Re: [GNC] Stock Purchase Throws off Trial Balance

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

What I have observed is that the trial balance report is based on some sort of 
"averaging," and not debits/credits. There are a few reports on this.

Quoting John Ralls:

""Average Cost" in this case doesn't mean what normal people would think. The 
function finds all of the splits in all of the non-trading accounts that 
involve currencies other than the parent transaction's currency and creates the 
scheme equivalent of a table that looks something like 
  comm1 comm2 quantity value
where comm1 is the transaction currency, comm2 is the split commodity, quantity 
is the total number of split-commodity units and value the total number of 
transaction-currency units.

Note that the transaction currency is determined by the account-register you 
start out in, so one would expect that if all of the transactions are initiated 
from the Checking Account register the table will look like
  USD  EUR 1/100  21000/100

Fiddling around with the numbers shows that the resulting exchange rate is the 
trading gain divided by the residual amount in the EUR account, so that the 
value balance in the EUR account is always the trading gain. 

Unfortunately figuring out what gnc:get-exchange-cost-totals 
(https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/master/src/report/report-system/commodity-utilities.scm#L624)
 is really doing exceeds my limited Scheme ability."

> On 11/06/2024 2:06 PM PST Dr. Timothy B. Jones  wrote:
> 
>  
> Greetings:
> 
> I am on the 5.9 version of GCUCash for Windows.  I have been doing stock 
> trades since 2016 on the software without this issue.  However today I made 
> the following STOCK PURCHASE and entered it just as I have for years.  
> (Bought 250 shares of GCI for $667.50)  The transaction looks like this:
> 
> DEBIT GCI STOCK  $667.50
> DEBIT TRADING CURRENCY $667.50
> 
> CREDIT CASH $667.50
> CREDIT TRADING:GCI $667.50
> 
> This is consistent with how hundreds of other purchases have posted.  
> HOWEVER, this particular post is putting my Trial Balance off by $667.50 (the 
> debit side $667.50 lower than the credit side).  I have done everything I 
> know how to do to figure out why this particular buy transaction would throw 
> it off when it is obviously balanced.  If I delete it, the Trial Balance goes 
> back to balanced, so there is no doubt this transaction is causing the issue.
> 
> Thoughts?  Am I missing something obvious?
> 
> Thank you!!  Timothy
> 
> Timothy B. Jones, Ed.D.
> Author, International Speaker & Consultant
> (214) 252-0489
> http://www.timothybjones.net
> 
> 
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Re: [GNC] File Cabinet, 3-Ring Binders, Paper Records?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Tom,

I personally run paperless-ngx (FOSS and actively developed) on a Synology NAS 
(DS920+). Then I backup my data regularly to multiple locations, including 
online storage.

Paperless-ngx allows for "Archive Serial Number (ASN)," which can be used to 
store the paper documents in order received/scanned, and then when one of the 
paper documents is needed, it's a matter of pulling that serial number.

If desired, there is OCR. I use it, and now I can search for a document by 
phrases of text.

After digitizing, I keep paper receipts in envelopes, one envelope for each 
month, for merchandise returns and such. Most other documents, bank statements, 
utility bills, credit card statements, and so on, I only keep the digital copy. 
In general, when I need to review a receipt, I don't go to the paper copy, I 
just search on paperless-ngx, and I get the information I need right away.

What I can say is that I'm able to locate documents much faster (nearly 
immediate), have all the documents organized in the way I want (sorting), group 
documents together using tags, and paperless-ngx also keeps track of when I 
added the document, the date of the document, and other data.

The switch from paper to paperless took some effort, but looking back, I can 
say I made the right decision.

I mentioned that I backup my data above. I also keep a copy of my GnuCash data 
files on that same Synology NAS, and then I include them in my daily backups. 
If there were a major disaster, I could not recover destroyed paper, but I 
could recover the digital copies quickly and easily from my online backups.



> On 11/06/2024 8:29 AM PST Tom Balazs  wrote:
> 
>  
> How do you store all the paperwork related to your bookkeeping? Sorry if
> this is a bit off topic.
> 
> I now file all incoming (bookkeeping related) paper mail in a series of
> 3-ring binders. Occasionally, I move older statements to an "archive"
> folder and store them in another room. I don't really want to put an ugly
> 3- or 4-drawer filing cabinet in this room. But, my collection of "current"
> financial folders is becoming unwieldy.
> 
> I try to avoid all the go-green, switch to digital statement appeals
> because I get so much junk in my email that it's hard to find the
> relevant/important stuff. I like getting statements etc. as paper mail.
> 
> I could scan documents, but I would be hesitant to throw out my paper
> documents, because of the risk of digital data loss (computer failure,
> etc).
> 
> Tom
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Re: [GNC] Loan repayments created not matching

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Jason,

The basic challenge here is that early in a loan's history the principal 
balance is at its maximum, so the interest portion of the payment is also at a 
maximum. The last payment is where the principal balance is at the minimum, so 
the principal portion of that payment is at a maximum.



> On 11/04/2024 1:46 PM PST Jason Seegers  wrote:
> 
>  
> Ok, actually I figured it out now.
> 
> When using the repayment creator thing, there is a step where you have to 
> select the start date and the total number of payments. The software 
> calculates the remaining periods which i simply ignored and left as it. I 
> changed it back to match the total number of payments and this sorted the 
> problem out. Now the entries created matched what the system calculates.
> 
> Very bizarre. I think this is a bug but perhaps I am misunderstanding the 
> screen I am looking at.
> 
> From: Jason Seegers 
> Sent: 04 November 2024 15:16
> To: David H 
> Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org ; 
> stepbystepf...@comcast.net 
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Loan repayments created not matching
> 
> Good to know that it works.
> 
> In response to Stephens email, the main formula is pmt( 0.06690 / 12.00 : 
> 96.00 : 28,050.00 : 0 : 0 ).
> 
> How would I check the individual transactions formula and what should I be 
> looking out for?
> 
> From: David H 
> Sent: 04 November 2024 14:05
> To: Jason Seegers 
> Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org ; 
> stepbystepf...@comcast.net 
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Loan repayments created not matching
> 
> Your images came through fine for me using gmail in the web browser and are 
> also present in the archive  - 
> https://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-user/2024-November/114010.html :-)
> 
> Cheers David H.
> 
> On Tue, 5 Nov 2024 at 05:10, Jason Seegers 
> mailto:jason.onl...@outlook.com>> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> https://imgur.com/a/z2iKDyl
> [https://i.imgur.com/VhOjOm7.png?fb]
> imgur.com
> Discover the magic of the internet at Imgur, a community powered 
> entertainment destination. Lift your spirits with funny jokes, trending 
> memes, entertaining gifs, inspiring stories, viral videos, and so much more 
> from users.
> imgur.com
> 
> 
> I've only just realised now that the images I put in didn't actually remain 
> as part of the email when I sent it. So above is an imgur link for the images.
> 
> Basically, it is the system not posting what it says it will which I can't 
> wrap my head around. I am not expecting the calculation to be the same as the 
> bank, this is simply that the software is posting a different amount to what 
> it tells me and the reality is the result it posts is completely wrong but 
> the preview it provides for the result is actually correct.
> 
> Example (in case images done work in imgur link) for period 1 or 1st payment.
> 
> System calculates payment 1 as: 338 split as 199 for capital and 139 for 
> interest
> System then posts: 338 split as 255 for capital and 83 for interest
> 
> As you can see, this is completely incorrect and I don't understand why it 
> isn't posting the numbers it is calculating?
> 
> From: gnucash-user 
> mailto:outlook@gnucash.org>>
>  on behalf of Michael or Penny Novack via gnucash-user 
> mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>>
> Sent: 04 November 2024 09:27
> To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org 
> mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>>
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Loan repayments created not matching
> 
> On 11/3/2024 5:20 PM, Jason Seegers wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Not sure what I am doing wrong here but when I use the loan repayment 
> > calculator as per the screenshots below, the transactions created don’t 
> > match what I am shown and I am stumped as to why.
> >
> > Any ideas to get this to actually agree?
> 
> How far off?
> 
> If a small discrepancy, the "why" is very simple. There is NOT one
> correct way to do the calculation and so no way to expect the result
> from the calculation the loan provider used will match the result from
> the calculation gnucash uses. There are a number of ASSUMPTIONS being
> made (one of the largest, how is the end of the loan handled if, as
> usual, not going to come out even).
> 
> You simply can't expect exact agreement.
> 
> Now as to the two amortizations shown in the screen shots, more useful
> would be the # of each "rent" (periodic payment). We have no way of
> knowing if those absolute dates correspond. In other words, we DON'T
> know if 3/21 is the nth payment on each. Since you are presumably
> dealing with loan start in the past, do you have that past lined up?
> 
> Michael D Novack
> 
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Re: [GNC] [OT] Re: GnuCash 5.9 on macOS 15.2 Dev Beta

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

I'm thinking I need to place a call to Maxwell...


> On 11/04/2024 10:56 AM PST William Prescott  wrote:
> 
>  
> I should have read more carefully before replying. Are you (Michael) 
> responding to the electron speed or the signal speed. The signal travels much 
> faster than an individual electron. The analogy I read was to think of a tube 
> filled with marbles moving through it. A marble drops out of the end much 
> faster than it takes for one marble to traverse the entire tube.
> 
> Will
>
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Re: [GNC] Dealing with mutual funds

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Boniforti,

I applaud your effort to advance your financial accounting. With that out of 
the way, there are good reasons how professional accountants can help 
individuals. There are a myriad of horror stories about how transactions could 
be structured differently, while accomplishing the same objectives, yet have 
various benefits (eg much lower taxes).

On the other side, I had a friend who thought he was a small time operator, but 
then the federal tax authority (that's IRS in the US) contacted him, and he 
suddenly found out that he owed a tremendous amount of taxes, but he would owe 
very little if he had maintained some records.

In summary, an accounting professional can help you with things you might never 
know, and avoid problems that you might have found out about.

What I suggest is keeping a list of questions for the next 6 months, plus or 
minus, and then take that list in for a consultation with a local accountant.


> On 11/03/2024 12:57 PM PST Boniforti Flavio  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi Jim.
> 
> I'm a private individual, not a company. Thus, I don't need an accountant
> and my jurisdiction doesn't matter in what I'm doing: it's my personal
> finance tool, which I use to track my income/expenses and total wealth.
> With "would that work?" I was trying to ask if I was missing something and
> if my assumption was correct.
> Regarding the "actual value", it's the "market value" which I'm referring
> to. Related to this, I'd like to understand if the market value of my VT
> stocks will be reflected in GnuCash when I update the quotes via
> Finance::Quote, or not. I understand that the VT purchase transactions
> won't and cannot be changed in value because I bought VT at a specific
> date/time and I paid what the price/value was back then. I'm curious to
> understand if GnuCash can reflect today's "market value" in some way or
> not.
> 
> F.
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/boniforti_music
> https://soundcloud.com/boniforti_music
> https://bonny-j.bandcamp.com
> 
> 
> Am So., 3. Nov. 2024 um 21:50 Uhr schrieb Jim DeLaHunt <
> list+gnuc...@jdlh.com>:
> 
> > Boniforti:
> >
> > On 2024-11-03 02:25, Boniforti Flavio wrote:
> > > ...As of now, I have just put all the CHF Cash in that account.
> > > As I've added CHF in 5-6 different transactions and in between those I
> > have
> > > also converted to USD and bought VT stocks, would I need to zero the "CHF
> > > Cash" account, then add each CHF wire transfer transaction individually?
> > > And then for each currency conversion I did, create the according
> > > transaction between "CHF Cash" and "USD Cash" accounts, after which I
> > would
> > > add the VT purchase transactions - right?
> > > If I do it like that, I could "hide" the ForEx trading fees by simply
> > > adjusting the conversion rate (like if I had converted CHF 1'000.- and I
> > > got USD 1'140.- and paid 1 USD fees, I could just "ignore" the fee and
> > > adjust the conversion rate so that it gives CHF 1000 --> USD 1140). Would
> > > that work?
> > > Would this process also work when buying VT stocks? In that case, I buy a
> > > fixed amount of VT stocks at the VT price, and I could "hide" the fees by
> > > adjusting the stock unit price?!
> >
> > I must admit that I am not following everything you are talking about here.
> >
> > However, I read you asking, "would that work?". There are two people who
> > can answer that: you, and your accountant.  It is up to you to decide
> > what information you want your bookkeeping to provide for you.  Do you
> > care about knowing how efficient your CHF-USD transactions are, or do
> > you not care?  Are you willing to do more complex data entry to track
> > extra information, or not? And, your accountant can give you insight
> > about what information is helpful, or even required, in your situation
> > and jurisdiction.
> >
> > Maybe people on this list will also give you answers to the questions
> > above. But if not, one reason is that we are not the right people to
> > answer such questions.
> >
> > > What's not clear to me at this point is: if I will have 1000 VT stocks,
> > > where will the actual value be reflected/calculated? Is it depending on
> > > manual retrieving the VT quotes via Finance::Quote?
> >
> > Tell us what you mean by "actual value".
> >
> > Do you mean the "current market value" of those shares? If so, it varies
> > over time.  The price at which you purchased the shares becomes one data
> > point at one time for values. The quotes retrieved via Finance::Quote
> > become other data points at other times. GnuCash's "Price Database" will
> > let you see all the price data points which GnuCash has.
> >
> > Or, do you mean the "cost basis"? In that case, I believe GnuCash
> > determines it by the transaction at which you buy the shares. If the
> > transaction says that you paid 1,000 CHF for 100 shares of VT, then the
> > cost basis of that lot of VT shares is 100 CHF/share. If the transaction
> > says that you paid 1,140 USD for the 

Re: [GNC] Stocks with prices in more than one currency

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

"Another person is doing these stock transactions.
They provide me with the QIF files."
 
It sounds as though the other person is entering bad data, which is causing bad 
reports. It's not completely clear as to the origin of the QIF data, so I'm 
guessing a bit here. You mentioned Finance::Quote too, so there are a few 
different ways the data gets entered.
 
