Re: [Libreoffice-qa] qtz (key-ID) builds with two entries "Language Settings" in "Tools - Options" dialog

[Thomas Hackert]

Good morning Sophie, *,
On Montag, 2. Dezember 2013 20:47 Sophie wrote:
> Le 02/12/2013 17:53, Andras Timar a écrit :
> [...]
> 
>> The two "Language Settings" get different KeyIDs, therefore
>> LibreOffice cannot merge them runtime. The same would happen, if
>> you translated the two "Language Settings" string differently.
>> This is not a bug.
> Ok, thanks!
> Just a side question here, why the startcenter do not have keyID
> for the left pane (Open, Templates, etc...)?

there are more key-IDs missing (in the Options dialog, the "Close" 
button in Extension Manager etc.) ... :(

But I am not sure, why this happens ... :(
Have a nice day
Thomas.

-- 
World tensions have, if anything, increased in the quarter century 
since H. G. Wells uttered his glum warning: "There is no more evil 
thing on earth than race prejudice, none at all. I write 
deliberately -- it is the worst single thing in life now. It 
justifies and holds together more baseness, cruelty and abomination 
than any other sort of error in the world."
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[Libreoffice-qa] Bibisectzilla needs testing

[Robinson Tryon]

Ayup,

I've got the combined bibisect repository up on the test server and
I'm ready for some people to clone it, poke at it, and test it out. To
prevent overuse (and because it's easier to reuse the existing
gitolite on the server than set up a separate public git server),
please send me a public ssh key if you'd like to gain access.

I've also made an out-of-tree script 'run-libreoffice.sh' that
automatically uses a separate user profile in /tmp (per my old
discussions and the example Miroslaw gave today):
http://testing.eagleeyet.net/~qubit/bibisect/run-libreoffice.sh

Let's get down to testing! :-)

Cheers,
--R
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[Tommy]

On Sun, 01 Dec 2013 19:31:47 +0100, Robinson Tryon  
 wrote:





Here's the list (in alphabetical order):
* blo
* lbz
* libo
* lo
* lob
* lobz


Thanks,
--R
___



my two votes go to:
lob
lobz

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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bibisect - Separate Profile

[Mirosław Zalewski]

Dnia 2013-12-02, o godz. 11:36:31
Joel Madero  napisał(a):

> Can someone who knows how to run bibisect with a separate profile
> please update the wiki :) 

Sorry, but it's faster to write here:

./opt/program/soffice -env:UserInstallation=file:///tmp/soffice-bisect

Will create soffice-bisect profile directory in /tmp/ (will get
automatically removed during next machine boot).
If you want to start fresh for each bisect iteration, you can add git
commit hash to directory name. Something like that (should be in one
line):

./opt/program/soffice 
-env:UserInstallation=file:///tmp/soffice-bisect-$(git rev-parse HEAD)
-- 
Best regards
Mirosław Zalewski
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] qtz (key-ID) builds with two entries "Language Settings" in "Tools - Options" dialog

[Sophie]

Hi Andras,
Le 02/12/2013 17:53, Andras Timar a écrit :
[...]

> The two "Language Settings" get different KeyIDs, therefore
> LibreOffice cannot merge them runtime. The same would happen, if you
> translated the two "Language Settings" string differently. This is not
> a bug.
Ok, thanks!
Just a side question here, why the startcenter do not have keyID for the
left pane (Open, Templates, etc...)?

Kind regards
Sophie
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[Libreoffice-qa] Bibisect - Separate Profile

[Joel Madero]

Can someone who knows how to run bibisect with a separate profile please 
update the wiki :) I would but I'm not exactly clear on how it's done 
and you can corrupt your profile in about 1 minute using bibisect which 
is a pain if you have a bunch of custom things going on in your profile 
(such as losing dictionaries, templates, etc . . . ).



Thanks!


