Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[Liz Dodd]

On Wed, 31 Aug 2022 21:08:35 -0500
"W. Neal Lewis"  wrote:

> David,
> 
> That's where this all started.
> 
> It didn't make sense so I thought I would ask people who were more 
> knowledgeable.
> 
> I did look on line and nothing on line made any more sense.
> 
> So, thank you for your help.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Neal Lewis

Putting on my educator hat 

Not everyone understands the same way, people read the same words and
assign different meaning to those words.
So we need access to lots of different approaches.

Putting on my moderator hat
.
Officially this list does not support accounting discussions, but it is
one of the things we do here, as well as how to use Gnucash.

Liz
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Re: [GNC] Currency quotes stopped

[Jim DeLaHunt]

On 2022-08-31 18:38, rob wrote:


Hi Guys,

I have Windows 11 with Gnucash 4.11 installed and also "Online price
retrieval for Gnucash".  Finance quote is 1.52.  Gnc-fq-check is ok.
AlphaVantage key API is also ok.

I can get update quotes for shares but since a few weeks no update quotes
for the currencies.


Hello, Rob:

I am in the same boat. GnuCash using Alphavantage stopped retrieving 
quotes for currencies sometime between 7-14 August. It was a nuisance 
for me, too.


Apparently what happened is that Alphavantage changed their system. 
Alphavantage started limiting, to paying customers only, a certain kind 
of currency quote which used to be free. There is a workaround. The 
software in between GnuCash and Alphavantage, known as Finance::Quote, 
can change to using Alphavantage a different way, a way which is still 
free. But it will take time for them to make that change, and for 
GnuCash to incorporate it.


The details are in a GnuCash bug report 
. This matter was 
discussed on this list earlier. See 
 
in the archives.



Please tell me how to solve this. Its important for me.
If you are adventurous, and comfortable editing Perl code, you can patch 
your own copy of Finance::Quote. The GnuCash bug report has a link to 
the Finance::Quote bug report. The patch is described there.

Thanks


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[GNC] Currency quotes stopped

[rob]

Hi Guys,

I have Windows 11 with Gnucash 4.11 installed and also "Online price
retrieval for Gnucash".  Finance quote is 1.52.  Gnc-fq-check is ok.
AlphaVantage key API is also ok.

I can get update quotes for shares but since a few weeks no update quotes
for the currencies.

Please tell me how to solve this. Its important for me.

Thanks
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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[W. Neal Lewis]

Stan,

Correction made.

Tehachapi Loop is one of the great Civil Engineering feats of this world 
and well worth coming to see.


Thanks for building the observation platform. You have the thanks of a 
great many people.


Best regards,

Neal Lewis

On 8/31/22 1:42 PM, Stan Brown wrote:

Sure thing! If you have followups about Gnucash please send them to the mailing 
list so that everyone can benefit (or offer corrections if needed).

I agree about the Loop, and we get a fair number of international visitors. We 
recently built a concrete and wood observation platform overlooking it, so you 
no longer have to just stand on the shoulder of the road.

--
Regards,
Stan Brown
https://Brownmath.com
http://oakroadsystems.com

On Tue, Aug 30, 2022, at 7:08 PM, W. Neal Lewis wrote:

Thank you Stan,

Let me study what you have said and let it soak in. It is good information.

Thank you,

Wm. Neal Lewis
Newton, Kansas
Industrial & Systems Engineer

P.S. Techachapi is a beautiful place and has one of the great Civil
Engineering wonders of the world, "The Techachapi Loop" Many years ago I
got to watch trains crossing over themselves. Quite an awesome sight. WNL

On 8/29/22 3:05 PM, Stan Brown wrote:

I agree with what Michael or Penny wrote, but I'm going to post anyway
because seeing it described in slightly different ways may be helpful
for the original questioner.

On 2022-08-28 15:38, W. Neal Lewis wrote:

However, although (A+L)=Eq, (A+L)≠Eq+(I+Ex). I have added a term to the
right side that is most decidedly not on the left ∴ they cannot be equal.
∴ A and L must be terms that include other factors.

First off, it's assets MINUS Liabilities, not plus, and the same for
Expenses. If you have a $500,000 house and a mortgage balance of
$150,000, with no other assets or liabilities. your net worth (Equity)
is not $500,000+150,000 = $650,000; it's $500,000-150,000 = $350,000.

Secondly, your two equations assume different conditions. The more
general equation
  Assets - Liabilities = Equity + Income - Expenses
is always valid, so that's probably the one to think about until it's
second nature.

But what happens if(*) you "close the books"? This means to total up the
year's or month's income and expenses, post the total net income or net
loss into an Equity account such as Retained Earnings, and zero out all
the income and expense accounts. GnuCash has a menu item to perform this
closing for you. Since all income accounts and all expense accounts have
zero balances right after closing the books, the general equation
reduces to
  Assets - Liabilities = Equity

(*) I say _if_ you close them, because there's no requirement to do so
in GnuCash. Some people including me like a fresh start each year;
others don't.

But that shorter equation is always valid, even when there are nonzero
income and expense account balances, if you interpret "Equity" in a more
general way. GnuCash actually does this for you when you run a balance
sheet.
  It adds up all income account balances and subtracts all expense
account balances, obtaining your net income or net loss to date. That
total is shown in the Equity section of the balance sheet as Retained
Earnings.
  GnuCash doesn't change any account balances, and the computed
Retained Earnings don't get posted to any actual account in your
database; it's purely a rollup of the income and expense balances rather
than showing them individually on the balance sheet. If we interpret
Equity as "all equity accounts plus the net income (or minus the next
expense) since the books were last closed",(**) then once again you have
  Assets - Liabilities = Equity

(**) This might seem like cheating, but it's not. All income and expense
amounts are logically part of your net worth, as the following example
will show.

