Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 5:50:59 pm balachandar muruganantham wrote: > > plone is a very widely used CMS - where are the security patches? I do > > not think their site even has a security page, feed or mailing list. So > > the logic > > is flawed > > if you know how to search for it, you should be getting it. > > http://plone.org/products/plone/security/advisories omg - imagine - 10 holes in 4 years - probably no body is using the software - or may be it is good? -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 5:33:53 pm balachandar muruganantham wrote: > > or take django - only one very minor security hole in the svn head. Has > > never > > had a security vulnerability in a released version - and this is over a > > period > > of 5 years. > > how abt this? is it security patch or a release? > http://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2009/jul/28/security/ that is with respect to the development server which is never used, or intended to be used in production - it is just a tool to help development on a local machine and as such is not part of django's production environment. -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 11:26:49 am Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > > As these CMSs are more frequently used, attacks against these CMSs will > > also be higher and also also the people working on fixing these holes - > > which is why you see lot more security patches in the more popular CMSs. > > plone is a very widely used CMS - where are the security patches? I do not > think their site even has a security page, feed or mailing list. So the > logic > is flawed > if you know how to search for it, you should be getting it. http://plone.org/products/plone/security/advisories - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "ஆக்கம் இழந்தேமென் றல்லாவார் ஊக்கம் ஒருவந்தங் கைத்துடை யார். " - குறள் எண் : 593 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
This is about ILUGC and the website http://www.noogenesis.com/pineapple/blind_men_elephant.html cheers varadarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 3:14:55 pm Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > > On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 3:10:12 pm Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > > > >Take the case of Apache, for example when was the last time you had to > > > >upgrade because of a security issue? > > > > > > I see your point but Apache has been around a lot longer than WP. In > > > anycase, there was a vulnerability a few weeks ago: > > > > or take django - only one very minor security hole in the svn head. Has > > never had a security vulnerability in a released version - and this is > over > > a period of 5 years. > > an interesting thing happened on the django list some time back. Some php > guy > wanted to migrate to django and asked 'where is the page for security > vulnerabilities?' and was told that there was no such page as there are no > security vulnerabilities. So the guy promptly refused to look further into > django as he felt that an application without regular updates to fix > security > holes is unreliable. > if there is no security vulnerability, either software is good or not many people are using it and hence no bugs are reported. - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "கழாஅக்கால் பள்ளியுள் வைத்தற்றால் சான்றோர் குழாஅத்துப் பேதை புகல். " - குறள் எண் : 840 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 3:14 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 3:10:12 pm Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > > >Take the case of Apache, for example when was the last time you had to > > >upgrade because of a security issue? > > > > I see your point but Apache has been around a lot longer than WP. In > > anycase, there was a vulnerability a few weeks ago: > > or take django - only one very minor security hole in the svn head. Has > never > had a security vulnerability in a released version - and this is over a > period > of 5 years. > > how abt this? is it security patch or a release? http://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2009/jul/28/security/ - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "அழச்சொல்லி அல்லது இடித்து வழக்கறிய வல்லார்நடபு ஆய்ந்து கொளல். " - குறள் எண் : 795 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 3:14:55 pm Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 3:10:12 pm Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > > >Take the case of Apache, for example when was the last time you had to > > >upgrade because of a security issue? > > > > I see your point but Apache has been around a lot longer than WP. In > > anycase, there was a vulnerability a few weeks ago: > > or take django - only one very minor security hole in the svn head. Has > never had a security vulnerability in a released version - and this is over > a period of 5 years. an interesting thing happened on the django list some time back. Some php guy wanted to migrate to django and asked 'where is the page for security vulnerabilities?' and was told that there was no such page as there are no security vulnerabilities. So the guy promptly refused to look further into django as he felt that an application without regular updates to fix security holes is unreliable. -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 3:10:12 pm Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > >Take the case of Apache, for example when was the last time you had to > >upgrade because of a security issue? > > I see your point but Apache has been around a lot longer than WP. In > anycase, there was a vulnerability a few weeks ago: or take django - only one very minor security hole in the svn head. Has never had a security vulnerability in a released version - and this is over a period of 5 years. -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
