Re: Reducing horizontal spacing
Janek,
I also experimented with a context statement that matched the first
documentation page, but I couldn't get it to work (see attached).
David
On 12/7/2013 1:45 AM, Janek Warchoł wrote:
2013/12/7 David Bolton davidkbol...@gmail.com:
My goal is to reduce the horizontal spacing so that I fit four measures
per system instead of two.
Unfortunately I can't work out where the override statement is supposed
to go. I've tried mimicking the locations shown in the documentation but
they all give errors for my score.
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.17/Documentation/notation/changing-spacing
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16/Documentation/notation/the-override-command
See attached for my score.
It didn't work because you haven't specified appropriate context -
SpacingSpanner lives in the Score context.
\version 2.14.0
tune = \relative c' {
\clef treble
\key c \major
\time 8/1
% prevent bar number display on the second line
\set Score.barNumberVisibility = #(every-nth-bar-number-visible 100)
d1^\markup{\large{\bold{1. Dorian}}}_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} e f g a b_\markup{\large{*}} c d
e,^\markup{\large{\bold{3. Phrygian}}}_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} f g a b c d e
f,^\markup{\large{\bold{5. Lydian}}}_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} g a b_\markup{\large{*}} c d e f
g,^\markup{\large{\bold{7. Mixolydian}}}_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} a b c d e f g
\break
a,,^\markup{\large{\bold{2. Hypodorian}}} b_\markup{\large{*}} c d_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} e f g a
b,^\markup{\large{\bold{4. Hypophrygian}}} c d e_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} f g a b
c,^\markup{\large{\bold{6. Hypolydian}}} d e f_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} g a b_\markup{\large{*}} c
d,^\markup{\large{\bold{8. Hypomixolydian}}} e f g_\markup{\large{\bold{f}}} a b c d
}
#(set-default-paper-size letter 'landscape)
#(set-global-staff-size 22)
\score {
\new Staff \with { \remove Time_signature_engraver} { \tune }
\layout {
\context {
\Score
\override SpacingSpanner.common-shortest-duration = #(ly:make-moment 1/2)
}
}
}
\markup{\large{* Under certain conditions, the B is flatted in modes 1, 2, 5, and 6.}}
\paper { indent = 0\mm }___
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Re: Reducing horizontal spacing
David, 2013/12/7 David Bolton davidkbol...@gmail.com: Janek, I also experimented with a context statement that matched the first documentation page, but I couldn't get it to work (see attached). That's probably because you are using LilyPond version that doesn't match the documentation version you're using. When i tried compiling it with latest development version, it worked correctly. hth, Janek ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
A music function that drops music.
I have created this function to drop a staff from a \score { } block:
DropMusic =
#(define-music-function
(parser location arg1)
(ly:music?)
#{
#}
)
This will be useful in Denemo to allow the user to create a staff that
is not typeset, but needs to be present for other purposes (such as
creating the BeamExceptions that David mentioned).
I imagine this is a function without a purpose for most users but I
mention it here for three reasons
* Perhaps it already exists under a different name, or is not the
best syntax, or doesn't do exactly what I think it does.
* Perhaps it does have other uses: conditionally dropping
passages ...
* and because I am inordinately proud of having managed to create
it. A tribute, in fact, to the quality of LilyPond's
documentation. A very fine line to draw between saying too much
(and losing people's attention) and saying too little.
Richard
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Re: A music function that drops music.
Richard Shann rich...@rshann.plus.com writes:
I have created this function to drop a staff from a \score { } block:
DropMusic =
#(define-music-function
(parser location arg1)
(ly:music?)
#{
#}
)
This will be useful in Denemo to allow the user to create a staff that
is not typeset, but needs to be present for other purposes (such as
creating the BeamExceptions that David mentioned).
I imagine this is a function without a purpose for most users but I
mention it here for three reasons
* Perhaps it already exists under a different name, or is not the
best syntax, or doesn't do exactly what I think it does.
\void
There are some slight differences in behavior since \void has a
predicate of type scheme? rather than ly:music?, and because it does not
return music but *unspecified*, but in most use cases they should do
pretty much the same.
* and because I am inordinately proud of having managed to create
it. A tribute, in fact, to the quality of LilyPond's
documentation. A very fine line to draw between saying too much
(and losing people's attention) and saying too little.
Well, it depends on whether you _synthesized_ your example from
instructions that were reasonably comprehensible, or whether you pruned
an existing example down using guesswork.
The second approach would likely have been faster for this problem and
would say little about the quality of the documentation but rather about
your guessing skills and the amenability of LilyPond to guesswork (which
I consider important).
Which is actually rather common: one of the most frequent phenomena of
people asking for help because their Emacs broke is I don't know what
this code in my .emacs file does, I just copied it from somewhere.
The first approach would be slower, but of course says more about the
quality of documentation and your progress on the road to mastering the
more powerful depths of LilyPond.