Suppose you have earned $90K salary so far this year and spent $76 K of
it in food, clothes, and so forth. You still have a $500 K house with
$150 K mortgage.

Assets: $514 K ($500 K house, plus the $14K part of your salary that's
still in your in a bank account)
Liabilities: $150 K (mortgage balance)
Equity: $365 K (The $350 equity in your house, plus your $90 K in salary
income, minus your $76 K in expenses)

Once again, Assets - Liabilities = Equity: $514 K - $150 K = $364 K.

Suppose you want a balance sheet that doesn't roll net income or expense
into Retained Earnings, but shows the individual account balances? That
is called a Trial Balance, and GnuCash can create such a report for you.
Or of course you can run a Balance Sheet for the desired date and an
Income Statement (Profit and Loss statement) for the period starting the
day after the books were closed and ending the date of the Balance Sheet.

Stan Brown
Tehachapi, CA, USA
https://BrownMath.com
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Re: [GNC] Mailing list options (was Re: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90)

[Phyllis Bruce]

I got it because digest is turned off but I get the stray one.  I certainly did 
get the request to not use it as the subject of a reply: however, Robert was 
giving someone instructions on registering and/or adjusting their options so I 
went to check mine.  One of the options seems to indicate you can limit the 
topics you receive and should probably be deleted from the options list.  By 
the way, I use gmail and am able to choose reply all.

I do routinely just delete subjects that don’t interest me.  Had a senior 
moment and couldn’t figure how to reply to Robert in a new thread.  DUH,  Guess 
copy/paste might have worked…

Thanks for sticking up for me Liz.  

> On Aug 31, 2022, at 8:19 PM, Liz Dodd  wrote:
> 
> On Wed, 31 Aug 2022 16:48:41 -0700
> Stan Brown  wrote:
> 
>>> On 2022-08-31 15:15, Phyllis Bruce wrote:
>>> Robert, I am not interested in any of the business accounting or
>>> stock accounting questions. I followed your instructions to change
>>> my options which were already set as you suggested.  However, I was
>>> unable to find a list of topics to limit what I will receive, or a
>>> way to enter said topics once I find the list.  
>> 
>> Please don't use the digest title as a subject line.
> 
> Phyllis has not been a person who has used the digest, nor used the
> digest title as a subject line.
> 
> I'm not sure how she got tangled up in this thread.
> 
> Liz
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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[W. Neal Lewis]

Thank you Dean.

I liked the resources you suggested. I plan to buy the book on Amazon 
tomorrow.


The web page mentioned by David T was where it all started for me, since 
that did not make sense. So I did do research and got even more confused.


So, having a copy of Gnucash on my computer, and in dire need of getting 
something set up to handle finances, I figured the people on the Forum 
could probably help.


And they have.

So, it may indeed take the cake; but when I understand it, it will be a 
major help, and everyone who has contributed will part of the reason.


Best regards,

Neal Lewis



On 8/31/22 11:10 AM, Dean Gibson wrote:
I'm surprised that people don't buy ($$$) a book (see below) that 
gives them a good introduction to accounting, or even find a good 
tutorial online (no $$$), & instead go to a mailing list intended for 
the support of free (no $$$) SOFTWARE (not accounting), & then expect 
other people to teach them (on their time) the most RUDIMENTARY 
concept in all of accounting.


I taught myself accounting, & when there was something I didn't 
understand, I did the necessary research to LEARN. Learning concepts 
in any field takes time & effort.


I normally ignore these types of issues on this list, but this 
discussion takes the cake.


References:

https://accountingplay.com/introduction-to-accounting/ (FREE - online)

https://play.google.com/store/audiobooks/details?id=AQAamCOYKM=US 
($$$ - audiobook)


https://www.amazon.com/Accounting-All-Dummies-Online-Practice/dp/1119453895/ 
($$$ - print)


There are also videos on YouTube.


On 2022-08-31 01:55, David T. via gnucash-user wrote:
I'm surprised no one has 
mentionedhttps://www.gnucash.org/docs/v4/C/gnucash-guide/basics-accounting1.html#basics-accountingequation2


That's the Tutorial & Guide page that explains the concept.

David T.

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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[W. Neal Lewis]

Michael,

Thank you. Those ideas are another thing that I'm getting my head around.

Best regards,

Neal Lewis

On 8/31/22 10:44 AM, Michael or Penny Novack wrote:

On 8/31/2022 4:08 AM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
That is an "L" not an "I" in the equation at the end of my email: 
"A=I (+/-) Eq" to get it to equal.


There are only three FUNDAMENTAL account types, asset, liability, and 
equity. The confusion about the equation is perhaps because our 
computer automatically gives us SOME totals but not others.


Thus the equation is really

(sum of accounts of type asset) = (sum of accounts of type equity) + 
(sum of accounts of type liability)  AND there is "sense reversal" 
implied because we are really saying simply


total debits = total credits as opposed to arithmetic equality (since 
debit and credit have opposite "sense")


Like I said, BOTH accounts of type income and accounts of type expense 
are actually of type equity. They did not originally exist (say in the 
14th Century) and the opposite side of transactions that were items of 
income or items of expense were immediately entered against equity.


When you ask gnucash to produce a Balance Sheet the net of those 
accounts (income accounts and expense accounts) IS there under the 
pseudo account "retained gains" or "retained losses" as part of the 
equity total.


