Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods now tuition
Hi Jack, I have seen what my son receives for his GI Bill. He is working full time, and going to school full time to get his BS and is barely squeaking by. To contrast that, when my older brother was getting his almost 40 years ago, he was able to go to school full time and not have to work...Your comments are right on the mark. These people defend us and as soon as they want their piece of the pie, the schools and landlords are right there to relieve them of it... It's also ironic how the months my son John is not enrolled full time, the government decreases his allotment. Walt Lewis At 04:28 PM 4/28/2005 -0600, you wrote: "The GI bill plus one outside job put me through grad school." + The problem with the GI Bill and BAH today is that the schools/landlords know about increases in allotments before the soldier/Marine/sailor/airman does. No matter how much Congress might increase the amounts it is negated almost before it is passed. The Jack Attack! ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/wlewis9637%40wowway.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Beginning Methods now tuition
"The GI bill plus one outside job put me through grad school." + The problem with the GI Bill and BAH today is that the schools/landlords know about increases in allotments before the soldier/Marine/sailor/airman does. No matter how much Congress might increase the amounts it is negated almost before it is passed. The Jack Attack! ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
The figure I refered to in 1968 was for all fees as noted. At that time at a land grant university tuition was still a blanket $50.00 per semester. A few years later the school had gone to credit hours to determine tuition. The GI bill plus one outside job put me through grad school. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 4:36 PM To: The Horn List; The Horn List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Robert Dickow Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods An interesting observation. When I first started my college attendance, full tuition for all credits taken was $50. per semester. In a couple of years or so the GI bill was instrumental in the change for state schools to start charging for each credit hour taken as private schools were getting more from Uncle Sam than the state schools. The practice hung on and the state schools marched steadily onward and upward with their fees and credit hour charges. Even so, the GI Bill only provided $500. a year to those greedy institutions who got the maximum. When I started school on GI Bill I got a whole $65. per month out of which I had to pay $20 for a room and $30. for meals at a boarding house. That left me the awesome sum of $15. a month for catting around, dating, clothes, toothpaste and other essentials. CORdially, Paul Mansur > > Pete Exline's description of the 'olden days' was fun. > > Maybe the olden days really were the 'good old days.' > I was teaching at a little private college in Kentucky during > the late 70s until 1984. Our band was very small, only one > horn, no trombones, a couple of clarinets, etc. No orchestra > existed. Yet one day while rummaging in some file cabinets > I ran across a school program from the early 50s. The 55 piece > orchestra in the cover photo had played Scheherezade on > the evening's program. > > What had happened over the intervening years?!! I'm not sure. > I did learn, however, that all those students were on FULL > SCHOLARSHIP. A full scholarship was $350.00, which just > happened to exactly equal the 'activity grant' that the students > are still getting today. The aid amount never went any higher > during those years, while tuitions, however, had gone up > to about $14,000 a year. > > Go figure. > > Bob Dickow > Lionel Hampton School of Music > ------ > > From: Wendell L Exline <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: horn@music.memphis.edu > > Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods > > Date: Thursday, April 21, 2005 5:31 PM > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > Your message about the "olden days" was fun. How familiar it all > > sounded. My 7th grade band had eight "horns" in the section. > > > > ___ > post: horn@music.memphis.edu > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/p_mansur1%40comcast.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/bgross%40airmail.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
An interesting observation. When I first started my college attendance, full tuition for all credits taken was $50. per semester. In a couple of years or so the GI bill was instrumental in the change for state schools to start charging for each credit hour taken as private schools were getting more from Uncle Sam than the state schools. The practice hung on and the state schools marched steadily onward and upward with their fees and credit hour charges. Even so, the GI Bill only provided $500. a year to those greedy institutions who got the maximum. When I started school on GI Bill I got a whole $65. per month out of which I had to pay $20 for a room and $30. for meals at a boarding house. That left me the awesome sum of $15. a month for catting around, dating, clothes, toothpaste and other essentials. CORdially, Paul Mansur > > Pete Exline's description of the 'olden days' was fun. > > Maybe the olden days really were the 'good old days.' > I was teaching at a little private college in Kentucky during > the late 70s until 1984. Our band was very small, only one > horn, no trombones, a couple of clarinets, etc. No orchestra > existed. Yet one day while rummaging in some file cabinets > I ran across a school program from the early 50s. The 55 piece > orchestra in the cover photo had played Scheherezade on > the evening's program. > > What had happened over the intervening years?!! I'm not sure. > I did learn, however, that all those students were on FULL > SCHOLARSHIP. A full scholarship was $350.00, which just > happened to exactly equal the 'activity grant' that the students > are still getting today. The aid amount never went any higher > during those years, while tuitions, however, had gone up > to about $14,000 a year. > > Go figure. > > Bob Dickow > Lionel Hampton School of Music > ------ > > From: Wendell L Exline <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: horn@music.memphis.edu > > Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods > > Date: Thursday, April 21, 2005 5:31 PM > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > Your message about the "olden days" was fun. How familiar it all > > sounded. My 7th grade band had eight "horns" in the section. > > > > ___ > post: horn@music.memphis.edu > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/p_mansur1%40comcast.