>Take the case of Apache, for example when was the last time you had to >upgrade because of a security issue? I see your point but Apache has been around a lot longer than WP. In anycase, there was a vulnerability a few weeks ago: http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-announce/2009-August/016066.html Also, I upgraded a Apache Tomcat a few weeks ago due to a vulnerability. Consider the Centos Security Update Announce list for the past 10 days in September. http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-announce/2009-September/thread.html The link above will indicate why I would consider using CentOS instead of other distros which don't get these frequent security bug fixes. If the turn around time for publishing bug fixes from the time when a vulnerability is listed is too high, it counts against the project. And that is a better metric of project quality rather than the number of listed vulnerabilities. That and, of course, the severity of the vulnerability. I have used Joomla, WP etc before and I have upgraded due to security issues a number of times. But then, I have done the same with my OS, webserver, database, browser etc. If you turn on automatic updates even on your linux desktop, you will see how often security fixes flow in. My point is essentially just this - between setting up a website from ground up using custom developed code and using a popular, frequently update CMS, my vote goes towards the second option - that is, using a popular CMS. Thank you, Prem ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
pavithran wrote: Unfortunately web apps can never be secured . There would be some vulnerability popping up . I think this is not the case of wordpress alone . Sure, you cannot make them completely air-tight, but you can ensure a _reasonable_ amount of security if you architect a webapp properly, ensure you have proper test coverage and take basic security precautions. But, as I said, the web framework you are using plays a big role in helping you achieve those goals. WP has a huge customer base hence will have lot of bugs .. may be the user vs contributor ratio plays a major role for testing,reporting,designing and developing the WP . I hope I answered this as part of reply to Prem's mail. I would like to know the issues you faced with it . Did you file a bug report ? Anyways maybe a different thread in this mailing list would be fine . Basically a vulnerability with xmlrpc.php that ships with all WP installs (it was repoted by then) - somebody took advantage of a vulnerability, was able to write some perl scripts to the /tmp directory and was happily using the vps as a dumping/sharing site for some pirated software. This was years ago, when I didn't know too much about sysadmin stuff. Luckily, the hosting provider Bytemark, found the problem and that led me to a long round of learning about firewalls, iptables, etc. Since then I immediately delete xmlrpc.php in every fresh WP install/upgrade I do (yes, I wish I could get rid of a legacy WP install I have and move it elsewhere, but right now it has tons of data and quite a chore to move). Vamsee. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
On Thursday 10 Sep 2009 11:26:49 am Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > As these CMSs are more frequently used, attacks against these CMSs will > also be higher and also also the people working on fixing these holes - > which is why you see lot more security patches in the more popular CMSs. plone is a very widely used CMS - where are the security patches? I do not think their site even has a security page, feed or mailing list. So the logic is flawed -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
2009/9/10 Vamsee Kanakala : > Because it's so full of holes that you need to "upgrade" it every other > week? Unfortunately web apps can never be secured . There would be some vulnerability popping up . I think this is not the case of wordpress alone . WP has a huge customer base hence will have lot of bugs .. may be the user vs contributor ratio plays a major role for testing,reporting,designing and developing the WP . > Which is what annoys me about web apps written in php - whether php > encourages bad code or what I don't know, but almost all popular open source > php software is full of spaghetti code. PHP does that :( Well it was created to be a "Personal Home Page" and the first versions were so simple to use that it gained huge popularity . But its always up to developers to write clean code . > I say this as somebody who wrote a > plugin for wordpress and integrated another php app (elgg.net) into another > system. I can't even say how bad my experience of elgg integration was. Pure > horror would cover it. I would like to know the issues you faced with it . Did you file a bug report ? Anyways maybe a different thread in this mailing list would be fine . Regards, Pavithran -- pavithran sakamuri www.pavithran.org ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
