Re: [jdev] The future of Jabber/XMPP?
My take: http://www.google.fr/trends?q=xmpp No XMPP ain't dyin'... ;-) On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 11:03, Dave Cridland d...@cridland.net wrote: On Sat Jul 10 22:39:23 2010, Yves Goergen wrote: Sometime in the last decade I saw a more or less great momentum towards open IM standards, with Google Talk and GMX/web.de introducing XMPP services or Apple iChat supporting the protocol. Recently, Facebook also joined the club (without s2s AFAIK), but I have the vague impression that the whole thing slowly falls asleep. There hasn't been real great leaps in the near past, or did I just miss them? Now even Google tries to introduce yet another messaging protocol that isn't as verbose as XML [citation needed]. Okay. Some observations: 1) There was a period in the recent past when virtually any major organization with an online presence needed IM. Whenever that's happened in recent years, they've picked up XMPP instead of rolling their own. There's fewer big names left that haven't got IM one way or another now, hence less noise to make - this will always be the most visible XMPP headline news. Less obvious is the BBC's recent deployment, for web purposes, and many similar ones. 2) XMPP deployment - in the IM space - is massive. Every major software supplier in the IM space now provides XMPP - through gateways in the cases of MSFT and IBM, but still XMPP. Although corporate enterprise IM has a strong contigent of OCS, there's a significant portion of pure XMPP there, and in the government/military space, XMPP is very much a hot topic. 3) In terms of movement in the specifications - new extensions, etc - we're moving fast enough that it's actually quite hard to keep up, across the board - we're certainly seeing clients specializing into various areas, and I think it's happening to an increasing extent for servers, too - even if I think all of the server implementors would generally say they're unspecialized for now. 4) I would note that, as far as I can tell (bearing in mind I've not worked with XMPP specifically for as long as many others in this thread), there are about the same number of clients and servers under active, vibrant development as there have been for ages. The population of the set is volatile - but the numbers seem pretty stable. 5) In terms of Google specifically - Google is a large, broad-based, company with a momentum all of its own. Very much like Microsoft, it's important to remain objective when looking at what they're doing. So while Google have insisted (on multiple occasions) that XMPP, using XML, is way too verbose (and therefore power hungry) for mobile, I'd note that by contrast Nokia's use of XMPP to the handset appears to be entirely standards-based. So in summary, although XMPP's progress and successes are a lot less newsworthy, and the landscape is almost unrecognizable compared to a few years ago, it's no less vibrant, and the future for XMPP is only disappointing because it's a descent into mundane ubiquity. Dave. -- Dave Cridland - mailto:d...@cridland.net - xmpp:d...@dave.cridland.net - acap://acap.dave.cridland.net/byowner/user/dwd/bookmarks/ - http://dave.cridland.net/ Infotrope Polymer - ACAP, IMAP, ESMTP, and Lemonade ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___ -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] The future of Jabber/XMPP?