The larger question is what to do moving forward.
 
"In general, each weekend, I do: File: Import: Import QIF
of the stock transactions that took place the previous week for a specific 
account.
I do that for each of several accounts in several files/books."
 
It would be easy if you were the one entering the data, as then I'd just 
suggest to remain aware of the situation, and check your entries. Educating the 
person entering the data might not be so easy.
 
Since you're working with several accounts in several files/books, automating 
the process is probably worthwhile, but I don't have a specific suggestion as 
to a best way to check the data integrity, and manually reviewing data is not 
something that I'd suggest.
 
Hopefully someone here can suggest an automated way to check for the multiple 
currency problem, and ideally provide an automated way to remove/correct the 
bad entries.
 
 
 

> On 11/03/2024 7:06 AM PST Fred Tydeman  wrote:
>  
>  
>  
> 
> On Sat, Nov 2, 2024 at 6:16 PM Patrick James via gnucash-user 
> mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote:
> 
> > Fred,
> > 
> > The basic challenge here is that you don't seem to know how data gets into 
> > your GnuCash database. There are some very crafty people reading this list, 
> > so I'm not going to exclude the possibility that one might be able to 
> > explain how different currencies were entered into your GnuCash data, yet 
> > at the same time I'm going to bet that it would make things much easier if 
> > you could explain how both USD and CAD data ended up in your data.
> > 
> > Even if you don't know when the specific entries were created, maybe you 
> > can explain your workflow.
> > 
>  
> Note:  I am listing dates in the form of /MM/DD.
> That is not how they show on the screen.
>  
> I renamed an older backup file (with this issue) to a new name so I could 
> look at it.
> Looking at the price data base for this one CAD stock,
> there is one entry for USD and about 20 entries for CAD.
> The USD entry says user:split-import with a date of 2024/01/23.
> There is also a CAD entry with the same date that says user:split-register.
> There is one CAD entry with an earlier date (2024/01/03), also 
> user:split-register.
> There are many CAD entries with later dates that say: user:split-register
> There are many CAD entries with later dates that say: Finance::Quote
>  
> Each of the user:split-register price entries correspond to a Buy of that 
> stock.
>  
> Another person is doing these stock transactions.
> They provide me with the QIF files.
>  
> In general, each weekend, I do: File: Import: Import QIF
> of the stock transactions that took place the previous week for a specific 
> account.
> I do that for each of several accounts in several files/books.
> I then try to run a Price update (does not always work).
>  
> In looking at the GBP stock with this issue, I see three USD entries
> and six GBP entries in the price history.
> One USD entry is a user:price-editor.
> The other two USD entries have both a USD and a GBP entry on the same date.
> The GBP entries are: user:split-register
> The USD entries are: user:split-import
>  
> I was using GnuCash 4.14 on Fedora Linux 37
> I am now using GnuCash 5.9 on Fedora Linux 40
> I probably changed four months ago.
>  
> 
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Re: [GNC] Stocks with prices in more than one currency

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Fred,

The basic challenge here is that you don't seem to know how data gets into your 
GnuCash database. There are some very crafty people reading this list, so I'm 
not going to exclude the possibility that one might be able to explain how 
different currencies were entered into your GnuCash data, yet at the same time 
I'm going to bet that it would make things much easier if you could explain how 
both USD and CAD data ended up in your data.

Even if you don't know when the specific entries were created, maybe you can 
explain your workflow.


> On 11/02/2024 2:06 AM PDT Fred Tydeman  wrote:
> 
>  
> This bug report has more details and the reason the current price was not
> used.
> 
> https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=799453
> 
> On Thu, Oct 31, 2024 at 10:08 PM Kalpesh Patel 
> wrote:
> 
> > While I don't know the full background on your situation, something is not
> > adding up right. If the setup for your book is correct then the exchange
> > rate between two currencies should reconcile the report to correct value
> > for the Advance Portfolio and the Current Value for it.
> >
> >
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Re: [GNC] Error deleting scheduled transaction split

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

What I did was delete the problematic split by using tab to move between the 
fields and the delete key to delete the undesirable data, including the split 
account.
 
 

> On 11/01/2024 7:09 PM PDT R Losey  wrote:
>  
>  
> Thanks. How did one charge the account anchoring the scheduled transaction? I 
> didn't think that the scheduled transactions were not anchored to any account 
> until they are entered.
>  
> 
> On Fri, Nov 1, 2024 at 4:45 PM Patrick James via gnucash-user 
> mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote:
> 
> > Verifying this behavior R Losey reported using GnuCash 5.9 on Windows 11.
> > 
> > Also the "anchor" is not very strong, as I changed the split account that 
> > was supposedly anchoring the scheduled transaction, and then I could delete 
> > the split.
> > 
> > I would consider this a bug. It's definitely not a feature, but my larger 
> > question is about why the anchor message comes up if it's so easy to change 
> > the anchor split and then delete it.
> > 
> > > On 11/01/2024 8:49 AM PDT R Losey  > > mailto:rlo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > I brought up the scheduled transaction editor, and attempted to delete one
> > > of entry of a multi-split transaction, and I received the error message:
> > > "You cannot delete this split", stating that it was anchoring this
> > > transaction to the register... this was in a register - it was the
> > > transaction editor.
> > >
> > > I am running the current version 5.9 on an M1 iMac running 14.6.1. I
> > > suspect it may happen on other platforms; I'll probably try on Windows a
> > > bit later today.
> > >
> > > As a temporary workaround, I have set the amount of that split entry to
> > > zero, and when it gets triggered and entered, I just delete the unneeded
> > > line from the register, and it deletes without any problems.
> > >
> > > --
> > > _
> > > Richard Losey
> > > rlo...@gmail.com mailto:rlo...@gmail.com
> > > Micah 6:8
> > > ___
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> > 
> 
>  
> --
> _
> Richard Losey
> rlo...@gmail.com mailto:rlo...@gmail.com
> Micah 6:8
> 
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Re: [GNC] Error deleting scheduled transaction split

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Verifying this behavior R Losey reported using GnuCash 5.9 on Windows 11.

Also the "anchor" is not very strong, as I changed the split account that was 
supposedly anchoring the scheduled transaction, and then I could delete the 
split.

I would consider this a bug. It's definitely not a feature, but my larger 
question is about why the anchor message comes up if it's so easy to change the 
anchor split and then delete it.

> On 11/01/2024 8:49 AM PDT R Losey  wrote:
> 
>  
> I brought up the scheduled transaction editor, and attempted to delete one
> of entry of a multi-split transaction, and I received the error message:
> "You cannot delete this split", stating that it was anchoring this
> transaction to the register... this was in a register - it was the
> transaction editor.
> 
> I am running the current version 5.9 on an M1 iMac running 14.6.1. I
> suspect it may happen on other platforms; I'll probably try on Windows a
> bit later today.
> 
> As a temporary workaround, I have set the amount of that split entry to
> zero, and when it gets triggered and entered, I just delete the unneeded
> line from the register, and it deletes without any problems.
> 
> -- 
> _
> Richard Losey
> rlo...@gmail.com
> Micah 6:8
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Re: [GNC] Stocks with prices in more than one currency

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Hello Fred,

You have no idea how data gets into your GnuCash file?


> On 10/31/2024 10:04 AM PDT Fred Tydeman  wrote:
> 
>  
> I have no idea how Gnucash ended up with prices in two different currencies
> for the same stock.
> I only found out that it did when the Advanced Portfolio report had a very
> wrong Current Value for that stock.
> 
> On Thu, Oct 31, 2024 at 2:48 PM Murugan Mariappan <
> m.muruganan...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > Hi Fred
> >
> > Can you explain why you have the same stock with two different currency
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Saludos Cordiales
> >
> >
> > Murugan
> > --
> > *From:* gnucash-user  > hotmail@gnucash.org> on behalf of Fred Tydeman  > >
> > *Sent:* 31 October 2024 04:16
> > *To:* Gnucash Users 
> > *Subject:* [GNC] Stocks with prices in more than one currency
> >
> > Is there a fast way to find stocks that have prices in more than one
> > currency?
> > Looking at the price history for each stock, one by one, is not fast.
> >
> > As I discovered, stocks with prices in more than one currency mess up the
> > Advanced Portfolio report.
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Re: [GNC] Cash Account

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

As the GnuCash help page suggests, not all assets are equal, in that there 
exists different levels of asset liquidity.

One use of this is the presentation of assets on the balance sheet. The greater 
the liquidity of an asset, the closer to to top the asset is listed.

Personally in GnuCash I assign "Asset" to each asset, but now I'm wondering if 
I've limited my ability to use some nice features of GnuCash. Then again, if 
it's just about user interface, and similar, then I'm not missing anything that 
is important to me.


> On 10/02/2024 9:43 AM PDT R Losey  wrote:
> 
>  
> Perhaps I'm being overly dense here...
> 
> Cash, Bank Accounts, etc are sub-elements of Assets.
> 
> So certainly, GnuCash treats assets the same - an asset is an asset.
> 
> But once you divide assets up - in any way - you are treating them as
> different things... therefore,
> "Is 'Cash on Hand' an asset?" - Yes.
> "Is it treated like other assets?" - Yes.
> Is it the same thing as some other asset? - No
> 
> 
> Just seems to me that we are trying to distinguish between a head category
> (Asset) and its various sub-categories (Cash on Hand) -- this is not really
> a like-to-like comparison.
> 
> On Wed, Oct 2, 2024 at 11:05 AM Brook Milligan via gnucash-user <
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote:
> 
> > Is it really the case that the _only_ impact of account type is to change
> > the headings in the GUI?
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Brook
> >
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

> On 10/02/2024 8:26 AM PDT Bruce Griffis  wrote:

> If I need to pay 24 dollars just to get a 12 dollar item, it had better
> have a value of 24 dollars just to sit on a shelf and look at it. 

Put differently, it's not a 12 dollar item. It's a 24 dollar item.

So you are correct, the item needs to have a value of at least $24 for you to 
purchase it. If you valued the item at less than $24, then you would not pay 
the $24.
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Re: [GNC] Cash Account

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

> On 10/01/2024 9:44 AM PDT Chris Miller via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi Folks, 
> 
> These are GnuCash questions; not accounting questions: 
> 
> 
> * How do "Cash", "Bank" and "Asset" accounts different from each other? 
> They are all assets ... 
> * How do "Liability" and "Credit Card" accounts different from each 
> other? They are all liabilities ... 
> 
> 
> Are these distinctions without a difference? 
> Are they here because most users might not know that a "Bank" account is an 
> asset and a "Credit Card" is a liability? 
> Does GnuCash treat them differently? 
> 
> Thanks for the help, 
> -- 
> Chris. 
> 

The page below suggests there is some good reason, but it's a bit ambiguous.

My overall interpretation from the entire page is that it helps with the 
balance sheet, or something similar to that.

"A GnuCash account must have a unique name (that you assign) and one of the 
predefined GnuCash “account types”. There are a total of 12 account types in 
GnuCash. These 12 account types are based on the 5 basic accounting types; the 
reason there are more GnuCash account types than basic accounting types is that 
this allows GnuCash to perform specialized tracking and handling of certain 
accounts. There are 6 asset accounts (Cash, Bank, Stock, Mutual Fund, Accounts 
Receivable, and Other Assets), 3 liability accounts (Credit Card, Accounts 
Payable, and Liability), 1 equity account (Equity), 1 income account (Income), 
and 1 expense account (Expenses)."

Again, I'm not exactly sure about the way that GnuCash was programmed with 
respect to these various different accounts, as I just use the basic accounts 
and organize things myself.

SOURCE: https://lists.gnucash.org/docs/C/gnucash-guide/accts-types1.html
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Years ago, I was reading through the tax code, and I had a question, so I 
presented it to a tax attorney.

The attorney thought the question was a little bit overdone, yet at the same 
time, he could not dispute my reasoning.

Without getting into the technical details of the US tax code, the basic 
summary is "receiving something of value after being required to do something 
at the direction of another IS INCOME." In this case it was about receiving a 
discount AFTER AND ONLY IF I fill out a survey. To receive the discount I was 
required to complete the survey.

The bottom line is, yes, that 10% discount on my purchase is income under the 
US tax code, because I was required to do something at the direction of the 
other party.

If I simply happen upon a 10% coupon, and need not do anything at the direction 
of the other party (other than present it), then the discount is not taxable 
under the US tax code.

This crazy nonsense is not what the IRS is interested in, or at least my 
attorney assured me that there would be no problem if I "forgot" to report the 
discount after being required to fill out a survey.

Then it was a bit about materiality, "Even if the IRS did find out about that 
10% discount on a relatively small purchase, thus an even smaller amount of 
income, the IRS simply cannot spend time on this." I'm paraphrasing, but the 
basic idea is that the IRS has better things to do than worry about income 
related to survey discounts.


> On 09/30/2024 7:03 PM PDT Michael or Penny Novack via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> Just a hobby.
> 
> Well many/most of our hobbies are not "at risk" of producing income. And 
> jurisdictions differ.
> 
> Here in the US if your hobby does produce an income, that IS taxable, 
> but because a hobby, expenses count only toward reducing that income. In 
> other words, losses from the hobby cannot be used to offset other 
> income. For this reason, the tax folks will usually try to judge the 
> activity as hobby if not making profits X years out of Y. Understand? 
> YOU can end up owing them more taxes if "hobby" rather than business but 
> never the other way around. So even if I planned the activity as a hobby 
> I would want to keep the books correctly for a business.
> 
> Look, some people buy/fix up/sell houses "flip houses" - big money 
> can be involved so ruled hobby or business could matter (and THIS 
> example complicated if only one at a time and they occupy "their residence")
> 
> Some people buy the remains of cars found in barns, restore the 
> antiques, show them in competitions -- then sell to begin again. Might 
> have a number in various stages of the process. Again, hobby or business 
> can have tax consequences.
> 
> Michael D Novack
> 
> 
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Chris,

"Take a look at my new car. I paid $1,000 plus $25,000 in shipping, so if I 
sold it today for $2,000, I'd be doubling my money."

