Re: [hlds_linux] hlds_linux Digest, Vol 28, Issue 43
Why on earth is everybody setting their tic to 66? Is something wrong? Or bad drugs? -I've been out of the loop for a week or so. On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 9:20 PM, hlds_linux-requ...@list.valvesoftware.comwrote: Send hlds_linux mailing list submissions to hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to hlds_linux-requ...@list.valvesoftware.com You can reach the person managing the list at hlds_linux-ow...@list.valvesoftware.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of hlds_linux digest... Today's Topics: 1. srcds rate settings (Adam Bogacz) 2. Re: srcds rate settings (Ulrich Block) 3. Re: srcds rate settings (D3vilfish - Simiancage.org) 4. Re: srcds rate settings (D3vilfish - Simiancage.org) 5. OB first Impressions (D3vilfish - Simiancage.org) 6. Testing (Please Disregard) ( adminmob...@vugaming.net ) 7. Re: Testing (Please Disregard) (E3pO) 8. Re: Testing (Please Disregard) (Nathan Nagato) 9. Re: Testing (Please Disregard) (Shane Arnold) 10. Re: Testing (Please Disregard) (Crazy Canucks) -- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 22:05:16 +0200 From: Adam Bogacz adam...@poczta.fm Subject: [hlds_linux] srcds rate settings To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Message-ID: 4c23ba7c.1080...@poczta.fm Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed so with new fixed tickrate how rate settings should look like ? i have this: fps_max 500 sv_minrate 25000 sv_maxrate 25000 sv_maxupdaterate 66 sv_minupdaterate 66 sv_maxcmdrate 66 sv_mincmdrate 66 regards a...@thcc.pl -- Mistrzowski konkurs - wygraj nowoczesny telefon komorkowy! Sprawdz http://linkint.pl/f2745 -- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 22:22:43 +0200 From: Ulrich Block ulbl...@gmx.de Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] srcds rate settings To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Message-ID: 4c23be93.2000...@gmx.de Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed If you are a rude admin that does not care that many people need to adjust their netsettings to their fps/bandwidth yes. If you take in count that the client fps are lower with orangebox and you need to give the users same space to adjust: sv_minrate 15000 sv_maxrate 4 sv_maxupdaterate 66 sv_minupdaterate 40 sv_maxcmdrate 66 sv_mincmdrate 35 Adam Bogacz schrieb: so with new fixed tickrate how rate settings should look like ? i have this: fps_max 500 sv_minrate 25000 sv_maxrate 25000 sv_maxupdaterate 66 sv_minupdaterate 66 sv_maxcmdrate 66 sv_mincmdrate 66 regards a...@thcc.pl -- Mistrzowski konkurs - wygraj nowoczesny telefon komorkowy! Sprawdz http://linkint.pl/f2745 ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux -- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 21:44:31 +0100 From: D3vilfish - Simiancage.org priv...@caterhamhill.net Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] srcds rate settings To: 'Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list' hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Message-ID: 01cb13de$0c7d3230$257796...@net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Everybody I've spoken to so far has the same fps as pre OB, I currently get with vsync off and multi core support on anywhere between 250 to 650 fps my stress test was 381.33fps on a 4890gfx with win7. Anyone getting less than playable fps should be looking at a new pc tbh imho. As for bandwidth I think we all agree rate hacking is worst than wall hacking, why people join servers that they have a bad ping/connection to is their own fault! -Original Message- From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Ulrich Block Sent: 24 June 2010 21:23 To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] srcds rate settings If you are a rude admin that does not care that many people need to adjust their netsettings to their fps/bandwidth yes. If you take in count that the client fps are lower with orangebox and you need to give the users same space to adjust: sv_minrate 15000 sv_maxrate 4 sv_maxupdaterate 66 sv_minupdaterate 40 sv_maxcmdrate 66 sv_mincmdrate 35 Adam Bogacz schrieb: so with new fixed tickrate how
Re: [hlds_linux] Steam Linux client
Use ssh and follow the directions provoided on the site. Don't use wine. On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Steffen Tronstad s...@nextgentel.comwrote: Depends on what you need it for. Just for servers, you can use this: http://storefront.steampowered.com/download/hldsupdatetool.bin (LINUX) If you want to run Steam games, you have to use wine or similar. -Opprinnelig melding- Fra: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] På vegne av Eric Riemers Sendt: 27. oktober 2009 16:44 Til: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list Emne: Re: [hlds_linux] Steam Linux client http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=759734 So its wine time.. First hit on google though.. this is the server mailinglist ;p On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:14:31 -0400, Rusty Bower rbo...@gmail.com wrote: Easy question. Is there a dedicated Linux steam client, or do you have to do everything through wine? Rusty Bower ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Steam Linux client
Rumors huh? Fascinating. :P On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:55 AM, Rusty Bower rbo...@gmail.com wrote: Ya. I was looking for running the games. There are rumors of a Linux client. Just wanted to see if there was any meat to the rumor. Sent from my iPhone Rusty Bower On Oct 27, 2009, at 11:41, Steffen Tronstad s...@nextgentel.com wrote: Depends on what you need it for. Just for servers, you can use this: http://storefront.steampowered.com/download/hldsupdatetool.bin (LINUX) If you want to run Steam games, you have to use wine or similar. -Opprinnelig melding- Fra: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:hlds_linux- boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] På vegne av Eric Riemers Sendt: 27. oktober 2009 16:44 Til: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list Emne: Re: [hlds_linux] Steam Linux client http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=759734 So its wine time.. First hit on google though.. this is the server mailinglist ;p On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:14:31 -0400, Rusty Bower rbo...@gmail.com wrote: Easy question. Is there a dedicated Linux steam client, or do you have to do everything through wine? Rusty Bower ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Steam Linux client