--
David Kastrup
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Re: LilyPond Website Work (was: A thought on Windows Experience)
Am 06.12.2013 09:12, schrieb Janek Warchoł: 2013/12/6 Carl Peterson carlopeter...@gmail.com: Having worked for two corporations that have fairly extensive (and stringent) visual identity and branding guidelines (colors, typeface, formatting, etc.), I've learned that there are ways to make an obvious change between two things while still making them look like they go together. A suggestion from my colleague: for a long time he kept confusing LM and NR, and he said that it would be nice if (for example) they had different color schemes so that one will know where to look at things (hmm, i remember seeing it in the blue manual...). Janek As can be seen here (one more time): Am 07.12.2013 08:45, schrieb Janek Warchoł: 2013/12/7 David Bolton davidkbol...@gmail.com: ... And by the way, why are you using documentation for versions 2.16 and 2.17 while the file is marked as 2.14? This looks like a bad idea. best, Janek It may also be a good idea to find a way to visually distinguish between the stable and the development sections of website/manual? Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: lilypond.org Pondings
On Dec 6, 2013, at 5:06 PM, Urs Liska u...@openlilylib.orgmailto:u...@openlilylib.org wrote: Am 06.12.2013 22:51, schrieb SoundsFromSound: Urs Liska wrote Hi, What is the official definition of a ponding? http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2012-04/msg00533.html A website that uses LilyPond somehow... How about this? Seems kind of a big deal to me. :-P http://m.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Score ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
On 06/12/13 00:47, Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote: Since I am not a programmer, I am not sure why, yet when I double click a .ly file in Windows 7 Frescobaldi opens (rapidly) and displays the code. I would imagine that when you install Frescobaldi, it updates the Windows file config such that Frescobaldi becomes the default program with which to open files with the .ly extension. That _will_ be quick, because it's just opening a text file in a specialized text editor. It's not the same as running Lilypond itself on an input file. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
On 06/12/13 23:37, Janek Warchoł wrote: Well, i'm not familiar with this area, but keep in mind that one has to find a free, open-source solution that works for every platform we support (Win, Mac, various Unixes) and can be automated. It's not enough to go and create one installer - we need software that would recreate such installer, without manual intervention, for every release. I don't see why you assume that. There's no particular reason why you need an identical bundled install for every platform -- different platforms come with different expectations on the part of users, so it should be fine to have e.g. a Windows installer that bundles Lilypond with an appropriate IDE, whereas on GNU/Linux you just install Lilypond itself. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: LilyPond Website Work
2013/12/7 David Kastrup d...@gnu.org: It may also be a good idea to find a way to visually distinguish between the stable and the development sections of website/manual? Stable: solid color in the color coded area. Development: diagonally striped or patterned in some other way. +1 ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
2013/12/7 Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net: On 06/12/13 23:37, Janek Warchoł wrote: Well, i'm not familiar with this area, but keep in mind that one has to find a free, open-source solution that works for every platform we support (Win, Mac, various Unixes) and can be automated. It's not enough to go and create one installer - we need software that would recreate such installer, without manual intervention, for every release. I don't see why you assume that. There's no particular reason why you need an identical bundled install for every platform -- different platforms come with different expectations on the part of users, so it should be fine to have e.g. a Windows installer that bundles Lilypond with an appropriate IDE, whereas on GNU/Linux you just install Lilypond itself. you're probably right. as i said, i don't know this stuff. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net writes: On 06/12/13 00:47, Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote: Since I am not a programmer, I am not sure why, yet when I double click a .ly file in Windows 7 Frescobaldi opens (rapidly) and displays the code. I would imagine that when you install Frescobaldi, it updates the Windows file config such that Frescobaldi becomes the default program with which to open files with the .ly extension. That _will_ be quick, because it's just opening a text file in a specialized text editor. The last time I thought that was when I wanted to compare how much worse Emacs fared when using it for working on LaTeX files compared to a specialized simple text editor called Kile or something. Emacs hit in at over 16MB with my current work session (granted, containing quite more than just a LaTeX file). Then I started Kile and it swallowed about 90MB of memory, mostly because it pulled in half a dozen libraries and demons, getting those KDE parts up that it needed for operation. Don't underestimate specialized simple text editors. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
On 07/12/13 16:49, Janek Warchoł wrote: you're probably right. as i said, i don't know this stuff. Well, in this case I think it's not about what you know -- it's about what you think is best to do. If it turns out that the easiest way to organize things is to have one install bundle for all platforms, fine, but as things are you already have differences in how things are set up in the Windows vs. Linux installers. The thing to focus on probably just needs to be, what's the best way to serve a new user of Lilypond on this platform? And in that case, providing Frescobaldi as part of the default install on Windows makes sense (but as I said, with the option to deselect it there for users who have other preferences). ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
2013/12/7 Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net: On 07/12/13 16:49, Janek Warchoł wrote: you're probably right. as i said, i don't know this stuff. Well, in this case I think it's not about what you know -- it's about what you think is best to do. If it turns out that the easiest way to organize things is to have one install bundle for all platforms, fine, but as things are you already have differences in how things are set up in the Windows vs. Linux installers. The thing to focus on probably just needs to be, what's the best way to serve a new user of Lilypond on this platform? And in that case, providing Frescobaldi as part of the default install on Windows makes sense (but as I said, with the option to deselect it there for users who have other preferences). +1 ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