Hopefully David won't be filing for bankruptcy after he records the sale as a 
$200 profit.

David does make a good point that we are discussing a hobby at most, so it's up 
to Flavio to determine how to manage the books.

That said, if an asset is going to be recorded on the books, which is not 
necessary in Flavio's situation, then I completely agree that all the cost of 
the asset should be recorded.


> On 09/30/2024 2:33 PM PDT Chris Miller via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi David,
>If I bought a guitar for $500 and then spent $300 to have it shipped to
>me, I would most definitely want that recorded as an $800 guitar, so I
>would not mistakenly sell it to somebody who offered me $700 because it
>looked like a $200 profit.
>The book value of an asset is as the FASB says. It includes all the
>costs to procure and deploy an asset. There is a reason for that.
>Chris.
>Laboriously sent to you from my ... do you really care?
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

For whatever reason, we live in a world where location does matter, and the 
value of a good changes with its location.

If the value of a good did not change with location, there would be no shipping.


> On 09/30/2024 1:32 PM PDT David Cousens  wrote:
> 
>  
> Flavio,
> 
> Shipping is a service so it does not add to the value of your assets so
> it is simply an expense so the transaction becomes:
> 
> PURCHASE:
> Increase "Assets:Material:Item #1" of 300
> Decrease "Checking account" by 300.
> Increase "Expenses:Postage" of 10.
> Decrease "Checking account" by 10.
> 
> then there is no need to account for the shipping at time of sale
> SALE:
> Increase "Checking account" by 320.
> Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1" by 300.
> Increase  "Income:Sales"        by  20.
> 
> The difference between "Income:Sales" and "Expenses:Postage" is your
> profit on the transaction  and the difference between the balance of
> the top level Income account and the top level Expenses account will
> represent your overall profit.  If you needed to know the profit on an
> individual item you would add a subaccount to the Expenses:Postage
> :Item #1.
> 
> David Cousens
> 
> 
> On Mon, 2024-09-30 at 18:47 +0200, Boniforti Flavio wrote:
> > Hi all.
> > I'm again stuck with a specific type of transaction and would like to
> > have
> > it validated (or corrected). Suggestions on how you would do it are
> > welcome
> > as well - I might not be using the most intuitive way of registering
> > it.
> > 
> > So...
> > 
> > I bought an item for 300. Paid for it from my checking account.
> > I paid for shipping separately 10. Paid for this as well from my
> > checking
> > account.
> > Sold the item for 320, which was wire-transferred into my checking
> > account.
> > I have earned 10 from the transaction.
> > 
> > I have created an account for that item:
> > Assets:Material:Item #1
> > Also, I've added a shipping sub-account to it:
> > Assets:Material:Item #1:Shipping
> > 
> > Then I entered the split transaction as follows:
> > 
> > PURCHASE =
> > Increase "Assets:Material:Item #1" of 300.
> > Increase "Assets:Material:Item #1:Shipping" of 10.
> > Decrease "Checking account" by 300.
> > Decrease "Checking account" by 10.
> > As I also have an account for "Postage expenses", how would I have to
> > register the 10 bucks I spent for shipping, so that it also accounts
> > towards the postage expenses in general?
> > 
> > SALE =
> > Increase "Checking account" by 320.
> > Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1:Shipping" by 10.
> > Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1" by 300.
> > Increase "Sales Surplus" by 10.
> > 
> > Thanks (again) for your help!
> > F.
> > 
> > https://www.instagram.com/boniforti_music
> > https://soundcloud.com/boniforti_music
> > https://bonny-j.bandcamp.com
> > ___
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

In terms of what relevance is FASB, or some other accounting standard, if there 
are no standards, it's very difficult to have a discussion, as one can make his 
or her own rules of the road.

With some "reasonable accounting standards," whatever those may be, the heart 
of this discussion is the division of expenses between different accounting 
periods.


> On 09/30/2024 1:02 PM PDT Stan Brown (using GC 4.14)  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> 
> What is the relevance of the FASB to the personal books of an individual
> who is not conducting a business and is not a US national? Even if the
> Swiss accounting standards board agrees with the FASB, is Flavio obliged
> to follow it?
> 
> I would be pretty foolish to say the FASB is wrong, but I think it's
> important to distinguish between an individual's own non-business books
> and the books of a business. As I understand things, the FASB governs
> accounting for _companies_. If Mr X buys something for $100 and it costs
> him $100 plus $8.25 tax plus $10 shipping, should he value it at $100,
> $108.25, $110, or $118.25? A case could be made for any of those,
> depending on what the individual wants to track separately in reports.
> 
> Stan Brown
> Tehachapi, CA, USA
> https://BrownMath.com
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Stan, 

Inbound, Outbound or both?


> On 09/30/2024 11:22 AM PDT Stan Brown (using GC 4.14)  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> I would absolutely record shipping as an expense, not an asset. The
> asset has value after you receive it; the shipping is "used up" the
> moment the package arrives. Only things that still have value should be
> listed in Assets.
> 
> You realized there was something wrong with treating it as an asset,
> when you recognized that nothing had been recorded in Expenses:Postage.
> 
> Standard disclaimer: this is not professional accounting advice and I a
> not an accountant. If this were a business rather than your personal
> books you should consider consulting a professional.
> 
> Stan Brown
> Tehachapi, CA, USA
> https://BrownMath.com
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

You're getting into an area where you have choices to make. There is nothing 
particularly wrong with separating the freight, and maybe that's important to 
you. At the same time, maybe it's not important, and the work is not worth any 
benefit. Is there any benefit to you to separate the freight? What are you 
going to do with the information in the future?
 
Also since we're talking about your personal finances where you've indicated 
you're free to do whatever you want, then if that information is important in 
the future, then it's almost always easier to separate it on the front end 
(today, rather than going back and restating all the records).
 
Personally I'd just put the freight and cost of the item together, and then 
when I sell the specific good (i.e. specific lot identification for inventory), 
I'd just put the total cost of the item to COGS.
 
There are problems with this:
 
SALE =
Increase "Checking account" by 320.
Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1" by 300.
Increase "Sales Surplus" by 10.
Increase "Shipping of sold goods" by 10.
 
What I would do for my own personal finances:
 
Increase Cash (debit) = Checking Account = $320
Increase COGS (debit) by $310
Increase Revenue from sales (credit) by $320
Decrease Inventory (credit): "Assets:Material:Item #1" by $310.
 
What I would do for my own personal finances if there were $15 outbound freight:
 
Increase Cash (debit) = Checking Account = $335
Increase COGS (debit) by $310
Increase Revenue from sales (credit) by $320
Decrease Inventory (credit): "Assets:Material:Item #1" by $310.
increase outbound freight expense (credit) by $15
 
Again the above is what I would do with my personal finances. I compute my 
personal chance of having problems with a few tiny transactions to be very 
small, $10 here or there, which sum up to near zero over the year.
 
Consult a professional before you get to a significant size with your sales.
 

> On 09/30/2024 10:29 AM PDT Boniforti Flavio  wrote:
>  
>  
> Hi Patrick.
> I'm no business, I just want for my personal finances to be able to see both 
> how much I spent in postage costs/fees (for everything I've ever had to 
> ship/send), as well as how much that cost has added to an item I've bought. 
> This, because I make a simple calculation: when I buy an item I pay for the 
> goods itself *and* the shipping. When I sell the same item (again - no 
> business here, just private sale between private citizens), I'd like to know 
> how much I earned (surplus) or lost, considering the cost as an entity made 
> of the value of the goods and the shipping I had to pay.
> So according to what you explained, I should actually not separate the 
> shipping I paid when buying the item - right? If correct, the transaction 
> would become like this:
>  
> PURCHASE = 
> Increase "Assets:Material:Item #1" of 310.
> Decrease "Checking account" by 310.
>  
> Therefore the sale would be:
>  
> SALE =
> Increase "Checking account" by 320.
> Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1" by 300.
> Increase "Sales Surplus" by 10.
> Increase "Shipping of sold goods" by 10.
>  
> Can you comment/validate the above?
>  
> TIA,
> F.
>  
> 
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Re: [GNC] Another "multi-account" logical issue - any advice on how to register this?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

One question you're asking is about the cost of goods sold (COGS), and how to 
determine what's included and excluded. There are two directions of freight, 
inbound and outbound. In the US inbound freight is generally included in the 
COGS and outbound freight (to the customer) is a cost of sales (monthly 
expense, never included in the inventory).

Also it's time to mention that there are different systems of inventory 
(FIFO/LIFO/Specific lot/average cost).


> On 09/30/2024 9:47 AM PDT Boniforti Flavio  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi all.
> I'm again stuck with a specific type of transaction and would like to have
> it validated (or corrected). Suggestions on how you would do it are welcome
> as well - I might not be using the most intuitive way of registering it.
> 
> So...
> 
> I bought an item for 300. Paid for it from my checking account.
> I paid for shipping separately 10. Paid for this as well from my checking
> account.
> Sold the item for 320, which was wire-transferred into my checking account.
> I have earned 10 from the transaction.
> 
> I have created an account for that item:
> Assets:Material:Item #1
> Also, I've added a shipping sub-account to it:
> Assets:Material:Item #1:Shipping
> 
> Then I entered the split transaction as follows:
> 
> PURCHASE =
> Increase "Assets:Material:Item #1" of 300.
> Increase "Assets:Material:Item #1:Shipping" of 10.
> Decrease "Checking account" by 300.
> Decrease "Checking account" by 10.
> As I also have an account for "Postage expenses", how would I have to
> register the 10 bucks I spent for shipping, so that it also accounts
> towards the postage expenses in general?
> 
> SALE =
> Increase "Checking account" by 320.
> Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1:Shipping" by 10.
> Decrease "Assets:Material:Item #1" by 300.
> Increase "Sales Surplus" by 10.
> 
> Thanks (again) for your help!
> F.
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/boniforti_music
> https://soundcloud.com/boniforti_music
> https://bonny-j.bandcamp.com
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Re: [GNC] ANNOUNCE: GnuCash 5.9 Released

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

GnuCash is run and maintained by volunteers. I'm betting that the person who 
maintains the webspace (GnuCash.org) will update the main page during the next 
few days.
 
I am very grateful for the effort the volunteers expend. I am not one of the 
developers, but I've been known to spend time trying to replicate bugs, which 
has helped John Ralls find a few bugs, including Bug #799423.
 
https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=799423
 
Again, I'm very grateful for all the work the volunteers put forward, and I 
realize that sometimes the main page is not updated as quickly as some might 
desire.
 
 

> On 09/29/2024 11:27 PM PDT Joseph Keithley  wrote:
>  
>  
> Not to put to fine a point on it, why then have a central website that 
> doesn't provide the most current stable relesase?  And, no, I don't read 
> entire messasges that do little more than list bug fixes just to find more 
> websites.
> 
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Re: [GNC] ANNOUNCE: GnuCash 5.9 Released

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Joseph Keithley,

Please read the entire original message, including the links near the bottom.


> On 09/29/2024 10:37 PM PDT Joseph Keithley  wrote:
> 
>  
> The Gnucash.org page still only has versin 5.8 as the download.  Where do I
> get 5.9?
> 
> On Sun, Sep 29, 2024 at 4:19 PM John Ralls  wrote:
> 
> > The GnuCash development team announces GnuCash 5.9, the tenth release in
> > the stable 5.x series.
> > Between 5.8 and 5.9, the following bugfixes were accomplished:
> > • Bug 724745 - Added new transaction during reconcile, didn't show
> > up in reconcile window.
> > • Bug 797045 - Improve error reporting for bad credentials with
> > MySQL backend ("bad or corrupt data" => "access denied")
> > • Bug 798568 - Transaction Copy/Paste problem
> > • Bug 799308 - sqlite backend: Example Python script prints error
> > when creating new file.
> > • Bug 799370 - Transaction Journal view cursor placement after
> > commit to transaction change.
> > • Bug 799384 - Reconciled date cannot be parsed.
> > • Bug 799389 - Crash when removing an account
> > • Bug 799391 - Transaction Cut/Paste doesn't move the transaction
> > to the target account
> > • Bug 799395 - relative date offset quarters occasionally wrong
> > • Bug 799399 - Windows Keypad decimal locale error
> > • Bug 799416 - Post invoice: post to account dropdown listbox too
> > small
> > • Bug 799419 - Intermittent quote price issue
> > The following fixes and improvements were not associated with bug reports:
> > • Add YH Finance (FINANCEAPI) API Key to Quotes infrastructure
> > with a preference in the Online Quotes page and add financeapi to known
> > sources.
> > • Move copied_class and copied_leader_guid
> > Move static copied_class and static copied_leader_guid to be part of the
> > copied_item structure. This makes it more evident that calling
> > clear_copied_item needs to be called before copied_item is used.
> > • [gnc-datetime] improve CSV date parser with ICU and Boost.
> > • Add dateformat "Locale" with ICU; uses current locale
> > for date parsing. ICU's locale date parser may parse "3 May 2023" or
> > "2024年9月13日" (LC_TIME=zh_TW.utf8) and maybe others.
> > • Augment d-m-y m-d-y and y-m-d with boost UK/US/ISO
> > parsers. This allows CSV import of dates with months as words as "30 Sep
> > 2023" or "May 4, 1978" or "2023-Dec-25". Note boost parser cannot recognise
> > 2-digit years, therefore "30 Sep 24" is invalid.
> > • Csv Import - improve assisant's introduction page
> > • Correctly handle uncommitted edits when opening a file from
> > history.
> > • Don't use gnc_difftime and deprecate it because it casts time64
> > to doubles
> > • [gnc-pricedb.h] remove unused gnc_pricedb_substitute_commodity
> > • [gnc-pricedb.h] remove unused gnc_pricedb_lookup_at_time64
> > New and Updated Translations: Assamese, Chinese (Simplified), Chinese
> > (Traditional), Croatian, Dutch, English (United Kingdom), Hebrew,
> > Hungarian, Macedonian, Norwegian Bokmål, Portuguese (Brazil), Russian,
> > Spanish, Swedish, Turkish
> >
> > Help translate GnuCash on Weblate:
> > https://hosted.weblate.org/engage/gnucash/
> >
> > German AQBanking Users:
> > The AQBanking author is still working to get his updated PIN/TAN code
> > finalized so the Flatpak, macOS, and Windows bundles of this release
> > contain the last stable version, 6.5.4. The GnuCash nightly builds have
> > beta releases with the new implementation, so consider using one of those
> > if the stable AQBanking doesn't work for you.
> >
> > Known Problems
> >
> > Complete list of all open bugs:
> > https://bugs.gnucash.org/buglist.cgi?bug_severity=blocker&bug_severity=critical&bug_severity=major&bug_severity=normal&bug_severity=minor&bug_severity=trivial&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=NEEDINFO&bug_status=REOPENED&limit=0&list_id=8149&order=priority%2Cbug_severity&query_format=advanced
> >
> > Documentation
> >
> > The following fixes and improvements were not associated with bug reports:
> > • Update github CI actions versions.
> > New and Updated Translations: German
> >
> > Getting GnuCash for Windows and MacOS
> >
> > GnuCash is provided for both Microsoft Windows 10® and later and MacOS
> > 10.13 (High Sierra)® and later in pre-built, all-in-one packages. An
> > installer is provided for Microsoft Windows® while the MacOS® package is a
> > disk image containing a drag-and-drop application bundle.
> >
> > GnuCash is also available as a flatpak from Flathub.org. Instructions for
> > installing and running: https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Flatpak
> >
> > The SHA256 Hashes for the downloadable files are:
> >
> > • 5be2e5364fc36464fc32c768e2ab460a630f74db6aeb7d44266e3dab98222fd0
> > gnucash-5.9.tar.bz2
> > • 35375b2b1affe2a7e46becefb9e1205f432262c6ed0c7baa72f41b3b13f7235d
> > gnucash-5.9.tar.gz
> 