Prosody is not the only project to grow consistently and steady: http://www.ohloh.net/p/compare?project_0=ejabberdproject_1=Prosodyproject_2=Tigase+Jabber/XMPP+Serversubmit=Go There's also Vysper, and maybe do not bury too fast XCP (or its legacy). I've slowed down the XMPP Roundup publication pace, but there's plenty a new and updated projects, among which there is not only servers, but also clients, services, and many other innovative uses. To be honest, I just can't follow the news... XMPP is alive and kicking. On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 14:37, Jonathan Dickinson jonat...@dickinsons.co.za wrote: -- From: Matthew Wild mwi...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, July 11, 2010 12:54 AM To: Jabber/XMPP software development list jdev@jabber.org Subject: Re: [jdev] The future of Jabber/XMPP? On 10 July 2010 22:39, Yves Goergen nospam.l...@unclassified.de wrote: Hi there, I started the Prosody project a year or two back Prosody is one project you should really look at if you are worried about the protocol dying. These guys are doing some really great work (mad props to Matthew). Nicolas touched on OCS and other offerings (higher up in the thread). We currently use OCS are our IM platform at my work (*sigh* Microsoft shop, what can you do?) - keep in mind that these are Text/Voice/Video and pretty much nothing else. XMPP simply can't die because there is nothing else that fills the technology hole that it does. Furthermore these other technologies generally do not have the reliability that XMPP does (OCS is really unreliable; for instance, because of the P2P nature of it); so when it comes to choosing a protocol/architecture for mission critical systems XMPP is the way to go (just look at some of the XMPP consumers out there; US government, hospitals etc.) People are just jumping onto these other technologies because they are the new bandwagon. XMPP will always be there. Regards, Matthew ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___ -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] Facebook now supports XMPP connections
On Fri, Feb 12, 2010 at 11:45, Pedro Melo m...@simplicidade.org wrote: Exactly. They have a presentation somewhere about this, can't find it at the moment. http://cufp.galois.com/2009/slides/PiroLetuchy.pdf -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] wiki.xmpp.org
On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 07:16, Sander Devrieze san...@sanderdevrieze.net wrote: 2009/12/22 Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im: I've started moving some pages from Wikipedia to wiki.xmpp.org, as linked from http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Servers Feel free to help out. :) You should fix the license as public domain is not compatible with Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Besides, in some countries, one cannot write directly under PD. But before considering a heavy license change process, can you please Sander tell us or point to what's incompatible? -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] wiki.xmpp.org
...why this move? This sounds like a fork, and that would be unwishable... On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 05:42, Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im wrote: I've started moving some pages from Wikipedia to wiki.xmpp.org, as linked from http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Servers Feel free to help out. :) Peter -- Peter Saint-Andre https://stpeter.im/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___ -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] wiki.xmpp.org
On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 16:29, Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im wrote: On 12/22/09 8:10 AM, Peter Saint-Andre wrote: On 12/21/09 11:16 PM, Sander Devrieze wrote: 2009/12/22 Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im: I've started moving some pages from Wikipedia to wiki.xmpp.org, as linked from http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Servers Feel free to help out. :) You should fix the license as public domain is not compatible with Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Hmm, yes, you're saying that we can't copy content from CC to PD. We'll need to fix that... Fixed. So, you change the license without asking all the content authors out there? ;-) -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] Converting one-on-one chat into a multi-user conference
Yes, the unique room ID could well be client-side generated. We are integrating that feature in ejabberd. On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 12:40, Yann Leboulanger aste...@lagaule.org wrote: Le 11/12/2009 10:37, jadahl a écrit : Trying out the feature in Gajim, only thing I can see is the two servers I have easy access to without setting up my own server (Openfire and ejabberd), these two has no support for it. Or am I wrong? When gajim asks for a unique room, both of them has no idea of what is going on. Indeed there are not many implementatino supporting unique room jid feature, but in this case, Gajim just use a random room jid, probability that it's not used is high .. -- Yann ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___ -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] Fosdem 2010
