Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-10-05 Thread noc ops
Does anyone know where we stand with lartc howto?


regards,
/virendra

Stephen Hemminger wrote:
 On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 14:00:30 +0100
 Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
current format to a wiki

   


Good idea, I'll see if the OSDL will put up a wiki for it
on developer.osdl.org, stay tuned.
 


Can I suggest that you look very hard at Mediawiki (ie as per 
wikipedia).  It's built for scalability, is really easy to edit, very 
actively maintained, and has all the distributed stuff built in if you 
really needed to spread the load over several machines.  All in all a 
very grown up documentation tool.  Oh and it's also multi-lingual so it 
might also be possible to use it to help with the translation issues

I mainly mentioned it because I'm sure there are some tools for 
converting the current lartc faq up to the wiki format and obviously 
that's the first main step.

If someone will host it then I have some experience maintaining a 
mediawiki site and could probably help out some
 
 
 Okay, if the lartc.org guys don't pick it up, I'll setup a mediawiki
 when I get back from holiday.  For an example see:
   http://wiki.linux-nfs.org
 
   
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-10-05 Thread Stephen Hemminger
On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 16:18:24 -0700
noc ops [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Does anyone know where we stand with lartc howto?
 
 
 regards,
 /virendra
 
 Stephen Hemminger wrote:

The new wiki 
http://linux-net.osdl.org
is available and you are welcome to put it there.
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-20 Thread Riccardo Losselli




i am totally pro refreshing the lartc howto. and wiki is a great idea


Me too. i'm not active on the list but i want to contribute back...
Some time ago i had the same frustation many of you had on the how-to, i
was using it for some students and wanted to translate it in italian and
then send back the results, but got no response.
I do not read the list on a regular basis, but if you want to count my
help, i'm here (cc in private mail for direct request helps speeding my
reply =)
Bye,
Ricky

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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-20 Thread Alexander Reelsen
Hi

All my previous mails didnt seem to get through. :)

So next try.

On Sa, Aug 20, 2005 at 01:17:20 +0200, Riccardo Losselli wrote:
 i am totally pro refreshing the lartc howto. and wiki is a great idea
 Me too. i'm not active on the list but i want to contribute back...
 Some time ago i had the same frustation many of you had on the how-to, i
 was using it for some students and wanted to translate it in italian and
 then send back the results, but got no response.
 I do not read the list on a regular basis, but if you want to count my
 help, i'm here (cc in private mail for direct request helps speeding my
 reply =)
I'm all for the wiki along with the document. So you have a fine
rockstable document and a wiki with experiences from the users or
examples for new features which are experiemental or somesuch.

I would basically volunteer to take over the howto, try to manage
translations, perhaps even add some content, though it would be better
to leave that to people with more expierences.

I will not have too much time until january for this task, but after
that I will return to my regular study life, which leaves a time slot
here and there, you know... :-)

What would be crucial for the further document existence:
- CVS with translations (and people who contribute)
- Wiki
- regular updates (I would try my best)
- Some kind of moderation/testing system in order to get new features
  into the howto (there's something in my mind, which I cannot get into
  words as my time is just somewhat limited, but the idea is fine

So, if the old developers are willing to give it up and noone with
more time steps in between, I hereby offer my time to maintain the
HOWTO.


Regards, Alexander
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-19 Thread Stephen Hemminger
On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 14:00:30 +0100
Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
 documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
 contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
 current format to a wiki
 
 
 
 
 Good idea, I'll see if the OSDL will put up a wiki for it
 on developer.osdl.org, stay tuned.
   
 
 
 Can I suggest that you look very hard at Mediawiki (ie as per 
 wikipedia).  It's built for scalability, is really easy to edit, very 
 actively maintained, and has all the distributed stuff built in if you 
 really needed to spread the load over several machines.  All in all a 
 very grown up documentation tool.  Oh and it's also multi-lingual so it 
 might also be possible to use it to help with the translation issues
 
 I mainly mentioned it because I'm sure there are some tools for 
 converting the current lartc faq up to the wiki format and obviously 
 that's the first main step.
 
