Re: New team for Dari (prs)
Roozbeh Pournader wrote: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 9:49 PM, Mazdak Kiani [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My language ISO 639-3 code is prs: http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/documentation.asp?id=prs http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=prs When we can use ISO 639-1 language codes, we should use those. ISO 639-3 should only be used when a code does not exist. Locale projects, including Unicode CLDR, use fa_AF for Dari. For example, see here: http://unicode.org/cldr/apps/survey?_=fa_AFx=languages The list of languages mentioned, for example, shows Afghan names of languages, like hespaanavi for Spanish (vs. Iranian Persian espaaniaayi) and dari for Persian (vs. Iranian Persian faarsi). Same is true about the Computer Locale Requirements for Afghanistan project, commissioned by the United Nations Development Programme and approved by Afghanistan's Ministry of Communications, which recommends the code fa_AF again (disclaimer: I'm a co-author of that report): http://www.evertype.com/standards/af/ Using fa_AF, your users will also have the benefit of seeing Iranian Persian translations when a Dari translation is not yet available, which helps the users a lot, as Iranian Persian is almost always legible to Afghans. Good luck, Roozbeh ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n Salaam, I support what Roozbeh says, cause Dari is not just a language but an official language in Afghanistan (The only country where Dari is an official language) so fa_AF is I think better than prs. Regards, -Khalid ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: New team for Dari (prs)
Hi i agree with *Tommi, we should use a general name that can be used for more countries,that accepted by afghans iranians and tajiks and everybody who speak farsi. fa_af limits us to afghanestan.* On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 11:55 AM, Khalid Amiri Amarkhail [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Roozbeh Pournader wrote: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 9:49 PM, Mazdak Kiani [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My language ISO 639-3 code is prs: http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/documentation.asp?id=prs http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=prs When we can use ISO 639-1 language codes, we should use those. ISO 639-3 should only be used when a code does not exist. Locale projects, including Unicode CLDR, use fa_AF for Dari. For example, see here: http://unicode.org/cldr/apps/survey?_=fa_AFx=languages The list of languages mentioned, for example, shows Afghan names of languages, like hespaanavi for Spanish (vs. Iranian Persian espaaniaayi) and dari for Persian (vs. Iranian Persian faarsi). Same is true about the Computer Locale Requirements for Afghanistan project, commissioned by the United Nations Development Programme and approved by Afghanistan's Ministry of Communications, which recommends the code fa_AF again (disclaimer: I'm a co-author of that report): http://www.evertype.com/standards/af/ Using fa_AF, your users will also have the benefit of seeing Iranian Persian translations when a Dari translation is not yet available, which helps the users a lot, as Iranian Persian is almost always legible to Afghans. Good luck, Roozbeh ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n Salaam, I support what Roozbeh says, cause Dari is not just a language but an official language in Afghanistan (The only country where Dari is an official language) so fa_AF is I think better than prs. Regards, -Khalid ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: New team for Dari (prs)
On Wed, 2008-06-25 at 08:07 +0300, Tommi Vainikainen wrote: Roozbeh Pournader [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 9:49 PM, Mazdak Kiani [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My language ISO 639-3 code is prs: http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/documentation.asp?id=prs http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=prs When we can use ISO 639-1 language codes, we should use those. ISO 639-3 should only be used when a code does not exist. At least such should is not documented on GNOME's wiki. Any language needs to get a libc locale first, and these restrictions are enforced there. Locale projects, including Unicode CLDR, use fa_AF for Dari. For example, see here: According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dari_%28Persian%29) this Dari language is also spoken in Pakistan, Tajikistan and Turkmenistan. Should Dari speakers in those countries use country code _AF as their locale? Isn't such usage problematic in many ways? Therefore I argue that technically it is better to use three letter language codes if ISO standard has assigned a separate code, because then there is no disambiguity of using country codes etc. Yeah, like, because English is spoken in so many countries, why do we have en_US, en_CA, en_UK, ...? -- behdad http://behdad.org/ Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -- Benjamin Franklin, 1759 ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: New team for Dari (prs)