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Cleaning out old documents I found a receipt from my first semester of college my senior year, 1964. It was for $420.00 which included tuition (it was flat rate at the time), room, board, fees, and laundry, everything except books. That would be about $2,300.00 today. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Dickow Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 11:50 AM To: The Horn List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods Pete Exline's description of the 'olden days' was fun. Maybe the olden days really were the 'good old days.' I was teaching at a little private college in Kentucky during the late 70s until 1984. Our band was very small, only one horn, no trombones, a couple of clarinets, etc. No orchestra existed. Yet one day while rummaging in some file cabinets I ran across a school program from the early 50s. The 55 piece orchestra in the cover photo had played Scheherezade on the evening's program. What had happened over the intervening years?!! I'm not sure. I did learn, however, that all those students were on FULL SCHOLARSHIP. A full scholarship was $350.00, which just happened to exactly equal the 'activity grant' that the students are still getting today. The aid amount never went any higher during those years, while tuitions, however, had gone up to about $14,000 a year. Go figure. Bob Dickow Lionel Hampton School of Music -- > From: Wendell L Exline <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: horn@music.memphis.edu > Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods > Date: Thursday, April 21, 2005 5:31 PM > > Hi Paul, > > Your message about the "olden days" was fun. How familiar it all > sounded. My 7th grade band had eight "horns" in the section. > ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/bgross%40airmail.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Pete Exline's description of the 'olden days' was fun. Maybe the olden days really were the 'good old days.' I was teaching at a little private college in Kentucky during the late 70s until 1984. Our band was very small, only one horn, no trombones, a couple of clarinets, etc. No orchestra existed. Yet one day while rummaging in some file cabinets I ran across a school program from the early 50s. The 55 piece orchestra in the cover photo had played Scheherezade on the evening's program. What had happened over the intervening years?!! I'm not sure. I did learn, however, that all those students were on FULL SCHOLARSHIP. A full scholarship was $350.00, which just happened to exactly equal the 'activity grant' that the students are still getting today. The aid amount never went any higher during those years, while tuitions, however, had gone up to about $14,000 a year. Go figure. Bob Dickow Lionel Hampton School of Music -- > From: Wendell L Exline <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: horn@music.memphis.edu > Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods > Date: Thursday, April 21, 2005 5:31 PM > > Hi Paul, > > Your message about the "olden days" was fun. How familiar it all > sounded. My 7th grade band had eight "horns" in the section. > ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
To hold it in Eb, hold it down a full step. To hold it in D, hold it down a step and a half, etc. John Baumgart - Original Message - From: "G" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "The Horn List" Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2005 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods > Hi, > > I learned out of the good ol' First Division Band > Method. > > A few years later, I found my old copy in a box, so I > took it and cut out the picture of Phil Farkas, > entitled "How To Hold The French Horn In F" and stuck > it on my locker at the university. Just in case I ever > forgot. > > Thing that puzzled me was that I was completely lost > if ever I had to hold a French Horn in Eb, or one in > D, or one in A, or God forbid one in B. > > Gary ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Hi, I learned out of the good ol' First Division Band Method. A few years later, I found my old copy in a box, so I took it and cut out the picture of Phil Farkas, entitled "How To Hold The French Horn In F" and stuck it on my locker at the university. Just in case I ever forgot. Thing that puzzled me was that I was completely lost if ever I had to hold a French Horn in Eb, or one in D, or one in A, or God forbid one in B. Gary Get Firefox!!http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/central.html ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Hi Paul, Your message about the "olden days" was fun. How familiar it all sounded. My 7th grade band had eight "horns" in the section. One was an old double Conn Schmidt model with a piston change valve. Mine was a Conn 4D, one was a Pan American single F, and the others were a mixture of rain catchers and mellophones. We also had a 65 piece orchestra. The director took away from any of the horn players, the Eb crooks, so we would learn to transpose the Eb parts, which were in the majority in those days Within a month or so we were all transposing the Eb parts with no problems. By high school time doubles were dominating and we were all on the way to be virtuosos(i). It was a great time and the spring solo contests were great adventures. About 1937 (I think) the nation was divided into regions and the solo contests were in three stages. There was the district, the winners of whom went to the state. The state winners were eligble for the national-regionals. There were other competitions around the country including the Tri-State Festival in Enid, OK, which began in 1935 and continues even today. Well Paul, we grew up with it and it has been a great ride! Pete Exline ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