 If someone will host it then I have some experience maintaining a 
 mediawiki site and could probably help out some

Okay, if the lartc.org guys don't pick it up, I'll setup a mediawiki
when I get back from holiday.  For an example see:
http://wiki.linux-nfs.org


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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-18 Thread Stef Coene
On Wednesday 17 August 2005 23:44, Taylor, Grant wrote:
  It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
  IMHO, a distributed wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
  the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
  that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
  get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

 I think the Wiki, if that route is chosen, should be on the www.lartc.org
 domain name.  This means that we will have to find and contact the
 administrators of that domain / DNS servers.
(I'm not official subscribed to this list, but I'm still reading some posts)
I know the owner of lartc.org and I mailed him about this problem.  I will 
keep the list updated if he answers me.

 As far as the distributed web 
 site goes I think it is a good idea.  To pull off the distributed site we
 would need to have the DNS records resolve to multiple boxen across the
 net.  I have considered a self replicating set up for some of my servers
 and at present I'm looking at using Coda or AFS as a replicating  / caching
 local copies of the remote file system content.  I've never dealt with
 Wikis other than and end user (and I say that the ones that I've looked at
 have been slow) so I don't know what they take to set up.  I suspect that
 they use a database and thus we would want to set up the Wiki to use a
 database that has real time replication between the two (or more) web
 servers that the wiki points to.  I would be more than happy to help with
 such an endeavor.  I can not host it at my office (bosses will not let me)
 but I can help provide content and / or convert stuff.
There are lots of wiki's available.  Some use plain text files, some uses 
mysql, some are written in php, some are written in perl.  I prefer the mysql 
+ php way to store the information.


Stef
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-18 Thread Ed W


I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
current format to a wiki


   



Good idea, I'll see if the OSDL will put up a wiki for it
on developer.osdl.org, stay tuned.
 



Can I suggest that you look very hard at Mediawiki (ie as per 
wikipedia).  It's built for scalability, is really easy to edit, very 
actively maintained, and has all the distributed stuff built in if you 
really needed to spread the load over several machines.  All in all a 
very grown up documentation tool.  Oh and it's also multi-lingual so it 
might also be possible to use it to help with the translation issues


I mainly mentioned it because I'm sure there are some tools for 
converting the current lartc faq up to the wiki format and obviously 
that's the first main step.


If someone will host it then I have some experience maintaining a 
mediawiki site and could probably help out some


Ed w
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[LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Georg C. F. Greve
Hi,

more than a month ago I proposed an addition to the HOWTO to address a
certain packet classification problem/bug and how to fix it (see
http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q3/016728.html).

I never received any reaction from the HOWTO maintainers, not even
when addressing them directly (see mail below).

Given that a month has gone by: Is the HOWTO currently unmaintained?

Regards,
Georg


---BeginMessage---
--20050723180350+0200-4600352811890471214323957
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi,

some days ago, I encountered what turned out to be either a problem of
the HOWTO or the QDISC code itself. The start of the thread is:

 http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q3/016716.html

and I came up with a short draft for the HOWTO that explains the
problem and gives the workaround, which you can find at

 http://mailman.ds9a.nl/pipermail/lartc/2005q3/016728.html

Could you please include this in the HOWTO?

Thanks,
Georg

=2D-=20
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Join the Fellowship and protect your freedom! (http://www.fsfe.org)

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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Andreas Klauer
On Wednesday 17 August 2005 10:04, Georg C. F. Greve wrote:
 I never received any reaction from the HOWTO maintainers, not even
 when addressing them directly (see mail below).

 Given that a month has gone by: Is the HOWTO currently unmaintained?

www.lartc.org says:
Linux Advanced Routing  Traffic Control HOWTO Current version is 1.0.0 
Files were last updated at 2004-03-31 00:11 CET (ie, about 12108.1 hours 
ago).

So yes, I'd guess it's not actively maintained.

Andreas
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Georg C. F. Greve
 || On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:19:54 +0200
 || Andreas Klauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

 ak www.lartc.org says:

 ak Linux Advanced Routing  Traffic Control HOWTO Current version
 ak is 1.0.0 Files were last updated at 2004-03-31 00:11 CET (ie,
 ak about 12108.1 hours ago).

 ak So yes, I'd guess it's not actively maintained.

Thanks for that quick reply.

I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?

Regards,
Georg

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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Ed W



I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?
 



I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
current format to a wiki


Just a thought

Ed W
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Kenneth Kalmer
On 8/17/05, Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?
 
 Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?
 
 Is anyone willing to take over that job?
 
 
 
 I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the
 documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to
 contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's
 current format to a wiki
 
 Just a thought
 

And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how busy the current
site is? If not too busy (i.e. 10GB a month) I'd gladly put up a wiki
on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just have to move it to
another server in due course.

