Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
Just offering my $0.02. I'm working on the Knox podling and perhaps I've just been lucky by my mentors have been GREAT. Sure some times I've had to ping them directly to get a question answered or get a vote but that is to be expected in a volunteer org. One thing Knox did right (by accident) is that we have alot of mentors, seven. I was always able to find someone with cycles to help. The only thing I would suggest is that perhaps podlings need a well defined process by which they can add/replace mentors if they didn't get as lucky as me. On 11/8/13 1:49 AM, Marvin Humphrey wrote: On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:34 PM, Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com wrote: The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. I think your email contained lots of excellent advice for podlings now in incubation. I dream of something better, though. Just because you and I had to walk to school barefoot in the snow uphill both ways doesn't mean that our children should have to. :) Marvin Humphrey - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
Ha ha ha ha. Does the same also apply to maintaining the records, for clutch, the vote monitoring and other tools, signing reports, writing reports for that matter, and all the other aspects of the incubator - all of that might get done eventually one day if people can ever find the time, don't make a fuss, as frustrating as it is just keep asking politely or do it yourself etc? What it means if mentors aren't voting on things like releases after weeks is that the mentors aren't doing any mentoring, in which case whats the point in the podling being here? ...ant On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 7:00 AM, David Crossley cross...@apache.org wrote: Martijn Dashorst wrote: ... Well said. Hooray for common-sense and taking ownership. We must remember that we are all individuals. The ASF enables us to do what we want. We each need to take the initiative. -David - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
Thanks for that! Here's another that someone posted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EfnGMEjgK4feature=youtu.be Upayavira On Fri, Nov 8, 2013, at 06:49 AM, Marvin Humphrey wrote: On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:34 PM, Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com wrote: The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. I think your email contained lots of excellent advice for podlings now in incubation. I dream of something better, though. Just because you and I had to walk to school barefoot in the snow uphill both ways doesn't mean that our children should have to. :) The incubator *can - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
Whoops. Wrong email. Oh well. Creating that video was fun anyway. Upayavira On Fri, Nov 8, 2013, at 10:42 AM, Upayavira wrote: Thanks for that! Here's another that someone posted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EfnGMEjgK4feature=youtu.be Upayavira On Fri, Nov 8, 2013, at 06:49 AM, Marvin Humphrey wrote: On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:34 PM, Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com wrote: The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. I think your email contained lots of excellent advice for podlings now in incubation. I dream of something better, though. Just because you and I had to walk to school barefoot in the snow uphill both ways doesn't mean that our children should have to. :) The incubator *can - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
Welcome to the community. Go read the wiki. Follow the mailing list. Figure out everything else by yourself! Good luck. Let us know when you think you're ready to be a TLP. Really? One of my co-workers hit me with the line one: Is that your best work? Eric. On 11/7/13, 3:34 PM, Martijn Dashorst wrote: In my opinion it is always a failure of a podling when they can't get a release out of the door, or are unable to vote in new committers. The future is not something we enter. The future is something we create. --Leonard I. Sweet As a podling is waiting for its release to be approved, I sure hope they aren't holding their breath. If they have missing mentors, then prod the mentors. If the mentors don't react, prod general@ (in a polite way). If that doesn't help prod private@ or send a message to VP incubator. Is it frustrating that a first release can take a month to get to your users? Yup. But consider that if it takes a month, your release and your release process had many issues. Your next release should go much faster (you did automate the release building, did you?). Is it frustrating that nobody wants to look at your release? Yup. But ask politely: you are asking volunteers their time–time they can spend with their children, spouses, parents, friends or with their existing projects. Time they will never get back. So spend that time wisely! Outside the incubator you will find that it is still hard to get a release vetted. People get swamped in work. They move houses. Life happens. The incubator won't the last time you will struggle to get the required +3 binding votes. Outside the incubator you also need to make it happen, so show that you are able to do so! If/when a drive by review unveils some things that are wrong with a release (even minutia) go fix them, automate them and respin the release. Do the work and get the release up to standards. You got the attention, someone put the time in to review your release, the onus is on you to fix it. Do it quickly and you'll have a review that much faster. Even better if you can prove that you fixed the discovered issues (show a rat report, a diff of the archive structure, etc). Subscribe to the general@ list and read the things that are uncovered for failed releases. Fix that too in your release. This way you learn from other folks' mistakes. Fill in your board reports on time. Prod your mentors to sign off the reports. Do the trademark search. Fix the licensing. Expand your community. Self governance doesn't just mean the ability to answer messages on users@ or to have civil discourse on dev@, or the ability to commit code without having too many merge conflicts. It also means taking responsibility for your project. You are responsible for getting a release out of the door: it is your project! You are responsible for ensuring the status page is completely checked off: it is your project! You are responsible for completing a trademark search: it is your project! You are responsible for filing a board report on time: it is your project! And yes I speak from my own experience. With Wicket we were living in a slum for half a year. But finally we got our own act together to get a release out the door, to vote in new committers, to fix our status page, to fix our licensing issues etc. That is hard work and you have to spend the time and energy to complete those tasks. But when you have everything in order, you can graduate with confidence. The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. Martijn - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
[IMO] There are no Incubator issues
