[Ilugc] DNS records and MX querying CGI

[Girish Venkatachalam]

Guys,

I have written a CGI script to figure out the IP address associated
with a domain.

It will also print multiple IP addresses associated with a domain.

Additionally what the script can do is print all the MX records(for
e-mail sending) with
their associated weights and IP addresses.

Take a look yourself:

http://spam-cheetah.com/dns.html

Of course you can download the CGI script and view the syntax
highlighted version
either here:

http://www.spam-cheetah.com/bgquery.html

Or you could go there from the query page.

Hope this is useful. In case you are curious you can read about DNS
from RFC1035.txt
which you can obtain like this:

$ wget ietf.org/rfc/rfc1035.txt

And you can

# perl -MCPAN -e 'install Net::DNS;'

and

$ man Net::DNS

I developed this code from the examples given in the man page.

-Girish

-- 
Gayatri Hitech
web: http://gayatri-hitech.com

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Re: [Ilugc] chkconfig equivalent in Jaunty

[Balaviswa nathanv]

I think we have /etc/init.d is also available in jaunty

But please dont forget to add "sudo" before that command

Regards

Bala

On Sat, Oct 10, 2009 at 1:03 PM, Rajagopal Swaminathan
 wrote:
> Greetings,
>
>
>>> Does Jaunty have equivalents of following (Redhat/CEntOS) commands:
>>>
>>> chkconfig
>>> service
>>
>> update-rc.d
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> Regards,
>
> Rajagopal
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-- 
V.Balaviswanathan
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[Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Hrishikesh Murali]

Hi,
I am in need of help with OpenVPN here. This is the situation:

I have the VPN server running successfully on 192.168.1.1 and the
clients are connected to it (192.168.1.2 and 192.168.1.3).

Computer 1
-
  eth0 - 192.168.1.1/24 (This is the VPN server)
  tap0 - 10.222.222.1

Computer 2
-
  eth0 - 192.168.1.2/24
  eth1 - 10.1.2.1/24  (internal network is 10.1.2.0/24,
and this is the gateway)
  tap0 - 10.222.222.2

Computer 3
-
  eth0 - 192.168.1.3/24
  eth1 - 10.1.3.1/24  (internal network is 10.1.3.0/24,
and this is the gateway)
  tap0 - 10.222.222.3


I have enabled forwarding from tap0 to eth1 and vice-versa using
iptables on the two gateways and added this command in the VPN server
configuration file:
  push "route 10.1.0.0 255.255.0.0"

This adds a routing entry in each client when they are connected:
  route add -net 10.1.0.0 netmask 255.255.0.0 gw 10.222.222.1

On the VPN server, i have added the following routes:
 1) route add -net 10.1.2.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 gw 10.1.2.1
 2) route add -net 10.1.3.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 gw 10.1.3.1

By doing so, i am successfully able to ping from 10.1.2.x to 10.1.3.x.

My problem is that all the packets go to the VPN server and then it is
forwarded to the gateways. I feel this will result in too much load on
the VPN server as it keeps running and in burst traffic situations
(and might crash). Am i wrong in this assumption?

Is there a better way to do the routing, that is can I push the
routing entries 1) and 2) automatically from the VPN server onto the
clients whenever they connect so that traffic does not have to come
through the VPN server, it can go directly to the gateway?

If so, what is the command I have to specify in the VPN configuration file?

Also, I need to log traffic and detect burst traffic. I know this is
possible using iptables, and have tried it out. But, is there a way
where I can specify in the VPN server configuration file to
automatically push commands onto the client to prevent burst traffic
(DOS attacks typically)?

I must prevent computers from one subnet from DOSing the VPN server,
or the other subnets, or any computer in the VPN. How do I do this?

What is the difference between "dev tun" and "dev tap" in the VPN
configuration files? I know it specifies the tunneling device, but why
two separate devices? In what situations do I use each device?

I have also noticed this, in my VPN server configuration file, I have the line:
server 10.222.222.0 255.255.255.0
If I specify "dev tun" in both server and clients, the server starts
giving out ip's to clients from 10.222.222.5, but if I specify "dev
tap" in both server and clients, the server starts giving out ip's to
clients from 10.222.222.2. Why is it so?