On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 08:43:07AM -0400, Behdad Esfahbod wrote: On Wed, 2008-06-25 at 08:07 +0300, Tommi Vainikainen wrote: ... According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dari_%28Persian%29) this Dari language is also spoken in Pakistan, Tajikistan and Turkmenistan. Should Dari speakers in those countries use country code _AF as their locale? Isn't such usage problematic in many ways? Therefore I argue that technically it is better to use three letter language codes if ISO standard has assigned a separate code, because then there is no disambiguity of using country codes etc. Yeah, like, because English is spoken in so many countries, why do we have en_US, en_CA, en_UK, ...? What about the case like Arabic where we have one common ar locale where all translations reside, and several ar_XX locales per country to allow different locale settings. If Dari is spoken in different countries, it might not be a good idea to force all Dari speakers to use one single locale. Regards, Khaled -- Khaled Hosny Arabic localizer and member of Arabeyes.org team signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: New team for Dari (prs)
On Wed, 2008-06-25 at 16:16 +0300, Khaled Hosny wrote: On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 08:43:07AM -0400, Behdad Esfahbod wrote: On Wed, 2008-06-25 at 08:07 +0300, Tommi Vainikainen wrote: ... According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dari_%28Persian%29) this Dari language is also spoken in Pakistan, Tajikistan and Turkmenistan. Should Dari speakers in those countries use country code _AF as their locale? Isn't such usage problematic in many ways? Therefore I argue that technically it is better to use three letter language codes if ISO standard has assigned a separate code, because then there is no disambiguity of using country codes etc. Yeah, like, because English is spoken in so many countries, why do we have en_US, en_CA, en_UK, ...? What about the case like Arabic where we have one common ar locale where all translations reside, and several ar_XX locales per country to allow different locale settings. If Dari is spoken in different countries, it might not be a good idea to force all Dari speakers to use one single locale. Sure, but I'm not sure that the Afghan and Tajik use the exact same language. Both are part of a family called Dari, aka Eastern Persian, as opposed to Iranian Persian which is called Western Persian. Others prefer to call the language used in Tajikistan Tajik, to distinguish it from the Afghan version. Both are fairly recognizable by a native of Iran. And Iranian Persian is recognizable by both Afghans and Tajiks. The root language is really fa, as Roozbeh suggested. Quoting [1]: fas is the ISO 639-3 language code for Persian. Its ISO 639-1 code is fa. There are 2 individual language codes assigned: 1. prs — Dari Persian 2. pes — Western Persian So, should we use change the fa translations to pes? No. Note that ISO639-3 codes are more of scholarly interest. Also according to [2], both prd and prs are ISO639-3 language codes for Persian (Dari). No idea what the difference is. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_639_macrolanguage Regards, Khaled -- behdad http://behdad.org/ Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -- Benjamin Franklin, 1759 ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Announcing new translation team coordinator for Romanian [ro]
Hello, I'm the current translation team coordinator for Romanian [ro]. As I'm unable to dedicate the necesary time to translations, Mișu Moldovan [EMAIL PROTECTED] agreed to take this over. He is an active GNOME translator (keeping the libs to 100% for a long time now), and also involved in lots of other translation projects (translation of XFCE, pidgin, xmms, the Diacritice project, etc.). What steps need to be performed for a svn account for Mișu? Regards, -- Mugurel Tudor [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: Announcing new translation team coordinator for Romanian [ro]
Le mercredi 25 juin 2008 à 20:29 +0300, Mugurel Tudor a écrit : Hello, I'm the current translation team coordinator for Romanian [ro]. As I'm unable to dedicate the necesary time to translations, Mișu Moldovan [EMAIL PROTECTED] agreed to take this over. He is an active GNOME translator (keeping the libs to 100% for a long time now), and also involved in lots of other translation projects (translation of XFCE, pidgin, xmms, the Diacritice project, etc.). What steps need to be performed for a svn account for Mișu? http://live.gnome.org/TranslationProject/RequestingAnAccount http://live.gnome.org/NewAccounts Good reading :-) Claude ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: New team for Dari (prs)
On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Tommi Vainikainen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dari_%28Persian%29) this Dari language is also spoken in Pakistan, Tajikistan and Turkmenistan. Should Dari speakers in those countries use country code _AF as their locale? Isn't such usage problematic in many ways? Not at all, if we distinguish spoken languages with written languages. In Tajikistan, they write the language in Cyrillic, and use the tg ISO 639-1 code. In Pakistan and Turkmenistan, they rarely write in the language, and when they do, they either use the Iranian orthography or the Afghan one. We translate computer user interfaces to written languages, not spoken languages. Therefore I argue that technically it is better to use three letter language codes if ISO standard has assigned a separate code, because then there is no disambiguity of using country codes etc. Let's say I am a Persian speaker living in the US. What should I use on my GNU/Linux computer when there is no fa_US? I would use fa_IR or fa_AF depending on my preference for the orthography, and then change other locale settings like LC_PAPER, the timezone, etc to use US measurements. Roozbeh ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: New team for Dari (prs)
