[Hornlist] New intonation idea for harmonics
For those of you that have seen the chart I made (the rough draft) and were interested I'm still working on better ways to colorize and organize everything. You will be interested to know that the note names do not change one bit for each harmonic whether you use an A fundamental of 1Hz or 9 million Hz. Also the cents sharp or flat never change. Bearing this in mind I'm going to do some physics work with fundamentals and see if I can get a general consensus of exactly how sharp and how flat some fingerings are based on tube length and fundamentals. Since it's almost impossible to get accurate fundamental readings on the horn (you can lip it all over the place) I think I'm going to go for the 4th or 8th fundamental, divide the frequency by 8, then come up with a nice metric length of the basic horn. Now I could measure horn length by string but that's a mess and this way I can get a very accurate reading for the basic horn. Now for the tubes themselves it is basically a simultaneous algebra equation to determine the added length of tube one, and tube two. Both tubes are generally in tune by themselves (they're normally manufactured that way) and with the 6% rule I can pretty much calculate the third tubes length. Some Horns are not manufactured with an in-tune third slide since it is always used in conjuction and rarely alone. I'll also have to come up with a short survey and program to figure out a general consensus across all models of horns. For the harmonics however they do not change. They are always the same ratios. Where am I going with this? Well once I can get a general survey or consensus of how flat/sharp fingering combinations are I can combine it with the harmonics chart in order to produce a mathematical way of determining which fingerings are in tune, which ones are sharp/flat, and by HOW MUCH they are flat or sharp in cents. You may even be asking why I'm doing it in cents, well cents no matter what fundamental or A you tune to will always remain the same ratio. So if I can come up with a universal cent intonation tendency I can couple that with the normal harmonic chart. Has this ever been done before though? -William ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] New intonation idea for harmonics
If you use 'just intonation' harmonic ratios (ratii ?) to determine the 'proper' pitch, then you also need to be aware that the pitch for each note is dependent on the 'root' note of the scale being considered. The proper pitches for the notes of a just intonation scale beginning on concert F (horn C) will be different than the same note names for a scale beginning on concert C (horn G) - even if the horn's A is kept the same. And there will be similar differences for all of the root notes. For general intonation, being able to play all the scales so they sound good is a reasonable goal! This problem with 'moving pitches' is why it is so important to listen carefully when playing in an emsemble and to play your notes so they blend with the others. For me, it is the horn A's and E's that give the most trouble. Jay Kosta Endwell NY ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] New intonation idea for harmonics
Of course. I've got it set up so that two octaves of fundamentals are covered and all harmonics are mathematically perfect pitch-wise. If you use cents then the intonations are always the same. Math is beautiful like that... A HREF=http://www.cheatbot.com/harmonics1.html;http://www.cheatbot.com/harmonics1.html/A Take a look at that, you'll see what I mean. -William In a message dated 12/7/2003 3:48:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If you use 'just intonation' harmonic ratios (ratii ?) to determine the 'proper' pitch, then you also need to be aware that the pitch for each note is dependent on the 'root' note of the scale being considered. The proper pitches for the notes of a just intonation scale beginning on concert F (horn C) will be different than the same note names for a scale beginning on concert C (horn G) - even if the horn's A is kept the same. And there will be similar differences for all of the root notes. For general intonation, being able to play all the scales so they sound good is a reasonable goal! This problem with 'moving pitches' is why it is so important to listen carefully when playing in an emsemble and to play your notes so they blend with the others. For me, it is the horn A's and E's that give the most trouble. Jay Kosta Endwell NY ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] New intonation idea for harmonics
Oh yes and my goal of this is just to have a definate relative pitch tendency chart and to have some mathematical basis for any future research in this arena. The math, the way it works, is quite simple. No matter what harmonic, on 1Hz, or a million, you will have the same ratios from one to the other. Note names depend on the fundamental only. The ratios are always the same, and you can move a fifth up for a fundamental and have a fifth up on every other note in the harmonic series... There are tons of other neat tricks too which I am compiling for later :) -William In a message dated 12/7/2003 3:48:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If you use 'just intonation' harmonic ratios (ratii ?) to determine the 'proper' pitch, then you also need to be aware that the pitch for each note is dependent on the 'root' note of the scale being considered. The proper pitches for the notes of a just intonation scale beginning on concert F (horn C) will be different than the same note names for a scale beginning on concert C (horn G) - even if the horn's A is kept the same. And there will be similar differences for all of the root notes. For general intonation, being able to play all the scales so they sound good is a reasonable goal! This problem with 'moving pitches' is why it is so important to listen carefully when playing in an emsemble and to play your notes so they blend with the others. For me, it is the horn A's and E's that give the most trouble. Jay Kosta Endwell NY ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