2009/9/9 pavithran : > People can refer to the wiki article[1] for a comparision but I would > like to hear individual views/likes/concerns regarding any CMS . Excuse me , I forgot to give the link . 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_content_management_systems#Free_and_open_source_software Regards, Pavithran -- pavithran sakamuri www.pavithran.org ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
Prem Kurian Philip wrote: As these CMSs are more frequently used, attacks against these CMSs will also be higher and also also the people working on fixing these holes - which is why you see lot more security patches in the more popular CMSs. I basically agree to the argument that they are used more, and there are more holes discovered - but that certainly doesn't explain the _frequency_ at which the upgrades arrive - there are other open source software used as widely as wordpress, if not more. You don't get bi-weekly admonishments to upgrade or risk getting hacked into. (I tend to take these warnings seriously, because I had bad experiences with both WP and Drupal security-wise). Take the case of Apache, for example - when was the last time you had to upgrade because of a security issue? If you go for a completely static site, it would be only a matter of time before you start adding dynamic elements to the site. It may start with a signup form, a news ticker and soon before you know it, you will have your own mini CMS. I only recommended we go static way only for the main site - we just need the functionality of a wiki, without the bother of managing spam. The ability to checkout, modify and checkin updates to the site is basically to avoid the notion of a signup form. That said, I didn't say we need to go completely the static way - something like planet can only be done effectively by a dynamic component. Vamsee. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS
From: Vamsee Kanakala >Please read the reasons for the upgrade. Do you seriously think they >release wordpress updates with new features every two weeks? Check the >Changelog, please: >http://codex.wordpress.org/WordPress_Versions >Two of the last three releases are security releases. Do you see how >closely they are released? Exactly two weeks. Please show me a blog >system written in any other language that does 'security releases' so >often. Please proceed to read up the past release schedule, this pattern >will be self-evident. There are 100s of open source CMSs out there. This is because some developer or other decided that ALL of the existing open source CMSs didn't meet his expectation and so he/she wrote one more. Very few of these CMSs see widespread usage - Drupal, Joomla, Typo3, Wordpress etc are exceptions and not the rule. As these CMSs are more frequently used, attacks against these CMSs will also be higher and also also the people working on fixing these holes - which is why you see lot more security patches in the more popular CMSs. If you go for a completely static site, it would be only a matter of time before you start adding dynamic elements to the site. It may start with a signup form, a news ticker and soon before you know it, you will have your own mini CMS. If you decide to develop a CMS from scratch, the chances are that many security holes will remain in your solution because not too many people will check for them. Therefore superficially it may seem that your software is more secure - that is until someone decides to exploit some hole. The best approach is to choose any of the popular CMSs (they are all mostly similar in terms of features) and then use it for the site instead of developing one from scratch or assuming that you are going to remain content with a purely static site. If the CMS sees good usage, you will also receive timely fixes which you can apply to the site. Thanks, Prem ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
balachandar muruganantham wrote: every 6 months ubuntu releases updates / upgrades. is it full of holes? different projects have different release times. wordpress able to release the fixes quickly. what about kernel patches? u have continues releases coming? is it full of holes? Please read the reasons for the upgrade. Do you seriously think they release wordpress updates with new features every two weeks? Check the Changelog, please: http://codex.wordpress.org/WordPress_Versions Two of the last three releases are security releases. Do you see how closely they are released? Exactly two weeks. Please show me a blog system written in any other language that does 'security releases' so often. Please proceed to read up the past release schedule, this pattern will be self-evident. no language encourages writing bad code. it depends on the developer who write it. u can write bad code in any