Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 18:30:10 -0800 (PST) From: David Chien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues > Funny you mentioned your preference for Symantec AV, but go with Sygate > and ZoneAlarm firewalls. How about Symantec's firewall David? Any > opinions there? I've never used Symantec's firewall because I don't find it useful to pay for an excellent firewall (which can be had free in either Sygate or ZoneAlarm). anyways, I've looked over reviews, tested both of these free choices out, haven't found any problems so I haven't looked further. --- Still I do pay attention to user reviews: http://reviews.cnet.com/Norton_Personal_Firewall_2005/4852-3667_7-30992807.html?tag=tab and it gets a dismal 37% thumbs up from 67 users at cnet.com (you can search download.com for user reviews on the others) as well as magazine reviews. Here, PCMag.com says that the default install of Norton allows over 1700 programs by default, and that's something I never want a firewall to do -- it should and must ask me at least one time (if not each and every time) for access to the net as required. -- That's why I'm running Sygate on a public, fast connection PC at work - I want something that'll ask each and every time for access no matter what; ZoneAlarm at home, nicer, less prompts, and very little will every download in the short time I'm online by modem at home and travel. (also, work system is running xp so need for more protection - running more programs, testing and uninstalling trials, etc.; 98SE at home, which, once patched, can't really be hacked into doesn't need as strong of a protection - stable, only runs Mozilla and doesn't get changed often, IMO. ie. more holes in XP than 98, so need for more access prompts on XP than 98.) Since both programs are free and they're updated quickly, and haven't had any major flaws reported in years, they're the ones I go with, esp. since the forums for both products are uptodate and you can get help quickly. It's not to say they're perfect. Because versions update quickly, and intrusions , too, many comparative reviews are obsolete and worthless rather quickly (ie. by the next update). You can always test yourself using various tools listed here: eg. http://www.pcflank.com/art41a.htm Anyways, the paranoid can always use a Mac OS 9 box or DOS. > As for AV... I was kind of wondering what issues Lee has with Norton. I > have Norton 2000 that I just keep reinstalling onto a fresh copy of W98 > somewhere that keeps making Symantec (now owning Norton) think it's a fresh > installation. That way I get free updates for 6 months to a year or so. I > was guessing that the current Symantec AV definitions are about as good as > I'm going to find no? yes. For Norton 2002-2003, it's a simple matter of uninstalling, deleting all symantec named folders, reinstalling. Older versions must be a uninstall and reinstall. Latest versions, avoid because they're locked to a pc. you can also install firewall, turn the time up a decade, install, download and install "symantec intelligent updater", reboot, do the updater again, open and close the AV window, then turn the time back while blocking all current and future access by the LiveUpdate. then, download and install the updater manually in the future. = adorable toshiba libretto The latest news and information for the Toshiba Libretto owner. http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ __ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 15:08:55 +0100 From: Philip Nienhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues David Chien wrote: > > Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:21:31 -0800 (PST) > From: David Chien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues > > The very strangest thing I've seen smart, intelligent people do is to install > the 2nd best or worse ranked antivirus software into their computers -- then > feel safe that they're protected. > > People - wake up! Read http://www.virusbtn.com/vb100/archives/products.xml > and many other virus scanner test sites online. Thanks for the link. Be aware that this web site is just one of many sites reporting comparative virus scanner reviews. > If you simply look at the recent 2004 year results of AVG, you will see right > away that it has failed once (they test 4 times a year). Right away, you're > using a virus scanner that has a tested 25% failure rate, or only a 75% > protection rate (based on test results). > > It is like saying, I'll take that crappy EBOLA vaccination (there isn't any, > forget it if you get it), and I'll take my chances when I catch it. > > Hello? Wouldn't you want to know that you've taken the best vaccination on > the > planet? Wouldn't you want to know that each and every virus is caught on your > system? > > Please look at the other products for better virus protection -- here, > Symantec > AntiVirus is my choice because it runs well, has great reviews (commerically > and user), does the job, and has passed each and every test since 2000. (Yes, > the older 5.0 version failed in 1999, but let us assume that five years of > solid pass rates since then means they've got their stuff together nowadays - > products to improve over