Michael D Novack


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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[W. Neal Lewis]

David,

That's where this all started.

It didn't make sense so I thought I would ask people who were more 
knowledgeable.


I did look on line and nothing on line made any more sense.

So, thank you for your help.

Best regards,

Neal Lewis

On 8/31/22 3:55 AM, David T. wrote:
I'm surprised no one has mentioned 
https://www.gnucash.org/docs/v4/C/gnucash-guide/basics-accounting1.html#basics-accountingequation2


That's the Tutorial & Guide page that explains the concept.

David T.

On August 31, 2022 10:15:04 AM GMT+03:00, Gyle McCollam 
 wrote:


Neal,
Your welcome.  I see a few others have responded with similar thoughts and 
explanations.  I'm sorry I forgot to respond to all, so the list did not see my 
original email, but as I said other replied with similar answers, but in more 
detail.

Don't worry, I trust you will get there.  I'm sure there are engineering 
concepts that we accountants would not understand immediately.  The key to this 
is that at any point in time (Income -  expenses = Equity).  So if your income 
and expenses aren't zero (close Books at the end of the year), you have to add 
this expression to A=I (+/-) Eq to get it to equal.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.comemail

From: W. Neal Lewis
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2022 9:24 PM
To: Gyle McCollam
Subject: Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

Gyle,

Thank you for your reply.

Let me think about it for a while.

It does not yet make sense to my Engineering brain.

Sorry to be so dense, but terms as well as numbers must balance for an 
equation to be correct.

Best regards,

Neal Lewis



On 8/28/22 6:28 PM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
At the end of the year I (income) - Ex (expenses) is your 
increase/decrease, depending on whether the number is positve or negative, to 
equity for the year and at any given point during the year it is your 
increase/decrease YTD equity figure.  So realistically, when you added +(I-Ex) 
and it should be minus Ex, you haven't really changed the equation A=L+Eq.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.comemail

From: 
gnucash-user
  on behalf of W. Neal Lewis
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 6:38 PM
To:gnucash-user@gnucash.org  

Subject: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

I will agree that by mathematical logic, Assets-(Liabilities)=Equity. ∴
Assets+(Liabilites)-(Liabilities)=Equity+Liability, or stated more
simply, A=Eq+L. I have added Liability to both sides ∴ both sides remain
equal.

However, although (A+L)=Eq, (A+L)≠Eq+(I+Ex). I have added a term to the
right side that is most decidedly not on the left ∴ they cannot be equal.

∴ A and L must be terms that include other factors.

Not good at accounting, I will ask what those other factors are.

I want to use GnuCash but I am having trouble getting my mind to accept
an equation that is not correct unless terms are redefined.

Please help me with my (obviously) incorrect understandings.

Thank you,

Neal Lewis

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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[W. Neal Lewis]

Gyle,

Thank you for your encouragement.

I will keep after it.

Best regards,

Neal Lewis

On 8/31/22 3:08 AM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
That is an "L" not an "I" in the equation at the end of my email: "A=I 
(+/-) Eq" to get it to equal.


Thank You,

*Gyle McCollam*

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com email


*From:* gnucash-user 
 on behalf of Gyle 
McCollam 

*Sent:* Wednesday, August 31, 2022 3:15 AM
*To:* W. Neal Lewis 
*Cc:* gnucash-user@gnucash.org 
*Subject:* Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?
Neal,
Your welcome.  I see a few others have responded with similar thoughts 
and explanations.  I'm sorry I forgot to respond to all, so the list 
did not see my original email, but as I said other replied with 
similar answers, but in more detail.


Don't worry, I trust you will get there.  I'm sure there are 
engineering concepts that we accountants would not understand 
immediately.  The key to this is that at any point in time (Income -  
expenses = Equity).  So if your income and expenses aren't zero 
(close Books at the end of the year), you have to add this expression 
to A=I (+/-) Eq to get it to equal.



Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com> email



From: W. Neal Lewis 
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2022 9:24 PM
To: Gyle McCollam 
Subject: Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

Gyle,

Thank you for your reply.

Let me think about it for a while.

It does not yet make sense to my Engineering brain.

Sorry to be so dense, but terms as well as numbers must balance for an 
equation to be correct.


Best regards,

Neal Lewis



On 8/28/22 6:28 PM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
At the end of the year I (income) - Ex (expenses) is your 
increase/decrease, depending on whether the number is positve or 
negative, to equity for the year and at any given point during the 
year it is your increase/decrease YTD equity figure.  So 
realistically, when you added +(I-Ex) and it should be minus Ex, you 
haven't really changed the equation A=L+Eq.



Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com> email



From: gnucash-user 
 
on behalf of W. Neal Lewis 


Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 6:38 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org 


Subject: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

I will agree that by mathematical logic, Assets-(Liabilities)=Equity. ∴
Assets+(Liabilites)-(Liabilities)=Equity+Liability, or stated more
simply, A=Eq+L. I have added Liability to both sides ∴ both sides remain
equal.

However, although (A+L)=Eq, (A+L)≠Eq+(I+Ex). I have added a term to the
right side that is most decidedly not on the left ∴ they cannot be equal.

∴ A and L must be terms that include other factors.

Not good at accounting, I will ask what those other factors are.

I want to use GnuCash but I am having trouble getting my mind to accept
an equation that is not correct unless terms are redefined.

Please help me with my (obviously) incorrect understandings.