On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 17:44, Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 10/13/09 7:28 AM, Winfried Tilanus wrote: Hi There, For your notice: The 2010 edition of Fosdem is scheduled on 6 and 7 februari 2010. The organisation just send out calls for main tracks, lightning talks and stands. Devrooms are to follow (the concept will be reworked a bit this year). Any idea's for activities from the XMPP-community? More hacking, less talking! :) How about a few tracks for people who want to hack on specific codebases / in specific languages. Examples: 1. Python Hacking for XMPP (SleekXMPP, Twisted, etc.) 2. Building an XMPP Server in Lua (Prosody) 3. Erlang, XMPP, and You (ejabberd) 4. Improving XMPP Support in the World's Most Popular IM Client (Pidgin) 5. Psi Bug Squashing and Feature Enhancements We could also do interop testing among various codebases. I don't yet know if I'll be attending FOSDEM so I am going to leave the organizational tasks to others. Peter I agree with the more hacking and the more testing, to which we can also add more writing. Maybe we could also bring love and attention to PubSub and Jingle. -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] MS + XMPP
We had alreay covered that in XMPP Roundup 8, back in April: http://blog.xmpp.org/index.php/2009/04/xmpp-roundup-8/ XMPP gateway in MS LCS Alfonso Castro, director of interoperability strategy at Microsoft, announced at Solutions Linux 2009 that Live Communication Server, Microsoft’s presence and instant messaging product, will have an XMPP gateway in the future. As Jehan is metionning, this is only a gateway for OCS, although we can do real federation: http://www.process-one.net/en/blogs/article/seamless_federation_between_xmpp_and_microsoft_ocs Nÿco On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 19:50, Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Of interest: http://communicationsserverteam.com/archive/2009/10/01/588.aspx http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2009/oct09/10-01ucinterop.mspx http://channel9.msdn.com/posts/jccim/Instant-Messaging-Interoperability-extended-through-XMPP-Jabber/ Peter - -- Peter Saint-Andre https://stpeter.im/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.8 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkrE7AIACgkQNL8k5A2w/vx4GACg6ESWnkrW8gp4Nb40Rmt0pSxf 2GoAnjLLbf/jNCxv12cPGj2CzW2GMQDY =X0Bq -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___ -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://xmpp.org - http://april.org/ - http://qsos.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] XMPP for graphical collaborative environment
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 13:38, Mr.SpOOnmr.spoo...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I'm new here. Welcome! I have an idea for a thesis that I have to develop and just the other day I thought I could realize it using XMPP. I know nothing about it and I didn't find any good guide or tutorial online. I'm planning on buying The definitive guide, but I thought it would be better asking here before. The Definitive Guide is definitively a good buy! ;-) I'm not sure what I might be able to do with XMPP. My idea is to develop a GUI with Processing (www.processing.org) and put it on the web, maybe using processingjs (http://processingjs.org/). The GUI environment should be dynamic and it is used to control some backend code. Let's say there is a user session. I login, I have my session and I start creating my GUI. I want to give the possibility to share the GUI whith othere users and to let this other users modify the GUI. Is it possible achieving something like this with XMPP? Maybe if the GUI is controlled by an XML file? Hope it is clear what I'm asking for. Anyway, do you know some good resource online to learn about XMPP? Thanks, bye Carlo Maybe these (non-yet XSF) specs can help you get some inspiration? XEP-: Multi-User Collaboration http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/mucol.html XEP-: Shared XML Document Editing http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/sxde.html XEP-: Shared XML Editing http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/sxe.html JEP-: An SVG Based Whiteboard Format http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/whiteboard.html XEP-: Whiteboard http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/whiteboard2.html Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/ Adhérez à l'April : http://april.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] a vision
