date:20161206

On 12/06/2016 09:52 PM, Sam Jorna wrote:

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 09:44:12PM -0500, james wrote:

On 12/06/2016 09:09 PM, M. J. Everitt wrote:

James

With the creation of the Mentors project
(https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Mentors) a bit of clarification
has occurred to help prospective developers outside the IRC and/or
proxy-maintainers project).

Am I to understand that the 'Mentors' are a pathway to gaining
gentoo-dev status (still the same requirements) but I do not have to use
IRC to communicate with whomever?

In order to become a Gentoo developer you do need a mentor[0]. If
instead you're only looking to proxy-maintain a package(s), you can work
either through the Proxy Maintainers project or directly with a
developer (if they're the maintainer).

If so; Halaluyah! and count me in. I hate irc, with a passion, just so
you know.

How you communicate with your mentor is up to you and your mentor. Going
through the recruitment [0]process does require a review session which,
as far as I know, is only held on IRC, but otherwise it's up to you to
organise what medium you use.

The Recruiters project page contains links
to the current quizzes (linked therein).

hth.

On this page, the string 'quiz' occurs (3) times. I find no links to the
current quizes?

Did I miss something?

The links to the quizzes are [1]here.

[0]
https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Recruiters#What_does_the_recruitment_process_involve.3F
[1] https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Recruiters#Current_quizzes

Thanks guys. I'm going to finish up the new quizzes on my own.
Perhaps you guys should 'draw straws' so in a few weeks/months
we can rapidly complete the dev application process. Ive got over 2
years on this off and on.

I promise to present at lest 10 ebuilds as a body of work (EAPI-6 OK?)?
Yes I do prefer email over irc. If you force irc on me, then I think it
would be nice to have a streamlined method so the instant I fire it up,
it is secure and I do not have to haggle with interlopers via the channel.

I'm not a fan of 'gang rape' either, so hopefully irc channel comes
complete with manners and respect, regardless of who has what technical
acumen over the others? Is that too much to ask? Really, for someone
like me, it is just best to avoid irc.

James

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 09:37:55PM -0500, james wrote:
> >> I subscribe on 6/23/2016::
> >>
> >> From:: gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org
> >>
> >
> > This is the correct address and as it noted, you should get a
> > confirmation/welcome email when you've successfully subscribed. Did you
> > get this?
> 
> YES, back on 6/23/2016 It never functioned correctly for me.
> I think everyone switched to the new list, which I never heard about.
> 
> 
> And here is the reply::
> 
> gentoo-proxy-maint+confsub-nomail-75dc5ad5188e6314-garftd=verizon@lists.gentoo.org
> 
> on 6/23/2016 10:21am
> 
> 
> 
> So do I need to apply again, or an I on the list? I went (nomail) cause 
> at the time reading via gmane.org was working. Perhaps I should just 
> change the status to receive the mails?   I can test post, if that is 
> helpful?

I can see you've posted something to the list just now.

If you need to reconfigure your settings so it mails you, send a mail to 
gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org to see [0]options.

[0] https://www.gentoo.org/get-involved/mailing-lists/instructions.html

-- 
Sam Jorna (wraeth)
GnuPG Key: D6180C26


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish


On 12/06/2016 09:20 PM, Sam Jorna wrote:

On Wed, Dec 07, 2016 at 01:17:54PM +1100, Sam Jorna wrote:

have a look at the new [0]Mentors project, or even send a mail to -dev


I forgot the link, sorry:

[0] https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Mentors




On this page, the string 'quiz' occurs (3) times. I find no links to the 
current quizes?


Did I miss something?

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 09:44:12PM -0500, james wrote:
> On 12/06/2016 09:09 PM, M. J. Everitt wrote:
> 
> >> James
> >>
> > With the creation of the Mentors project
> > (https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Mentors) a bit of clarification
> > has occurred to help prospective developers outside the IRC and/or
> > proxy-maintainers project).
> 
> Am I to understand that the 'Mentors' are a pathway to gaining 
> gentoo-dev status (still the same requirements) but I do not have to use
> IRC to communicate with whomever?

