Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
On 12/12/2016 8:17 PM, Phil Smith III wrote: Indeed. Though ISTR that one of John Moores' previous efforts was a multi-platform security system, so I'd be willing to bet that they do understand the issue pretty well. Wasn't that Barry Schraeger's BOLT? AFAIK, Barry is not involved in this effort at LzLabs. -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: FTP serialization when writing PDS/PDSE members
On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 17:11:37 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote: > >What you are seeing leads me to believe that the data set I/O is *not* >occurring while it is being transferred. Otherwise, you should also see >an ENQ on SPFEDIT/DSN (no member), right? > Blocking conceals a lot of sins. If I allocate my test data set unblocked I get the IEC217I B14-10 I expected. I just hadn't written enough data to fill a block. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
R.S. wrote, in part: >I'm rather curious about RACF (security? who needs security?), CICS, IMS, etc. Indeed. Though ISTR that one of John Moores' previous efforts was a multi-platform security system, so I'd be willing to bet that they do understand the issue pretty well. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
On Tue, 13 Dec 2016 01:40:07 +, Anthony Thompson wrote: >Pardon for getting the input wrong. New JCL: >// >// EXPORT SYMLIST=* >// SET TEST='THIS IS THE VALUE OF THE SUBSTITUTED STRING.' >//STEP1EXEC PGM=IEBGENER >//SYSUT1 DD DATA,SYMBOLS=JCLONLY,DCB=LRECL=222 > This is a test of symbol use in instream data sets. Test here: &TEST >/* >//SYSUT2 DD SYSOUT=(,) >//SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=(,) >//SYSINDD DUMMY > >I'm supposing you used the TSO SUBMIT command to submit the job. A foible of >TSO SUBMIT is that it doesn't do input greater than 80 characters. > Actually, I used FTP which allows up to 254. >So you've got an 80-byte SYSUT1 input but you're telling the system it's >really 222 bytes. Bang. I/O error. > Is there any documented restriction I'm violating? Since I see none, I'm pressing my SR for an APAR. What was your RECFM. Try it with RECFM=VB. >I put the same JCL above into a dataset with LRECL 222 and submitted it to an >internal reader via IEBGENER (ICEGENER). Job Finished with RC 0. > It seems that the only thing one can specify as LRECL is what it already is. Why is the option explicitly supported? Actually, by experiment, it's very complicated. Which is why I have an RCF in asking for a detailed explanation, and why IBM has been unable to supply the information for 15 months. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Starting a STC with options
Look at the JES2 Definition for STC You may be able to set up all STCs to a specific output class, then issue a $RALL command to route to another place to the archival process. $R all,r=j5,d=r7,outd=(w,h,k,l), (other options) >--,D=--+-LOCAL--|--ANYLOCAL---+> +-N----|--nodename-+ +-destid---+ +-N----R---+ +-U----+ +-node--.--remote--+ +-node--.--destid--+ +-node--.--*---+ +-*+ +-remote---+ '-userid---' JES2 routes all eligible print and punch output from remote 5 to remote 7, but retains command authority at remote 5. If you do not specify the OUTDisp parameter, all output with a disposition of WRITE, HOLD, KEEP, or LEAVE will be rerouted. I have not reviewed all the parms/cmds, but this could work. Make sure it does not purge the output normally CONDPURG=Yes|No Specifies whether (YES) or not (NO) system data sets (such as JESMSG and SYSMSG) in this job class are to be conditionally purged. This parameter is not allowed on the JOBCLASS(class) initialization statement. Lizette > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On > Behalf Of Mark Regan > Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:58 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Subject: Starting a STC with options > > Is there a way to start a STC so that when it is stopped that its complete job > log is sent by NJE to another JES2 node. The reason I ask is that we have JES2 > nodes that don't have an archival system on them, so I want to send the job > log to a JES2 system that does via NJE. > > Thanks. > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
IPSEC
All, I have a dumb question and apologize in advance for asking it here. We have a LDAP sitting on Windows being sent data , that's encrypted with AES128 encryption . The STC on z/OS sends a 32k packet via a socket write and the customer has IPSEC turned on. We saw a hang of the Windows LDAP and we had the customer turn off IPSEC, everything worked.. We are scratching our heads, wondering if we have a compatibility issue or is IPSEC completely transparent to the application... Can someone enlighten this old man Scott -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3
> There is a preceding MODESET KEY=ZERO. It wouldn't make sense for that to > reset Control Register 3, turning on bit 0 and off bit 8, would it? "You can > set any SPK you want, so long as it is the one you already have." The MODESET documentation says: ,MODE=PROB, MODE=SUP Specifies that the PSW problem state indicator (bit 15) is to be either turned on (PROB) or turned off (SUP). If the MODESET operation completes with a problem state PSW, the caller?s PSW key mask (PKM) is set according to the following rules: ?The bit matching the resulting PSW key is set on. ?The bit matching key 9 is set on. ?For a task attached with ATTACHX using the KEY=NINE parameter, the bits that were on in the PKM of the ATTACHX issuer are set on. ?All other bits are set off. If the resulting PSW is in supervisor state, the caller?s PKM is unchanged. Jim Mulder z/OS Diagnosis, Design, Development, Test IBM Corp. Poughkeepsie NY -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
Pardon for getting the input wrong. New JCL: // // EXPORT SYMLIST=* // SET TEST='THIS IS THE VALUE OF THE SUBSTITUTED STRING.' //STEP1EXEC PGM=IEBGENER //SYSUT1 DD DATA,SYMBOLS=JCLONLY,DCB=LRECL=222 This is a test of symbol use in instream data sets. Test here: &TEST /* //SYSUT2 DD SYSOUT=(,) //SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=(,) //SYSINDD DUMMY I'm supposing you used the TSO SUBMIT command to submit the job. A foible of TSO SUBMIT is that it doesn't do input greater than 80 characters. So you've got an 80-byte SYSUT1 input but you're telling the system it's really 222 bytes. Bang. I/O error. I put the same JCL above into a dataset with LRECL 222 and submitted it to an internal reader via IEBGENER (ICEGENER). Job Finished with RC 0. Ant. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Tuesday, 13 December 2016 1:14 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin On 2016-12-12, at 00:56, Anthony Thompson wrote: > Ran this JCL : > > // > // EXPORT SYMLIST=* > // SET TEST='THIS IS THE VALUE OF THE SUBSTITUTED STRING.' > //STEP1EXEC PGM=IEBGENER > //SYSUT1DD DATA,SYMBOLS=JCLONLY > &TEST > /* > //SYSUT2DD SYSOUT=(,) > //SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=(,) > //SYSIN DD DUMMY > > Only removed the DCB on SYSUT1. Job worked. > Than's not "only". You also changed the content of SYSUT1 in my example. Try it with the SYSUT1 I cited, with or without DCB: //SYSUT1DD *,SYMBOLS=JCLONLY,DCB=LRECL=222 This is a test of symbol use in instream data sets. Test here: &TEST On 2016-12-12, at 02:50, Anthony Thompson wrote: > Just so. But anyone can frig around with invalid DCB's and make any utility > break. What do you claim was invalid about my DCB. Cite Reference. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3