time, so older results should carry less weight.) > > You can examine the other product results and come to your own conclusions, > but > I would bet on Symantec Antivirus as the one that works. Sure. Yet the URL I posted yesterday points to another web site which has quite different conclusions. Other sites containing comparitive tests may show still different results. And PC magazines I'm subscribed to have published yet again different conclusions. So I'd say your bet is as good as mine. Nevertheless, I agree with Matt that sensible use of Internet resources is by far the most important aspect, much much more than the relative quality of a virus scanner. The last time I had a virus on my computer (Melissa) must have been > 10 yrs ago. From that time on I had a virus scanner loaded, I've never had virus alarms since. I do much the same as Matt: - be careful with attachments - keep Windows up-to-date. And in addition, I: - run AdAware & Spybot S&D regularly - have good firewalls running (I got a hardware w. NAT in the router, and then personal firewalls on al boxes) - delete spam and probable virus-loaded mails already at the server (using MailWasher) - don't use Internet Explorer, except for those stupid sites which only work with IE (I always send those web masters the W3C link to check their HTML) - have scrubbed out Outlook (+ -Expr), Netmeeting and other MS junk like MS-Java - removed Netbios from the TCP/IP protocol - use OS/2 or Linux if e.g., I have to search for extraneous drivers on suspect web sites. Philip
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 14:44:07 +0100 From: Philip Nienhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues Matt Hanson wrote: > > Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 01:27:16 -0800 (PST) > From: Matt Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues > > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > Here's a link to a couple of very handy utilities (& other things), > > Control Panel and Startup Monitor, for W2K. Control Panel offers a > > fancied-up msconfig-type utility, which works very well, allowing one to > > select/deselect software that W2K will run at startup. A great > > improvement over Task Manager. > > Hmmm... Looks like a handy utilty to shut down some processes that > otherwise might also be disabled in the W2K Administrative Tools. Haven't > gotten to the point of installing the stripped down version of W2K Philip > writes about. But I keep wondering if it might be possible to get more > performance out of W2K by just going in and shutting down processes that I > may not need, as I'm not running it as a client server. For a start, have a look here: http://www.techspot.com/tweaks/win2k_services/ I found it doesn't make very much difference in performance, but some services do affect (negatively) security. Philip Philip
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 01:27:16 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Here's a link to a couple of very handy utilities (& other things), > Control Panel and Startup Monitor, for W2K. Control Panel offers a > fancied-up msconfig-type utility, which works very well, allowing one to > select/deselect software that W2K will run at startup. A great > improvement over Task Manager. Hmmm... Looks like a handy utilty to shut down some processes that otherwise might also be disabled in the W2K Administrative Tools. Haven't gotten to the point of installing the stripped down version of W2K Philip writes about. But I keep wondering if it might be possible to get more performance out of W2K by just going in and shutting down processes that I may not need, as I'm not running it as a client server. Matt __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 22:07:52 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues --- David Chien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Also, Sygate Personal Firewall and ZoneAlarm both do a great job for > me. > But I'm using both on different systems and find that they both work > fine. Funny you mentioned your preference for Symantec AV, but go with Sygate and ZoneAlarm firewalls. How about Symantec's firewall David? Any opinions there? I have Norton Personal Firewall 2001 I picked up somewhere along the way, and it's been good for me as far as I can tell. You can set it to auto-deal with things, or have it alert you each time there's an incoming our outgoing issue, and lets you configure the settings manually... or for issues with major brand software like other Symantec software, will suggest you let it auto-configure itself. As for AV... I was kind of wondering what issues Lee has with Norton. I have Norton 2000 that I just keep reinstalling onto a fresh copy of W98 somewhere that keeps making Symantec (now owning Norton) think it's a fresh installation. That way I get free updates for 6 months to a year or so. I was guessing that the current Symantec AV definitions are about as good as I'm going to find no? Matt __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:30:25 -0800 (PST) From: David Chien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues > My bad. The problem software is Sygate firewall, not AVG. (Oh, the > shame:-/ ) See sygate forums - a few of the very latest releases are not stable for a number of users, so the versions recommended there should be used. Otherwise, it's solid as a rock for me. --- Also, Sygate Personal Firewall and ZoneAlarm both do a great job for me. The differences? Sygate is a IT firewall -- it'll ask you for every access and really let you lock down access in and out. ZoneAlarm tries to be a bit more friendly, is as good for most users, but doesn't ask for the 'obvious' things you'd normally want in/out (eg. JetDirect printing). Problem here is that ZoneAlarm may automatically try to be a bit too generous for the parnoid; Sygate too serious for the normal user. But I'm using both on different systems and find that they both work fine. --- = adorable toshiba libretto The latest news and information for the Toshiba Libretto owner. http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:21:31 -0800 (PST) From: David Chien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues The very strangest thing I've seen smart, intelligent people do is to install the 2nd best or worse ranked antivirus software into their computers -- then feel safe that they're protected. People - wake up! Read http://www.virusbtn.com/vb100/archives/products.xml and many other virus scanner test sites online. --- If you simply look at the recent 2004 year results of AVG, you will see right away that it has failed once (they test 4 times a year). Right away, you're using a virus scanner that has a tested 25% failure rate, or only a 75% protection rate (based on test results). It is like saying, I'll take that crappy EBOLA vaccination (there isn't any, forget it if you get it), and I'll take my chances when I catch it. Hello? Wouldn't you want to know that you've taken the best vaccination on the planet? Wouldn't you want to know that each and every virus is caught on your system? Please look at the other products for better virus protection -- here, Symantec AntiVirus is my choice because it runs well, has great reviews (commerically and user), does the job, and has passed each and every test since 2000. (Yes, the older 5.0 version failed in 1999, but let us assume that five years of solid pass rates since then means they've got their stuff together nowadays - products to improve over time, so older results should carry less weight.) You can examine the other product results and come to your own conclusions, but I would bet on Symantec Antivirus as the one that works. --- = adorable toshiba libretto The latest news and information for the Toshiba Libretto owner. http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 08:37:52 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues In a message dated 1/27/2005 4:54:48 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > And on quirky OS behaviour, > immediately runing something like TaskInfo2000 and looking for processes > that are running that aren't anything I know is usual to see running. > http://www.mlin.net/ Here's a link to a couple of very handy utilities (& other things), Control Panel and Startup Monitor, for W2K. Control Panel offers a fancied-up msconfig-type utility, which works very well, allowing one to select/deselect software that W2K will run at startup. A great improvement over Task Manager. Startup Monitor is a TSR which watches for software attempting to install itself. It works very well, but can be annoying. Lee
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 14:35:41 +0100 From: Philip Nienhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > In a message dated 1/27/2005 3:33:18 AM Mountain Standard Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > Got a link for that? I searched on www.grisoft.com but couldn't find it. > > My bad. The problem software is Sygate firewall, not AVG. (Oh, the > shame:-/ ) Don't worry. Would ZoneAlarm be a good alternative? (or Kerio, ...) ... > > What would concern me more is whether AVG Free can catch enough viruses. > > I have the impression that it performs a bit less in this respect than > > McAfee, but McAfee really slows down Windows on the Lib110. > > I used the (until recently) free version of Computer Asociates AV+firewall > called EZ Armor, but the renewal was $30, and the firewall was difficult to > manage. AVG seems OK, but I have had a low incidence rate of virus > infection, so > can't judge its effectiveness. Not a Norton fan, and I agree with your > observation of McAfee. It was great when it was freeware, though. Found a good link, interesting results. It suggests that McAfee is the best of all and AVG just performs average. To your liking: Norton did not come out that good either: http://agn-www.informatik.uni-hamburg.de/vtc/ > Sorry for the error. That's OK, Philip