On 07/12/13 16:52, David Kastrup wrote: The last time I thought that was when I wanted to compare how much worse Emacs fared when using it for working on LaTeX files compared to a specialized simple text editor called Kile or something. Emacs hit in at over 16MB with my current work session (granted, containing quite more than just a LaTeX file). Then I started Kile and it swallowed about 90MB of memory, mostly because it pulled in half a dozen libraries and demons, getting those KDE parts up that it needed for operation. Don't underestimate specialized simple text editors. Indeed, but still small fry compared to what Lilypond can eat up on some scores :-) ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Hook like \AtEndDocument
- Original Message - From: David Kastrup d...@gnu.org Check out URL:http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Item?id=630. It's not clear to me why this is not in URL:http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16/Documentation/snippets/ since it is in the LilyPond tree under Documentation/snippets and it seems sort of pointless to maintain it there without making it available. Bug? -- David Kastrup Probably not. For snippets to actually reach the documentation, they must be tagged with one of the headings that are in the snippet document (e.g. Pitches, Rhythms, Expressive marks) - this one isn't, so it's not included in the docs. I guess there are 3 options: don't worry; add a tag that is a section of the document; or update the snippets document with the other used tags. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Hook like \AtEndDocument
Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net writes: - Original Message - From: David Kastrup d...@gnu.org Check out URL:http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Item?id=630. It's not clear to me why this is not in URL:http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16/Documentation/snippets/ since it is in the LilyPond tree under Documentation/snippets and it seems sort of pointless to maintain it there without making it available. Bug? Probably not. For snippets to actually reach the documentation, they must be tagged with one of the headings that are in the snippet document (e.g. Pitches, Rhythms, Expressive marks) - this one isn't, so it's not included in the docs. That explains what happens, but that does not make it a non-bug. It seems rather pointless to maintain the snippet separately from the LSR if we are never going to do anything with it. I guess there are 3 options: don't worry; add a tag that is a section of the document; or update the snippets document with the other used tags. Or have some catchall document where not just the selected snippets are shown. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
- Original Message - From: Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net To: Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com Cc: LilyPond Users lilypond-user@gnu.org Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 3:58 PM Subject: Re: A thought on Windows Experience On 07/12/13 16:49, Janek Warchoł wrote: you're probably right. as i said, i don't know this stuff. Well, in this case I think it's not about what you know -- it's about what you think is best to do. If it turns out that the easiest way to organize things is to have one install bundle for all platforms, fine, but as things are you already have differences in how things are set up in the Windows vs. Linux installers. The thing to focus on probably just needs to be, what's the best way to serve a new user of Lilypond on this platform? And in that case, providing Frescobaldi as part of the default install on Windows makes sense (but as I said, with the option to deselect it there for users who have other preferences). I've already said I oppose this, and I'll restate this. I have nothing against those who want to use Frescobaldi, and I'm sure it's a great app. I, however don't use it since I work in a completely different way. I would expect there to be a lot of other people in a similar position. I don't want to remember to deselect an option I'll never use every time I install LilyPond (Windows users - do you enjoy deselecting the Ask toolbar for every Java update?). And, more importantly, I tend to keep relatively up to date with LilyPond versions - I've got over 70 installed. Under no circumstances do I want to download Frescobaldi every time I download LilyPond. Links and recommendations - fine, great, wonderful. Bundled install? No way - that's when I'd stop being release manager and when I'd freeze at the current LilyPond install. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
2013/12/7 Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net: Links and recommendations - fine, great, wonderful. Bundled install? No way - that's when I'd stop being release manager and when I'd freeze at the current LilyPond install. We could have both bundled and unbundled installer. But right now noone seems to be willing to do the actual work, so we can drop this discussion anyway ;-) ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Hook like \AtEndDocument
- Original Message - From: David Kastrup d...@gnu.org To: Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net Cc: Lilypond-User lilypond-user@gnu.org Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 4:14 PM Subject: Re: Hook like \AtEndDocument Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net writes: - Original Message - From: David Kastrup d...@gnu.org Check out URL:http://lsr.dsi.unimi.it/LSR/Item?id=630. It's not clear to me why this is not in URL:http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16/Documentation/snippets/ since it is in the LilyPond tree under Documentation/snippets and it seems sort of pointless to maintain it there without making it available. Bug? Probably not. For snippets to actually reach the documentation, they must be tagged with one of the headings that are in the snippet document (e.g. Pitches, Rhythms, Expressive marks) - this one isn't, so it's not included in the docs. That explains what happens, but that does not make it a non-bug. It seems rather pointless to maintain the snippet separately from the LSR if we are never going to do anything with it. I guess there are 3 options: don't worry; add a tag that is a section of the document; or update the snippets document with the other used tags. Or have some catchall document where not just the selected snippets are shown. -- David Kastrup http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3709 -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Schikkers List