There is a preceding MODESET KEY=ZERO. It wouldn't make sense for that to reset Control Register 3, turning on bit 0 and off bit 8, would it? "You can set any SPK you want, so long as it is the one you already have." Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 3:54 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3 Hmmm. I am seeing the following in Extended Addressability: "All programs are initially dispatched with a PKM value equal to the storage protect key of the program's TCB or SRB. Example: A PKM value of X'0080' represents key 8 and X'0001' represents key 15. The PC, PR, and PT instructions can change the PKM value." I wonder why I am getting a S0C2 on SPKA 0(R1) when R1 contains FF80, I was almost surely dispatched with Key 8, and there have been no Px's that should have changed the mask. Hard to picture that LE would change it gratuitously. (PoOp says "Bits 0-55 and 60-63 of the second-operand address are ignored.") Anyone have any ideas? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Position available
Hi I am Interested in exploring this position further I am well versed in CICS and MQ on z/OS Paul D'Angelo -- Original Message -- From: Alan Haff To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Position available Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2016 15:51:51 -0600 I work for a multinational ISV and we have an opening for a z/OS sysprog. The system is located in the Rocky Mountain west but relocation isn't required. We run z/OS 1.13, 2.1 and 2.2, and subsystems include IMS 12, 13 & 14; CICS 3.1, 4.1, 4.2, 5.1 & 5.2; DB2 8, 9 & 10; and MQ 7 & 8. The hardware is a z13s (2965-G03) with 88GB of memory, three CPs, three IFLs and an ICF, connected to a DS8000 with 33.5 TiB of storage. Let me know if you're interested and I'll fill you in on the details. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
3800 printers
Does anyone know of any 3800 laser printers still in service? Or not in service but available? -- Will -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3
Hmmm. I am seeing the following in Extended Addressability: "All programs are initially dispatched with a PKM value equal to the storage protect key of the program's TCB or SRB. Example: A PKM value of X'0080' represents key 8 and X'0001' represents key 15. The PC, PR, and PT instructions can change the PKM value." I wonder why I am getting a S0C2 on SPKA 0(R1) when R1 contains FF80, I was almost surely dispatched with Key 8, and there have been no Px's that should have changed the mask. Hard to picture that LE would change it gratuitously. (PoOp says "Bits 0-55 and 60-63 of the second-operand address are ignored.") Anyone have any ideas? Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 1:59 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3 Good thought, but I don't assume 8. I do an IPK/STC R2 during initialization. The value in my SPKA register is FFF80 (I do an LB so the high bit gets propagated) so the IPK is working plausibly at least. (PooP says the high bits are ignored.) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
Somehow if I were IBM I would not be quaking in my boots. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of R.S. Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 2:10 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld The solution is a little bit simpler: they don't support binary code. They can recompile some source code using Raincode compilers, but even the source code need to be "simplfied" (read: some constructs are not understood). How does it work? As about references. And *check them*, otherwise you'll get as accurate and valuable knowledge as Computerworld article. ;-) Regarding DB2: it's the easiest part to replace: it can be any relational database, including DB2 LUW. I'm rather curious about RACF (security? who needs security?), CICS, IMS, etc. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
The solution is a little bit simpler: they don't support binary code. They can recompile some source code using Raincode compilers, but even the source code need to be "simplfied" (read: some constructs are not understood). How does it work? As about references. And *check them*, otherwise you'll get as accurate and valuable knowledge as Computerworld article. ;-) Regarding DB2: it's the easiest part to replace: it can be any relational database, including DB2 LUW. I'm rather curious about RACF (security? who needs security?), CICS, IMS, etc. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland --- Treść tej wiadomości może zawierać informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wyłącznie do użytku służbowego adresata. Odbiorcą może być jedynie jej adresat z wyłączeniem dostępu osób trzecich. Jeżeli nie jesteś adresatem niniejszej wiadomości lub pracownikiem upoważnionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, że jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne działanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i może być karalne. Jeżeli otrzymałeś tę wiadomość omyłkowo, prosimy niezwłocznie zawiadomić nadawcę wysyłając odpowiedź oraz trwale usunąć tę wiadomość włączając w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorized to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. mBank S.A. z siedzibą w Warszawie, ul. Senatorska 18, 00-950 Warszawa, www.mBank.pl, e-mail: kont...@mbank.pl Sąd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydział Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sądowego, nr rejestru przedsiębiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Według stanu na dzień 01.01.2016 r. kapitał zakładowy mBanku S.A. (w całości wpłacony) wynosi 168.955.696 złotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3
Good thought, but I don't assume 8. I do an IPK/STC R2 during initialization. The value in my SPKA register is FFF80 (I do an LB so the high bit gets propagated) so the IPK is working plausibly at least. (PooP says the high bits are ignored.) Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Blaicher, Christopher Y. Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 1:54 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3 I don't know for sure, but could it be that there is no assurance that it's key was key 8? There are indicators in the books that programs can run in keys 9 through 15. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Position available
I work for a multinational ISV and we have an opening for a z/OS sysprog. The system is located in the Rocky Mountain west but relocation isn't required. We run z/OS 1.13, 2.1 and 2.2, and subsystems include IMS 12, 13 & 14; CICS 3.1, 4.1, 4.2, 5.1 & 5.2; DB2 8, 9 & 10; and MQ 7 & 8. The hardware is a z13s (2965-G03) with 88GB of memory, three CPs, three IFLs and an ICF, connected to a DS8000 with 33.5 TiB of storage. Let me know if you're interested and I'll fill you in on the details. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3
