Re: [OSM-legal-talk] attribution of data for use on TV
Hi, tele...@hushmail.com wrote: My question is what type of attribution is appropriate? We had a huge discussion about this 2.5 years ago but not a lot has changed since, so you might want to read the thread with the misleading subject OSM Layer into Adobe Illustrator, http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2007-February/011537.html where a guy from a TV broadcaster inquired about using the Baghdad map on-air. It all boils down to paragraph 4c of the CC-BY-SA license which says: You must keep intact all copyright notices for the Work and give the Original Author credit reasonable to the medium or means You are utilizing... The problem is, or at least was for that particular request 2.5 years ago, that nobody in OSM can give you a definitive and legally binding answer what exactly reasonable to the medium or means is. I think I'm speaking for the majority of contributors when I say that having the credits in the credits roll at the end of a TV production is perfectly all right (that's the usual place for credits in that medium) but the responsiblity rests with you, or the broadcaster, in the end. Anyway, I want to do what is right here. So, do I simply attribute in the app and let my TV users know I'm using OpenStreetMap data OR do I need to attribute on-air? I could easily add an OpenStreetMap attribution in the splash screen and about box. For *you* it is sufficient to tell your clients - in a manner reasonable to your medium, i.e. computer software - that you're using OSM data and that this comes under the license CC-BY-SA 2.0. That's all that is legally required from you. The fact that the data is CC-BY-SA then means that your customers, when using the data, must also acknowledge the source and specify the license; this, however, is not your responsibility but theirs. Of course if you are interested in a healthy long-term relationship with your customers you should advise them accordingly, lest they get a bollocking from angry OSM contributors (see http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Lacking_proper_attribution) and then complain to you about not having been informed. Bye Frederik ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] attribution of data for use on TV
Hi, Frederik Ramm schrieb: where a guy from a TV broadcaster inquired about using the Baghdad map on-air. That guy was me :-) We never used the map in the end - we're a news broadcaster so didn't have time to thrash through the legalities on that day. I think I'm speaking for the majority of contributors when I say that having the credits in the credits roll at the end of a TV production is perfectly all right (that's the usual place for credits in that medium) but the responsiblity rests with you, or the broadcaster, in the end. As a further datum point, the map generation system we use at the moment, Curious maps from Viz systems (http://www.vizrt.com/products/article231.ece) is pretty standard in broadcasting, and uses datasets from a variety of sources, public domain and private. USGS and NASA for long range views, Microsoft Virtual Earth for close-ups. In this case, the Virtual Earth logo is displayed reasonably prominently onscreen, overlaying the graphics, rather than in the credits at the end of the program. Nobody seems bothered about that as a requirement. ie, it doesn't annoy anybody, so it seems fair to expect similar prominence for OSM data. Although it's just occurred to me that Microsoft license their data from someone else (TeleAtlas?) so I'm surprised they get the onscreen credit, rather than the original supplier. Regards Phillip PHILLIP BARNETT SERVER MANAGER 200 GRAY'S INN ROAD LONDON WC1X 8XZ UNITED KINGDOM T +44 (0)20 7430 4474 F E phillip.barn...@itn.co.uk http://WWW.ITN.CO.UK P Please consider the environment. Do you really need to print this email? Please Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Independent Television News Limited unless specifically stated. This email and any files attached are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify postmas...@itn.co.uk Please note that to ensure regulatory compliance and for the protection of our clients and business, we may monitor and read messages sent to and from our systems. Thank You. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] attribution of data for use on TV
2009/9/17 Barnett, Phillip phillip.barn...@itn.co.uk Although it's just occurred to me that Microsoft license their data from someone else (TeleAtlas?) so I'm surprised they get the onscreen credit, rather than the original supplier. Navteq for Microsoft. Emilie Laffray ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] attribution of data for use on TV
On 9/17/09, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Hi, tele...@hushmail.com wrote: My question is what type of attribution is appropriate? I think I'm speaking for the majority of contributors when I say that having the credits in the credits roll at the end of a TV production is perfectly all right (that's the usual place for credits in that medium) but the responsiblity rests with you, or the broadcaster, in the end. +1 i agree - the method of attribution can be whatever the standard method of attribution is for the medium. of course, we'd all like to see the OSM logo displayed prominently on the screen, but it should be an advantage of using OSM data that you don't have to give free advertising to TA/NT/MS/GG ;-) cheers, matt ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
[OSM-legal-talk] UK Public Rights of Way