In order to become a Gentoo developer you do need a mentor[0]. If 
instead you're only looking to proxy-maintain a package(s), you can work 
either through the Proxy Maintainers project or directly with a 
developer (if they're the maintainer).

> If so; Halaluyah! and count me in. I hate irc, with a passion, just so 
> you know.

How you communicate with your mentor is up to you and your mentor. Going 
through the recruitment [0]process does require a review session which, 
as far as I know, is only held on IRC, but otherwise it's up to you to 
organise what medium you use.

> > The Recruiters project page contains links
> > to the current quizzes (linked therein).
> >
> > hth.
> 
> 
> 
> On this page, the string 'quiz' occurs (3) times. I find no links to the 
> current quizes?
> 
> Did I miss something?

The links to the quizzes are [1]here.

[0] 
https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Recruiters#What_does_the_recruitment_process_involve.3F
[1] https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Recruiters#Current_quizzes

-- 
Sam Jorna (wraeth)
GnuPG Key: D6180C26

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

2016-12-06 Thread M. J. Everitt

On 07/12/16 02:44, james wrote:
>
> On this page, the string 'quiz' occurs (3) times. I find no links to
> the current quizes?
>
> Did I miss something?
>
> James
>
https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Recruiters#Current_quizzes



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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

2016-12-06 Thread Matthias Maier


On Tue, Dec  6, 2016, at 20:37 CST, james  wrote:

> So do I need to apply again, or an I on the list? I went (nomail)
> cause at the time reading via gmane.org was working. Perhaps I should
> just change the status to receive the mails?   I can test post, if
> that is helpful?

No, the list is simply dead (was never used in any meaningful way
anyway).

You can read the whole 3 e-mails over the last 5 months here [1]

Best,
Matthias


[1] https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 PM, William Hubbs  wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 05:26:19PM -0500, Mike Gilbert wrote:
>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 4:15 PM, Michał Górny  wrote:
>> > On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 12:54:26 -0500
>> > Mike Gilbert  wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
>> >> > Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
>> >> > depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
>> >> > with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>> >>
>> >> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.
>> >
>> > vapier doesn't consider this QA violation a QA violation.
>> >
>> > https://bugs.gentoo.org/487844
>>
>> Perhaps QA could take some action then?
>>
>> Updating ~1500 ebuilds with a [tinfo=] use-dep seems like a poor solution.
>
> 
> Our policies are in the dev manual, so please cite the violation there.
> If you can't, this is not a qa violation, so please don't call it one.
> 
>
> I don't see a problem with the use flag and suggest updating the other 
> ebuilds.

The USE flag introduces needless complexity for zero benefit. Please
explain to me why this is a good idea.

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish


On 12/06/2016 09:09 PM, M. J. Everitt wrote:


James


With the creation of the Mentors project
(https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Mentors) a bit of clarification
has occurred to help prospective developers outside the IRC and/or
proxy-maintainers project).


Am I to understand that the 'Mentors' are a pathway to gaining 
gentoo-dev status (still the same requirements) but I do not have to use

IRC to communicate with whomever?

If so; Halaluyah! and count me in. I hate irc, with a passion, just so 
you know.




The Recruiters project page contains links
to the current quizzes (linked therein).

hth.




On this page, the string 'quiz' occurs (3) times. I find no links to the 
current quizes?


Did I miss something?

James

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish


On 12/06/2016 09:17 PM, Sam Jorna wrote:

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 08:59:11PM -0500, james wrote:

On 12/06/2016 07:29 PM, Robin H. Johnson wrote:

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 01:13:12PM -0500, james wrote:

A while back, we we were promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy
folks that did not get on well with IRC. It never materialized,

The mail alias proxy-ma...@gentoo.org (same alias as proxy-maintainers@)
has 22 people on it. It was created 2013/09/26.

The list gentoo-proxy-ma...@lists.gentoo.org was created 2016/05/29.
I don't see much usage of it, nobody has emailed since August.
https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/

The request for it was filed and tracked here:
https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581370

How exactly is that never materialized?




I subscribe on 6/23/2016::

From:: gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org



This is the correct address and as it noted, you should get a
confirmation/welcome email when you've successfully subscribed. Did you
get this?