I've also gotten very frustrated with some old outdated information,
and especially the lack of information regarding the 2.6.x kernel.

All in favour...?

Regards

-- 

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[EMAIL PROTECTED]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] stats
http://vspx27.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/main.py?qtype=userpageusername=kenneth%2Ekalmer
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Mike O
I don't even think this is list is being maintained. Several people have 
tried to unsubscribe.




From: Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Georg C. F. Greve [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: Andreas Klauer [EMAIL PROTECTED],lartc@mailman.ds9a.nl
Subject: Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:28:10 +0100



I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?




I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to contribute, 
and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's current format to 
a wiki


Just a thought

Ed W
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Lee Sanders
Hi Kenneth,

Aye/puts hand up in agreement.

A wiki would be great. The problem right now is there is little, and usually 
not very good, documentation on how to setup queue's and other advanced 
routing.

The end result this list is full of people asking questions and very few who 
answer.

:L

 And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how busy the current
 site is? If not too busy (i.e. 10GB a month) I'd gladly put up a wiki
 on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just have to move it to
 another server in due course.

 I've also gotten very frustrated with some old outdated information,
 and especially the lack of information regarding the 2.6.x kernel.

 All in favour...?
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Andre D. Correa


Hi, I got frustrated with it several months ago when I tried to update 
IMQ information and never got a response.


I can host a WiKi too, maybe we can mirror content and share the task. 
I'm not sure if any WiKi has a mirroring functionality but we can figure 
this out.



Andre D. Correa, CISSP |  Visite meus projetos pessoais:
andre.correa (at) pobox.com|  Visit my personal projects:
http://andre.hiperlinks.com.br |  -http://malware.hiperlinks.com.br
Sao Paulo / SP / Brazil|  -http://www.linuximq.net/




Kenneth Kalmer wrote:

On 8/17/05, Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?

Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?

Is anyone willing to take over that job?




I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the
documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to
contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's
current format to a wiki

Just a thought




And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how busy the current
site is? If not too busy (i.e. 10GB a month) I'd gladly put up a wiki
on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just have to move it to
another server in due course.

I've also gotten very frustrated with some old outdated information,
and especially the lack of information regarding the 2.6.x kernel.

All in favour...?

Regards


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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Stephen Hemminger
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:28:10 +0100
Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 I guess the obvious question then is: How do we get it maintained?
 
 Does anyone know where the current maintainers have disappeared?
 
 Is anyone willing to take over that job?
   
 
 
 I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and consider uploading the 
 documentation there.  This would make it easier for people to 
 contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to convert from it's 
 current format to a wiki
 

Good idea, I'll see if the OSDL will put up a wiki for it
on developer.osdl.org, stay tuned.
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Dariusz Dwornikowski

 Aye/puts hand up in agreement.
 
 A wiki would be great. The problem right now is there is little, and usually 
 not very good, documentation on how to setup queue's and other advanced 
 routing.
 
 The end result this list is full of people asking questions and very few who 
 answer.

i am totally pro refreshing the lartc howto. and wiki is a great idea


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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Jonathan Day
It seems strange that astronomers discovered a whole
set of Black Holes at about the time the maintainers
vanished...

It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
IMHO, a distributed wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

It would also be good if at least one site offered
multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
testing what they're trying.

--- Kenneth Kalmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 On 8/17/05, Ed W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  I guess the obvious question then is: How do we
 get it maintained?
  
  Does anyone know where the current maintainers
 have disappeared?
  
  Is anyone willing to take over that job?
  
  
  
  I wonder if someone would host a mediawiki and
 consider uploading the
  documentation there.  This would make it easier
 for people to
  contribute, and I think it shold be fairly easy to
 convert from it's
  current format to a wiki
  
  Just a thought
  
 
 And a great one I might add. Does anybody know how
 busy the current
 site is? If not too busy (i.e. 10GB a month) I'd
 gladly put up a wiki
 on my server for it. If it get's busier I'll just
 have to move it to
 another server in due course.
 
 I've also gotten very frustrated with some old
 outdated information,
 and especially the lack of information regarding the
 2.6.x kernel.
 
 All in favour...?
 