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 12:24 AM, Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.im wrote: As posted at my blog [...] I agree with most of the points, except: 3. Internationalized versions of everything so that volunteers around the world can run sites like de.jabber.org (Germany) and pt.jabber.org (Portugal). We already have strong local communities worldwide that do an amazing job : http://www.jabber.org.au/ http://www.jabberes.org/ http://www.jabberfr.org/ http://www.jabber.no/ http://www.jabber.cz/ http://www.jabber.org.uk/ http://www.jabber.ru/ http://web.swissjabber.ch/ Again, watch closer the french example, the one I know the most, we got: * website: http://www.jabberfr.org/ * wiki: http://wiki.jabberfr.org/ * forum: http://forum.jabberfr.org/ * MUC server: xmpp:chat.jabberfr.org * web MUC: http://chat.jabberfr.org/ * blog: http://news.jabberfr.org/ * blog agregator: http://planet.jabberfr.org/ * directory: xmpp:users.jabberfr.org http://annuaire.jabberfr.org/ * randomchat: http://randomchat.jabberfr.org/ * notification bot: xmpp:jabbe...@im.apinc.org * cooperation between french services: http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Coop%C3%A9ration * web presence: xmpp:presence.jabberfr.org * proxy: proxy.jabberfr.org * transports... Plus small initiatives, plus what we do IRL... But that's not enough, we need more, like PubSub applications (like microblogging), real-time agregator (like Mimir), maybe games, collaboration tools, etc. In short, we demo every day, in real-time, a portion of the power of XMPP technologies. IMHO, I don't thing jabber.org should drive/lead/take over already existing local communities, a great deal of job is already done, and we don't need to dilute the effort. IMHO, I think jabber.org should first look at what's done worldwide (especially the spanish, czech, and russian powerful examples). You can use (should?) online translation tools so that you can browse the sites. However IMHO I think jabber.org should ignite/foster non yet existent local communities. But enough speaking, I've contributed this: http://www.jabber.org/web/Category:Feature Much like we've done on: http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Cat%C3%A9gorie:Fonctionnalit%C3%A9_Jabber This page lists all the Jabber/XMPP features, as people really don't know half of them, we have to publicise them. All the pages are just created as empty shells. I have used a category, and redirects. I'll create a model or category Draft or TODO, so that we can have a todo-list. Please review, and feel free to contribute an introductory text on each page/feature, it is a good basis. If a feature is missing, please create the page and put [[Category:Feature]] at the end of the page. If you create a synonymous page, put #REDIRECT [[Synonymous]] at the top of the page, and don't forget [[Category:Feature]] at the end of the page (well... two lines below). Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/ Adhérez à l'April : http://april.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] a vision
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:00 PM, Remko Tronçon re...@el-tramo.be wrote: We already have strong local communities worldwide that do an amazing job : I still think there's more value in making jabber.org a uniform service across international boundaries, the way Peter described. But all the past initiatives have failed to bring contributions... The process of centralizing contributions in english at jabber.org, and then translate to many language.jabber.org subdomains... and update, and update, will be quite heavy, and the synchronization is quite undoable, we don't have a framework for that. If we do Wikipedia-like, which means no coordination or so between languages, then what's the added value to host the language on jabber.org? Every local community doing its own thing is nice and fun, but it's confusing to newcomers as well. True, but the contribution barrier is lower. What we can do is just mention the local community in the central jabber.org site, instead of re-doing its work. It also means that you have a Jabber ID that is bound to the particular service. Can you explain? I think that localized versions of the same site would have much more impact, less investment (localized sites don't need to run their own jabber service), and would be much more practical. True for the service hosting. Untrue for the practical aspect, only from a centralized point of view. Contributors to the central place would have to follow a heavy process through english and his language. Plus it would fork the local community. I maybe repeating, but IMHO we should just *first* gather contributors, *then* inquire what's done in local communities, bring the ideas to jabber.org and implement them the 'rough consensus' way, *and then* translate to languages IF the corresponding local community is not yet existent. Who can help? Who can read and review what follows? For example, if we just keep in the wiki perimeter, we (JabberFr) have: * Made a kickstart wiki-based wizzard named Jabber in ten minutes with [client], including animated GIFs screencasts and Next buttons, quite a heavy work, not be dropped, but updated http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Jabber_en_dix_minutes_avec_Spark http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Jabber_en_dix_minutes_avec_Gajim http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Jabber_en_dix_minutes_avec_Psi * drafted portals: user, dev, admin, enterprise (to be done, somewhere in time) http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Portail:Utilisateur http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Portail:D%C3%A9veloppeurur http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Portail:Administrateur http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Portail:Entreprise * inventoried and classified clients: almost exhaustively up-to-date http://wiki.jabberfr.org/Clients All we have to do here, is just copy-paste-translate the already existing framework, if you think these are good ideas. Anyone who wants two cents? ;-) Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/ Adhérez à l'April : http://april.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] a vision
