I was just in a discussion about 2D drawing tools. I am a fan of QCad. Many people complain about the strange UI on QCad. But after you climb the considerable learning curve, you can absolutely fly with it... because you can think in geometry and operate like a draftsman, with no time spent doing squinty-eyed mouse nudging. Yes! And before qcad it was xfig. With an even stranger UI. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Metric units
On Wed, 28 Jan 2009, DJ Delorie wrote: But given that some parts (like SOJ or DIP) are specified in terms of inch units, I think the whole concept of a metric only library is rather pointless. I think what the OP really wants is not what the OP asked for. I wonder if PCB's internal representation using Imperial units has been a problem. I thought it might present issues with some newer SMD parts, like the 0.4mm pitch LQFP that I'm using in a project, but in reality, the layout looked fine and I didn't run into any problems with things not aligning correctly. (The real ballache is that my project has a mix of metric and imperial measured parts, like the imperial spaced SOIC and SOJ but with metric LQFP and TQFP too, so I had to use a very fine grid to get stuff to line up neatly for both metric and imperial parts). So basically, I've not had a problem myself and being able to make footprints in metric seems good enough so far. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Metric units
Am Donnerstag, den 29.01.2009, 13:25 + schrieb Dylan Smith: I wonder if PCB's internal representation using Imperial units has been a problem. I thought it might present issues with some newer SMD parts, like the 0.4mm pitch LQFP that I'm using in a project, but in reality, the Internal pcb unit is 0.01 mil currently (I think is was 1 mil in old days) which is OK for fine-pitch metric parts. Problem is more using metric grid -- rounding errors can result in strange things like garbage consisting of very short line segments. This was discussed months ago on this list... ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any discussion about combining schematics and symbols into one file?
Yamazaki R2 wrote: I think i might have brought this up before but I wanted to bring this up again. I know this would be kind of a big change to the way gEDA works, but it would be nice to combine component's schematic, symbol, and maybe pcb view into one file. Or at least the option to do so. On Mac OS X, there is the concept of a bundle. They are actually implemented as directories w/ a suffix. The bundle is treated as a unit. The application (Xcode, for example) is given the path to the bundle, and it finds therein all the files it needs. Normal file browsing tools can be used to browse into the bundle, if desired. Seems to me it would be pretty simple to define a bundle format for schematics as well. -- Steve WilliamsThe woods are lovely, dark and deep. steve at icarus.com But I have promises to keep, http://www.icarus.com and lines to code before I sleep, http://www.picturel.com And lines to code before I sleep. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Strange error from gEDA upon startup
Peter: I found the files in the proper place easily they are there. How do I know whether or not the gdk-pixbuf has support for xpm files? This is a fink install and I just updated it last night to the latest. Thanks, Ed Kingston Co. fred...@sb.net ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any discussion about combining schematics and symbols into one file?
On Jan 29, 2009, at 9:24 AM, Stephen Williams wrote: Yamazaki R2 wrote: I think i might have brought this up before but I wanted to bring this up again. I know this would be kind of a big change to the way gEDA works, but it would be nice to combine component's schematic, symbol, and maybe pcb view into one file. Or at least the option to do so. On Mac OS X, there is the concept of a bundle. They are actually implemented as directories w/ a suffix. The bundle is treated as a unit. The application (Xcode, for example) is given the path to the bundle, and it finds therein all the files it needs. Normal file browsing tools can be used to browse into the bundle, if desired. Seems to me it would be pretty simple to define a bundle format for schematics as well. In my flows, the bundle is a CVS module. CVS keeps track of sources, and ignores the fungus that grows around them (netlists, backup files, logs, etc.). The key thing is to keep every symbol except completely generic ones (like gnd-1.sym) in some directory in the module. Use relative pathnames in makefiles and gafrc files to establish relationships (sometimes I also use soft links). So, typically, a project silistat will have directories: silistat/schematic silistat/symbols silistat/doc etc. Lots of ways to do the details. The klunky thing right now is importing symbols. Lots of: locate thingie-1.sym cp wherever/thingie-1.sym ../symbols/mythingie.sym Then remember to rescan directories in the symbol browser (@#$%), choose and place the symbol, Hs, customize as needed, fs, Hu, ep. Or, if you imported a schematic and got the dreaded red triangle, import the missing symbol as above, rescan (this wasn't necessary in older versions), pr, yes I really want to, and then you're probably OK. Yes, it's klunky, but in a big project it saves a lot of time down the road. -- Steve WilliamsThe woods are lovely, dark and deep. steve at icarus.com But I have promises to keep, http://www.icarus.com and lines to code before I sleep, http://www.picturel.com And lines to code before I sleep. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ j...@noqsi.com ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any discussion about combining schematics and symbols into one file?