YES, back on 6/23/2016 It never functioned correctly for me.
I think everyone switched to the new list, which I never heard about.


And here is the reply::

gentoo-proxy-maint+confsub-nomail-75dc5ad5188e6314-garftd=verizon@lists.gentoo.org

on 6/23/2016 10:21am



So do I need to apply again, or an I on the list? I went (nomail) cause 
at the time reading via gmane.org was working. Perhaps I should just 
change the status to receive the mails?   I can test post, if that is 
helpful?





Keep in mind, also, that as Robin noted above, the list has been very
quiet and will remain that way until people start using it.


So I just now sent email to :
proxy-maint+subscr...@gentoo.org


This is not the mailing list address, but the alias for the Proxy
Maintainers project - you can't subscribe to this. That being said, I
couldn't see this email in my client.


NO answer on this attempt. ON this page::
https://www.gentoo.org/get-involved/mailing-lists/all-lists.html


The gentoo-proxy-maint mailing list was indeed missing from that list
and has just been added thanks to Robin.


Oh yea, I emailed those quizes timely to one of the devs I was working
with, and got no answer. (sorry, not going to identify that dev). So I
prefer to answer the latest quizes; you guys can figure out who I
should send those to.


It's unfortunate that this happened.

As for whom to send your quizzes to, they would go to your mentor. If
you don't have a mentor, try approaching a developer with whom you've
been working and see if they will be able to. Alternatively, you can
have a look at the new [0]Mentors project, or even send a mail to -dev
asking for one.


I've had (5) mentor/sponsers. All quite friendly. Several wanted to just 
put me up for dev. I am flexible, but, I've been put through the ringer 
over a (2) year period.  That's why when I hear about a kid, whom 
gaining gentoo dev status would be most benefical, getting hood-winked 
and ran around, I tend to believe their stories; and that angers me.




I look forward to having another contributor among the ranks. :)

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

2016-12-06 Thread Mart Raudsepp

Ühel kenal päeval, T, 06.12.2016 kell 20:59, kirjutas james:
> 
> So I just now sent email to :
> proxy-maint+subscr...@gentoo.org
> 
> 
> NO answer on this attempt. ON this page::
> https://www.gentoo.org/get-involved/mailing-lists/all-lists.html
> 
> All I see is: gentoo-proxy-maint
> 
> Am I subscribe?  Did I miss the exact syntax to get subscribed?
> 
> Perhaps proxy-ma...@gentoo.org needs to be listed with the rest of
> the mailing lists?

proxy-ma...@gentoo.org is a mail alias, not a mailing list, you can't
subscribe to that.
gentoo-proxy-ma...@gentoo.org is the mailing list.

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

On Wed, Dec 07, 2016 at 01:17:54PM +1100, Sam Jorna wrote:
> have a look at the new [0]Mentors project, or even send a mail to -dev 

I forgot the link, sorry:

[0] https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Mentors

-- 
Sam Jorna (wraeth)
GnuPG Key: D6180C26


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 08:59:11PM -0500, james wrote:
> On 12/06/2016 07:29 PM, Robin H. Johnson wrote:
> > On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 01:13:12PM -0500, james wrote:
> >> A while back, we we were promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy
> >> folks that did not get on well with IRC. It never materialized,
> > The mail alias proxy-ma...@gentoo.org (same alias as proxy-maintainers@)
> > has 22 people on it. It was created 2013/09/26.
> >
> > The list gentoo-proxy-ma...@lists.gentoo.org was created 2016/05/29.
> > I don't see much usage of it, nobody has emailed since August.
> > https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/
> >
> > The request for it was filed and tracked here:
> > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581370
> >
> > How exactly is that never materialized?
> >
> 
> 
> I subscribe on 6/23/2016::
> 
> From:: gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org
> 

This is the correct address and as it noted, you should get a 
confirmation/welcome email when you've successfully subscribed. Did you 
get this?

Keep in mind, also, that as Robin noted above, the list has been very 
quiet and will remain that way until people start using it.

> So I just now sent email to :
> proxy-maint+subscr...@gentoo.org

This is not the mailing list address, but the alias for the Proxy 
Maintainers project - you can't subscribe to this. That being said, I 
couldn't see this email in my client.