Warmest Regards,
Joel

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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] qtz (key-ID) builds with two entries "Language Settings" in "Tools - Options" dialog

[Thomas Hackert]

Hello Andras, Sophie, *,
On Montag, 2. Dezember 2013 17:53 Andras Timar wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 5:38 PM, Sophie 
> wrote:
>> Le 02/12/2013 17:12, Thomas Hackert a écrit :
>>> as I tried to find a string in the UI, I switched LO to the UI
>>> language "key-ID" (with installed qtz lang- as well as
>>> helppack). After restarting LO I opened "3LxCd||Tools –
>>> cVAJp||Options". There are the entries "NX4eJ||Language
>>> Settings" as well as "Bshz7|| Language Settings". The first
>>> entry contains the usual "Languages", "Writing Aids" stuff and
>>> the last one "English sentence checking" entry. Is this
>>> intended?
>>>
>>> Steps to reproduce:
>>> 1. Install key-ID langpack (e.g.
>>> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/pre-releases/deb/x86_64/LibreOfficeDev_4.2.0.0.beta1_Linux_x86-64_deb_langpack_qtz.tar.gz)
>>> 2. Switch UI language to "key-ID" 3. Open "Tools – Options"
>>> dialog 4. Look at the left side of the dialog
>>>
>>> LO: Version: 4.2.0.0.beta1 Build ID:
>>> f4ca7b35f580827ad2c69ea6d29f7c9b48ebbac7
>>> OS: Debian Testing AMD64
>>
>> I can reproduce. Usually, this page is the last entry of the
>> Language Settings section, I don't know if it's an issue with the
>> KeyID build.

@Sophie: Thanks for confirming :)

> The two "Language Settings" get different KeyIDs, therefore
> LibreOffice cannot merge them runtime. The same would happen, if
> you translated the two "Language Settings" string differently.
> This is not a bug.

Thank you for your explanation :) So nothing to worry about ;?
Greetings
Thomas.

-- 
Don't Worry, Be Happy.
-- Meher Baba

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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] qtz (key-ID) builds with two entries "Language Settings" in "Tools - Options" dialog

[Andras Timar]

On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 5:38 PM, Sophie  wrote:
> Le 02/12/2013 17:12, Thomas Hackert a écrit :
>> Hi @ll,
>> as I tried to find a string in the UI, I switched LO to the UI
>> language "key-ID" (with installed qtz lang- as well as helppack).
>> After restarting LO I opened "3LxCd||Tools – cVAJp||Options". There
>> are the entries "NX4eJ||Language Settings" as well as "Bshz7||
>> Language Settings". The first entry contains the usual "Languages",
>> "Writing Aids" stuff and the last one "English sentence checking"
>> entry. Is this intended?
>>
>> Steps to reproduce:
>> 1. Install key-ID langpack (e.g. 
>> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/pre-releases/deb/x86_64/LibreOfficeDev_4.2.0.0.beta1_Linux_x86-64_deb_langpack_qtz.tar.gz)
>> 2. Switch UI language to "key-ID"
>> 3. Open "Tools – Options" dialog
>> 4. Look at the left side of the dialog
>>
>> LO: Version: 4.2.0.0.beta1 Build ID:
>> f4ca7b35f580827ad2c69ea6d29f7c9b48ebbac7
>> OS: Debian Testing AMD64
>
> I can reproduce. Usually, this page is the last entry of the Language
> Settings section, I don't know if it's an issue with the KeyID build.

The two "Language Settings" get different KeyIDs, therefore
LibreOffice cannot merge them runtime. The same would happen, if you
translated the two "Language Settings" string differently. This is not
a bug.

Best regards,
Andras
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] qtz (key-ID) builds with two entries "Language Settings" in "Tools - Options" dialog

[Sophie]

Le 02/12/2013 17:12, Thomas Hackert a écrit :
> Hi @ll,
> as I tried to find a string in the UI, I switched LO to the UI 
> language "key-ID" (with installed qtz lang- as well as helppack). 
> After restarting LO I opened "3LxCd||Tools – cVAJp||Options". There 
> are the entries "NX4eJ||Language Settings" as well as "Bshz7||
> Language Settings". The first entry contains the usual "Languages", 
> "Writing Aids" stuff and the last one "English sentence checking" 
> entry. Is this intended?
> 
> Steps to reproduce:
> 1. Install key-ID langpack (e.g. 
> http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/pre-releases/deb/x86_64/LibreOfficeDev_4.2.0.0.beta1_Linux_x86-64_deb_langpack_qtz.tar.gz)
> 2. Switch UI language to "key-ID"
> 3. Open "Tools – Options" dialog
> 4. Look at the left side of the dialog
> 
> LO: Version: 4.2.0.0.beta1 Build ID: 
> f4ca7b35f580827ad2c69ea6d29f7c9b48ebbac7
> OS: Debian Testing AMD64

I can reproduce. Usually, this page is the last entry of the Language
Settings section, I don't know if it's an issue with the KeyID build.