I don't know for sure, but could it be that there is no assurance that it's key was key 8? There are indicators in the books that programs can run in keys 9 through 15. Chris Blaicher Technical Architect Mainframe Development Syncsort Incorporated 2 Blue Hill Plaza #1563, Pearl River, NY 10965 P: 201-930-8234 | M: 512-627-3803 E: cblaic...@syncsort.com www.syncsort.com CONNECTING BIG IRON TO BIG DATA -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 4:49 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Question on SPKA and Control Register 3 I had guessed that an APF-authorized but otherwise "ordinary" program running with Key 8 would be able to issue an SPKA with an "address" of xx8x in problem state without getting a S0C2. I appear to have guessed wrong. I just wanted to do a reality check to make sure I had not fat-fingered something: typically a program in Key 8 does *not* have a PSW-key-mask bit of one for SPK 8 in Control Register 3? Is that correct? Just out of curiosity -- why would that be? Why not let a program set its SPK back to its original state? Charles -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ATTENTION: - The information contained in this message (including any files transmitted with this message) may contain proprietary, trade secret or other confidential and/or legally privileged information. Any pricing information contained in this message or in any files transmitted with this message is always confidential and cannot be shared with any third parties without prior written approval from Syncsort. This message is intended to be read only by the individual or entity to whom it is addressed or by their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are on notice that any use, disclosure, copying or distribution of this message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and/or Syncsort and destroy all copies of this message in your possession, custody or control. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Question on SPKA and Control Register 3
I had guessed that an APF-authorized but otherwise "ordinary" program running with Key 8 would be able to issue an SPKA with an "address" of xx8x in problem state without getting a S0C2. I appear to have guessed wrong. I just wanted to do a reality check to make sure I had not fat-fingered something: typically a program in Key 8 does *not* have a PSW-key-mask bit of one for SPK 8 in Control Register 3? Is that correct? Just out of curiosity -- why would that be? Why not let a program set its SPK back to its original state? Charles -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
On 12/12/2016 11:50 AM, Charles Mills wrote: Along those lines, would such a product have to/be able to "emulate" DB2? Easy to come halfway close (MySQL) -- damned difficult to do it all. Just ask Oracle. Doesn't DB2 UDB run on non-z platforms? If so, you might be able to intercept the z/OS DB2 calls and redirect them to non-z version you've installed. Although most-likely technically feasible given enough time and customer mind share, it seems to me that the real difficulty for LzLabs will be a business model based on antiquated metrics in an ever-changing landscape. Today's z/OS-based mainframe is doing things unimagined just a few years ago such as web-based software management, MWaaS cloud-based middleware provisioning, arguably the best Java implementation in the industry, substantial and ever increasing participation in the API Economy, etc. with new innovations appearing more quickly than ever thanks to Agile/DevOps/continuous delivery development models. (It's precisely these innovations that enabled Rocket Software's Apache Spark implementation to be developed and made available to z/OS customers in near record time.) It's no longer clear that moving off the mainframe can be fully rationalized as the "smart" choice for most z/OS customers. Indeed, many are moving work in the opposite direction with great success and saving heaps of money in the process. One excellent example is the "z/OS and DevOps" story Walmart told in their Tuesday morning keynote presentation at SHARE in Atlanta... -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
No - just understand the differences in application structures and assumptions on the environment. Jerry Whitteridge Manager Mainframe Systems & Storage Albertsons - Safeway Inc. 623 869 5523 Corporate Tieline - 85523 If you feel in control you just aren't going fast enough. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 12:50 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld Along those lines, would such a product have to/be able to "emulate" DB2? Easy to come halfway close (MySQL) -- damned difficult to do it all. Just ask Oracle. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jerry Whitteridge Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:57 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld The problems occur not in the move of the programs and their execution, but in the logic of the application design which nearly always makes assumptions about the environment the application was designed around. Moving the application code without the underlying infrastructure that it relies on is what kill the functionality of the application on the new platform. (I'm talking about things like application security, multiple userids used for different functions, database access security, utilities, enqueues to prevent concurrent access etc. etc. etc.) Jerry Whitteridge Manager Mainframe Systems & Storage Albertsons - Safeway Inc. 623 869 5523 Corporate Tieline - 85523 If you feel in control you just aren't going fast enough. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of zMan Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 11:46 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld Um, OK...so it's going to work for the subset of programs that happen to use the calls that they've implemented? This reminds me of early Windows, when it was a shell over DOS: everything was fine until it wasn't, when you'd try something that hadn't been handled yet, and fall off the edge of the earth. Seems like it's going to take a ton of testing to be sure your application is going to run safely?! On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:06 PM, Mike Schwab wrote: > Sounds like z/390. Keep the hardware instructions, rewrite the z/OS calls. > > On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 10:49 PM, zMan wrote: > > http://www.computerworlduk.com/infrastructure/lzlabs- > promises-end-mainframe-migration-woes-with-software- > defined-approach-3645686/ > > seems enthralled with LzLabs, but the article doesn't really shed > > any > light > > that I can see. > > > > Consider statements like: > > *Yet, while considered robust and reliable for certain uses, > > mainframes > are > > costly to maintain and difficult to support, particularly due to the > > imminent retirement of those with knowledge of a system’s inner > workings.* > > > > OK, we can debate this (and have), but then: > > *Cresswell described the migration process: “When an application is > > moved from the mainframe into our environment we don't recompile it > > or anything like that. We literally take the binary code that comes > > off the mainframe environment,” Cresswell explained.* > > > > How does this help with the maintenance issue? Do you keep a real z > > for a dev platform? > > > > Next graf says: > > *“At the time we put it into the container we replace all the APIs > > with contemporary ones that reference our software defined mainframe > container.”* > > Um, right. So that > > L R3,540Get TCB address > > statement is going to get replaced? Or just replicated/emulated? Or > they're > > going to emulate all of the data structures in z/OS? > > > > Or is this all a shell game, and it's really just Herc in the cloud? > > > > I'm not opposed to someone doing something to shake things up. But > > the > lack > > of detail from Lz is starting to smell like PSI redux. > > -- > > zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" > > > > > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO > > IBM-MAIN > > > > -- > Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA > Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN _
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 11:50:04 -0800, Charles Mills wrote: >would such a product have to/be able to "emulate" DB2? May not have to emulate it. DB2 is available on other platforms. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: z/OS Web Based Dropbox ?