No, my mother insisted that I wear wool socks... --- Alan Cole <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Barefoot? -AC. > ~~~ > Of course that was in the days when I had to walk 5 miles to school in 5 > feet of snow uphill both ways. > > __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Barefoot? -AC. ~~~ Of course that was in the days when I had to walk 5 miles to school in 5 feet of snow uphill both ways. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.1 - Release Date: 4/20/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Boy, you had it easy. The music direcector where I went to school did all that (except Tonette) PLUS footbal marching band before school, high school orchestra during 3rd period, and chorus at noon. In spite of that he inspired me to love music and to play the horn. Of course that was in the days when I had to walk 5 miles to school in 5 feet of snow uphill both ways. But seriously, he did all that, and I had a ball doing all of that. Herb Foster --- Paul Mansur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Wednesday, April 20, 2005, at 10:44 AM, Steve Freides wrote: > > > > > How on earth can you teach someone to play an instrument in an ensemble > > setting? Seems impossible to me. > > > > > Simple. You begin with 20 or 30 kids and get a good Band Instrument > Method. That's how I got my start, and the way most of us began in > what is known as instrumental music education in this country. That's > also how I started my students when I was a public school band > director. There was no other choice. My schedule included daily > classes of two elementary school beginning bands, an intermediate > elementary school band, a junior high beginning band, a junior high > advanced band, a high school band, and two pre-band Tonette classes for > fourth graders. I coached solos, ensembles, et al plus a pep band for > basketball games before and after school and at night. After six years > of this with about 250 to 300 students daily I gave up and went back to > school to get a terminal degree, (the union card for college > employment) and found an easier way to make a living. For one thing > positive, if you do it right you learn a LOT about ALL the wind and > percussion instruments. Those who also had to teach an orchestra had > to also get quite familiar with the strings. > They're mostly out of print, now, but there were some good Beginning > books 50 years ago. "Easy Steps To The Band" comes to mind. It > contained much very practical material and was about as effective as it > was possible for a band method to be. I always had some fine ensembles > and a handful of All-State players every year. Boy! Talk about Work! > That was WORK! > > CORdially, Mansur's Answers > > ___ > post: horn@music.memphis.edu > unsubscribe or set options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/herb_foster%40yahoo.com > __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Yes, my middle school did this as well. When I was in 6th grade there were 3 horns -- then 7th there were 2 --- in 8th I was the only one left! Therefore, my group lessons were actually private lessons with my band instructor. When this was added to my private one with my mother, I advanced much further than my classmates. This sort of practice needs to happen more often because players who do not take lessons because they will hardly ever advance. They will continue their instrumental careers doing just well enough to play the hardest song on the program, if that. >Is this true? My son's school starts instruments in the fifth grade but >there are separate lessons and band/orchestra practice. The lessons aren't >individual but they're small groups, usually all the kids who play the same >instrument has a group lesson together, once in a while two similar >instruments if there aren't a lot of kids playing it. For the kids who can >already plan and/or take lessons outside of school, there is an "advanced" >ensemble they play in, usually in addition to the regular big bunch. > >How on earth can you teach someone to play an instrument in an ensemble >setting? Seems impossible to me. > >-S- > > > > By > > necessity, a whole band method book is used. Some are much > > better for horns than others, and even the best are mediocre > > where the horns are concerned. Those of you who teach > > beginning bands, how do you address the issues that confront > > beginning horn players in a whole band setting? > > > > Again, I have my own opinions on the matter, but I'm > > interested in the opinions of others. > > > > Rory > >___ >post: horn@music.memphis.edu >unsubscribe or set options at >http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/waldhorn%40rediffmail.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