Kind regards
Sophie

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[Libreoffice-qa] qtz (key-ID) builds with two entries "Language Settings" in "Tools - Options" dialog

[Thomas Hackert]

Hi @ll,
as I tried to find a string in the UI, I switched LO to the UI 
language "key-ID" (with installed qtz lang- as well as helppack). 
After restarting LO I opened "3LxCd||Tools – cVAJp||Options". There 
are the entries "NX4eJ||Language Settings" as well as "Bshz7||
Language Settings". The first entry contains the usual "Languages", 
"Writing Aids" stuff and the last one "English sentence checking" 
entry. Is this intended?

Steps to reproduce:
1. Install key-ID langpack (e.g. 
http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/pre-releases/deb/x86_64/LibreOfficeDev_4.2.0.0.beta1_Linux_x86-64_deb_langpack_qtz.tar.gz)
2. Switch UI language to "key-ID"
3. Open "Tools – Options" dialog
4. Look at the left side of the dialog

LO: Version: 4.2.0.0.beta1 Build ID: 
f4ca7b35f580827ad2c69ea6d29f7c9b48ebbac7
OS: Debian Testing AMD64

Sorry for the inconvenience
Thomas.

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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Missing symbols in squares in "Bullets and Numbering" dialog on "Image" tab

[Thomas Hackert]

Hello Pedro, *,
On Montag, 2. Dezember 2013 11:16 Pedro wrote:
> Thomas Hackert wrote
> You are referring to the "Graphics" tab in the "Bullets and
> Numbering" dialog (I know it was a translation from German,
> this is just to make it more accurate)
 
 yes and no ... I am referring to the Graphics tab, but somehow
 forgot to mention it, sorry ... :(
>>> 
>>> You did not forget. You called it "Image" tab (that is what I
>>> was referring to). See the Subject of the email ;)
>> 
>> ah, O.K. But why do you write "Graphics"? In my build it is
>> called "Image", no matter, which UI language I choose ... ;)
> 
> The explanation is simple :) You are using the 4.2 Alpha as a

slight correction: 4.2 Beta1 ... ;)

> reference while I'm using the 4.1 branch (4.1.4.1 in this case).
> In fact if you load ANY previous LO version other than from the
> 4.2 branch you will see Graphics ;)

Ah, O.K. Thank you for your explanation :)

> The problem is that someone decided (wrongly) to rename the tab to
> Image in branch 4.2

Was it not decided somewhere to rename all occurrences of 
"graphics", "picture" etc. to "image"? I seem to remember, that I 
have read it somewhere ... ;)

> This not only breaks with all past versions (including all
> manuals) but also is inconsistent with the rest of the options in
> the Options tab

O.K.

> 
> 
> So this is another BUG and REGRESSION... Unless the plan is to
> replace "Graphics" with "Image"... Can someone in the QA team ask
> to the UX team?

Me not, sorry ... :(

> Thomas Hackert wrote
>>> Please let me know when you report it so that I can confirm it
>>> ;)
>> 
>> It is https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72218 now ...
>> ;)
> 
> Confirmed, as you probably already were notified :)

Yes, sure :) Thank you very much for confirming :)
Greetings
Thomas.

-- 
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[bjoern]

On Mon, Dec 02, 2013 at 08:45:33AM -0500, Robinson Tryon wrote:
> Until someone in infra tells me otherwise, I'm going to assume that
> all of the bugs and bugtracking categories covered under the
> 'LibreOffice' product on FDO will migrate to the new Bugzilla instance
> being set up by Tollef. I'm quite supportive of carving-off all of our
> non-LibreOffice-specific bugs and shoving them into a separate
> bugtracker, but my thinking here is to focus on one step at a time.

Yup.