Re: [GNC] Entering my real estate and mortgage?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Boniforti,

I am not a maintainer/moderator of this list.

The challenge with accounting questions is the accounting standard being used. 
For someone who is new to accounting, it seems as though there should be one 
"right" or "best" answer, but often the "right" or "best" answer is 
situational, and depends on factors such as the organization and accounting 
standard being applied. Even then, goals and objectives might differ, and thus 
when there are options, the "best" choice is a management decision.

If someone asks, "How do you personally do this..." then you avoid the 
challenge, but then you may not be so certain of what went into the decision 
the person made.

Someone might say, "Here is how I account for this given transaction..." or 
"Here is how I would account for a transaction if I were in your situation...", 
and that may be helpful for you. After gathering up a bunch of data, analyze 
it, and then the way to get best advice for your situation is to take your 
information to a professional who can and will represent you.

In summary, there are major problems with getting accounting advice on the 
internet, and following poor advice could be very costly in the future.

> On 09/29/2024 11:41 AM PDT Boniforti Flavio  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi Stan - I know this is a GC mailing list and not an accounting one. This
> is simply my best way to learn something and get helpful information. If
> these kinds of questions are OT here, then please excuse me and I'll search
> somewhere else for information.
> 
> Thanks to everyone replying to my initial question, even though I didn't
> reply to every single email in this thread.
> 
> F.
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/boniforti_music
> https://soundcloud.com/boniforti_music
> https://bonny-j.bandcamp.com
> 
> 
> Am So., 29. Sept. 2024 um 01:06 Uhr schrieb Stan Brown (using GC 4.14) <
> stan...@fastmail.fm>:
> 
> > On 2024-09-28 14:07, Boniforti Flavio wrote:
> > > I would enter it as follows (let's assume the real estate total cost is
> > > 500k):
> > >
> > > Assets:Fixed Assets:Real Estate - increase 300k
> > > Liabilities:Loans:Mortgage Loans: - increase 300k
> > > Assets:Fixed Assets:Real Estate - increase 150k (downpayment)
> > > Assets:Current Assets:Checking Account - decrease 150k (downpayment)
> > > Assets:Fixed Assets:Real Estate - increase 50k (reservation)
> > > Assets:Current Assets:Checking Account - decrease 50k (reservation)
> >
> > You do realize this is an accounting question, not a GnuCash question,
> > right? But there is a GnuCash feature you may not be aware of.
> >
> > I'm not sure why you are contemplating three transactions with a total
> > of six splits, when it's all logically one transaction. You wouldn't be
> > getting this mortgage if you weren't buying this property, or buying
> > this property without this mortgage or "reservation" (a Swiss
> > real-estate term I don't know). I believe that entering them as one
> > transaction would be more logical, and faster too:
> >
> > Assets...Real Estate: increase (debit) 500K (property value)
> > Liabilities...Mortgage Loans: increase (credit) 300K
> > Assets...Checking Account: decrease (credit) 150K (down payment)
> > Assets...Checking Account: decrease (credit) 50K (reservation)
> >
> > If you're doing this in an account register, you may need to click the
> > Split button at the top to open enough fields to make this entry.
> >
> > Stan Brown
> > Tehachapi, CA, USA
> > https://BrownMath.com/
> > ___
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> > gnucash-user@gnucash.org
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> > -
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> >
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Re: [GNC] Recommendations for hosting gnucash file - Google Drive, Microsoft 365, Local server?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

Michael,

Modern encryption systems, including open source systems, should be compliant 
with Kerckhoffs's principle.


> On 09/09/2024 10:32 AM PDT Michael or Penny Novack via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> On 9/9/2024 10:16 AM, Derek Atkins wrote:
> > The GnuCash team, historically, have explicitly decided that GnuCash leave
> > encryption and other password protection to external tools and NOT perform
> > it internally.  GnuCash is a financial tool, not a security tool.
> 
> A) Password protection IN THE APP would only provide a false sense of 
> security. This is OPEN SOURCE software. That means rather easy for an 
> attacker to compile their own version of gnucash (that ignored a wrong 
> password). Harder for an attacker with closed source, they would need 
> some special tools, but doable*.
> 
> B) The external tool/encrypted storage device done by people whose 
> specialty is security. One caveat --- do not trust you would have 
> security against a gov't. You would never know which encryption systems 
> they can crack (the spooks don't publish).
> 
> Michael D Novack
> 
> * In my working days, I've used a disassembler, a hex editor, and a tool 
> that mapped where in the code a running program was. In my case, nothing 
> nefarious, just things like lost source code << but it's our own 
> software -- need to make a change, need to recover human readable source 
> code so programmers can make future changes, etc. >>
>
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Re: [GNC] Tracking Unrealized Capital Gains

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

I'm guessing your understanding of how to use GNUCash is sufficient to 
accomplish whatever is best for your situation. Your question is more about 
what's best for your situation, and while you did not mention it directly, you 
also want to make sure that the information that you get is worth the cost of 
obtaining it. Sometimes people have reasons for tracking things, but the 
information is not worth its cost.

If you're talking about substantial tax liability, then I suggest talking to 
someone who has the skill and knowledge to minimize your tax bill. That same 
person should be able to give some guidance as to how to best account based on 
your specific situation, including when your taxes will be owing and due.



> On 07/23/2024 2:57 PM PDT David Warren  wrote:
> 
> Everything should have a *reason *for tracking.  My reason is that if there
> are gains in certain of my investment accounts, I don't want my net worth
> to appear higher than it actually is, and I want to be prepared for large
> tax bills (high class problem) where I will need cash to pay the government
> when investment gains are ultimately realized.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any tips or realized practices...
> 
> David
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Re: [GNC] GnuCash getting worse?

[Patrick James via gnucash-user]

> On 07/21/2024 3:29 AM PDT Fred Bone  wrote:
> 
>  
> On 20 July 2024 at 6:19, Nate Bargmann said:
> 
> [...]
> > Already GNC's column layout is opposite of the
> > manual check registers I've been using for 40+ years and that leads to
> > mistakes in one or the other for me so the last thing that is needed is
> > more ambiguity.
> 
> Eh? I was brought up to believe that "debits on the left, credits on the 
> right" has been an accounting standard since Adam was a lad.
> 

When you make a bank deposit, you debit your asset account, but the bank 
credits your deposit account on its books (a liability account for the bank).

The shift from your books to the bank's books, from an asset account to 
liability account, from the left-hand side of the balance sheet equation to the 
right-hand side, is where the change in the normal balance took place.

There are plenty of philosophical discussions about people who rely on the bank 
to keep their books, and there are other discussions about what reconciliation 
means and how closely your books should match the bank's records, and this 
especially seems to be a topic of discussion when someone claims there is 
missing money.
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Re: [GNC] Request for help!

[Patrick James]

> On 07/11/2024 6:30 PM PDT Ronald Solomon  wrote:
> 
>  
> Yes, I know I can however, trying to type out the concerns is
> time-consuming, and in the past, I didn't ask the correct questions so did
> not get a correct answer. I appreciate everyone giving me information but
> my issues are not being answered. That is why I am asking for someone to
> talk over the phone with me or zoom so I can share my screen.
> 
> Ron Solomon
> 

Ron,

First let me begin with the history of the CSV import. According to my 
research, the CSV import in GNUCash was designed with one purpose in mind: 
Importing information from bank downloads. It was then expanded from there, but 
the basic design was to import from bank downloads.

Now to your specific question on how to import.

We need to start with a test file and work up to your production data.

Start with a fresh gnucash data file, one that named for testing purposes. This 
is not your production data file.

Next I'm going to suggest importing the sample mulit-split data presented in 
example 6.1:

Example 6.1. Sample Multi-split.csv

Date,Description,Deposit,Account
05/03/2006,Grocery Store,-45.21,Assets:Checking
,,45.21,Expenses:Groceries
14/03/2006,Employers R Us,670.00,Assets:Checking
,,180.00,Expenses:Taxes:Federal
,,90.00,Expenses:Taxes:Medicare
,,60.00,Expenses:Taxes:Social Security
,,-1000.00,Income:Salary

SOURCE: https://gnucash.org/docs/v5/C/gnucash-manual/trans-import.html

You'll need to copy and paste the data into a text editor and save the file 
with the csv extension.

Settings for that file are:

File Format: Character-separated
Comma
Multi-split

Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8)
Date format: d-m-y

Leading lines to skip: 1

Now select pull down menus and match the first row (lined out)

Date - Description - Amount - Account 


If you get stuck in that process, please let us know where.
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Re: [GNC] CSV Importer - Debit vs Credit

[Patrick James]

Paul,

It has been my personal experience that importing double quotes can be 
problematic for GNUCash, so I always remove all the double quotes during my 
pre-processing of the data.

The bug report is here:

https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=798479



> On 07/04/2024 12:40 PM PDT Paul Kroitor  wrote:
> 
> 
> NB: since " is used in the actual data, I'm using ' above as a delimiter and
> " as a character in the string.
>
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Re: [GNC] Maddening!!!!!!!!

[Patrick James]

Save, Exit, and Reload will clear the rouge transactions.
 

> On 02/08/2024 8:54 AM PST Jack Slater  wrote:
>  
>  
> Anything coming soon to fix this?
> 
> On Thu, Jan 25, 2024 at 12:26 PM Patrick James  mailto:patrickjame...@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > This is bug 799093, and John Ralls has not asked additional questions after 
> > I was able to reliably reproduce (part of) the issue, so, hopefully, there 
> > is sufficient information to find the bug.
> > 
> > https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=799093
> > 
> > s by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
> > 
> 
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Re: [GNC] New user error

[Patrick James]

I've been comparing and contrasting two options:

1. Reports -> Assets & Liabilities -> General Journal
2. Tools -> General Journal

If the second option is selected, which is the one I generally use, then 
sorting by date of entry puts the transactions in date order. The General 
Journal (option 2) is also subject to filters.

The General Journal Report (option 1) does not have any options, at least none 
that I've found, so it should include all data entry.


> On 02/08/2024 7:06 AM PST Derek Atkins  wrote:
> 
>  
> I presume you mean Tools -> General Journal ?
> 
> -derek
> 
> On Thu, February 8, 2024 9:58 am, Michael or Penny Novack wrote:
> > On 2/7/2024 11:11 PM, Adrien Monteleone wrote:
> >> Michael,
> >>
> >> Transaction Journal View is simply the same full transaction
> >> accessible via either 'Split' or 'Auto-Split' but for all transactions
> >> - *not* one at a time.
> >
> > Yes of course, can have on your screen "journal view" for all
> > transactions affecting the account. But that is NOT "full journal view".
> > Gnucash is "virtual journal" but you can get gnucash to show you that
> > (full journal).
> >
> > By "full journal" I mean something looking like what would have been
> > used in old pen and ink on paper days. The entries in date order no
> > matter what accounts were involved.
> >
> > See what the report "General Journal" gives you.
> >
> >
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Re: [GNC] New user error

[Patrick James]

Two questions:

1. What is "interactive mode," how does it differ from other modes, and where 
do I find the different modes?

> There IS however a report which will show you the journal (the date 
> ordered transactions) if for some reason you wanted to look at that.

2. While I understand reports have many options, and this discussion could 
quickly extend beyond the register view, if we (reasonably) keep it to the 
register, what's the difference between "Sort by" and select "Date of entry" 
versus the report?