What if I enable forwarding using iptables from eth0 to eth1 in the
gateways? Will routing from 10.1.2.x to 10.1.3.x work even then? If
not, why?

I know there are too many questions to be answered :), but it would be
really helpful if I could get some answers.

-- 
Cheers,
Hrishikesh Murali
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[Ilugc] Re: Linux article in Dinamalar

[balachandar]

பத்மநாதன்  writes:

> 
> The article about Linux
> 
> http://dinamalar.in/Supplementary/cmalar_detail.asp?news_id=863


 Website address of our ilug is wrong in the article.

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Re: [Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Kapil Hari Paranjape]

Hello,

On Mon, 12 Oct 2009, Hrishikesh Murali wrote:
> I have the VPN server running successfully on 192.168.1.1 and the
> clients are connected to it (192.168.1.2 and 192.168.1.3).

If all the computers are on a common ethernet segment why are you
running a VPN between these machines in addition to the ethernet?
(If you want to encrypt data by default you are better of switching
all machines to IPSec.)

> Computer 1
> -
>   eth0 - 192.168.1.1/24 (This is the VPN server)
>   tap0 - 10.222.222.1

Note that tun devices are preferred to tap devices.

> Is there a better way to do the routing, that is can I push the
> routing entries 1) and 2) automatically from the VPN server onto the
> clients whenever they connect so that traffic does not have to come
> through the VPN server, it can go directly to the gateway?

Again your requirement is not very clear from your description. If
your VPN is meant to encrypt traffic then the traffic must pass
through the VPN server which behaves like the hub of a star network.

Regards,

Kapil.
--

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Re: [Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Raja Subramanian]

On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Hrishikesh Murali  wrote:
> Hi,
> I am in need of help with OpenVPN here. This is the situation:
>
> I have the VPN server running successfully on 192.168.1.1 and the
> clients are connected to it (192.168.1.2 and 192.168.1.3).
>
> Computer 1
> -
>      eth0 - 192.168.1.1/24     (This is the VPN server)
>      tap0 - 10.222.222.1
>
> Computer 2
> -
>      eth0 - 192.168.1.2/24
>      eth1 - 10.1.2.1/24          (internal network is 10.1.2.0/24,
> and this is the gateway)
>      tap0 - 10.222.222.2
>
> Computer 3
> -
>      eth0 - 192.168.1.3/24
>      eth1 - 10.1.3.1/24          (internal network is 10.1.3.0/24,
> and this is the gateway)
>      tap0 - 10.222.222.3
>
>
> I have enabled forwarding from tap0 to eth1 and vice-versa using
> iptables on the two gateways and added this command in the VPN server
> configuration file:
>      push "route 10.1.0.0 255.255.0.0"
>
> This adds a routing entry in each client when they are connected:
>      route add -net 10.1.0.0 netmask 255.255.0.0 gw 10.222.222.1
>
> On the VPN server, i have added the following routes:
>     1) route add -net 10.1.2.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 gw 10.1.2.1
>     2) route add -net 10.1.3.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 gw 10.1.3.1
>
> By doing so, i am successfully able to ping from 10.1.2.x to 10.1.3.x.
>
> My problem is that all the packets go to the VPN server and then it is
> forwarded to the gateways. I feel this will result in too much load on
> the VPN server as it keeps running and in burst traffic situations
> (and might crash). Am i wrong in this assumption?
>
> Is there a better way to do the routing, that is can I push the
> routing entries 1) and 2) automatically from the VPN server onto the
> clients whenever they connect so that traffic does not have to come
> through the VPN server, it can go directly to the gateway?

In VPN parlance, what you are asking for is a full mesh VPN
topology where any VPN site/network can communicate
to any other site/network in the mesh directly.  Most commercial
firewalls Cisco/Check Point/Juniper support this topology.

OpenVPN however only does star -- central VPN server with all
clients communicating to the server only.  There is no direct
communication between clients.  If you want to do this, run a
VPN server and client at each site and establish multiple tunnels.

For just 3 sites, it's pretty easy, but scaling it to large number of
sites is difficult with OpenVPN -- management and dynamic routing
will become increasingly difficult unless you script/automate.