2013/12/5 Jan Nieuwenhuizen jann...@gnu.org What I meant was: what is required for the a minimal first useful user experience. Would a hardcoded tuning do, so that we can implement a tuning choosing mechanism later? yes, stringTunings = #guitar-tuning would be ok for most guitarists It is quite common to have pieces in lute tuning (one string a semitone off, don't remember which one right now) and also to turn the lowest string one note down occasionally. So I take it that my guess that 90% of all guitar pieces have standard tuning was too optimistic? It really depends on the music and kind of guitar. Alternate tunings are used mostly on acoustic guitar and especially in fingerstyle and flatpicking tecniques. I know very few pieces for electric guitar which use alternate tunings (usually 6th string dropped down to d or cis). ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
Am 07.12.2013 17:17, schrieb Janek Warchoł: 2013/12/7 Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net: Links and recommendations - fine, great, wonderful. Bundled install? No way - that's when I'd stop being release manager and when I'd freeze at the current LilyPond install. Why so categorical? How about finding compromises and solutions that work best for most people? We could have both bundled and unbundled installer. For example this compromise? But right now noone seems to be willing to do the actual work, so we can drop this discussion anyway ;-) It’s a pity when good discussions have to end like this. Joram ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
RE: A thought on Windows Experience
Mr. Wakeling, Thank you for the reply and the explanation. Seems to me to be a simple solution for some of the objections. Mark -Original Message- From: Joseph Rushton Wakeling [mailto:joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net] Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 7:45 AM To: Mark Stephen Mrotek; lilypond-user@gnu.org Subject: Re: A thought on Windows Experience On 06/12/13 00:47, Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote: Since I am not a programmer, I am not sure why, yet when I double click a .ly file in Windows 7 Frescobaldi opens (rapidly) and displays the code. I would imagine that when you install Frescobaldi, it updates the Windows file config such that Frescobaldi becomes the default program with which to open files with the .ly extension. That _will_ be quick, because it's just opening a text file in a specialized text editor. It's not the same as running Lilypond itself on an input file. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
- Original Message - From: Noeck noeck.marb...@gmx.de To: lilypond-user@gnu.org Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 4:37 PM Subject: Re: A thought on Windows Experience Am 07.12.2013 17:17, schrieb Janek Warchoł: 2013/12/7 Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net: Links and recommendations - fine, great, wonderful. Bundled install? No way - that's when I'd stop being release manager and when I'd freeze at the current LilyPond install. Why so categorical? How about finding compromises and solutions that work best for most people? Because we can't compromise on a boolean bundle or no-bundle. We could have both bundled and unbundled installer. For example this compromise? So we have to have even more large files residing on the server, when we already have enough. But right now noone seems to be willing to do the actual work, so we can drop this discussion anyway ;-) It’s a pity when good discussions have to end like this. Joram It's a pity that there's so much discussion and so few offers of actual implementation. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
On 07/12/13 17:14, Phil Holmes wrote: I've already said I oppose this, and I'll restate this. I think it's unfortunate that your opposition consists of just saying no, rather than trying to work out if there are ways to get what you want _and_ get what other people are suggesting. For example, your objection is based on the assumption that every time there's a new Lilypond release, you'll have to go to the Lilypond website, download a new installer, and install over the old version, remembering each time to deselect the install components you don't want. You assume that (for example) it's not possible for the installer to auto-detect your existing implementation and by default select only the installed components to upgrade; or that it's not possible for the Lilypond install to include an upgrade tool which alerts you to the existence of a new release and downloads and installs the updated components for you. All of this requires somebody to look into how to achieve these things, and to implement them. People shouldn't be discouraged from exploring these possibilities by pre-emptive judgements about what they will come up with. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
- Original Message - From: Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net To: Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net; Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com Cc: LilyPond Users lilypond-user@gnu.org Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 4:48 PM Subject: Re: A thought on Windows Experience On 07/12/13 17:14, Phil Holmes wrote: I've already said I oppose this, and I'll restate this. I think it's unfortunate that your opposition consists of just saying no, rather than trying to work out if there are ways to get what you want _and_ get what other people are suggesting. For example, your objection is based on the assumption that every time there's a new Lilypond release, you'll have to go to the Lilypond website, download a new installer, and install over the old version, remembering each time to deselect the install components you don't want. You assume that (for example) it's not possible for the installer to auto-detect your existing implementation and by default select only the installed components to upgrade; or that it's not possible for the Lilypond install to include an upgrade tool which alerts you to the existence of a new release and downloads and installs the updated components for you. All of this requires somebody to look into how to achieve these things, and to implement them. People shouldn't be discouraged from exploring these possibilities by pre-emptive judgements about what they will come up with. Patches welcome. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
On 07/12/13 17:55, Phil Holmes wrote: Patches welcome. Should I take that as conceding the argument in principle? :-) I know it's frustrating to see so much discussion and no code, but one reason people discuss so much is because they want to make sure there is a solution that will satisfy everyone. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
on marketing