language. Nice platitude. But fortunately, some frameworks help you write good code - they encourage best practices, like MVC, writing unit tests, etc. Not say MVC is the best approach, but it's at least better than mixing view code with sql. I know there are templates systems etc for php, but they're very much optional, and the language itself doesn't place any emphasis on using them. just because u used a crapy system for doing some crappy integration, u cannot blame the entire wordpress. wordpress never appreciated it. it has the capability to do anything with it. I'll let that slide, because it makes no sense w.r.t your next statement. wordpress with elgg - u tried to create what ever with it. u should blame the person who gave such a crappy suggestion. before starting any integration, first u should try to analyze whether this will fit or not. I did not integrate wordpress *with* elgg. I just had to write a wordpress plugin to support a web service. And elgg integration was a separate project altogether. Please read my mail again. every one wants to protect the trademark. what about Linux? Firefox? and Redhat? fedora? there is nothing wrong with drupal doing it. till now, all its code are released under GPL v2 I didn't say there's anything wrong with it - it's just for awareness. Vamsee. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wednesday 09 Sep 2009 3:58:06 pm Srinivasan Sundararajan wrote: > > thanks for sharing your thoughts. may i infer that it is easier for the > > user(developer) to set up a drupal / joomla based CMS -- thus a typical > FOSS community contributor group can use this platform. Plone possibly > needs a "resource-rich" service provider. > > Any significant feature variation as regards to the average user (who may > have very little FOSS exposure) who wants to access the system, use and > contribute to the contents ? I started this thread with the intention of showing that choice of platform depends on various factors, and blind choice of a cms for every use may be overkill in some circumstances. I have used plone in a couple of instances where the users are absolute newbies, and minmal configuration is necessary. It has worked out ok - until the users started to demand more customisation, in which case I have shifted to using a framework. Perhaps a simple analogy would help. If I want idlis for breakfast, there are 4 ways of getting them: 1. buy the rice, dhal and other indgredients, grind the maav to taste, ferment overnight and cook and eat in the morning 2. buy already ground maav, add other ingredients, ferment overnight and cook and eat in the morning 3. buy ready made fermented maav, cook and eat. 4. buy ready made idlis and eat the choice of what to do depends on time available, skill set available, finance and taste. -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 12:02 AM, Vamsee Kanakala wrote: > pavithran wrote: > >> By the way why is "wordpress" missing in the list ? >> >> > > Because it's so full of holes that you need to "upgrade" it every other > week? Which is what annoys me about web apps written in php - whether php > encourages bad code or what I don't know, but almost all popular open source > php software is full of spaghetti code. I say this as somebody who wrote a > plugin for wordpress and integrated another php app (elgg.net) into > another system. I can't even say how bad my experience of elgg integration > was. Pure horror would cover it. > every 6 months ubuntu releases updates / upgrades. is it full of holes? different projects have different release times. wordpress able to release the fixes quickly. what about kernel patches? u have continues releases coming? is it full of holes? no language encourages writing bad code. it depends on the developer who write it. u can write bad code in any language. just because u used a crapy system for doing some crappy integration, u cannot blame the entire wordpress. wordpress never appreciated it. it has the capability to do anything with it. wordpress with elgg - u tried to create what ever with it. u should blame the person who gave such a crappy suggestion. before starting any integration, first u should try to analyze whether this will fit or not. > Btw, here's some interesting news about Drupal: > > http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2009/Sep/0003.html > every one wants to protect the trademark. what about Linux? Firefox? and Redhat? fedora? there is nothing wrong with drupal doing it. till now, all its code are released under GPL v2 - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "அகழ்வாரைத் தாங்கும் நிலம்போலத் தம்மை இகழ்வார்ப் பொறுத்தல் தலை " - குறள் எண் : 151 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 10:22 PM, pavithran wrote: > 2009/9/9 Srinivasan Sundararajan : > > without making it a php-based vs python-based argument, can some of us do > a > > comparative study of a few select CMS (say Drupal, Jhoomla, Plone) : > > highlight their specialities, give some guidelines as to which groups > could > > effectively use which system, etc. It might also give a chance for > > developers to add the missing features (provided they gel with the > overall > > architecture). > > Yes that's a nice study . > People can refer to the wiki article[1] for a comparision but I would > like to hear individual views/likes/concerns regarding any CMS . > > By the way why is "wordpress" missing in the list ? > wordpress is not a cms. its a blog publishing system. but you can use wordpress as a CMS. - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "கண்டார் உயிருண்ணும் தோற்றத்தால் பெண்டகைப் பேதைக்கு அமர்த்தன கண். " - குறள் எண் : 1084 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