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:53 PM, Remko Tronçon re...@el-tramo.be wrote: All this can be avoided with one central 'jabber.org' service: you have a core team of people focusing on running an excellent XMPP service, and another team focusing on keeping the website up, and another team for the translations. Combined efforts give much better results. Why not call it MSN or QQ? (just kidding..). Combiend efforts are already in place in local communities. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 2:16 PM, Remko Tronçon re...@el-tramo.be wrote: But all the past initiatives have failed to bring contributions... By the way, I think one of the most important parts of failure on jabber.org contributions is the fact that it was Wiki-driven. Most of the reasons why it failed was because... we failed to gather contributions. Everything non-mediawiki has a high barrier of entry. I agree that this is impossible to keep in sync, and I don't believe a Wiki-based approach can work. Communties that have a wiki (that works): http://www.jabber.cz/ http://www.jabberfr.org/ Please, plse, take a look! ;-) Peter talks about A clean and simple website with minimal text that will help end users get started with Jabber. That should be much easier to maintain and internationalize, without resorting to Wikis. I disagree, having exeprienced it many times in many places, every potential contributor already knows and contributes at least a bit to Wikipedia (and its syntax), thus a Medawiki-based place is an excellent way to go. It works. Period. Unless you don't seed work and let it die. My seed is here: a small cleaning and features. Please help. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/ Adhérez à l'April : http://april.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] a vision
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 2:50 PM, Remko Tronçon re...@el-tramo.be wrote: When I surf to jabber.org, I want to see a professional looking page with 2 things: - A 3-line explanation of what jabber is Where is the text of the Drupal-based former website? - A button with Join now, which creates me an account on the Jabber network by only asking me questions that I know the answer to (Name, Email, Preferred login name) You got now the Join now!, but still no form ;-) What I do see is: - A website that looks like a perpetual work in progress. Pretty scary, doesn't really sound like a good IM service to me. - About 50 links, many of which are uninteresting (the sidebar, because it's a wiki) I've minimized the size of this sidebar (can be reverted). - Create account links that don't create a Jabber account True, still no form, it's page full of text. Who has got such a piece of script/software? - Links to events that have passed, but nobody dares to touch the front page, because nobody owns that page Done. - Links to things like 'discussion' that give me an error This does'nt to me although I understand some people might think so watching a big input field. - A quickstart guide that tells me to pick a server (a what? why?) We can drive the user to jabber.org IM service', but shouldn't we be software/service-agnostic? - A box saying that there have been GMail issues. When was that? This morning? Last week? It seems this Jabber thing has lots of issues with GMail, because it's been there for quite a while. (Why is it there? Exactly, nobody dares to touch it) Done. Want me to go on? :) Yes, please! ;-) Anyway, I'm not going to rant about Wikis anymore, this isn't helping. I do believe that Peter's suggestion is a good one: one simple page to get people hooked up with Jabber fast, that we can refer people to if they want to chat on Jabber. One translator per language would be nice to have the site translated, with a good system in place that notifies of changes (which shouldn't happen often) to this page. cheers, Remko If it's an overworked-two-persons, closed-loop work, the don't rant about the lack of contributions. No? ;-) If not, then let the contributions come in by seeding/starting/igniting, like we both do today here. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/ Adhérez à l'April : http://april.org/ ___ JDev mailing list Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] XMPP Open Day
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 6:55 AM, Jack Moffitt j...@chesspark.com wrote: All the feedback on XMPP Open Day was great, so I'd like to make it into reality. I've written it up here: http://metajack.im/2008/12/18/announcing-xmpp-open-day/index.html and I've created a wiki page for everyone to hack on here; http://wiki.jabber.org/web/XMPP_Open_Day jack. Dates: * Jeremie Miller announced Jabber on 1999 january the 4th * the IETF accepted XMPP-related RFCs as Internet Drafts on 2004 october the 4th I've edited the wiki page. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:nicolas.ver...@gmail.com Jabber ID : xmpp:n...@jabber.fr http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/ Adhérez à l'April : http://april.org/ ___ JDev mailing list FAQ: http://www.jabber.org/discussion-lists/jdev-faq Forum: http://www.jabberforum.org/forumdisplay.php?f=20 Info: http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/jdev Unsubscribe: jdev-unsubscr...@jabber.org ___
