[libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-18 Thread Hlompho Mota
Greetings,
I would like to ask how one would get started in building the language for
Sesotho?
To an extend even building language support for the language.

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-18 Thread sebul
Hello

2021년 5월 19일 (수) 오전 8:04, Hlompho Mota 님이 작성:
>
> Greetings,
> I would like to ask how one would get started in building the language for
> Sesotho?
> To an extend even building language support for the language.
>

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/LibreOffice_Localization_Guide#Register_with_LibreOffice
will help you.

The link
says
If the language is not listed in Weblate at all, it's a pretty good
indication that you will have to start from scratch. In this case, prepare
for a lot of translation work (or better, find yourself a few comrades) and
contact the localization mailing list telling your intentions and listing
all the necessary information (see below).

Have  good luck.

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-18 Thread Ming H.
Hi,

-- Original --
From: "Hlompho Mota" ;
Send time: Wednesday, May 19, 2021 6:58 AM
> 
> Greetings,
> I would like to ask how one would get started in building the language for
> Sesotho?
> To an extend even building language support for the language.

Someone who knows more probably will give you a more detailed answer, but
for now you can look at the southern Sotho / Sesotho translation on Weblate [1]
and find the area for improvement.  For now you can only make suggestions,
and since there is no contact person listed on the LibreOffice language teams
page [2], you'll want to contact the previous translator to see how you can
cooperate.  If he/she is no longer working on the translation, you can write to
this list again and ask to become the main translator for Sesotho and get access
to directly change the translation string on Weblate instead of just making
suggestions.

1. https://translations.documentfoundation.org/languages/st/
2. https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language_Teams

Hope this helps,
Ming
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-18 Thread Hlompho Mota
The thing is I did.
South Sotho as its called has a dialect more aimed at South Africa. Lesotho
has its own way of presenting the language.
Given that challenge, rather than offending people, I think it would be
ideal to have Sesotho. We don't do the whole Northern and Southen Sotho
thing...

Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ

On Wed, 19 May 2021 at 02:10, Ming H. <2097632...@qq.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> -- Original --
> From: "Hlompho Mota" ;
> Send time: Wednesday, May 19, 2021 6:58 AM
> >
> > Greetings,
> > I would like to ask how one would get started in building the language
> for
> > Sesotho?
> > To an extend even building language support for the language.
>
> Someone who knows more probably will give you a more detailed answer, but
> for now you can look at the southern Sotho / Sesotho translation on
> Weblate [1]
> and find the area for improvement.  For now you can only make suggestions,
> and since there is no contact person listed on the LibreOffice language
> teams
> page [2], you'll want to contact the previous translator to see how you can
> cooperate.  If he/she is no longer working on the translation, you can
> write to
> this list again and ask to become the main translator for Sesotho and get
> access
> to directly change the translation string on Weblate instead of just making
> suggestions.
>
> 1. https://translations.documentfoundation.org/languages/st/
> 2. https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language_Teams
>
> Hope this helps,
> Ming

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-19 Thread sophi
Hi and welcome!

Le 19/05/2021 à 04:03, Hlompho Mota a écrit :
> The thing is I did.
> South Sotho as its called has a dialect more aimed at South Africa. Lesotho
> has its own way of presenting the language.
> Given that challenge, rather than offending people, I think it would be
> ideal to have Sesotho. We don't do the whole Northern and Southen Sotho
> thing...

So what would be the language code to use given that we already have
Southern Sotho (st) in Weblate and researching for it, ISO gives:
https://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/langcodes_name.php?iso_639_1=st

Cheers
Sophie
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IRC: sophi
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The Document Foundation

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-19 Thread Mike Saunders
Hi Hlompho,

If you'd like to get more people involved with the translation effort,
just let me know. I do marketing and community outreach here at The
Document Foundation, and can spread the word on our blog and social
media, encouraging others with knowledge of the language to join in, eg
like this:

https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2020/06/22/community-member-monday-jwtiyar-ali/

Just drop me a line if so!

