Top-posting etc. (was: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu)
On Tuesday 03 April 2007 18:15:07 Bayrouni wrote:
Sylvain Chouleur a écrit :
1) I'm sorry but don't understand what 'top post' means
When you reply don't write your message at the top but at the bottom.
just at the bottom.
In other words, write at the last line.
Well, that's somewhat better, but still not ideal.
top post: v.
1. Writing your entire reply to a message (generally email or newsgroup
posting) above any quoted material you are replying to.
bottom post: v.
1. Writing your entire reply to a message (generally email or newsgroup
posting) below any quoted material you are replying to.
Top posting is generally considered either wasteful, if the quoted part
isn't
required, or confusing, since the answers to questions will appear the
questions themselves and the conversation will generally be read in the
wrong order. This being said, top posting is preferred in some fora. Top
posting is a common beginner (see n00b) behavior in the face of properly
behaving email/newsgroup client (see below). At least one mail client
(Microsoft Outlook) makes it intentionally difficult to not to top post,
though cursor, signature, and quoted material placement AND non-standard
quoting methods.
Bottom posting is preferred over top posting in most fora, but is still
wasteful especially in combination with me too posts, in which the volume
of quoted (and thus at least partially redundant) material greatly dwarfs
the
amount of unquoted (and ideally original) material.
The most preferred method of replying is sometimes called interleaved
posting. In this case you quote only the relevant parts of the message
you
are replying to, leaving only enough information to provide a context for
your material. The appropriate amount of quoted material can differ
greatly
based on the fora for which the message is intended. Your material is
placed
after what it is replying to, which might be before other quoted material.
Here's an example:
--- Begin Example ---
I've filed bug XXX against foo/bar-1.1_pre2; it breaks some of my
scripts
I wrote against foo/bar-1.0
That's not a bug. It's a feature.
Riposte A
I see the security implications, but I've attached a patch that retains the
1.0 behavior while addressing the buffer overflow risk in a future-proof
manner.
Riposte C
This is the problem with open source software. The %#$@ developers want it
to
be broken. That's a stupid point and you should be ashamed for presenting
it.
--- End Example ---
In the example above, the Riposte B text was dropped since the message
contained no direct reply to it.
A properly behaving email/newsgroup client, in absence of other user
preferences, should quote the entire message being replied to (the
format=flowed RFC covers acceptable quoting methods), place the user's
cursor
at the top (or slightly above) the quoted material, and automatically
insert
the content of the users signature (on UNIX, baring other configuration,
this
is in contents of the file $HOME/.sig) below the quoted material after the
standard signature separator ('-- ' on it's own line). The user will then,
move down the message, deleting quoted material irrelevant to their reply
and
writing their content immediately after the relevent quoted material and
stopping when they reach the signature separator. New users often simply
type their reply, without touching the quoted material resulting in a top
post (see above).
--
Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_))
ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-'
http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/
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Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
Hi, On Mon, 02 Apr 2007 23:05:09 +0200 Sylvain Chouleur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I tried to install and use lm_sensors but it don't detect any sensors. Since there are really lots of drivers, I just guess you didn't compile the right ones when building your kernel. Moreover, I think it's a problem of acpi or the kernel configuration because on my debian, I don't use lm_sensors, just acpi. That's two completely different things. May be detection is bad made or may be cpu id bad used, but top show me that: [...] ?!? How does top come into play here?!? and acpi -t: Thermal 1: ok, 65.0 degrees C OK, so ACPI temperature zone support is working. And at this state, on debian, the thermal is at 53 degrees C so and don't understand. If that's why you posted top output: It doesn't depend on absolute load. Maybe your debian box enables throttling, either ACPI P-States, or CPUfreq. You might want to play with the cpufreq ondemand governor (there's also an alternative implementation, read the docs of those kernel options) or cpufreqd. Is there some option to activate in the kernel to support better the thermal or cpu use? CPUfreq, see above. And it certainly won't make CPU use better (it throttles) -- but might lower the temperature. -hwh -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
Hello! I have found the source of my problem: I've not a wifi card integrated in my laptop and so I'm using a usb dongle with ndiswrapper driver. And it's when this usb key is plugged that the acpi temperature is growing and it don't happens if it's a classic usb key (storage for example) which is plugged. So we have changed the problem! But it is not resolved :( So do you have any idea for this problem?? Thank you for your help! From: Hans-Werner Hilse [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 11:24:10 +0200 Hi, On Mon, 02 Apr 2007 23:05:09 +0200 Sylvain Chouleur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I tried to install and use lm_sensors but it don't detect any sensors. Since there are really lots of drivers, I just guess you didn't compile the right ones when building your kernel. Moreover, I think it's a problem of acpi or the kernel configuration because on my debian, I don't use lm_sensors, just acpi. That's two completely different things. May be detection is bad made or may be cpu id bad used, but top show me that: [...] ?!? How does top come into play here?!? and acpi -t: Thermal 1: ok, 65.0 degrees C OK, so ACPI temperature zone support is working. And at this state, on debian, the thermal is at 53 degrees C so and