That sounds just as funny as a 10,000fps server lol. On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 12:15 PM, Carl aidsf...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone actually tried running windows srcds in wine on nix? On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Gregg Hanpeter ghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: Rumors huh? Fascinating. :P On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:55 AM, Rusty Bower rbo...@gmail.com wrote: Ya. I was looking for running the games. There are rumors of a Linux client. Just wanted to see if there was any meat to the rumor. Sent from my iPhone Rusty Bower On Oct 27, 2009, at 11:41, Steffen Tronstad s...@nextgentel.com wrote: Depends on what you need it for. Just for servers, you can use this: http://storefront.steampowered.com/download/hldsupdatetool.bin (LINUX) If you want to run Steam games, you have to use wine or similar. -Opprinnelig melding- Fra: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:hlds_linux- boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] På vegne av Eric Riemers Sendt: 27. oktober 2009 16:44 Til: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list Emne: Re: [hlds_linux] Steam Linux client http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=759734 So its wine time.. First hit on google though.. this is the server mailinglist ;p On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:14:31 -0400, Rusty Bower rbo...@gmail.com wrote: Easy question. Is there a dedicated Linux steam client, or do you have to do everything through wine? Rusty Bower ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux -- Sent from my telnet ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Stuck @ Updating Installation
Steam is jacked right now. On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 6:20 PM, Alistair Cockeram h...@imf2000.org wrote: On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 12:28:30PM -0600, Goerge wrote: how much time are you giving it? it seems normal for it to take a few minutes =[ Got there in the end, seemed I just needed to restart a few times. -- Alistair Cockeram ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] HELLO
Spame! On Thu, Oct 15, 2009 at 5:14 AM, Joe Doe titan...@hotmail.com wrote: Find what you love at mall-good.com Dear friend: Thanks for your reading the letter. I hope the information below will be helpful. We did foreign trade for many years all over the world and gained certain market shares and excellent reputation.We are a company selling electronics:mobile.phones,LCDTV., Laptop., Motorcycles., digital.Video,Mp4/Mp3.,GPS.,PS3. We promise excellent quality and challenging price. there will be more surprises are waiting for you. For the family, for the friends, for yourself to choose one best gift, having a memorable experience. If you have valuable time, please visit our Web site. the website: MALL-good.com The contact Email/Msn: mallg...@188.com ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Game Server Manager Needed - Hiring
With many people in need of jobs I see no harm done. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 2:38 PM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: I'd also be smart then to sell dedicated systems and management services on this same mailing list then? Shane Arnold wrote: I'd say Mr Robinett is a pretty smart guy, seeing as he is posting job vacancies on a mailing list that's theoretically packed with Games Administrators of varying skill levels ;) Joseph Laws wrote: No need to attack me or be a prick. Crying about a plugin for a VALVe game is much different than using this mailing list as a job posting board. Its great that you don't mind, I'm sure you wouldn't mind if others on this mailing list added your email addresses to numerous spam lists. If you don't like that, unsubscribe. Mike Zimmermann wrote: The unsubscribe if you don't like it. Thread stops here. -Mike On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: Plugin chat should have its own mailing list, IMO. At least the plugin talk is in some way directly affiliated with VALVe software and updates One person looks for an employee here, another will...and so on and so on. I don't think it should be permitted, VALVe already tried shutting down the mailing list before...turning this into a source for hosting companies to recruit isn't cool. f7 f0rkz wrote: How is any of the off topic shit here not spam? I do recall some SNAFU of a bunch of people crying over a particular plugin for a good month. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: Sorry but the last I checked this listing was for news and discussion about VALVe updates and software...and not for help seeking qualified employees. How is this any different than spam? Mike Zimmermann wrote: cry, one email to a perfectly targeted audience isn't going to break your inbox -Mike On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 10:36 AM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: More like your account should be disabled. This isn't Monster.com brosef. Shane Robinett wrote: Looking for someone who can work remotely and Manage LINUX and WINDOWS based game servers (STEAM based and others). Includes; * Installing of operating systems * Installing of games * Providing community management and responsiveness In additional plus IT skills that allow for remote management of IT infrastructures ranging from windows to linux based. Exchange server, FTP servers, Web services (apache/iis) Please email me direct at sh...