> On 02/07/2024 2:26 PM PST Michael or Penny Novack 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> On 2/7/2024 4:59 PM, R Losey wrote:
> > I was intrigued by the Transaction Journal mentioned, but I don't have a
> > Transaction Journal in my View menu...
> >
> > after additional digging, I discovered it doesn't show up on the Accounts
> > page; one must be in one of the accounts to see it.
> 
> Gnucash is "virtual journal". Those of us who learned in the old paper 
> and pen on paper days will remember we FIRST entered transactions in the 
> journal, then posted them to the ledger accounts. IF you select "journal 
> view" you can enter transactions that way, and when the entry is 
> complete, automatic posting. BUT except for one transaction at a time, 
> you can't see the journal directly while in interactive mode.
> 
> There IS however a report which will show you the journal (the date 
> ordered transactions) if for some reason you wanted to look at that.
> 
> This is not the time or place to discuss that some reports have 
> misleading names (in gnucash)
> 
> 
> Michael D Novack
> 
> 
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Re: [GNC] New user error (was: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 251, Issue 12)

[Patrick James]

After suggesting that the manual was read, and that "the double entry is 
understood," at some point the best answer becomes "it's time to hire an 
accountant."

> On 02/07/2024 10:50 AM PST sunfish62--- via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> Your register shows transactions. They add up to zero (as I and others have 
> noted)  and so don't show in the Chart of Accounts. 
> 
> RTFM
> 
> ⁣David T. ​
> 
> On Feb 7, 2024, 9:40 PM, at 9:40 PM, accounting Billing 
>  wrote:
> >I think this is a technical difficulty. Because none of the
> >transactions
> >are showing at all.
> >
> >On Wed, Feb 7, 2024 at 11:02 AM sunfis...@yahoo.com
> >
> >wrote:
> >
> >> You keep entering the second entry in your transaction **into the
> >same
> >> account you're in. **
> >>
> >> Think of it this way, you take $20 out of your right pocket, and then
> >put
> >> $20 into your right pocket. Assuming your right pocket started with
> >$20,
> >> how much is left after this transaction? ($20)
> >>
> >> GnuCash is recording *that* transaction, which is what you told it to
> >do.
> >>
> >> You say you've read the manual, but I'd recommend reviewing 2.2.3 and
> >5.3
> >> in the Guide, and section 6.2 in Help.
> >>
> >> David T.
> >> On Feb 7, 2024, at 5:43 PM, accounting Billing <
> >> account...@rapidroutelogistics.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I did read the manual and understand the double entry. But how come
> >the
> >>> software is not recording and showing any transactions?
> >>>
> >>> If anyone can get a zoom call and help us to set this up. We will
> >donate
> >>> and compensate for their time.
> >>> My name is Beck, Cell 347-206-1096.
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Feb 7, 2024 at 9:38 AM sunfis...@yahoo.com
> >
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
>  Also, you need to read the manual to understand double entry
> >accounting
>  and its implementation in GnuCash. (Stephen's previous reply to
> >your
>  question about Equity applies here as well.)
> 
>  And GnuCash list etiquette.
> 
>  David T.
>  On Feb 7, 2024, at 5:27 PM, accounting Billing <
>  account...@rapidroutelogistics.com> wrote:
> >
> > Also, When i try to record the expenses transactions, It is not
> >showing on
> > the dashboard.
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 7, 2024 at 9:16 AM 
> >wrote:
> >
> >  Send gnucash-user mailing list submissions to
> >>  gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> >>
> >>  To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >>  https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> >>  or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >>  gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org
> >>
> >>  You can reach the person managing the list at
> >>  gnucash-user-ow...@gnucash.org
> >>
> >>  When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more
> >specific
> >>  than "Re: Contents of gnucash-user digest..."
> >>
> >>
> >>  Today's Topics:
> >>
> >> 1. Re:  GNUCash 5.5 (Stan Brown (using GC 4.14))
> >> 2. Re:  Change Printed Invoice (Lester Bennett)
> >> 3. Re:  Change Printed Invoice (Michael or Penny Novack)
> >> 4.  GNUCash 5.5 (accounting Billing)
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >>
> >>  Message: 1
> >>  Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2024 17:30:43 -0800
> >>  From: "Stan Brown (using GC 4.14)" 
> >>  To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> >>  Subject: Re: [GNC] GNUCash 5.5
> >>  Message-ID: <065b2fe8-8524-48c6-98c5-644030e7a...@fastmail.fm>
> >>  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> >>
> >>
> >>  On 2024-02-06 16:51, accounting Billing wrote:
> >>
> >>>  From: accounting Billing 
> >>>  Date: Tue, Feb 6, 2024, 3:00?PM
> >>>  Subject: GNUCash 5.5
> >>>  To: , , <
> >>>  christopher@gmail.com>
> >>>
> >>>  We are willing to use GnuCash for our business accounting, But
> >we are
> >>>  facing some issues.
> >>>
> >>>  When I try to add any transactions. It is not showing on the
> >Accounts
> >>>  Total numbers.
> >>>
> >>>  When I try to put a transaction on the list, It is not showing
> >on the
> >>>
> >>  main
> >>
> >>>  page.
> >>>
> >>
> >>  You debited and credited Equity:Opening Balances for the same
> >amount, so
> >>  the net is zero, just as your attachment shows.  I don't
> >understand the
> >>  context of the I/O error; possibly the @ signs in your disk
> >names are a
> >>  problem.
> >>
> >>  Before you go further, may I strongly, strongly suggest that you
> >read
> >>  the Tutorial and Concepts Guide and actually work through the
> >examples
> >>  that are relevant to your particular situation.
> >>  
> >>
> >>  At bottom, GnuCash is just a computer replacement for keeping
> >books of
> >>  account in pen and ink. However, it has its o

Re: [GNC] View - Double Line

[Patrick James]

I'm running GNUCash 5.4, because Windows.

My experience has been similar, but sometimes the register does display 
properly. Often when it does not display properly, if I arrow up, the situation 
is corrected.

I have not documented the behavior to the point where I could write a bug 
report, but I strongly suspect there is a bug.


> On 02/07/2024 9:19 AM PST dunop...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
>  
> Hello - I like to use the Double Line View so that I can put comments in
> each transaction. I have to click the Double Line View every time. Is there
> a setting or way to configure gnucash to always enable that setting?
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Daniel Tran
> 
>  
> 
> ___
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Re: [GNC] New user error (was: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 251, Issue 12)

[Patrick James]

This message is only about "recording and showing any transactions."

The recording of transactions is separate from the showing of transactions. 

The transactions could be recorded, but not shown. What I suggest is looking at 
all the options under the "View" pull-down menu, especially the "filter by" 
option.



> On 02/07/2024 6:43 AM PST accounting Billing 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> I did read the manual and understand the double entry. But how come the
> software is not recording and showing any transactions?
> 
> If anyone can get a zoom call and help us to set this up. We will donate
> and compensate for their time.
> My name is Beck, Cell 347-206-1096.
> 
> On Wed, Feb 7, 2024 at 9:38 AM sunfis...@yahoo.com 
> wrote:
> 
> > Also, you need to read the manual to understand double entry accounting
> > and its implementation in GnuCash. (Stephen's previous reply to your
> > question about Equity applies here as well.)
> >
> > And GnuCash list etiquette.
> >
> > David T.
> > On Feb 7, 2024, at 5:27 PM, accounting Billing <
> > account...@rapidroutelogistics.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Also, When i try to record the expenses transactions, It is not showing on
> >> the dashboard.
> >>
> >> On Wed, Feb 7, 2024 at 9:16 AM  wrote:
> >>
> >>  Send gnucash-user mailing list submissions to
> >>>  gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> >>>
> >>>  To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >>>  https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> >>>  or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >>>  gnucash-user-requ...@gnucash.org
> >>>
> >>>  You can reach the person managing the list at
> >>>  gnucash-user-ow...@gnucash.org
> >>>
> >>>  When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >>>  than "Re: Contents of gnucash-user digest..."
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  Today's Topics:
> >>>
> >>> 1. Re:  GNUCash 5.5 (Stan Brown (using GC 4.14))
> >>> 2. Re:  Change Printed Invoice (Lester Bennett)
> >>> 3. Re:  Change Printed Invoice (Michael or Penny Novack)
> >>> 4.  GNUCash 5.5 (accounting Billing)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  Message: 1
> >>>  Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2024 17:30:43 -0800
> >>>  From: "Stan Brown (using GC 4.14)" 
> >>>  To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> >>>  Subject: Re: [GNC] GNUCash 5.5
> >>>  Message-ID: <065b2fe8-8524-48c6-98c5-644030e7a...@fastmail.fm>
> >>>  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  On 2024-02-06 16:51, accounting Billing wrote:
> >>>
>   From: accounting Billing 
>   Date: Tue, Feb 6, 2024, 3:00?PM
>   Subject: GNUCash 5.5
>   To: , , <
>   christopher@gmail.com>
> 
>   We are willing to use GnuCash for our business accounting, But we are
>   facing some issues.
> 
>   When I try to add any transactions. It is not showing on the Accounts
>   Total numbers.
> 
>   When I try to put a transaction on the list, It is not showing on the
> 
> >>>  main
> >>>
>   page.
> 
> >>>
> >>>  You debited and credited Equity:Opening Balances for the same amount, so
> >>>  the net is zero, just as your attachment shows.  I don't understand the
> >>>  context of the I/O error; possibly the @ signs in your disk names are a
> >>>  problem.
> >>>
> >>>  Before you go further, may I strongly, strongly suggest that you read
> >>>  the Tutorial and Concepts Guide and actually work through the examples
> >>>  that are relevant to your particular situation.
> >>>  
> >>>
> >>>  At bottom, GnuCash is just a computer replacement for keeping books of
> >>>  account in pen and ink. However, it has its own special ways of doing
> >>>  things, and if you don't use the techniques as shown in the examples,
> >>>  results will not be as you expect and you'll get immensely frustrated.
> >>>
> >>>  Stan Brown
> >>>  Tehachapi, CA, USA
> >>>  https://BrownMath.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  Message: 2
> >>>  Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2024 12:47:05 +1000
> >>>  From: Lester Bennett 
> >>>  To: John Ralls 
> >>>  Cc: Gnucash Users 
> >>>  Subject: Re: [GNC] Change Printed Invoice
> >>>  Message-ID: 
> >>>  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >>>
> >>>  Thanks John. I don't know why I didn't see the Custom Title options. I
> >>>  must have been through the configuration about 5 times. I guess I was
> >>>  blinkered and just looking for the word "Invoice".
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  On 7/02/2024 10:27 am, John Ralls wrote:
> >>>
> 
> 
>   On Feb 6, 2024, at 4:01 PM, John Ralls  wrote:
> >
> >  Please remember to copy the list on all replies.
> >
> >  The tab is actually called "Printable Invoice". I've attached a
> >  screenshot.
> 
> 
> 
>   The screenshot apparently got eaten. Another try:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  --
> >>>  This email has been checked for 

Re: [GNC] End of year

[Patrick James]

> On 01/30/2024 9:39 AM PST Michael or Penny Novack 
>  wrote:
> 
> ONE refers to closing all the accounts of type income and expense 
> (temporary accounts of fundamental type equity) into equity itself or 
> accounts under equity. You will have to be doing the latter if the 
> entity type isn't "sole" (personal books or a sole proprietorship) 
> because need to allocate to the individual partners or shareholders. 
> Just closing the accounts of type income and expense WILL start the new 
> year off with these at zero.

There are those who love the "Income Summary" account, and then there are those 
who would rather forget about it.
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Re: [GNC] How do you record the rounding of your netpay?

[Patrick James]

In my view it's going to be very difficult to justify spending any time 
tracking a whole bunch of zeroes with a contra equity account. I would not even 
want to see that on the books, much less spend time every pay period adjusting 
the contra account balance to some new amount less than 1.

At the end, the final paycheck, I'm betting the final paycheck is also rounded 
up, so that over the entire life of employment, the maximum "extra" paid is 
under 1, with an expected value of around 0.50.

This is all just a bunch of zeros, and the cost to track it is less than the 
value of the information.


> On 01/27/2024 3:14 PM PST David Cousens  wrote:
> 
>  
> If you really want to track this you could setup a contra account to your 
> Income acct which sums into the Income account e.g.
> 
> first month:
> 
> Income   Credit 1800.50
> Asset:Taxes withheld Debit   300.00
> Income::Pay rounding Credit0.50
> Asset:Bank   Debit  1501.00
> 
> second month:
> 
> Income   Credit 1800.30
> Asset:Taxes withheld Debit   300.00
> Income:Pay Rounding  Debit00.30
> Asset:Bank   Debit  1500.00
> 
> The balance in the Pay rounding account should hover around 0.00. and your 
> bank account will record the correct balance
> in the account at the bank.
> 
> 
> I cannot for the life of me understand why any payroll system would be 
> rounding to the nearest pound if they are using
> direct credit of your pay. To the nearest penny yes but not the nearest 
> pound. Seems like a hangover from when they paid
> in cash and didn't want to be bothered with coins.
> 
> David Cousens
> 
> On Sat, 2024-01-27 at 08:17 +, Oleander via gnucash-user wrote:
> > Hello everyone,
> > 
> > how do you record the rounding of your netpay?
> > 
> > After subtracting taxes from my gross pay, if the result of my net pay is a 
> > floating point number, my company rounds
> > this number up to the next integer then credits the amount to my bank 
> > account. But the rounding is just a loan, the
> > next month it will be charged from my gross pay along with taxes and if the 
> > result of my net pay again is a floating
> > point number, it will be rounded up to the next integer and then credited 
> > to my bank account and so on.
> > 
> > Eg:
> > 
> > 1st Month
> > 
> > Gross Pay = €1800.50
> > 
> > Taxes = €300
> > 
> > Netpay = 1500.50 --> 1501€ (amount credited to my bank account)
> > 
> > 2nd Month
> > 
> > Gross Pay = €1800.30
> > 
> > Taxes = €300
> > 
> > 1st Month Rounding = €0.50
> > 
> > Netpay = 1499.80 --> 1500€ (amount credited to my bank account)
> > 
> > Thank you
> > ___
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Re: [GNC] How do you record the rounding of your netpay?

[Patrick James]

This rounding is not material to your financial condition.

Tracking the rounding is not worth the time and effort necessary, so you could 
adjust your gross pay for the rounding.