don't understand. If that's why you posted top output: It doesn't depend on absolute load. Maybe your debian box enables throttling, either ACPI P-States, or CPUfreq. You might want to play with the cpufreq ondemand governor (there's also an alternative implementation, read the docs of those kernel options) or cpufreqd. Is there some option to activate in the kernel to support better the thermal or cpu use? CPUfreq, see above. And it certainly won't make CPU use better (it throttles) -- but might lower the temperature. -hwh -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list _ Ten : Messenger en illimité sur votre mobile ! http://mobile.live.fr/messenger/ten/ -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Tuesday 03 April 2007, Sylvain Chouleur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote about 'Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu': I have found the source of my problem: 1) Don't top post. 2) 65 C isn't a problem. My laptop regularly runs 85+ C under load. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ pgpobwYw7w9o8.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
1) I'm sorry but don't understand what 'top post' means 2) It's not the temperature itself which is my problem, but the fan which rotate very quickly and I want to have a very clean system _ Personnalisez votre Messenger avec Live.com http://www.windowslive.fr/livecom/ -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
Sylvain Chouleur a écrit : 1) I'm sorry but don't understand what 'top post' means When you reply don't write your message at the top but at the bottom. just at the bottom. In other words, write at the last line. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
I tried to install and use lm_sensors but it don't detect any sensors. Moreover, I think it's a problem of acpi or the kernel configuration because on my debian, I don't use lm_sensors, just acpi. May be detection is bad made or may be cpu id bad used, but top show me that: top - 23:01:52 up 23 min, 6 users, load average: 0.28, 0.25, 0.25 Tasks: 86 total, 3 running, 82 sleeping, 0 stopped, 1 zombie Cpu(s): 10.3%us, 1.7%sy, 0.0%ni, 69.4%id, 16.9%wa, 1.7%hi, 0.0%si, 0.0%st Mem:448112k total, 305916k used, 142196k free,29056k buffers Swap: 747012k total,0k used, 747012k free, 161780k cached and acpi -t: Thermal 1: ok, 65.0 degrees C And at this state, on debian, the thermal is at 53 degrees C so and don't understand. Is there some option to activate in the kernel to support better the thermal or cpu use? (I'm using a mobile AMD Athlon(tm) XP2400+, 1788.817Mhz) Thank you for your help! On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 02:49:31 -0800 luis . emc2 wrote: On Fri, Mar 30, 2007 at 11:10:58AM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I check the temperatures whith acpi: acpi -t I think some chipset don't give the temperature directly, actually return a numerical value and you have to run a math formula to calculate the correct temperatura. With the app lmsensors * sys-apps/lm_sensors Latest version available: 2.10.1 Latest version installed: 2.10.1 Size of downloaded files: 2,663 kB Homepage:http://www.lm-sensors.org/ Description: Hardware Monitoring user-space utilities License: GPL-2 in the file /etc/lmsensors.conf you must config the formula With acpi I don't know how configurate, but I think you can use lmsensors to read acpi information. If you don't find how to configure acpi, try lmsensors _ Gagnez des écrans plats avec Live.com http://www.image-addict.fr/ -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
I check the temperatures whith acpi: acpi -t From: Jan-Hendrik Zab [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 00:00:47 +0200 On Thu, 29 Mar 2007 23:28:10 +0200 Sylvain Chouleur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I don't have this file What program is supposed to make it? lm_sensors How are you checking the temperatures? On Thu, Mar 29, 2007 at 04:27:36PM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: Hello I have a little problem on my gentoo, when I check the temperature I see that it is always about 10°C higher than when I am on debian. However, the cpu is at 0.3% used, as in debian. Check the file /etc/sensors.conf (or copy the debian file) -- | Jan-Hendrik Zab | +49 (0)1773392888 | http://www.v3ng34nce.org -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list _ Avec Windows Live OneCare éliminez tous les virus de votre PC ! http://www.windowslive.fr/liveonecare/default.asp -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Fri, Mar 30, 2007 at 11:10:58AM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I check the temperatures whith acpi: acpi -t I think some chipset don't give the temperature directly, actually return a numerical value and you have to run a math formula to calculate the correct temperatura. With the app lmsensors * sys-apps/lm_sensors Latest version available: 2.10.1 Latest version installed: 2.10.1 Size of downloaded files: 2,663 kB Homepage:http://www.lm-sensors.org/ Description: Hardware Monitoring user-space utilities License: GPL-2 in the file /etc/lmsensors.conf you must config the formula With acpi I don't know how configurate, but I think you can use lmsensors to read acpi information. If you don't find how to configure acpi, try lmsensors -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Freitag, 30. März 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, Mar 30, 2007 at 11:10:58AM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I check the temperatures whith acpi: acpi -t I think some chipset don't give the temperature directly, actually return a numerical value and you have to run a math formula to calculate the correct temperatura. With the app lmsensors * sys-apps/lm_sensors Latest version available: 2.10.1 Latest version installed: 2.10.1 Size of downloaded files: 2,663 kB Homepage:http://www.lm-sensors.org/ Description: Hardware Monitoring user-space utilities License: GPL-2 in the file /etc/lmsensors.conf you must config the formula no. You 'must' not. For most chips and a lot of mainboards the correct formulas are already there. So there is no need to do anything. Just emerge lmsensors and be happay. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 12:58:04 +0200, Hemmann, Volker Armin wrote: For most chips and a lot of mainboards the correct formulas are already there. So there is no need to do anything. Just emerge lmsensors and be happay. You will probably need to run sensors-detect after emerging it. -- Neil Bothwick A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
