Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? also called Re: FTP From JSP
---Snipped from JSPInsider article: ... these are good times to be a simple country programmer! Casey: To have life so simple is always a joy. Unfortunately,... Thanks for posting your site and the link to your first-in-a-series article. It presents an informative and intriguing comparison of asp to jsp. It seems a comparison is better made between MS IIS server-side technologies, including asp, with its limited internet server support (principally MS IIS), to server-side Java, including jsp, which is widely supported by most internet server platforms out there. In case some may perceive MS bashing, I like MS tools. I've developed sw for decades, using MS tools for a good part of that time. Among them, I develop in MS VC++ on an NT workstation/server, and run first-tests of C++ and Java apps on MS IIS. Yes, NT IIS is simple, easy to install and manage, but at best, MS IIS leaves ambivalence. MS IIS seems a little like Macintosh: a good platform without market acceptance in important application areas. The lessons of Apple Computer (Apple once held dominant market share) and Ashton Tate's dBase (ditto. Now, Ashton who?) resonate. Great technologies don't die, they fade into oblivion. (Does anyone remember Betamax, VisiCalc or VisiOn?). The argument in favor of MS IIS is that, for "small" sites, MS IIS (asp) holds its own in comparison to Java servers (and jsp), admitting that server-side Java is better suited for "larger" sites. Has anyone argued otherwise? Ultimately, it's unimportant how capable MS IIS asp may be. Use determines acceptance. Many dBase programmers have said, "dBase can do that," but dBase is not used for so many "thats." Similarly, at some point, IS resources turn away from MS IIS towards more accepted platforms. At what point does MS IIS and asp fade into oblivion? Your article suggests an expansive definition for a "small" site, raising a valid question as to how small is "small." Your term "users" seems more clearly called "client requests," since an Internet client-server "user" usually disconnects once the request is satisfied. To call 500 simultaneous requests a "small" site seems a bit much. A quick run at the numbers suggests that a maximum of 500 simultaneous client requests means that server capacity could far exceed 15 million hits per month, 500,000 per day. Shove most NT IIS servers into this environment would prove disappointing. The limit is one of acceptable usage. Of course, MS wants IS managers to believe the limit is the hardware, not the NT (Win2000) OS; perhaps they are right. Still, in my experience, MS IIS(NT/Win2000) is not the preferred choice for high traffic machines. Implementing asp-com technologies outside MS IIS is difficult, at best. IS management seems to accept the concept that MS IIS is acceptable for "small" i-server apps and most IS people feel comfortable saying Java is superior beyond some minimally "small" size site. One question is "How big is a "small" site?" Another question is, "Do you want to speculate with your, or your company's, resources on whether MS IIS will ever be accepted as suitable for serving a rapidly expanding client base with growing client needs?" Bill Gates says he's betting the company on his new net technologies, just as VisiCorp once bet their company on VisiOn (Visi-what?). Do you want to bet your project on MS IIS future, ignoring accepted MS IIS limits? This much seems most simple: Java servers are the accepted choice for growing sites with big-picture needs. Here, the future of MS IIS is simply speculative. Comments? Phil Campbell the-wally-project.org -Original Message----- From: casey kochmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, July 07, 2000 2:41 PM Subject: Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Hello Phil I just recently wrote an article discussing your questions topic. The article is called ASP Vs JSP and it is the first of several installments on this topic. You can read the article at http://www.jspinsider.com/articles/jspasp/jspasp1.html === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
Can someone recommend a good on-line article on pros and cons of asp v. jsp? We're not too impressed with what we know about asp, seeing no advantage over jsp and believing it may have noteworthy disadvantages. Any thoughts, comments are appreciated Phil Campbell === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
Go to orionserver.com , Under the FAQ section there is a link to benchmark , which compares performance of ASP vs JSP === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
This question has been posted before, I think it should be on the FAQ list or the archive. Anyhow, here are the links I saved from last post: Here are some references with comparisons between ASP and JSP: Comparing JavaServer Pages and Microsoft Active Server Pages Technologies http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/jsp-asp.html JavaServer Pages for the ASP Developer http://www.asptoday.com/articles/19991022.htm JSP will win hearts, but competition is strong http://www.zdnet.com/eweek/stories/general/0,11011,410709,00.html Shane Duan [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Phil Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 9:33 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject:asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Can someone recommend a good on-line article on pros and cons of asp v. jsp? We're not too impressed with what we know about asp, seeing no advantage over jsp and believing it may have noteworthy disadvantages. Any thoughts, comments are appreciated Phil Campbell === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