>
> If so, what is the command I have to specify in the VPN configuration file?
>
> Also, I need to log traffic and detect burst traffic. I know this is
> possible using iptables, and have tried it out. But, is there a way
> where I can specify in the VPN server configuration file to
> automatically push commands onto the client to prevent burst traffic
> (DOS attacks typically)?

It takes a lot of traffic to overwhelm any OpenVPN server, my WRT54GL
wireless modem at home runs tomato + openvpn firmware and handles
1Mb/s DSL with ease.  I typically run 2-3 tunnels, and the hardware is
a 233MHz ARM with 16MB RAM.  Any typical desktop today will handle
most OpenVPN workloads easily.


> I must prevent computers from one subnet from DOSing the VPN server,
> or the other subnets, or any computer in the VPN. How do I do this?

If you have a commercial firewall then you can just use it to filter VPN
traffic before it enters your network.  You can set the DOS limiters on
the firewall.  Otherwise, iptables is your friend.


> What is the difference between "dev tun" and "dev tap" in the VPN
> configuration files? I know it specifies the tunneling device, but why
> two separate devices? In what situations do I use each device?

TUN is a Layer 2 device and which can carry any protocol over ethernet
frames.  TAP is a Layer 3 device used for IP protocols only.

Use TUN if you want to Ethernet bridging with OpenVPN. I use TUN
on my home VPN server to connect it to from remote networks. Use
TAP if you don't want Ethernet bridging and want to routed networks
instead.  OpenVPN Howto and Wikipedia have good documentation
on this point.


> I have also noticed this, in my VPN server configuration file, I have the 
> line:
>        server 10.222.222.0 255.255.255.0
> If I specify "dev tun" in both server and clients, the server starts
> giving out ip's to clients from 10.222.222.5, but if I specify "dev
> tap" in both server and clients, the server starts giving out ip's to
> clients from 10.222.222.2. Why is it so?

Bridging vs routing topology.  This question has been asked several
times on OpenVPN mailing lists.  No point repeating the answers here.


> What if I enable forwarding using iptables from eth0 to eth1 in the
> gateways? Will routing from 10.1.2.x to 10.1.3.x work even then? If
> not, why?

Will not work unless you implement a meshed VPN, or at least
simulate one wi

Re: [Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Raja Subramanian]

On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 8:38 PM, Raja Subramanian
 wrote:
> TUN is a Layer 2 device and which can carry any protocol over ethernet
> frames.  TAP is a Layer 3 device used for IP protocols only.

Whoops!  It's supposed to be the other way around.

- Raja
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Re: [Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Mohan Sundaram]

On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Hrishikesh Murali  wrote:
>
> My problem is that all the packets go to the VPN server and then it is
> forwarded to the gateways. I feel this will result in too much load on
> the VPN server as it keeps running and in burst traffic situations
> (and might crash). Am i wrong in this assumption?
>

The network seems to be a lab network or something for you to try out VPNs.
One cannot talk of crashes without knowing where the bottleneck is. With a
PIII processor, 100Mb traffic can be handled with 1500 packet sizes. I guess
that is the ethernet card speed here and so processor will not be the
bottleneck.

>
> Is there a better way to do the routing, that is can I push the
> routing entries 1) and 2) automatically from the VPN server onto the
> clients whenever they connect so that traffic does not have to come
> through the VPN server, it can go directly to the gateway?
>

Yes. Obviously all the machines are on one 192... network. Like Kapil asked,
there must be an intent for a VPN. Normally, VPNs are built over public
networks between remote locations. You can build a star or a mesh networks.
Obviously, a mesh will not suffer from a single point getting excessively
loaded as in a star.

>
> I must prevent computers from one subnet from DOSing the VPN server,
> or the other subnets, or any computer in the VPN. How do I do this?
>
IPTables.