"Listen, I'm a politician which means I'm a cheat and a liar, and when I'm not
kissing babies I'm stealing their lollipops. But it also means I keep my
options open."
-- Jeffrey Pelt, The Hunt for Red October

Best,

Bjoern
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[Robinson Tryon]

On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 8:21 AM, bjoern  wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 02, 2013 at 07:09:06AM -0600, Norbert Thiebaud wrote:
>> With the expeirence of setting a large bugzilla up likewe need... it
>> should not be that hard to creat a separate instance for infra...and
>> in the future a separate instance for other project that may come
>> along
>
> Im pretty certain infra wont go with bugzilla though -- currently their
> favourite is RedMine. But yeah, the original point made still stands mixing
> LibreOffice the product with other issue tracking in the project is likely
> unhelpful.

Until someone in infra tells me otherwise, I'm going to assume that
all of the bugs and bugtracking categories covered under the
'LibreOffice' product on FDO will migrate to the new Bugzilla instance
being set up by Tollef. I'm quite supportive of carving-off all of our
non-LibreOffice-specific bugs and shoving them into a separate
bugtracker, but my thinking here is to focus on one step at a time.

--R
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[Norbert Thiebaud]

On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 7:21 AM, bjoern  wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 02, 2013 at 07:09:06AM -0600, Norbert Thiebaud wrote:
>> With the expeirence of setting a large bugzilla up likewe need... it
>> should not be that hard to creat a separate instance for infra...and
>> in the future a separate instance for other project that may come
>> along
>
> Im pretty certain infra wont go with bugzilla though -- currently their
> favourite is RedMine.

Yeah, they are notorious for settling on obscure, never heard of (and
never heard of again :-) ) tools, like OTRS, sphynx, etc... :-D

Norbert
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[bjoern]

On Mon, Dec 02, 2013 at 07:09:06AM -0600, Norbert Thiebaud wrote:
> With the expeirence of setting a large bugzilla up likewe need... it
> should not be that hard to creat a separate instance for infra...and
> in the future a separate instance for other project that may come
> along

Im pretty certain infra wont go with bugzilla though -- currently their
favourite is RedMine. But yeah, the original point made still stands mixing
LibreOffice the product with other issue tracking in the project is likely
unhelpful.

Best,

Bjoern
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[Norbert Thiebaud]

On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 5:12 AM, bjoern  wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 06:51:55PM -0500, Robinson Tryon wrote:
>> The nice thing with putting everything under a "LibreOffice"
>> bugtracker for now is that if in the future we do decide to migrate
>> bugtracking for TDF-specific web infra to a separate instance, that's
>> going to be a much smaller and simpler piece.
>
> This was what I was thinking of, yep.

I think that should not be 'in the future'. from the start the
libreoffice bugzilla should be libreoffice centric.
tdf-infra has it's own ways and likely will have way different
workflow than lo wrt the handling of these..
and yes, tdf is likely to one day have other product under its
umbrella, so not repeating the fdo situation, just somewhere else...
would be wise.

With the expeirence of setting a large bugzilla up likewe need... it
should not be that hard to creat a separate instance for infra...and
in the future a separate instance for other project that may come
along


Norbert

Note: that is why using lo/libo prefix is not only not an issue but in
fact desirable to associate strongly the bugzilla instance with the
product it tracks...
and as bjoern said.. the prefix is really lo#  and every instance
would be lo# that cannot be confuse with the porduct itself
anymore that fdo# can be confused with fdo the org.
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Bugzilla Migration: Abbreviation to replace fdo#12345

[Norbert Thiebaud]

> Am 01.12.2013 19:31, schrieb Robinson Tryon:
>>> * lo
for the sake of concision I'd prefer that one. remeber that commit
message would contain it aka lo#  and real-estate is very sparse
on the 'summary' line of a commit.

>>> * blo
fine size wise... but I just do not associate it with the intented meaning..
prolly because I read blo  as in blow not as below

>>> * lbz
eew! sound like the abbreviation of an obscure imperial unit.. or a
90's boysband :-)

>>> * libo
too long

>>> * lob
common sql accronym: large object

>>> * lobz
too long

Norbert
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Annouce: Bibisect for MACOSX

[Norbert Thiebaud]

On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 3:37 AM, Robinson Tryon
 wrote:
>
> Hmm...a lag of a week in the bibisect repo could be a deal-breaker for
> QA members who try to test with daily builds, especially the members
> who build LO on their own machines right now.