Thanks for the thought. It was suggested that we look at FTP+ which is part of Connect:Direct - something we already have but didn't know that feature existed. It looks very promising for what we need. -- Lionel B. Dyck Mainframe Systems Programmer - TRA Enterprise Operations (Station 200) (005OP6.3.10) Information and Technology, IT Operations and Services -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Rick Troth Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 1:42 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: z/OS Web Based Dropbox ? On 11/29/16 13:12, Dyck, Lionel B. (TRA) wrote: > Does anyone know of a z/OS web based dropbox application that will allow a > user to upload a file securely and to download a file securely? I remember, but cannot seem to find, RSYNC ported to USS. RSYNC would help on this point, and so many others. If you can get a consumer-friendly web interface to z/OS, great. If not, then you can certainly get a consumer-friendly web interface to some off-platform file hierarchy. (Unix, Linux, Windows, Mac) You could then RSYNC between that and USS and then copy (if needed) to/from non-USS datasets. (Depending on your workload, come of your content could stay in USS making matters simpler.) Works. If only we could find that USS RSYNC. -- R; <>< -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
Along those lines, would such a product have to/be able to "emulate" DB2? Easy to come halfway close (MySQL) -- damned difficult to do it all. Just ask Oracle. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jerry Whitteridge Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:57 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld The problems occur not in the move of the programs and their execution, but in the logic of the application design which nearly always makes assumptions about the environment the application was designed around. Moving the application code without the underlying infrastructure that it relies on is what kill the functionality of the application on the new platform. (I'm talking about things like application security, multiple userids used for different functions, database access security, utilities, enqueues to prevent concurrent access etc. etc. etc.) Jerry Whitteridge Manager Mainframe Systems & Storage Albertsons - Safeway Inc. 623 869 5523 Corporate Tieline - 85523 If you feel in control you just aren't going fast enough. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of zMan Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 11:46 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld Um, OK...so it's going to work for the subset of programs that happen to use the calls that they've implemented? This reminds me of early Windows, when it was a shell over DOS: everything was fine until it wasn't, when you'd try something that hadn't been handled yet, and fall off the edge of the earth. Seems like it's going to take a ton of testing to be sure your application is going to run safely?! On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:06 PM, Mike Schwab wrote: > Sounds like z/390. Keep the hardware instructions, rewrite the z/OS calls. > > On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 10:49 PM, zMan wrote: > > http://www.computerworlduk.com/infrastructure/lzlabs- > promises-end-mainframe-migration-woes-with-software- > defined-approach-3645686/ > > seems enthralled with LzLabs, but the article doesn't really shed > > any > light > > that I can see. > > > > Consider statements like: > > *Yet, while considered robust and reliable for certain uses, > > mainframes > are > > costly to maintain and difficult to support, particularly due to the > > imminent retirement of those with knowledge of a system’s inner > workings.* > > > > OK, we can debate this (and have), but then: > > *Cresswell described the migration process: “When an application is > > moved from the mainframe into our environment we don't recompile it > > or anything like that. We literally take the binary code that comes > > off the mainframe environment,” Cresswell explained.* > > > > How does this help with the maintenance issue? Do you keep a real z > > for a dev platform? > > > > Next graf says: > > *“At the time we put it into the container we replace all the APIs > > with contemporary ones that reference our software defined mainframe > container.”* > > Um, right. So that > > L R3,540Get TCB address > > statement is going to get replaced? Or just replicated/emulated? Or > they're > > going to emulate all of the data structures in z/OS? > > > > Or is this all a shell game, and it's really just Herc in the cloud? > > > > I'm not opposed to someone doing something to shake things up. But > > the > lack > > of detail from Lz is starting to smell like PSI redux. > > -- > > zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" > > > > > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO > > IBM-MAIN > > > > -- > Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA > Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN Warning: All e-mail sent to this address will be received by the corporate e-mail system, and is subject to archival and review by someone other than the recipient. This e-mail may contain proprietary information and is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient(s), you are notified that you have received this message in error and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this message is stric
Re: z/OS Web Based Dropbox ?
On 11/29/16 13:12, Dyck, Lionel B. (TRA) wrote: Does anyone know of a z/OS web based dropbox application that will allow a user to upload a file securely and to download a file securely? I remember, but cannot seem to find, RSYNC ported to USS. RSYNC would help on this point, and so many others. If you can get a consumer-friendly web interface to z/OS, great. If not, then you can certainly get a consumer-friendly web interface to some off-platform file hierarchy. (Unix, Linux, Windows, Mac) You could then RSYNC between that and USS and then copy (if needed) to/from non-USS datasets. (Depending on your workload, come of your content could stay in USS making matters simpler.) Works. If only we could find that USS RSYNC. -- R; <>< -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Why Can't You Buy z Mainframe Services from Amazon Cloud Services?
mitchd...@gmail.com (Dana Mitchell) writes: > Exactly! They are just managing the decline and extracting maximum > profit out of it along the way, IBM (and more importantly Wall St.) > have no interest in expanding the z business. > > I wouldn't exactly consider cloud a high margin business. there was scenario in the 90s when wallstreet probably cared. 1992 IBM had gone into the red and was being reorganized into the 13 "baby blues" in preparation for breacking up the company. At the time, large number of customers were moving off mainframes to other platforms (major factor in company going into the red) ... however large part of the financial industry & wallstreet was still heavily invested in mainframes (I've periodically told story about senior disk engineer doing talk in the late 80s at annual, world-wide, internal communication group ... claiming the communication group was going to be responsible for demise of disk division, they were seeing data fleeing mainframe datacenters with drop in disk sales). The former president of AMEX which had been in battle with KKR for private-equity take-over of RJR ... and KKR won: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbarians_at_the_Gate:_The_Fall_of_RJR_Nabisco KKR ran into problem with RJR and hired away president of AMEX to turn it around. Then the IBM board hired him away to resurrect IBM and reverse the breakup ... using some of the same techniques that were used at RJR: http://www.ibmemployee.com/RetirementHeist.shtml Also in 1992, AMEX spun off a lot of its dataprocessing into independent business unit which was the largest IPO up until that time. Besides doing a lot of AMEX stuff, it also does a significant amount of transaction, statementing, account management, etc outsourcing for large number of other financial institutions (at one point handling everything for over half of all credit card accounts in the US). It has been one of the largest mainframe customers (total trivia, 15yrs later, KKR does private-equity take-over of that business, in the largest reverse-IPO up until that time). Starting in the middle 90s, major financial institutions spent billions of dollars to move off mainframe cobol overnight batch settlement to straight-though processing on large number of "killer micros". Over decades, batch financial had been front-ended with "real-time" transaction, but they were really just being queued for overnight batch processing window. In the 90s, globalization was currenting size of overnight batch window and singificantly increasing workload ... breaking the overrnight window. Turns out the efforts were using some standard parallization libraries that had 100 times the overhead of cobol batch. The toy demos looked good ... but pointing out to them that they wouldn't scale was ignored. They had to go into deployments that went down in spectacular flames (100 times overhead totally swamping any throughput anticipated with large number of "killer micros"). Middle of last decade I was involved in project that did high-level specification of business processes that was then decomposed into large number of light-weight SQL statements. It leveraged the significant efforts by major RDBMS vendors (including IBM) in enormous throughput for parallized cluster operation. It easily demonstrated the required throughput for straight-through processing along with being able to easily add all sort of enhancements (helped by advances in "killer micros" gave them throughput compareable to mainframes). Did well accepted demonstrations for major financial associations ... and then hit brickwall. Was finally told that there were too many executives that bore the scars of the failed efforts in the 90s and it was going to have to wait for new generation of executives (which could be demise of one of the last major mainframe cash cows). Trivia: I was involved in the original relational/SQL implementation, System/R and tech transfer to Endicott for product release. At the time this was done "under the radar" because most of the company was focused on the strategic next generation DBMS, (code-name) EAGLE. When EAGLE imploded, there was request for how fast could System/R be available on MVS ... which was eventually released as DB2 (originally for decision support only). -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Shopz Hung?
