Re: [homenet] Servers in the home are not a crime
Misguided. -Original Message- From: Mark Andrews Date: Sunday, February 24, 2013 12:21 PM To: Michael Thomas Cc: John Jason Brzozowski , Michael Richardson , Mark Townsley , Dave Taht , Jari Arkko , Ted Lemon , "homenet@ietf.org Group" , David Lamparter , Lorenzo Colitti Subject: Re: [homenet] Servers in the home are not a crime > >In message <512958cb.8000...@mtcc.com>, Michael Thomas writes: >> Brzozowski, John wrote: >> >> The other use case for frequent renumbering is an ISP who wants to >> >> prevent the customer from setting up servers. The washing machine >>is a >> >> server. Either the ISP succeeds, or fails, but in either case, >>they are >> >> acting directly against the customer's wishes. >> >> > [jjmb] are a customer is violating their usage agreement with the ISP. >> >> >> Is there any way this working group can make a statement that my >>washing mach >> ine, >> home cameras, DVR, hot tub, thermostat, and light sockets, etc, etc, >>etc are >> not TOS-worth scofflaws, and that ISP should come up with some 21st >>century w >> ay of >> describing abusive behaviour for their customers rather than relying on >>detec >> tion of >> the heinous crime of listen(2)? > >Actually ISP's that renumber their customers regularly are performing >a DoS on their customers which actually may be illegal rather than >just a contract violation as they are deliberately breaking existing >connections. I've seen software updates take longer than a hour >to download. They also can't in good faith be said to be delivering >the Internet. They generally have to break protocol default behaviors >and write specialised servers to get this broken behaviour. There >is a expectation that when you renew a lease that you will get the >same address unless it is a exceptional circumstance. > >> Mike >> ___ >> homenet mailing list >> homenet@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet >-- >Mark Andrews, ISC >1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia >PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: ma...@isc.org ___ homenet mailing list homenet@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet
Re: [homenet] Servers in the home are not a crime
In message <512958cb.8000...@mtcc.com>, Michael Thomas writes: > Brzozowski, John wrote: > >> The other use case for frequent renumbering is an ISP who wants to > >> prevent the customer from setting up servers. The washing machine is a > >> server. Either the ISP succeeds, or fails, but in either case, they are > >> acting directly against the customer's wishes. > > > [jjmb] are a customer is violating their usage agreement with the ISP. > > > Is there any way this working group can make a statement that my washing mach > ine, > home cameras, DVR, hot tub, thermostat, and light sockets, etc, etc, etc are > not TOS-worth scofflaws, and that ISP should come up with some 21st century w > ay of > describing abusive behaviour for their customers rather than relying on detec > tion of > the heinous crime of listen(2)? Actually ISP's that renumber their customers regularly are performing a DoS on their customers which actually may be illegal rather than just a contract violation as they are deliberately breaking existing connections. I've seen software updates take longer than a hour to download. They also can't in good faith be said to be delivering the Internet. They generally have to break protocol default behaviors and write specialised servers to get this broken behaviour. There is a expectation that when you renew a lease that you will get the same address unless it is a exceptional circumstance. > Mike > ___ > homenet mailing list > homenet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet -- Mark Andrews, ISC 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: ma...@isc.org ___ homenet mailing list homenet@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet
[homenet] Servers in the home are not a crime
Brzozowski, John wrote: The other use case for frequent renumbering is an ISP who wants to prevent the customer from setting up servers. The washing machine is a server. Either the ISP succeeds, or fails, but in either case, they are acting directly against the customer's wishes. [jjmb] are a customer is violating their usage agreement with the ISP. Is there any way this working group can make a statement that my washing machine, home cameras, DVR, hot tub, thermostat, and light sockets, etc, etc, etc are not TOS-worth scofflaws, and that ISP should come up with some 21st century way of describing abusive behaviour for their customers rather than relying on detection of the heinous crime of listen(2)? Mike ___ homenet mailing list homenet@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet
