Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?/to Mario
WWW.GOANET.ORG ** C O M M U N I T Y ** A N N O U N C E M E N T Save Goa Campaign / Goa Bachao Abhiyan Report all violations of Hill-cutting, Coastal Regulation Zone (CRZ) and other Land Use violations to: Nodal Officer & District Collector (Goa) Mr. Nikhil Kumar Office: 2223612; Residence (after 8PM): 2420710; mobile 9822123071 --- Carvalho <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Mario, which one do you want me to prove, that I can > discuss the GDP of Brazil or that I can dance the > mambo, one, two, three o-four, :-)) > Mario responds: > I think the octogenarian Goan men who would be interested in the GDP of Brazil or either of the mambos would be very safe for someone like you to associate with - but watch out for those insipid Goan women. As they say, "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned - especially by a woman!":-))) > WWW.GOANET.ORG ** C O M M U N I T Y ** A N N O U N C E M E N T Save Goa Campaign / Goa Bachao Abhiyan Report all violations of Hill-cutting, Coastal Regulation Zone (CRZ) and other Land Use violations to 24-hour Helpline +91 9822684372
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
WWW.GOANET.ORG ** C O M M U N I T Y ** A N N O U N C E M E N T Save Goa Campaign / Goa Bachao Abhiyan Report all violations of Hill-cutting, Coastal Regulation Zone (CRZ) and other Land Use violations to: Nodal Officer & District Collector (Goa) Mr. Nikhil Kumar Office: 2223612; Residence (after 8PM): 2420710; mobile 9822123071 --- Jim Fernandes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Cecil, > > What was your reasoning behind the remark "Kunbis > and Gawdas from Salcete"? Why didn't you say > "Bardez" or whatever taluka you come from? Aren't > there any folks coming from the lower stata in your > taluka at all? > Mario observes: > Hey, Jim, take all this Salcete versus Bardez stuff with a grain of salt, will ya? Haven't you read Sashticars, Carmo and Selma, on this subject? Why are you picking only on Cecil? It's like, you know, Nu Yark versus Nu Joisey! All in good fun. > Jim writes: > > I care "diddly squat" about who comes to Goa to have > fun ... they aren't spending my money. > Mario adds: > Amen, bro. Actually, as Cecil asked, where would you want them to spend their money, in Goa where it benefits Goans, or somewhere else? > WWW.GOANET.ORG ** C O M M U N I T Y ** A N N O U N C E M E N T Save Goa Campaign / Goa Bachao Abhiyan Report all violations of Hill-cutting, Coastal Regulation Zone (CRZ) and other Land Use violations to 24-hour Helpline +91 9822684372
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?/to Mario
WWW.GOANET.ORG ** C O M M U N I T Y ** A N N O U N C E M E N T Save Goa Campaign / Goa Bachao Abhiyan Report all violations of Hill-cutting, Coastal Regulation Zone (CRZ) and other Land Use violations to: Nodal Officer & District Collector (Goa) Mr. Nikhil Kumar Office: 2223612; Residence (after 8PM): 2420710; mobile 9822123071 > Selma writes: > > > > I find the men positively charming and I've never > > had any problems with getting them to talk to me. > > > Mario observes: > > > Yeah, right! I think I'll leave it right there!:-)) -- Mario, which one do you want me to prove, that I can discuss the GDP of Brazil or that I can dance the mambo, one, two, three o-four, :-)) selma __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com WWW.GOANET.ORG ** C O M M U N I T Y ** A N N O U N C E M E N T Save Goa Campaign / Goa Bachao Abhiyan Report all violations of Hill-cutting, Coastal Regulation Zone (CRZ) and other Land Use violations to 24-hour Helpline +91 9822684372
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?/to Sunith
--- Carvalho <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I think I said I find the [Goan] women insipid,... > Mario wonders: > With this kind of snotty attitude I wonder what the Goan women must think of Selma???:-)) > Selma writes: > > I find the men positively charming and I've never > had any problems with getting them to talk to me. > Mario observes: > Yeah, right! I think I'll leave it right there!:-)) >
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
Cecil, What was your reasoning behind the remark "Kunbis and Gawdas from Salcete"? Why didn't you say "Bardez" or whatever taluka you come from? Aren't there any folks coming from the lower stata in your taluka at all? I care "diddly squat" about who comes to Goa to have fun ... they aren't spending my money. Xastikar, Jim F. New York. -- Original message -- From: Cecil Pinto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami wrote: > During the new year weekend it looked like the whole of Delhi descended in > goa. Went for a cocktail party with a friend at someone's mansion. guess > what, I was the only Goan Only Delhities and a couple of government people. > > > Cecil: > And you were expecting what? Kunbis and gawdas from Salcete? ... ... ...