Thank you,

Neal Lewis
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Re: [GNC] Mailing list options (was Re: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90)

[Liz Dodd]

On Wed, 31 Aug 2022 16:48:41 -0700
Stan Brown  wrote:

> On 2022-08-31 15:15, Phyllis Bruce wrote:
> > Robert, I am not interested in any of the business accounting or
> > stock accounting questions. I followed your instructions to change
> > my options which were already set as you suggested.  However, I was
> > unable to find a list of topics to limit what I will receive, or a
> > way to enter said topics once I find the list.  
> 
> Please don't use the digest title as a subject line.

Phyllis has not been a person who has used the digest, nor used the
digest title as a subject line.

I'm not sure how she got tangled up in this thread.

Liz
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Re: [GNC] "Deleted" Invoices or Bills

[Adrien Monteleone]

They remain forever. (There was a decent explanation as to why recently 
on IRC - the short of it is that deleting them cleanly is simply too 
messy with the current code.)


My workflow in such cases is to change their ID to 'use next'. You can 
either create a dummy vendor/customer for them as well, or just leave 
them as-is since you can re-assign the vendor/customer before posting.


When I want to start a new bill/invoice, I do a find for 'use next' IDs, 
but that is pretty rare now as I just duplicate a previous document and 
edit from there. (and I don't think I have any 'use next' documents left 
anyway.)


Regards,
Adrien

On 8/31/22 6:59 PM, Eric Hammond wrote:

A different track
In my hasty entering / importing of Invoices and Bill I find that some of them 
are duplicates, or not needed.
I can make them "disappear" by un-posting and clicking the delete button, but 
where do they go?
Does GnuCash automatically purge the trash? If not, how do I clean it up?
Thanks for the help,
Eric



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Re: [GNC] Mailing list options (was Re: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90)

[Adrien Monteleone]

Usenet doesn't exist for a large swath of users as ISPs have dropped 
access to it.


Though if it ever was resurrected, I would prefer it too. In the 
meantime, I'm accessing the list via Gmane. (which reminds me, I am 
seriously derelict in writing up a How To on the Wiki)


Regards,
Adrien

On 8/31/22 6:48 PM, Stan Brown wrote:


This kind of filtering would be child's play in Usenet. I've never
understood the objections to that approach, but they exist so I'm not
attempting to reopen the question here.



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Re: [GNC] "Deleted" Invoices or Bills

[Eric Hammond]

A different track
In my hasty entering / importing of Invoices and Bill I find that some of them 
are duplicates, or not needed.
I can make them "disappear" by un-posting and clicking the delete button, but 
where do they go?
Does GnuCash automatically purge the trash? If not, how do I clean it up?
Thanks for the help,
Eric
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[GNC] Mailing list options (was Re: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90)

[Stan Brown]

On 2022-08-31 15:15, Phyllis Bruce wrote:
> Robert, I am not interested in any of the business accounting or
> stock accounting questions. I followed your instructions to change my
> options which were already set as you suggested.  However, I was
> unable to find a list of topics to limit what I will receive, or a way
> to enter said topics once I find the list.

Please don't use the digest title as a subject line.

The mailing list doesn't offer that kind of granularity, Phyllis. (It's
pretty standard 1980s or 1990s vintage mailing list software, from what
I can tell.) There couldn't be "a list of topics to limit what I will
receive", because there's no way to predict what subject lines people
will use -- also, of course, because unfortunately a lot of people use
the digest title as a subject line, so there's no way to know what's in
the message without reading it.

If you set digest off, each message will be separate, and your own mail
program will probably let you filter out threads you don't want to see.

This kind of filtering would be child's play in Usenet. I've never
understood the objections to that approach, but they exist so I'm not
attempting to reopen the question here.

Stan Brown
Tehachapi, CA, USA
https://BrownMath.com

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Re: [GNC] Using the List

[Adrien Monteleone]

Phyllis,

There is no 'list' of topics to choose from.

All messages are simply e-mail that go through the mailing list server.

If you have turned off digest mode, then you'll get a new e-mail every 
time someone starts a new topic or replies to an existing topic.


Some days, it is rather quiet, others are 'noisy', depending on who is 
available, and of course, how much interest there is in a topic.


You can simply delete the e-mails with subject lines you aren't 
interested in without reading them. They'll always be available on the 
list archive if you ever end up needing the advice contained in them.


If your e-mail app allows for 'conversation threading', I'd suggest 
turning it on if it isn't already. (If you're using Gmail via a web 
browser, it is already on) That way, replies are nested and grouped as 
part of the topic 'conversation' rather than appearing as separate 
conversations. (though occasionally this breaks, but not often)


With all of that out of the way, there is no 'entering' a topic. You 
simply read and reply to the respective e-mails. Please be sure to 
'reply-list' or 'reply-all' (I'm not sure what Gmail offers) so your 
message goes to the list server, and not just to the last individual you 
are replying to.


Regards,
Adrien

On 8/31/22 5:15 PM, Phyllis Bruce wrote:

Robert, I am not interested in any of the business accounting or stock 
accounting questions. I followed your instructions to change my options which 
were already set as you suggested.  However, I was unable to find a list of 
topics to limit what I will receive, or a way to enter said topics once I find 
the list.  Your help is much appreciated.

Phyllis



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Re: [GNC] gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90

[Phyllis Bruce]

Robert, I am not interested in any of the business accounting or stock 
accounting questions. I followed your instructions to change my options which 
were already set as you suggested.  However, I was unable to find a list of 
topics to limit what I will receive, or a way to enter said topics once I find 
the list.  Your help is much appreciated.

Phyllis

> On Aug 31, 2022, at 4:46 PM, Robert Simmons  wrote:
> 
> James,
> 
> Can you visit the following list management URL:
> 
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> 
> Down at the very bottom there is a box for your email address. The text
> next to it is "To unsubscribe from gnucash-user, get a password reminder,
> or change your subscription options enter your subscription email address:"
> 
> Enter your email address, then click the "Unsubscribe or edit options"
> button.
> 
> On the next page, there is a login at the top. You will need to look for
> the list's welcome email. The password you need to use is at the very
> bottom of that email. Enter that password on this page, and then click the
> button "Log in".
> 
> On the next page, at the bottom, there are a set of grey boxes, each with
> different settings. Look for the one called "Set Digest Mode". There is a
> radio button to the right in that box. Select "Off". Finally, click the
> button at the bottom of that page "Submit My Changes".
> ___
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> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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Re: [GNC] gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90

[Robert Simmons]

James,

Can you visit the following list management URL:

https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user

Down at the very bottom there is a box for your email address. The text
next to it is "To unsubscribe from gnucash-user, get a password reminder,
or change your subscription options enter your subscription email address:"

Enter your email address, then click the "Unsubscribe or edit options"
button.

On the next page, there is a login at the top. You will need to look for
the list's welcome email. The password you need to use is at the very
bottom of that email. Enter that password on this page, and then click the
button "Log in".

On the next page, at the bottom, there are a set of grey boxes, each with
different settings. Look for the one called "Set Digest Mode". There is a
radio button to the right in that box. Select "Off". Finally, click the
button at the bottom of that page "Submit My Changes".
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Re: [GNC] Best practices for mailing list

[Dausnart Admin via gnucash-user]

> Please help to keep the mailing list useful.

+1!

—
Enneco-Gotzon Ares
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[GNC] Best practices for mailing list

[Stan Brown]

Please help to keep the mailing list useful.

1. If you're starting a new topic, just start it. Don't quote anything.

2. If you're answering a question or commenting on something somebody
wrote, trim away _everything_ except what you're responding to, and the
line that says who write it. Never quote a whole issue of the digest.

3. Always use helpful and specific subject lines, not something like
"gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90".

Thanks!

Stan Brown
Tehachapi, CA, USA
https://BrownMath.com

On 2022-08-31 10:43, James Baxter via gnucash-user wrote:
>  Gnucash to do with buying stocks
> Ok, So stocks are called tickers. (I Think) So when enter tthem into Gnucash. 
> when the cost or price goes up. Does this happen with them on Gnucash.
> If so, How do you place it on the srceen. I have been reading about them of 
> this. but I don't see how this happens.
> thanksJames baxterkangaro...@yahoo.com

(155 completely irrelevant lines trimmed)
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Re: [GNC] gnucash-user Digest, Vol 233, Issue 90

[James Baxter via gnucash-user]

 Gnucash to do with buying stocks
Ok, So stocks are called tickers. (I Think) So when enter tthem into Gnucash. 
when the cost or price goes up. Does this happen with them on Gnucash.
If so, How do you place it on the srceen. I have been reading about them of 
this. but I don't see how this happens.
thanksJames baxterkangaro...@yahoo.com

On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 12:00:31 PM EDT, 
gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org  wrote:  
 
 Send gnucash-user mailing list submissions to
    gnucash-user@gnucash.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
    https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
    gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
    gnucash-user-ow...@gnucash.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of gnucash-user digest..."


Today's Topics:

  1.  A new start - somewhat strange (Norbert Klein)
  2. Re:  A new start - somewhat strange (Derek Atkins)
  3. Re:  Reports: Account ending balances (Pa In)
  4. Re:  Reports: Account ending balances (Adrien Monteleone)
  5. Re:  A new start - somewhat strange (David Carlson)
  6. Re:  Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?
      (Michael or Penny Novack)


--

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2022 17:53:00 +0700
From: Norbert Klein 
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: [GNC] A new start - somewhat strange
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

Self introduction: I am Norbert Klein, a 88 year old German, living
since 32 years in Cambodia.

Some years ago, I had been using GnuCash on a computer running under Ubuntu.

Some months ago, I wanted to set up GnuCash again, this time on a
computer using Windows? -? but before I could move ahead, I had a
hard-disk failure and had to get a news hard-disk.

Now I wanted to start again, Windows 10, GnuCash 4.11-1 setup
downloaded, I accepted all suggestions during setup; at the end I saw
the GnuCash icon on the desktop. I clicked on it, expecting some kind of
initial GnuCash program ? but I got only this:

?Unsaved Book ? GnuCash?




















Before I might make some mistakes, I rather ask. Any suggestions? Please?

Norbert ? nhkl...@mgmx.net






--

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2022 07:10:22 -0400
From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Norbert Klein" 
Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: [GNC] A new start - somewhat strange
Message-ID:
    <9558bf6d24aca151fa1b36c101be3bae.squir...@mail2.ihtfp.org>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8

Just create a new file:

 File -> New File

-derek

On Wed, August 31, 2022 6:53 am, Norbert Klein wrote:
> Self introduction: I am Norbert Klein, a 88 year old German, living
> since 32 years in Cambodia.
>
> Some years ago, I had been using GnuCash on a computer running under
> Ubuntu.
>
> Some months ago, I wanted to set up GnuCash again, this time on a
> computer using Windows? -? but before I could move ahead, I had a
> hard-disk failure and had to get a news hard-disk.
>
> Now I wanted to start again, Windows 10, GnuCash 4.11-1 setup
> downloaded, I accepted all suggestions during setup; at the end I saw
> the GnuCash icon on the desktop. I clicked on it, expecting some kind of
> initial GnuCash program ? but I got only this:
>
> ?Unsaved Book ? GnuCash?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Before I might make some mistakes, I rather ask. Any suggestions? Please?
>
> Norbert ? nhkl...@mgmx.net
>
>
>
>
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> -
> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
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>


-- 
      Derek Atkins                617-623-3745
      de...@ihtfp.com            www.ihtfp.com
      Computer and Internet Security Consultant



--

Message: 3
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2022 07:36:02 -0400
From: Pa In 
To: adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net
Cc: gnucash-u...@lists.gnucash.org
Subject: Re: [GNC] Reports: Account ending balances
Message-ID:
    
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

Perfect Adrian!