 Regards
 
 -- 
 
 Kenneth Kalmer
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] stats

http://vspx27.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/main.py?qtype=userpageusername=kenneth%2Ekalmer
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Andreas Klauer
On Wednesday 17 August 2005 19:05, Jonathan Day wrote:
 It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
 IMHO, a distributed wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
 the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
 that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
 get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

I'd prefer if we could keep the central site www.lartc.org since that 
location is already more than well known. If the owner just doesn't have 
the time to maintain the Howto anymore, it would be best to put the wiki 
directly there, since that can be self-maintained by the users then. So I 
suggest we at least try to contact the original maintainer / domain owner 
before putting a Wiki just anywhere.

If that's not possible, I think I'd prefer one central, but reliable 
long-term host over a distributed solution. Mirrors are fine, though.

 It would also be good if at least one site offered
 multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
 via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
 testing what they're trying.

There are sites that let you run a connection speed test and stuff. 
However, this does not have to do anything with the Wiki per se.

Regards
Andreas Klauer
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Carl-Daniel Hailfinger
Jonathan Day schrieb:
 It seems strange that astronomers discovered a whole
 set of Black Holes at about the time the maintainers
 vanished...
 
 It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
 IMHO, a distributed wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
 the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
 that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
 get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

Or some big organization like SUSE/RedHat/etc. who are
unlikely to vanish could offer hosting a wiki. That
makes alien abduction and slashdotting really unlikely.

Using multiple sites is always a problem because invariably
people will lose interest, sites will get out of sync, the
question which site should be linked from external sites
and all of the sites stealing google ranking from each
other.

If people feel comfortable with SUSE hosting such a wiki,
I could ask them.


Regards,
Carl-Daniel
-- 
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Carl-Daniel Hailfinger
Andreas Klauer schrieb:
 On Wednesday 17 August 2005 19:05, Jonathan Day wrote:
 
It would also be good if at least one site offered
multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
testing what they're trying.
 
 There are sites that let you run a connection speed test and stuff. 
 However, this does not have to do anything with the Wiki per se.

Yes, a way to test certain setups would be cool, but you
have to be aware that there might be security bugs in the
services you offer. Your risk would be higher than for
usual setups because people might also be able to use
post-authentication bugs. A person setting up such a test
system should also be aware that people might use more
bandwidth than anticipated.


Regards,
Carl-Daniel
-- 
http://www.hailfinger.org/
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Re: [LARTC] HOWTO unmaintained?

2005-08-17 Thread Taylor, Grant
 It looks like a number of people are offering sites -
 IMHO, a distributed wiki (ie: you can edit at any of
 the sites) or a master/mirror setup would be good, as
 that would help prevent problems if site maintainers
 get kidnapped by aliens, sites get slashdotted, etc.

I think the Wiki, if that route is chosen, should be on the www.lartc.org 
domain name.  This means that we will have to find and contact the 
administrators of that domain / DNS servers.  As far as the distributed web 
site goes I think it is a good idea.  To pull off the distributed site we would 
need to have the DNS records resolve to multiple boxen across the net.  I have 
considered a self replicating set up for some of my servers and at present I'm 
looking at using Coda or AFS as a replicating  / caching local copies of the 
remote file system content.  I've never dealt with Wikis other than and end 
user (and I say that the ones that I've looked at have been slow) so I don't 
know what they take to set up.  I suspect that they use a database and thus we 
would want to set up the Wiki to use a database that has real time replication 
between the two (or more) web servers that the wiki points to.  I would be more 
than happy to help with such an endeavor.  I can not host it at my 
office (bosses will not let me) but I can help provide content and / or convert 
stuff.

 It would also be good if at least one site offered
 multiple ways to connect - eg: via an IPSec tunnel or
 via IPv6 - as this would give people a simple way of
 testing what they're trying.

Again I am not able to do this, but I think it could be relatively easily done 
by offering a host with multiple IPs bound to it and give people a UML that 
they can test things in.  Much of the routing / firewalling work that I have 
done can easily be done in side of a UML.  This would mean that a system would 
need to be fairly capable and running a UML it's self to be a router in to the 
UML farm / UML switch backplane.  Again I would be more than willing to help 
set up such a system (and enjoy it at that).  I think it would be interesting 
to do this with multiple distributions and possibly versions there of.  To pull 
this off the box would need to be fairly powerful though to support many people 
at one time.  I'd say that you could get away with a dual multi GHz proc box 
with at least 2 - 4 GB of RAM.  I would expect that this could support 10+ 
concurrent users in side of UML doing some compiling or more if they are just 
using recompiled binaries.



Grant. . . .
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