> NO answer on this attempt. ON this page::
> https://www.gentoo.org/get-involved/mailing-lists/all-lists.html

The gentoo-proxy-maint mailing list was indeed missing from that list 
and has just been added thanks to Robin.

> Oh yea, I emailed those quizes timely to one of the devs I was working 
> with, and got no answer. (sorry, not going to identify that dev). So I 
> prefer to answer the latest quizes; you guys can figure out who I 
> should send those to.

It's unfortunate that this happened.

As for whom to send your quizzes to, they would go to your mentor. If 
you don't have a mentor, try approaching a developer with whom you've 
been working and see if they will be able to. Alternatively, you can 
have a look at the new [0]Mentors project, or even send a mail to -dev 
asking for one.

I look forward to having another contributor among the ranks. :)

-- 
Sam Jorna (wraeth)
GnuPG Key: D6180C26

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Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

2016-12-06 Thread William Hubbs

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 05:26:19PM -0500, Mike Gilbert wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 4:15 PM, Michał Górny  wrote:
> > On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 12:54:26 -0500
> > Mike Gilbert  wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
> >> > Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
> >> > depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
> >> > with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
> >>
> >> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.
> >
> > vapier doesn't consider this QA violation a QA violation.
> >
> > https://bugs.gentoo.org/487844
> 
> Perhaps QA could take some action then?
> 
> Updating ~1500 ebuilds with a [tinfo=] use-dep seems like a poor solution.


Our policies are in the dev manual, so please cite the violation there.
If you can't, this is not a qa violation, so please don't call it one.


I don't see a problem with the use flag and suggest updating the other ebuilds.

William


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

2016-12-06 Thread M. J. Everitt

On 07/12/16 01:59, james wrote:
> On 12/06/2016 07:29 PM, Robin H. Johnson wrote:
>> On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 01:13:12PM -0500, james wrote:
>>> A while back, we we were promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy
>>> folks that did not get on well with IRC. It never materialized,
>> The mail alias proxy-ma...@gentoo.org (same alias as proxy-maintainers@)
>> has 22 people on it. It was created 2013/09/26.
>>
>> The list gentoo-proxy-ma...@lists.gentoo.org was created 2016/05/29.
>> I don't see much usage of it, nobody has emailed since August.
>> https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/
>>
>> The request for it was filed and tracked here:
>> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581370
>>
>> How exactly is that never materialized?
>>
>
>
> I subscribe on 6/23/2016::
>
> From:: gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org
>
> gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org
>
>
>
> Hi, this is the Mlmmj program managing the
>  mailing list.
>
> Somebody (and we hope it was you) has requested that your email address
>  be added to the list, without mail delivery. This
> means you will not receive any posts to the list, but you are
> considered a member. This means, for instance, you are able to post to
> a list which only subscribers may post to, while you follow the list
> using a web archive or another subscribed email address.
>
> To confirm you want to do this, please send a message to
> 
>
> which can usually be done simply by replying to this message. The subject
> and the body of the message can be anything.
>
> After doing so, you should receive a reply informing you that the
> operation
> succeeded.
>
>
> And here is the reply::
>
> gentoo-proxy-maint+confsub-nomail-75dc5ad5188e6314-garftd=verizon@lists.gentoo.org
>
>
> on 6/23/2016 10:21am
>
> .
>
>
>
>
> So I just now sent email to :
> proxy-maint+subscr...@gentoo.org
>
>
> NO answer on this attempt. ON this page::
> https://www.gentoo.org/get-involved/mailing-lists/all-lists.html
>
> All I see is: gentoo-proxy-maint
>
> Am I subscribe?  Did I miss the exact syntax to get subscribed?
>
> Perhaps proxy-ma...@gentoo.org needs to be listed with the rest of
> the mailing lists?
>
>
>
> let's see if that one goes through (nothing after 10 minutes).
>
>
> My goal is to read that list and publish documents on what is exactly
> needed to get dev status. I think it's not a good idea to force folks
> to use irc to learn about proxy-maint, get help on ebuilds when you
> need it so there should be a nice set of document and tests one can
> work through, without intervention. Then take the quizes and be
> treated like an outcast for a while, before being able to work the
> portage tree. I am not interested in anything core to gentoo. I am
> extremely
> interested in building minimized cluster ebuilds and wrapping them up
> in stage-4s for ease of installation. Really, nothing threatening at all.
>
>
>
> I already finished up both quiz, including the second(exit) one, but
> there was a few question that were incomplete.
> That was all right befor Goktuk did his revision work, so I'd like to
> answer the updated quized, as most of the questions, when I answered,
> were not even up to EAPI-5. Where are the quiz questions.
>
>
> Oh yea, I emailed those quizes timely to one of the devs I was working
> with, and got no answer. (sorry, not going to identify that dev). So I
> prefer to answer the latest quizes; you guys can figure out who I
> should send those to.
>
>
>
>
>  I never got any mail from the list. I could see a few postings via
> gmane.org. Sure, gmane is mostly dysfunctional now.  I never saw or
> any information on the second list
>
>
> James
>
With the creation of the Mentors project
(https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Mentors) a bit of clarification
has occurred to help prospective developers outside the IRC and/or
proxy-maintainers project). The Recruiters project page contains links
to the current quizzes (linked therein).