FYI, found on the dreaded facebook Beethoven's 104 Piano Sonatas available in MuseScore thanks to Classicman! http://musescore.com/user/19710/sets/54311 Greetings, Jan -- Jan Nieuwenhuizen jann...@gnu.org | GNU LilyPond http://lilypond.org Freelance IT http://JoyofSource.com | Avatar® http://AvatarAcademy.nl ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
- Original Message - From: Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net To: Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net; Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com Cc: LilyPond Users lilypond-user@gnu.org Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 5:00 PM Subject: Re: A thought on Windows Experience On 07/12/13 17:55, Phil Holmes wrote: Patches welcome. Should I take that as conceding the argument in principle? :-) No. If, however, you actually offer a patch, then we could at least see whether what you're proposing is possible. Since it never seems to happen, I can only presume it's not. I know it's frustrating to see so much discussion and no code, but one reason people discuss so much is because they want to make sure there is a solution that will satisfy everyone. It seems that a number of people here only discuss and never contribute. That's a waste of my time reading it in case there is something valuable, which seems rare. Remember you can never satisfy all of the people all of the time. As it stands, I'm the one of only two people who has actually worked on improving the windows experience over the last few years. I'm now getting thoroughly bored with pointless discussion and no action and so not likely to do any more myself or continue to read this thread. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: on marketing
On 07/12/13 18:07, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote: Beethoven's 104 Piano Sonatas That would be 32 :-) But 104 separate movements in total ... ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: lilypond.org Pondings
Am 07.12.2013 16:07, schrieb Daniel Rosen: On Dec 6, 2013, at 5:06 PM, Urs Liska u...@openlilylib.org mailto:u...@openlilylib.org wrote: Am 06.12.2013 22:51, schrieb SoundsFromSound: Urs Liska wrote Hi, What is the official definition of a ponding? http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2012-04/msg00533.html A website that uses LilyPond somehow... How about this? Seems kind of a big deal to me. :-P http://m.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Score Definitely! Mike, are you still responsible for this or how will new Pondings be included? ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
Am 07.12.2013 17:41, schrieb Mark Stephen Mrotek: I would imagine that when you install Frescobaldi, it updates the Windows file config such that Frescobaldi becomes the default program with which to open files with the .ly extension. Yes, that's the case. I just did an install of Frescobaldi on Windows to have a look. And at one point there was a checkbox to assign Frescobaldi as default program for .ly files. Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
2013/12/5 Ryan McClure ryanmichaelmccl...@gmail.com: A quick question--sorry to clog the mailling list--but what are the rules concerning copyright with this sort of thing? Would all works have to be public domain/approved by the copyright holder? I have explicit permission from the author of Eja, Mater Finale engraving for using it in this comparison. As for the other materials, they are short fragments and fair use (or critical/scholarly purposes) laws should apply. 2013/12/6 David Kastrup d...@gnu.org: Shane Brandes sh...@grayskies.net writes: The U.S. has the concept of fair use see 17 U.S.C. § 107 But we want LilyPond to be distributable in more than just the U.S.A. Who said that i want to make these comparisons part of LilyPond itself? I'm talking about creating a library of resources related to lilypond, but they don't have to be in the lilypond itself. 2013/12/6 Carl Peterson carlopeter...@gmail.com: In particular, I would say that anything used should be incontrovertibly in the public domain (i.e., the older, the better). This is just impossible with comparisons like these ones - the finale/sibelius engravings cannot be old enough to be in public domain. best, Janek ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
On Sat, Dec 7, 2013 at 1:03 PM, Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.comwrote: 2013/12/6 Carl Peterson carlopeter...@gmail.com: In particular, I would say that anything used should be incontrovertibly in the public domain (i.e., the older, the better). This is just impossible with comparisons like these ones - the finale/sibelius engravings cannot be old enough to be in public domain. Indeed. However, if someone can make new engravings from music that is in public domain and release or license them to the project, that's a different story. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
2013/12/7 Carl Peterson carlopeter...@gmail.com: On Sat, Dec 7, 2013 at 1:03 PM, Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com wrote: 2013/12/6 Carl Peterson carlopeter...@gmail.com: In particular, I would say that anything used should be incontrovertibly in the public domain (i.e., the older, the better). This is just impossible with comparisons like these ones - the finale/sibelius engravings cannot be old enough to be in public domain. Indeed. However, if someone can make new engravings from music that is in public domain and release or license them to the project, that's a different story. That'd be nice, but: - virtually noone has time to do this - there's actually a point in making a comparison with publicly available scores: compare LilyPond output to what you can get from a publisher ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
2013/12/6 Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakeling@webdrak What Finale version are you using to generate these examples? They weren't created by me; i don't know the version (but the Eja Mater is probably 2003 or 2005). I hate to say this, but from my point of view (as a Lilypond user and enthusiast) I think that rather than favouring Lilypond, this rather supports the contention that in general Finale's output is good enough. I presume what you have there is untweaked Finale engraving, and many of the issues you identify are very minor or most likely easily fixed. Have you looked at Eja Mater awful Finale.pdf? Do you consider the issues marked in red minor? They actually make it very difficult to sing the rhythm correctly! If you want a real comparison, give two expert users -- one of Finale, one of Lilypond -- the same score and give them an hour to engrave as much as they can, with the goal that every single bar they engrave is perfect. Then compare what they achieve. Do you have a spare expert Finale user? Because the problem is that on the *LilyPond* mailing list it's hard to find expert Finale users. We'd have to hire someone, and that costs money. Janek ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: on marketing
On Sat, 2013-12-07 at 18:11 +0100, Joseph Rushton Wakeling wrote: On 07/12/13 18:07, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote: Beethoven's 104 Piano Sonatas That would be 32 :-) But 104 separate movements in total ... Is that because MuseScore cannot handle scores with several movements, I wonder. Contrast that with a LilyPond score with multiple movements, appendices, table of contents ... I generated a few scores with all that via Denemo a while back. But still people carry on using MuseScore. Richard ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
- Original Message - From: Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com To: Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net Cc: LilyPond Users lilypond-user@gnu.org Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 6:18 PM Subject: Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials 2013/12/6 Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakeling@webdrak What Finale version are you using to generate these examples? They weren't created by me; i don't know the version (but the Eja Mater is probably 2003 or 2005). I hate to say this, but from my point of view (as a Lilypond user and enthusiast) I think that rather than favouring Lilypond, this rather supports the contention that in general Finale's output is good enough. I presume what you have there is untweaked Finale engraving, and many of the issues you identify are very minor or most likely easily fixed. Have you looked at Eja Mater awful Finale.pdf? Do you consider the issues marked in red minor? They actually make it very difficult to sing the rhythm correctly! If you want a real comparison, give two expert users -- one of Finale, one of Lilypond -- the same score and give them an hour to engrave as much as they can, with the goal that every single bar they engrave is perfect. Then compare what they achieve. Do you have a spare expert Finale user? Because the problem is that on the *LilyPond* mailing list it's hard to find expert Finale users. We'd have to hire someone, and that costs money. Janek I have often offered to create Sibelius 7 versions. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: on marketing
Richard Shann writes: On Sat, 2013-12-07 at 18:11 +0100, Joseph Rushton Wakeling wrote: On 07/12/13 18:07, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote: Beethoven's 104 Piano Sonatas That would be 32 :-) But 104 separate movements in total ... Is that because MuseScore cannot handle scores with several movements, I wonder. Contrast that with a LilyPond score with multiple movements, appendices, table of contents ... I generated a few scores with all that via Denemo a while back. But still people carry on using MuseScore. See title. Jan -- Jan Nieuwenhuizen jann...@gnu.org | GNU LilyPond http://lilypond.org Freelance IT http://JoyofSource.com | Avatar® http://AvatarAcademy.nl ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
RE: on marketing
-Original Message- From: Joseph Rushton Wakeling [mailto:joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net] Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 12:12 PM To: lilypond-user@gnu.org Subject: Re: on marketing On 07/12/13 18:07, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote: Beethoven's 104 Piano Sonatas That would be 32 :-) But 104 separate movements in total ... Including two from the sonata for four hands op. 6. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
On 07/12/13 19:18, Janek Warchoł wrote: Have you looked at Eja Mater awful Finale.pdf? Do you consider the issues marked in red minor? They actually make it very difficult to sing the rhythm correctly! That one example in bar 69 is very ouch, but it's the kind of problem that would be an issue for sightreading only -- you'd fix it and move on. I agree it's nastier for choral singing (where everyone has the score) compared to instrumental playing, where you'd have just the single part and so only the conductor would have to handle that rhythmic clash. I have to say that I do wonder if that was user error, though -- because I never came up with such a catastrophic misalignment when I was using Finale. At a guess, perhaps caused by the user entering more notes than could fit in the bar, then deleting some of them, or otherwise correcting note lengths? The one in bar 80 doesn't strike me as much of an issue. An irritation but not in any way a serious problem, because it isn't out of sync with anything else horizontally. I was far more concerned about the placement of the dots on the dotted 8ths, because that _did_ seem like something that could jar the reading of the single line parts, even when you know the rhythm. I don't mean to dismiss your concerns here, but I think that these problems are small fry in the scale of the kinds of illegibility or ambiguity or simply reading difficulty that there can be in parts put in front of musicians. You probably haven't seen some of the hand-written parts (from reputable publishers!) that I have ... :-) Do you have a spare expert Finale user? Because the problem is that on the *LilyPond* mailing list it's hard to find expert Finale users. We'd have to hire someone, and that costs money. No, but I imagine that if you went on the Finale mailing list and said, Hey, we're trying out this challenge as part of a drive to test and improve our usability, anyone up for it? you'd get some volunteers. You don't need a super-hot-whizzkid-who-works-for-Bärenreiter, you just need someone who is competent and capable and knows their way around the software. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
Janek Warchoł wrote 2013/12/6 Joseph Rushton Wakeling lt;joseph.wakeling@webdrak gt; What Finale version are you using to generate these examples? They weren't created by me; i don't know the version (but the Eja Mater is probably 2003 or 2005). I hate to say this, but from my point of view (as a Lilypond user and enthusiast) I think that rather than favouring Lilypond, this rather supports the contention that in general Finale's output is good enough. I presume what you have there is untweaked Finale engraving, and many of the issues you identify are very minor or most likely easily fixed. Have you looked at Eja Mater awful Finale.pdf? Do you consider the issues marked in red minor? They actually make it very difficult to sing the rhythm correctly! If you want a real comparison, give two expert users -- one of Finale, one of Lilypond -- the same score and give them an hour to engrave as much as they can, with the goal that every single bar they engrave is perfect. Then compare what they achieve. Do you have a spare expert Finale user? Because the problem is that on the *LilyPond* mailing list it's hard to find expert Finale users. We'd have to hire someone, and that costs money. Janek ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@ https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user I could assist with Finale 2014 though I hesitate to call myself an 'expert' in Finale. Power user maybe, but no expert. Does that help? - composer | sound designer LilyPond Tutorials (for beginners) -- http://bit.ly/bcl-lilypond -- View this message in context: http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/engraving-comparisons-and-other-promotional-materials-tp155133p155325.html Sent from the User mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: on marketing