Re: [jdev] Facebook XMPP
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 10:28 PM, Nick Vidal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So how about writting an open letter to these influential companies? Who thinks this is a good idea? I agree. It won't hurt, besides it will help us gain visibility, which we cruelly lack nowadays, especially when big commercial companies, like Facebook, Baidu in China, launch their brand new IM system, the need for interop and breaking the walls can be shown more obvious. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] Facebook XMPP
Yes, but please, PLEASE, never ever forget anymore those BIG players: * Gadu-Gadu in Poland * Nate On in South Korea * QQ in China * soon Baidu Hi in China All of them are deeply anchored in their area of adoption, even if you don't see them from your part of the world. Remember also that AIM/MSN/ICQ/Yahoo are SMALL! Nÿco On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 12:33 AM, Sander Devrieze [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 2008/5/15 JabberForum [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I aggree. I don't really see a point in having an open letter. They know of our existence, and they'll contact us soon enough. An open letter maybe can be useful if it is done as some kind of press release. First contact several potential walled garden owners and get them to support the open letter by switching to XMPP. Then list them in this letter or let them publish this letter or something like that. Overview of the battle field, in order of how easy it will be to get them to use XMPP (I may be wrong here): 1) Walled garden networks of social networks and things like that--They will be the easiest to convert to XMPP as their market share is too small and they need to start from zero regarding clients. XMPP also seems to have the right features for them. 2) Yahoo--There market share is the smallest of the big walled garden networks and I guess it is diminishing. Also, in order to get some more protection against a hostile takeover of Microsoft, they may want to adopt XMPP. As Micosoft really wants to get more important on the Internet, this argument is also true for social networks that want to protect themselves (cfr. Facebook) 3) AIM/ICQ--I believe AOL's market share is also diminishing, but it's still big and they don't have to fair a hostile takeover bid I guess. It will be harder to get them converted. A good reason for them to adopt XMPP early would be that they still have a big market share. If they don't wait to long with switching, they will be able to control the direction of XMPP more easily than if they wait until they are forced to switch. 4) MSN--This will be the hardest. I guess it may be XMPP versus MSN for a relative long time. Microsoft integrated MSN in all its software and services. The best way is probably to focus on giving the whole XMPP world a stronger position in companies; if enough companies ask XMPP support in Microsoft's products, Microsoft will be forced to add it, but it will not be easy. -- Mvg, Sander Devrieze. -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] Facebook XMPP
On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 12:39 AM, Peter Saint-Andre [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: An open letter I don't believe in open letters. How gauche! [...] we [...] decided that we would stop doing press releases because they are *so* 20th-century. Now we just blog: http://blog.xmpp.org/ Most decidors in the world are still 20th century, and for them, blog are for kids and amateurs... Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] Facebook XMPP
Lets just wait and see what happens. I think that's the best option indeed and I'll stop my paranoia for now ;) I personally thanked and congratulated them by e-mail, underlining they did a good choice. I also asked for an opening of their S2S, and proposed my help.. Though they were flooded... Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] Facebook XMPP
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 3:28 PM, Nick Vidal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 12:24 PM, Sander Devrieze [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ---8--- cut Wether or not you're against or with the walled gardens, we have to help them implement a real XMPP service, respecting the XEP, and playing fair with XSF, pushing/helping them contributing to the XEP processes, and interop tests, and more... Bring them in, not let them out. Help them help us. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] Facebook XMPP
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 5:40 PM, Peter Saint-Andre [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (I miss the Jabber Journals...). Yes those were nice. Too bad I don't have time to write them anymore. Do you need help? Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] what would you think of this as an SoC project?
