GNUstep bounty
I've put together a list of projects that I'd like to get finished, and that we perhaps could use some of our money for. If you'd like to help fill this out, let me know. = The GNUstep project is offering a bounty for the completion of various parts of GNUstep. The bounty varies based on the type of project. Although it may not be a lot of money, it might be enough to serve as an incentive to work on GNUstep. If you are interested in working on any of these projects, please contact Adam Fedor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>. Each project will have a specific timeline and list of deliverables against which payment can be made. 1. Complete printing support Printing in GNUstep is includes only a very basic lpr interface and the beginnings of a CUPS interface. However there needs to be a lot of testsing done and probably a lot of bug fixing and completion of unimplemented functions. A printer support application also needs to be written. Bounty: US $700. 2. Complete RTF, HTML and other text converters. RTF support is outdated, and other text converters need to be written. Bounty: US $500 3. Complete audio support. Like printing support, audio support is really only a shell of what it should be. Bounty: US $700. 4. Accessibility, multiple input support Add support for multiple input devices, multi-language input (XIM?) and various (other) accessibility interfaces. Bounty: US $1000 5. Keyed archiving support (Cocoa compatible) Complete keyed archiving support for all relevent classes. Bounty: US $500 6. Add new Cocoa classes. Compile a list of new classes. Create skeleton files for all missing classes. Complete as many classes as possible. Bounty: US $500 ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
Hi Adam, Adam Fedor wrote: > I've put together a list of projects that I'd like to get finished, and > that we perhaps could use some of our money for. If you'd like to help > fill this out, let me know. > the idea of bounties for contributions to GNUstep is ok with me, but I think that we should break down the parts we offer bounties for in smaller pieces. If I understand you correctly this is what you are suggesting with the list of deliverables. When we publish the bounty list we need links to detailed descriptions of these deliverables. Otherwise people may get frustrated with the big tasks and not start at all. What I don't understand are the price differences between the items. While is sound support more valuable then text converters? Overall the list of bounty items looks fine to me. Cheers Fred ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
Hi, Citát Fred Kiefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Hi Adam, > > Adam Fedor wrote: > > I've put together a list of projects that I'd like to get finished, and > > that we perhaps could use some of our money for. If you'd like to help > > fill this out, let me know. > > > > the idea of bounties for contributions to GNUstep is ok with me, but I > think that we should break down the parts we offer bounties for in > smaller pieces. If I understand you correctly this is what you are > suggesting with the list of deliverables. When we publish the bounty > list we need links to detailed descriptions of these deliverables. > Otherwise people may get frustrated with the big tasks and not start at all. > What I don't understand are the price differences between the items. > While is sound support more valuable then text converters? > > Overall the list of bounty items looks fine to me. > Even I am not the one who should decide about this issue, I have a suggestion. Fred is asking very important question about the price differences. Take for example, how I and my colegues are doing it when we have to deal with real projects - in tenders. We usualy have several proposals from 4 or more software development companies for each request. Some of the companies are sometimes "shooting prices from the legs", then I ask them to provide more detailed breakdown of the work. Each item is assigned estimated amount of work in hours or days and persons. Sometimes it is broken to particular functionalities. Moreover, each item is assigned a type person performing the work: analyst, programmer, tester, document writer, ... and each type of person has its price per day or per hour. From this list a simple summary is computed to get the price for the whole work. Well, nothing new - quite obvious. Why would not we use similar approach in OSS project GNUstep? I would suggest to prepare a wiki page with detailed request for development. Each request should have: - name/very short summary - breakdown table - contact person from GNUstep core developers who is responsible for that part and who should be consulted (this is important) The breakdown tables should contain columns (and perhaps column groups): - partial task - estimated amount of work (units) - type of work (to determine unit price) At the end of the proposal unit prices should be listed. And at the beginning of the proposal a list of basic knowledge required should be mentioned (like in a job offer ad) If you would like to do it, do it "the business way". What I can do is to polish the bounties offer and prepare a nice PDF that can be put on the GNUstep site later to attract developers. Stefan Urbanek p.s.: If you are really decided to give away money from the GNUstep fund, then why not to use it for gaining more publicity to GNUstep too? I and perhaps others, can try to write a slashdot article about (another) OSS project doing development in a commercial way. What do you think? -- http://stefan.agentfarms.net First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mahatma Gandhi ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