@phxx.com - please do not respond on the list! Sorry for the interruption - I am sure I am going to get spammed by you guys for this! Shane Robinett Director of Business Development Phone: 407-687-7752 Fax: 888-558-2921 PHXX http://www.phxx.com/ Technology Solutions for Today's Business www.phxx.com http://www.phxx.com/ __ PHXX Proprietary Portal Framework NEO2 NEO2 has helped Etisalat bringing gaming to the Middle East and Africa. www.phxxgaming.com/marketing_opportunities.php http://www.phxxgaming.com/marketing_opportunities.php Simple-Share Share files simply, easily, and securely with friends - no matter how big the file! www.simple-share.com http://www.phxxgaming.com/marketing_opportunities.php ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.421 / Virus Database: 270.14.8/2425 - Release Date: 10/09/09 08:10:00 ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.421 / Virus Database: 270.14.8/2425 - Release Date: 10/09/09 08:10:00 ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit:
Re: [hlds_linux] Game Server Manager Needed - Hiring
It didn't start out as a pickle. :P On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Crazy Canucks crazy_canu...@rogers.comwrote: In theory this guy isn't selling anything, in fact, he might just have something to offer that some out of work Games Systems Admin might be very interested in. I have no problem with it. I suppose if the list was flooded with help wanted ads, it would be an issue, but seeing as this is the first submission of this sort to this list I have seen in the years that I've been subscribed to this list, I don't think that is going to be a problem. I think a few people need to extract that pickle from their butt and relax a little... Drek Joseph Laws wrote: I'd also be smart then to sell dedicated systems and management services on this same mailing list then? Shane Arnold wrote: I'd say Mr Robinett is a pretty smart guy, seeing as he is posting job vacancies on a mailing list that's theoretically packed with Games Administrators of varying skill levels ;) Joseph Laws wrote: No need to attack me or be a prick. Crying about a plugin for a VALVe game is much different than using this mailing list as a job posting board. Its great that you don't mind, I'm sure you wouldn't mind if others on this mailing list added your email addresses to numerous spam lists. If you don't like that, unsubscribe. Mike Zimmermann wrote: The unsubscribe if you don't like it. Thread stops here. -Mike On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: Plugin chat should have its own mailing list, IMO. At least the plugin talk is in some way directly affiliated with VALVe software and updates One person looks for an employee here, another will...and so on and so on. I don't think it should be permitted, VALVe already tried shutting down the mailing list before...turning this into a source for hosting companies to recruit isn't cool. f7 f0rkz wrote: How is any of the off topic shit here not spam? I do recall some SNAFU of a bunch of people crying over a particular plugin for a good month. On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: Sorry but the last I checked this listing was for news and discussion about VALVe updates and software...and not for help seeking qualified employees. How is this any different than spam? Mike Zimmermann wrote: cry, one email to a perfectly targeted audience isn't going to break your inbox -Mike On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 10:36 AM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: More like your account should be disabled. This isn't Monster.com brosef. Shane Robinett wrote: Looking for someone who can work remotely and Manage LINUX and WINDOWS based game servers (STEAM based and others). Includes; * Installing of operating systems * Installing of games * Providing community management and responsiveness In additional plus IT skills that allow for remote management of IT infrastructures ranging from windows to linux based. Exchange server, FTP servers, Web services (apache/iis) Please email me direct at sh...@phxx.com - please do not respond on the list! Sorry for the interruption - I am sure I am going to get spammed by you guys for this! Shane Robinett Director of Business Development Phone: 407-687-7752 Fax: 888-558-2921 PHXX http://www.phxx.com/ Technology Solutions for Today's Business www.phxx.com http://www.phxx.com/ __ PHXX Proprietary Portal Framework NEO2 NEO2 has helped Etisalat bringing gaming to the Middle East and Africa. www.phxxgaming.com/marketing_opportunities.php http://www.phxxgaming.com/marketing_opportunities.php Simple-Share Share files simply, easily, and securely with friends - no matter how big the file! www.simple-share.com http://www.phxxgaming.com/marketing_opportunities.php ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.421 / Virus Database: 270.14.8/2425 - Release Date: 10/09/09 08:10:00 ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Retrieve tickrate / serverfps
You need to type rcon stats 2009/10/6 Björn GRYZOR Rohlén gry...@gmail.com I already discussed this with Anakin and found out there is no solution to this. Thanks anyway. -The G ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] CS:S Error verifying STEAM UserID Ticket