hth.



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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish


On 12/06/2016 07:29 PM, Robin H. Johnson wrote:

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 01:13:12PM -0500, james wrote:

A while back, we we were promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy
folks that did not get on well with IRC. It never materialized,

The mail alias proxy-ma...@gentoo.org (same alias as proxy-maintainers@)
has 22 people on it. It was created 2013/09/26.

The list gentoo-proxy-ma...@lists.gentoo.org was created 2016/05/29.
I don't see much usage of it, nobody has emailed since August.
https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/

The request for it was filed and tracked here:
https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581370

How exactly is that never materialized?




I subscribe on 6/23/2016::

From:: gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org

gentoo-proxy-maint+h...@lists.gentoo.org



Hi, this is the Mlmmj program managing the
 mailing list.

Somebody (and we hope it was you) has requested that your email address
 be added to the list, without mail delivery. This
means you will not receive any posts to the list, but you are considered 
a member. This means, for instance, you are able to post to a list which 
only subscribers may post to, while you follow the list using a web 
archive or another subscribed email address.


To confirm you want to do this, please send a message to

which can usually be done simply by replying to this message. The subject
and the body of the message can be anything.

After doing so, you should receive a reply informing you that the operation
succeeded.


And here is the reply::

gentoo-proxy-maint+confsub-nomail-75dc5ad5188e6314-garftd=verizon@lists.gentoo.org

on 6/23/2016 10:21am

.




So I just now sent email to :
proxy-maint+subscr...@gentoo.org


NO answer on this attempt. ON this page::
https://www.gentoo.org/get-involved/mailing-lists/all-lists.html

All I see is: gentoo-proxy-maint

Am I subscribe?  Did I miss the exact syntax to get subscribed?

Perhaps proxy-ma...@gentoo.org needs to be listed with the rest of
the mailing lists?



let's see if that one goes through (nothing after 10 minutes).


My goal is to read that list and publish documents on what is exactly 
needed to get dev status. I think it's not a good idea to force folks to 
use irc to learn about proxy-maint, get help on ebuilds when you need it 
so there should be a nice set of document and tests one can work 
through, without intervention. Then take the quizes and be treated like 
an outcast for a while, before being able to work the portage tree. I am 
not interested in anything core to gentoo. I am extremely

interested in building minimized cluster ebuilds and wrapping them up
in stage-4s for ease of installation. Really, nothing threatening at all.



I already finished up both quiz, including the second(exit) one, but 
there was a few question that were incomplete.

That was all right befor Goktuk did his revision work, so I'd like to
answer the updated quized, as most of the questions, when I answered,
were not even up to EAPI-5. Where are the quiz questions.


Oh yea, I emailed those quizes timely to one of the devs I was working 
with, and got no answer. (sorry, not going to identify that dev). So I 
prefer to answer the latest quizes; you guys can figure out who I should 
send those to.





