Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
When building a new desktop it would thus be a good idea to look for windows 7 compatibility which means that secure boot can be turned off then. OK thanks Martin At 22:19 10/11/2014, you wrote: No version of windows will leave dirty footprints in your BIOS, secure boot is already baked into the bios and is a requirement for it to be deemed windows 8 compatible by Microsoft. Which is basically any computer you can buy these days. Older windows OSs will suffer the same problem as most Linux distros in that they will not boot with secure boot enabled. As far as I know only windows 8 and a few select Linux distros will boot on a computer with secure boot enabled. So it will not matter if you can get a computer with or without windows installed on it, if it is windows 8 compatible it will have secure boot on it. Note that it is also a requirement by Microsoft on x86_64 computers that you must be able to turn off secure boot (though it is not always easy and there could be other problems with booting Linux). However on arm chips, the requirement is the opposite and you can not turn it off (so stay far away from any windows 8 compatible arm computers you are thinking about turning into Linux boxes, such as the Microsoft surface tablet). -- Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin (17061790) -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
On 10/11/2014 23:48, Joseph Bennie wrote: .. the only meaningful difference was the RH7 changed something and every time it boots theres a little flash of the uefi boot shell before it loads the OS. There is a tool that does boot repairs. It's useful enough that I have a bootable USB stick dedicated to it. This may be what RH did. http://sourceforge.net/projects/boot-repair-cd/ -- This message was written elegantly and lucidly, by my own fair hand using a quill pen on hand laid parchment. It was then scanned, OCRed, spiel-chequed, then cat und pastied into this email. If it's now just gibberish, it's the software's fault. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
OT i know but does this mean when an old windows OS is installed, the same error will occur? ie xp vista What is the earliest version of the windows to support the signed kernel? Martin At 13:44 09/11/2014, you wrote: Thanks, Michael; with that hint I tried a google search on Asus Sabertooth FX + secure boot and found a You-tube video showing me how to do all sorts of tweaking, including disabling secure boot. Tried that, and now I can boot from the rEFInd CD. New NSA Slogan: We work to ensure your safety. Don't Worry We Have Your Back[door] -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
A web search for Windows signed kernel secure boot turned up a Microsoft web page which tells me that secure boot applies to Windows 8, Windows 8.1, Windows Server 2012 Windows Server 2012 R2. Looks as though XP and Vista (and for that matter Windows 7) shouldn't leave dirty footprints in your BIOS! Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- On 10/11/14 19:40, Martin N wrote: OT i know but does this mean when an old windows OS is installed, the same error will occur? ie xp vista What is the earliest version of the windows to support the signed kernel? Martin At 13:44 09/11/2014, you wrote: Thanks, Michael; with that hint I tried a google search on Asus Sabertooth FX + secure boot and found a You-tube video showing me how to do all sorts of tweaking, including disabling secure boot. Tried that, and now I can boot from the rEFInd CD. New NSA Slogan: We work to ensure your safety. Don't Worry We Have Your Back[door] -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
No version of windows will leave dirty footprints in your BIOS, secure boot is already baked into the bios and is a requirement for it to be deemed windows 8 compatible by Microsoft. Which is basically any computer you can buy these days. Older windows OSs will suffer the same problem as most Linux distros in that they will not boot with secure boot enabled. As far as I know only windows 8 and a few select Linux distros will boot on a computer with secure boot enabled. So it will not matter if you can get a computer with or without windows installed on it, if it is windows 8 compatible it will have secure boot on it. Note that it is also a requirement by Microsoft on x86_64 computers that you must be able to turn off secure boot (though it is not always easy and there could be other problems with booting Linux). However on arm chips, the requirement is the opposite and you can not turn it off (so stay far away from any windows 8 compatible arm computers you are thinking about turning into Linux boxes, such as the Microsoft surface tablet). On 10 November 2014 21:29, Ian Park i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com wrote: A web search for Windows signed kernel secure boot turned up a Microsoft web page which tells me that secure boot applies to Windows 8, Windows 8.1, Windows Server 2012 Windows Server 2012 R2. Looks as though XP and Vista (and for that matter Windows 7) shouldn't leave dirty footprints in your BIOS! Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- On 10/11/14 19:40, Martin N wrote: OT i know but does this mean when an old windows OS is installed, the same error will occur? ie xp vista What is the earliest version of the windows to support the signed kernel? Martin At 13:44 09/11/2014, you wrote: Thanks, Michael; with that hint I tried a google search on Asus Sabertooth FX + secure boot and found a You-tube video showing me how to do all sorts of tweaking, including disabling secure boot. Tried that, and now I can boot from the rEFInd CD. New NSA Slogan: We work to ensure your safety. Don't Worry We Have Your Back[door] -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Michael Daffin james1...@gmail.com -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
