Re: [LU] Leedslist Digest, Vol 148, Issue 18

[Roger Goodair via Leedslist]

   Kev,
   This is the part of our team that I just can't fathom. The defending at
   times is absolutely shambolic. Okay, we have well documented
   deficiencies in the full back positions (although Struik works his
   gonads off trying to fill in at left back), but we have two
   international standard centre backs at the club in Koch and Llorente.
   Have they suddenly become bad player's because they've turned up at
   Elland Road - answers on a postcard please?
   On a more general note, I think we currently have a team that is mostly
   filled with workhorses, who don't have the necessary quality, or level
   of fitness (so much for MB's over training eh!) to be consistently
   competitive in the Premier League.
   Rogerre
   (Temporarily out of lurkdom as I'm on a two month sabbatical in
   Thailand d-)

   On 29 Oct 2022 18:00, leedslist-requ...@gn.apc.org wrote:

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 Today's Topics:

1. Current Predicament (Kevin Lewis)
2. Re: Current Predicament (Michael Benjamin)

 
 --

 Message: 1
 Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2022 07:53:05 +0100
 From: Kevin Lewis 
 To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
 Subject: [LU] Current Predicament
 Message-ID:
 
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

 The list certainly spices up a bit when the team starts to struggle!
 I'm not too sure what any manager could do with this squad.

 To survive in the Premier League all teams need to be able to defend
 at
 times and not give soft chances away.
 Leeds have not been able to do that for many years.

 We got away with it in the Championship and the first season in the
 PL
 because the energy was so good.

 The first 3 Bielsa years were unbelievable and tremendous, but I am
 slowly
 coming round to the fact that to do the same in the Premier League
 with
 budget players just is not sustainable.

 Last year Everton gave away a lot of soft goals, but stiffening the
 defence
 has turned them round.  They at least stay in games for a long
 while.
 Leeds can dominate possession but still get well-beaten.

 One assumes that Marsch will get sacked sometime soon.  I'm not sure
 who
 can come in and sort out the defending, plus get the team scoring
 again.
 Whoever it is will need to sign 5 players in January and do what
 Newcastle
 did last year.  Even if the money is made available (having spent
 net zero
 in the last 2 windows) are the clowns who conduct our transfers
 capable of
 getting deals over the line?
 The only benefit this season is that there will be a lot more games
 during
 and after the January window.

 As for today:
 Will it be the usual kamikaze-ball or will Marsch try to keep it
 tight?
 The former could end up with a similar result to last season, but
 can you
 really see this group keeping Liverpool out for 20 mins, let alone
 75-80 to
 give us a chance of getting something?

 MOT

 KOT

 --

 Message: 2
 Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2022 06:56:32 +
 From: Michael Benjamin 
 To: Kevin Lewis , "leedslist@gn.apc.org"
 
 Subject: Re: [LU] Current Predicament
 Message-ID:
 
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

 Does it matter what JM does?
 Anything better than 0-3 is a blessing.
 Get rid ASAP
 This gig is over
 --Michael
 Dr  Michael Benjamin,
 Community Psychiatrist.
 Oranit,
 ISRAEL
 SKYPE: BEDENOGA
 PHONE: +972-505-317772
 Online CBT ||   Online Consultations
 BLOG: Times Of Israel || Quora || Jerusalem Post || MYCYBERTHERAPY
 BLOG
 AMAZON AUTHORS PAGE.
 -Original Message-
 From: Leedslist  On Behalf Of Kevin
 Lewis via Leedslist
 Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2022 9:53 AM
 To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
 Subject: [LU] Current Predicament
 The list certainly spices up a bit when the team starts to struggle!
 I'm not too sure what any manager could do with this squad.
 To survive in the Premier League all teams need to be able to defend
 at times and not give soft chances away.
 Leeds have not been able to do that for many years.
 We got away with it in the Championship and the first season in the
 PL because the energy was so good.
 The first 3 Bielsa years were unbe

Re: [LU] Current Predicament

[Robert Heath]

If Adams plays and Llorente doesn't, we might have a chance of it not being
TOO painful.

At any rate, if I were Leeds I'd ask the ref to just let Salah take his 2
penalties before kicking off. That would at least get those out of the way
early and we could concentrate on defending properly without having to
worry about when VAR is going to intervene and gift him a goal for no
reason whatsoever.