On Sat, Dec 7, 2013 at 1:19 PM, Richard Shann rich...@rshann.plus.comwrote: On Sat, 2013-12-07 at 18:11 +0100, Joseph Rushton Wakeling wrote: On 07/12/13 18:07, Jan Nieuwenhuizen wrote: Beethoven's 104 Piano Sonatas That would be 32 :-) But 104 separate movements in total ... Is that because MuseScore cannot handle scores with several movements, I wonder. Contrast that with a LilyPond score with multiple movements, appendices, table of contents ... I generated a few scores with all that via Denemo a while back. But still people carry on using MuseScore. Richard Richard, I use MuseScore for quick and dirty composition work...I'm not trying to make it pretty, I'm just trying to get it on a page and be able to directly manipulate it. I've done that with Finale when I've had some version of it installed on my computer. I can do that with MuseScore. I tried a couple of times to do it with Denemo and really didn't have a good experience. Part of it is the very menu-centric approach (too cluttered), but in general, it just wasn't intuitive to me as a GUI. MuseScore does well enough for what I do with it. I think that initial experience with Denemo can be very overwhelming, particularly if we're talking about someone coming from a Finale-like experience. I've used Finale and a broad selection of other music tools (both composition and production), and Denemo was just...different. MuseScore is different from Finale, but it's alike enough to be a much shallower learning curve. To bring us back to Marketing, it's well and good to talk about all the things that LilyPond or Denemo or Frescobaldi can do that Finale and/or Sibelius can't. However, if we're looking at convincing people to switch from Finale and/or Sibelius to the LilyPond sphere of influence, we have to be able to show them that everything Finale can do, LilyPond can do, and can do as well, if not better. Urs put together a good example of this when he demonstrated the ease of constructing the rhythm patterns from the theory book. But admittedly, that's a high-level/obscure case that a lot of people, frankly, won't see as being applicable to their use case. Carl ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
On 07/12/13 19:39, SoundsFromSound wrote: I could assist with Finale 2014 though I hesitate to call myself an 'expert' in Finale. Power user maybe, but no expert. Does that help? I think that power user would be fine for the kind of test run I proposed. I mean, so long as you don't let your affection for Lilypond bias your performance ... :-) After all, the fundamental purpose of a trial like this is to have some kind of estimate of the relative productivity that capable users of the software can enjoy. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
Am 07.12.2013 19:39, schrieb Joseph Rushton Wakeling: No, but I imagine that if you went on the Finale mailing list and said, Hey, we're trying out this challenge as part of a drive to test and improve our usability, anyone up for it? you'd get some volunteers. One potential issue I'm seeing with this (I have already thought about this too) is: I think we all want LilyPond to be the best tool around, but IISC we're all talking about a serious comparison that also may server to teach us what to improve. But once we're going to compete with people from other tools' mailing lists it will probably become a real (and therefore less informative) competition. Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
Am 06.12.2013 17:11, schrieb Joseph Rushton Wakeling: On 05/12/13 21:18, Janek Warchoł wrote: as promised, here are engraving comparisons that i hand out to musicians i meet: What Finale version are you using to generate these examples? I hate to say this, but from my point of view (as a Lilypond user and enthusiast) I think that rather than favouring Lilypond, this rather supports the contention that in general Finale's output is good enough. I presume what you have there is untweaked Finale engraving, and many of the issues you identify are very minor or most likely easily fixed. I have to throw in a comparison: http://lilypond.ursliska.de/uploads/pics/07_02.png http://lilypond.ursliska.de/uploads/pics/finale2008_one-system.png These are an excerpt from a copyright piece, but I've got permission to display in the context of a tutorial and of a blog post (they're in my plain text essay on the blog). I think this is a very good example for the fact that LilyPond often manages to produce legible layout even if it fails. Actually the only thing that's _really_ wrong with this example is the long slur - but that's of the kind I wouldn't expect any automated engraving to manage. Finale (admittedly 2008 - but LilyPond is 2.13 too IIRC) managed to clash about every conceivable grob in this case. Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Jniz music notation software
Hello Just to inform you that Jniz is a new free software designed for musicians as a support tool to the musical composition. It is using Lilypond to export in midi, lilypond formats. The website: http://www.jniz.org Hope you will enjoy it.. All the best Bruno Grandjean Jniz dev ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
On 07/12/13 20:05, Urs Liska wrote: I have to throw in a comparison: http://lilypond.ursliska.de/uploads/pics/07_02.png http://lilypond.ursliska.de/uploads/pics/finale2008_one-system.png These are an excerpt from a copyright piece, but I've got permission to display in the context of a tutorial and of a blog post (they're in my plain text essay on the blog). I think this is a very good example for the fact that LilyPond often manages to produce legible layout even if it fails. Actually the only thing that's _really_ wrong with this example is the long slur - but that's of the kind I wouldn't expect any automated engraving to manage. Finale (admittedly 2008 - but LilyPond is 2.13 too IIRC) managed to clash about every conceivable grob in this case. Yes, but you're comparing default behaviour to default behaviour. I think we can all agree that Lilypond almost invariably wins in that comparison. The reason I proposed a competent-user-vs-competent-user comparison is that a competent user wouldn't leave those clashes in place but would manually tweak them. If those manual tweaks are quick-and-easy to make, then those faults of default behaviour may be considered much less serious. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
