Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
I'm quite sure that if you do, I am the only one who wont profit off it haha Well Janice, dear, haven't you ever heard of agents? It wasn't you that was intended to benefit from this marketing strategy. But you would be famous. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
every time I have ever started a horse or rode one the first time, i hust had a feeling... later on I would think holey moley what was i thinking, but it just felt right at the time. I have felt for quite a while nasi would have no problem if I wanted to get on him, but i dont want a lot of weight on him. One thing I want.. is to see how he will be with others really handling him, leading him etc (with me there) instead of just petting and giving treats, will be interesting to see. I think i will know if he isnt ready, or if its a bad decision at the time. and if it is i will just have a training session of having him groomed, led, hang around with children. One time while wearing a dress, I climbed a roundpen rail and mounted a green horse that had never been ridden and he had on only a halter. not a soul around. It was at the place where I bought jaspar. The horse turned and looked at me long, eyes soft, just stood there. at complete peace. Then I thought oh c***p how do I get down! I grabbed the roundpen rail and sorta dragged myself off while he walked away casually. I just had a feeling about him! He turned out to be a very unpredictable horse under saddle that hurt three people pretty bad last I heard of him. The first time I ever got on stonewall, same thing. It was just time. No one was around. two years of ground training leading up to that moment. I just slid a leg over, he stood quietly. I petted him. I didnt ask him to go, I just got off. praise praisepraise :) I have gotten in trouble a couple of times riding strange horses. both times for friends looking at a horse for sale they were too chicken to ride. I had a good feeling tho so rode them. But one, a paso, i accidentally dropped one rein and he didnt neck rein so there I was. He started heading for the barn door, so low it would have conked my head but the owner stopped him. Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
>>> I just had the same idea yesterday. I've finally gotten my horses in to a >>> situation >>> that is much closer to my house, only a few miles, where I can see them >>> everyday. Good to hear from you, Kim. I thought about you just a couple of days ago. Good to hear that you're well and glad you've got a new and improved situation with your horses. >>> So in this zen moment, I put a sidepull on him, and jumped on bareback. He >>> stood real >>> nice, then he took a few steps, figuring out his balance, also stopped on a >>> really >>> light touch, very nicely. I did this three times. Maybe two minutes each. >>> The last >>> one, I tapped his butt, and he did a turn on the forehand, which was also >>> rewarded, we >>> will get the signals straight for forward and engaging the hindquarters. So >>> it was >>> great. I think that's a good point - finding those moments when you KNOW things are right, and taking advantage of them. Typically, I think that's better than working on a schedule. We have to have a true relationship with your horse though before you can do that. I'm sure you do, but not everyone does. I could REALLY take a beating if I confess...oh, what the heck. I sat on two-year-old Tifa VERY briefly one day a few weeks ago. She was lying down, and I went over to see her. She didn't get up, but seemed to remain 100% relaxed and peaceful. In a moment of insight, I knew I could put a leg over her. She accepted it without a thought, so I went ahead and put a little bit of weigth on her, while she was still down. She could care less. Since she was lying down, and I was only on her for maybe 10 seconds, I'm sure this didn't strain her back. I got up before she tried to get up, which I think was best - no scrambling to get off her in a hurry. I also know that I won't ride her any earlier because I did that - she's still at least 2-3 years from "saddle training". It was just an opportunity I saw to introduce her to the idea of a human on her back, and it was a peaceful easy experience for her to soak up over the next few years. That's not something I particularly expect to do with my other young ones - not unless such an easy opportunity presents itself in such an ideal way. Most likely, it will be another 2-3 years before anyone sits on her again. On the other hand, four-year-old Ima hasn't had anyone on her back yet. I've sort of swung my leg over her when she's come to visit me while I was sitting on the board fence, but I never had one of those Tifa-opportunities present itself for fully sitting on her. >>>I think my point is that riding a horse for the first time does not have to >>>be a >>>dangerous, dramatic affair, it really isn't if you are in >>>tuneI'll get a >>>video of the next time, now I have a video helper. It certainly doesn't have to be dramatic. Do you normally work with Snorri alone or with a helper? I prefer to do certain things along, but I'm lucky to have a good friend I can trust to help me with certain things. If too many people are around, or people I don't know, it's harder for me to get into those "zen moments." Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