What ever it is, I think the same problem is also affecting SMP/E's RECEIVE service retrieval. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
Circa 1980 IBM delivered a new version of MVS that issued some instructions that the Amdahl model we (TRW Credit Data) ran on could not handle. Amdahl countered with some OS modifications that trapped every S0C1, examined it, and--if appropriate--simulated the action or NOOPed it. They also replaced the offending instruction with either a NOOP or a branch directly to the simulation routine. As the system ran, it became more efficient as S0C1 abends diminished in number. There are ways for clever folks to make things work against formidable odds. . . J.O.Skip Robinson Southern California Edison Company Electric Dragon Team Paddler SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager 323-715-0595 Mobile 626-543-6132 Office ⇐=== NEW robin...@sce.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Mike Schwab Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 9:06 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: (External):Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld Sounds like z/390. Keep the hardware instructions, rewrite the z/OS calls. On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 10:49 PM, zMan wrote: > http://www.computerworlduk.com/infrastructure/lzlabs-promises-end-main > frame-migration-woes-with-software-defined-approach-3645686/ > seems enthralled with LzLabs, but the article doesn't really shed any > light that I can see. > > Consider statements like: > *Yet, while considered robust and reliable for certain uses, > mainframes are costly to maintain and difficult to support, > particularly due to the imminent retirement of those with knowledge of > a system’s inner workings.* > > OK, we can debate this (and have), but then: > *Cresswell described the migration process: “When an application is > moved from the mainframe into our environment we don't recompile it or > anything like that. We literally take the binary code that comes off > the mainframe environment,” Cresswell explained.* > > How does this help with the maintenance issue? Do you keep a real z > for a dev platform? > > Next graf says: > *“At the time we put it into the container we replace all the APIs > with contemporary ones that reference our software defined mainframe > container.”* Um, right. So that > L R3,540Get TCB address > statement is going to get replaced? Or just replicated/emulated? Or > they're going to emulate all of the data structures in z/OS? > > Or is this all a shell game, and it's really just Herc in the cloud? > > I'm not opposed to someone doing something to shake things up. But the > lack of detail from Lz is starting to smell like PSI redux. > -- > zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" > Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: pty (was: TSO Setup on SSH)
Paul Gilmartin wrote: I belive that the 3270 OMVS command does create a PTY, but the function ssh uses (tcsetattr()?) fails to mask passwords on a 3270, Ssh is aware of this, so it refuses to prompt for a password Aha. Well, IBM should fix that, and also fix their broken SCP implementation :) -- Jack J. Woehr # Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of www.well.com/~jax # thinking, a way of skeptically interrogating the universe www.softwoehr.com # with a fine understanding of human fallibility. - Carl Sagan -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
The only thing easier about the Windows API relative to the z/OS "API" is that it is implemented almost entirely as library calls. There is little in Windows that is equivalent to the control block chasing that is a common and often necessary programming technique on z/OS. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of John McKown Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:55 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Charles Mills wrote: > I agree, but it must be an adequately solvable sort of problem if Wine > can do it for the Windows API (adequately). > > Charles > > You just beat me to that (immediate _after_ I clicked SEND). But I'd consider WINE more like CA's DUO which ran DOS programs under MVS without recompilation. DUO intercepted the DOS service requests and emulated them or vectored them to the MVS service (a translation stub kind of). Of course, IMO, the DOS API is far simpler than Windows. Not a lot of "crap" like MS. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
The problems occur not in the move of the programs and their execution, but in the logic of the application design which nearly always makes assumptions about the environment the application was designed around. Moving the application code without the underlying infrastructure that it relies on is what kill the functionality of the application on the new platform. (I'm talking about things like application security, multiple userids used for different functions, database access security, utilities, enqueues to prevent concurrent access etc. etc. etc.) Jerry Whitteridge Manager Mainframe Systems & Storage Albertsons - Safeway Inc. 623 869 5523 Corporate Tieline - 85523 If you feel in control you just aren't going fast enough. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of zMan Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 11:46 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld Um, OK...so it's going to work for the subset of programs that happen to use the calls that they've implemented? This reminds me of early Windows, when it was a shell over DOS: everything was fine until it wasn't, when you'd try something that hadn't been handled yet, and fall off the edge of the earth. Seems like it's going to take a ton of testing to be sure your application is going to run safely?! On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:06 PM, Mike Schwab wrote: > Sounds like z/390. Keep the hardware instructions, rewrite the z/OS calls. > > On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 10:49 PM, zMan wrote: > > http://www.computerworlduk.com/infrastructure/lzlabs- > promises-end-mainframe-migration-woes-with-software- > defined-approach-3645686/ > > seems enthralled with LzLabs, but the article doesn't really shed > > any > light > > that I can see. > > > > Consider statements like: > > *Yet, while considered robust and reliable for certain uses, > > mainframes > are > > costly to maintain and difficult to support, particularly due to the > > imminent retirement of those with knowledge of a system’s inner > workings.* > > > > OK, we can debate this (and have), but then: > > *Cresswell described the migration process: “When an application is > > moved from the mainframe into our environment we don't recompile it > > or anything like that. We literally take the binary code that comes > > off the mainframe environment,” Cresswell explained.* > > > > How does this help with the maintenance issue? Do you keep a real z > > for a dev platform? > > > > Next graf says: > > *“At the time we put it into the container we replace all the APIs > > with contemporary ones that reference our software defined mainframe > container.”