On Fri, 23 Sep 2005 08:48:17 +0200 Stefan wrote: [...] > p.s.: If you are really decided to give away money from the GNUstep fund, > then why not to use it for gaining more publicity to GNUstep too? [...] I second that. -- Chris -- GMX DSL = Maximale Leistung zum minimalen Preis! 2000 MB nur 2,99, Flatrate ab 4,99 Euro/Monat: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/dsl ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
On 2005-09-23 09:33:43 +0200 Chris Vetter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Fri, 23 Sep 2005 08:48:17 +0200 Stefan wrote: [...] p.s.: If you are really decided to give away money from the GNUstep fund, then why not to use it for gaining more publicity to GNUstep too? [...] Port WebCore to GNUstep / Window would gain a lot of publicity IMO Fabien ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
On Fri, 23 Sep 2005 11:07:40 +0200, Fabien wrote: > On 2005-09-23 09:33:43 +0200 Chris Vetter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Sep 2005 08:48:17 +0200 Stefan wrote: > > [...] > >> p.s.: If you are really decided to give away money from the GNUstep > >> fund, > >> then why not to use it for gaining more publicity to GNUstep too? > > [...] > Port WebCore to GNUstep / Window would gain a lot of publicity IMO Well, I didn't write that, Stefan Urbanek did, but yes, that would certainly get some attention. Stefan Kleine-Stengemann (sp???) did a port and it was/is quite useful, at least for playing around and testing -- I still have the source for a rudimentary web browser around somewhere that is mostly working (that is, for 'simple' pages (eg. those that do not require frames) -- though it probably is rather outdated by now. Nevertheless a port of WebCore, combined with a real browser based on that port and GNUstep certainly would get GNUstep some reputation/recognition. -- Chris -- GMX DSL = Maximale Leistung zum minimalen Preis! 2000 MB nur 2,99, Flatrate ab 4,99 Euro/Monat: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/dsl ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
Am 23.09.2005 um 08:48 schrieb Stefan Urbanek: Citát Fred Kiefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Adam Fedor wrote: I've put together a list of projects that I'd like to get finished, and that we perhaps could use some of our money for. If you'd like to help fill this out, let me know. the idea of bounties for contributions to GNUstep is ok with me, but I think that we should break down the parts we offer bounties for in smaller pieces. Take for example, how I and my colegues are doing it when we have to deal with real projects - in tenders.[...] Why would not we use similar approach in OSS project GNUstep? Because from the commercial perspective, the price of a/the bounty is neglible? I'd see it more like an extra candy, an encouragement to do a more important project instead of that more eye catching one. Perhaps an extra argument for commercial developers to improve GNUstep for this project instead of linking that hackery used last time. I would suggest to prepare a wiki page with detailed request for development. Each request should have: - name/very short summary - breakdown table - contact person from GNUstep core developers who is responsible for that part and who should be consulted (this is important) Yes. Even the process of defining tasks is already a first step to get them solved. The breakdown tables should contain columns (and perhaps column groups): - partial task Yes. Don't forget a proper testsuite. - estimated amount of work (units) - type of work (to determine unit price) And the roughly expected price per man per hour would be where? And at the beginning of the proposal a list of basic knowledge required should be mentioned (like in a job offer ad) Open source projects are typically open to everyone. Not sure wether GNUstep should make a differece here. Some people need a week to get something running, others a month. Since results can be verified easily, I'd measure people by their results, not by their university degree. my $0.02 Markus - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Dipl. Ing. Markus Hitter http://www.jump-ing.de/ ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
Citát Markus Hitter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Am 23.09.2005 um 08:48 schrieb Stefan Urbanek: > > > Citát Fred Kiefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > >> Adam Fedor wrote: > >> > >>> I've put together a list of projects that I'd like to get > >>> finished, and > >>> that we perhaps could use some of our money for. If you'd like to > >>> help > >>> fill this out, let me know. > >> > >> the idea of bounties for contributions to GNUstep is ok with me, > >> but I > >> think that we should break down the parts we offer bounties for in > >> smaller pieces. > > > > Take for example, how I and my colegues are doing it when we have > > to deal with > > real projects - in tenders.