First month would be an increase (in pay/earnings) of €0.50, and the second 
month would be a decrease by €0.30. Over time your recorded Salary on your 
books will never drift more than €1, as there is always an adjustment to trend 
toward a €0 difference.

1st Month

€1501 DR Cash
€300 DR Taxes
€1801 CR Salary

2nd Month

€1500 DR Cash
€300 DR Taxes
€1800 CR Salary



> On 01/27/2024 12:17 AM PST Oleander via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hello everyone,
> 
> how do you record the rounding of your netpay?
> 
> After subtracting taxes from my gross pay, if the result of my net pay is a 
> floating point number, my company rounds this number up to the next integer 
> then credits the amount to my bank account. But the rounding is just a loan, 
> the next month it will be charged from my gross pay along with taxes and if 
> the result of my net pay again is a floating point number, it will be rounded 
> up to the next integer and then credited to my bank account and so on.
> 
> Eg:
> 
> 1st Month
> 
> Gross Pay = €1800.50
> 
> Taxes = €300
> 
> Netpay = 1500.50 --> 1501€ (amount credited to my bank account)
> 
> 2nd Month
> 
> Gross Pay = €1800.30
> 
> Taxes = €300
> 
> 1st Month Rounding = €0.50
> 
> Netpay = 1499.80 --> 1500€ (amount credited to my bank account)
> 
> Thank you
> ___
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Re: [GNC] Maddening!!!!!!!!

[Patrick James]

This is bug 799093, and John Ralls has not asked additional questions after I 
was able to reliably reproduce (part of) the issue, so, hopefully, there is 
sufficient information to find the bug.

https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=799093


> On 01/25/2024 10:02 AM PST Jack Slater  wrote:
> 
>  
> I'm back! Reconciling a credit card account today. Another "rogue"
> transaction created in the reconcile register (image attached).
> However it's NOT in the account ledger (image attached)!! When I try to
> edit the reconcile transaction I get an error message reading "Target split
> is currently hidden in this register" (also attached). I know I read a bug
> report on this action and I thought I could add more evidence in hopes of
> getting the issue resolved.
> 
> [image: there.jpg]
> [image: not there.jpg]
> 
> [image: error.jpg]
> 
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 5:48 PM Jim DeLaHunt  wrote:
> 
> > Jack:
> >
> > On 2024-01-11 09:11, Jack Slater wrote:
> > > 90 minutes of reconciling down the drain with a crash near the end of the
> > > final account
> > My commiserations. Yes, it is maddening to lose 90 minutes of work when
> > the tech decides to fail you.
> > > ... Oddly, even though GnuC auto saves periodically, it seems
> > > none of any add/delete/balance transactions were saved in any account!
> > Why
> > > would that be
> >
> > I can think of several interesting directions you could take this thread:
> >
> > Why didn't GnuCash seem to preserve any of the changes in my 90 minutes
> > of work?
> >
> > How can I change my workflow so that I lose less work when the tech
> > decides to fail me?
> >
> > How can I improve the way I write message to this list, so that I get
> > more helpful answers?
> >
> > How can I stop these tech failures from happening?
> >
> > On that last point, I can offer two concrete suggestions:
> >
> > 1. GnuCash has a "Check and Repair" feature which is useful to try when
> > you are concerned about "rogue" transactions and such. Try going to the
> > Accounts tab of the main window, and select menu item Actions -- Check
> > and Repair -- Repair All. This menu is described a little in the GnuCash
> > manual, section 4.2.1.4. "Account Tree - Actions Menu", at
> > <
> > https://www.gnucash.org/docs/v5/C/gnucash-manual/gui-acct-tree.html#AccTree-actions-menu
> > >.
> >
> > 2. The text in your "Entry Point Not Found" dialogue, which GnuCash
> > displays when it crashes, has been discussed on this list recently.  It
> > is described in a bug report at
> > . It is suspected to be
> > problem from GnuCash 5.4 leaving pieces behind when GnuCash 5.5
> > installs. There is a workaround there:
> >
> > a. Use the File Explorer to open "C:\Program Files (x86)\gnucash\bin\"
> >
> > b. If there is a file named "libxmlsec1.dll" present, but no file named
> > "libxmlsec.dll", then rename file "libxmlsec1.dll" to the name
> > "libxmlsec.dll" (without the trailing "1").
> >
> > I do not use GnuCash on Windows, so I have no experience with this
> > problem. I only know what I read. If you ask this list directly about
> > how to work around this bug, Windows users may be able to give you
> > better help.
> >
> > I hope this helps,
> >   —Jim DeLaHunt
> >
> >
> >
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Re: [GNC] how to record tax credit for capital loss

[Patrick James]

> If I run out of past credits then that's a final gain, that's taxable
> the moment it's realized (and some brokers straightly withold it from
> the selling price!), it's not possible to offset with a future loss
> within the same year.

It should be total obvious that to minimize taxes if you were selling two 
different positions for a net of no gain or loss, then you'd better sell the 
loss on day 1 and the gain on day 2.

I would not want to risk my broker trading the gain a few seconds before the 
loss.
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Re: [GNC] how to record tax credit for capital loss

[Patrick James]

You mention picking the earliest year to minimize the tax liability (i.e. 
maximize the loss matching), but within a window of time.

> On 01/24/2024 7:53 AM PST Mattia Rizzolo  wrote:
> 
>  Besides, one offests losses by fist pickin the
> furtherst year first, so it's good to know how much is left to offset
> from each given year for each broker (it's common practice in Q4 to look
> at what's left over from 3-4 years before and evaluate what to do to not
> lose the credit).

The normal balance is CR in the equity account, but for tax purposes you're 
looking for a zero/DR balance. According to what you're suggesting, you can 
match current CRs (gains) to past DRs (losses), but you can only offset the DR 
balance within a given window of time (and there are some tax reporting periods 
in this discussion).

So if you have a DR balance in your Brokerage 1 2020 account, then you'd credit 
that account if you sold for a gain today, until the account balance is zero, 
and then you'd credit 2021 for the leftover CR amount, up to the 2021 DR 
balance, and so on and so forth.

Eventually you'll run out of gain, or you'll have to credit the remaining CR 
balance to the current year account (Brokerage 1 2024), which you might be able 
to offset with a future DR, if you sold something for a loss, and that future 
transaction meets the right windows of time.
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Re: [GNC] how to record tax credit for capital loss

[Patrick James]

Again keeping in mind that I am NOT a tax authority.

Now that we're on the equity side, let's move forward with your tracking.

I very much doubt that you need two separate accounts for the losses and gains; 
from what you're suggesting, you need to match some gains with some losses. I 
would match these in a single account " Capital Gains" where it is known 
that CR is "gain" (the expected/desired 'normal' balance) and DR is "loss." 
Just labeling an account "Capital" is difficult when looking back/keeping track 
of what is what. And one need not label it "Capital Gain or Loss," as the "or 
loss" part is understood based on the balance in the account.

Given what you are requesting, I'd have something like this:

Capital Gain
2017 Broker 1
2017 Broker 2
2018 Broker 1
2018 Broker 2

You would know what is best in terms of subaccounts.

Then run reports if you need some specific information, which could include 
separating the losses from the gains based on the debits and credits.

Keep in mind that I'm providing some ideas about how to use GNUCash as a tool, 
and I have no idea about your tax requirements.


> On 01/24/2024 3:11 AM PST Mattia Rizzolo  wrote:
> 
>  
> Thank you Patrick for your suggestion!
> 
> I see what you are suggesting here… Mh.
> 
> It could easily become very messy as the rules for offsetting gains is
> fairly annoying here: gains some financial instruments can offset losses
> only from some other particular financial instruments (i.e., "gains"
> from the dividends can *never* be offeset, or losses from stocks can't
> be offset by gain on ETFs, etc)…  Plus the fact that I'd need to split
> losses by years and brokers… it's going to be annoying to have an
> account clearly state the "correct" credit I'm due this way.
> 
> 
> But I think you may have pointed me to the right direction, of keeping
> everything within the equities, here is what I've done:
> (yes, I realize that income/expenses are "the same thing")
> 
> Expenses
>  |- Capital Loss
> |- Broker 1
> |- 2017
> |- 2020
> |- 2021
> |- 2023
> Income
>  |- Capital Gain
> 
> So, I changed my losses to be posted against the proper "capital loss"
> account instead of being a negative gain, and then I'm posting the
> future gains as compensation of that loss (and only for the part that
> can be compensated).
> This way indeed the balance of the Broker1 account does match with what
> the broker is showing me.
> 
> 
> Do anybody believe I may be missing something out when recording capital
> gains/losses this way?
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 23, 2024 at 03:43:03PM -0800, Patrick James wrote:
> > Let's start with your best bet is to work with your tax professional as to 
> > how best to keep track of what's needed for taxes.
> > 
> > In the US, what you call a "credit" generally would not be an asset 
> > account. The "credit" would be a potential offset to some future gain, if 
> > there is any future gain, so I would leave all this over on the equity side.
> > 
> > Day 0 Purchase:
> > 
> > Stock (asset) $100DR
> > Cash $100CR
> > Purchase of 100 shares of Stock Y for $1 per share
> > 
> > Day 365 Sale:
> > 
> > Cash $90DR
> > Capital Gain $10DR
> > Stock (asset) $100CR
> > Sale of 100 shares of Day 0 Stock Y for $0.90 per share.
> > 
> > NOTE: One hopes that capital gains has a CR (gain) balance, rather than the 
> > DR balance above (loss).
> > 
> > Later, if there was some sale for a gain, then the CR recorded to Capital 
> > Gain would offset some or all of the DR.
> > 
> > Also note that matching the shares as I have done above is not always as 
> > simple as this single stock sale where all shares are purchased on a single 
> > day and the entire holding is sold a year later.
> > 
> > Again, talk to your tax professional about how to best keep the records 
> > necessary for tax compliance.
> > 
> > 
> > > On 01/23/2024 1:43 PM PST Mattia Rizzolo  wrote:
> > > 
> > >  
> > > Hello,
> > > 
> > > I'd like some input on how to best record a tax credit due to capital
> > > loss, and possibly the following usage of such credit.
> > > Disclaimer: I'm not doing this for anything worth, it's a personal book
> > > that nobody but me sees, so I can take a few liberties and not follow
> > > whatever regulation to the letter.  Besides, I have no formal education
> &g

Re: [GNC] how to record tax credit for capital loss

[Patrick James]

Let's start with your best bet is to work with your tax professional as to how 
best to keep track of what's needed for taxes.

In the US, what you call a "credit" generally would not be an asset account. 
The "credit" would be a potential offset to some future gain, if there is any 
future gain, so I would leave all this over on the equity side.

Day 0 Purchase:

Stock (asset) $100DR
Cash $100CR
Purchase of 100 shares of Stock Y for $1 per share

Day 365 Sale:

Cash $90DR
Capital Gain $10DR
Stock (asset) $100CR
Sale of 100 shares of Day 0 Stock Y for $0.90 per share.

NOTE: One hopes that capital gains has a CR (gain) balance, rather than the DR 
balance above (loss).

Later, if there was some sale for a gain, then the CR recorded to Capital Gain 
would offset some or all of the DR.

Also note that matching the shares as I have done above is not always as simple 
as this single stock sale where all shares are purchased on a single day and 
the entire holding is sold a year later.

Again, talk to your tax professional about how to best keep the records 
necessary for tax compliance.


> On 01/23/2024 1:43 PM PST Mattia Rizzolo  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hello,
> 
> I'd like some input on how to best record a tax credit due to capital
> loss, and possibly the following usage of such credit.
> Disclaimer: I'm not doing this for anything worth, it's a personal book
> that nobody but me sees, so I can take a few liberties and not follow
> whatever regulation to the letter.  Besides, I have no formal education
> on accounting.
> 
> 
> The case is the following:
> 
> 1 buy security A, cost $100
> 2 buy security B, cost $100
> 3 sell security A, get $90
> 3a → record $10 loss
> 3b → get a $10 tax credit on following capital gains
> 4 sell security B, get $120
> 4a → record $20 gain
> 4b → offset $10 from 3b
> 4c → pay tax on the remaining $10 (26%, $2.6 over here)
> 
> I reckon all jurisdictions have something similar in concept, all with
> their differences in details.
> 
> This is a tad further complicated by the fact that each broker has its
> own "bucket" of credits (can't comingle losses and gains across
> different brokers).  Also the credits expire after 4 years, so I should
> record under which year they matured.  As such, I expect an addition to
> my CoA, such as:
> Assets
>   |- Credits
> |- Capital Loss credits
> |- broker 1
>  |- 2020
>  |- 2021
>  |- 2022
>  |- 2023
>  |- 2024
> |- broker 2
>  |- 2022
>  .
> 
> 
> 
> I've been using gnucash for ~3 years now, but I always procrastinated on
> figuring out the 3b/4b steps, just posting the resulting net tax
> transaction as computed by the broker.
> For me it's really not obvious what's the opposing account from where
> the money should come/go...
> How do people do it here? :)
> 
> 
> Thank you for all the hints!
> 
> -- 
> regards,
> Mattia Rizzolo
> 
> GPG Key: 66AE 2B4A FCCF 3F52 DA18  4D18 4B04 3FCD B944 4540  .''`.
> More about me:  https://mapreri.org : :'  :
> Launchpad user: https://launchpad.net/~mapreri  `. `'`
> Debian QA page: https://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=mattia  `-
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Re: [GNC] Compare two sets of accounts?

[Patrick James]

The --nofile parameter is fine as you are commanding GnuCash "Do not load the 
last file opened."

There is another option, which is to command GnuCash to open a specific file.

The command line structure is: gnucash [options] [datafile]

So if you add the datafile, GnuCash will open with that set of books ready to 
go.

See "Command line options" here:

https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Logging

Your best option depends on your workflow. I'm running GnuCash on Windows, and 
for my two most commonly used datafiles, I placed separate icons on my desktop 
so I may easily and quickly open one or both of the data files.


