Re: [lace] re: Rosalibre comments
Robin says but because the techniques are her invention, that's getting into infringeing on Cathy's intellectual property (morally, if not legally). I am not comfortable with that. No matter how much a few of us enjoy it, I'm afraid Cathy's revolution may be a quirky lace that fewer and fewer people bother with. However, Cathy quite clearly says in the front of the book in answer to the question Can I teach others this lace? Yes, if you do so without distributing any patterns, descriptions or diagrams from this document. I hold the copyright on this material, but will not trademark the specifics of the technique. If another teacher has worked enough with Cathy or from the book to feel confident to teach the lace, then they will almost certainly have also done some of their own designs and made their own working notes and diagrams, and that is all that she is asking. After all the hard work she put in developing the techniques and writing the book, she would probably be pleased and interested to see it becoming a well known lace instead of fading into obscurity. Jacquie in Lincolnshire - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003/albums/most-recent
[lace] re: Rosalibre comments
Robin P. wrote: I have taught RL to each of the 3 lace groups to which I belong, because that's teaching friends. I was asked once to teach at a more formal workshop (the Winter Lace Conference), but because the techniques are her invention, that's getting into infringeing on Cathy's intellectual property (morally, if not legally). I am not comfortable with that. No matter how much a few of us enjoy it, I'm afraid Cathy's revolution may be a quirky lace that fewer and fewer people bother with. Dear Robin et al, I am very glad I bought the book when I did. Haven't used it, but if you see something you might like, you buy it NOW, so you can have the book in case it is popular and it goes out of print. This book was published in something like 2005, and 7 years later it's not easily found, out of print. Here are the issues as I see them: The only book on the subject is out of print. Cathy wrote a whole page on using, teaching and copying her book, so clearly at the time, she wanted to profit from her endeavor, and rightly so. Instead of copying the pages, she suggested buying the book twice on that page. An excellent idea, and really the only option while that is possible. That is no longer possible, yet clearly there are people who want to learn this unique lace. On the other hand, she does suggest contacting her in the event someone wants to sell more than 5 pieces of lace designed by her, She also mentions that if you want to copy just a page or 2, or just one design and not buy the book, contact her. From comments on Arachne, it appears that Cathy has moved on. From the website quoted in her book, it is very clear that this is a woman of remarkable talent and capability, so it is sad for us that she has done so. Cathy deserves the profit from her ideas and design. But with a book out of print, that is not happening. If Cathy is truly out of the ring, then she may not be aware of this situation. It seems to me that the best solution to the whole problem is for someone to contact Cathy, and find out about her intentions and desires concerning this lace at this time. She may still be of the same mind. She may be planning to reprint the book. She may not care, as she has moved on. Until her wishes and desires are known, not much can be done. This also brings up the issue of a teacher not wanting to use the patterns from a book which is not her own. Sometimes someone rethinks things, writes a book which has designs that may work better than the traditional ones in that particular kind of lace. Yet there are copyright problems. How difficult is it to contact the author to copy a design in her book for a class, especially a beginner class, where people may not want to invest a large sum in a book if they find out they don't like making the lace, whereas some may find they do after the class and then buy the book. Has anyone tried contacting an author in order to use patterns to teach from? How difficult is it? What success did you have? Lyn in Lancaster, Pennsylvania, USA, where the weather is a bit cool for this time of year, high of 83F 25.5C, but it will be hotter by tomorrow. My email sends out an automatic message. Arachne members, please ignore it. I read your emails. - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003/albums/most-recent
[lace] re: Rosalibre comments