In my opinion it is always a failure of a podling when they can't get a release out of the door, or are unable to vote in new committers. The future is not something we enter. The future is something we create. --Leonard I. Sweet As a podling is waiting for its release to be approved, I sure hope they aren't holding their breath. If they have missing mentors, then prod the mentors. If the mentors don't react, prod general@ (in a polite way). If that doesn't help prod private@ or send a message to VP incubator. Is it frustrating that a first release can take a month to get to your users? Yup. But consider that if it takes a month, your release and your release process had many issues. Your next release should go much faster (you did automate the release building, did you?). Is it frustrating that nobody wants to look at your release? Yup. But ask politely: you are asking volunteers their time–time they can spend with their children, spouses, parents, friends or with their existing projects. Time they will never get back. So spend that time wisely! Outside the incubator you will find that it is still hard to get a release vetted. People get swamped in work. They move houses. Life happens. The incubator won't the last time you will struggle to get the required +3 binding votes. Outside the incubator you also need to make it happen, so show that you are able to do so! If/when a drive by review unveils some things that are wrong with a release (even minutia) go fix them, automate them and respin the release. Do the work and get the release up to standards. You got the attention, someone put the time in to review your release, the onus is on you to fix it. Do it quickly and you'll have a review that much faster. Even better if you can prove that you fixed the discovered issues (show a rat report, a diff of the archive structure, etc). Subscribe to the general@ list and read the things that are uncovered for failed releases. Fix that too in your release. This way you learn from other folks' mistakes. Fill in your board reports on time. Prod your mentors to sign off the reports. Do the trademark search. Fix the licensing. Expand your community. Self governance doesn't just mean the ability to answer messages on users@ or to have civil discourse on dev@, or the ability to commit code without having too many merge conflicts. It also means taking responsibility for your project. You are responsible for getting a release out of the door: it is your project! You are responsible for ensuring the status page is completely checked off: it is your project! You are responsible for completing a trademark search: it is your project! You are responsible for filing a board report on time: it is your project! And yes I speak from my own experience. With Wicket we were living in a slum for half a year. But finally we got our own act together to get a release out the door, to vote in new committers, to fix our status page, to fix our licensing issues etc. That is hard work and you have to spend the time and energy to complete those tasks. But when you have everything in order, you can graduate with confidence. The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. Martijn - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:34 PM, Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com wrote: The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. I think your email contained lots of excellent advice for podlings now in incubation. I dream of something better, though. Just because you and I had to walk to school barefoot in the snow uphill both ways doesn't mean that our children should have to. :) Marvin Humphrey - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
A month.. aha. :-) 08.11.2013 3:35 пользователь Martijn Dashorst martijn.dasho...@gmail.com написал: In my opinion it is always a failure of a podling when they can't get a release out of the door, or are unable to vote in new committers. The future is not something we enter. The future is something we create. --Leonard I. Sweet As a podling is waiting for its release to be approved, I sure hope they aren't holding their breath. If they have missing mentors, then prod the mentors. If the mentors don't react, prod general@ (in a polite way). If that doesn't help prod private@ or send a message to VP incubator. Is it frustrating that a first release can take a month to get to your users? Yup. But consider that if it takes a month, your release and your release process had many issues. Your next release should go much faster (you did automate the release building, did you?). Is it frustrating that nobody wants to look at your release? Yup. But ask politely: you are asking volunteers their time–time they can spend with their children, spouses, parents, friends or with their existing projects. Time they will never get back. So spend that time wisely! Outside the incubator you will find that it is still hard to get a release vetted. People get swamped in work. They move houses. Life happens. The incubator won't the last time you will struggle to get the required +3 binding votes. Outside the incubator you also need to make it happen, so show that you are able to do so! If/when a drive by review unveils some things that are wrong with a release (even minutia) go fix them, automate them and respin the release. Do the work and get the release up to standards. You got the attention, someone put the time in to review your release, the onus is on you to fix it. Do it quickly and you'll have a review that much faster. Even better if you can prove that you fixed the discovered issues (show a rat report, a diff of the archive structure, etc). Subscribe to the general@ list and read the things that are uncovered for failed releases. Fix that too in your release. This way you learn from other folks' mistakes. Fill in your board reports on time. Prod your mentors to sign off the reports. Do the trademark search. Fix the licensing. Expand your community. Self governance doesn't just mean the ability to answer messages on users@ or to have civil discourse on dev@, or the ability to commit code without having too many merge conflicts. It also means taking responsibility for your project. You are responsible for getting a release out of the door: it is your project! You are responsible for ensuring the status page is completely checked off: it is your project! You are responsible for completing a trademark search: it is your project! You are responsible for filing a board report on time: it is your project! And yes I speak from my own experience. With Wicket we were living in a slum for half a year. But finally we got our own act together to get a release out the door, to vote in new committers, to fix our status page, to fix our licensing issues etc. That is hard work and you have to spend the time and energy to complete those tasks. But when you have everything in order, you can graduate with confidence. The short guide to graduation: do the work, see it through, persevere and graduate. Martijn - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [IMO] There are no Incubator issues
Martijn Dashorst wrote: ... Well said. Hooray for common-sense and taking ownership. We must remember that we are all individuals. The ASF enables us to do what we want. We each need to take the initiative. -David - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