I also see that every once in awhile. I usually restart Steam and it goes away most of the time. Its kinda like a system hickup. On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 4:23 PM, ics i...@ics-base.net wrote: Seen this a lot in the past. Usually if there isn't anything major going on at Steam, like some master server being down or moved, the problem usually lies on the gameserver itself. I've seen issues where i am able to enter 10 different servers but 1 keeps rejecting me. In this case, the server has some old master servers in it's blob's or something. Deleting those and doing server update will propably fix it. -ics David A. Parker kirjoitti: Hello, Yesterday, I tried joining a game on our CS:S server and kept getting the message Error verifying STEAM UserID Ticket. I deleted the ClientRegistry.blob file on my client and restarted Steam a few times, but it did not help. There were 12 players on the server, but there were several other people who could not connect for the same reason. It seemed to be pretty hit-or-miss as far as people being able to join the server. Some people got in without any problems, and others (like me) got this error every time and were never able to join. The server is fully updated. Does anyone have any ideas about why this error would be popping up, and what I can do to resolve it? Thanks, Dave ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] CP for Servers
Take a look at this: http://www.swiftpanel.com/ -Never tried it but I heard good things at WHT. -G On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 3:02 PM, -=Acid=Rain=- acidr...@acidrain.com.brwrote: Hi there guys, Is there any CP for dedicated servers running on linux, good like TCADMIN for Windows? Thanks! Rodrigo Acid Rain Kroehn -=Acid=Rain=- Games www.acidrain.com.br ___ AVISO LEGAL: Esta mensagem e arquivo(s) podem conter informações confidenciais e/ou legalmente protegidas. Caso tenha recebido por engano, favor devolvê-la ao remetente e eliminá-la do seu sistema, não divulgando ou utilizando a totalidade ou parte desta mensagem ou dos documentos a ela anexados. LEGAL NOTICE: This message and attached document(s) may contain information of confidential nature and/or legally protected. If you have received this message by mistake, please reply to the sender, eliminate it from your system and do not disclose or use this message or the attached documents, in whole or in part. _ ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
Hee-effin-Haw! On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 8:50 AM, Crazy Canucks crazy_canu...@rogers.comwrote: I blink in 201 ms because I have sli for my eyelids, and I overclocked my lower cortex! 250mhz baby! Completely off track, I know... Guy Watkins wrote: I can blink my eyes in 299 ms. I blink quickly because I am afraid of the dark! :) } -Original Message- } From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:hlds_linux- } boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Eric Greer } Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 11:58 PM } To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list } Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers? } } I recently had a guy complain about ping from Chicago to Montreal. } His ping was 30 and he proclaimed his internet was 'badass' and he } pings 80 to china so my servers had a problem. } } I explained exactly how the internet works but he insisted my server } had issues. I further explained it takes 300ms to blink your eye. } They named their clan '300ms or FAIL' and dedicated it to hating me } :-) } } I feel honored :-) } } Eric } } } } On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 7:55 PM, Gregg Hanpeterghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: } On a side note, whenever anyone complains about bad registration I } usually } ask them for a traceroute and most often that player is shitty at the } moment. But anyways, with the many seasons I have spent in cal and cevo, } I } know a cruddy server when I join it, especially when the ip begins with } an 8 } (hehe). } } On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Gregg Hanpeter ghanpe...@gmail.com } wrote: } } Yes, I probably would if there were 9 other players in the server.. But } you } have to keep in mind that I am on comcast and they blow. More often } than not } I blame the isp or anyone that is located in giganet. } } } } } On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 2:25 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: } } I think servers above 350 FPS are just one of those What the customer } wants, the customer gets things. } } Do you think you would notice a difference with tick rate at 100 and } FPS over 350 Gregg? } } Eric } } } } On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Gregg Hanpeterghanpe...@gmail.com } wrote: } I would be complaining. I hate cruddy registry. If you take this } discussion } to CEVO forums you would get a lot of negative opinions to low fps } rates. } Sure the average joe won't notice but I sure would. } } On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Ulrich Block ulbl...@gmx.de wrote: } } Stcok fps ist ~245 even if the value is set to fps_max 300 ^^ And } no } our } players didnt even realise setting that i set fps_max to 75 @ tick } 66. } I was just curious if they would realise and they did not... } } Eric Greer schrieb: }I was reading about 'if its really worth it' today. }Apparently 500 FPS servers add 2ms of delay while 1000 FPS } servers } add } 1ms }delay. Also, 2000 FPS adds only .5ms. } }Considering it takes the human being 300ms to blink his eye, and } i } can do }that while typing accurately... talking about anything over } 350fps } literally }becomes trivial. Include in tick rates deprecating this math and } you're }literally down to nothing more than the CPU calculating the same } crap } over }and over and over. } }The most important thing is tick rate. In my opinion, if a blind } study } was }done NOBODY would be able to accurately tell the difference } between a } 100 }tick 350fps server compared to anything higher - ever. } }But that never stopped people from selling what the public wants } to } pay } for }:-). Plus, the amount of placebo effect involved with 'pro' PC } gamers is } so }intense I have a hard time comprehending it. Simply telling } them } they've }switched to a 1000 FPS server should make them rave about how } great } it } is. } The only REAL difference is what number comes up in tests. } }I'm sure gamers will never believe this and you'll find lines of } people }waiting to tell you that they can see the difference between 350, } 500, } 1000 }and 2000 FPS servers. *sigh* } }Eric } } }On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Daniel Nilsson } daniel.joki...@gmail.com } wrote: } } }It´s very true that many do not see the difference from } different }ticrates. Mainly because thare are no big difference (Especialy } from } 66 }to 100). Now several of you will protest. But the most important } is } the }following } }1. The fps must in must be stable. } }2. The box must have an stabile networking to avoid changes in } packages