>
> What is the difference between "dev tun" and "dev tap" in the VPN
> configuration files? I know it specifies the tunneling device, but why
> two separate devices? In what situations do I use each device?
>

*First task is to search. A google search yields "TAP (as in network tap)
simulates an Ethernet device and it operates with layer 2 packets such
as Ethernet frames. TUN (as in network TUNnel) simulates a network
layer device and it operates with layer 3 packets such as
IP packets.
TAP is used to create a network bridge, while TUN is used with routing."*

I have also noticed this, in my VPN server configuration file, I have the
> line:
>server 10.222.222.0 255.255.255.0
> If I specify "dev tun" in both server and clients, the server starts
> giving out ip's to clients from 10.222.222.5, but if I specify "dev
> tap" in both server and clients, the server starts giving out ip's to
> clients from 10.222.222.2. Why is it so?
>
> TAP being a layer 2 device takes one IP. TUN device requires 2 endpoint
IPs. The server assigns IP on its side and then to the other/client side and
so this difference.

-- Mohan Sundaram
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Re: [Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Kapil Hari Paranjape]

Hello,

On Mon, 12 Oct 2009, Raja Subramanian wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Hrishikesh Murali  wrote:
> In VPN parlance, what you are asking for is a full mesh VPN
> topology where any VPN site/network can communicate
> to any other site/network in the mesh directly.  Most commercial
> firewalls Cisco/Check Point/Juniper support this topology.
> 
> OpenVPN however only does star -- central VPN server with all
> clients communicating to the server only.

Thanks to Raja for figuring out that "mesh" toplogy is what
Hrishikesh wants.

As Raja has said OpenVPN only supports star structure (i.e. all
traffic goes through the VPN server) or point-to-point.

You can create a OpenVPN mesh network you need to to do a lot of
scripting to create many point-to-point networks and routing
tables will be long.

If the VPN structure is being used for encryption only and not for
tunneling, then a better alternative is to use IPSec or IPv6.

Regards,

Kapil.
--

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Re: [Ilugc] new netbook

[narendra sisodiya]

On Sat, Oct 10, 2009 at 7:27 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves
 wrote:
>
> On Saturday 10 Oct 2009 6:57:51 am Arun SAG wrote:
> > On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 4:45 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves
> wrote:
> > > >just got my new netbook - with linux
> >
> > Nice :). what company and model? and whats the distro?
>
> MSI - atom processor, 1 GB RAM and 20 GB hd - comes with open suse 10 and
> everything I have tried so far except mpeg works out of the box
What is the Model number ?
--
┌─┐
│    Narendra Sisodiya ( नरेन्द्र सिसोदिया )
│    Web : http://narendra.techfandu.org
│    Twitter : http://tinyurl.com/dz7e4a
└─┘
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Re: [Ilugc] Help With OpenVPN

[Hrishikesh Murali]

Hi,
Thanks for the replies everyone.

If all the computers are on a common ethernet segment why are you
> running a VPN between these machines in addition to the ethernet?
> (If you want to encrypt data by default you are better of switching
> all machines to IPSec.)
>

I want to test out the VPN server on the LAN first before deploying it on
the internet.


-- 
Cheers,
Hrishikesh Murali
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[Ilugc] Configure HP Pavilion dv6000 laptop keyboard layout in fedora

[balachandar]

Hi luggies,   
   I m using HP Pavilion dv6000 (HP Pavilion Entertainment PC).I tried the
keyboard layout application in fedora to configure my keyboard layout.But i cant
configure it after trying most of the options.Please help to come out.My
alphabets are working fine.But the symbols are altered.

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Re: [Ilugc] Re: Linux article in Dinamalar

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Monday 12 Oct 2009 8:29:15 pm balachandar wrote:
> பத்மநாதன்  writes:
> > The article about Linux
> >
> > http://dinamalar.in/Supplementary/cmalar_detail.asp?news_id=863
>
>  Website address of our ilug is wrong in the article.
excellent article - I wish our local tamil gurus could write in such simple, 
expressive tamil.
-- 
regards
kg
http://lawgon.livejournal.com
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Re: [Ilugc] new netbook

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Monday 12 Oct 2009 9:44:02 pm narendra sisodiya wrote:
> > MSI - atom processor, 1 GB RAM and 20 GB hd - comes with open suse 10 and
> > everything I have tried so far except mpeg works out of the box
>
> What is the Model number ?

100 - and it is 160 GB hdd
-- 
regards
kg
http://lawgon.livejournal.com
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[Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Girish Venkatachalam]

Install firebug

using the Mozilla adds on page or go here:

http://getfirebug.com

Then you get a cockroach image on the bottom pane of the browser.

