Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Just post at VDC? http://developer.valvesoftware.com/ -- ts2do -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Is there a community wiki page for such thing? On 8/12/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Those posts are from 2005. I had to post about 30 times over the span of > 16 months before the critical vphysics bug finally got addressed by Valve, > so I'd advise summarizing the current issues on a new wiki. > > At 2006/08/04 07:21 AM, Jeffrey \"botman\" Broome wrote: > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >>This is great information, and not at all what I thought was being > >>complained about earlier. I don't believe anyone's posted these > >>complaints here or on Verc before. I don't suppose you'd like to > >>consolidate this information into a wiki page so Valve has a central > >>place to go to for those bugs...? > > > >See the following threads... > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-January/011546.html > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-January/011361.html > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-April/013254.html > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-May/013560.html > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-May/013711.html > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-July/014064.html > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-October/015487.html > > > >...I think Valve is well aware of the problem. :) > > > >-- > >Jeffrey "botman" Broome > > > >___ > >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
Those posts are from 2005. I had to post about 30 times over the span of 16 months before the critical vphysics bug finally got addressed by Valve, so I'd advise summarizing the current issues on a new wiki. At 2006/08/04 07:21 AM, Jeffrey \"botman\" Broome wrote: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>This is great information, and not at all what I thought was being >>complained about earlier. I don't believe anyone's posted these >>complaints here or on Verc before. I don't suppose you'd like to >>consolidate this information into a wiki page so Valve has a central >>place to go to for those bugs...? > >See the following threads... > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-January/011546.html > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-January/011361.html > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-April/013254.html > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-May/013560.html > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-May/013711.html > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-July/014064.html > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-October/015487.html > >...I think Valve is well aware of the problem. :) > >-- >Jeffrey "botman" Broome > >___ >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please >visit: >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is great information, and not at all what I thought was being complained about earlier. I don't believe anyone's posted these complaints here or on Verc before. I don't suppose you'd like to consolidate this information into a wiki page so Valve has a central place to go to for those bugs...? See the following threads... http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-January/011546.html http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-January/011361.html http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-April/013254.html http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-May/013560.html http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-May/013711.html http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-July/014064.html http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/private/hlcoders/2005-October/015487.html ...I think Valve is well aware of the problem. :) -- Jeffrey "botman" Broome ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] It has been explained several times on here. I've also sent detailed lists directly to valve, so they know whats missing. On 8/3/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > This is great information, and not at all what I thought was being > complained about earlier. I don't believe anyone's posted these complaints > here or on Verc before. I don't suppose you'd like to consolidate this > information into a wiki page so Valve has a central place to go to for those > bugs...? > > At 2006/08/02 08:38 AM, Jeffrey \"botman\" Broome wrote: > >Jeremy Swigart wrote: > >>-- > >>[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > >>You certainly do need access to a hell of alot more than what the server > >>plugins provide. The properties of the weapon is not in any way part of > the > >>problem. It's finding out if the bot has a particular weapon, and then > >>somehow changing to it, not to mention querying the weapon ammo. > > > >...also being able to determine what weapon other players/bots currently > >have deployed (so you know whether to stand and fight or run away). > > > >Being able to know which weapon and/or ammo pickups are active (i.e. the > >weapon/ammo has spawned and can currently be picked up). Being able to > >determine if wall chargers are usable or not (have they been used up?). > > Being able to determine the state/location of platforms and doors (do > >I need to wait for a moving platform/lift or is it already at the > >bottom/top?). Being able to detect bullet or explosive projectile > >impacts and sounds. Being able to tell when things like flashbang > >grenades have exploded so that the bot reacts properly. > > > >These are just a few of the things that aren't easily accessible via > >plugins. Without the plugin system supporting these types of querries, > >developing an easy-to-maintain and mod release agnostic plugin bot will > >be extremely difficult. > > > >-- > >Jeffrey "botman" Broome > > > >___ > >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