I'm sorry but these are orthogonal issue.

1/ bibisect is to bisect regressions.
2/ bibsect construction right now is not automated (well, except for
the monster canonical build box... when it is active)
3/ uploading of daily build is <> of uploading of tar.gz for the
purpose of bibisect integration. daily build upload dmg/rpm/deb/msi,
whereas for bibisect integration we will upload a tar.gz image of
instdir
4/ it is even more unrelated to someone doing his own build.

iow: bibisect is not intented to find bug in the bleeding edge.. daily
build and self-build are indeed indicated for that. bibisect is to
help narrow down a regression that got past automated testing and the
bleeding edge manual testing..

>
> Tinderboxes do send email, but AFAIK those emails only go to tinderbox
> owners or to devs. QA would like to be kept further appraised about
> not only builds succeeding, but also whether those builds can run and
> function properly.

Daily build upload update teh 'current' link on their respective
secion in the website.
it does that only when it was able to upload a dailybuild that was
sucessfully built
which is deemed a build that can 'run and function properly'.. if it
was know it was not so, it would not be uploaded.

>
>> but sometimes some tb are out-of-order
>
> From what I understand, we did not have official TDF tinderboxes for
> all major platforms until very recently. As a result, it was difficult
> for QA to maintain reliability with volunteer tinderboxes that might
> disappear for a while.
>
> Official TDF tinderboxes are a great improvement in reliability for
> us, and will hopefully enjoy great uptime.
even 'official' TDF tinderboxes require the love and attention of someone

>
> I agree that bibisect is not the best tool to detect if a tb is not
> currently building. Aside from emailing out, what else can we do to
> more promptly triage and address the situation when a (previously
> building) tb starts to fail to produce viable builds?

I plan to have gerrit buildbot to start to collect information about
tb activity in general
this could work if bjoern tb3 thing reach fruition...
_david_ already added some logging facility in buildbot and the
tb3-plugin on gerrit which in turn should allow
for activity tracking of the tbs... that won't tell if the build is
'viable' but it will tell if a tb has not build anything at all or not
build anyting successfully for some time.

Norbert
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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Missing symbols in squares in "Bullets and Numbering" dialog on "Image" tab

[Pedro]

Hi Thomas, all


Thomas Hackert wrote
 You are referring to the "Graphics" tab in the "Bullets and
 Numbering" dialog (I know it was a translation from German, this
 is just to make it more accurate)
>>> 
>>> yes and no ... I am referring to the Graphics tab, but somehow
>>> forgot to mention it, sorry ... :(
>> 
>> You did not forget. You called it "Image" tab (that is what I was
>> referring to). See the Subject of the email ;)
> 
> ah, O.K. But why do you write "Graphics"? In my build it is called 
> "Image", no matter, which UI language I choose ... ;)

The explanation is simple :) You are using the 4.2 Alpha as a reference
while I'm using the 4.1 branch (4.1.4.1 in this case). In fact if you load
ANY previous LO version other than from the 4.2 branch you will see Graphics
;)

The problem is that someone decided (wrongly) to rename the tab to Image in
branch 4.2

This not only breaks with all past versions (including all manuals) but also
is inconsistent with the rest of the options in the Options tab

 

So this is another BUG and REGRESSION... Unless the plan is to replace
"Graphics" with "Image"... Can someone in the QA team ask to the UX team?


Thomas Hackert wrote
>> Please let me know when you report it so that I can confirm it ;)
> 
> It is https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72218 now ... ;)

Confirmed, as you probably already were notified :)

Cheers,
Pedro



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[Libreoffice-qa] TXT and PDF files in "Format – Slide Design..." with installed template pack

[Thomas Hackert]

Hello @ll,
somehow strange ...

1. Download the extension pack from the Germanophone LibOx site 
(http://dvd.de.libreofficebox.org/assets/de/templates/libreofficebox-de-vorlagen.oxt)
2. Install it via "Tools – Extension Manager"
3. Either create a new presentation or open an existing one
4. Go to "Format – Slide Design..."
5. Click on "Load..." in "Slide Design..." window
6. You will see "lgpgl.readme.txt" on the right side below templates 
and if you click on "Verschiedenes" (last entry below "Category"), 
you will see "dissertation-stw-man.pdf" ... :(

And if you have enabled "Preview", you will get the following error 
message:

Error loading the template :
Incorrect format.
The file cannot be used as template.