On 4/30/08, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > nasi has been trained up til now to whoa, go, stand still at the > mounting block while I lean over him waving arms around, wiggle the > saddle vigorously, slap the stirrups against his side etc. He is fine > with all that. just stands there. I have ponied him on two trail > rides, he did great. He seems unafraid and not spooky of anything. > > I just had the same idea yesterday. I've finally gotten my horses in to a situation that is much closer to my house, only a few miles, where I can see them everyday. I am actually amazed at how little I have had to go over things with Snorri, as long as I do it right. I think I ground drove him a couple times, had already taught him to give to real light pressure at that point, not many sessions, so we were having a zen moment yesterday, one where he was really happy with me b/c I came to his rescue when he was trying to bite and itchy spot on his butt. I have recently leaned over his back a couple times, but not all the way on. So in this zen moment, I put a sidepull on him, and jumped on bareback. He stood real nice, then he took a few steps, figuring out his balance, also stopped on a really light touch, very nicely. I did this three times. Maybe two minutes each. The last one, I tapped his butt, and he did a turn on the forehand, which was also rewarded, we will get the signals straight for forward and engaging the hindquarters. So it was great. I also have lost 40 lbs over the last several months, partially because I thought I would be too heavy for him at that point. I think he can handle it now, just for a little walking. Lately I feel I have awakened in some aspects of how to get the best out of the horse, like really seeing how our energy affects the energy of the horse, etc. I think my point is that riding a horse for the first time does not have to be a dangerous, dramatic affair, it really isn't if you are in tuneI'll get a video of the next time, now I have a video helper. Kim M. (in Kentucky)
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
On 5/1/08, Nancy Sturm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Wonder if we could figure a way to market Janice? > > Nancy > I'm quite sure that if you do, I am the only one who wont profit off it haha Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
Oh Janice, I do so look forward to your posts. I was thinking that very thing earlier this morning. I consider Janice a national treasure and feel that her quirky wit is quite wasted on yahoo mail lists. Wonder if we could figure a way to market Janice? Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
>I think, what I will do, is have Kale . . .get on Nasi > and have him ride him up the mobile home stairs, then dive into the > geeses wading pool. SNORT!!! Oh Janice, I do so look forward to your posts. -- Renee M. in Michigan
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
On Thu, 1 May 2008 08:39:07 -0500, you wrote: >name my nephew out of a type of lettuce is beyond me...) It's a cabbage. I must admit I was thinking wow, what a strange name (but I thought maybe it had that spelling but some trendy pronunciation such as Karly and it was just me being un-cool to think it was just plain Kale) Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk ---
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
I think, what I will do, is have Kale (is it Cale? Why someone would name my nephew out of a type of lettuce is beyond me...) get on Nasi and have him ride him up the mobile home stairs, then dive into the geeses wading pool. His life might be endangered but what the heck, maybe it would win the virtual horse show. HA. a joke! a joke!! Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
>>> But any adult would be too heavy I think. Not just me. Even a 120 pound >>> adult would >>> be too heavy at this point I think! If you think he's not physically mature enough to carry even a small adult now, then why be in a rush for a child to sit on him? He's only four today, and I know that many horses continue to physically AND mentally mature until they are seven, or even ten.I think Ima, who's also celebrating a fourth birthday today, is both physically and mentally mature enough to have a small-medium adult sit on her, but I'm in no rush. She'll only be MORE mature when her turn comes around, hopefully later this year. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
I would bet your grandson has been riding much of his life - certainly for many years? Gabriel started riding when he was about 13 I think, but we started with lessons right from the get go and the girl we chose is a dressage rider. Then he rode her ponies over fences for a couple of years before he got too big for them - he's not a big guy, only about 5'6", but too big for our Secion A ponies. Now he's a sometimes endurance rider on his Arab, Tali Sinjabi.. This story took on a twist when his older brother drove him to his lesson one afternoon, fell in love on the spot, and eventually married Ellie the dressage instructor. They have a second baby due 6/28. So be very careful when choosing riding instructors that you choose someone you would welcome into the family. In the case, we did well. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
I have ground driven him a few times but he is way better at it than me! But he doesnt pull and drag on me. He is a very lackadaisacal nonchalant guy. I think it will be ok. Trust me. I know my horses and if he is the least bit uncomfortable or even fretting I will just let Kale waller all over him as he stands at the mounting block. I am in no way "starting him under saddle with a child". I guess that is a misunderstanding. I am just proceeding to the next logical step after two years of me teaching him cues as I lead him around to me wallering on him while he stands perfectly still at the mounting block, to now, time for someone to go ahead and sit on him. But any adult would be too heavy I think. Not just me. Even a 120 pound adult would be too heavy at this point I think! But one day I had him carry a sack of feed across the saddle all over the yard and he was fine with it, even when it fell and crashed at his feet, he was like "oh just one more weird thing she is doing to me all the time..." And I wasnt intending at ALL to have Kale RIDE him on his own using reins. yi. wouldnt even do that in a stall or roundpen. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