pavithran wrote: By the way why is "wordpress" missing in the list ? Because it's so full of holes that you need to "upgrade" it every other week? Which is what annoys me about web apps written in php - whether php encourages bad code or what I don't know, but almost all popular open source php software is full of spaghetti code. I say this as somebody who wrote a plugin for wordpress and integrated another php app (elgg.net) into another system. I can't even say how bad my experience of elgg integration was. Pure horror would cover it. Btw, here's some interesting news about Drupal: http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2009/Sep/0003.html Vamsee. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
2009/9/9 Srinivasan Sundararajan : > without making it a php-based vs python-based argument, can some of us do a > comparative study of a few select CMS (say Drupal, Jhoomla, Plone) : > highlight their specialities, give some guidelines as to which groups could > effectively use which system, etc. It might also give a chance for > developers to add the missing features (provided they gel with the overall > architecture). Yes that's a nice study . People can refer to the wiki article[1] for a comparision but I would like to hear individual views/likes/concerns regarding any CMS . By the way why is "wordpress" missing in the list ? Regards, Pavithran -- pavithran sakamuri www.pavithran.org ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
From: Srinivasan Sundararajan > thanks for sharing your thoughts. may i infer that it is easier for the >user(developer) to set up a drupal / joomla based CMS -- thus a typical FOSS >community contributor group can use this platform. Plone possibly needs a >"resource-rich" service provider. That is right. Regards, Prem ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
>> thanks for sharing your thoughts. may i infer that it is easier for the > user(developer) to set up a drupal / joomla based CMS -- thus a typical FOSS > community contributor group can use this platform. Plone possibly needs a > "resource-rich" service provider. > > Any significant feature variation as regards to the average user (who may > have very little FOSS exposure) who wants to access the system, use and > contribute to the contents ? Hi! This site gives info on CMS for various applications. http://www.opensourcecms.com/ "Each system listed here provides for a user demo so you can make an informed decision regarding which system best suits your needs without having to go through the tedious process of installing multiple systems only to find they don't do what you require" The features are explained and they are also rated .There are user comments also. A very useful resource if you want yo evaluate a CMS ! Cheers Varadarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Prem Kurian Philip wrote: > From: Srinivasan Sundararajan > > >I understand that the shift to plone (from mambo) was because of the > better > >(portal)user - friendly features. > > My experience with Drupal, Joomla and Plone: > > Both Joomla and Drupal have vibrant user communities and lot of resources > on the web. Both are easy to learn and use. > > Many shared hosting services provide security updates to Drupal and Joomla > installations on their servers as and added service at no cost. > > Plone - . will require a VPS or a dedicated server. It requires quite > a bit of memory to run properly. Very powerful. Very flexible. Not easy > to learn and ... configure. . Also, you won't find as many developers > comfortable with Plone. > > thanks for sharing your thoughts. may i infer that it is easier for the user(developer) to set up a drupal / joomla based CMS -- thus a typical FOSS community contributor group can use this platform. Plone possibly needs a "resource-rich" service provider. Any significant feature variation as regards to the average user (who may have very little FOSS exposure) who wants to access the system, use and contribute to the contents ? srinivasan. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