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
I would be complaining. I hate cruddy registry. If you take this discussion to CEVO forums you would get a lot of negative opinions to low fps rates. Sure the average joe won't notice but I sure would. On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Ulrich Block ulbl...@gmx.de wrote: Stcok fps ist ~245 even if the value is set to fps_max 300 ^^ And no our players didnt even realise setting that i set fps_max to 75 @ tick 66. I was just curious if they would realise and they did not... Eric Greer schrieb: I was reading about 'if its really worth it' today. Apparently 500 FPS servers add 2ms of delay while 1000 FPS servers add 1ms delay. Also, 2000 FPS adds only .5ms. Considering it takes the human being 300ms to blink his eye, and i can do that while typing accurately... talking about anything over 350fps literally becomes trivial. Include in tick rates deprecating this math and you're literally down to nothing more than the CPU calculating the same crap over and over and over. The most important thing is tick rate. In my opinion, if a blind study was done NOBODY would be able to accurately tell the difference between a 100 tick 350fps server compared to anything higher - ever. But that never stopped people from selling what the public wants to pay for :-). Plus, the amount of placebo effect involved with 'pro' PC gamers is so intense I have a hard time comprehending it. Simply telling them they've switched to a 1000 FPS server should make them rave about how great it is. The only REAL difference is what number comes up in tests. I'm sure gamers will never believe this and you'll find lines of people waiting to tell you that they can see the difference between 350, 500, 1000 and 2000 FPS servers. *sigh* Eric On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Daniel Nilsson daniel.joki...@gmail.com wrote: It´s very true that many do not see the difference from different ticrates. Mainly because thare are no big difference (Especialy from 66 to 100). Now several of you will protest. But the most important is the following 1. The fps must in must be stable. 2. The box must have an stabile networking to avoid changes in packages sent and recived. This part i have noticed on my own when playing online. Playing on a server for 5-10 min... hitting nothing. Take an look at the in and out on the netgraph and voila. They drop from 60 to 40, up to 50 and so on. Swithces to an more stable server and suddenly i hit everything, almost. But the funny part imo is that is it unstable for everyone or youst me because of my isp peering to that server isp or is it the same for everyone on that server. If it is the latest part. Why does some hit on those servers at all. //Daniel Ulrich Block skrev: Same here. The most players can not even notice if they are playing on tick 33, 66 or even 100. Remember the valve defaults ar updaterate 20 cmdrate 30. Many of the players out there do not know to alter this cvars, so that they can not notice the tick I run some public Servers at tick 33 with fps_max 300 and nobody ever complained about bad hit registration. The 1000fps thing is only for the wannabe pro players that are not able to say its their fault they died. Besides there are no real 1000fps only values close to that number like 950-990 fps. But again nobody will notice the difference between 500 and 1000fps Servers. Maybe some players from 250 to 500... What i noticed is the fact, that the ping is slightly reduced when running at higher fps. Ferenc Kovacs schrieb: If you was fine before you heard about the 1000fps thing, I think you shouldnt bother. The difference between stable ~250 and 1000 fps is almost zero from the players perspective, but requires higher cpu cost, so you can have fewer server on the same box. just my 2c Tyrael On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 2:15 PM, Nevermoreneverm...@pheek.net wrote: Very insteresting thread! I run a lot of servers in the same box with stock debian kernel. Wich optimization is suitable for me? Thank you all! ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4402 (20090907) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
Yes, I probably would if there were 9 other players in the server.. But you have to keep in mind that I am on comcast and they blow. More often than not I blame the isp or anyone that is located in giganet. On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 2:25 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: I think servers above 350 FPS are just one of those What the customer wants, the customer gets things. Do you think you would notice a difference with tick rate at 100 and FPS over 350 Gregg? Eric On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Gregg Hanpeterghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: I would be complaining. I hate cruddy registry. If you take this discussion to CEVO forums you would get a lot of negative opinions to low fps rates. Sure the average joe won't notice but I sure would. On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Ulrich Block ulbl...