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time? re Kunbis
--- Carvalho <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I would much rather be at a Kunbi function than at a > pretentious frou frou party in Bardez, where people > pretend they don't know Konkani. > Mario observes: > Selma, I think you have the two Goas mixed up. From my experience, it is in the Portuguese-Goan bastion of Salcete that people pretend not to know Konkani. >
[Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
Response to Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: At first, I am empathetic to Ana Maria's reaction. I feel the same when I see / hear someone blow-up Rs 5,000.00 on an expensive bottle of wine. Yet my perspective will be different if I were making or selling that wine. This brings me to the need to look at the larger picture, than our narrow perspective and interest. Ana Maria's reaction (as a Goan) to visitors / tourists coming to Goa and blowing up Rs. 50,000 on a 1-2 night junket is disappointing. Would it be better if those tourists not come at all? Or come and spend the same amount of money staying in Goa for a month? How would the latter situation work out for their contribution to the Goan economy and drain on her resources? My guess is that social parties involving Delhiwallas would involve business and political networking. So I am disappointed that a well-traveled and educated Goan like Ana Maria did not take advantage of their presence in Goa, and tell us about the networking. I hope she welcomed these busy-bodies, empathized with them about their ultra-short stay and invited them to come back again. Hope Ana Maria encouraged them to make-up for their short stay by taking back to Delhi a lot of Goan bibique etc. and at least a six-month supply of feni, not to mention other Goan gifts for their relatives and friends. The above would be better rather than writing about the Goan kashti. Is that what her take-home message was from the party? I compliment the Delhiites for rushing home back to work, after a day or two of partying. Now I know why the country is doing so well. Would we want them to just lol around in Goa on the beach? And then criticize them for that too? I think these Delhiwallas should be thanked for choosing Goa for the short vacation. They could have gone to many other tourists spots in India and aboard. As far as their flying visit to Goa, they should be emulated for their dedication to their work. By visiting Goa and spending their money there, the ripple effect permits their money to reach the very people Ana Maria would like to see the money go --- and they will be our bhaus and bhoinims in Goa. Kind Regards, GL
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?/to Sunith
--- Sunith D Velho <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Cecil, > > No need to worry about Selma this time. She has made > it quite clear > that she considers other goan women insipid. > > No we know why no one will talk to her at Goan > events. > > Regards > Sunith Velho -- Dear Sunith, I was wondering who would take the bait on that one :)) As for no one talking to me at Goan events, your penchant for hyperbole and extrapolation is superb. I think I said I find the women insipid, I find the men positively charming and I've never had any problems with getting them to talk to me. Not only can I discuss the GDP of Brazil but I can dance a mean Mambo No. 5 as well :) Take care and have a good one, we've got snow up here. selma __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time? re Kunbis
For the first time in my life, I agree more with Cecil... than with Selma. Without intending to defend Cecil (he doesn't need it... and he's too unpredictable anyway!) his comment didn't strike me the way Selma read it. In fact, I burst into a chortle on first seeing it, provoking a family member to ask, "What happened?" To me, Cecil was trying to say: "Yes, Goa itself is a stratified, class and caste divided society. So why complain when the divisions work against you? Do we complain when we have been treating others unfairly (for generations)?" Coming to think of it, we're pretty racist when it comes to keeping people out of our own "parties". So, Cecil's question, if I read it right, why complain when a party in Goa has a "Delhites-only" unwritten signboard outside it? Don't know if Cecil would agree with my reading of his comment... but that's how it came across to me. FN PS: I don't agree with Cecil's deliberately provocative and unjustified criticism of all "South Goans" in general, as he calls them. I think he does it more for effect, like his "world famous all over Goa" joke. On 07/01/07, Carvalho <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Do we really have to denigrate the Kunbis and Gawdas of Salcete? These salt of the earth people have raised themselves up in society through sheer dint of hard work. Today they are represented in society as masons, teachers and administrative staff. > - Original Message - > From: "Cecil Pinto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > And you were expecting what? Kunbis and gawdas > from Salcete? -- FN M: 0091 9822122436 P: +91-832-240-9490 (after 1300IST please) http://fn.goa-india.org http://fredericknoronha.wordpress.com