Use

console.print() in your js code to inspect.

Firebug is very very very powerful. ;)

It can tell you the missing files/images in your web page.

It can tell you the CSS that corresponds to various s on your page.

It is a GUI tool, so I can't say much here.

I had mentioned that I will cover firebug "tomorrow".

Today is that tomorrow.

-Girish

-- 
Gayatri Hitech
web: http://gayatri-hitech.com

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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 6:59:05 am Girish Venkatachalam wrote:
> Firebug is very very very powerful. ;)

I have personally found firebug useless - apache log files are far more 
effective 
in debugging problems with css and js - 90% of these problems in production 
are to do with paths. Since both css and js fail silently, the 404 errors will 
be found in the apache access logs and not in the error logs. As for other 
javascript errors, these should be debugged *before* putting them in 
production.
-- 
regards
kg
http://lawgon.livejournal.com
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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Girish Venkatachalam]

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 7:35 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves
 wrote:
> On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 6:59:05 am Girish Venkatachalam wrote:
>> Firebug is very very very powerful. ;)
>
> I have personally found firebug useless - apache log files are far more 
> effective
> in debugging problems with css and js - 90% of these problems in production
> are to do with paths. Since both css and js fail silently, the 404 errors will
> be found in the apache access logs and not in the error logs. As for other
> javascript errors, these should be debugged *before* putting them in
> production.

Dear KG,

If you nurse somewhat "negative" views in your heart,
 it is best that you not out them thereby discouraging
would be learners.

People who have never heard about firebug before will
get a chance to look at it. That is the purpose of my tip.

But after reading your post, they may feel that it was
not worth their while to take a look.

By the way your argument is wrong too.

I shall explain.

Apache logs only tell you traffic stats and referrers and
of course 404 errors and web server problems. Problems
with configuring Apache.

But firebug is a javascript development and CSS development
tool.

Have you done serious web development with javascript?

It can be really painful since it is as rich a language as C
in certain ways.

You most definitely need a friend like firebug.

And I never said that you should use firebug after you have
the code in production. You debug it whilst developing.

Even spidermonkey which I sent few days ago does not
simulate the complete browser environment.

Anyway it is not my nature to argue. I shall not
 reply to this thread anymore.

Have a nice day. Happy firebugging! ;)

I am very good at bugging people, not sure about this.

-Girish

-- 
Gayatri Hitech
web: http://gayatri-hitech.com

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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 7:46:08 am Girish Venkatachalam wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 7:35 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves
>
>  wrote:
> > On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 6:59:05 am Girish Venkatachalam wrote:
> >> Firebug is very very very powerful. ;)
> >
> > I have personally found firebug useless - apache log files are far more
> > effective in debugging problems with css and js - 90% of these problems
> > in production are to do with paths. Since both css and js fail silently,
> > the 404 errors will be found in the apache access logs and not in the
> > error logs. As for other javascript errors, these should be debugged
> > before putting them in production.
>
> Dear KG,
>
> If you nurse somewhat "negative" views in your heart,
>  it is best that you not out them thereby discouraging
> would be learners.

why will they get discouraged? if they want to learn new things, they should 
have courage to learn.
>
> People who have never heard about firebug before will
> get a chance to look at it. That is the purpose of my tip.
>
> But after reading your post, they may feel that it was
> not worth their while to take a look.

they also may think they should prove me wrong
>
> By the way your argument is wrong too.
>
> I shall explain.
>
> Apache logs only tell you traffic stats and referrers and
> of course 404 errors and web server problems. Problems
> with configuring Apache.
>
> But firebug is a javascript development and CSS development
> tool.
>
> Have you done serious web development with javascript?

no - as mentioned above, this is my personal point of view
>
> It can be really painful since it is as rich a language as C
> in certain ways.
>
> You most definitely need a friend like firebug.

I do not - others may do
>
> And I never said that you should use firebug after you have
> the code in production. You debug it whilst developing.

nice explanation here: http://www.evotech.net/blog/2007/06/introduction-to-
firebug/

-- 
regards
kg
http://lawgon.livejournal.com
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[Ilugc] GNU/Linux based laptops

[Krishnaswamy Subramanian]

Hi,

I'm looking for pre installed Linux based laptops. Can anyone suggest me
a good one with latest configuration?