On Sat, Oct 29, 2022 at 7:56 AM Michael Benjamin  wrote:

> Does it matter what JM does?
> Anything better than 0-3 is a blessing.
> Get rid ASAP
> This gig is over
>
> --Michael
>
>
> Dr  Michael Benjamin,
> Community Psychiatrist.
> Oranit,
> ISRAEL
>
> SKYPE: BEDENOGA
> PHONE: +972-505-317772
> Online CBT ||   Online Consultations
> BLOG: Times Of Israel || Quora || Jerusalem Post || MYCYBERTHERAPY BLOG
> AMAZON AUTHORS PAGE.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Leedslist  On Behalf Of Kevin Lewis
> via Leedslist
> Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2022 9:53 AM
> To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
> Subject: [LU] Current Predicament
>
> The list certainly spices up a bit when the team starts to struggle!
> I'm not too sure what any manager could do with this squad.
>
> To survive in the Premier League all teams need to be able to defend at
> times and not give soft chances away.
> Leeds have not been able to do that for many years.
>
> We got away with it in the Championship and the first season in the PL
> because the energy was so good.
>
> The first 3 Bielsa years were unbelievable and tremendous, but I am slowly
> coming round to the fact that to do the same in the Premier League with
> budget players just is not sustainable.
>
> Last year Everton gave away a lot of soft goals, but stiffening the
> defence has turned them round.  They at least stay in games for a long
> while.
> Leeds can dominate possession but still get well-beaten.
>
> One assumes that Marsch will get sacked sometime soon.  I'm not sure who
> can come in and sort out the defending, plus get the team scoring again.
> Whoever it is will need to sign 5 players in January and do what Newcastle
> did last year.  Even if the money is made available (having spent net zero
> in the last 2 windows) are the clowns who conduct our transfers capable of
> getting deals over the line?
> The only benefit this season is that there will be a lot more games during
> and after the January window.
>
> As for today:
> Will it be the usual kamikaze-ball or will Marsch try to keep it tight?
> The former could end up with a similar result to last season, but can you
> really see this group keeping Liverpool out for 20 mins, let alone 75-80 to
> give us a chance of getting something?
>
> MOT
>
> KOT
> ___
> Leedslist mailing list
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>
> Rest in Peace Guy, and wear your hat!
> ___
> Leedslist mailing list
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>
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>
> Rest in Peace Guy, and wear your hat!
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Re: [LU] Current Predicament

[Tim Whelan via Leedslist]

Just to add to the gloom, I remember that on both the last two occasions 
we were relegated from the top flight, in 1982 and 2004, Wolves were one 
of the teams who went down with us.
So it’s a bad omen that they are one of other clubs near the bottom this 
season.

-- Original Message --
On  Saturday, 29 Oct, 22 At 12:44, Robert Heath 
wrote:
If Adams plays and Llorente doesn't, we might have a chance of it not 
being

TOO painful.

At any rate, if I were Leeds I'd ask the ref to just let Salah take his 
2
penalties before kicking off. That would at least get those out of the 
way
early and we could concentrate on defending properly without having 
to
worry about when VAR is going to intervene and gift him a goal for 
no

reason whatsoever.

On Sat, Oct 29, 2022 at 7:56 AM Michael Benjamin  
wrote:


bgcolor="#88">Does it 
matter what JM does?

Anything better than 0-3 is a blessing.
Get rid ASAP
This gig is over

--Michael


Dr  Michael Benjamin,
Community Psychiatrist.
Oranit,
ISRAEL

SKYPE: BEDENOGA
PHONE: +972-505-317772
Online CBT ||   Online Consultations
BLOG: Times Of Israel || Quora || Jerusalem Post || MYCYBERTHERAPY 
BLOG

AMAZON AUTHORS PAGE.



-Original Message-
From: Leedslist  On Behalf Of Kevin 
Lewis

via Leedslist
Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2022 9:53 AM
To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
Subject: [LU] Current Predicament

The list certainly spices up a bit when the team starts to struggle!
I'm not too sure what any manager could do with this squad.

To survive in the Premier League all teams need to be able to defend 
at

times and not give soft chances away.
Leeds have not been able to do that for many years.

We got away with it in the Championship and the first season in the 
PL

because the energy was so good.

The first 3 Bielsa years were unbelievable and tremendous, but I am 
slowly
coming round to the fact that to do the same in the Premier League 
with

budget players just is not sustainable.

Last year Everton gave away a lot of soft goals, but stiffening the
defence has turned them round.  They at least stay in games for a 
long

while.
Leeds can dominate possession but still get well-beaten.