On 10 Nov 2014, at 22:19, Michael Daffin james1...@gmail.com wrote: No version of windows will leave dirty footprints in your BIOS, secure boot is already baked into the bios and is a requirement for it to be deemed windows 8 compatible by Microsoft. Which is basically any computer you can buy these days. Older windows OSs will suffer the same problem as most Linux distros in that they will not boot with secure boot enabled. As far as I know only windows 8 and a few select Linux distros will boot on a computer with secure boot enabled. So it will not matter if you can get a computer with or without windows installed on it, if it is windows 8 compatible it will have secure boot on it. Note that it is also a requirement by Microsoft on x86_64 computers that you must be able to turn off secure boot (though it is not always easy and there could be other problems with booting Linux). However on arm chips, the requirement is the opposite and you can not turn it off (so stay far away from any windows 8 compatible arm computers you are thinking about turning into Linux boxes, such as the Microsoft surface tablet). Just for the record I set up win10 demo on a factory shipped win8 Acer Aspire R7. I reset the TPM and followed the disable secure boot option, but still had problems installing stock debian….. however I decided to take an RH7 (30day demo subscription) for a spin incase it was just media issue and worked like charm (Top marks to RH for a very slick distro)…. however I just can’t be fussed with the RH way of doing things so got grumpy and re tried to install Debian. … this time Debian just worked … same disk same hard ware .. the only meaningful difference was the RH7 changed something and every time it boots theres a little flash of the uefi boot shell before it loads the OS. So I think this is repeatable. a) follow the options to reset tpm (in windows) b) follow the reboot without secure boot c) install Redhat 7 d) reinstall with distort of choice. Can someone give it a go. thanks .J On 10 November 2014 21:29, Ian Park i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com mailto:i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com wrote: A web search for Windows signed kernel secure boot turned up a Microsoft web page which tells me that secure boot applies to Windows 8, Windows 8.1, Windows Server 2012 Windows Server 2012 R2. Looks as though XP and Vista (and for that matter Windows 7) shouldn't leave dirty footprints in your BIOS! Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com mailto:i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- On 10/11/14 19:40, Martin N wrote: OT i know but does this mean when an old windows OS is installed, the same error will occur? ie xp vista What is the earliest version of the windows to support the signed kernel? Martin At 13:44 09/11/2014, you wrote: Thanks, Michael; with that hint I tried a google search on Asus Sabertooth FX + secure boot and found a You-tube video showing me how to do all sorts of tweaking, including disabling secure boot. Tried that, and now I can boot from the rEFInd CD. New NSA Slogan: We work to ensure your safety. Don't Worry We Have Your Back[door] -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk mailto:Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk http://www.hantslug.org.uk/ -- -- Michael Daffin james1...@gmail.com mailto:james1...@gmail.com -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
On 09/11/14 00:49, Victor Churchill wrote: My son's just got a no-OS laptop from them , and similarly it had a minimal windows on it when delivered. They did say in one of their progress emails (*) that they were installing an OS to do their pre delivery tests. I can't help regarding what thet might do to the UEFI process, I'm afraid. (*) they are assiduous in keeping the customer infomed re. the progress of their order. -- best regards, 웃 Victor Churchill, Bournemouth Hmm, they weren't so assiduous in keeping *me* informed when the build of my system was delayed because they were waiting for delivery of the power supply - a fortnight after I ordered it I'd heard nothing from them; web site showed it was still in the pre-production state so I nudged them, and it was only then that they told me they were waiting fopr delivery of the power supply. Thereafter they kept me updated, though. Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
Thanks, Michael; with that hint I tried a google search on Asus Sabertooth FX + secure boot and found a You-tube video showing me how to do all sorts of tweaking, including disabling secure boot. Tried that, and now I can boot from the rEFInd CD. Cheers Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- On 08/11/14 21:26, Michael Daffin wrote: That is secure boot preventing you from booting an unsigned kernel. You should be able to disable it in the BIOS though some don't label it as so obviously. On 8 Nov 2014 21:18, Ian Park i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com mailto:i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com wrote: I recently bought a new PC from PC Specialist (the third one I've had from them - the laptop I'm using to compose this, and an entry level desktop for my wife). The new machine has an Asus Sabretooth motherboard with a UEFI BIOS. The first time I booted up the PC, I was too slow to hit the F2 key to go into the BIOS, and it booted into Windows (I'd specified that I wanted the machine with no OS, but I guess that PC Specialist installed Windows for the system test). I promptly did a restart, and this time caught it in time to hit F2 and go into the BIOS. I was able to change the boot order so that it booted from the Mint live DVD, stoked up gparted and re-arranged sda to have the partition layout I wanted (sda1 as 512MB for the EFI boot partition, sda2 sda3 as 20GB partitions for root of Linux Mint and another OS to try out if I fancy it, sda4 as 20GB swap and sda5 as the remaining 160ish GB for the visible home partition to share between 2 distros. I was then able to install Mint 17 on sda2. I then followed the tutorial in Linux Voice issue 2 to set up sda1 as the EFI boot partition and install the rEFInd boot manager. I hit a rock when I tried to boot from a USB stick with rEFInd on it, or a CD with rEFInd on it. The error message was: The system found unauthorised changes on the firmware, operating system or UEFI drivers. I have a strong suspicion that this was an after-effect of the Windows installation which I deleted. Can anyone suggest a way of removing this Windows contamination, please? Thanks in advance Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com mailto:i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk mailto:Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
[Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
I recently bought a new PC from PC Specialist (the third one I've had from them - the laptop I'm using to compose this, and an entry level desktop for my wife). The new machine has an Asus Sabretooth motherboard with a UEFI BIOS. The first time I booted up the PC, I was too slow to hit the F2 key to go into the BIOS, and it booted into Windows (I'd specified that I wanted the machine with no OS, but I guess that PC Specialist installed Windows for the system test). I promptly did a restart, and this time caught it in time to hit F2 and go into the BIOS. I was able to change the boot order so that it booted from the Mint live DVD, stoked up gparted and re-arranged sda to have the partition layout I wanted (sda1 as 512MB for the EFI boot partition, sda2 sda3 as 20GB partitions for root of Linux Mint and another OS to try out if I fancy it, sda4 as 20GB swap and sda5 as the remaining 160ish GB for the visible home partition to share between 2 distros. I was then able to install Mint 17 on sda2. I then followed the tutorial in Linux Voice issue 2 to set up sda1 as the EFI boot partition and install the rEFInd boot manager. I hit a rock when I tried to boot from a USB stick with rEFInd on it, or a CD with rEFInd on it. The error message was: The system found unauthorised changes on the firmware, operating system or UEFI drivers. I have a strong suspicion that this was an after-effect of the Windows installation which I deleted. Can anyone suggest a way of removing this Windows contamination, please? Thanks in advance Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
That is secure boot preventing you from booting an unsigned kernel. You should be able to disable it in the BIOS though some don't label it as so obviously. On 8 Nov 2014 21:18, Ian Park i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com wrote: I recently bought a new PC from PC Specialist (the third one I've had from them - the laptop I'm using to compose this, and an entry level desktop for my wife). The new machine has an Asus Sabretooth motherboard with a UEFI BIOS. The first time I booted up the PC, I was too slow to hit the F2 key to go into the BIOS, and it booted into Windows (I'd specified that I wanted the machine with no OS, but I guess that PC Specialist installed Windows for the system test). I promptly did a restart, and this time caught it in time to hit F2 and go into the BIOS. I was able to change the boot order so that it booted from the Mint live DVD, stoked up gparted and re-arranged sda to have the partition layout I wanted (sda1 as 512MB for the EFI boot partition, sda2 sda3 as 20GB partitions for root of Linux Mint and another OS to try out if I fancy it, sda4 as 20GB swap and sda5 as the remaining 160ish GB for the visible home partition to share between 2 distros. I was then able to install Mint 17 on sda2. I then followed the tutorial in Linux Voice issue 2 to set up sda1 as the EFI boot partition and install the rEFInd boot manager. I hit a rock when I tried to boot from a USB stick with rEFInd on it, or a CD with rEFInd on it. The error message was: The system found unauthorised changes on the firmware, operating system or UEFI drivers. I have a strong suspicion that this was an after-effect of the Windows installation which I deleted. Can anyone suggest a way of removing this Windows contamination, please? Thanks in advance Ian -- Ian Park email: i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
On Sat, 08 Nov 2014 21:18:01 + Ian Park i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com wrote: Hello Ian, go into the BIOS, and it booted into Windows (I'd specified that I wanted the machine with no OS, but I guess that PC Specialist installed Windows for the system test) From what I remember of my purchsaes from them, it's a bare bones install; Useful only for their testing purposes and little, if anything, more. -- Regards _ / ) The blindingly obvious is / _)radnever immediately apparent The man in a tracksuit attacks me I Predict A Riot - Kaiser Chiefs pgpZ085n4zPB7.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] UEFI booting woes
My son's just got a no-OS laptop from them , and similarly it had a minimal windows on it when delivered. They did say in one of their progress emails (*) that they were installing an OS to do their pre delivery tests. I can't help regarding what thet might do to the UEFI process, I'm afraid. (*) they are assiduous in keeping the customer infomed re. the progress of their order. On 8 November 2014 22:11, Brad Rogers b...@fineby.me.uk wrote: On Sat, 08 Nov 2014 21:18:01 + Ian Park i.d.c.p...@ntlworld.com wrote: Hello Ian, go into the BIOS, and it booted into Windows (I'd specified that I wanted the machine with no OS, but I guess that PC Specialist installed Windows for the system test) From what I remember of my purchsaes from them, it's a bare bones install; Useful only for their testing purposes and little, if anything, more. -- Regards _ / ) The blindingly obvious is / _)radnever immediately apparent The man in a tracksuit attacks me I Predict A Riot - Kaiser Chiefs -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- best regards, 웃 Victor Churchill, Bournemouth -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