Thanks
Swamy

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Re: [Ilugc] GNU/Linux based laptops

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 8:26:27 am Krishnaswamy Subramanian wrote:
> I'm looking for pre installed Linux based laptops. Can anyone suggest me
> a good one with latest configuration?

acer - lowend series without 'Z' comes with linpus linux
-- 
regards
kg
http://lawgon.livejournal.com
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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[ashok samrat]

Hi all ,

> I have personally found firebug useless - apache log files are far more 
> effective
> in debugging problems with css and js - 90% of these problems in production
> are to do with paths. Since both css and js fail silently, the 404 errors will
> be found in the apache access logs and not in the error logs

Firebug is a fabulous tool , guess its been misunderstood , using
firebug to correct path problems is not the idea . You can change css
attributes dynamically and see them updated , time to load individual
files . Now there are pluggins developed on the top of firebug . If
you are a jquery user firebug is invaluable .
Stuff like firepython / firephp have added support for python / php
debugging using firebug .

What apache logs can fetch is useless while developing css for a website .


Cheers
Ashok
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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[সাহিদ]

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Girish Venkatachalam
 wrote:
> Install firebug
>

Another use case: Using firebug you can modify javascript of a web
page page on-the-fly. I have seen many pages breaking due to simple
javascript mistakes. Using firebug you can fix many of them to make it
work with firefox.


-- 
S.
Argue with idiots, and you become an idiot. - PG
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Re: [Ilugc] GNU/Linux based laptops

[Varrun Ramani]

2009/10/13 Krishnaswamy Subramanian 

> Hi,
>
> I'm looking for pre installed Linux based laptops. Can anyone suggest me
> a good one with latest configuration?
>
>

I think it would be wiser to get a laptop with good configuration, then
install any GNU/Linux distro on them. That way you would have a wider range
to choose from :)

-- 
Thanks & Regards
Varrun Ramani
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Re: [Ilugc] Configure HP Pavilion dv6000 laptop keyboard layout in fedora

[Natarajan V]

On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 10:10 PM, balachandar
 wrote:
>   I m using HP Pavilion dv6000 (HP Pavilion Entertainment PC).

I use one too, but on Kubuntu.

>My
> alphabets are working fine.But the symbols are altered.

What do you exactly mean by this? Are you getting a pound/ euro sign
instead of a dollor? Make sure that you use a Generic 101/104 keyboard
layout (US). Check your Locale settings as well. If you had set it to
en_GB, you might start getting Pound symbols.

HTH

with regards,
Natarajan.
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[Ilugc] PHP CURL to send Soap with Attachments

[balachandar muruganantham]

Hi all,

I am working on a application where i want to send a attachment to a
webservice along with the soap messages. i know that i can use NUSOAP or
PEAR::SOAP to achieve this.

but all these libraries are almost >500kb size. since i wanted to distribute
the code, i dont want to depend on 500kb deps.

can it be achieved with CURL? has any one tried?

to know about SOAP attachments see below.
http://www.w3.org/TR/SOAP-attachments

- balachandar muruganantham
உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net
எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal
Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/
"மடியிலா மன்னவன் எய்தும் அடியளந்தான் தாஅய தெல்லாம் ஒருங்கு. " - குறள் எண் :
610
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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Natarajan V]

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves
 wrote:
> On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 7:46:08 am Girish Venkatachalam wrote:
>> On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 7:35 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves
>>  wrote:
>> > On Tuesday 13 Oct 2009 6:59:05 am Girish Venkatachalam wrote:
>> >> Firebug is very very very powerful. ;)

I totally agree with this. I have been using it, with my team for
quite some time. It has saved me a lot of trouble.

>>
>> Apache logs only tell you traffic stats and referrers and
>> of course 404 errors and web server problems. Problems
>> with configuring Apache.

Apache server logs can give only 404 errors. And if you are saying
that it is more than enough to find out why your page isn't showing up
correctly or not, is just because of 404 errors, it clearly shows that
you were, more often than not, using only off the shelf JS and CSS.
This is not the case for most of the applications "others" do. We do
develop custom JS and CSS for our own applications. 404 is rarely a
case in these situations.