 I never got any mail from the list. I could see a few postings via 
gmane.org. Sure, gmane is mostly dysfunctional now.  I never saw or any 
information on the second list



James

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

2016-12-06 Thread Robin H. Johnson

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 01:13:12PM -0500, james wrote:
> A while back, we we were promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy
> folks that did not get on well with IRC. It never materialized, 
The mail alias proxy-ma...@gentoo.org (same alias as proxy-maintainers@)
has 22 people on it. It was created 2013/09/26.

The list gentoo-proxy-ma...@lists.gentoo.org was created 2016/05/29.
I don't see much usage of it, nobody has emailed since August.
https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/

The request for it was filed and tracked here:
https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581370

How exactly is that never materialized?

-- 
Robin Hugh Johnson
Gentoo Linux: Dev, Infra Lead, Foundation Trustee & Treasurer
E-Mail   : robb...@gentoo.org
GnuPG FP : 11ACBA4F 4778E3F6 E4EDF38E B27B944E 34884E85
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish

2016-12-06 Thread Gokturk Yuksek

Hi,

james:
> On 12/06/2016 11:35 AM, Craig Inches wrote:
>> Hi,
> 
>> I have decided to stop involvement with the Project as a proxied
>> maintainer, and to stop pursuing becoming a developer. Two main
>> reasons for this, one the community is at times openly hostile on the
>> mailing lists and IRC, of which I have asked people on IRC about whom
>> have responded this is the norm(once in awhile vents is fine it
>> happens but this has been consistently visible) this is ignoring
>> cultural differences that may cause misunderstanding; Secondly the
>> community is very insular and unwelcoming to new comers.
> 
> Sadly, you are at least partially correct. Thick skin should be listed
> as a requirement to participate with Gentoo.  A while back, we we were
> promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy folks that did not get on
> well with IRC. It never materialized, so I too cut my losses with irc
> as a blocker to becoming a gentoo dev. Also, I've has several folks
> promise to work with individually to obtain proxy status, but they all
> just disappear. No doubt, back_channel chatter from some jaded devs
> greased that relationship.
> 

The mailing list for proxy-maint was created 5 months ago [0], can be
reached by emailing gentoo-proxy-ma...@lists.gentoo.org after
subscribing, and the archive is located at [1].

Regarding your comment on working with individual developers, I have not
seen anything related to that in the project alias. I would be more than
happy to personally help you out with proxy-maintainership.

Thanks,

--
gokturk

[0] https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581370
[1] https://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-proxy-maint/




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Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 4:15 PM, Michał Górny  wrote:
> On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 12:54:26 -0500
> Mike Gilbert  wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
>> > Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
>> > depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
>> > with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>>
>> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.
>
> vapier doesn't consider this QA violation a QA violation.
>
> https://bugs.gentoo.org/487844

Perhaps QA could take some action then?

Updating ~1500 ebuilds with a [tinfo=] use-dep seems like a poor solution.

Re: [gentoo-dev] [PATCH] depend.apache.eclass EAPI=6 support

2016-12-06 Thread Andreas K. Huettel

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Am Montag, 5. Dezember 2016, 01:12:56 schrieb Michael Orlitzky:
> On 12/04/2016 06:18 PM, Andreas K. Huettel wrote:
> > Starting with EAPI=6, the variables APACHE_BASEDIR and APACHE_MODULESDIR
> > are not exported in global scope anymore.
> 
> Currently, we emit a warning when using depend.apache with EAPI=6. How
> many packages are triggering that warning? If we stop exporting those
> two variables, then EAPI=6 users of apache-module.eclass are going to
> start installing modules into the root.

Currently four ebuilds with EAPI=6 are using depend.apache.eclass. None of 
them uses the two variables.

However, there's a problem, and that needs still work.

apache-module.eclass makes heavy use of the variables and isn't versioned for 
EAPI yet. This affects only two of the above ebuilds; I'll likely downgrade 
them to EAPI=5 for now.