* > > Um, right. So that > > L R3,540Get TCB address > > statement is going to get replaced? Or just replicated/emulated? Or > they're > > going to emulate all of the data structures in z/OS? > > > > Or is this all a shell game, and it's really just Herc in the cloud? > > > > I'm not opposed to someone doing something to shake things up. But > > the > lack > > of detail from Lz is starting to smell like PSI redux. > > -- > > zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" > > > > > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO > > IBM-MAIN > > > > -- > Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA > Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN Warning: All e-mail sent to this address will be received by the corporate e-mail system, and is subject to archival and review by someone other than the recipient. This e-mail may contain proprietary information and is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient(s), you are notified that you have received this message in error and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Charles Mills wrote: > I agree, but it must be an adequately solvable sort of problem if Wine can > do it for the Windows API (adequately). > > Charles > > You just beat me to that (immediate _after_ I clicked SEND). But I'd consider WINE more like CA's DUO which ran DOS programs under MVS without recompilation. DUO intercepted the DOS service requests and emulated them or vectored them to the MVS service (a translation stub kind of). Of course, IMO, the DOS API is far simpler than Windows. Not a lot of "crap" like MS. -- Heisenberg may have been here. http://xkcd.com/1770/ Maranatha! <>< John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:45 PM, zMan wrote: > Um, OK...so it's going to work for the subset of programs that happen to > use the calls that they've implemented? This reminds me of early Windows, > when it was a shell over DOS: everything was fine until it wasn't, when > you'd try something that hadn't been handled yet, and fall off the edge of > the earth. > To me, it conceptually sounds a lot like WINE under Linux/Intel. WINE allows Windows programs to run under Linux (if the Linux & Windows match - i.e. both 32 bit or both 64 bit) without recompilation. I have used it on occasion. And it works rather well, considering. Of course, there are the times when I'd get a message what started with: "FIXME: WINE does not implement ..." . And with LzLabs it would be more like running WINE on Linux/ARM by using QEMU to execute the Intel opcodes in the Windows program. > > Seems like it's going to take a ton of testing to be sure your application > is going to run safely?! > > -- Heisenberg may have been here. http://xkcd.com/1770/ Maranatha! <>< John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
I agree, but it must be an adequately solvable sort of problem if Wine can do it for the Windows API (adequately). Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of zMan Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:46 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld Um, OK...so it's going to work for the subset of programs that happen to use the calls that they've implemented? This reminds me of early Windows, when it was a shell over DOS: everything was fine until it wasn't, when you'd try something that hadn't been handled yet, and fall off the edge of the earth. Seems like it's going to take a ton of testing to be sure your application is going to run safely?! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
Um, OK...so it's going to work for the subset of programs that happen to use the calls that they've implemented? This reminds me of early Windows, when it was a shell over DOS: everything was fine until it wasn't, when you'd try something that hadn't been handled yet, and fall off the edge of the earth. Seems like it's going to take a ton of testing to be sure your application is going to run safely?! On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 12:06 PM, Mike Schwab wrote: > Sounds like z/390. Keep the hardware instructions, rewrite the z/OS calls. > > On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 10:49 PM, zMan wrote: > > http://www.computerworlduk.com/infrastructure/lzlabs- > promises-end-mainframe-migration-woes-with-software- > defined-approach-3645686/ > > seems enthralled with LzLabs, but the article doesn't really shed any > light > > that I can see. > > > > Consider statements like: > > *Yet, while considered robust and reliable for certain uses, mainframes > are > > costly to maintain and difficult to support, particularly due to the > > imminent retirement of those with knowledge of a system’s inner > workings.* > > > > OK, we can debate this (and have), but then: > > *Cresswell described the migration process: “When an application is moved > > from the mainframe into our environment we don't recompile it or anything > > like that. We literally take the binary code that comes off the mainframe > > environment,” Cresswell explained.* > > > > How does this help with the maintenance issue? Do you keep a real z for a > > dev platform? > > > > Next graf says: > > *“At the time we put it into the container we replace all the APIs with > > contemporary ones that reference our software defined mainframe > container.”* > > Um, right. So that > > L R3,540Get TCB address > > statement is going to get replaced? Or just replicated/emulated? Or > they're > > going to emulate all of the data structures in z/OS? > > > > Or is this all a shell game, and it's really just Herc in the cloud? > > > > I'm not opposed to someone doing something to shake things up. But the > lack > > of detail from Lz is starting to smell like PSI redux. > > -- > > zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" > > > > -- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > -- > Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA > Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Query for Destination z article: remote system programming
Remote system programming used to mean using a keypunch machine outside the data center. Then 3270-style devices allowed increased potential distance -- and hike -- to and from mainframes. Finally, networked terminals, workstations, tablets, and smart phones made location irrelevant. Whether in an office or working from home, system programmers/administrators can now be in the next office, next building, next city, next time zone, next continent. Or, can they? Is there good or bad news here? Whether or not they ever did, do today's system programmers need physical access to data canters? Why or why not? How far is it practical to be remote (from systems, colleagues, managers, everything) before distance from -- lack of immediacy to -- data center, operations staff, users, matters? If you're doing remote support/admin, what are your tips regarding technologies to use, work practices, challenges, problems to solve, etc.? What connectivity is necessary, what equipment do you need (or wish for) at hand? Can you wrangle z/OS from a tablet or phone? What do you wish you'd known when you started providing remote support? Please copy replies to me directly so they're not buried in list digest; I'd appreciate hearing back by Friday, December 16th. I've collected some discussion about this from the lists so I'll likely query a few people directly. Please include your name and affiliation so I needn't request it. And remember, this is for publication -- while I can likely paraphrase what's said if you'd rather be anonymous, for credibility, I'd much rather attribute statements. Thanks! -- Gabriel Goldberg, Computers and Publishing, Inc. g...@gabegold.com 3401 Silver Maple Place, Falls Church, VA 22042 (703) 204-0433 LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/gabegoldTwitter: GabeG0 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Starting a STC with options
On Mon, Dec 12, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Mark Regan wrote: > Is there a way to start a STC so that when it is stopped that its complete > job log is sent by NJE to another JES2 node. The reason I ask is that we > have JES2 nodes that don't have an archival system on them, so I want to > send the job log to a JES2 system that does via NJE. > > Thanks. > > The easiest way to to convert it from an "started task" to a "started job". If you do that, you can put in a nearly normal JOB card (no CLASS=) and immediately after it, put in a // OUTPUT card. ref: http://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieab600/iea3b6_Coding_the_JOB_statement_for_the_started_task.htm ref: http://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.ieab600/outst.htm Example: //MYSTC JOB MSGCLASS=R USE PROPER OUTPUT CLASS //JESDS OUTPUT DEFAULT=YES, //JESDS=YES, //CLASS=R, //OUTDISP=(WRITE,WRITE) //DEST=NJENODE //* REST OF THE STC JCL -- Heisenberg may have been here. http://xkcd.com/1770/ Maranatha! <>< John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: EXTERNAL: Starting a STC with options