... :(

Is this a bug or a feature?

I have not found an template pack on 
http://libreoffice-na.us/English-4.1-installs/index.html so far, but maybe 
someone with 
a different one (e.g. the old SUN template packs or something else) 
can try to reproduce it with this pack as well ... ;)

Discovered with:
LO: Version: 4.1.3.2 Build ID: 
70feb7d99726f064edab4605a8ab840c50ec57a as well with Version: 
4.2.0.0.beta1 Build ID: f4ca7b35f580827ad2c69ea6d29f7c9b48ebbac7 
(both with installed Germanophone lang- as well as helppack)

Thanks for testing
Thomas.

-- 
Chemistry professors never die, they just fail to react.

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Re: [Libreoffice-qa] Annouce: Bibisect for MACOSX

[Robinson Tryon]

On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 1:02 AM, Norbert Thiebaud  wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 1, 2013 at 3:52 PM, Robinson Tryon
>  wrote:
>>
>> automatically, I hope? The QA Team has been expecting that daily
>> builds would be available promptly in bibisect repos.
>
> semi-automatically... that is automatically but with human
> supervision... has mishap need to be caugh and fixed early
>
> I imagine that there would be a log of a few days... maybe a week
> between the head of a branch and the bibisect repo..

Hmm...a lag of a week in the bibisect repo could be a deal-breaker for
QA members who try to test with daily builds, especially the members
who build LO on their own machines right now.

> if for no other reason that git gc does a better job if it has many
> loose object to compact, compression wise
> and doing git gcc --aggressive to balance that once in a while is
> prohibitively expensive... and as the repo become build, won;t even
> run on most machines

Could we limit our use of 'git gc' to once a week?

>>> This will also allow.. in case a particular patch made the thing
>>> unbuildable for a while... to retrospectively re-build that section of
>>> the history using a 'patched' version at each step to avoid the the
>>> bug the prevented the build to start with...
>>
>> When you say "re-build," if we're re-building from source, how would
>> the tarballs help us?
>
> because I can rebuild _some_ missing section... and stich the rest
> using the tarball
> I've been doing that dance for the past 3 weeks building the Mac bibisect

As I understand it, we use the content of each tarball as input for a
commit in the bibisect repository. Is it merely *easier* to "stitch
the rest" together when operating on separate tarballs than on the
content of commits in a git repo, or is there actually some important
information in the tarball that doesn't make it into the commit?

>> My hope with bibisect is that we'll prevent any of the primary builds
>> from breaking "for weeks at a time." I think that there are enough
>> Win/Mac/Linux people on the QA Team willing to test against the daily
>> bibisect repos that we'll notice if the build breaks for even a couple
>> of days.
>
> no it won't. we already have tinderbox that send email when stuff
> breaks..

Tinderboxes do send email, but AFAIK those emails only go to tinderbox
owners or to devs. QA would like to be kept further appraised about
not only builds succeeding, but also whether those builds can run and
function properly.

> but sometimes some tb are out-of-order

>From what I understand, we did not have official TDF tinderboxes for
all major platforms until very recently. As a result, it was difficult
for QA to maintain reliability with volunteer tinderboxes that might
disappear for a while.

Official TDF tinderboxes are a great improvement in reliability for
us, and will hopefully enjoy great uptime.

> sometimes stuff get
> overlooked, sometimes shit happens etc...

Oh yes -- there are always unexpected problems. If we plan our
workflow carefully, I think we can minimize the affect these problems
have on our testing and QA process.

> iow bibisect will not help us to detect that something does not
> build... sicne we build far more often than we aggregate bibisect
> build...

I believe our latest plan is to add a new build to the bibisect repo
daily (or every 50-60 commits). That will give us pretty good
granularity to track-down the introduction of a regression.

I agree that bibisect is not the best tool to detect if a tb is not
currently building. Aside from emailing out, what else can we do to
more promptly triage and address the situation when a (previously
building) tb starts to fail to produce viable builds?

Thanks,
--R
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