I'm aware that there have been several postings on this kind of question, but I would appreciate some advice/guidance if possible. I'm engaged in a discussion with my local authority, from whom I am trying to get a digital version of the Public Rights of Way map (PROW) for use on OSM. They have refused, on the basis that there are known errors in the data, and There are risks for a local authority in releasing erroneous prow data. People or bodies might make decisions on the basis of erroneous information and subsequently be entitled to compensation. Is this reasonable, especially bearing in mind that their own paper version of the 'definitive map', which is the only version accessible to the public, dates from 1956? My argument is that they could release the current (digital) version for OSM use, and instantly (or as soon as the data was uploaded/traced), provide the public with a better version, at almost zero cost. I am pursuing this through my local councillor, and also considering an FOI request, but would be interested to hear of any similar work on UK PROW issues, and in particular of any success stories or legal opinion on the liability issue one way or another. thanks Antony Scott -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/UK-Public-Rights-of-Way-tp25491996p25491996.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] UK Public Rights of Way
antonys wrote: I'm engaged in a discussion with my local authority, from whom I am trying to get a digital version of the Public Rights of Way map (PROW) for use on OSM. It'll almost certainly be OS-derived and therefore not suitable for OSM, I'm afraid. Even if they wanted to release it, the OS wouldn't hear of it. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/UK-Public-Rights-of-Way-tp25491996p25492203.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] UK Public Rights of Way
Re: OS derivation - interestingly, in the course of a long conversation and a couple of email exchanges, the officer at the council did not raise this as an issue. The understanding I have is that the data flow is the other way round - ie that the council updates the OS with incremental changes and the OS update their mapping. The council's digital map is the result of an incomplete exercise in digitisation which they now have access to internally, but is not available externally. It is this resource, which appears to be council derived, that I would like to get hold of. Ideally by persuasion, if we can persuade the council that it would be better to have this data in the public domain than not. As to the 1956 version of the definitive map being out of copright - good point, but how could I get a copy of it? It is a paper version of course, available for inspection at the council's offices. I suppose I could take a camera, or just ask if I could have a copy it does date from 1956 though, so how much use it will be is another question. Antony 2009/9/17 Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net antonys wrote: I'm engaged in a discussion with my local authority, from whom I am trying to get a digital version of the Public Rights of Way map (PROW) for use on OSM. It'll almost certainly be OS-derived and therefore not suitable for OSM, I'm afraid. Even if they wanted to release it, the OS wouldn't hear of it. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/UK-Public-Rights-of-Way-tp25491996p25492203.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] UK Public Rights of Way
On 17/09/09 20:46, Antony Scott wrote: Re: OS derivation - interestingly, in the course of a long conversation and a couple of email exchanges, the officer at the council did not raise this as an issue. The understanding I have is that the data flow is the other way round - ie that the council updates the OS with incremental changes and the OS update their mapping. The council's digital map is the result of an incomplete exercise in digitisation which they now have access to internally, but is not available externally. It is this resource, which appears to be council derived, that I would like to get hold of. Ideally by persuasion, if we can persuade the council that it would be better to have this data in the public domain than not. Yes, the council will be sending the data they create describing the routes of paths to the OS but they will also be using OS data when creating that description - if a path goes from the junction of two roads to the corner of a field then they will likely locate those features on a OS map and draw a line between them. As to the 1956 version of the definitive map being out of copright - good point, but how could I get a copy of it? It is a paper version of course, available for inspection at the council's offices. I suppose I could take a camera, or just ask if I could have a copy it does date from 1956 though, so how much use it will be is another question. It's not the map itself that is interesting, it's the paths they have drawn on it (many of which post date 1956 presumably) but if they have only used that old map in doing so then there is no derivation problem. Of course like you I'm not sure, from a practical point of view, how you would make use of that. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://www.compton.nu/ ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] UK Public Rights of Way
On Fri, 18 Sep 2009, Tom Hughes wrote: Yes, the council will be sending the data they create describing the routes of paths to the OS but they will also be using OS data when creating that description - if a path goes from the junction of two roads to the corner of a field then they will likely locate those features on a OS map and draw a line between them. This needs to be determined - I know from personal contact that here, in my local council area in australia, the GIS staff go out with GPS equipment to determine where things are. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