One assumes that Marsch will get sacked sometime soon.  I'm not 
sure who
can come in and sort out the defending, plus get the team scoring 
again.
Whoever it is will need to sign 5 players in January and do what 
Newcastle
did last year.  Even if the money is made available (having spent 
net zero
in the last 2 windows) are the clowns who conduct our transfers capable 
of

getting deals over the line?
The only benefit this season is that there will be a lot more games 
during

and after the January window.

As for today:
Will it be the usual kamikaze-ball or will Marsch try to keep it 
tight?
The former could end up with a similar result to last season, but can 
you
really see this group keeping Liverpool out for 20 mins, let alone 75-80 
to

give us a chance of getting something?

MOT

KOT
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[LU] Liverpool result

[David Boocock]

Just woke up in Brisbane to check the results feeling the recent
trepidation and what do you know…..I feel like the fella in the Stanley
Holloway monologue ‘My word you do look queer’ who felt like crap until
someone told him differently!!



I crawled in the street and I murmured,'I'm done.'
Then up came Old Jenkins and shouted,'By gum!'
'My word you do look well!
My word you do look well!
You're looking fine and in the pink!'
I shouted, 'Am I?... Come and have a drink!
You've put new life in me, I'm sounder than a bell.
By gad! There's life in the old dog yet.
My word, I do feel well!'


👍
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Re: [LU] Current Predicament - looking better :-)

[John Lee via Leedslist]

Credit to the whole team, including Marsch, for that result - that saved his 
job!

Cooper’s Bambi impression was, thankfully, just another comedy moment which 
didn’t cost us, but that aside a great result.

Gnonto’s cameo was encouraging, Summerville had his best game, and to see them 
combining for the second goal, via Bamford, was really positive. And take a bow 
Meslier - a giant out there. Nice to enjoy a game.

Sent from my iPad

> On 29 Oct 2022, at 07:53, Kevin Lewis via Leedslist  
> wrote:
> 
> The list certainly spices up a bit when the team starts to struggle!
> I'm not too sure what any manager could do with this squad.
> 
> To survive in the Premier League all teams need to be able to defend at
> times and not give soft chances away.
> Leeds have not been able to do that for many years.
> 
> We got away with it in the Championship and the first season in the PL
> because the energy was so good.
> 
> The first 3 Bielsa years were unbelievable and tremendous, but I am slowly
> coming round to the fact that to do the same in the Premier League with
> budget players just is not sustainable.
> 
> Last year Everton gave away a lot of soft goals, but stiffening the defence
> has turned them round.  They at least stay in games for a long while.
> Leeds can dominate possession but still get well-beaten.
> 
> One assumes that Marsch will get sacked sometime soon.  I'm not sure who
> can come in and sort out the defending, plus get the team scoring again.
> Whoever it is will need to sign 5 players in January and do what Newcastle
> did last year.  Even if the money is made available (having spent net zero
> in the last 2 windows) are the clowns who conduct our transfers capable of
> getting deals over the line?
> The only benefit this season is that there will be a lot more games during
> and after the January window.
> 
> As for today:
> Will it be the usual kamikaze-ball or will Marsch try to keep it tight?
> The former could end up with a similar result to last season, but can you
> really see this group keeping Liverpool out for 20 mins, let alone 75-80 to
> give us a chance of getting something?
> 
> MOT
> 
> KOT
> ___
> Leedslist mailing list
> Info and options: https://mailman.gn.apc.org/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
> To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
> 
> Find us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/leedslist/
> 
> Rest in Peace Guy, and wear your hat!

___
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Re: [LU] Last 7 games

[Richard Naef]

Even more so tonight ;)


From: Nicholas Armit 
Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2022 5:55:05 PM
To: seanscr...@aol.com ; leedslist@gn.apc.org 
; heathpalai...@gmail.com ; 
alec...@gmail.com ; Richard Naef 

Subject: Re: [LU] Last 7 games

They are now.