In message 11582901.1340810184709.javamail.r...@elwamui-darkeyed.atl.sa.earthlink.n et, lynrbai...@desupernet.net writes Has anyone tried contacting an author in order to use patterns to teach from? How difficult is it? What success did you have? I have always used my own patterns for teaching. However, some twenty years ago, I was making lace bookmarks to sell at a fair to raise money for our local hospice, and contacted Christine Springett to ask permission to use her snake pattern for this purpose (I wonder how many teachers/demonstrators have asked her before using said pattern on beginner pillows?) - she wrote me a lovely letter in reply, giving permission. On the other side of the coin, some years ago I was contacted by an author who is a well known lace teacher, saying that she had been using one of my patterns, published in 'Lace' some years before, for teaching purposes, and had used that pattern as the basis of a chapter of her book which she was just about to start selling (ie it was already printed by then). This put me in a difficult situation because had I refused permission for its use, it would have cost her a considerable amount. It was the first feedback I had had that anyone had used the pattern in any way, and to some extent flattering, but not all designers see things that way. However, her methods of working my technique are not the simplest, and I have since had published, in 'Lace' and the 'Canadian Lacemaker Gazette', my way of working overlapping loopy gimp rings. -- Jane Partridge - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003/albums/most-recent
[lace] re: Rosalibre comments
First off, Jeanette is much too modest. I've seen pictures of her designs and they're beautiful and very creative. As for publishing designs, there's a problem: imagine being given a pricking of a complex Milanese picture such as Pat Read or Louise Colgan have created, with no knowledge whatsoever of the techniques of Milanese. Or a lovely Beds pattern with no guipure experience. Now what? Cathy invented RL with a number of unique techniques, and if you haven't learned RL already you won't know what to do with the design. When I have taught original patterns I have referred people to Cathy's book. This is done just like the in pattern yyy (or it's just like that with the following differences). Since it is/was Cathy's lace revolution and she taught for just a few years, only a modest number of people are privy to those secrets at this time. Publishing a simple daffodil flower would require publishing a whole lot of accompanying information on how to do it, which could easily infringe Cathy's copyright and/or take up far too much space in a magazine. Tamara was asked to ! publish some of her RL but refused for this reason. So the only people who could use the published design are the ones who already know RL, and that won't widen the knowledge base. I have taught RL to each of the 3 lace groups to which I belong, because that's teaching friends. I was asked once to teach at a more formal workshop (the Winter Lace Conference), but because the techniques are her invention, that's getting into infringeing on Cathy's intellectual property (morally, if not legally). I am not comfortable with that. No matter how much a few of us enjoy it, I'm afraid Cathy's revolution may be a quirky lace that fewer and fewer people bother with. Robin P. Los Angeles, California, USA robinl...@socal.rr.com - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003/albums/most-recent
Re: [lace] re: Rosalibre comments
No matter how much a few of us enjoy it, I'm afraid Cathy's revolution may be a quirky lace that fewer and fewer people bother with. It is too bad that there doesn't seem to be some way that Cathy could make her book available as an internet download, or self-publish via the one at a time publishing facilities that have been discussed so that she could earn some money for her intellectual property. Has anybody talked to her about this? If she doesn't want to bother with it, perhaps she wouldn't mind if someone like Robin photocopied the book for classes and sent her some small per copy fee. The purpose of the copy right law, in the US, at least, is to encourage the development of intellectual property to benefit everyone by giving the creator a short time monopoly on it so that there is a financial incentive to create intellectual property. It is a shame when the impact is the creation of intellectual property that is then withheld from all those who would like to have access to it. This is the exact opposite of the purpose of the US copyright law. Devon PS. I know a folk singer who actually puts on his music that he knows that people are going to play his music, sing it and share the recordings at folk gatherings, and if someone records the song he doesn't mind, but suggests that they send him $2 and gives his address. I think it is a nice solution to the situation where everyone wants to do the right thing. - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://community.webshots.com/user/arachne2003/albums/most-recent