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time? re Kunbis
Cecil pinto wrote in response to Ana's post about attending a party where only Delhites were present: > - Original Message - > From: "Cecil Pinto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > And you were expecting what? Kunbis and gawdas > from Salcete? - Do we really have to denigrate the Kunbis and Gawdas of Salcete? These salt of the earth people have raised themselves up in society through sheer dint of hard work. Today they are represented in society as masons, teachers and administrative staff. I went to a Kunbi wedding once. The host was extremely gracious and hospitable. I've never seen such energetic and raw interpretation of dance and music, except once at a South African party. Perhaps there is some very distant racial genetic link with Africa and the indigenous population of Goa, but I digress. I would much rather be at a Kunbi function than at a pretentious frou frou party in Bardez, where people pretend they don't know Konkani. It is rather hypocritical to eloquently denounce religion bashing and then go on to denigrate another section of society who may not have the wherewithal to be represented on a cyber forum. selma __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
Cecil, No need to worry about Selma this time. She has made it quite clear that she considers other goan women insipid. No we know why no one will talk to her at Goan events. Regards Sunith Velho Cecil writes; I have known Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami as a friend for a long time. Before the crusading Joan of Arc takes up cudgels uninvited, this is not an attack on Ana Maria, but just seeking for clarification of a publicly stated viewpoint that is contradictory. -- Sunith D Velho [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
Well Cecil, if you want to start this debate. OK. I knew whose house I was going to, as I've been there before. earlier occasions, a lot of local people, I mean Goans and, non-goans who have made Goa their home. this time it was only Delhities. No, I am not uncomfortable in their company, because I have lived in Delhi, first as a child and then married life. I was under the impression it would be a mixed crowd. What the Delhities were saying is the local men were wearing very little clothes, which made the visitors to Goa uncomfortable. Hence my remark. Sorry I don't go to Bombay for a friend's wedding on one day and fly back the other. Its not my scene. By the way I have not been in Bombay for seven years. the last time was in 2001 in March for three days en-route Khatmandu. Delhi is a place which changes people and I have seen it, especially if you relocate from Bombay or Cheenai to Delhi, don't ask me why, more so if they have lived over 15 years in Delhi. I haven't met this friend from Delhi in over 10 years. the only reason I keep in contact with him is because I've known him since I was 18 and his first wife/son died tragically in the Uphaar Cinema fire at Connaught Place in 1997. He has since married again and I have not met his second wife. You have misunderstood me Cecil. What I meant to say is Goans do not want to call themselves Indians, especially if they have migrated to from India post 1961 from different parts of India to other countries. I lived in Brazil for four years. Very few Goans at that time. I was the only one who called myself Indian,. the others called themselves Portuguese. I know personally Goans who look down upon Indians and pass rude remarks about them. That is why I passed the remark. No, I do not resent anyone visiting Goa. What I resent is what is happening to go in the name of progress. Cheers Ana Maria - Original Message - From: "Cecil Pinto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 11:37 AM Subject: Must you come to Goa this time? > Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami wrote: > During the new year weekend it looked like the whole of Delhi descended in > goa. Went for a cocktail party with a friend at someone's mansion. guess > what, I was the only Goan Only Delhities and a couple of government people. > > > Cecil: > And you were expecting what? Kunbis and gawdas from Salcete? > Surely you were aware of what the composition of the guests would be? > That you still chose to go means