On Monday 26 January 2009, Yamazaki R2 wrote: it would be nice to combine component's schematic, symbol, and maybe pcb view into one file. Or at least the option to do so. Perhaps I am missing something, but the solution looks obvious to me. You need only to look at C for the answer. #include . So, have #include standard_library by default, and #include my_library for extra symbols. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any discussion about combining schematics and symbols into one file?
On Jan 29, 2009, at 12:23 PM, al davis wrote: On Monday 26 January 2009, Yamazaki R2 wrote: it would be nice to combine component's schematic, symbol, and maybe pcb view into one file. Or at least the option to do so. Perhaps I am missing something, but the solution looks obvious to me. You need only to look at C for the answer. #include . So, have #include standard_library by default, and #include my_library for extra symbols. Can do that with gafrc, but: The difficulty is that the standard library here really doesn't contain finished, heavy symbols. Think of them as base classes in an OO language. So, you have to customize by adding attributes. The trouble is, there's only one other place to add them: the schematic, on a per-instance basis. That's unmanageable in a 1000 component project. The only manageable way to customize them for a big project is to copy them and make them heavy. John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ j...@noqsi.com ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Guerilla marketing...
I don't know about guerilla marketing, but it might help to tell people about successful gEDA projects. Matt Ettus (http:// www.ettus.com) has apparently built a thriving business around free hardware designed with gEDA. My friends at MIT and Espace, Inc. are using his products to upgrade the HETE communication stations to support a variety of space missions, basically anything the dishes are suited for, rather than just the frequency/modulation used by a single mission. Of course, most professional gEDA projects are proprietary, so you can't show people much. However there's my ASIC work with Osaka University, which has spawned several papers, so you can read *about* it: www.noqsi.com/images/DeltaSigmaDigitization_SPIE.pdf ieeexplore.ieee.org/iel5/4436263/4437154/04437195.pdf?arnumber=4437195 ndip.in2p3.fr/ndip08/Presentations/3Tuesday/A-Midi/98-Nakajima.pdf The first paper mentions gEDA and ngspice. A few names are named, too. ;-) I'm thinking of publishing the project itself, but as a project it's rather disorganized, and I'd want to clean that up. I've learned a lot about organizing big gEDA projects over the last few years. John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ j...@noqsi.com ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Guerilla marketing...