[lace] Re: Rosalibre
On May 4, 2008, at 21:18, bevw wrote: Doesn't Schneeberg lace have that distinction also? How about Sluis --- Withof Duchesse? Lutac? All of the above are *twentieth* century laces, *not* twenty first. Late 20th maybe, but still 20th. Wiithof Duchesse goes back to, at least, 1990. I don't have the Lutac book but, as I remember it, although it's later than Withof, it still started in 199+. Schneeberg is, I think, an even earlier lace than Withof, which had been revived by Lia Baumeister. I might be wrong on that, and she may have invented it herself. But, if she had, it was *well before* 2000. So, I'll repeat: Rosalibre is *the only* lace (so far) which was invented/developed in the 21st century (after 2000). I used to have Cathy's book. The page of copyright provisos put me off. More's the pity, I gave the book away without even trying any of the patterns. Your loss. I'm sorry Cathy's copyright provisos put you off; I found them refreshingly straightforward and not unreasonable. Although, of course, none can be enforced. -- Tamara P Duvallhttp://t-n-lace.net/ Lexington, Virginia, USA (Formerly of Warsaw, Poland) - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Fw: [lace] Re: Rosalibre
Rose ground has it £24.50 -- From: Sue Duckles [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 10:25 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [lace] Re: Rosalibre Morning fellow Spiders Did a google search for Rosalibre and found a photo of it!!! All I can say is WOW. WOW. WOW!! I've got a new screensaver!!! I Want That Book!!! It covers everything I love in lace. COLOUR!! Now to find an English supplier who has it on stock bet Pat has... Sue in East Yorkshire Oh my! And Tamara hasn't answered yet! Rosalibre is a new lace invented by Cathy Belleville in the tradition of Brussels laces, whose previous last lace was Rosaline. It is fun, full of color and lots of interesting tricks. Tamara is quite the inventor with this lace and has come up with all kinds of interesting twists (cross twists, that is) Just Google up images and search for Roselibre and you can see some. Patty - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re: Rosalibre
On Apr 21, 2008, at 15:25, Patty Dowden wrote: Tamara is quite the inventor with this lace That should be in the past tense -- *was* :) After a year+ of working with wire and a year+ of working in pre-1600 laces, I found that I can no longer reproduce my own designs. My documentation had been a bit too sketchy, because I thought I'd remember something I loved so much. Hah! Famous last words... :( I can still duplicate Cathy Belleville's designs, because they're diagrammed literally step-by-step. And I can still incorporate my own changes to those. But that's it... all that's left is the techniques (and some of those are shaky), not the applications (but, hey, Cathy liked the way I used one of those techniques in Celeste's wings, so I'm happy) But, to come back to Sue's question... Patty and Alice are right. So far, it's the only lace which had been designed, from scratch, in the 21st century. It's a 3-dimensional, fairly coarse, coloured piece lace, made with few pairs (8-12, though the Spiral Rose which uses those 12 pairs doesn't really *need* them all; that was one of my changes g) and goodly number of sewings, some of which use a crochet hook and some the magic loop. For me, the special appeal of this lace lies not just in the use of very few pairs (my preference, since I hate winding) and a single-sized thread, but also in the clever way the colours are manipulated and the 3-D results achieved *right on the pillow* (not by sewing things together afterwards). You use the same number of pairs from start to finish of each element, but make one colour dominant and the other invisible (usually, there are only 2 colours in each element) -- *as needed* -- via technical tricks, like rolls. And in the process of hiding one colour, you create a third dimension. Or create the third dimension by going over the same ground again, in a second layer... It really is a fantastic lace, with terrific potential and I was dismayed when Cathy stopped developing it further, because she took a full time, grown up, job (I don't think that having to eat is a good excuse for stopping a lace revolution g) -- Tamara P Duvallhttp://t-n-lace.net/ Lexington, Virginia, USA (Formerly of Warsaw, Poland) - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Re: Rosalibre lace on a fedora