www.serverpages.com has some good articles on this. - Original Message - From: Phil Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 8:33 AM Subject: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Can someone recommend a good on-line article on pros and cons of asp v. jsp? We're not too impressed with what we know about asp, seeing no advantage over jsp and believing it may have noteworthy disadvantages. Any thoughts, comments are appreciated Phil Campbell === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
If you look at the benchmark test, a very simplistic file bench.asp and bench.jsp was used. In real environment if you are using asp or jsp its not for static data (or else html would have been better) but for dynamic data and always involves database interaction. I think this is where Microsoft scores a point because NT's IIS interaction with Microsoft SQL Sever 7.0 is highly optimised. Any benchmark test should consider database interactivity too. It really depends on lot of factors when it comes to making a choice between JSP ASP. I would recommend that if performance is the only criteria then you should do your benchmark using a "real-world" asp/jsp code that you would use in your environment. -Original Message- From: Daryani Santosh [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 10:56 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Go to orionserver.com , Under the FAQ section there is a link to benchmark , which compares performance of ASP vs JSP === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
i liked that -- From: Graham Cruickshanks[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Reply To: A mailing list about Java Server Pages specification and reference Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 9:04 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? I've been working with ASP for 3 year before changing recently to JSP, JSP Advantages: More reliable, (ASP may look like it works but JSP/Javabeans mean you have to catch exceptions i.e. better code) Faster ( really ) Object Oriented ( finally reusable code ) You can use a Debugger ( try that in ASP ) run anywhere etc, Tags Easy DB Connection Pool Complied Code ( Clients can't nick the source ) JSP Disadvantages require more expensive, good programmers where as monkeys can program ASP Cheers Graham Cruickshanks www.itsnotrocketscience.com -Original Message- From: Phil Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 07 July 2000 15:33 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Can someone recommend a good on-line article on pros and cons of asp v. jsp? We're not too impressed with what we know about asp, seeing no advantage over jsp and believing it may have noteworthy disadvantages. Any thoughts, comments are appreciated Phil Campbell == = To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets == = To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
I've been working with ASP for 3 year before changing recently to JSP,... It seems with this list of pros and cons, one would be well advised to avoid Microsoft's asp as one would avoid Cleopatra 's asp or the biblical asp... Phil -Original Message- From: Graham Cruickshanks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, July 07, 2000 9:39 AM Subject: Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? I've been working with ASP for 3 year before changing recently to JSP, JSP Advantages: More reliable, (ASP may look like it works but JSP/Javabeans mean you have to catch exceptions i.e. better code) Faster ( really ) Object Oriented ( finally reusable code ) You can use a Debugger ( try that in ASP ) run anywhere etc, Tags Easy DB Connection Pool Complied Code ( Clients can't nick the source ) JSP Disadvantages require more expensive, good programmers where as monkeys can program ASP Cheers Graham Cruickshanks www.itsnotrocketscience.com -Original Message- From: Phil Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 07 July 2000 15:33 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Can someone recommend a good on-line article on pros and cons of asp v. jsp? We're not too impressed with what we know about asp, seeing no advantage over jsp and believing it may have noteworthy disadvantages. Any thoughts, comments are appreciated Phil Campbell === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
Re: asp v. jsp/servlet environment?
Hello Phil I just recently wrote an article discussing your questions topic. The article is called ASP Vs JSP and it is the first of several installments on this topic. You can read the article at http://www.jspinsider.com/articles/jspasp/jspasp1.html At this time I suppose I can also announce a new JSP web site Called: JSP Insider. The URL is http://www.jspinsider.com We are in pilot mode for the month of July and would appreciate any feedback the JSP community might have to help us make the best possible JSP resource site. Our goal is to help people have an easy time using and learning JSP and also offering access to the tools to make us successful as developers. Casey Kochmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Phil Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: A mailing list about Java Server Pages specification and reference [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: asp v. jsp/servlet environment? Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 08:33:26 -0600 Can someone recommend a good on-line article on pros and cons of asp v. jsp? We're not too impressed with what we know about asp, seeing no advantage over jsp and believing it may have noteworthy disadvantages. Any thoughts, comments are appreciated Phil Campbell === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com === To unsubscribe: mailto [EMAIL PROTECTED] with body: "signoff JSP-INTEREST". Some relevant FAQs on JSP/Servlets can be found at: http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/faq.html http://www.esperanto.org.nz/jsp/jspfaq.html http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=JSP http://www.jguru.com/jguru/faq/faqpage.jsp?name=Servlets