Setting the budget option 'beginning on' to the dated I want the budget
report to start works even if I do not enter any budget amounts.

Thanks again for your help.  I can now report the balances for all accounts
for multiple months in a single report for any accounting period.

Regards,

Julian

On Wed., Aug. 31, 2022, 1:03 a.m. Adrien Monteleone, <
adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net> wrote:

> Ah, you may indeed have to create a budget even if there are no budgeted
> figures. My memory is a bit fuzzy on that point, but I think the budget
> report will 

Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[Dean Gibson]

I'm surprised that people don't buy ($$$) a book (see below) that gives 
them a good introduction to accounting, or even find a good tutorial 
online (no $$$), & instead go to a mailing list intended for the support 
of free (no $$$) SOFTWARE (not accounting), & then expect other people 
to teach them (on their time) the most RUDIMENTARY concept in all of 
accounting.


I taught myself accounting, & when there was something I didn't 
understand, I did the necessary research to LEARN.  Learning concepts in 
any field takes time & effort.


I normally ignore these types of issues on this list, but this 
discussion takes the cake.


References:

https://accountingplay.com/introduction-to-accounting/ (FREE - online)

https://play.google.com/store/audiobooks/details?id=AQAamCOYKM=US 
($$$ - audiobook)


https://www.amazon.com/Accounting-All-Dummies-Online-Practice/dp/1119453895/ 
($$$ - print)


There are also videos on YouTube.


On 2022-08-31 01:55, David T. via gnucash-user wrote:

I'm surprised no one has 
mentionedhttps://www.gnucash.org/docs/v4/C/gnucash-guide/basics-accounting1.html#basics-accountingequation2

That's the Tutorial & Guide page that explains the concept.

David T.

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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[Michael or Penny Novack]

On 8/31/2022 4:08 AM, Gyle McCollam wrote:

That is an "L" not an "I" in the equation at the end of my email: "A=I (+/-) 
Eq" to get it to equal.

There are only three FUNDAMENTAL account types, asset, liability, and 
equity. The confusion about the equation is perhaps because our computer 
automatically gives us SOME totals but not others.


Thus the equation is really

(sum of accounts of type asset) = (sum of accounts of type equity) + 
(sum of accounts of type liability)  AND there is "sense reversal" 
implied because we are really saying simply


total debits = total credits as opposed to arithmetic equality (since 
debit and credit have opposite "sense")


Like I said, BOTH accounts of type income and accounts of type expense 
are actually of type equity. They did not originally exist (say in the 
14th Century) and the opposite side of transactions that were items of 
income or items of expense were immediately entered against equity.


When you ask gnucash to produce a Balance Sheet the net of those 
accounts (income accounts and expense accounts) IS there under the 
pseudo account "retained gains" or "retained losses" as part of the 
equity total.


Michael D Novack


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Re: [GNC] A new start - somewhat strange

[David Carlson]

Narberth,

That message means that GnuCash did not find and open an existing data file
so it is expecting you to create a new one.  Thus Derek's answer.

On Wed, Aug 31, 2022, 7:11 AM Derek Atkins  wrote:

> Just create a new file:
>
>  File -> New File
>
> -derek
>
> On Wed, August 31, 2022 6:53 am, Norbert Klein wrote:
> > Self introduction: I am Norbert Klein, a 88 year old German, living
> > since 32 years in Cambodia.
> >
> > Some years ago, I had been using GnuCash on a computer running under
> > Ubuntu.
> >
> > Some months ago, I wanted to set up GnuCash again, this time on a
> > computer using Windows  -  but before I could move ahead, I had a
> > hard-disk failure and had to get a news hard-disk.
> >
> > Now I wanted to start again, Windows 10, GnuCash 4.11-1 setup
> > downloaded, I accepted all suggestions during setup; at the end I saw
> > the GnuCash icon on the desktop. I clicked on it, expecting some kind of
> > initial GnuCash program – but I got only this:
> >
> > “Unsaved Book – GnuCash”
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Before I might make some mistakes, I rather ask. Any suggestions? Please…
> >
> > Norbert – nhkl...@mgmx.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > gnucash-user mailing list
> > gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> > -
> > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
> > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
> >
>
>
> --
>Derek Atkins 617-623-3745
>de...@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com
>Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>
> ___
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Re: [GNC] Reports: Account ending balances

[Adrien Monteleone]

Great! Thanks for reporting back what worked.

Regards,
Adrien

On 8/31/22 6:36 AM, Pa In wrote:

Perfect Adrian!

Setting the budget option 'beginning on' to the dated I want the budget
report to start works even if I do not enter any budget amounts.

Thanks again for your help.  I can now report the balances for all accounts
for multiple months in a single report for any accounting period.

Regards,

Julian



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Re: [GNC] Reports: Account ending balances

[Pa In]

Perfect Adrian!

Setting the budget option 'beginning on' to the dated I want the budget
report to start works even if I do not enter any budget amounts.

Thanks again for your help.  I can now report the balances for all accounts
for multiple months in a single report for any accounting period.