Cheers,
Mike


On 19.05.21 04:03, Hlompho Mota wrote:
> The thing is I did.
> South Sotho as its called has a dialect more aimed at South Africa. Lesotho
> has its own way of presenting the language.
> Given that challenge, rather than offending people, I think it would be
> ideal to have Sesotho. We don't do the whole Northern and Southen Sotho
> thing...
> 
> Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
> www.lesothobarcodes.com
> +266 50698342 | +266 62016682
> 
> ᐧ
> 
> On Wed, 19 May 2021 at 02:10, Ming H. <2097632...@qq.com> wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>>
>> -- Original --
>> From: "Hlompho Mota" ;
>> Send time: Wednesday, May 19, 2021 6:58 AM
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>> I would like to ask how one would get started in building the language
>> for
>>> Sesotho?
>>> To an extend even building language support for the language.
>>
>> Someone who knows more probably will give you a more detailed answer, but
>> for now you can look at the southern Sotho / Sesotho translation on
>> Weblate [1]
>> and find the area for improvement.  For now you can only make suggestions,
>> and since there is no contact person listed on the LibreOffice language
>> teams
>> page [2], you'll want to contact the previous translator to see how you can
>> cooperate.  If he/she is no longer working on the translation, you can
>> write to
>> this list again and ask to become the main translator for Sesotho and get
>> access
>> to directly change the translation string on Weblate instead of just making
>> suggestions.
>>
>> 1. https://translations.documentfoundation.org/languages/st/
>> 2. https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language_Teams
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> Ming
> 

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-19 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi,

On Wednesday, 2021-05-19 10:14:37 +0200, Sophie Gautier wrote:

> Le 19/05/2021 à 04:03, Hlompho Mota a écrit :
> > South Sotho as its called has a dialect more aimed at South Africa. Lesotho
> > has its own way of presenting the language.
> > Given that challenge, rather than offending people, I think it would be
> > ideal to have Sesotho. We don't do the whole Northern and Southen Sotho
> > thing...
> 
> So what would be the language code to use given that we already have
> Southern Sotho (st) in Weblate and researching for it, ISO gives:
> https://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/langcodes_name.php?iso_639_1=st

We already have "Northern Sotho" in the language list, ISO 639-2 'nso'.

In Weblate https://translations.documentfoundation.org/languages/nso/

Its actual standard name seems to be Pedi
https://iso639-3.sil.org/code/nso
but everywhere else named Northern Sotho (except in Weblate ;-)

In the language list we may want to rename

Northern Sotho -> Sotho, Northern
Southern Sotho -> Sotho, Southern

so they are grouped together when alphabetically sorted.

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-19 Thread Hlompho Mota
I realised that issue,
So in light of that, I would like to know if it's ever possible that ls
being Lesotho ISO code be added to the Lesotho aspect of the branch?
Because the Sotho (as they may call it) does have some serious issues in
how the language has been put together from our perspective.
Then there is the other issue of how we write our words. Since written
language from our end has more of an influence from how French vocabulary
was written, there are some significant differences in how words are put
together.
So in light of this point, I think to prevent creating issues on the
efforts of the South Sotho, I think it would be ideal to create a new
branch altogether.

Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ

On Wed, 19 May 2021 at 10:15, sophi  wrote:

> Hi and welcome!
>
> Le 19/05/2021 à 04:03, Hlompho Mota a écrit :
> > The thing is I did.
> > South Sotho as its called has a dialect more aimed at South Africa.
> Lesotho
> > has its own way of presenting the language.
> > Given that challenge, rather than offending people, I think it would be
> > ideal to have Sesotho. We don't do the whole Northern and Southen Sotho
> > thing...
>
> So what would be the language code to use given that we already have
> Southern Sotho (st) in Weblate and researching for it, ISO gives:
> https://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/langcodes_name.php?iso_639_1=st
>
> Cheers
> Sophie
> --
> Sophie Gautier so...@libreoffice.org
> GSM: +33683901545
> IRC: sophi
> Foundation coordinator
> The Document Foundation
>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-19 Thread Hlompho Mota
I saw that,
From our end, we refer to the language as Sesotho.
Based on this point there are some other significant differences even how
we speak and use the language. Given that Lesotho is an independent state,
our language doesn't tend to have some of the influences from other
languages in South Africa.
However given that our language in its current form is the official
language, there is some issue that may need be addressed and that there are
some significant differences in how they are written.

Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ

On Wed, 19 May 2021 at 12:18, Eike Rathke  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Wednesday, 2021-05-19 10:14:37 +0200, Sophie Gautier wrote:
>
> > Le 19/05/2021 à 04:03, Hlompho Mota a écrit :
> > > South Sotho as its called has a dialect more aimed at South Africa.
> Lesotho
> > > has its own way of presenting the language.
> > > Given that challenge, rather than offending people, I think it would be
> > > ideal to have Sesotho. We don't do the whole Northern and Southen Sotho
> > > thing...
> >
> > So what would be the language code to use given that we already have
> > Southern Sotho (st) in Weblate and researching for it, ISO gives:
> >
> https://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/langcodes_name.php?iso_639_1=st
>
> We already have "Northern Sotho" in the language list, ISO 639-2 'nso'.
>
> In Weblate https://translations.documentfoundation.org/languages/nso/
>
> Its actual standard name seems to be Pedi
> https://iso639-3.sil.org/code/nso
> but everywhere else named Northern Sotho (except in Weblate ;-)
>
> In the language list we may want to rename
>
> Northern Sotho -> Sotho, Northern
> Southern Sotho -> Sotho, Southern
>
> so they are grouped together when alphabetically sorted.
>
>   Eike
>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-20 Thread sophi
Hi,
Le 20/05/2021 à 01:04, Hlompho Mota a écrit :
> I realised that issue,
> So in light of that, I would like to know if it's ever possible that ls
> being Lesotho ISO code be added to the Lesotho aspect of the branch?
ls is the ISO code of the country see:
https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:code:3166:LS, we use ISO language codes
(639-1 or 639-2)

> Because the Sotho (as they may call it) does have some serious issues in
> how the language has been put together from our perspective.
> Then there is the other issue of how we write our words. Since written
> language from our end has more of an influence from how French vocabulary
> was written, there are some significant differences in how words are put
> together.
> So in light of this point, I think to prevent creating issues on the
> efforts of the South Sotho, I think it would be ideal to create a new
> branch altogether.

I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on our
side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.

Cheers
Sophie

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GSM: +33683901545
IRC: sophi
Foundation coordinator
The Document Foundation

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-20 Thread Tuomas Hietala

Hello,

sophi kirjoitti 20.5.2021 12:28:

I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on our
side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.


Looking at the list of languages at hosted.weblate.org, there seem to be 
at least several which probably don't have (official) ISO codes: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/


So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict 
requirement on Weblate's part, at least.


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-20 Thread Sophie


Le 20 mai 2021 18:52:03 GMT+02:00, Tuomas Hietala  a 
écrit :
>Hello,
>
>sophi kirjoitti 20.5.2021 12:28:
>> I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on
>our
>> side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.
>
>Looking at the list of languages at hosted.weblate.org, there seem to
>be 
>at least several which probably don't have (official) ISO codes: 
>https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/
>
>So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict 
>requirement on Weblate's part, at least.

Could you be more specific and name which ones?
Cheers
Sophie


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-20 Thread Tuomas Hietala

Sophie kirjoitti 20.5.2021 21:32:

Le 20 mai 2021 18:52:03 GMT+02:00, Tuomas Hietala
 a écrit :

Hello,

sophi kirjoitti 20.5.2021 12:28:

I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on

our

side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.


Looking at the list of languages at hosted.weblate.org, there seem to
be
at least several which probably don't have (official) ISO codes:
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/

So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict
requirement on Weblate's part, at least.


Could you be more specific and name which ones?
Cheers
Sophie


I don't think "English (Developer)" is any officially ISO-recognised 
language, for example: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/en_devel/#information


There's also stuff like this: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/_DE/#information

Abd this: https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/untranslated/#information

It would seem to me that Weblate is happy to accept just about any 
made-up code, it doesn't have to be one of the officially recognised 
codes.