I'have installed lm_sensors and run sensors-detect but after, when I run sensors, he tell me that no sensors have been detected From: Neil Bothwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 12:44:31 +0100 On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 12:58:04 +0200, Hemmann, Volker Armin wrote: For most chips and a lot of mainboards the correct formulas are already there. So there is no need to do anything. Just emerge lmsensors and be happay. You will probably need to run sensors-detect after emerging it. -- Neil Bothwick A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? signature.asc _ Windows Live Spaces : créez votre blog à votre image ! http://www.windowslive.fr/spaces -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On pátek 30 března 2007, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I'have installed lm_sensors and run sensors-detect but after, when I run sensors, he tell me that no sensors have been detected IIRC you have to start lm_sensors first. /etc/init.d/lm_sensors start -- Petr Uzel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ : 101606095 Gentoo Linux -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:52:40 +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I'have installed lm_sensors and run sensors-detect but after, when I run sensors, he tell me that no sensors have been detected A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? Have you run /etc/init.d/lm_sensors start? -- Neil Bothwick Does fuzzy logic tickle? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
I have added lm_sensors to default runlevel when I do /etc/init.d/lm_sensors start, I've got this: * Loading lm_sensors modules... * Loading i2c-ali1535 ... [ ok ] * Loading eeprom ... [ ok ] * Initializing sensors ... [ !! ] From: Neil Bothwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:20:14 +0100 On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:52:40 +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I'have installed lm_sensors and run sensors-detect but after, when I run sensors, he tell me that no sensors have been detected A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? Have you run /etc/init.d/lm_sensors start? -- Neil Bothwick Does fuzzy logic tickle? signature.asc _ Gagnez des pc Windows Vista avec Live.com http://www.image-addict.fr/ -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
-Original Message- From: Sylvain Chouleur [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 30 March 2007 16:53 To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu I have added lm_sensors to default runlevel when I do /etc/init.d/lm_sensors start, I've got this: * Loading lm_sensors modules... * Loading i2c-ali1535 ... [ ok ] * Loading eeprom ... [ ok ] * Initializing sensors ... [ !! ] Looks like one of the needed modules isn't being loaded correctly or somesuch. Sensors-detect should have given you a list of the modules needed - try loading them all manually and run `sensors` ? (minus quotes) PS The comments regarding top posting are for your attention, by the way. It takes two seconds extra to bottom post vs top post and makes it much easier to follow a thread :) -- djn I do not represent anyone else in emails I send to this list. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 17:52:56 +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: I have added lm_sensors to default runlevel when I do /etc/init.d/lm_sensors start, I've got this: * Loading lm_sensors modules... * Loading i2c-ali1535 ... [ ok ] * Loading eeprom ... [ ok ] * Initializing sensors ... [ !! ] Enough of the top posting PLEASE! Let us know about your hardware and post the contents of /etc/conf.d/lm_sensors -- Neil Bothwick As a computer, I find your faith in technology amusing. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Thu, Mar 29, 2007 at 04:27:36PM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: Hello I have a little problem on my gentoo, when I check the temperature I see that it is always about 10°C higher than when I am on debian. However, the cpu is at 0.3% used, as in debian. Check the file /etc/sensors.conf (or copy the debian file) -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
But I don't have this file What program is supposed to make it? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 21:40:46 +0200 On Thu, Mar 29, 2007 at 04:27:36PM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: Hello I have a little problem on my gentoo, when I check the temperature I see that it is always about 10°C higher than when I am on debian. However, the cpu is at 0.3% used, as in debian. Check the file /etc/sensors.conf (or copy the debian file) -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list _ Découvrez le Blog heroic Fantaisy d'Eragon! http://eragon-heroic-fantasy.spaces.live.com/ -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
On Thu, 29 Mar 2007 23:28:10 +0200 Sylvain Chouleur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I don't have this file What program is supposed to make it? lm_sensors How are you checking the temperatures? On Thu, Mar 29, 2007 at 04:27:36PM +0200, Sylvain Chouleur wrote: Hello I have a little problem on my gentoo, when I check the temperature I see that it is always about 10°C higher than when I am on debian. However, the cpu is at 0.3% used, as in debian. Check the file /etc/sensors.conf (or copy the debian file) -- | Jan-Hendrik Zab | +49 (0)1773392888 | http://www.v3ng34nce.org -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Thermal cpu
Sylvain Chouleur wrote: But I don't have this file What program is supposed to make it? I use the lm-sensors built into the kernel and I don't have that file either. If he is using the kernel drivers that may be why he doesn't have it. Than again, I may be wrong too. Funny thing is, mine is accurate as compared to what the BIOS says. Funny it is off like that. Dale :-) :-) -- www.myspace.com/-remove-me-dalek1967 Copy n paste then remove the -remove-me- part. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