you are comfortable in their company. Or > aren't you? > > Reminds me of another woman on this forum who went to a party at Fundacao > Oriente and was shocked to hear Portuguese being spoken! > > - > > Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: > Oh, goa is so beautiful? but the local men wear swimsuits, I think they > meant khastis. I kept quiet, and then remarked. this is what they wear in > Goa. Do you expect goans to swim in full atire and women to wear saris? they > kept quiet. > > > Cecil: > I didn't quite get what you are trying to say. > Firstly it is very rare to see Goan men wearing kashtis and secondly yes, > many Goan women do use a saree as a swimsuit. Go to Baga in may and see for > yourself. What is the point you are trying to make? > > -- > > Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: > Another very close friend, flew in from Delhi on the 31st to attend Vijay > Mallaya's party and Babu Keni's party at the Mandovi. flew back on the 1st. > It really sickened me. > > > Cecil: > Why did it sicken you? > If you went to Mumbai to attend a friend's wedding or party and flew back > on the next day should it sicken someone else? > If these friends' behavior sicken you why do you still maintain your > friendship with them? > > --- > > Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: > How can people spend that kind of money, why can't they donate to some needy > individuals, to the poor and underpriveleged? > > > Cecil: > And how do you know that they are not donating to worthy causes? Also keep > in mind that everything is relative. Somewhere on the hillside in Betim is > a poor carpenter's assistant who looks at your lifestyle and says the same > thing of you. > > But most important Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami is to clarify what exactly > your point is. At the GoaNetter's met you went out of your way to drive > home the point that Goans are not in any way superior to Indians in > general. It seemed incongruous at the time that a GoaNetter at a GoaNetters > meet is going out of her way to unfavourably compare Goans with "Indians". > But given that there was sense in what you said (despite it not being the > ideal venue for such a discussion) nobody objected for the simple reason > that your voice at least helped to partially drown out the two > Australian-Goans (one not even subscribed to GoaNet!) at the meeting who > seemed to have an aggressive agenda of their own which nobody else could > identify or sympathize with. > > A
[Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami wrote: During the new year weekend it looked like the whole of Delhi descended in goa. Went for a cocktail party with a friend at someone's mansion. guess what, I was the only Goan Only Delhities and a couple of government people. Cecil: And you were expecting what? Kunbis and gawdas from Salcete? Surely you were aware of what the composition of the guests would be? That you still chose to go means you are comfortable in their company. Or aren't you? Reminds me of another woman on this forum who went to a party at Fundacao Oriente and was shocked to hear Portuguese being spoken! - Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: Oh, goa is so beautiful? but the local men wear swimsuits, I think they meant khastis. I kept quiet, and then remarked. this is what they wear in Goa. Do you expect goans to swim in full atire and women to wear saris? they kept quiet. Cecil: I didn't quite get what you are trying to say. Firstly it is very rare to see Goan men wearing kashtis and secondly yes, many Goan women do use a saree as a swimsuit. Go to Baga in may and see for yourself. What is the point you are trying to make? -- Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: Another very close friend, flew in from Delhi on the 31st to attend Vijay Mallaya's party and Babu Keni's party at the Mandovi. flew back on the 1st. It really sickened me. Cecil: Why did it sicken you? If you went to Mumbai to attend a friend's wedding or party and flew back on the next day should it sicken someone else? If these friends' behavior sicken you why do you still maintain your friendship with them? --- Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami: How can people spend that kind of money, why can't they donate to some needy individuals, to the poor and underpriveleged? Cecil: And how do you know that they are not donating to worthy causes? Also keep in mind that everything is relative. Somewhere on the hillside in Betim is a poor carpenter's assistant who looks at your lifestyle and says the same thing of you. But most important Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami is to clarify what exactly your point is. At the GoaNetter's met you went out of your way to drive home the point that Goans are