>> But firebug is a javascript development and CSS development
>> tool.

What it can do for you is something like gdb/ Turbo C debugger for JS
and CSS (if you have ever used anything of that sort).

>> Have you done serious web development with javascript?
>
> no - as mentioned above, this is my personal point of view

As mentioned above, firebug is not a tool to install and check off the
shelf JS and CSS, but for building custom JS. Quite complicated ones,
Complete Rich UI for example. Infact, even for checking off the shelf
products, its easier to see the graph at the bottom of firefox than to
open appache log files and grep for 404 errors and run through pages
of it.


>> It can be really painful since it is as rich a language as C
>> in certain ways.

Out of my 8 years exp in web-programming, most serious and difficult
problems come only in JS and CSS.

>> You most definitely need a friend like firebug.
>
> I do not - others may do

JS and CSS programmers need it. If you are using off the shelf
products, it is still useful, you never gave it a try.


with regards,
Natarajan.
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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Mano]

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves
wrote:>

> >
> > But firebug is a javascript development and CSS development
> > tool.
> >
> > Have you done serious web development with javascript?
>
> no - as mentioned above, this is my personal point of view
>

How did you develop a personal point of view without doing any serious
javascript development?

If your apps are no more complicated than a 'hello world' app (only
difference being 'hello world' being replaced by lot of text), you can get
away with scanning apache logs and fixing those 'wrong path' problems. OTH,
if 'behavior' on the browser side is involved (read js), firebug is
indispensable.

Apart from the other features others mentioned, the profiler is another
super tool in Firebug.

mano
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Re: [Ilugc] .a-tip-a-day (firebug - web development debug console Firefox plugin)

[Ravi Jaya]

2009/10/13 Sahid Khan (সাহিদ) 

> On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Girish Venkatachalam
>  wrote:
> > Install firebug
> >
>
I use the firebug extensively to study the HTTP request and response
headers...

-- 
Ravi Jaya

Mobile: +91 97909 16181

Blog:
http://aryabhataa.blogspot.com/
http://ravi-jaya.blogspot.com/
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Re: [Ilugc] GNU/Linux based laptops

[Ravi Jaya]

> Acer also has a few medium to high end models that come without Windows. I
> have a travelmate 6292 - Core 2 Duo, 2.2GHZ, 4MB L2 (I think it currently
> costs around 35K). The only problem is... its HOT. Literally.


It was last evening I was in Tata Croma Anna nagar. When I check with the
sales person who stands in the Laptop section for the Linux based notebooks.
I am pretty surprised to learn from him that the Corma had a  policy to buy
only windows based notebooks.



-- 
Ravi Jaya

Mobile: +91 97909 16181

Blog:
http://aryabhataa.blogspot.com/
http://ravi-jaya.blogspot.com/
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Re: [Ilugc] GNU/Linux based laptops

[Mano]

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Ravi Jaya wrote:

>
> It was last evening I was in Tata Croma Anna nagar. When I check with the
> sales person who stands in the Laptop section for the Linux based
> notebooks.
> I am pretty surprised to learn from him that the Corma had a  policy to buy
> only windows based notebooks.
>
>
WHen I bought it, I too noticed some hesitancy in the salesman when I asked
for non-windows models. But after I assured him that I will do the
installation myself he was back to normal :-) So, I think its the service
personnel's lack of skill in linux that makes them push windows - so the
customer will not come back to them when there is a problem.

regds,
mano
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Re: [Ilugc] GNU/Linux based laptops

[Mano]

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 11:59 AM, Mano  wrote:

> WHen I bought it, I too noticed some hesitancy in the salesman when I asked
> for non-windows models. But after I assured him that I will do the
> installation myself he was back to normal :-) So, I think its the service
> personnel's lack of skill in linux that makes them push windows - so the
> customer will not come back to them when there is a problem.
>
>
I did not buy it in Tata Croma. I bought it in a shop in Phase 1 of
spencers, near KFC. I forget the name. They also have a branch at Shanthi
Colony at anna nagar.

regds
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