@gmx.de wrote: Stcok fps ist ~245 even if the value is set to fps_max 300 ^^ And no our players didnt even realise setting that i set fps_max to 75 @ tick 66. I was just curious if they would realise and they did not... Eric Greer schrieb: I was reading about 'if its really worth it' today. Apparently 500 FPS servers add 2ms of delay while 1000 FPS servers add 1ms delay. Also, 2000 FPS adds only .5ms. Considering it takes the human being 300ms to blink his eye, and i can do that while typing accurately... talking about anything over 350fps literally becomes trivial. Include in tick rates deprecating this math and you're literally down to nothing more than the CPU calculating the same crap over and over and over. The most important thing is tick rate. In my opinion, if a blind study was done NOBODY would be able to accurately tell the difference between a 100 tick 350fps server compared to anything higher - ever. But that never stopped people from selling what the public wants to pay for :-). Plus, the amount of placebo effect involved with 'pro' PC gamers is so intense I have a hard time comprehending it. Simply telling them they've switched to a 1000 FPS server should make them rave about how great it is. The only REAL difference is what number comes up in tests. I'm sure gamers will never believe this and you'll find lines of people waiting to tell you that they can see the difference between 350, 500, 1000 and 2000 FPS servers. *sigh* Eric On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Daniel Nilsson daniel.joki...@gmail.com wrote: It´s very true that many do not see the difference from different ticrates. Mainly because thare are no big difference (Especialy from 66 to 100). Now several of you will protest. But the most important is the following 1. The fps must in must be stable. 2. The box must have an stabile networking to avoid changes in packages sent and recived. This part i have noticed on my own when playing online. Playing on a server for 5-10 min... hitting nothing. Take an look at the in and out on the netgraph and voila. They drop from 60 to 40, up to 50 and so on. Swithces to an more stable server and suddenly i hit everything, almost. But the funny part imo is that is it unstable for everyone or youst me because of my isp peering to that server isp or is it the same for everyone on that server. If it is the latest part. Why does some hit on those servers at all. //Daniel Ulrich Block skrev: Same here. The most players can not even notice if they are playing on tick 33, 66 or even 100. Remember the valve defaults ar updaterate 20 cmdrate 30. Many of the players out there do not know to alter this cvars, so that they can not notice the tick I run some public Servers at tick 33 with fps_max 300 and nobody ever complained about bad hit registration. The 1000fps thing is only for the wannabe pro players that are not able to say its their fault they died. Besides there are no real 1000fps only values close to that number like 950-990 fps. But again nobody will notice the difference between 500 and 1000fps Servers. Maybe some players from 250 to 500... What i noticed is the fact, that the ping is slightly reduced when running at higher fps. Ferenc Kovacs schrieb: If you was fine before you heard about the 1000fps thing, I think you shouldnt bother. The difference between stable ~250 and 1000 fps is almost zero from the players perspective, but requires higher cpu cost, so you can have fewer server on the same box. just my 2c Tyrael On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 2:15 PM, Nevermoreneverm...@pheek.net wrote: Very insteresting thread! I run a lot of servers in the same box with stock debian kernel. Wich optimization is suitable for me? Thank you all! ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
On a side note, whenever anyone complains about bad registration I usually ask them for a traceroute and most often that player is shitty at the moment. But anyways, with the many seasons I have spent in cal and cevo, I know a cruddy server when I join it, especially when the ip begins with an 8 (hehe). On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Gregg Hanpeter ghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, I probably would if there were 9 other players in the server.. But you have to keep in mind that I am on comcast and they blow. More often than not I blame the isp or anyone that is located in giganet. On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 2:25 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: I think servers above 350 FPS are just one of those What the customer wants, the customer gets things. Do you think you would notice a difference with tick rate at 100 and FPS over 350 Gregg? Eric On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Gregg Hanpeterghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: I would be complaining. I hate cruddy registry. If you take this discussion to CEVO forums you would get a lot of negative opinions to low fps rates. Sure the average joe won't notice but I sure would. On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Ulrich Block ulbl...@gmx.de wrote: Stcok fps ist ~245 even if the value is set to fps_max 300 ^^ And no our players didnt even realise setting that i set fps_max to 75 @ tick 66. I was just curious if they would realise and they did not... Eric Greer schrieb: I was reading about 'if its really worth it' today. Apparently 500 FPS servers add 2ms of delay while 1000 FPS servers add 1ms delay. Also, 2000 FPS adds only .5ms. Considering it takes the human being 300ms to blink his eye, and i can do that while typing accurately... talking about anything over 350fps literally becomes trivial. Include in tick rates deprecating this math and you're literally down to nothing more than the CPU calculating the same crap over and over and over. The most important thing is tick rate. In my opinion, if a blind study was done NOBODY would be able to accurately tell the difference between a 100 tick 350fps server compared to anything higher - ever. But that never stopped people from selling what the public wants to pay for :-). Plus, the amount of placebo effect involved with 'pro' PC gamers is so intense I have a hard time comprehending it. Simply telling them they've switched to a 1000 FPS server should make them rave about how great it is. The only REAL difference is what number comes up in tests. I'm sure gamers will never believe this and you'll find lines of people waiting to tell you that they can see the difference between 350, 500, 1000 and 2000 FPS servers. *sigh* Eric On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Daniel Nilsson daniel.joki...@gmail.com wrote: It´s very true that many do not see the difference from different ticrates. Mainly because thare are no big difference (Especialy from 66 to 100). Now several of you will protest. But the most important is the following 1. The fps must in must be stable. 2. The box must have an stabile networking to avoid changes in packages sent and recived. This part i have noticed on my own when playing online. Playing on a server for 5-10 min... hitting nothing. Take an look at the in and out on the netgraph and voila. They drop from 60 to 40, up to 50 and so on. Swithces to an more stable server and suddenly i hit everything, almost. But the funny part imo is that is it unstable for everyone or youst me because of my isp peering to that server isp or is it the same for everyone on that server. If it is the latest part. Why does some hit on those servers at all. //Daniel Ulrich Block skrev: Same here. The most players can not even notice if they are playing on tick 33, 66 or even 100. Remember the valve defaults ar updaterate 20 cmdrate 30. Many of the players out there do not know to alter this cvars, so that they can not notice the tick I run some public Servers at tick 33 with fps_max 300 and nobody ever complained about bad hit registration. The 1000fps thing is only for the wannabe pro players that are not able to say its their fault they died. Besides there are no real 1000fps only values close to that number like 950-990 fps. But again nobody will notice the difference between 500 and 1000fps Servers. Maybe some players from 250 to 500... What i noticed is the fact, that the ping is slightly reduced when running at higher fps. Ferenc Kovacs schrieb: If you was fine before you heard about the 1000fps thing, I think you shouldnt bother. The difference between stable ~250 and 1000 fps is almost zero from the players perspective, but requires higher cpu cost, so you can have fewer server on the same box
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
It sounds to me like he might be crazy, but I can have good latency to a server but have bad registration. 30 ping and he has problems? That is most likely his problem. That is why I always blame the connection. When you look at it realistically, these sorts of rates are at most only consistent in a lan based environment. Even though I argue your point for you in a way, I can still feel it. I know when I'm playing on a shit server. Cruddy peering,cruddy routing from isp's, and bad connections. I don't want to get into all that. There are too many variables on he user's end. I run my servers via Debian. I made my own kernel and trimmed all the phat from it. Currently it is rt but have heard that I am better off not using that so I am going to try it without it. All I need is consistency and I'm happy.. cheers, Gregg On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 11:58 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: I recently had a guy complain about ping from Chicago to Montreal. His ping was 30 and he proclaimed his internet was 'badass' and he pings 80 to china so my servers had a problem. I explained exactly how the internet works but he insisted my server had issues. I further explained it takes 300ms to blink your eye. They named their clan '300ms or FAIL' and dedicated it to hating me :-) I feel honored :-) Eric On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 7:55 PM, Gregg Hanpeterghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: On a side note, whenever anyone complains about bad registration I usually ask them for a traceroute and most often that player is shitty at the moment. But anyways, with the many seasons I have spent in cal and cevo, I know a cruddy server when I join it, especially when the ip begins with an 8 (hehe). On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Gregg Hanpeter ghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, I probably would if there were 9 other players in the server.. But you have to keep in mind that I am on comcast and they blow. More often than not I blame the isp or anyone that is located in giganet. On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 2:25 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: I think servers above 350 FPS are just one of those What the customer wants, the customer gets things. Do you think you would notice a difference with tick rate at 100 and FPS over 350 Gregg? Eric On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Gregg Hanpeterghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: I would be complaining. I hate cruddy registry. If you take this discussion to CEVO forums you would get a lot of negative opinions to low fps rates. Sure the average joe won't notice but I sure would. On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Ulrich Block ulbl...@gmx.de wrote: Stcok fps ist ~245 even if the value is set to fps_max 300 ^^ And no our players didnt even realise setting that i set fps_max to 75 @ tick 66. I was just curious if they would realise and they did not... Eric Greer schrieb: I was reading about 'if its really worth it' today. Apparently 500 FPS servers add 2ms of delay while 1000 FPS servers add 1ms delay. Also, 2000 FPS adds only .5ms. Considering it takes the human being 300ms to blink his eye, and i can do that while typing accurately... talking about anything over 350fps literally becomes trivial. Include in tick rates deprecating this math and you're literally down to nothing more than the CPU calculating the same crap over and over and over. The most important thing is tick rate. In my opinion, if a blind study was done NOBODY would be able to accurately tell the difference between a 100 tick 350fps server compared to anything higher - ever. But that never stopped people from selling what the public wants to pay for :-). Plus, the amount of placebo effect involved with 'pro' PC gamers is so intense I have a hard time comprehending it. Simply telling them they've switched to a 1000 FPS server should make them rave about how great it is. The only REAL difference is what number comes up in tests. I'm sure gamers will never believe this and you'll find lines of people waiting to tell you that they can see the difference between 350, 500, 1000 and 2000 FPS servers. *sigh* Eric On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Daniel Nilsson daniel.joki...@gmail.com wrote: It´s very true that many do not see the difference from different ticrates. Mainly because thare are no big difference (Especialy from 66 to 100). Now several of you will protest. But the most important is the following 1. The fps must in must be stable. 2. The box must have an stabile networking to avoid changes in packages sent and recived. This part i have noticed on my own when playing online. Playing on a server for 5-10 min... hitting nothing. Take an look at the in and out on the netgraph and voila. They drop from 60
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
So what is the secret to achieving 2000 fps if I dump the real time patch? I've never tried this but am now thinking about it. -- On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 9:50 AM, Joseph Laws jl...@hd-gaming.com wrote: I've never cared for the RT patches...but the hi-res timers pre 2.6.24 are very solid. John wrote: You need high res timers (HPET), on a newer kernel (2.6.24) -M I hated that kernel version. I'm running 2.6.26.5-rt8. And even with hpet enabled you still want the higher kernel frequency wouldn't you? I think Gary meant that you'd need a 2.6.24 or later kernel. HPET and hrtimers are a rather new addition to Linux. If you run something beyond 2.6.26 or so, make sure to also flag the server as a real-time process to remove the kernel's built-in SCHED_OTHER timer slack, which defaults to 50 usec and makes the FPS a bit less stable. This can be done with the chrt utility. With high resolution timers enabled, your machine doesn't need to run at 1000hz, because processes will be woken up at the right times regardless. In fact, a lower hz rate like 100 generally works out better; the lower number leads to less flipping of processes between CPUs, fewer unnecessary context switches to the kernel, etc. The only real advantage to a high hz might be in more accurate process accounting. In my testing, the -rt kernel patchset led to an overall reduction in performance, due to the additional context switching. YMMV. -John ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.77/2346 - Release Date: 09/04/09 17:51:00 ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
I've never done it on centos, only debian but it is all pretty much the same. I would google compile a kernel the centos way. Read very thoroughly for kernel panics suck real bad if you don't have kvm. Once you read the walkthrough's I would actually recommend using make oldconfig. Then when you make menuconfig you can just change the kernel frequency. I have heard mixed opinions about real time kernels but I use one and it is good for me. Take a look into those as well. -G On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 11:17 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: This goes to you too, Jason :-D So I've recently had some trouble getting CentOS to run 1000 FPS servers. I read online people seem to think you need a custom kernel compile to make this happen. What kind of adjustments need to be made and what settings must be in the config or command line to make this feat possible? Thanks everyone, Eric ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
On a side note I have heard that some flavors of Linux come stock with 1000hz kernels but I am not sure of which. You kernel is probably at 250hz I assume. How people achieve 2000-4000 fps is beyond me. -G On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 11:30 PM, Gregg Hanpeter ghanpe...@gmail.com wrote: I've never done it on centos, only debian but it is all pretty much the same. I would google compile a kernel the centos way. Read very thoroughly for kernel panics suck real bad if you don't have kvm. Once you read the walkthrough's I would actually recommend using make oldconfig. Then when you make menuconfig you can just change the kernel frequency. I have heard mixed opinions about real time kernels but I use one and it is good for me. Take a look into those as well. -G On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 11:17 PM, Eric Greer e...@hostedd.com wrote: This goes to you too, Jason :-D So I've recently had some trouble getting CentOS to run 1000 FPS servers. I read online people seem to think you need a custom kernel compile to make this happen. What kind of adjustments need to be made and what settings must be in the config or command line to make this feat possible? Thanks everyone, Eric ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] 1000 FPS CentOS Servers?
I hated that kernel version. I'm running 2.6.26.5-rt8. And even with hpet enabled you still want the higher kernel frequency wouldn't you? -G On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 11:31 PM, Gary Stanley g...@velocity-servers.netwrote: At 11:17 PM 9/4/2009, Eric Greer wrote: This goes to you too, Jason :-D So I've recently had some trouble getting CentOS to run 1000 FPS servers. I read online people seem to think you need a custom kernel compile to make this happen. What kind of adjustments need to be made and what settings must be in the config or command line to make this feat possible? Thanks everyone, Eric You need high res timers (HPET), on a newer kernel (2.6.24) -M ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