This is great information, and not at all what I thought was being complained about earlier. I don't believe anyone's posted these complaints here or on Verc before. I don't suppose you'd like to consolidate this information into a wiki page so Valve has a central place to go to for those bugs...? At 2006/08/02 08:38 AM, Jeffrey \"botman\" Broome wrote: >Jeremy Swigart wrote: >>-- >>[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] >>You certainly do need access to a hell of alot more than what the server >>plugins provide. The properties of the weapon is not in any way part of the >>problem. It's finding out if the bot has a particular weapon, and then >>somehow changing to it, not to mention querying the weapon ammo. > >...also being able to determine what weapon other players/bots currently >have deployed (so you know whether to stand and fight or run away). > >Being able to know which weapon and/or ammo pickups are active (i.e. the >weapon/ammo has spawned and can currently be picked up). Being able to >determine if wall chargers are usable or not (have they been used up?). > Being able to determine the state/location of platforms and doors (do >I need to wait for a moving platform/lift or is it already at the >bottom/top?). Being able to detect bullet or explosive projectile >impacts and sounds. Being able to tell when things like flashbang >grenades have exploded so that the bot reacts properly. > >These are just a few of the things that aren't easily accessible via >plugins. Without the plugin system supporting these types of querries, >developing an easy-to-maintain and mod release agnostic plugin bot will >be extremely difficult. > >-- >Jeffrey "botman" Broome > >___ >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please >visit: >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] True dat. There may be hope on the horizon with this new SDK guy, so hopefully we will see these things added in an upcoming SDK update. True that if you have mod source code access you can make bots just fine, I've been working on such bots for quite a while now in FF, but many bot coders want to do non mod specific bots, and plug them into CS:S, DOD, HL2DM, insert any mod here. Getting source access is unrealistic and in many cases impossible. On 8/2/06, Jeffrey botman Broome <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Jeremy Swigart wrote: > > -- > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > You certainly do need access to a hell of alot more than what the server > > plugins provide. The properties of the weapon is not in any way part of > the > > problem. It's finding out if the bot has a particular weapon, and then > > somehow changing to it, not to mention querying the weapon ammo. > > ...also being able to determine what weapon other players/bots currently > have deployed (so you know whether to stand and fight or run away). > > Being able to know which weapon and/or ammo pickups are active (i.e. the > weapon/ammo has spawned and can currently be picked up). Being able to > determine if wall chargers are usable or not (have they been used up?). > Being able to determine the state/location of platforms and doors (do > I need to wait for a moving platform/lift or is it already at the > bottom/top?). Being able to detect bullet or explosive projectile > impacts and sounds. Being able to tell when things like flashbang > grenades have exploded so that the bot reacts properly. > > These are just a few of the things that aren't easily accessible via > plugins. Without the plugin system supporting these types of querries, > developing an easy-to-maintain and mod release agnostic plugin bot will > be extremely difficult. > > -- > Jeffrey "botman" Broome > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
Jeremy Swigart wrote: -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] You certainly do need access to a hell of alot more than what the server plugins provide. The properties of the weapon is not in any way part of the problem. It's finding out if the bot has a particular weapon, and then somehow changing to it, not to mention querying the weapon ammo. ...also being able to determine what weapon other players/bots currently have deployed (so you know whether to stand and fight or run away). Being able to know which weapon and/or ammo pickups are active (i.e. the weapon/ammo has spawned and can currently be picked up). Being able to determine if wall chargers are usable or not (have they been used up?). Being able to determine the state/location of platforms and doors (do I need to wait for a moving platform/lift or is it already at the bottom/top?). Being able to detect bullet or explosive projectile impacts and sounds. Being able to tell when things like flashbang grenades have exploded so that the bot reacts properly. These are just a few of the things that aren't easily accessible via plugins. Without the plugin system supporting these types of querries, developing an easy-to-maintain and mod release agnostic plugin bot will be extremely difficult. -- Jeffrey "botman" Broome ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Only things are different when using modcode and not server plugins. The modcode doesn't have these issues... On 8/2/06, Jeremy Swigart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > You certainly do need access to a hell of alot more than what the server > plugins provide. The properties of the weapon is not in any way part of > the > problem. It's finding out