On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 8:24 AM, Behdad Esfahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Note that ISO639-3 codes are more of scholarly interest. They definitely are. And they are based on a very controversial source, Ethnologue. For some of the controversies around Ethnologue, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnologue Roozbeh ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: Slowness in farsi translation
Dont speak in argot free software isnt your heritage you must change your treatment it is not proportional with free software idea On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 12:26 AM, Roozbeh Pournader [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 10:47 PM, Mohammad Foroughi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] So, Roozbeh, please let others help you... Best Regards, Mohammad Foroughi Any person (including people who have not previously contributed to GNOME translations) is welcome to review Persian translations of GNOME, if he/she feels competent. I am not stopping anybody from reviewing translations. The bugs are there, and anybody can comment on them. (I always do a quick review myself before committing patches, which may become exhaustive if I think other people's reviews have not been thorough enough.) We've been reviewing translations and fixing bugs in Persian translations in the meanwhile too. A few patches from Hedayat Vatankhah, Shervin Afshar, Amir Hedayaty, Elnaz Sarbar, and Arash Mousavi have been reviewed and/or committed early this month, for example. Elnaz Sarbar and Behdad Esfahbod had helped review them. (I have put your patches at the end of my own queue, as I believe people acting in a polite manner deserve more attention.) This email of yours is again full of allegations and misinformation. I can go over your email and point your false claims again and again, but it is apparently not worth the time. I won't be able to work with you if you continue the attacks. Roozbeh Pournader ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
Re: Slowness in farsi translation
شما چی فکر کردید؟ این روزبه پورنادر یه بچه ننر لوسه که با دانشگاه شریف هم کلی مشکل داشته! این آدم کلی پول از دانشگاه شریف گرفته و هیچ کار مفیدی هم نکرده. Roozbeh: You are just a nasty fascist. Your only prominence is that you was the first one who got coordination of fa. It is about 2 years that you are inactive and there is no significant change in persian translation. But just know that some people are trying to contribute, you seem active! You just fucked up persian translation. افرادی مثل تو و اون بهداد بی تربیت ترجمه فارسی را به نابودی کشانده اند. I know why you re-start your translation: You just wanna keep your domination on persian translation. Please tell the list about your problems with Sharif University (sharif.edu) and problems you made. Please tell the list about times where you blocked translation... 2008/6/26 s.m ziaei [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Dont speak in argot free software isnt your heritage you must change your treatment it is not proportional with free software idea On Wed, Jun 25, 2008 at 12:26 AM, Roozbeh Pournader [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 10:47 PM, Mohammad Foroughi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] So, Roozbeh, please let others help you... Best Regards, Mohammad Foroughi Any person (including people who have not previously contributed to GNOME translations) is welcome to review Persian translations of GNOME, if he/she feels competent. I am not stopping anybody from reviewing translations. The bugs are there, and anybody can comment on them. (I always do a quick review myself before committing patches, which may become exhaustive if I think other people's reviews have not been thorough enough.) We've been reviewing translations and fixing bugs in Persian translations in the meanwhile too. A few patches from Hedayat Vatankhah, Shervin Afshar, Amir Hedayaty, Elnaz Sarbar, and Arash Mousavi have been reviewed and/or committed early this month, for example. Elnaz Sarbar and Behdad Esfahbod had helped review them. (I have put your patches at the end of my own queue, as I believe people acting in a polite manner deserve more attention.) This email of yours is again full of allegations and misinformation. I can go over your email and point your false claims again and again, but it is apparently not worth the time. I won't be able to work with you if you continue the attacks. Roozbeh Pournader ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n ___ gnome-i18n mailing list gnome-i18n@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-i18n