At 04:50 PM 9/12/2005, Tamara P Duvall wrote: PS I don't know how strict the requirements of the Red Hat Lacers are but would suggest a *black* hat and a riot of red roses and green leaves as decoration, instead of a red hat... Sorry, Tamara, but Red Hatters wear ***red*** hats. Reverse the colors, and make black flowers on the red hat and you might have something interesting. G When I was at the state fair one day, they had Red Hat day. There were Red Hatters all over the place. I'd never seen such a variety of red hat styles before. HmmmI bought a burgundy hat while I was there. Wonder if someone thought I was one of that group?? Speaking of state fair, we had up to 11 lacemakers there at one time to demo. We had a constant stream of people who stopped and watched. Of course, we had several versions of the tatting lady, but most people were really interested. I didn't get any prospective students, but a lot more people were educated on the existance of handmade lace. I think I did send a prospective student to the lacemaker from that town, so maybe there was at least one new lacemaker from the demo. We spent all day on two different days, so a lot of people saw lacemaking. I finished the project I was doing, and now have to start another one. Happy lacing, Alice in Oregon -- where it's cold at night but warm in the day - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re: Rosalibre lace on a fedora
On Sep 13, 2005, at 3:25, Alice Howell wrote: Sorry, Tamara, but Red Hatters wear ***red*** hats. Yes, so I have been now informed. The following should have - probably - gone on to chat, since it no longer has any connection to lace, however tenuous, being a musing. But... The Red Hatters (women over 55) take their direction from a poem by Jenny Joseph: When I am an old woman I shall wear purple, With a red hat which doesn't go and doesn't suit me. And I shall spend my pension on brandy and summer gloves. And satin sandals, and say we've no money for butter. I shall sit down on the pavement when I'm tired. And gobble up samples in shops and press alarm bells. And run my stick along public railings. And make up for the sobriety of my youth. I shall go out in my slippers in the rain. And pick flowers in other people's gardens. And learn to spit... But, maybe I ought to practice a little now? So people who know me are not too shocked or surprised when suddenly I am old and start to wear purple. I've always understood this poem to mean that, one day, the speaker will assert herself. As a Queen (wearing purple, the royal colour) of - at least - herself... She'll throw off all constraints of what's expected; she will do what she wants, when she wants. I never was quite certain why she should want to wait till she's old (practice a little now seems a bit tame and unrealistic, given that one has less energy for breaking barriers as one grows older)... And I never could understand why, *voluntarily*, she would want to wear colours that didn't suit her; I don't dress to meet other people's expectations of me, but neither do I wear an outfit - even if I'd bought it in a moment of abberation - in which I look (IMO) like a dog's dinner. But, if it's her way of saying no more of obeying the rules, who am I to object - it's *her choice*. However... To wear a red hat, with a purple band (to match the purple clothes) as a *required uniform*, seems to me to be a total refutation of the spirit of the poem; a *denial* of the wish for freedom expressed in it... I've always felt closer to the female mind-set than to the male one and would love to make even more connections. But... NOT, if it requires I wear purple, much less wear purple and red together :) I look *worse* than a dog's dinner in 99% of shades of purple. And I look like a freshly dug-up corpse in 45% of the red shades... I should give up the pleasure of looking good (at least in my own opinion) *as well as* the pleasure of sounding intelligent (my memory is deteriorating, as is my vocabulary in both languages), when I get to be 55? *WHY* Is getting out of a cage and into a straight jacket *really* what most women desire? If so, I'm more out of touch with reality than I'd thought I was... -- Tamara P Duvallhttp://t-n-lace.net/ Lexington, Virginia, USA (Formerly of Warsaw, Poland) - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re: Rosalibre lace on a fedora
A red hat with a passle of flowers in a riot of colors works, too. Robin P. Los Angeles, California, USA (formerly Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania) [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Tamara P Duvall [EMAIL PROTECTED] PS I don't know how strict the requirements of the Red Hat Lacers are but would suggest a *black* hat and a riot of red roses and green leaves as decoration, instead of a red hat... - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