>>> I agree with you completely and then I am going to confess that I just >>> asked my grandson to do the first few rides on Yrsa. The difference here is that Gabriel is 17 and a better, more balanced rider than I am and he probably weighs more. He's certainly more agile and athletic than I am.l I don't have him train, although he did a great job with a Welsh pony I gave him several years ago. I just let him be the first person who sits on the ponies and the first person they move forward with. > Using a young person can make sense in a situation like you describe. I would bet your grandson has been riding much of his life - certainly for many years? There's certainly something to the first rider being an agile, balanced rider. I'd rather that the horses not be backed by a really large person the first time, but there's always the trade-off between all the factors: weight, balance, senstitivity/awareness, agility, calmness and experience. Emily would probably have been ok to have done the first rides by the time she was 13 or MAYBE even 12, but we didn't start any horses about that time, and I wouldn't have allowed her to do it for anyone else, for horses I didn't know very well. She was a phenomonally good rider though, and a very sharp and sensible kid who'd had really good and sensitive training. Ironically, I probably wouldn't have wanted her to do it between the ages of 13 and 16, as her hormones kicked in. Gosh knows, parents get awfully stupid about that time, and starting a horse would be no time for a "family situation" involving a petulant teenager! Kids hit adolescence at varying ages, and to varying degrees of rotten-ness, but that would be a factor I'd consider. Unfortunately, I'd say that most of the kids that are finally getting enough experience to be the first rider up about the time that adolesence strikes, and by the time that has settled, they are essentially adult sized. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
2008/4/30 Karen Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > The rider can often feel some tension building that the leader can't feel, but > if it's a kid up, you can't bank on having that feedback. That's pretty much how Cara and I work through things. Cara is probably 100 lbs and is a nicely balanced rider, so she starts the babies. She gives me directions, and I follow through with what ever she says, and all the while she's giving signals with her legs and using light reinforcement with the reins (if she happens to have them). That saidground driving is so valuable..I can't even tell you how valuable it is... Have you ground driven Nasi much Janice? I wish we all could be there and pull up lawn chairs and tell you all our wonderful wise thoughts from the sidelines... Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
>>> I work as a trauma nurse at a level one pediatric trauma center and I have >>> to say >>> that I am not crazy about this recurring theme of using kids to start >>> horses. I am >>> sure that Nasi is well prepared and that all will go well, but no matter >>> how many >>> people write and tell me that this is how they prefer to start their >>> horses, I am >>> still going to think it is a bad idea. I have to go with Jacki on this one. Even if the risk is minimal, if something DOES happen, it will be all the harder to cope with if a small child gets hurt. When you start a horse, you automatically have an inexperienced horse, and in Nasi's case, a very young one. That's the worst combination you can have: an immature, inexperienced kid and an immature horse. No matter how many times you tell a kid to do something, or not to do something, they are still kids, and they can still be impetuous or simply not hear or understand what you mean. What seems sensible to them can seem totally ludicrous to us. And, it's not like they can actually practice this in advance. So, I'd also advise against it for the HORSE's sake. You want nothing for your horse but small incremental successes, even if it takes forever to make progress. As far as having you on one side and Donny on the other: when you think about it, if something does go awry, that's a very crowded situation. Horses are, in my experience, more likely to panic if they feel claustrophobic. There are times when I work with Shirley with a young horse that only one of us is right with the horse at a time, just in case there's an overreaction, it's easier to CALMLY clear the area. We also have a rule that the rider gives the leadline person the direction for when to stop, go, turn whatever. The rider can often feel some tension building that the leader can't feel, but if it's a kid up, you can't bank on having that feedback. If there are two or three people in the mix, it's harder to be sure that you don't crowd the horse and make things worse. Can you have an "evacutation plan" that you can depend on? I can guarantee you that if it were Cary where you're talking about Donny being, Cary wouldn't move the way I'd react. In a panic, you can't get yourself and the kid out of the way, and at the same instant, be telling a husband where to move too...while staying CALM for the horse's sake? That's a lot of players involved in a small area. I was on Gracie, probably her third ride, when the unforeseen happened. A huge horsefly bit her on the butt, she bucked, I instinctively grabbed mane to stay on, and when I grabbed, she thought something REALLY had hold of her, and then she REALLY bucked. I hit the ground hard, and she landed on my ankle - luckily just brushing it, not a solid blow, but I still limped for a month. I had the wind knocked out of me and I simply couldn't move out of the way for a few minutes - thankfully, Shirley was right outside the area and she knew immediately to stay calm and get Gracie settled down first, before checking on me. Gracie is a calm horse, and had had a lot of groundwork before that too. I was really glad that Cary wasn't there - he would have run to me, probably panicking Gracie more. No matter how many young horses I work with, I KNOW there's still some "unforeseen" potential out there. I haven't seen it in a while, but there's always something there. Since that Gracie incident, I'm very careful not to back a horse for the first time during the second week in August. That's the week the barn swallows leave the area, and that's when horse flies appear. Up until that moment, I had no idea that Gracie had such a hatred for horse flies, but believe me, I'll never forget it! I know not to make THAT mistake again, but I'm just not sure of all the other mistakes out there still left to be made... Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