if the bot has a particular weapon, and then > somehow changing to it, not to mention querying the weapon ammo. Such > basic > functionality is missing, among other things. Even > IBotController->SetActiveWeapon(const char *) is rather worthless, as it > spawns a weapon for the bot, essentially allowing him to cheat. Not only > that, but calling it too often crashes the game when it runs out of > entities. CBotCmd.weaponselect is useless too, as there is no way to get > the > entity index of a weapon the bot has. If valve were to spend 2 seconds > added > a int IBotController::HasWeapon(const char *), which returns -1 if the bot > doesnt have the weapon, or a valid index otherwise, we'd have something to > feed into weaponselect. We still wouldn't have access to ammo and stuff, > which is very important as well, but it'd still be an improvement. Server > plugin bots are possible with the current system, if you limit them to > like > 1 weapon each time they spawn, or risk the out of entity crashes. These > are > just some of the issues we've been trying to get valve to address for like > a > year now. > > If you want more information, see > http://forums.bots-united.com/showthread.php?t=4026 > > Few people are willing spend time on half-assed bots. > I got HL2DM bots working long ago as well, > http://www.omni-bot.de/e107/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?375 > but it's not very motivating to publically release them with such glaring > flaws. I hope the new SDK guy will finally rectify these issues. > > > On 8/1/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > Are you sure you read my message? The point was that you don't need to > > access memory for information about the weapons at all. Just create a > > config file that describes some properties about the weapons, like > whether > > it's hitscan or projectile etc. > > > > At 2006/07/30 02:12 PM, LDuke wrote: > > >-- > > >[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > >You can access info on weapons and other things needed for bots, but > only > > >with complicated hacks that are often broken when an update is > released. > > It > > >requires scanning memory for the location you need and then calling > that > > >address as a function. > > > > > >That's a lot different than handling your own waypoints, and probably > > isn't > > >worth the effort that needs to be expended everytime a release occurs > for > > >any mod that your bots would be expected to support. > > > > > >Grant > > >(L. Duke) > > > > > > > > >On 7/30/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] < > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >wrote: > > >> > > >> This is a bit of a copout. Yes the Valve APIs don't natively support > > >> weapon introspection, but the Valve APIs don't natively support map > > waypoint > > >> querying either, (nor has any FPS API that I'm aware of) and > > programmers > > >> have had no problems there. They simply stored the extra info they > > needed > > >> in external config files. > > >> > > >> > > >-- > > > > > >___ > > >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > > > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] You certainly do need access to a hell of alot more than what the server plugins provide. The properties of the weapon is not in any way part of the problem. It's finding out if the bot has a particular weapon, and then somehow changing to it, not to mention querying the weapon ammo. Such basic functionality is missing, among other things. Even IBotController->SetActiveWeapon(const char *) is rather worthless, as it spawns a weapon for the bot, essentially allowing him to cheat. Not only that, but calling it too often crashes the game when it runs out of entities. CBotCmd.weaponselect is useless too, as there is no way to get the entity index of a weapon the bot has. If valve were to spend 2 seconds added a int IBotController::HasWeapon(const char *), which returns -1 if the bot doesnt have the weapon, or a valid index otherwise, we'd have something to feed into weaponselect. We still wouldn't have access to ammo and stuff, which is very important as well, but it'd still be an improvement. Server plugin bots are possible with the current system, if you limit them to like 1 weapon each time they spawn, or risk the out of entity crashes. These are just some of the issues we've been trying to get valve to address for like a year now. If you want more information, see http://forums.bots-united.com/showthread.php?t=4026 Few people are willing spend time on half-assed bots. I got HL2DM bots working long ago as well, http://www.omni-bot.de/e107/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?375 but it's not very motivating to publically release them with such glaring flaws. I hope the new SDK guy will finally rectify these issues. On 8/1/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Are you sure you read my message? The point was that you don't need to > access memory for information about the weapons at all. Just create a > config file that describes some properties about the weapons, like whether > it's hitscan or projectile etc. > > At 2006/07/30 02:12 PM, LDuke wrote: > >-- > >[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > >You can access info on weapons and other things needed for bots, but only > >with complicated hacks that are often broken when an update is released. > It > >requires scanning memory for the location you need and then calling that > >address as a function. > > > >That's a lot different than handling your own waypoints, and probably > isn't > >worth the effort that needs to be expended everytime a release occurs for > >any mod that your bots would be expected to support. > > > >Grant > >(L. Duke) > > > > > >On 7/30/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >wrote: > >> > >> This is a bit of a copout. Yes the Valve APIs don't natively support > >> weapon introspection, but the Valve APIs don't natively support map > waypoint > >> querying either, (nor has any FPS API that I'm aware of) and > programmers > >> have had no problems there. They simply stored the extra info they > needed > >> in external config files. > >> > >> > >-- > > > >___ > >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