On Wednesday, April 20, 2005, at 10:44 AM, Steve Freides wrote: How on earth can you teach someone to play an instrument in an ensemble setting? Seems impossible to me. Simple. You begin with 20 or 30 kids and get a good Band Instrument Method. That's how I got my start, and the way most of us began in what is known as instrumental music education in this country. That's also how I started my students when I was a public school band director. There was no other choice. My schedule included daily classes of two elementary school beginning bands, an intermediate elementary school band, a junior high beginning band, a junior high advanced band, a high school band, and two pre-band Tonette classes for fourth graders. I coached solos, ensembles, et al plus a pep band for basketball games before and after school and at night. After six years of this with about 250 to 300 students daily I gave up and went back to school to get a terminal degree, (the union card for college employment) and found an easier way to make a living. For one thing positive, if you do it right you learn a LOT about ALL the wind and percussion instruments. Those who also had to teach an orchestra had to also get quite familiar with the strings. They're mostly out of print, now, but there were some good Beginning books 50 years ago. "Easy Steps To The Band" comes to mind. It contained much very practical material and was about as effective as it was possible for a band method to be. I always had some fine ensembles and a handful of All-State players every year. Boy! Talk about Work! That was WORK! CORdially, Mansur's Answers ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
I know in Utah, it IS true that most band programs are taught in one class setting. Many programs do have a summer band program, where individual instruments are taught for a few weeks, but without mandatory attendance, and with 2 months inbetween instruction and school starting, it does little good. In my experience, students in this situation NEED private lessons to succeed. Sonja R -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Freides Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 8:45 AM To: 'The Horn List' Subject: RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods Rory McDaniel wrote: -snip- > The vast majority of public schools with beginning bands have > whole band instruction with one teacher in the room. Is this true? My son's school starts instruments in the fifth grade but there are separate lessons and band/orchestra practice. The lessons aren't individual but they're small groups, usually all the kids who play the same instrument has a group lesson together, once in a while two similar instruments if there aren't a lot of kids playing it. For the kids who can already plan and/or take lessons outside of school, there is an "advanced" ensemble they play in, usually in addition to the regular big bunch. How on earth can you teach someone to play an instrument in an ensemble setting? Seems impossible to me. -S- > By > necessity, a whole band method book is used. Some are much > better for horns than others, and even the best are mediocre > where the horns are concerned. Those of you who teach > beginning bands, how do you address the issues that confront > beginning horn players in a whole band setting? > > Again, I have my own opinions on the matter, but I'm > interested in the opinions of others. > > Rory ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/sonjahornteacher%40cs.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
Rory McDaniel wrote: -snip- > The vast majority of public schools with beginning bands have > whole band instruction with one teacher in the room. Is this true? My son's school starts instruments in the fifth grade but there are separate lessons and band/orchestra practice. The lessons aren't individual but they're small groups, usually all the kids who play the same instrument has a group lesson together, once in a while two similar instruments if there aren't a lot of kids playing it. For the kids who can already plan and/or take lessons outside of school, there is an "advanced" ensemble they play in, usually in addition to the regular big bunch. How on earth can you teach someone to play an instrument in an ensemble setting? Seems impossible to me. -S- > By > necessity, a whole band method book is used. Some are much > better for horns than others, and even the best are mediocre > where the horns are concerned. Those of you who teach > beginning bands, how do you address the issues that confront > beginning horn players in a whole band setting? > > Again, I have my own opinions on the matter, but I'm > interested in the opinions of others. > > Rory ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
It is much better to have single horn lessons or horn group lessons for one year minimum before joining the band. The problem with school band is it, that nobody of the band get proper instructions, as disturbing noise, generalzation & incompetent teachers (very often) go the 08/15 way. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rory McDaniel Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 3:30 PM To: The Horn List Subject: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods OK, let's keep this avenue going. I think its a good thread of discussion. The vast majority of public schools with beginning bands have whole band instruction with one teacher in the room. By necessity, a whole band method book is used. Some are much better for horns than others, and even the best are mediocre where the horns are concerned. Those of you who teach beginning bands, how do you address the issues that confront beginning horn players in a whole band setting? Again, I have my own opinions on the matter, but I'm interested in the opinions of others. Rory ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.d e ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Beginning Methods
OK, let's keep this avenue going. I think its a good thread of discussion. The vast majority of public schools with beginning bands have whole band instruction with one teacher in the room. By necessity, a whole band method book is used. Some are much better for horns than others, and even the best are mediocre where the horns are concerned. Those of you who teach beginning bands, how do you address the issues that confront beginning horn players in a whole band setting? Again, I have my own opinions on the matter, but I'm interested in the opinions of others. Rory ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