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 08:26:59 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues In a message dated 1/27/2005 3:33:18 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Got a link for that? I searched on www.grisoft.com but couldn't find it. My bad. The problem software is Sygate firewall, not AVG. (Oh, the shame:-/ ) > > > Guess it may be time to pony up for AV software. > > Sure, there are other free AV-products, e.g.: > http://www.freeware.freeweb-hosting.com/av.html > http://www.thefreesite.com/Free_Software/Anti_virus_freeware/ > > Admittedly, AVG Free v. 7.0 performs a bit less in some respects than v. > 6.0. Manually updating the av-definitions often takes a long time, if > the server can be reached at all. Automatic updating-while-booting > always goes fast and flawless. > But it is free and otherwise works well, I don't complain. > > What would concern me more is whether AVG Free can catch enough viruses. > I have the impression that it performs a bit less in this respect than > McAfee, but McAfee really slows down Windows on the Lib110. I used the (until recently) free version of Computer Asociates AV+firewall called EZ Armor, but the renewal was $30, and the firewall was difficult to manage. AVG seems OK, but I have had a low incidence rate of virus infection, so can't judge its effectiveness. Not a Norton fan, and I agree with your observation of McAfee. It was great when it was freeware, though. Sorry for the error. > > P. > Lee
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 03:52:35 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues --- Philip Nienhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > What would concern me more is whether AVG Free can catch enough viruses. > I have the impression that it performs a bit less in this respect than > McAfee, but McAfee really slows down Windows on the Lib110. Heh... As I've written, my solution to AV software slowing down these Libbies has been just not to install it at all. I've been running underpowered systems on the net sinnce '94-'95 and have only gotten hit a few times in all that time. And until recently, those times were >always< when I neglected to run an AV scan on a file before I executed it. Only recently after installing W2K did I run into a virus that I got by merely >visiting< a website. And that could have been avoided if I had run Windows Update beforehand. The trick for me is just to run AV on any susceptible file before I run it. That and always watching for outgoing data transfers online when I've got nothing running that should be causing it. And on quirky OS behaviour, immediately runing something like TaskInfo2000 and looking for processes that are running that aren't anything I know is usual to see running. Having AV software running and checking on everything on an ongoing basic on thse old under-powered systems just slows things up way too much for my comfort. But I do always have it installed to run manually when I think a file may be suspicious Matt __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 11:30:40 +0100
From: Philip Nienhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 22:22:29 EST
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
>
> In a message dated 1/24/2005 1:34:00 PM Mountain Standard Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> > .question: what has WAN to do with AVG-Free?
>
> That would be a question for AVG - I have no idea (see below)
>
> >
> > > preventing it would appear. I would Shut Down the L100 at that point. On
> > the
> > > next boot-up, hibernation would work. Then, after resuming and attempting
> > to
> > > hibernate, the error message appears and prevents hibernation...Even
> > after
> > > de-activating - but not uninstalling - AVG, the error appeared. I've
> > finally
> > > uninstalled it. FWIW, this also occurs on my daughter's Portege 7010CT.
> > >
> > > Any advice is welcome!
> >
> > Well, my (IE-stripped) Win2K hibernates fine running AVG-Free (7.0 I
> > think) & wifi LAN. (The other -full- Win2K on the Lib runs McAfee.)
> >
> > I suppose your problem has little to do with AVG-Free.
> > Win2K hibernation can be hampered by hardware drivers which do not
> > properly shut down the HW before and reinitialize it after hibernation.
> > The NT driver for the L10/L110 Neomagic video is a fine example.
> > In your case, I'd suggest there's something wrong with your network
> > drivers or network connections ("WAN"). The fact that uninstalling AVG
> > does not help is a clear indication of this.
> >
> > Philip
> >
> You've misunderstood my (granted, abbreviated) explanation. Uninstalling AVG
> does, in fact, solve the WAN driver interference with W2K hibernation
Sorry, I didn't grab that.
> problem. And as I said, the same behavior occurs with a Portege 7010CT:
> prior to
> AVG-Free installation, problem-free W2K hibernation; afterwards, WAN driver
> interference. BTW, there is mention of this problem on the AVG site, with the
> recommendation to buy the commercial version, where the problem is "solved."
Got a link for that? I searched on www.grisoft.com but couldn't find it.
> Guess it may be time to pony up for AV software.
Sure, there are other free AV-products, e.g.:
http://www.freeware.freeweb-hosting.com/av.html
http://www.thefreesite.com/Free_Software/Anti_virus_freeware/
Admittedly, AVG Free v. 7.0 performs a bit less in some respects than v.
6.0. Manually updating the av-definitions often takes a long time, if
the server can be reached at all. Automatic updating-while-booting
always goes fast and flawless.
But it is free and otherwise works well, I don't complain.
What would concern me more is whether AVG Free can catch enough viruses.