From: Srinivasan Sundararajan >I understand that the shift to plone (from mambo) was because of the better >(portal)user - friendly features. >without making it a php-based vs python-based argument, can some of us do a >comparative study of a few select CMS (say Drupal, Jhoomla, Plone) : >highlight their specialities, give some guidelines as to which groups could >effectively use which system, etc. It might also give a chance for >developers to add the missing features (provided they gel with the overall >architecture). My experience with Drupal, Joomla and Plone: Drupal is a general framework for websites. It also functions as a CMS but it can go way beyond being just a CMS. It can be hosted on shared hosting accounts without any problems. Lots and lots of plugins, templates etc. Very flexible. Joomla is an excellent CMS. It is primarily a CMS but can also be modified to do other things. Again, loads of components and modules. Very easy to setup and maintain. Slightly less flexible than Drupal. Both Joomla and Drupal have vibrant user communities and lot of resources on the web. Both are easy to learn and use. Many shared hosting services provide security updates to Drupal and Joomla installations on their servers as and added service at no cost. Plone - Plone is python based and will require a VPS or a dedicated server. It requires quite a bit of memory to run properly. By default uses a ZopeDB database, but can be configured to use some other standard compliant RDBMSs as well. Very powerful. Very flexible. Not easy to learn and configure. Customization requires a fairly steep learning curve. Quite a few resources on the web but not nearly as much as for Drupal or Joomla. Also, you won't find as many developers comfortable with Plone. There are other solutions which can be used as well - Confluence is one example. It is available free of charge for open source websites. MuleSource, Spring framework, Open Symphony etc use Confluence. Very powerful and flexible solution. Regards, Prem ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
From: Thyagarajan >Wait wait wait, the list goes far far and faar long, please go to list of >groups at http://www.linux.org/groups/ and find how many of them in CMS, >nice to see lot of PHP based CMS. This was discussed at great lengths when the ilugc website revamp/alternative was first considered. A number of members on this list were against using a CMS for the site for various reasons. Regards, Prem ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
Hi, > and how many of them are autorikshaw lugs? > -- > RANT. :):) :) :) Cheers Thyagarajan Shanmugham ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
2009/9/9 Thyagarajan தியாகராஜன் > > > Wait wait wait, the list goes far far and faar long, please go to list of > groups at http://www.linux.org/groups/ and find how many of them in CMS, > nice to see lot of PHP based CMS. > > I understand that the shift to plone (from mambo) was because of the better (portal)user - friendly features. without making it a php-based vs python-based argument, can some of us do a comparative study of a few select CMS (say Drupal, Jhoomla, Plone) : highlight their specialities, give some guidelines as to which groups could effectively use which system, etc. It might also give a chance for developers to add the missing features (provided they gel with the overall architecture). srinivasan. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wednesday 09 Sep 2009 12:11:33 pm Thyagarajan தியாகராஜன் wrote: > Wait wait wait, the list goes far far and faar long, please go to list of > groups at http://www.linux.org/groups/ and find how many of them in CMS, > nice to see lot of PHP based CMS. and how many of them are autorikshaw lugs? -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
Hello and Hai, some of the linux user groups around the world and their softwares country:Albania site: http://www.albalinux.org/ software:drupal country:Argentina site: http://www.linux.org.ar/ software:drupal country:Argentina site: http://www.lugtucuman.org.ar/index.php/descargas software: joomla Country: Australia site: http://luv.asn.au/ software: drupal Country: Australia site: http://tlug.dnho.net/ software: drupal Country: Australia site: http://www.noosalug.org.au/joomla/ software: joomla Country: Australia site: http://www.taslug.org.au/modules/news/ software: XOOPS in PHP Country: Austria site: http://www.lugv.at/index.php?id=52 software: Typo3 in PHP Country:Bangaladesh site: http://www.linux.org.bd/ software: Joomla country:UK site: http://lug.org.uk/ software: drupal Wait wait wait, the list goes far far and faar long, please go to list of groups at http://www.linux.org/groups/ and find how many of them in CMS, nice to see lot of PHP based CMS. Cheers, Thyagarajan Shanmugham ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wednesday 09 Sep 2009 11:34:36 am balachandar muruganantham wrote: > > nrcfosshelpline is in django - also python > > django is not cms. its a web application framework as far as i know > (correct me if i am wrong). plone is a cms based on python. joomla, mambo, > drupal is a cms based on php. right -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 10:41 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Wednesday 09 Sep 2009 10:20:09 am Srinivasan Sundararajan wrote: > > bosslinux.in portal and portal for nrcfoss phase II are in plone - > python. > > nrcfosshelpline is in django - also python > > django is not cms. its a web application framework as far as i know (correct me if i am wrong). plone is a cms based on python. joomla, mambo, drupal is a cms based on php. - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "இல்லதென் இல்லவள் மாண்பானால் உள்ளதென் இல்லவள் மாணாக் கடை? " - குறள் எண் : 53 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wednesday 09 Sep 2009 10:20:09 am Srinivasan Sundararajan wrote: > bosslinux.in portal and portal for nrcfoss phase II are in plone - python. nrcfosshelpline is in django - also python -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