Are you sure you read my message? The point was that you don't need to access memory for information about the weapons at all. Just create a config file that describes some properties about the weapons, like whether it's hitscan or projectile etc. At 2006/07/30 02:12 PM, LDuke wrote: >-- >[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] >You can access info on weapons and other things needed for bots, but only >with complicated hacks that are often broken when an update is released. It >requires scanning memory for the location you need and then calling that >address as a function. > >That's a lot different than handling your own waypoints, and probably isn't >worth the effort that needs to be expended everytime a release occurs for >any mod that your bots would be expected to support. > >Grant >(L. Duke) > > >On 7/30/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >wrote: >> >> This is a bit of a copout. Yes the Valve APIs don't natively support >> weapon introspection, but the Valve APIs don't natively support map waypoint >> querying either, (nor has any FPS API that I'm aware of) and programmers >> have had no problems there. They simply stored the extra info they needed >> in external config files. >> >> >-- > >___ >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please >visit: >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] You can access info on weapons and other things needed for bots, but only with complicated hacks that are often broken when an update is released. It requires scanning memory for the location you need and then calling that address as a function. That's a lot different than handling your own waypoints, and probably isn't worth the effort that needs to be expended everytime a release occurs for any mod that your bots would be expected to support. Grant (L. Duke) On 7/30/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > This is a bit of a copout. Yes the Valve APIs don't natively support > weapon introspection, but the Valve APIs don't natively support map waypoint > querying either, (nor has any FPS API that I'm aware of) and programmers > have had no problems there. They simply stored the extra info they needed > in external config files. > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
This is a bit of a copout. Yes the Valve APIs don't natively support weapon introspection, but the Valve APIs don't natively support map waypoint querying either, (nor has any FPS API that I'm aware of) and programmers have had no problems there. They simply stored the extra info they needed in external config files. At 2006/07/24 06:50 PM, Jeffrey \"botman\" Broome wrote: >THE STORM wrote: >>Yep, there is! :) >> >>Check out http://www.bots-united.com/ for HPBbot2 and RCBot2. They are >>for HL2DM and their source is public released. > >Just be aware that the HPBbot2 stuff is just a shell that spawns a fake >client and doesn't do much else. > >Since HL2 plugin had very limited support for getting detailed player >and weapon properties, I decided it wasn't pursuing a plug-in bot for >HL2 and mods. > >There was a lengthy discussion about this on the hlcoders email list >about a year ago if you really wanted to dig through the archive on why >it was difficult to create a plugin bot that was fully functional and >easy to maintain. > >-- >Jeffrey "botman" Broome > >___ >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please >visit: >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
THE STORM wrote: Yep, there is! :) Check out http://www.bots-united.com/ for HPBbot2 and RCBot2. They are for HL2DM and their source is public released. Just be aware that the HPBbot2 stuff is just a shell that spawns a fake client and doesn't do much else. Since HL2 plugin had very limited support for getting detailed player and weapon properties, I decided it wasn't pursuing a plug-in bot for HL2 and mods. There was a lengthy discussion about this on the hlcoders email list about a year ago if you really wanted to dig through the archive on why it was difficult to create a plugin bot that was fully functional and easy to maintain. -- Jeffrey "botman" Broome ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] HL2DM bots
Yep, there is! :) Check out http://www.bots-united.com/ for HPBbot2 and RCBot2. They are for HL2DM and their source is public released. Regards, The Storm Robbie Groenewoudt wrote: -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] So far HL2DM hasn't got any working bots, though there are serverplugins that add bots to HL2DM. At the moment I can't really find an open-source plugin that does this but don't think porting the code from a plugin to modcode should be that hard? Does anyone know a good open-source HL2DM bots serverplugin? Robbie -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
[hlcoders] HL2DM bots
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] So far HL2DM hasn't got any working bots, though there are serverplugins that add bots to HL2DM. At the moment I can't really find an open-source plugin that does this but don't think porting the code from a plugin to modcode should be that hard? Does anyone know a good open-source HL2DM bots serverplugin? Robbie -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