Regards,

Julian

On Wed., Aug. 31, 2022, 1:03 a.m. Adrien Monteleone, <
adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net> wrote:

> Ah, you may indeed have to create a budget even if there are no budgeted
> figures. My memory is a bit fuzzy on that point, but I think the budget
> report will require you specify a budget, which defines what the periods
> are, and those are fixed with absolute dates. It is not a sliding window
> like 'this year' that other reports offer. So you set up a new 'budget',
> put no figures in it (unless you want to) define the time frame of the
> budget to the reporting period you want (say, 1/22—12/22), then run a
> Budget Report for that 'budget' you just defined, turning off Actuals,
> Difference, and various subtotals, et cetera as needed to clean it up.
>
> Another option, though the layout may not be desirable, is the
> Transaction Report selecting the desired accounts, then removing as much
> info as possible, and including the 'table' option. That *might* get you
> close. But I think the Budget Report is closer if you can get the
> reporting period to line up.
>
> A further alternative would be separate Income Statement & Balance Sheet
> reports. (if you want to export to a spreadsheet)
>
> If you just want to view it on screen, then you can create a custom
> multi-column report with both of those. Note, the multi-column report is
> more than just 'columns' and more like specifying layout. (you can have
> more than one report in a single 'column' if I recall correctly) It is
> possible to use this to create a 'dashboard' of sorts with various
> reports/charts in its own tab.
>
> Regards,
> Adrien
>
> On 8/30/22 11:51 PM, Pa In wrote:
> > I did look at the budget report but when I manually select the range of
> > budget periods 1 to 60 the first column shows balances for 2015-03 (when
> I
> > first started using GnuCash) and 2020-01 respectively.  I can't figure
> out
> > how to 'advance' the date for period 1 so that it captures more recent
> > activity.
>
>
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Re: [GNC] A new start - somewhat strange

[Derek Atkins]

Just create a new file:

 File -> New File

-derek

On Wed, August 31, 2022 6:53 am, Norbert Klein wrote:
> Self introduction: I am Norbert Klein, a 88 year old German, living
> since 32 years in Cambodia.
>
> Some years ago, I had been using GnuCash on a computer running under
> Ubuntu.
>
> Some months ago, I wanted to set up GnuCash again, this time on a
> computer using Windows  -  but before I could move ahead, I had a
> hard-disk failure and had to get a news hard-disk.
>
> Now I wanted to start again, Windows 10, GnuCash 4.11-1 setup
> downloaded, I accepted all suggestions during setup; at the end I saw
> the GnuCash icon on the desktop. I clicked on it, expecting some kind of
> initial GnuCash program – but I got only this:
>
> “Unsaved Book – GnuCash”
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Before I might make some mistakes, I rather ask. Any suggestions? Please…
>
> Norbert – nhkl...@mgmx.net
>
>
>
>
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
>


-- 
   Derek Atkins 617-623-3745
   de...@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com
   Computer and Internet Security Consultant

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[GNC] A new start - somewhat strange

[Norbert Klein]

Self introduction: I am Norbert Klein, a 88 year old German, living
since 32 years in Cambodia.

Some years ago, I had been using GnuCash on a computer running under Ubuntu.

Some months ago, I wanted to set up GnuCash again, this time on a
computer using Windows  -  but before I could move ahead, I had a
hard-disk failure and had to get a news hard-disk.

Now I wanted to start again, Windows 10, GnuCash 4.11-1 setup
downloaded, I accepted all suggestions during setup; at the end I saw
the GnuCash icon on the desktop. I clicked on it, expecting some kind of
initial GnuCash program – but I got only this:

“Unsaved Book – GnuCash”




















Before I might make some mistakes, I rather ask. Any suggestions? Please…

Norbert – nhkl...@mgmx.net




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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[David T. via gnucash-user]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned 
https://www.gnucash.org/docs/v4/C/gnucash-guide/basics-accounting1.html#basics-accountingequation2

That's the Tutorial & Guide page that explains the concept.

David T.

On August 31, 2022 10:15:04 AM GMT+03:00, Gyle McCollam  
wrote:
>Neal,
>Your welcome.  I see a few others have responded with similar thoughts and 
>explanations.  I'm sorry I forgot to respond to all, so the list did not see 
>my original email, but as I said other replied with similar answers, but in 
>more detail.
>
>Don't worry, I trust you will get there.  I'm sure there are engineering 
>concepts that we accountants would not understand immediately.  The key to 
>this is that at any point in time (Income -  expenses = Equity).  So if your 
>income and expenses aren't zero (close Books at the end of the year), you have 
>to add this expression to A=I (+/-) Eq to get it to equal.
>
>
>Thank You,
>
>Gyle McCollam
>
>Gyle McCollam
>
>gmccol...@live.com   email
>
>
>From: W. Neal Lewis 
>Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2022 9:24 PM
>To: Gyle McCollam 
>Subject: Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?
>
>Gyle,
>
>Thank you for your reply.
>
>Let me think about it for a while.
>
>It does not yet make sense to my Engineering brain.
>
>Sorry to be so dense, but terms as well as numbers must balance for an 
>equation to be correct.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Neal Lewis
>
>
>
>On 8/28/22 6:28 PM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
>At the end of the year I (income) - Ex (expenses) is your increase/decrease, 
>depending on whether the number is positve or negative, to equity for the year 
>and at any given point during the year it is your increase/decrease YTD equity 
>figure.  So realistically, when you added +(I-Ex) and it should be minus Ex, 
>you haven't really changed the equation A=L+Eq.
>
>
>Thank You,
>
>Gyle McCollam
>
>Gyle McCollam
>
>gmccol...@live.com   email
>
>
>From: gnucash-user 
>
> on behalf of W. Neal Lewis 
>
>Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 6:38 PM
>To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org 
>
>Subject: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?
>
>I will agree that by mathematical logic, Assets-(Liabilities)=Equity. ∴
>Assets+(Liabilites)-(Liabilities)=Equity+Liability, or stated more
>simply, A=Eq+L. I have added Liability to both sides ∴ both sides remain
>equal.
>
>However, although (A+L)=Eq, (A+L)≠Eq+(I+Ex). I have added a term to the
>right side that is most decidedly not on the left ∴ they cannot be equal.
>
>∴ A and L must be terms that include other factors.
>
>Not good at accounting, I will ask what those other factors are.
>
>I want to use GnuCash but I am having trouble getting my mind to accept
>an equation that is not correct unless terms are redefined.
>
>Please help me with my (obviously) incorrect understandings.
>
>Thank you,
>
>Neal Lewis
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>https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
>-
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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[Gyle McCollam]