Nick

On Saturday, October 22, 2022 at 07:25:37 PM EDT, Richard Naef 
 wrote:


Agree, things aren't as bleak as they seemed after Leicester or as great as 
after Chelsea or Arsenal

-Original Message-
From: Leedslist 
mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org>> On Behalf 
Of seanscribe--- via Leedslist
Sent: 22 October 2022 15:31
To: leedslist@gn.apc.org; 
heathpalai...@gmail.com; 
alec...@gmail.com
Cc: leedslist@gn.apc.org
Subject: Re: [LU] Last 7 games

Dave,
It's absolutely NOT Marsch's fault "that we have no left back worthy of a first 
team place and are still relying on an unfit Bamford or a failed Rodrigo up 
top." Just a reminder to all the Marsch-haters (and closet anti-Americans): Our 
useless left-back Junior Firpo, our failure of a record-breaking signing 
Rodrigo and our injury-prone penalty-missing centre-forward Bamford were ALL 
signings approved by, and signed during the reign of, Marcelo Bielsa. Just 
about every Leeds United supporter and Leeds United beat reporter (Phil Hay, 
Graham Smyth, James Marshment, etc.) was saying all summer transfer window that 
we needed a reliable goalscoring striker and a left-back. The club has even 
acknowledged trying to sign CDK and Gapko (before the desperation purchase of 
Gnonto on the last day of the window). There's no evidence that (unlike some 
recent managers) Marsch was insisting on having a tiny squad, let along telling 
the board not to buy a centre-forward and a left-back. (Bear in mind also that 
of the four players who can play in that position, three - Dallas, Struijk and 
Hjelde - are injured/recovering from an appendectomy. On current form I would 
put Firpo behind all three on the "depth chart" in that position.) It's 
reasonable to cast a harsh light on Marsch for his team selection versus 
Leicester, the tactics and the lack of a Plan B (hmmm, where have we heard that 
before?), but it's completely unfair to blame him for big money purchases that 
the club failed to make in the window.
I continue to believe that if just a couple of the turning points in recent 
matches (e.g. the ref's failure to send off Saliba for his pull-back on 
Bamford; the missed penalty versus Arsenal, etc.) had gone our way, we'd be 
having a totally different conversation. But I also realize that it's got to go 
our way soon or not at all (for Jesse). On the plus side, how long before Mateo 
Joseph and Sonny Perkins are ready to step up a level? Joseph just scored his 
third hat-trick in eight league games for our top-of-the-table unbeaten 
Under-21s.
Cheers!
Sean

-Original Message-
From: nattan--- via Leedslist 
mailto:leedslist@gn.apc.org>>
To: Robert Heath mailto:heathpalai...@gmail.com>>; 
Alec McQueen mailto:alec...@gmail.com>>
Cc: Leeds List 2010 mailto:leedslist@gn.apc.org>>
Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2022 5:51 am
Subject: Re: [LU] Last 7 games

I get what you are saying and you do have a point. It is not JMs fault that v 
Arsenal  Rodrigo gave away a goal and that Bamford missed a penalty.  Equally 
individual errors ( Roca this week, Cooper v Palace,  Llorente nightmare v 
Brentford) have cost us other games/ points and that is down to the players BUT 
some errors are down to the system, we are so easy to play against- fire a ball 
over midfield into the corner and you create chances , - that is the manager's 
fault.  Equally the fact that we have no left back worthy of a first team place 
and are still relying on an unfit Bamford or a failed Rodrigo up top is his 
fault Even when it works well our lack of a cutting edge means we get nothing 
when we are on top in a match and our soft underbelly means our opponents 
always have a chance.
We have had on paper a reasonably easy run of fixtures- only Arsenal and 
Chelsea of top 5 clubs and played all the bottom clubs.  Things are looking 
dodgy Do I want him sacked ? No , I want him to put a run of good results 
together and get us up the table and build on it , but I really cant see that 
happening. I will be cheering him and the team on on Sunday but I expect the 
first of the Marsch out chants if we go behind ( oddly last match we were 
discussing who was the last manager who got the " out" chants. Never happened 
to Bielsa,  Heckingbottom sacked before we had chance,  ditto Christensen,  
Monk we wanted to stay,  Evans was unpopular but crowd never turned, Rosler, 
milanic , hockaday all too short lived, Redders popular, same generally with 
McDermott,  so did we chant Warnock out ? If not it would be Grayson,  dont 
recall chants,  so McAllister is the last one I can remember for sure getting 
the " out "

Re: [LU] Last 7 games

[Alec McQueen]