Hi, I think this has already been discussed in at least one list, maybe not the present one, but on LinuxFR.org, there is a small web-based chat system using a very handy threading mecanism. Cehck out with the mouse pointer: http://linuxfr.org/board/ Disclaimer: please do not carefully read the chats (in french), there are a lot of stupid conversations here, but sometimes very interesting ones. ;-) How it works: Lines of chat are prefixed by the server's timestamp, and the username of course. An user using the web-based interface clicks on this timestamp in order to answer or reply to a line of chat. Then the text entry form is prefixed with the clicked timestamp. When posted, a mouse pointer hovering the new line's referenced timestamp highlights the referenced line of chat. Thus by hovering all the referenced timestamp, one could easily read, follow, and instant view of mixed chat threads. This is very handy, I would love to have such an easy to read and follow threading system in usual chat clients. What do you think of it? Is it near of far from what your students worked on? Could it improve their work? Nÿco On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 1:55 AM, Greg Wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Two grad students at U of Toronto have been working this term on a tool to analyze chat conversations (IRC, IM, etc.) and cluster messages into threads. They presented their work this afternoon, and will be doing another presentation on April 9; I think it has promise, especially since they're using incremental algorithms that would be well-suited to real-time execution. They're not going to carry on with it (they have thesis topics picked out, and this ain't it :-), but the long-term goal would be to build something that could plug into various clients, or be used to process logs. Would this make a good project for XMPP SoC? It would require a student who already has some understanding of IR, clustering algorithms, and NLP, but it could help make large chat spaces more usable. I'd be willing to mentor... Thanks, Greg Wilson http://www.cs.toronto.edu/~gvwilson -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] what would you think of this as an SoC project?
Check out with the mouse pointer: http://linuxfr.org/board/ Times out on me. Yes, it was down, it's back up now. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/ - http://qsos.org/
Re: [jdev] OpenID services
On Dec 15, 2007 12:17 AM, Peter Saint-Andre [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tobias Markmann wrote: On Dec 15, 2007 12:02 AM, Peter Saint-Andre [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a list of Jabber-enabled OpenID services? Someone pinged me about that today but I didn't have a list to share. Maybe this is something we could add to the new jabber.org website Like this one; open-id with xmpp http authentication: http://openid.xmpp.za.net/ Right. I'm just wondering if there are more like that. :) /psa Like this one http://xmppid.net/ ? Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/
Re: [jdev] Google to Connect to Other IM Networks Using Jabber Transports?
On 11/1/07, Tomasz Sterna [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dnia 01-11-2007, Cz o godzinie 15:00 -0600, Peter Saint-Andre pisze: http://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2007/10/google-to-connect-to-other-im-networks.html Yes I saw that in my RSS feeds this morning. I don't have any inside information to share about it, but it's intriguing. The code shown is a list of methods to use for transport of AJAX request made by the client to the server. (browser native, or emulated with IFrames) It has nothing to do with Jabber Transports. Besides, the IM fields that you will be able to fill in for a contact, are already present. Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/
Re: [jdev] JABBERSTUDIO NOTICE -- SITE DEMISE
On 3/14/07, Mark Doliner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wikipedia has a few lists of Jabber software. The formatting is not exactly ideal... but anyone is free to update it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jabber_client_software http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jabber_component_software http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jabber_library_software http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jabber_server_software -Mark What about http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_applications_using_Jabber ? I know of UnclassifiedNewsBoard, FlySpray, phpBB3, GForge, LibreSource... Do you know more? Nÿco -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/
Re: [jdev] JABBERSTUDIO NOTICE -- SITE DEMISE
On 3/14/07, Tony Finch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 14 Mar 2007, Peter Saint-Andre wrote: Nicolas Vérité wrote: What about http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_applications_using_Jabber ? I know of UnclassifiedNewsBoard, FlySpray, phpBB3, GForge, LibreSource... Do you know more? Zimbra, Zabbix, Jaiku, Twitter, etc. ... Joost ... I think we have to differentiate applications and services: Twitter and Joost's source code or compiled form are not avaiable for an install in my company/association/home... -- Nicolas Vérité (Nÿco) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber ID : xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://linuxfr.org/ - http://fr.wikipedia.org/ - http://www.jabberfr.org/