- -- 

Andreas K. Huettel
Gentoo Linux developer 
dilfri...@gentoo.org
http://www.akhuettel.de/

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Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

2016-12-06 Thread Michał Górny

On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 12:54:26 -0500
Mike Gilbert  wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
> > Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
> > depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
> > with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].  
> 
> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.

vapier doesn't consider this QA violation a QA violation.

https://bugs.gentoo.org/487844

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny



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Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 2:17 AM, Mike Gilbert  wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 1:05 PM, konsolebox  wrote:
>> On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:54 AM, Mike Gilbert  wrote:
>>> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
 Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
 depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
 with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>>>
>>> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.
>>
>> There are people who use packages that rely on sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>
> So we should either:
>
> 1. Always enable tinfo.
> 2. Always disable tinfo, but install a binary compatibility symlink:
>
> /lib/libtinfo.so.6 -> libncurses.so.6

If that's certain not to cause issues now or in the future, and is
workable in all depending packages, then I'm ok with it.

-- 
konsolebox

Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 1:05 PM, konsolebox  wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:54 AM, Mike Gilbert  wrote:
>> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
>>> Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
>>> depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
>>> with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>>
>> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.
>
> There are people who use packages that rely on sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].

So we should either:

1. Always enable tinfo.
2. Always disable tinfo, but install a binary compatibility symlink:

/lib/libtinfo.so.6 -> libncurses.so.6

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish


On 12/06/2016 11:35 AM, Craig Inches wrote:

Hi,



I have decided to stop involvement with the Project as a proxied
maintainer, and to stop pursuing becoming a developer. Two main
reasons for this, one the community is at times openly hostile on the
mailing lists and IRC, of which I have asked people on IRC about whom
have responded this is the norm(once in awhile vents is fine it
happens but this has been consistently visible) this is ignoring
cultural differences that may cause misunderstanding; Secondly the
community is very insular and unwelcoming to new comers.


Sadly, you are at least partially correct. Thick skin should be listed 
as a requirement to participate with Gentoo.  A while back, we we were 
promised an email channel for gentoo-proxy folks that did not get on 
well with IRC. It never materialized, so I too cut my losses with irc

as a blocker to becoming a gentoo dev. Also, I've has several folks
promise to work with individually to obtain proxy status, but they all
just disappear. No doubt, back_channel chatter from some jaded devs 
greased that relationship.


So, I've been planing to just have my own repo, work on ebuilds as
I like (actually accumulated close to 50 now) and F those a.holes
Then along comes Anna:: what a breath of fresh are and wisdom beyond
her years (see her recent post on gentoo-dev), if you have not already
done so.



In twelve months of working with people only 2 have actively
encouraged involvement (shout out to Idella4 and pacho for this), some
projects didn't respond, or if they did they provided no details or
feedback to those of us who where new and trying to contribute. I
don't want to mention names about the negatives because I don't blame
the individuals; it too me seems to be systemic within the community.
I have a few comments about how I think you could improve things, but
feel free to ignore they are offered in the spirit of constructive
criticism:



Review your CoC, its open to abuse as pointed out on another thread.
Enforcement of rules should be consistent.
Review your recruitment strategies, and framework for contribution.
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ might be of interest to some
posters! construct a well reason argument - but be prepared to
reconsider!
Finally encourage Active involvement from all Developers in Gentoo
matters not just in their packages, apathy is your worst enemy



I have updated one outstanding ticket for bugzilla from last week that
was assigned to me as maintainer wanted, and will shortly put through
a pull request on github which updates the meta data for bugzilla and
displaycal removing me as a maintainer.



To end on a positive note, I was a user for many years and will
continue for the short term at the very least as I think the concept
of gentoo is great.


Anna Wilcox has proposed some new and invigorating ideas so that all of 
gentoo may prosper from the splintering into the various gentoo derived 
distributions. In fact I sincerely hope that her ideas are coalesced 
into a GLEP and that forking gentoo, (which is already a meta_distro) is 
rigorously supported and encouraged and stream-lined. I just hope those 
sailing the Gentoo ship, learn some humility and how to assimilate the 
best of the ideas from the various gentoo-derived distros back into 
gentoo proper. CoreOS is a very rich source of materials and ideas, ripe 
for integration back into gentoo-proper, imho;ymmv.


My research on Anna yields a deep wisdom and I have found new reasons 
for joy, related to gentoo, because of her (team) vision. Perhaps you 
should at least go and view www.adelielinux.org.


She is definitely of leadership quality, with impeccable vision and 
manners. I for one, know I can only dream about such qualities, but I'm 
old and cantankerous and fit right in here at gentoo, with the strong 
collective of 'old  bastards'.