[...] Why would not we use similar > > approach in OSS project GNUstep? > > Because from the commercial perspective, the price of a/the bounty is > neglible? I'd see it more like an extra candy, an encouragement to do > a more important project instead of that more eye catching one. > Perhaps an extra argument for commercial developers to improve > GNUstep for this project instead of linking that hackery used last time. > There are three ways: 1. voulenteer development 2. commercial development 3. paid developer Even we are now discussing the 3rd way, the second way should be kept in mind. Any ideas for encouraging the commercial developers? (if you mean companies by that term) > > I would suggest to prepare a wiki page with detailed request for > > development. > > Each request should have: > > - name/very short summary > > - breakdown table > > - contact person from GNUstep core developers who is responsible > > for that part > > and who should be consulted (this is important) > > Yes. Even the process of defining tasks is already a first step to > get them solved. > > > The breakdown tables should contain columns (and perhaps column > > groups): > > - partial task > > Yes. Don't forget a proper testsuite. > > > - estimated amount of work (units) > > - type of work (to determine unit price) > > And the roughly expected price per man per hour would be where? > I forgot it, of course it should be there. > > > And at the beginning of the proposal a list of basic knowledge > > required should be mentioned (like in a job offer ad) > > Open source projects are typically open to everyone. Not sure wether > GNUstep should make a differece here. Some people need a week to get > something running, others a month. Since results can be verified > easily, I'd measure people by their results, not by their university > degree. > The purpose of mentioning the required basic knowledge is to provide more information to the potential developer. Developers should faster decide whether they would be able to perform the task or not without asking the list. It shuold not serve as a selection process for us: "you do not know that, then you should not do the task". People learn and some of them want to learn. The list of required knowledge can serve also as a list of knowledge that the developer of the task would learn or would strenghten. If someone dares to implement a feature without required knowledge, be so, but implement it right. That should be also mentioned on the "call for developers" announcement. Stefan Urbanek -- http://stefan.agentfarms.net First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mahatma Gandhi ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
Speaking of financial incentives, what ever happened to the paid icons project that started up last year? Could someone from the UI list who might be listening update us developers on that status? thanks. ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
Am 23.09.2005 um 14:43 schrieb Stefan Urbanek: And the roughly expected price per man per hour would be where? I forgot it, of course it should be there. Well, I meant "where": in which price range. Would you expect to attract commercial developers with a one-digit number, like e.g. $5/ hour? Maybe my rough estimates are completely wrong, though. Markus - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Dipl. Ing. Markus Hitter http://www.jump-ing.de/ ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
On 2005-09-23 07:08:09 -0600 Adrian Robert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Speaking of financial incentives, what ever happened to the paid icons project that started up last year? Could someone from the UI list who might be listening update us developers on that status? I should forward the email from Quentin if I can find it, but basically Jasper is still working on it, but since it has taken so long, he has decided to do the rest of the icons for free. ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
On 2005-09-23 00:48:17 -0600 Stefan Urbanek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: At the end of the proposal unit prices should be listed. And at the beginning of the proposal a list of basic knowledge required should be mentioned (like in a job offer ad) If you would like to do it, do it "the business way". What I can do is to polish the bounties offer and prepare a nice PDF that can be put on the GNUstep site later to attract developers. Stefan Urbanek Yes, I was looking for help in putting more detail into the tasks. Particularly from people who have more insight into what needs to be done. Note that I don't have the money to fund all of these at once, so we either have to pick priorities or fund projects in stages. p.s.: If you are really decided to give away money from the GNUstep fund, then why not to use it for gaining more publicity to GNUstep too? I and perhaps others, can try to write a slashdot article about (another) OSS project doing development in a commercial way. What do you think? Sure. How would we spend the money here? ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
Re: GNUstep bounty
On 9/23/05, Adam Fedor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 2005-09-23 07:08:09 -0600 Adrian Robert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > Speaking of financial incentives, what ever happened to the paid > > icons > > project that started up last year? Could someone from the UI list > > who might > > be listening update us developers on that status? > > I should forward the email from Quentin if I can find it, but > basically Jasper is still working on it, but since it has taken so > long, he has decided to do the rest of the icons for free. Basically, we gave 150$ (if i remember well) to Jasper in the beginning, as a first payment. He started to work, but then after some promising icons he stopped and was delayed for various reasons. Then he decided to make the rest of the icons for free, as he was so late. The current icons and some proposals can be seen here: http://www.jasperhauser.nl/projects/gnustep/ (jasper even wrote a complementary guideline for creating icons.. note that he misunderstood and he uses étoilé where he should have used gnustep ;-) (the icon guidelines we wrote with quentin were for gnustep, not étoilé, even if étoilé uses them). -- Nicolas Roard "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." -Arthur C. Clarke ___ Gnustep-dev mailing list Gnustep-dev@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnustep-dev