/*ROUTE PRINT X should work for you but you may need to switch to a "Started Job" so as to be able to specify that line as it should be immediately following the job card . Jerry Whitteridge Manager Mainframe Systems & Storage Albertsons - Safeway Inc. 623 869 5523 Corporate Tieline - 85523 If you feel in control you just aren't going fast enough. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Mark Regan Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:58 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: EXTERNAL: Starting a STC with options Is there a way to start a STC so that when it is stopped that its complete job log is sent by NJE to another JES2 node. The reason I ask is that we have JES2 nodes that don't have an archival system on them, so I want to send the job log to a JES2 system that does via NJE. Thanks. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN Warning: All e-mail sent to this address will be received by the corporate e-mail system, and is subject to archival and review by someone other than the recipient. This e-mail may contain proprietary information and is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient(s), you are notified that you have received this message in error and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Starting a STC with options
Is there a way to start a STC so that when it is stopped that its complete job log is sent by NJE to another JES2 node. The reason I ask is that we have JES2 nodes that don't have an archival system on them, so I want to send the job log to a JES2 system that does via NJE. Thanks. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
pty (was: TSO Setup on SSH)
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 09:50:05 -0700, Jack J. Woehr wrote: >Paul Gilmartin wrote: >> No "walls", just pitfalls. Should I submit an SR about the "script" glory >> hole? > >Possibly. Venkat cannot be the only person to run up against the limitation of >TN3270 sessions presenting no ptty. I've >experienced it. > I belive that the 3270 OMVS command does create a PTY, but the function ssh uses (tcsetattr()?) fails to mask passwords on a 3270, Ssh is aware of this, so it refuses to prompt for a password when it recognizes that the PTY is from a 3270. Log from 3270 OMVS: user@OS/390.25.00: tty /dev/ttyp user@OS/390.25.00: script Script command is started. The file is typescript. ... you have mail ... user@OS/390.25.00: tty /dev/ttyp0001 ... but ssh doesn't recognize the script PTY as a 3270, so prompts for a password. It appears that FTP uses a GETPASS interface, long deprecated by POSIX to prompt for a password. But if I call FTP under script it prompts for a password, failing to mask it. IBM really ought to fix tcsetattr() and remove all these problems. I suspect that if I open an SR they'll modify script to present a 3270 terminal to clients, leaving tcsetattr() broken as they did for an SR I submitted years ago. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [OT] S/370 Archive Footage
Before S/360, characters were often encoded in 6 bits. Even ASCII was 7 bits. Which allowed the definition of UTF-8. On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 3:14 PM, Bill Woodger wrote: > I never thought I'd see film of "the flick", for manual bursting of fan-fold > paper, on YouTube. > > "Characters" is not a surprise. The man with the company cheque-book probably > wouldn't know a byte if it bit him. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: LzLabs in ComputerWorld
Sounds like z/390. Keep the hardware instructions, rewrite the z/OS calls. On Sun, Dec 11, 2016 at 10:49 PM, zMan wrote: > http://www.computerworlduk.com/infrastructure/lzlabs-promises-end-mainframe-migration-woes-with-software-defined-approach-3645686/ > seems enthralled with LzLabs, but the article doesn't really shed any light > that I can see. > > Consider statements like: > *Yet, while considered robust and reliable for certain uses, mainframes are > costly to maintain and difficult to support, particularly due to the > imminent retirement of those with knowledge of a system’s inner workings.* > > OK, we can debate this (and have), but then: > *Cresswell described the migration process: “When an application is moved > from the mainframe into our environment we don't recompile it or anything > like that. We literally take the binary code that comes off the mainframe > environment,” Cresswell explained.* > > How does this help with the maintenance issue? Do you keep a real z for a > dev platform? > > Next graf says: > *“At the time we put it into the container we replace all the APIs with > contemporary ones that reference our software defined mainframe container.”* > Um, right. So that > L R3,540Get TCB address > statement is going to get replaced? Or just replicated/emulated? Or they're > going to emulate all of the data structures in z/OS? > > Or is this all a shell game, and it's really just Herc in the cloud? > > I'm not opposed to someone doing something to shake things up. But the lack > of detail from Lz is starting to smell like PSI redux. > -- > zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it" > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Frig (was: I/O error ...)
Paul Gilmartin wrote: "Frigate" is probably unrelated. ISTR the novel /Up the Down Staircase/ observing that one could not possibly introdcue Emily Dickinson's poem "There is no Frigate like a Book" into a New York public high school English class. -- Jack J. Woehr # Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of www.well.com/~jax # thinking, a way of skeptically interrogating the universe www.softwoehr.com # with a fine understanding of human fallibility. - Carl Sagan -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: TSO Setup on SSH
Paul Gilmartin wrote: No "walls", just pitfalls. Should I submit an SR about the "script" glory hole? Possibly. Venkat cannot be the only person to run up against the limitation of TN3270 sessions presenting no ptty. I've experienced it. But I did give him what might be a workaround to try: ssh into USS and then submit his job via the 'tso' command. -- Jack J. Woehr # Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of www.well.com/~jax # thinking, a way of skeptically interrogating the universe www.softwoehr.com # with a fine understanding of human fallibility. - Carl Sagan -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: TSO Setup on SSH
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 00:14:24 -0700, Jack J. Woehr wrote: > >It must be somehow doable to use a password, but it certainly wasn't the >architectural intent of the IBM developers. >The difference between 3270 and Unix-style ttys is too great. >Furthermore SSH experts inside and outside IBM view passwords in association >with batch operations as a security risk. >You are better off to use a key exchange. > No "walls", just pitfalls. Should I submit an SR about the "script" glory hole? -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Frig (was: I/O error ...)
Please change the friggin' Subject: when you change the friggin' topic! On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 10:01:36 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote: >Urban Dictionary (one of several definitions) > Without looking, I have little uncertainty about the etymology of many of those several definitions. "Frigate" is probably unrelated. But I recall the Smothers Brothers once had fun with that one. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: TSO Setup on SSH
venkat kulkarni wrote: I do agree that we should be using password less, but as suggested earlier that apart from public key, we can also use password verify way to authentication. So, I want to try this to complete this activity . If it's just for testing, maybe this would work for you: * ssh from your workstation into USS (instead of using TN3270 into TSO) * use the USS command 'tso' to submit the JCL Then I think you have your ptty with which the connection for interactive password entry can take place. See "tso — Run a TSO/E command from the shell" in /UNIX System Services Command Reference Version 2 Release 2 SA23-2280-02/ -- Jack J. Woehr # Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of www.well.com/~jax # thinking, a way of skeptically interrogating the universe www.softwoehr.com # with a fine understanding of human fallibility. - Carl Sagan -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
Urban Dictionary (one of several definitions) frig (Term used by engineers) To make a rough-and-ready, quick-and-dirty adjustment to something to make it work or to make it operate in a particular way. To adjust manually for a particular purpose. Can be used of a physical device but also of a computer program, etc. "Since I'd figured out how it worked, I decided to frig it so it output the data exactly how *I* wanted it." I have to say it is over 20 years since I heard it in that context. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: RFE? SPFEDIT ENQ for /bin/cp and C RTL?