on-topic plugOur little company, Evil Mad Science LLC ( http://evilmadscience.com/ ) has a similar model-- Most of our products are open source hardware kits that were designed in gEDA. We're not shy about it; whenever possible, we point out that the projects were done with gEDA, and we make the design files available in pcb format. It is a goal of ours to increase adoption of open-source hardware tools; I think we've actually managed to get quite a number of people to look at gEDA with our designs. :) /on-topic plug I don't know about guerilla marketing, but it might help to tell people about successful gEDA projects. Matt Ettus (http:// www.ettus.com) has apparently built a thriving business around free hardware designed with gEDA. My friends at MIT and Espace, Inc. are using his products to upgrade the HETE communication stations to support a variety of space missions, basically anything the dishes are suited for, rather than just the frequency/modulation used by a single mission. Of course, most professional gEDA projects are proprietary, so you can't show people much. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
Is there a command line switch or a script that will take an existing schematic and embed all of the symbols? I thought I saw this on the mailing list but I could not find it in my gmails. I did not see anything on the wiki. Thanks. (* jcl *) -- You can't create open hardware with closed EDA tools. http://www.luciani.org ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 05:10:00PM -0500, John Luciani wrote: Is there a command line switch or a script that will take an existing schematic and embed all of the symbols? I thought I saw this on the mailing list but I could not find it in my gmails. I did not see anything on the wiki. It's in the menu (edit?) in gschem. -- Ben Jackson AD7GD b...@ben.com http://www.ben.com/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 5:15 PM, Ben Jackson b...@ben.com wrote: On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 05:10:00PM -0500, John Luciani wrote: Is there a command line switch or a script that will take an existing schematic and embed all of the symbols? I thought I saw this on the mailing list but I could not find it in my gmails. I did not see anything on the wiki. It's in the menu (edit?) in gschem. Never thought to look there ;) Thanks. (* jcl *) -- You can't create open hardware with closed EDA tools. http://www.luciani.org ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
On Thu, 2009-01-29 at 17:10 -0500, John Luciani wrote: Is there a command line switch or a script that will take an existing schematic and embed all of the symbols? I don't know, but I was going to ask the same question sometime soon... Bdale ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
gschlas -e foo.sch ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Design a keyboard with gschem/pcb
I'd also be curious to know if there's any magic for getting the replicas of the subcircuits numbered properly in PCB, although I fully expect to generate the entire initial layout with a script rather than using the GUI. I've published pcb scripts that do block-copies before, for example my 16-channel powermeter board. The renumbering commands are in there too. Here's another copy, note that the renumbers are cumulative. LoadFrom(Layout,powermeter-blank.pcb) LoadFrom(LayoutToBuffer,channel1.pcb) # left upper, first one already there # First is at 200,0 PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,3) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,8) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,13) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,18) # Now skip 300 more for the next five RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,28) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,33) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,38) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,43) # Other side pastebuffer(Rotate,2) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,11) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,16) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,21) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,26) # skip RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,36) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,41) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,46) RenumberBuffer(0,10) PasteBuffer(ToLayout,29,51) djopt(splitlines) # Teardrops() LoadFrom(Netlist,djtest.net) SaveTo(LayoutAs,djtest.pcb) Quit() ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 5:22 PM, DJ Delorie d...@delorie.com wrote: gschlas -e foo.sch That's good to know too. Will be useful in a Makefile. Thanks. (* jcl *) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user -- You can't create open hardware with closed EDA tools. http://www.luciani.org ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Embedded Symbols
gschlas -e foo.sch
That's good to know too. Will be useful in a Makefile.
Like this? ;-)
web :
for i in channel.sch ethernet.sch power.sch mcu.sch; do \
cp $$i tmp.sch ; \
gschlas -e tmp.sch ; \
mv tmp.sch ${WEB}/$$i; \
done
. . .
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Re: gEDA-user: Design a keyboard with gschem/pcb
My matrix utilities may work -- http://tinyurl.com/6cbn6h You create a schematic containing one cell and then create the corresponding pcb for the cell. Setup the rows and columns and spacing in a configuration file. Schematic and PCB matrix will be in sync. Worked well for LED matrices and electronic loads (a.k.a. current sinks). (* jcl *) -- You can't create open hardware with closed EDA tools. http://www.luciani.org ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Design a keyboard with gschem/pcb
On Jan 29, 2009, at 3:21 PM, Ben Jackson wrote: Is it worth using a hierarchical sheet for this? I would. Does anyone have an example? reg.sch Description: Binary data Note that I've put in the symbol representing the subcircuit as a graphical=1 comment. And I used gschlas -e for the first time. ;-) How do the instances end up getting numbered? If you give it refdes=X1, gnetlist will give C1 in the subcircuit the refdes X1/C1 when it flattens the netlist or BOM. John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ j...@noqsi.com ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Guerilla marketing...