> On 01/21/2024 8:05 AM PST Myron A Schroeder  wrote:
> 
>  
> Where do I find the " --nofile runtime parameter."
> 
> Looks like an interesting way to have more than one set of books on my
> computer.
> 
> Thanks for your help.
> 
> Myron Schroeder
> 
> On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 11:42 AM Gyle McCollam  wrote:
> 
> > The quick and dirty solution is to save a copy of what you send to the
> > accounts, under a different name (say: B4A) and when you get back the file
> > from the accountants review the accounts tab of the B4A with the returned
> > file.  That will tell you which accounts have a change in value.  You can
> > then open those accounts and see what changes/corrections they made.  ou
> > can then make those same changes in your current file.  Just make sure that
> > after you save a copy (B4A) that you aren't using that file going forward
> > as GC usually opens the last saved file.
> >
> >
> > Thank You,
> >
> > Gyle McCollam
> >
> > Gyle McCollam
> >
> > gmccol...@live.com   email
> >
> > 
> > From: gnucash-user  on
> > behalf of Simon Roberts 
> > Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 8:50 AM
> > To: Gnucash Users 
> > Subject: [GNC] Compare two sets of accounts?
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Does GNC provide any mechanism for comparing two versions of the same set
> > of accounts?
> >
> > I'll be sending my books to my accountant soon, and I imagine they will
> > have some corrections/adjustments. I'll be giving them a laptop with GNC
> > installed, so they can most easily browse, and it occurs to me that they
> > could also make their changes in place. But, unless they write down
> > separately every entry they create or change, I would need to somehow
> > re-integrate their work with my "master" file. Either that, or I'd have to
> > freeze my bookkeeping while they're working on things, and that's likely to
> > take too long to be acceptable.
> >
> > With the hostage-taker's rent-ware that I used to use, there was a specific
> > mechanism for an "accountant's copy" and a means to merge the changes back
> > automatically. But I've failed to find this in the docs for GNC (quite
> > possibly as a result of poor / uninspired searching!)
> >
> > Is this supported directly? Is this something folks have found an approach
> > for? I suppose, as a not quite worst case, I could simply diff the XML file
> > itself, but that's going to produce results that will be somewhat messy, at
> > best. But at least I'd know something about what changed.
> >
> > What ideas can you offer (or manual pages, if I've failed that
> > embarrassingly!)
> >
> > TIA,
> > Simon
> >
> >
> > --
> > Simon Roberts
> > 303 249 3613
> > https://www.youtube.com/@DancingCloudServices
> > https://www.linkedin.com/in/simonhgroberts/
> > ___
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Re: [GNC] Compare two sets of accounts?

[Patrick James]

I was extending to 2023 changes. For example, if Simon made some insignificant 
change to 2023, let's say a memo (debits = credits = none = memo only) that he 
believed was important, but this does not change the financial condition of 
2023 (or something else that is so insignificant that he can review after 
receiving his books back), then he'd have to track that.
 
I have not carefully studied the database structure, so maybe it's possible to 
capture for export my example of a 2023 memo that was entered in 2024?
 

> On 01/19/2024 1:02 PM PST Gyle McCollam  wrote:
>  
>  
> Assuming that the info sent to the accountants ended at 12/31/2023, Simon 
> could export all 2024 transactions in CSV format as you suggested.  He could 
> then import into the returned files from the accountants and he wouldn't have 
> to track any changes he made.
>  
> The log files are another option, but it would depend on how long they were 
> saved and how long the accountants took.
>  
> 
> Thank You,  
> 
> Gyle McCollam
> 
> Gyle McCollam
> 
> gmccol...@live.com mailto:gmccol...@gyleshomes.com   email
> 
>  
> 
> -----
> From: gnucash-user  on 
> behalf of Patrick James 
> Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 12:24 PM
> To: Gnucash Users 
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Compare two sets of accounts?
>  
> One option might be to use the data log files, information in 2.5.2 here:
> 
> https://code.gnucash.org/docs/C/gnucash-guide/basics-backup1.html
> 
> I have not played around with those much, but I suspect you could backup your 
> master set of books (3-2-1 backup strategy might be used here), and then make 
> a copy of your master set to test the replay of the data log files (.log), as 
> described in the link above.
> 
> Another, separate, option might be for you to keep track of the changes you 
> made, and then export the changes in CSV formation, then import them to the 
> file that's returned from your accountant.
> 
> Check out the CSV import/export information here:
> 
> Export:
> https://gnucash.org/docs/v5/C/gnucash-manual/trans-export.html
> 
> Import:
> https://gnucash.org/docs/v5/C/gnucash-manual/trans-import.html
> 
> 
> 
> > On 01/19/2024 5:50 AM PST Simon Roberts  
> > wrote:
> >
> > 
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Does GNC provide any mechanism for comparing two versions of the same set
> > of accounts?
> >
> > I'll be sending my books to my accountant soon, and I imagine they will
> > have some corrections/adjustments. I'll be giving them a laptop with GNC
> > installed, so they can most easily browse, and it occurs to me that they
> > could also make their changes in place. But, unless they write down
> > separately every entry they create or change, I would need to somehow
> > re-integrate their work with my "master" file. Either that, or I'd have to
> > freeze my bookkeeping while they're working on things, and that's likely to
> > take too long to be acceptable.
> >
> > With the hostage-taker's rent-ware that I used to use, there was a specific
> > mechanism for an "accountant's copy" and a means to merge the changes back
> > automatically. But I've failed to find this in the docs for GNC (quite
> > possibly as a result of poor / uninspired searching!)
> >
> > Is this supported directly? Is this something folks have found an approach
> > for? I suppose, as a not quite worst case, I could simply diff the XML file
> > itself, but that's going to produce results that will be somewhat messy, at
> > best. But at least I'd know something about what changed.
> >
> > What ideas can you offer (or manual pages, if I've failed that
> > embarrassingly!)
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Re: [GNC] Compare two sets of accounts?

[Patrick James]

One option might be to use the data log files, information in 2.5.2 here:

https://code.gnucash.org/docs/C/gnucash-guide/basics-backup1.html

I have not played around with those much, but I suspect you could backup your 
master set of books (3-2-1 backup strategy might be used here), and then make a 
copy of your master set to test the replay of the data log files (.log), as 
described in the link above.

Another, separate, option might be for you to keep track of the changes you 
made, and then export the changes in CSV formation, then import them to the 
file that's returned from your accountant. 

Check out the CSV import/export information here:

Export:
https://gnucash.org/docs/v5/C/gnucash-manual/trans-export.html

Import:
https://gnucash.org/docs/v5/C/gnucash-manual/trans-import.html



> On 01/19/2024 5:50 AM PST Simon Roberts  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi all,
> 
> Does GNC provide any mechanism for comparing two versions of the same set
> of accounts?
> 
> I'll be sending my books to my accountant soon, and I imagine they will
> have some corrections/adjustments. I'll be giving them a laptop with GNC
> installed, so they can most easily browse, and it occurs to me that they
> could also make their changes in place. But, unless they write down
> separately every entry they create or change, I would need to somehow
> re-integrate their work with my "master" file. Either that, or I'd have to
> freeze my bookkeeping while they're working on things, and that's likely to
> take too long to be acceptable.
> 
> With the hostage-taker's rent-ware that I used to use, there was a specific
> mechanism for an "accountant's copy" and a means to merge the changes back
> automatically. But I've failed to find this in the docs for GNC (quite
> possibly as a result of poor / uninspired searching!)
> 
> Is this supported directly? Is this something folks have found an approach
> for? I suppose, as a not quite worst case, I could simply diff the XML file
> itself, but that's going to produce results that will be somewhat messy, at
> best. But at least I'd know something about what changed.
> 
> What ideas can you offer (or manual pages, if I've failed that
> embarrassingly!)
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Re: [GNC] Error Windows 11 when running reports

[Patrick James]

There is a known bug with reports in GnuCash version 5.5 on a Windows machine. 

The bug is well-understood, but the fix is not so easy.

Moving down to 5.4 will fix the report problem.

> On 01/17/2024 3:29 PM PST Ignacio Ayuste  wrote:
> 
>  
> Hi All, for a lot reports i noticed the file generated in temp folder but
> the app crash, I run the app using winDbg and the error is:
> 
> (4130.c2c): Access violation - code c005 (!!! second chance !!!)
> eax= ebx=62f200a0 ecx= edx= esi=1049fff0
> edi=0004
> eip=62d400d3 esp=00bfe840 ebp=00bfe888 iopl=0 nv up ei pl nz na po
> nc
> cs=0023  ss=002b  ds=002b  es=002b  fs=0053  gs=002b
> efl=00210202
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC8JSObject27getOwnNonIndexPropertyNamesEPS0_PNS_9ExecStateERNS_17PropertyNameArrayENS_15EnumerationModeE+0x473:
> 62d400d3 8b49fc  mov ecx,dword ptr [ecx-4]
> ds:002b:fffc=
> 
> 0:000> !analyze -v
> ***
> *
>   *
> *Exception Analysis
>   *
> *
>   *
> ***
> 
> 
> KEY_VALUES_STRING: 1
> 
> Key  : AV.Fault
> Value: Read
> 
> Key  : Analysis.CPU.mSec
> Value: 2483
> 
> Key  : Analysis.Elapsed.mSec
> Value: 35877
> 
> Key  : Analysis.IO.Other.Mb
> Value: 80
> 
> Key  : Analysis.IO.Read.Mb
> Value: 1
> 
> Key  : Analysis.IO.Write.Mb
> Value: 117
> 
> Key  : Analysis.Init.CPU.mSec
> Value: 1046
> 
> Key  : Analysis.Init.Elapsed.mSec
> Value: 761028
> 
> Key  : Analysis.Memory.CommitPeak.Mb
> Value: 97
> 
> Key  : Failure.Bucket
> Value:
> INVALID_CLASS_PTR_READ_c005_libjavascriptcoregtk-3.0-0.dll!Unknown
> 
> Key  : Failure.Hash
> Value: {7c9c3c53-a28e-a583-683b-6075744558e7}
> 
> Key  : Timeline.OS.Boot.DeltaSec
> Value: 39191
> 
> Key  : Timeline.Process.Start.DeltaSec
> Value: 761
> 
> Key  : WER.OS.Branch
> Value: ni_release
> 
> Key  : WER.OS.Version
> Value: 10.0.22621.1
> 
> Key  : WER.Process.Version
> Value: 5.5.0.0
> 
> 
> NTGLOBALFLAG:  70
> 
> PROCESS_BAM_CURRENT_THROTTLED: 0
> 
> PROCESS_BAM_PREVIOUS_THROTTLED: 0
> 
> APPLICATION_VERIFIER_FLAGS:  0
> 
> EXCEPTION_RECORD:  (.exr -1)
> ExceptionAddress: 62d400d3
> (libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC8JSObject27getOwnNonIndexPropertyNamesEPS0_PNS_9ExecStateERNS_17PropertyNameArrayENS_15EnumerationModeE+0x0473)
>ExceptionCode: c005 (Access violation)
>   ExceptionFlags: 
> NumberParameters: 2
>Parameter[0]: 
>Parameter[1]: fffc
> Attempt to read from address fffc
> 
> FAULTING_THREAD:  0c2c
> 
> PROCESS_NAME:  gnucash.exe
> 
> READ_ADDRESS:  fffc
> 
> ERROR_CODE: (NTSTATUS) 0xc005 - The instruction at 0x%p referenced
> memory at 0x%p. The memory could not be %s.
> 
> EXCEPTION_CODE_STR:  c005
> 
> EXCEPTION_PARAMETER1:  
> 
> EXCEPTION_PARAMETER2:  fffc
> 
> STACK_TEXT:
> WARNING: Stack unwind information not available. Following frames may be
> wrong.
> 00bfe888 62d4794a 0c43bcd0 10e1fff0 
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC8JSObject27getOwnNonIndexPropertyNamesEPS0_PNS_9ExecStateERNS_17PropertyNameArrayENS_15EnumerationModeE+0x473
> 00bfe8b8 62d170db 0c43bcd0  0004
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC8JSObject20growOutOfLineStorageERNS_2VMEjj+0x3a
> 00bfe958 62d13f7c 0c43bcd0 00bfea88 
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC16InternalFunction14finishCreationERNS_2VMERKN3WTF6StringE+0xa0b
> 00bfe988 62d31db1 0c43bcd0 00bfea88 
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC17FunctionPrototype14finishCreationERNS_2VMERKN3WTF6StringE+0x1c
> 00bfeae8 62d398c0 0c43bcd0 1045f530 0c43bcd0
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC14JSGlobalObject5resetENS_7JSValueE+0x111
> 00bfeb18 6332e524 10dbffe0 0040 0c43bcd0
> libjavascriptcoregtk_3_0_0!ZN3JSC14JSGlobalObject4initEPNS_8JSObjectE+0xa0
> 00bfeb48 6332fe9c 0c43bcd0 10dbffe0 00bfeb98
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x3cb64
> 00bfeb98 63334d32 0c43bcd0 10dbffe0 00bfebe8
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x3e4dc
> 00bfec08 63334f9f 00bfec2c 002f 00bfec38
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x43372
> 00bfec38 63355d38 0c43bcd0 00bfec90 0c44bf88
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x435df
> 00bfecb8 633564e3 0c44bf88 f4830899 00bfed18
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x64378
> 00bfed08 63356912 0c44bf88 0c457f24 0c457f24
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x64b23
> 00bfedb8 63356a96 0c3c1e28 00bfee94 0c44bf88
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x64f52
> 00bfedd8 63484033 0c3c1e28 00bfee94 0c458750
> libwebkitgtk_3_0_0!webkit_authentication_widget_get_type+0x650d

Re: [GNC] Liability Balances - All payments disappeared

[Patrick James]

I suspect it is fair to say that the UI design results in different uses of the 
same English terms from accounting, thus a "split" in terminology.