I have the impression that it performs a bit less in this respect than
McAfee, but McAfee really slows down Windows on the Lib110.
P.
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 22:22:29 EST
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
In a message dated 1/24/2005 1:34:00 PM Mountain Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> .question: what has WAN to do with AVG-Free?
That would be a question for AVG - I have no idea (see below)
>
> > preventing it would appear. I would Shut Down the L100 at that point. On
> the
> > next boot-up, hibernation would work. Then, after resuming and attempting
> to
> > hibernate, the error message appears and prevents hibernation...Even
> after
> > de-activating - but not uninstalling - AVG, the error appeared. I've
> finally
> > uninstalled it. FWIW, this also occurs on my daughter's Portege 7010CT.
> >
> > Any advice is welcome!
>
> Well, my (IE-stripped) Win2K hibernates fine running AVG-Free (7.0 I
> think) & wifi LAN. (The other -full- Win2K on the Lib runs McAfee.)
>
> I suppose your problem has little to do with AVG-Free.
> Win2K hibernation can be hampered by hardware drivers which do not
> properly shut down the HW before and reinitialize it after hibernation.
> The NT driver for the L10/L110 Neomagic video is a fine example.
> In your case, I'd suggest there's something wrong with your network
> drivers or network connections ("WAN"). The fact that uninstalling AVG
> does not help is a clear indication of this.
>
> Philip
>
You've misunderstood my (granted, abbreviated) explanation. Uninstalling AVG
does, in fact, solve the WAN driver interference with W2K hibernation
problem. And as I said, the same behavior occurs with a Portege 7010CT: prior
to
AVG-Free installation, problem-free W2K hibernation; afterwards, WAN driver
interference. BTW, there is mention of this problem on the AVG site, with the
recommendation to buy the commercial version, where the problem is "solved."
Guess it may be time to pony up for AV software.
Lee
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:33:08 +0100
From: Philip Nienhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:38:42 EST
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
>
> In a message dated 1/24/2005 5:13:48 AM Mountain Standard Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
>
> > Correct, the slipstreamed full W2K one takes about 1 - 1.5 minutes.
> > A slipstreamed but then IE-stripped W2K takes a mere 15-20 seconds,
> > although that time has increased a bit with a new virus scanner version
> > (AVG Free).
> >
>
> I'm also running (or rather *was* running) AVG Free, but it interfered with
> W2K hibernation. Upon attempting to hibernate, a message about a WAN driver
.question: what has WAN to do with AVG-Free?
> preventing it would appear. I would Shut Down the L100 at that point. On the
> next boot-up, hibernation would work. Then, after resuming and attempting to
> hibernate, the error message appears and prevents hibernation...Even after
> de-activating - but not uninstalling - AVG, the error appeared. I've finally
> uninstalled it. FWIW, this also occurs on my daughter's Portege 7010CT.
>
> Any advice is welcome!
Well, my (IE-stripped) Win2K hibernates fine running AVG-Free (7.0 I
think) & wifi LAN. (The other -full- Win2K on the Lib runs McAfee.)
I suppose your problem has little to do with AVG-Free.
Win2K hibernation can be hampered by hardware drivers which do not
properly shut down the HW before and reinitialize it after hibernation.
The NT driver for the L10/L110 Neomagic video is a fine example.
In your case, I'd suggest there's something wrong with your network
drivers or network connections ("WAN"). The fact that uninstalling AVG
does not help is a clear indication of this.
Philip
Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:38:42 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] AVG Free Issues In a message dated 1/24/2005 5:13:48 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Correct, the slipstreamed full W2K one takes about 1 - 1.5 minutes. > A slipstreamed but then IE-stripped W2K takes a mere 15-20 seconds, > although that time has increased a bit with a new virus scanner version > (AVG Free). > I'm also running (or rather *was* running) AVG Free, but it interfered with W2K hibernation. Upon attempting to hibernate, a message about a WAN driver preventing it would appear. I would Shut Down the L100 at that point. On the next boot-up, hibernation would work. Then, after resuming and attempting to hibernate, the error message appears and prevents hibernation...Even after de-activating - but not uninstalling - AVG, the error appeared. I've finally uninstalled it. FWIW, this also occurs on my daughter's Portege 7010CT. Any advice is welcome! Lee