2009/9/9 Thyagarajan தியாகராஜன் > Hi, > > > > Sorry to hijack this thread, a matter of foot note, NRCFOSS may also > have > these objectives as vision, they are using Mambo for their website , a cms > written in Php. > > cheers, > > Thyagarajan > bosslinux.in portal and portal for nrcfoss phase II are in plone - python. srinivasan. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
Hi, > > > Improve lives with open source. > Our Mission > >* Outreach to educate about benefits derived from open source. >* Promote open standards. >* Promote interoperability. >* Provide a safe place for newcomers to learn. >* Help people find gainful employment. >* Support open source communities, projects, foundations, and start ups. >* Help educators be more effective. >* Help companies, communities, academics interested in open source > to connect. > > Sorry to hijack this thread, a matter of foot note, NRCFOSS may also have these objectives as vision, they are using Mambo for their website , a cms written in Php. cheers, Thyagarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
> > The question is: What is Ilugc's mission/goal? > Good question ! http://www.fosslc.org/drupal/about Improve lives with open source. Our Mission * Outreach to educate about benefits derived from open source. * Promote open standards. * Promote interoperability. * Provide a safe place for newcomers to learn. * Help people find gainful employment. * Support open source communities, projects, foundations, and start ups. * Help educators be more effective. * Help companies, communities, academics interested in open source to connect. I think all LUGS have similar mission ! And CMS like Drupal meets this purpose. Cheers Varadarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
>> > >>>We should try to utilise existing CMS as much possible, unless we are >> > > aiming >> > > for some different product. >> > > ++1 >> > Don't reinvent the wheel . just align it ! >> > ++1 >> What if I have only a Maruti 800 wheel but my mission is to send (and bring >> back safely) man to moon on a space shuttle. ;-) > you cannot :) thats why man invented rocket / space shuttle to reach moon > and come back. man used the wheel for other types of vehicle. right from > the invention of wheel, it is still in circular shape. Hi ! Free and Open Source Software Learning Centre uses drupal http://www.fosslc.org/drupal/node/376 It even uses the same theme ! Great minds think alike ! Cheers Varadarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Mano wrote: > On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:29 PM, varadarajan narayanan < > rad.naraya...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > >>>We should try to utilise existing CMS as much possible, unless we are > > > aiming > > > for some different product. > > > ++1 > > > > Don't reinvent the wheel . just align it ! > > > > ++1 > > > > > What if I have only a Maruti 800 wheel but my mission is to send (and bring > back safely) man to moon on a space shuttle. ;-) > you cannot :) thats why man invented rocket / space shuttle to reach moon and come back. man used the wheel for other types of vehicle. right from the invention of wheel, it is still in circular shape. Free and Open Source Software Learning Centre uses drupal http://www.fosslc.org/drupal/node/376 - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "கண்ணுடைய ரென்பவர் கற்றோர் முகத்திரண்டு புண்ணுடையர் கல்லா தவர். " - குறள் எண் : 393 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Mon, Sep 7, 2009 at 1:29 PM, varadarajan narayanan < rad.naraya...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>>We should try to utilise existing CMS as much possible, unless we are > > aiming > > for some different product. > > ++1 > > Don't reinvent the wheel . just align it ! > > ++1 > > What if I have only a Maruti 800 wheel but my mission is to send (and bring back safely) man to moon on a space shuttle. ;-) The question is: What is Ilugc's mission/goal? regds, mano ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
>>>We should try to utilise existing CMS as much possible, unless we are > aiming > for some different product. > ++1 Don't reinvent the wheel . just align it ! ++1 Cheers Varadarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
Hi, >>We should try to utilise existing CMS as much possible, unless we are aiming for some different product. ++1 cheers, Thyagarajan Shanmugham ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 5:31 AM, Vamsee Kanakala wrote: > > We all can code with hand. What extra time we spend by 'coding by hand', it > will be off-set by less-complicated administration overhead. > > There is a perfectly good way to update stuff (like committing to and > deploying a public repo) on the alternatives too, both ilugc.org and > ilugc.org.in - perhaps it's not 'real-time' like a CMS. But then, that > real-time aspect also encourages spam. So I guess people can make up their > own minds. > > A lot of man hours has been put in some popular open source CMS like joomla, drupal, wordpress etc, and also these CMS has been developed over a period of time, eg, 2 or 3 or 4 years. So, considering the amount of time required for those projects to mature to this level, its obvious, that we dont have that much resource of manpower to develop a project of that kind. We should try to utilise existing CMS as much possible, unless we are aiming for some different product. Regards, senthil ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