> On 01/18/2024 12:03 PM PST Adrien Monteleone  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> Yes, this is an example where it isn't just the terminology of users, 
> but rather that the UI uses the term 'split' for two different meanings.
> 
> I too have memo transactions with only one split and no value.
> 
> Regards,
> Adrien
>
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Re: [GNC] Liability Balances - All payments disappeared

[Patrick James]

A "simple journal entry" is a journal entry that involves no more than two 
accounts.

A "compound journal entry" is a journal entry that involves more than two 
accounts.

That's the 'easy' part.

Now there are entries that involve multiple debits or multiple credits, or 
both, that only impact two accounts. This I personally call this a "split," as 
at least one debit or credit is being "split" into more than is necessary for 
the basics. Often the memos are important here.

When the "transaction journal" in GnuCash is selected, GnuCash shows all the 
impacted accounts, and if "Double Line" is also selected, then it shows the 
memo field too.

I'm not sure what the best use of "split" is, as this question reminds me of 
various seemingly simple questions, such as "Where does milk come from?"


> On 01/18/2024 8:56 AM PST Adrien Monteleone  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> Fair enough. We need a new term for one of these things. It is a 
> repeated source of confusion & consternation.
> 
> Regards,
> Adrien
> 
> On 1/18/24 9:54 AM, Michael or Penny Novack wrote:
> > Except I would never refer to a transaction that affect JUST TWO 
> > accounts to have any "splits". When I use the term "splits" I mean that 
> > either there is more than one debit account, more than one credit 
> > account, or both. ALL transactions involve at least two accounts, at 
> > least one debit and at least one credit. That is fundamental to double 
> > entry bookkeeping.
> 
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Re: [GNC] Template Transactions Behavior in Scheduled Transaction Editor

[Patrick James]

>From the pulldown menus:

Actions -> Scheduled Transactions -> Since Last Run...

> On 01/12/2024 7:13 PM PST Liz  wrote:
>
> So would you like a button which gives an option to make a test run?
> 
> Liz
>  
> On Fri, 12 Jan 2024 12:08:14 -0600
> David Carlson  wrote:
> 
> > I consider the SX to be a graphical form of a script, and so I am not
> > sure how the editor could detect what is safe to call an expression
> > that could be evaluated while it is being edited.
> >
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Re: [GNC] Maddening!!!!!!!!

[Patrick James]

I own a few, but I generally don't use timers.
 
What should I expect at 90 minutes, and at what point do I start the timer?
 

> On 01/12/2024 12:29 PM PST David Carlson  wrote:
>  
>  
> ...except when something happens after 90 minutes of that sort of activity 
> that creates a huge mess.
> 
> On Fri, Jan 12, 2024 at 2:11 PM Jack Slater  mailto:theillini...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > I'd certainly agree.
> > 
> > On Fri, Jan 12, 2024 at 11:57 AM Patrick James  > mailto:patrickjame...@comcast.net>
> > wrote:
> > 
> > > My personal experience is that this "phantom transaction" problem began in
> > > 5.X.
> > >
> > > Using 4.X, I experienced no problems changing/adding/deleting transactions
> > > during a reconciliation.
> > >
> > >
> > > > On 01/12/2024 9:44 AM PST David Carlson  > > > mailto:david.carlson@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > It sounds like you are entering new transactions while part way through
> > > > performing a reconciliation process.
> > > >
> > > > I suspect that could confuse the reconciliation.
> > > >
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> 
> 
> --
> David Carlson
> 
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Re: [GNC] Maddening!!!!!!!!

[Patrick James]

Jack,

This "log file" discussion seemed to get moved to a stack type of log. There is 
another log with GNUCash, which is somewhat unique in that programmers usually 
need the stack log (all programming).

The GNUCash data log file is explained in 2.5.2.

https://lists.gnucash.org/docs/C/gnucash-guide/basics-backup1.html

> On 01/11/2024 9:41 AM PST Jack Slater  wrote:
> 
>  
> Sorry Dale but I'd no idea how or what to look for or do.
>
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Re: [GNC] Maddening!!!!!!!!

[Patrick James]

My personal experience is that this "phantom transaction" problem began in 5.X.

Using 4.X, I experienced no problems changing/adding/deleting transactions 
during a reconciliation.


> On 01/12/2024 9:44 AM PST David Carlson  wrote:
> 
>  
> It sounds like you are entering new transactions while part way through
> performing a reconciliation process.
> 
> I suspect that could confuse the reconciliation.
>
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Re: [GNC] Find not working in Gnucash for Windows 5.0

[Patrick James]

Tute Terner,

Will you please upload your sample data set.


> On 04/07/2023 11:46 AM Adrien Monteleone  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> Do the splits *that match the open account register* have 'paid' in 
> their memos?
> 
> If the 'paid' text is in a memo assigned to some *other* account, you 
> will not get results. Memos are not for the open register, but only for 
> accounts matching *for that split*.
> 
> e.g.,
> 
> Dr. Expenses:Utilities100
>-(Memo = "paid")
>Cr. Assets:Checking100
>  -(Memo is blank)
> 
> And you do a search with the Checking account register in view, for 
> "paid" you will get no results, because there are no splits *assigned to 
> the Checking account* with that memo. The splits that have that memo, 
> are assigned (in this case) to Expenses:Utilities.
> 
> You can do the search from the Accounts page, and set additional 
> criteria as needed to refine the search.
> 
> Regards,
> Adrien
> 
> On 4/7/23 5:57 AM, Tute Terner wrote:
> > On 2023-04-05 07:18, Tute Terner wrote:
> >> /When I search in the Find dialog box using the Description field, 
> >> />/everything works. But when I search by the Memo field or the 
> >> />/'Description, Notes or Memo' field or the Action field the Search 
> >> />/Results always turn out empty, even though the search string is 
> >> present />/in the Memo or Action fields of some transactions.  I am 
> >> using Gnucash />/5.0 for Windows, but I have noticed this in some 
> >> previous versions too. />/Am I doing something incorrect or is this a 
> >> bug. I don't see that />/anybody has mentioned this behaviour in the 
> >> mailing list or in the bug />/list. Thank you. /
> > 
> > 
> > The specific search instance I had is this. I have a Gnucash file with 
> > accounts X, Y, and Z. X and Y have split Memo fields containing the 
> > search string 'paid'. I display account register X and search for 'paid' 
> > in the Memo field. Zero results. I then go to 'List of accounts' tree 
> > tab and search the same, using 'New Search' every time. I get results 
> > from both X and Y. So this works, but I don't want the result from Y.
> > 
> > So again I search from the accounts tree tab adding the 'and' condition 
> > of Account and set it to X. Again 0 results. I display account register 
> > Y and run the search on Memo field only. Again 0 results.
> > 
> > To make doubly sure I created a dummy gnucash file with accounts X, Y 
> > and Z as above. Same results. So looks like a bug to me.
> 
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Re: [GNC] Find not working in Gnucash for Windows 5.0

[Patrick James]

I am not a programmer, but this has a similar behavior to the bug I reported, 
in that the selected tab makes a big difference.

Sure, I reported the bug as a "second search" as that is how I associated it at 
the time, but with this added information the bug might be more about the tab 
selected.

I added this to my bug report here:

https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=798803


> On 04/07/2023 3:57 AM Tute Terner  wrote:
> 
>  
> On 2023-04-05 07:18, Tute Terner wrote:
> >/When I search in the Find dialog box using the Description field, 
> >/>/everything works. But when I search by the Memo field or the 
> >/>/'Description, Notes or Memo' field or the Action field the Search 
> >/>/Results always turn out empty, even though the search string is present 
> >/>/in the Memo or Action fields of some transactions.  I am using Gnucash 
> >/>/5.0 for Windows, but I have noticed this in some previous versions too. 
> >/>/Am I doing something incorrect or is this a bug. I don't see that 
> >/>/anybody has mentioned this behaviour in the mailing list or in the bug 
> >/>/list. Thank you. /
> 
> 
> The specific search instance I had is this. I have a Gnucash file with 
> accounts X, Y, and Z. X and Y have split Memo fields containing the 
> search string 'paid'. I display account register X and search for 'paid' 
> in the Memo field. Zero results. I then go to 'List of accounts' tree 
> tab and search the same, using 'New Search' every time. I get results 
> from both X and Y. So this works, but I don't want the result from Y.
> 
> So again I search from the accounts tree tab adding the 'and' condition 
> of Account and set it to X. Again 0 results. I display account register 
> Y and run the search on Memo field only. Again 0 results.
> 
> To make doubly sure I created a dummy gnucash file with accounts X, Y 
> and Z as above. Same results. So looks like a bug to me.
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Re: [GNC] Find not working in Gnucash for Windows 5.0

[Patrick James]

Fair enough. My experience with the "Find..." is that it's buggy, and so you're 
right, I didn't spend a tremendous amount of effort sorting out the differences.

> On 04/06/2023 9:46 AM john  wrote:
> 
>  
> You're leaping to conclusions. The OP didn't say anything about it being a 
> second search.
> 
> Regards,
> John Ralls
> 
> 
> > On Apr 6, 2023, at 9:34 AM, Patrick James  
> > wrote:
> > 
> > This is a bug, and I reported it as Bug ID 798803.
> > 
> > https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=798803
> > 
> > Selecting the "New Search" radio button should search as new, but alas, it 
> > does not.
> >
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Re: [GNC] Find not working in Gnucash for Windows 5.0

[Patrick James]

This is a bug, and I reported it as Bug ID 798803.

https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=798803

Selecting the "New Search" radio button should search as new, but alas, it does 
not.


> On 04/05/2023 11:07 PM Stan Brown  wrote:
> 
>  
> On 2023-04-05 07:18, Tute Terner wrote:
> > When I search in the Find dialog box using the Description field,
> > everything works. But when I search by the Memo field or the
> > 'Description, Notes or Memo' field or the Action field the Search
> > Results always turn out empty, even though the search string is present
> > in the Memo or Action fields of some transactions.  I am using Gnucash
> > 5.0 for Windows, but I have noticed this in some previous versions too.
> > Am I doing something incorrect or is this a bug. I don't see that
> > anybody has mentioned this behaviour in the mailing list or in the bug
> > list. Thank you.
> 
> Probably you already know this, but ...
> 
> Gnucash will only find transactions that are in the window that is on
> top when you initiate the Find.
> 
> Therefore, if you want to make sure of getting all matching transactions
> in all accounts rather than just one, you need to start your Find while
> the Accounts window (lost of accounts) is on top.
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Re: [GNC] Site certificate expiry warning

[Patrick James]

About two months ago, there was a major ice storm in Austin, and the area was 
completely unprepared for such a storm. A friend of mine was without power for 
about 12 days. He has two small children, and he has good local resources, 
which were also impacted by the ice storm, and it was not easy on him.

From the other messages here, the web server is in Austin, and was impacted by 
the storm. The basic claim extends to the ISP in terms of recovery from the ice 
storm, which propagated to the GnuCash server.

No one here seems to have a philosophical problem with https, but when an ice 
storm bring the system down, well, that's a problem.

> On 03/30/2023 11:36 AM Tom Weichmann  wrote:
> 
>  
> I'm confused, is someone arguing against using HTTPS on gnucash.org?  Is
> there some cost that is trying to be avoided or something like that?  I use
> HTTPS on my little personal website because why have any data on the
> internet that isn't encrypted.  I can't think of a downside
> 
> On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 2:29 PM Dr. David Kirkby <
> drkir...@kirkbymicrowave.co.uk> wrote:
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Re: [GNC] Site certificate expiry warning

[Patrick James]

I keep trying to figure out what to do with all my "likes" on various social 
media sites, and as of today, no one can really explain why I want/desire/need 
more "likes," or similar.


> On 03/30/2023 11:29 AM Dr. David Kirkby  
> wrote:
> 
> But that still means if you want to do well in Google, you maximise your
> chances if you use HTTPS. Even if you have a completely static website,
> with no possibility of a user entering even an email address or name.
> 
> 
> 
> Dave
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Re: [GNC] Where to download 5.0

[Patrick James]

Here is where I downloaded my copy:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/gnucash/files/gnucash%20%28stable%29/5.0/


> On 03/29/2023 5:39 PM Gyle McCollam  wrote:
> 
>  
> Sorry, I'm sure this has been posted, but when I o to Gnucash.org website it 
> only shows 4.13 or 4.9.  I tried surgeforce, but the 5.0 download won't open 
> on windows.
> 
> 
> Thank You,
> 
> Gyle McCollam
> 
> Gyle McCollam
> 
> gmccol...@live.com   email
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Re: [GNC] 5.0-1 (Flathub) issue

[Patrick James]

Once the correct payee is highlighted, simply tab to the next field, and 5.0 
will fill it in as you desire. Also note that you may arrow up and down during 
the data entry to select your desired payee, and then click tab.

I have a few payees that are very similar, but are long, so the number of 
keystrokes has gone down by a significant amount for those situations. The 
other situations are the same number of keystrokes, or very close.


> On 03/29/2023 6:30 AM John J Egan  wrote:
>  
> Since this update, creating a entry in the register now pops-up a 
> 'similar entries' selection search result box, rather than just filling 
> in the payee as it used to. It's SO frustrating, and a lot more work now!
> 
> Please revert back this new "feature".
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Re: [GNC] Exporting reports to spreadsheet

[Patrick James]

George,

This is a Windows 'feature,' as Windows has file extension associations.

If you do a quick online search, you should be able to find the instructions on 
how reassign the association of the ".ods" extension to LibreOffice Calc.

Alternatively, try right-clicking the icon and selecting "Open with" 

> On 03/29/2023 9:11 AM George Riner  wrote:
> 
>  
> The setting:
> 
> Windows 10
> Gnucash 4.13
> 
> When I Export a report I've been supplying a windows extension of 
> ".ods". Which I assumed would cause that exported report file to open in 
> some OpenDocumentSpreadsheet application, in my case: LibreOffice Calc.
> 
> But it doesn't do that. I double-click the file to open it in the 
> default application and it opens in LibreOffice Writer.
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