In a message dated 4/30/2008 4:57:33 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) He looks very cute and ready for a person to sit on, I love that sensation on him. What a cutie. Sylvia **Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings at AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp0030002851)
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
no matter how many people write and tell me that this is how they prefer to start their horses, I am still going to think it is a bad idea. I agree with you completely and then I am going to confess that I just asked my grandson to do the first few rides on Yrsa. The difference here is that Gabriel is 17 and a better, more balanced rider than I am and he probably weighs more. He's certainly more agile and athletic than I am.l I don't have him train, although he did a great job with a Welsh pony I gave him several years ago. I just let him be the first person who sits on the ponies and the first person they move forward with. I used to start a few horses for other people when I was younger. I think the most importand thing is to assure that nothing bad/scarey happens. I really wouldn't want to pull someone back off. Tosca's first ride took place over about a week. First Gabe put weight in the left stirrup several times, then in the right stirrup several times. Because she was so stoic, he eventually gently slid onto the sadd.e We said good girl and put her up. The whole exercise was pretty silly because she just stood there each time, but the very first filly I ever started put me through the top rail of a wooden corral, a lesson I have never forgotten. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
> I work as a trauma nurse at a level one pediatric trauma center and I have > to say that I am not crazy about this recurring theme of using kids to start > horses. I am sure that Nasi is well prepared and that all will go well, but > no matter how many people write and tell me that this is how they prefer to > start their horses, I am still going to think it is a bad idea. I hear you. Basically I feel he is ready to be sat on for a minute but I am too heavy. And he is too young. I think I will just see how it goes. Play it by ear. My intent is not to have him "ridden" but backed. briefly. I was thinking my husband could hold kale around the waist and if Nasi steps away he could just slide off into my husbands arms. But nasi has stood at the mounting block for months without moving a hair while I woggled the saddle leaned over him, waved arms all around, slapped stirrups against his sides. he seems to take a nap... Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
> > > Should I do bareback? > > Has Nasi worn a saddle already? oh yeah all the time! He has been ponied in it on trail rides. The sensation. I think he is totally ready if I mounted him, but since I am too heavy for his size now and his age, it has to be my nephew, so I think I will spend a long time, all morning if necessary, getting him and Kale relaxed and enjoying themselves. i think at first he will wonder what is going on, the kid there, around him at the mounting block etc and it may make him wary so I want to get him past that. Janice Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
- Original Message - From: "Janice McDonald" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >I have rented a kid and he is coming over saturday to hopefully back > Nasi ( 4 years old tomorrow icelandic) the first time. I work as a trauma nurse at a level one pediatric trauma center and I have to say that I am not crazy about this recurring theme of using kids to start horses. I am sure that Nasi is well prepared and that all will go well, but no matter how many people write and tell me that this is how they prefer to start their horses, I am still going to think it is a bad idea. I think that the biggest reason to avoid using kids is this no matter who first backs the horse, even if the rider does everything right... the potential for serious injury exists and you would have a tough time forgiving yourself if something goes wrong. I realize that every time a kid gets on a horse they could get injured, but they are choosing to ride... when we ask a kid to get on a new horse we are putting them in a position that they would not be in if we weren't asking, and that difference is critical. I try to avoid giving unsolicited advice, but my job focuses on kids and injuries and I know that the best thing I can do is advocate for kids before they get medi-vaced into a facility like mine. Sorry Janice - Jacki
Re: [IceHorses] nasi's big day
> nasi has been trained up til now to whoa, go, stand still at the > mounting block while I lean over him waving arms around, wiggle the > saddle vigorously, slap the stirrups against his side etc. He is fine > with all that. just stands there. I have ponied him on two trail > rides, he did great. He seems unafraid and not spooky of anything. Good! Charm's "training" has been over a long period of time, trying to touch on every thing that needs to be done before hand. I try not to add too many new things to the mix at once. > Should I do bareback? Has Nasi worn a saddle already? Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