P.S. Never give up on Gentoo, as that would be unwise, imho.


Peace and Best of luck to you, Craig.

James



Cheers,
Craig

Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:54 AM, Mike Gilbert  wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
>> Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
>> depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
>> with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>
> I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.

There are people who use packages that rely on sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].

-- 
konsolebox

Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:12 AM, Ian Stakenvicius  wrote:
> On 05/12/16 06:13 AM, konsolebox wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
>> depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
>> with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
>>
>> It could be as simple as:
>>
>> IUSE="tinfo"
>>
>> RDEPEND="sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo=]"
>>
>> pkg_setup() {
>> use tinfo && export LDFLAGS="-ltinfo ${LDFLAGS}" LIBS="-ltinfo ${LIBS}"
>> }
>>
>> The last line can be changed/enhanced, depending on the package.
>>
>> It helps keep binaries consistent even if sys-libs/ncurses[-tinfo]
>> gets recompiled to sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo], because they are forced to
>> be recompiled.  This is better than hard-coded dynamic workarounds.
>>
>
> Should this message perhaps have been directed to a particular set of
> developers or package maintainers rather than everyone on this list?

Sorry, I just thought it's better to send it to the list first.  I
already created a bug report for it (#601764).  It was rejected right
away for a reason not related to the main point.  I also made a reply
in #457530.

> I'm not sure what our stance is on propagating USE flags to rdeps when
> the package itself doesn't care (except due to the --libs output
> changing from pkg-config).  I feel that adding tinfo to IUSE the way
> it's suggested here might be the only technical solution right now,
> but at the same time it seems like something that might be better
> suited to something that should be addressed through other mechanisms
> in a future-EAPI...

Yes I thought a better solution can be provided in a future EAPI, like
perhaps a 
force-rebuild-everything-that-depends-on-the-package-if-flag-usage-changes,
but I'd rather not wait for it.  A new mechanism like that might also
force rebuilding of packages that don't rely on the features of
libtinfo.  An explicit declaration that a package wants tinfo like
sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo=] is better.

> Note in particular though that the pkg_setup example ISN'T imo a good
> idea -- rather, pkg-config should be used, as it will return the
> appropriate --libs output whether ncurses is built with USE=tinfo
> enabled or not.

Yes, I also said in my reply that pkg-config can be used for more accuracy.

-- 
konsolebox

Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 6:13 AM, konsolebox  wrote:
> Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
> depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
> with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].

I would rather see the tinfo USE flag removed from ncurses.

Re: [gentoo-dev] tinfo flag

2016-12-06 Thread Ian Stakenvicius

On 05/12/16 06:13 AM, konsolebox wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Please consider promoting the use of tinfo flag in packages that
> depend on sys-libs/ncurses so that they would synchronize properly
> with sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo].
> 
> It could be as simple as:
> 
> IUSE="tinfo"
> 
> RDEPEND="sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo=]"
> 
> pkg_setup() {
> use tinfo && export LDFLAGS="-ltinfo ${LDFLAGS}" LIBS="-ltinfo ${LIBS}"
> }
> 
> The last line can be changed/enhanced, depending on the package.
> 
> It helps keep binaries consistent even if sys-libs/ncurses[-tinfo]
> gets recompiled to sys-libs/ncurses[tinfo], because they are forced to
> be recompiled.  This is better than hard-coded dynamic workarounds.
> 

Should this message perhaps have been directed to a particular set of
developers or package maintainers rather than everyone on this list?

I'm not sure what our stance is on propagating USE flags to rdeps when
the package itself doesn't care (except due to the --libs output
changing from pkg-config).  I feel that adding tinfo to IUSE the way
it's suggested here might be the only technical solution right now,
but at the same time it seems like something that might be better
suited to something that should be addressed through other mechanisms
in a future-EAPI...

Note in particular though that the pkg_setup example ISN'T imo a good
idea -- rather, pkg-config should be used, as it will return the
appropriate --libs output whether ncurses is built with USE=tinfo
enabled or not.

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[gentoo-dev] Re: [gentoo-project] Cross Post due to technical component - Thanks for all the fish