That is an "L" not an "I" in the equation at the end of my email: "A=I (+/-) 
Eq" to get it to equal.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com   email


From: gnucash-user  on 
behalf of Gyle McCollam 
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2022 3:15 AM
To: W. Neal Lewis 
Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org 
Subject: Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

Neal,
Your welcome.  I see a few others have responded with similar thoughts and 
explanations.  I'm sorry I forgot to respond to all, so the list did not see my 
original email, but as I said other replied with similar answers, but in more 
detail.

Don't worry, I trust you will get there.  I'm sure there are engineering 
concepts that we accountants would not understand immediately.  The key to this 
is that at any point in time (Income -  expenses = Equity).  So if your income 
and expenses aren't zero (close Books at the end of the year), you have to add 
this expression to A=I (+/-) Eq to get it to equal.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com   email


From: W. Neal Lewis 
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2022 9:24 PM
To: Gyle McCollam 
Subject: Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

Gyle,

Thank you for your reply.

Let me think about it for a while.

It does not yet make sense to my Engineering brain.

Sorry to be so dense, but terms as well as numbers must balance for an equation 
to be correct.

Best regards,

Neal Lewis



On 8/28/22 6:28 PM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
At the end of the year I (income) - Ex (expenses) is your increase/decrease, 
depending on whether the number is positve or negative, to equity for the year 
and at any given point during the year it is your increase/decrease YTD equity 
figure.  So realistically, when you added +(I-Ex) and it should be minus Ex, 
you haven't really changed the equation A=L+Eq.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com   email


From: gnucash-user 

 on behalf of W. Neal Lewis 

Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 6:38 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org 

Subject: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

I will agree that by mathematical logic, Assets-(Liabilities)=Equity. ∴
Assets+(Liabilites)-(Liabilities)=Equity+Liability, or stated more
simply, A=Eq+L. I have added Liability to both sides ∴ both sides remain
equal.

However, although (A+L)=Eq, (A+L)≠Eq+(I+Ex). I have added a term to the
right side that is most decidedly not on the left ∴ they cannot be equal.

∴ A and L must be terms that include other factors.

Not good at accounting, I will ask what those other factors are.

I want to use GnuCash but I am having trouble getting my mind to accept
an equation that is not correct unless terms are redefined.

Please help me with my (obviously) incorrect understandings.

Thank you,

Neal Lewis
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Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

[Gyle McCollam]

Neal,
Your welcome.  I see a few others have responded with similar thoughts and 
explanations.  I'm sorry I forgot to respond to all, so the list did not see my 
original email, but as I said other replied with similar answers, but in more 
detail.

Don't worry, I trust you will get there.  I'm sure there are engineering 
concepts that we accountants would not understand immediately.  The key to this 
is that at any point in time (Income -  expenses = Equity).  So if your income 
and expenses aren't zero (close Books at the end of the year), you have to add 
this expression to A=I (+/-) Eq to get it to equal.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com   email


From: W. Neal Lewis 
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2022 9:24 PM
To: Gyle McCollam 
Subject: Re: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

Gyle,

Thank you for your reply.

Let me think about it for a while.

It does not yet make sense to my Engineering brain.

Sorry to be so dense, but terms as well as numbers must balance for an equation 
to be correct.

Best regards,

Neal Lewis



On 8/28/22 6:28 PM, Gyle McCollam wrote:
At the end of the year I (income) - Ex (expenses) is your increase/decrease, 
depending on whether the number is positve or negative, to equity for the year 
and at any given point during the year it is your increase/decrease YTD equity 
figure.  So realistically, when you added +(I-Ex) and it should be minus Ex, 
you haven't really changed the equation A=L+Eq.


Thank You,

Gyle McCollam

Gyle McCollam

gmccol...@live.com   email


From: gnucash-user 

 on behalf of W. Neal Lewis 

Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 6:38 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org 

Subject: [GNC] Can someone tell me how A-L=Eq+(I-Ex) is correct?

I will agree that by mathematical logic, Assets-(Liabilities)=Equity. ∴
Assets+(Liabilites)-(Liabilities)=Equity+Liability, or stated more
simply, A=Eq+L. I have added Liability to both sides ∴ both sides remain
equal.

However, although (A+L)=Eq, (A+L)≠Eq+(I+Ex). I have added a term to the
right side that is most decidedly not on the left ∴ they cannot be equal.

∴ A and L must be terms that include other factors.

Not good at accounting, I will ask what those other factors are.

I want to use GnuCash but I am having trouble getting my mind to accept
an equation that is not correct unless terms are redefined.

Please help me with my (obviously) incorrect understandings.

Thank you,

Neal Lewis
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