On Mon, 12 Dec 2016 09:22:14 -0600, Kirk Wolf wrote: >I created this one for the C RTL in November 2015: > >https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/rfe/execute?use_case=viewRfe&CR_ID=80811 > >Please vote for it if you agree with the requirement. > I voted. I also added a comment about /bin/cp since I believe that's a consequential behavior. I hope you regard that as friendly. Thanks, gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
On 2016-12-12, at 00:56, Anthony Thompson wrote: > Ran this JCL : > > // > // EXPORT SYMLIST=* > // SET TEST='THIS IS THE VALUE OF THE SUBSTITUTED STRING.' > //STEP1EXEC PGM=IEBGENER > //SYSUT1DD DATA,SYMBOLS=JCLONLY > &TEST > /* > //SYSUT2DD SYSOUT=(,) > //SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=(,) > //SYSIN DD DUMMY > > Only removed the DCB on SYSUT1. Job worked. > Than's not "only". You also changed the content of SYSUT1 in my example. Try it with the SYSUT1 I cited, with or without DCB: //SYSUT1DD *,SYMBOLS=JCLONLY,DCB=LRECL=222 This is a test of symbol use in instream data sets. Test here: &TEST On 2016-12-12, at 02:50, Anthony Thompson wrote: > Just so. But anyone can frig around with invalid DCB's and make any utility > break. What do you claim was invalid about my DCB. Cite Reference. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: RFE? SPFEDIT ENQ for /bin/cp and C RTL?
I created this one for the C RTL in November 2015: https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/rfe/execute?use_case=viewRfe&CR_ID=80811 Please vote for it if you agree with the requirement. Kirk Wolf Dovetailed Technologies http://dovetail.com On Sat, Dec 10, 2016 at 2:23 PM, Paul Gilmartin < 000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: > Would this gain support?: > > I have encountered failures using /bin/cp on PDS(E) members > when the data set is ENQ SHRed by other jobs. I suspect C > RTL suffers similar restrictions. > > ISPF Edit, FTP, and NFS are clever enough to use (the same) > ENQ on individual members. I'd like to see /bin/cp similarly > enhanced. > > (At times, my circumvention is to use FTP or NFS from my > desktop to perform the operation.) > > Would this be two RFEs or one? I suspect /bin/cp are so closely > bound that fixing one would almost certainly have the collateral > benefit of fixing the other. > > -- gil > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Shopz Hung?
Thanks for the confirmation, Dave. Not that misery love companybut glad it is not just me. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jousma, David Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 10:05 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Shopz Hung? Yea, I have one waiting in download phase. This is typical of Monday mornings it seems. _ Dave Jousma Manager Mainframe Engineering, Assistant Vice President david.jou...@53.com 1830 East Paris, Grand Rapids, MI 49546 MD RSCB2H p 616.653.8429 f 616.653.2717 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Richards, Robert B. Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 9:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Shopz Hung? Anyone else experiencing issues with ShopzSeries? I have submitted two orders and neither of them progresses past the point of submit status. It has been almost two hours since the original submission. Bob -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN This e-mail transmission contains information that is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended only for the addressee(s) named above. If you receive this e-mail in error, please do not read, copy or disseminate it in any manner. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. Please reply to the message immediately by informing the sender that the message was misdirected. After replying, please erase it from your computer system. Your assistance in correcting this error is appreciated. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Shopz Hung?
Yea, I have one waiting in download phase. This is typical of Monday mornings it seems. _ Dave Jousma Manager Mainframe Engineering, Assistant Vice President david.jou...@53.com 1830 East Paris, Grand Rapids, MI 49546 MD RSCB2H p 616.653.8429 f 616.653.2717 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Richards, Robert B. Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 9:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Shopz Hung? Anyone else experiencing issues with ShopzSeries? I have submitted two orders and neither of them progresses past the point of submit status. It has been almost two hours since the original submission. Bob -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN This e-mail transmission contains information that is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended only for the addressee(s) named above. If you receive this e-mail in error, please do not read, copy or disseminate it in any manner. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. Please reply to the message immediately by informing the sender that the message was misdirected. After replying, please erase it from your computer system. Your assistance in correcting this error is appreciated. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Shopz Hung?
Anyone else experiencing issues with ShopzSeries? I have submitted two orders and neither of them progresses past the point of submit status. It has been almost two hours since the original submission. Bob -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
Um, the Oxford English (as in England) Dictionary lists the same meaning I know here across the pond. https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/frig Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Bill Woodger Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 2:02 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin More computing history. "Frig". No, it doesn't mean what those across the water may think. A particular UK-computing term, not sure of the origins, and it certainly "surprised" me when I cam across the use of the word as a 17-year-old trainee who happened to know the "other" meaning. "I'm going to run a little frig", "can you frig it?", "I put in a little frig last night, and now we need to fix it proper(ly)". Now, I'm off for a quick fag. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Why Can't You Buy z Mainframe Services from Amazon Cloud Services?
On Fri, 9 Dec 2016 17:31:32 -0500, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: > > I frankly doubt that the top layers of IBM even care if the z business > (eventually) goes away. Watson and cloud are their new saviors and future > cash cows > (or so they hope). > > Just my $0.02USD worth. > > Peter Exactly! They are just managing the decline and extracting maximum profit out of it along the way, IBM (and more importantly Wall St.) have no interest in expanding the z business. I wouldn't exactly consider cloud a high margin business. Dana -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
More computing history. "Frig". No, it doesn't mean what those across the water may think. A particular UK-computing term, not sure of the origins, and it certainly "surprised" me when I cam across the use of the word as a 17-year-old trainee who happened to know the "other" meaning. "I'm going to run a little frig", "can you frig it?", "I put in a little frig last night, and now we need to fix it proper(ly)". Now, I'm off for a quick fag. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
Just so. But anyone can frig around with invalid DCB's and make any utility break. Ant. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Bill Woodger Sent: Monday, 12 December 2016 7:14 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin So that would be an ordinary 80-byte SYSIN, data within 80 bytes. Not what Paul is trying. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: I/O error substituting symbols in sysin
So that would be an ordinary 80-byte SYSIN, data within 80 bytes. Not what Paul is trying. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