Cheers,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-20 Thread Ming H.
Hi Sophie, hi all,

-- Original --
From: ;
Send time: Thursday, May 20, 2021 5:28 PM
> 
> I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on our
> side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.

I admit that I'm rather ignorant on how LibreOffice and Weblate handle
these different languages, but why can't we just give them a combined
language-and-country ISO code "st-LS" like we already do for English,
Chinese and Portuguese (en-US, en-UK, zh-CN, zh-TW, pt-BR, etc.)? 

Ming
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-21 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi,

On Thursday, 2021-05-20 01:04:11 +0200, Hlompho Mota wrote:

> So in light of that, I would like to know if it's ever possible that ls
> being Lesotho ISO code be added to the Lesotho aspect of the branch?

If you are proposing 'st-LS' additionally to 'st' (which defaults to
'st-ZA') then yes, that would be possible.

For the LibreOffice language list I'd then suggest
Sotho (Lesotho)

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-21 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi,

On Thursday, 2021-05-20 19:52:03 +0300, Tuomas Hietala wrote:

> So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict
> requirement on Weblate's part, at least.

For LibreOffice however it is a strict requirement to have a valid BCP 47
*language tag*. Which usually is the ISO 639-1/2/3 language code plus
maybe a ISO 3166 country code, but can also be any tag of IANA
registered subtags. If you're interested in the glory details see my
link collection at https://erack.de/bookmarks/D.html#Language_Tags

Making up an arbitrary string like 'en_devel' will not work. A similar
valid language tag however could be 'en-x-devel' indicating
a private-use tag, which is not interoperable though and thus should
never be used for document content or anything else leaving the
"private-use agreement sector".

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-26 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi,

On Friday, 2021-05-21 13:44:37 +0200, Eike Rathke wrote:

> > So in light of that, I would like to know if it's ever possible that ls
> > being Lesotho ISO code be added to the Lesotho aspect of the branch?
> 
> If you are proposing 'st-LS' additionally to 'st' (which defaults to
> 'st-ZA') then yes, that would be possible.
> 
> For the LibreOffice language list I'd then suggest
> Sotho (Lesotho)

So, should it be st-LS and "Sotho (Lesotho)"?

They would have to be added to the known locales and language list, if so.

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-31 Thread Hlompho Mota
Here is the funny thing,
We just referee to our language as Sesotho. But with the need to
accommodate the international codes allocated I thought it would be more
ls-ST. But rather than using Sotho, Could we refer to it as Sesotho?

Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ
ᐧ

On Wed, 26 May 2021 at 22:09, Eike Rathke  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Friday, 2021-05-21 13:44:37 +0200, Eike Rathke wrote:
>
> > > So in light of that, I would like to know if it's ever possible that ls
> > > being Lesotho ISO code be added to the Lesotho aspect of the branch?
> >
> > If you are proposing 'st-LS' additionally to 'st' (which defaults to
> > 'st-ZA') then yes, that would be possible.
> >
> > For the LibreOffice language list I'd then suggest
> > Sotho (Lesotho)
>
> So, should it be st-LS and "Sotho (Lesotho)"?
>
> They would have to be added to the known locales and language list, if so.
>
>   Eike
>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-31 Thread Hlompho Mota
Greetings,
Based on this part of the protocol:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc5646#section-2.2.4
I think the idea that Lesotho could have its own defined language tag.
(Well from my limited understanding)
Besides that, there are some significant differences in our language. So on
this note, I hope that it could count as a case for this petition.


Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ

On Fri, 21 May 2021 at 14:10, Eike Rathke  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Thursday, 2021-05-20 19:52:03 +0300, Tuomas Hietala wrote:
>
> > So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict
> > requirement on Weblate's part, at least.
>
> For LibreOffice however it is a strict requirement to have a valid BCP 47
> *language tag*. Which usually is the ISO 639-1/2/3 language code plus
> maybe a ISO 3166 country code, but can also be any tag of IANA
> registered subtags. If you're interested in the glory details see my
> link collection at https://erack.de/bookmarks/D.html#Language_Tags
>
> Making up an arbitrary string like 'en_devel' will not work. A similar
> valid language tag however could be 'en-x-devel' indicating
> a private-use tag, which is not interoperable though and thus should
> never be used for document content or anything else leaving the
> "private-use agreement sector".
>
>   Eike
>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-05-31 Thread Hlompho Mota
Greetings,
To make issues simpler to just name it as Sesotho that than Sotho.
So in creating the international code, we could simply just give it the
proper definition.

Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ

On Wed, 26 May 2021 at 22:09, Eike Rathke  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Friday, 2021-05-21 13:44:37 +0200, Eike Rathke wrote:
>
> > > So in light of that, I would like to know if it's ever possible that ls
> > > being Lesotho ISO code be added to the Lesotho aspect of the branch?
> >
> > If you are proposing 'st-LS' additionally to 'st' (which defaults to
> > 'st-ZA') then yes, that would be possible.
> >
> > For the LibreOffice language list I'd then suggest
> > Sotho (Lesotho)
>
> So, should it be st-LS and "Sotho (Lesotho)"?
>
> They would have to be added to the known locales and language list, if so.
>
>   Eike
>
> --
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> 2D3A
>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-06-01 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi Hlompho,

On Monday, 2021-05-31 23:37:10 +0200, Hlompho Mota wrote:

> Based on this part of the protocol:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc5646#section-2.2.4
> I think the idea that Lesotho could have its own defined language tag.
> (Well from my limited understanding)

The Region Subtag is exactly the ISO 3166-1 country code mentioned with
st-LS (here LS for Lesotho) in the other subthread.

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-06-01 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi Hlompho,

On Monday, 2021-05-31 23:23:36 +0200, Hlompho Mota wrote:

> Here is the funny thing,
> We just referee to our language as Sesotho. But with the need to
> accommodate the international codes allocated I thought it would be more
> ls-ST.

I presume you got that twisted and meant st-LS instead.. there's no 'ls'
language code and you don't want it for 'Sao Tome and Principe' ;-)

> But rather than using Sotho, Could we refer to it as Sesotho?

Sure, the naming in the language listbox is just up to us, as long as it
makes sense..

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-06-01 Thread Eike Rathke
Hi,

On Tuesday, 2021-06-01 18:46:40 +0200, Eike Rathke wrote:

> > But rather than using Sotho, Could we refer to it as Sesotho?
> 
> Sure, the naming in the language listbox is just up to us, as long as it
> makes sense..

Done with

Add Sesotho {st-LS} 0x8030 to language list
https://git.libreoffice.org/core/+/75458bfab180a57597e674d38e2953c440cf118d%5E%21/

  Eike

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-06-02 Thread Hlompho Mota
Thank you,
You are far too kind.

In relation to the Weblate project, who do I ask about adding Sesotho?

Hlompho Mota | Managing Director
www.lesothobarcodes.com
+266 50698342 | +266 62016682

ᐧ

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 21:29, Eike Rathke  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Tuesday, 2021-06-01 18:46:40 +0200, Eike Rathke wrote:
>
> > > But rather than using Sotho, Could we refer to it as Sesotho?
> >
> > Sure, the naming in the language listbox is just up to us, as long as it
> > makes sense..
>
> Done with
>
> Add Sesotho {st-LS} 0x8030 to language list
>
> https://git.libreoffice.org/core/+/75458bfab180a57597e674d38e2953c440cf118d%5E%21/
>
>   Eike
>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

2021-06-03 Thread sophi
Hi,
Le 02/06/2021 à 10:06, Hlompho Mota a écrit :
> Thank you,
> You are far too kind.
> 
> In relation to the Weblate project, who do I ask about adding Sesotho?

I'll create it. Will you translate UI and help files or only UI for the
moment?
Cheers
Sophie
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The Document Foundation

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