On Tue, 2009-01-27 at 17:34 -0500, Stuart Brorson wrote: I suspect that interest in both zero-cost *and* true FOSS EDA stuff will increase as the world economy continues to tank That would certainly be nice. FWIW, I've seen folks use various licenses with different degrees of success for open hardware projects. I personally like the TAPR Open Hardware License, http://tapr.org/ohl. That plus GPL for firmware and CC by-sa 3.0 for related documentation seems like a very workable mix. See http://altusmetrum.org for what I'm currently hacking on with friends using gEDA. Bdale ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Guerilla marketing...
On Thu, 2009-01-29 at 15:38 -0500, Windell H. Oskay wrote: on-topic plugOur little company, Evil Mad Science LLC ( http://evilmadscience.com/ ) has a similar model-- Most of our products are open source hardware kits that were designed in gEDA. We're not shy about it; whenever possible, we point out that the projects were done with gEDA, and we make the design files available in pcb format. It is a goal of ours to increase adoption of open-source hardware tools; I think we've actually managed to get quite a number of people to look at gEDA with our designs. :) /on-topic plug If you've got a spare bit of board space, and the inclination to help advertise the project, why not drop a gEDA logo onto your boards (attached). Would be fun to see how / where we can get the logo ;) I suspect those doing space-flight applications might claim to win there though. Best wishes, -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) geda_logo.pcb Description: application/pcb-layout ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Guerilla marketing...
Bdale Garbee wrote: FWIW, I've seen folks use various licenses with different degrees of success for open hardware projects. Would you elaborate on the degrees of success you have seen? I'm launching that kind of business myself. Kits and TAPR licensed open hardware systems for field biologists, to start. John Griessen -- Ecosensory Austin TX ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Design a keyboard with gschem/pcb
On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 05:25:06PM -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: LoadFrom(Layout,powermeter-blank.pcb) How did you get the hookups in that? Did you edit a merged board and then delete the modules? It seems error prone since you might get far into the project and eventually want to change both the channel and the blank and re-merge. LoadFrom(LayoutToBuffer,channel1.pcb) # left upper, first one already there # First is at 200,0 PasteBuffer(ToLayout,0,3) This is where the Inkscape concept of clones would be handy. That way the pasted copies would all continue to inherit from the master... I guess first we'd need a concept of groups. That might not be too hard... -- Ben Jackson AD7GD b...@ben.com http://www.ben.com/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Design a keyboard with gschem/pcb
How did you get the hookups in that? Did you edit a merged board and then delete the modules? It seems error prone since you might get far into the project and eventually want to change both the channel and the blank and re-merge. I edited a merged board once, made two copies, and trimmed each down. During editing, I edit only the two source boards, and merge/view them to make sure it's making sense. I've never really edited the merged board, other than to try a few things before migrating those changes to the originals. Mostly I look at the merged board but edit the templates. I did have an idea of how much space each channel could use, though, based on some fiddling with the adapter board I had already done. This is where the Inkscape concept of clones would be handy. That way the pasted copies would all continue to inherit from the master... I guess first we'd need a concept of groups. That might not be too hard... A heirarchical PCB layout would do it too, but it's not even on my horizon. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Guerilla marketing...
On Friday 30 January 2009, Steve Meier wrote: The issue isn't, is geda or kicad technologically competitive tools, the issue is can users move designs back and forth from the established eda tools and the free tools? If you answer yes then you reduce the risk of the users if you answer no then the safe action of the users is to stick with the tools that they know. That's one of the reasons I suggested the need for a bi-directional translator system, with ideas for doing it, a while back. It also needs to link to other tools and provide a path for new ones. It is a good project for summer of code. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