   We are not out of the woods yet, but today shows what's possible. Plan
   A worked today because Liverpool were trying their Plan A and it wasn't
   working so well. And we got some luck which we haven't had last few
   games.
   And Meslier was immense and we had 2 good enough moments to make the
   difference today. It was also a decent defensive performance against a
   decent team (despite whatever anyone says). Agreed that Liverpool were
   not on their game today, so inconsistent... I reckon they
   underestimated us. But we can be great and we can be crap.
   Inconsistency R Us, that's us this year...of course more downs than
   ups, but I still think JM is not quite the muppet that some people
   think.
   But this is far from over... we need to build some consistency, and JM
   knows it. I still think we need to give JM until at least January... if
   we are bottom then, then maybe we need a change. All the lower half
   teams are picking up points... nobody is left behind. I thought a few
   weeks ago, we could rely on Forest and Leicester taking up 2 of the
   relegation slots Now, it's 3 amongst 10 or so clubs. Any of them
   could slide down and get into serious trouble, us included. I think
   anyone below Palace in 10th can go down. Right now, my bet is Forest,
   Bournemouth, and Wolves.
   Sent from my iPad

 On 30 Oct 2022, at 10:08, Richard Naef
  wrote:

 Even more so tonight ;)
   ___

   From: Nicholas Armit 
   Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2022 5:55:05 PM
   To: seanscr...@aol.com ; leedslist@gn.apc.org
   ; heathpalai...@gmail.com
   ; alec...@gmail.com ;
   Richard Naef 
   Subject: Re: [LU] Last 7 games

   They are now.
   Nick
   On Saturday, October 22, 2022 at 07:25:37 PM EDT, Richard Naef
wrote:
   Agree, things aren't as bleak as they seemed after Leicester or as
   great as after Chelsea or Arsenal
   -Original Message-
   From: Leedslist <[1]leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org> On Behalf Of
   seanscribe--- via Leedslist
   Sent: 22 October 2022 15:31
   To: [2]leedslist@gn.apc.org; [3]heathpalai...@gmail.com;
   [4]alec...@gmail.com
   Cc: [5]leedslist@gn.apc.org
   Subject: Re: [LU] Last 7 games
   Dave,
   It's absolutely NOT Marsch's fault "that we have no left back worthy of
   a first team place and are still relying on an unfit Bamford or a
   failed Rodrigo up top." Just a reminder to all the Marsch-haters (and
   closet anti-Americans): Our useless left-back Junior Firpo, our failure
   of a record-breaking signing Rodrigo and our injury-prone
   penalty-missing centre-forward Bamford were ALL signings approved by,
   and signed during the reign of, Marcelo Bielsa. Just about every Leeds
   United supporter and Leeds United beat reporter (Phil Hay, Graham
   Smyth, James Marshment, etc.) was saying all summer transfer window
   that we needed a reliable goalscoring striker and a left-back. The club
   has even acknowledged trying to sign CDK and Gapko (before the
   desperation purchase of Gnonto on the last day of the window). There's
   no evidence that (unlike some recent managers) Marsch was insisting on
   having a tiny squad, let along telling the board not to buy a
   centre-forward and a left-back. (Bear in mind also that of the four
   players who can play in that position, three - Dallas, Struijk and
   Hjelde - are injured/recovering from an appendectomy. On current form I
   would put Firpo behind all three on the "depth chart" in that
   position.) It's reasonable to cast a harsh light on Marsch for his team
   selection versus Leicester, the tactics and the lack of a Plan B (hmmm,
   where have we heard that before?), but it's completely unfair to blame
   him for big money purchases that the club failed to make in the window.
   I continue to believe that if just a couple of the turning points in
   recent matches (e.g. the ref's failure to send off Saliba for his
   pull-back on Bamford; the missed penalty versus Arsenal, etc.) had gone
   our way, we'd be having a totally different conversation. But I also
   realize that it's got to go our way soon or not at all (for Jesse). On
   the plus side, how long before Mateo Joseph and Sonny Perkins are ready
   to step up a level? Joseph just scored his third hat-trick in eight
   league games for our top-of-the-table unbeaten Under-21s.
   Cheers!
   Sean
   -Original Message-
   From: nattan--- via Leedslist <[6]leedslist@gn.apc.org>
   To: Robert Heath <[7]heathpalai...@gmail.com>; Alec McQueen
   <[8]alec...@gmail.com>
   Cc: Leeds List 2010 <[9]leedslist@gn.apc.org>
   Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2022 5:51 am
   Subject: Re: [LU] Last 7 games
   I get what you are saying and you do have a point. It is not JMs fault
   that v Arsenal  Rodrigo gave away a goal and that Bamford missed a
   penalty.  Equally individual errors ( Roca this week, Cooper v Palace,
   Llorente nightmare v Brentford) have cost us other games/