not in any way superior to Indians in general. It seemed incongruous at the time that a GoaNetter at a GoaNetters meet is going out of her way to unfavourably compare Goans with "Indians". But given that there was sense in what you said (despite it not being the ideal venue for such a discussion) nobody objected for the simple reason that your voice at least helped to partially drown out the two Australian-Goans (one not even subscribed to GoaNet!) at the meeting who seemed to have an aggressive agenda of their own which nobody else could identify or sympathize with. Anyway Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami, do you resent the non-Goans visiting Goa? Or do you resent only Delhites? What specifically is your standpoint and what solutions do you proffer? Cheers! Cecil P.S. I have known Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami as a friend for a long time. Before the crusading Joan of Arc takes up cudgels uninvited, this is not an attack on Ana Maria, but just seeking for clarification of a publicly stated viewpoint that is contradictory. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.7/618 - Release Date: 1/6/2007
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
--- Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > During the new year weekend it looked like the whole > of Delhi descended in > goa. Went for a cocktail party with a friend at > someone's mansion. guess > what, I was the only Goan Only Delhities and a > couple of government people. -- Dear Ana Maria, Forgive my ignorance but why would it be disturbing to attend a party where you're the only Goan? Very often not only am the lone Goan/Indian at a party or in an office but I'm the only person with brown skin. This is the world we live in. It's multi-racial and multi-cultural. We can't be turning back the clock to a time when everyone knew the bandmaster and the cook at the wedding. Incidentally, I would love to be at a party with cosmopolitan Delhite women and men. I've always found Goan women to be slightly insipid. Goan men on the other hand are riveting after three kingfisher beers and fascinating after the band starts playing Mambo No. 5. Then as morning draws near, he whispers in your ear that Liberty cruise liner is departing the very next day and wishes you adieu. :) Selma __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
Ana Maria: Why did you go for the cocktail party? To paraphrase VM, "Must you come to (Delhi-oriented) cocktail parties this time (of the year)? Also I would like to comment on one of the comments you made at the ICT-for-D debate (if you will excuse me for taking ideas from one forum to another, no malice meant): It's easy to blame Delhites for all our (actual, exaggerated or perceived) ills. What about Goan involvement themselves? For selling their lands, for tolerating poor governance, for not using their brain power to challenge wrongs intelligently, for wanting everything of the "good life" and yet aggressively critiquing the flip side of the capitalist coin when it cuts into us the wrong way? For not standing up to the crooks and manipulators (not just politicians!) in our society? For lionising the very same people who makes such a large-scale 'sell out' so easy? For professing a love for Goa, and yet sitting half-way around the globe and only adding to the pressures that mount on the resources and people of Goa, by their very actions? For patronising the very same land-speculators lobby whom we decry all the time? FN On 06/01/07, Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: This refers to the article which Vivek Menezes wrote in the goanet. Its excellent. Congratulations Vivek. During the new year weekend it looked like the whole of Delhi descended in goa. Went for a cocktail party with a friend at someone's mansion. guess what, I was the only Goan
[Goanet] Must you come to Goa this time?
This refers to the article which Vivek Menezes wrote in the goanet. Its excellent. Congratulations Vivek. During the new year weekend it looked like the whole of Delhi descended in goa. Went for a cocktail party with a friend at someone's mansion. guess what, I was the only Goan Only Delhities and a couple of government people. Oh, goa is so beautiful? but the local men wear swimsuits, I think they meant khastis. I kept quiet, and then remarked. this is what they wear in Goa. Do you expect goans to swim in full atire and women to wear saris? they kept quiet. Another very close friend, flew in from Delhi on the 31st to attend Vijay Mallaya's party and Babu Keni's party at the Mandovi. flew back on the 1st. It really sickened me. How can people spend that kind of money, why can't they donate to some needy individuals, to the poor and underpriveleged? Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami
