RE: [Hornlist] What is a "compensating double horn?"
A double horn has two separate sets of valve slides. If the shorter tube is used (Bb horn, thumb valve pressed), the lower set (shorter) of valve slides is in use. If the F-extension is added (thumb valve released), the longer (upper) set of valve slides comes into action. A compensating double has one set of valve slides on the upper side. This set is used for the Bb horn. The lower set of slides is just the extra length to be added to each slide when playing on the F side. In this case the air will flow through both sets of slides. A compensating double has less weight, but more bends of the air flow. = -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Freides Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2004 3:57 AM To: 'The Horn List' Subject: [Hornlist] What is a "compensating double horn?" I've been poking around the Internet, reading lots, and see this expression. What is a "compensating double" horn as compared to a normal F/B-flat double horn? Seems to be some sort of student thing. (Today's activity for this self-teaching hornist was to play the main theme from Dvorak's New World Symphoy, the Largo movement, in concert F and concert G. The concert G - written 4th line D - is currently the highest note I can play and even then only fitfully. Great fun, though - the passage sounds lovely on the horn and, for reasons I can't explain, sounds much nicer in concert G than in concert F.) Thanks for listening to me ramble. -S- ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] oil addict
Hello Paul, all these recommended methods work more or less. But that´s not the problem. The problem is the carelessness of the end user of the instruments, so to speak the PLAYER. If they insert just a few droppings of oil carefully, there will be no wash down of slide grease. If they would use rotor & spindle oil carefully & inside clean the instrument from time to time & if they would also care not to play with their mouth still full of meals or candies, we had not to discuss such simple things. I think, we - we all, all the society - have reached a point, where common understandings of the things & the mechanic are down , completely down. It seems, that a majority has never learned or forgotten already, that we have got a brain to use. We ask & discuss. If there is another opinion, which does not please us (e.g. asking for self discipline), we oppose. If we all would use our brain, we would not commit all these silly actions in all fields of life. We exaggerate, we condemn, instead forgiving or understanding or action carefully. Are we so spoiled by all these super idiotic commercials & their ballyhoo ??? Like: put the nail between thumb & forefinger of the left hand, haha, point the nails point against the wall,- got it ? -, get the hammer into your right hand, - you too madam-, holding it at the grip firmly, wow, hammer against the head of the nail until the nail sticks in the wall, splash , applaus. Are we that like ? Really ? . The industry seems to think so -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2004 3:38 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Hornlist] oil addict In a message dated 10/12/04 2:59:28 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Would it be better to oil through a male tube? > Using this manner of oiling, it is possible to get extraneous slide grease or other matter into the valves from the crook attached to the slide tube-especially if there is any corrosion in the slide crook. I have found for my own use, and I always recommend to my clients that they find an eyedropper bottle to use. First remove the slide and with a few drops of oil in the dropper, place it all of the way into the outer slide tube, then squirt the oil directly onto the rotor. This method seems to avoid the problems you are discussing. Paul Navarro ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] oil addict
On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> if the nervous condition makes the hands shaking, how about using an
> anti vibration device while playing ?
Like quicksand?
{ David Goldberg: [EMAIL PROTECTED] }
{ Math Dept, Washtenaw Community College }
{ Ann Arbor Michigan }
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RE: [Hornlist] oil addict
Perfect answer. But to 2nd paragraph: if the nervous condition makes the hands shaking, how about using an anti vibration device while playing ? == -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Houston Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 11:09 PM To: The Horn List Subject: Re: [Hornlist] oil addict It's really an exaggerated problem, for most folks. All you need to do is hold the horn so that the valve slides are pointing upward, and carefully allow a couple drops of oil to fall down their middles. It really isn't hard to do, normally. If a nervous condition makes that impossible, then there are other options that were already mentioned. But for an individual with nominally steady hands, and a fair understanding of where "up" is, it's no trick at all to hit the rotors and miss the tubing walls - every time. From: "rjackallen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Hornlist] oil addict > Why not introduce oil to the rotors (if you must) through a plastic > soda straw being careful not to scrape stuff from the inside of the tubes? ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] New to french horn....info needed
Samantha: OK, here are some good mouthpiece (IMHO) recommendations which are cheap which have worked well in my horn studio: Holton/Farkas MC, MDC, or DC. (M stands for medium, D for deep, c for cup...you do the math:) Your needs could vary depending on your personnal setup. Schilke 31C2 (bigger diameter) Schilke 27 (smaller diameter) Both nice mouthpieces with nice rims. I know of two american "AA" orchestra principal horns who use the Schilke 27. At websites such as mouthpieceexpress.com or music123, these should be under 50$. There are others which work just as well - doubtless someone on this list will mention them as well. My opinions: -don't get a mouthpiece with an overly wide rim. The horn mouthpiece rim will feel very narrow compared to your trumpet mouthpiece. Thicker rims tend to impede flexibility on horn. Remember, the trumpet is a 2 1/3 octave brass instrument. The horn has 4 octaves to navigate! Register shifting is more of an issue with us. -don't get a mouthpiece with a small bore. Coming from trumpet, you're likely to already have some work ahead of you in "darkening" the sound. A medium-large bore mouthpiece will help here. -DO get a private teacher to help you. If there is a lack of willing/able private instructors near you, see if you can find a college horn major, preferable a junior or senior, perhaps a grad student. Many public school music teachers are (quite rightly, sometimes) intimidated by the horn and don't have the free time to help you. You'll make a lot more progress even if you can take a lesson every other week from someone who can actually demonstrate what to do in person. My Advice, Worth what you paid for it (but backed up by my all-staters!) Scott --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Hello.. I am a junior in high school and I have > decided to switch to > french horn b/c we dont have any f-horn > players..I need help w/gettin a > mouthpieceI dont know wut type to > get.since there are a LOT of > types..each brand differentlyI cant > spend more than $50...I > have been playing trumpet for like 5 yrs. so i dont > need a beginners > mouthpiece.I play mellophone in the marching > band but we use trumpet > mouthpieces and we are getting into christmas > concert music now. >please help > >Samantha > > ___ > post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hornhog%40yahoo.com > ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] New to french horn....info needed
Hello.. I am a junior in high school and I have decided to switch to french horn b/c we dont have any f-horn players..I need help w/gettin a mouthpieceI dont know wut type to get.since there are a LOT of types..each brand differentlyI cant spend more than $50...I have been playing trumpet for like 5 yrs. so i dont need a beginners mouthpiece.I play mellophone in the marching band but we use trumpet mouthpieces and we are getting into christmas concert music now. please help Samantha ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] What is a "compensating double horn?"
I've been poking around the Internet, reading lots, and see this expression. What is a "compensating double" horn as compared to a normal F/B-flat double horn? Seems to be some sort of student thing. (Today's activity for this self-teaching hornist was to play the main theme from Dvorak's New World Symphoy, the Largo movement, in concert F and concert G. The concert G - written 4th line D - is currently the highest note I can play and even then only fitfully. Great fun, though - the passage sounds lovely on the horn and, for reasons I can't explain, sounds much nicer in concert G than in concert F.) Thanks for listening to me ramble. -S- ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
In a message dated 10/12/04 2:59:28 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Would it be better to oil through a male tube? > Using this manner of oiling, it is possible to get extraneous slide grease or other matter into the valves from the crook attached to the slide tube-especially if there is any corrosion in the slide crook. I have found for my own use, and I always recommend to my clients that they find an eyedropper bottle to use. First remove the slide and with a few drops of oil in the dropper, place it all of the way into the outer slide tube, then squirt the oil directly onto the rotor. This method seems to avoid the problems you are discussing. Paul Navarro ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
It's really an exaggerated problem, for most folks. All you need to do is hold the horn so that the valve slides are pointing upward, and carefully allow a couple drops of oil to fall down their middles. It really isn't hard to do, normally. If a nervous condition makes that impossible, then there are other options that were already mentioned. But for an individual with nominally steady hands, and a fair understanding of where "up" is, it's no trick at all to hit the rotors and miss the tubing walls - every time. From: "rjackallen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Hornlist] oil addict Why not introduce oil to the rotors (if you must) through a plastic soda straw being careful not to scrape stuff from the inside of the tubes? ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
When it comes time to regrease, I wrap some paper towel around a pencil
and rotate it slowly (eraser end first) down the tube toward the valve,
being careful to avoid pushing goo farther into the valve. After about
half way, I pull it out to check how gooey the paper is, and maybe use a
clean piece to continue. I don't know if that's a smart way to clean out
old grease, but I don't get sluggish valves.
{ David Goldberg: [EMAIL PROTECTED] }
{ Math Dept, Washtenaw Community College }
{ Ann Arbor Michigan }
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Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
A needle oiler, such as Hetman uses, can drop the oil in past the greasy part of the slide with no grease contact. Once you're aware of the potential problem, it's pretty simple to avoid it. I've thought about putting the oil in the crook, but it might still contact some grease. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
Why not introduce oil to the rotors (if you must) through a plastic soda straw being careful not to scrape stuff from the inside of the tubes? Jack - Original Message - From: "Greg Campbell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "The Horn List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 1:29 PM Subject: Re: [Hornlist] oil addict > Carlberg Jones wrote: > > Would it be better to oil through a male tube? There's much less > > slide grease on its inside surface to wash into the rotors. > > Only if you're sure that the inside of the tube isn't covered with > anything else (meatball sandwich, potato chips, bacterial culture...). > > Greg > > ___ > post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/rjackallen%40cox.net ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
At 4:22 PM -0400 10/12/04, David Goldberg wrote: >oops. You made a mistrake? Do tell . . . Carlberg Jones Guanajuato, Gto. MEXICO ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] wanted: lawson mouthpiece
Kurtis, have you seen this: http://www.lawsonhorns.com/mouthpieces.htm At the bottom of that page, a publication mentioned that you can ask for from Lawson...if I remember right, this publication contains diagrams of the various Lawson cups and rims. Fred Kurtis Henderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I'm looking to buy a used lawson moutpiece. I'm sure I want the S670, I'm a little fuzzy on the rim. I know I want a grip diameter of .705, and I am pretty sure I want the reverse peak. Is that the one where the tallest point of the rim is on the outer edge? I'm pretty sure I don't want the cushion or round rim. Anywho, to conclude, I am looking to buy a used Lawson S670 cup, and I'm pretty sure a B23G .705 rim, if it's the thinner one. Also, please correct me if I'm mistaken. It's been a few weeks since I decided on this, and I neglected to write down the right figures. And the Osmun website's pictures for the Lawsom mouthpiece article are dead links. Please feel free to contact me privately, Kurtis Henderson ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/fbaucom%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] wanted: lawson mouthpiece
I'm looking to buy a used lawson moutpiece. I'm sure I want the S670, I'm a little fuzzy on the rim. I know I want a grip diameter of .705, and I am pretty sure I want the reverse peak. Is that the one where the tallest point of the rim is on the outer edge? I'm pretty sure I don't want the cushion or round rim. Anywho, to conclude, I am looking to buy a used Lawson S670 cup, and I'm pretty sure a B23G .705 rim, if it's the thinner one. Also, please correct me if I'm mistaken. It's been a few weeks since I decided on this, and I neglected to write down the right figures. And the Osmun website's pictures for the Lawsom mouthpiece article are dead links. Please feel free to contact me privately, Kurtis Henderson ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
Carlberg Jones wrote: Would it be better to oil through a male tube? There's much less slide grease on its inside surface to wash into the rotors. Only if you're sure that the inside of the tube isn't covered with anything else (meatball sandwich, potato chips, bacterial culture...). Greg ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
> Would that be better than running the risk of having the oil run along the > slide grease bearing female tubes? Tube or not tube - that is the question. D, or not D - that is another question. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
Good idea, Carlberg! I'm going to start doing this. Fred Carlberg Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: At 12:43 PM -0400 10/12/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > [snip] . . . the generous application of oil will carry in yet a little >more slide grease. Would it be better to oil through a male tube? There's much less slide grease on its inside surface to wash into the rotors. One could pull out a normal slide with male tubes, put the oil in it and put the slide all the way back in, introducing the oil that way. Would that be better than running the risk of having the oil run along the slide grease bearing female tubes? Just a thought. Carlberg Jones Guanajuato, Gto. MEXICO ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/fbaucom%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
At 12:43 PM -0400 10/12/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > [snip] . . . the generous application of oil will carry in yet a little >more slide grease. Would it be better to oil through a male tube? There's much less slide grease on its inside surface to wash into the rotors. One could pull out a normal slide with male tubes, put the oil in it and put the slide all the way back in, introducing the oil that way. Would that be better than running the risk of having the oil run along the slide grease bearing female tubes? Just a thought. Carlberg Jones Guanajuato, Gto. MEXICO ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Kohn: Encounters II
Alecks O wrote I have to play this piece for an American Music concert and was wondering if anybody knows of a recording of it. Also, does anyone know the present whereabouts of Karl Kohn? ** karl Kohn has retired, but he still can be reached through the Music Department at Pomona College. I hear he is enjoying retirement, though he suffers from a mild case of emeritis. I heard Ralph Pyle play the premier of this piece back in the 60's. Gotta go, Cabbage ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] oil addict
If one greases the slides - the slides being still tight - , both shafts get grease, right. Both are inserted single in their socket, turned around a bit and pulled out. What does the clever horn player notice then ? Excess grease at the the shaft (socket) AND at the inlet of the socket. He will clean this away. This procedure is a bit more complicate with the valve slides. Here the one shaft could serve for both sockets. Cleaning away the excess grease same as before. Notice: apply grease as thin as possible, please, so similar things as described by Bill can never happen. It is really funny, that so many folks resonate about cleaning their instruments, but how come that repairmen complain so often about "complete menus" left in the horns for years ! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 5:44 PM To: The Horn List Subject: Re: [Hornlist] oil addict Check what they are using as slide grease. If the oil pick up a small amount each time it is oiled, the excess oil will go away with the condensation, but the slide grease will stick to the valve. As the excess goes away the slide grease will become the dominant lubricant, and will need another generous application of oil to dilute it back to a thin consistency, but the generous application of oil will carry in yet a little more slide grease. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] oil addict
Check what they are using as slide grease. If the oil pick up a small amount each time it is oiled, the excess oil will go away with the condensation, but the slide grease will stick to the valve. As the excess goes away the slide grease will become the dominant lubricant, and will need another generous application of oil to dilute it back to a thin consistency, but the generous application of oil will carry in yet a little more slide grease. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] warm-down related
Where can one find these "wobble" exercises by Stuart DeHaro? Would you be so kind to give me the link? Thank you very much! niki voglhofer student linz, austria --- Steven Tarter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I do not have a specific, regular "warm-down" > procedure the way that I have > a daily warm-up that I follow... > > but I have noticed that if I end a heavy practice > session with long tone > studies the next day my lip is VERY stiff and > unflexible/unresponsive. So, > I always try to end with something that works the > "flexibility" muscles > (such as lip trills or the "wobble" excercises from > Stuart DeHaro's > website). > > --Steve Tarter-- > teacher, amateur > Tokyo, Japan > ___ > post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/nvoglhofer%40yahoo.com > ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] warm-down related
I do not have a specific, regular "warm-down" procedure the way that I have a daily warm-up that I follow... but I have noticed that if I end a heavy practice session with long tone studies the next day my lip is VERY stiff and unflexible/unresponsive. So, I always try to end with something that works the "flexibility" muscles (such as lip trills or the "wobble" excercises from Stuart DeHaro's website). --Steve Tarter-- teacher, amateur Tokyo, Japan ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