Hi, >>cool - now test out the org.in site and give your valuable inputs on the user experience there ;-) I like planet in ilugc.org.in. Cheers, Thyagarajan ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Friday 04 Sep 2009 2:41:43 pm Thyagarajan தியாகராஜன் wrote: > First of all congrats Bala for the work what you rendered. I who added the > event. It is cool , simple in terms of user experience. cool - now test out the org.in site and give your valuable inputs on the user experience there ;-) -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
Hi, >> but with http://demo.ilugc.in, you will see the content being updated by its users. i updated content related to SFD 2009. some one have added event. users can do job posting, report bugs etc. >>There is a perfectly good way to update stuff (like committing to and deploying a public repo) on the alternatives too, both ilugc.org and ilugc.org.in - perhaps it's not 'real-time' like a CMS. But then, that real-time aspect also encourages spam. So I guess people can make up their own minds. First of all congrats Bala for the work what you rendered. I who added the event. It is cool , simple in terms of user experience. again, well done bala. Regards, Thyagarajan Shanmugham ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
balachandar muruganantham wrote: for community kind of sites, developing everything from scratch is like reinventing the wheel. when there are already tools available for building community sites like http://demo.ilugc.in, u need not do coding with hand. We all can code with hand. What extra time we spend by 'coding by hand', it will be off-set by less-complicated administration overhead. but with http://demo.ilugc.in, you will see the content being updated by its users. i updated content related to SFD 2009. some one have added event. users can do job posting, report bugs etc. There is a perfectly good way to update stuff (like committing to and deploying a public repo) on the alternatives too, both ilugc.org and ilugc.org.in - perhaps it's not 'real-time' like a CMS. But then, that real-time aspect also encourages spam. So I guess people can make up their own minds. Vamsee. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
balachandar muruganantham wrote: for e.g http://www.ilugc.org/ is coded with hand. it has also given the locations of the code. but you could see the *Time :* Sat Aug 8th 15:00 IST 2009 (**3PM**) which is not yet updated by the community. this is the problem with static sites which i feel. That's not really fair, my friend. Even so-called dynamic sites will show old dates if nobody bothers to update the details. Which is what happened in this case. Let's not confuse the method of updating with the act of updating. Vamsee. ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
Re: [Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 5:39 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > hi, > > in light of some discussions going on here about a simple website, check > this > out: > > http://sunlightlabs.com/blog/2008/cool-project-what-cms-did-you-guys-use/ > for websites like Pass223.com, i wouldnt use drupal or any CMS. it has a different requirement. basically whether you use CMS or build the site from scratch depends on the requirement. for community kind of sites, developing everything from scratch is like reinventing the wheel. when there are already tools available for building community sites like http://demo.ilugc.in, u need not do coding with hand. currently, demo.ilugc.in supports what our ilugc needs and it basically uses open source cms which is growing like anything and its not simple site. for e.g http://www.ilugc.org/ is coded with hand. it has also given the locations of the code. but you could see the *Time :* Sat Aug 8th 15:00 IST 2009 (**3PM**) which is not yet updated by the community. this is the problem with static sites which i feel. but with http://demo.ilugc.in, you will see the content being updated by its users. i updated content related to SFD 2009. some one have added event. users can do job posting, report bugs etc. - balachandar muruganantham உலகம்.net - இலவச தமிழ் வலைப்பதிவுச் சேவை - http://ulagam.net எனது தமிழ் பக்கங்கள் - http://www.balachandar.net/pakkangal Beyond Work - http://beyondwork.wordpress.com/ "இழிவறிந்து உண்பான்கண் இன்பம்போல் நிற்கும் கழிபேர் இரையான்கண் நோய். " - குறள் எண் : 946 ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
[Ilugc] do you need a CMS?
hi, in light of some discussions going on here about a simple website, check this out: http://sunlightlabs.com/blog/2008/cool-project-what-cms-did-you-guys-use/ -- regards kg http://lawgon.livejournal.com ___ To unsubscribe, email ilugc-requ...@ae.iitm.ac.in with "unsubscribe " in the subject or body of the message. http://www.ae.iitm.ac.in/mailman/listinfo/ilugc