Am 07.12.2013 20:18, schrieb Joseph Rushton Wakeling: On 07/12/13 20:05, Urs Liska wrote: I have to throw in a comparison: http://lilypond.ursliska.de/uploads/pics/07_02.png http://lilypond.ursliska.de/uploads/pics/finale2008_one-system.png These are an excerpt from a copyright piece, but I've got permission to display in the context of a tutorial and of a blog post (they're in my plain text essay on the blog). I think this is a very good example for the fact that LilyPond often manages to produce legible layout even if it fails. Actually the only thing that's _really_ wrong with this example is the long slur - but that's of the kind I wouldn't expect any automated engraving to manage. Finale (admittedly 2008 - but LilyPond is 2.13 too IIRC) managed to clash about every conceivable grob in this case. Yes, but you're comparing default behaviour to default behaviour. I think we can all agree that Lilypond almost invariably wins in that comparison. The reason I proposed a competent-user-vs-competent-user comparison is that a competent user wouldn't leave those clashes in place but would manually tweak them. If those manual tweaks are quick-and-easy to make, then those faults of default behaviour may be considered much less serious. You may have a look at this and the following pages: http://lilypond.ursliska.de/notensatz/lilypond-tutorials/tackle-complex-tasks/part-2-improving-the-output.html It is quite outdated, but it shows that the steps to fix the score in LilyPond are quite manageable (in particular with \shape or the new \shapeII), while I think fixing the Finale part (reliably) will be much more problematic, at least with this kind of music where the complexity leads to that amount of catastrophic results as in the Finale version. Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
On 07/12/13 19:54, Urs Liska wrote: But once we're going to compete with people from other tools' mailing lists it will probably become a real (and therefore less informative) competition. Well, if you couch it in terms along the lines of, Hey, we're just trying to improve our software here, we all want the best software and make it a friendly game rather than a Hey, we're better than you! exercise, I don't see that it need get too serious (at least in the sense of unfriendly competition). Anyway, there's a limit to how competitive it can get simply by virtue of the fact that Lilypond can be tweaked in response to how it does in such a competition, whereas with Finale, the development team has to take notice :-) Personally I would approach the Finale community with an invitation that gives the impression that you expect to come out worse in this comparison (because after all, it's about productivity rather than default engraving quality), but that you hope to learn something from the exercise. Then, if it's true, appropriate gratitude can be shown and lessons can be learned -- while if Lilypond comes out ahead (in which case, it should also be approached with humility rather than triumphalism), hopefully a few Finale users will start taking Lilypond more seriously. The important thing to recognize is that Finale and Sibelius users are not the competition. They're fellow dreamers about excellence in music notation software. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: engraving comparisons and other promotional materials
On 07/12/13 20:21, Urs Liska wrote: I think fixing the Finale part (reliably) will be much more problematic, at least with this kind of music where the complexity leads to that amount of catastrophic results as in the Finale version. That's why you want to run the test, to see if a good and enthusiastic Finale user can rise to the challenge! :-) ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: LilyPond Website Work
On 12/7/2013 6:39 AM, Urs Liska wrote: As can be seen here (one more time): Am 07.12.2013 08:45, schrieb Janek Warchoł: 2013/12/7 David Bolton davidkbol...@gmail.com: ... And by the way, why are you using documentation for versions 2.16 and 2.17 while the file is marked as 2.14? This looks like a bad idea. best, Janek It may also be a good idea to find a way to visually distinguish between the stable and the development sections of website/manual? Maybe it is helpful to know that I got to the manual page from a web search. I realized that I was on the wrong version because of the URL, but there is no easy way to get to the right version. For example, manually changing the version number in the URL never seems to work (it gives 404 errors), and there are no links on the page to the equivalent documentation for other versions. My recommendations would be: 1. Use a consistent URL for the latest stable version of LilyPond documentation. That way web searches and other pages across the web link to the latest version instead of ancient versions of the documentation. 2. On old or unstable documentation include a link to the equivalent page in the stable version of the documentation. David ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: LilyPond Website Work
On 12/7/2013 9:48 AM, Janek Warchoł wrote: 2013/12/7 David Kastrup d...@gnu.org: It may also be a good idea to find a way to visually distinguish between the stable and the development sections of website/manual? Stable: solid color in the color coded area. Development: diagonally striped or patterned in some other way. +1 For me, it had more to do with the difficult of moving to the place I was suppose to be (and assuming that the current page was good enough). For comparison MuseScore only shows the latest version online (with references inline to old versions when necessary). Finale supports hacking of the URL. For example visit the following page and then replace 2012 with 2011: http://www.finalemusic.com/UserManuals/Finale2012Mac/Content/Finale/MMMTRDLG.htm Microsoft Office shows version information in the search results: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/word-help/results.aspx?qu=insert+a+pictureex=1origin=HP005189866 David ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: LilyPond Website Work
On Sat, Dec 7, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net wrote: My recommendations would be: 1. Use a consistent URL for the latest stable version of LilyPond documentation. That way web searches and other pages across the web link to the latest version instead of ancient versions of the documentation. Unfortunately, this is not possible. The released stable version is currently 2.16. However, it seems that a number of packagers are significantly behind this, using 2.14. We can't link to a single stable version when there are 2 or more. I think the suggestion is basically (until 2.18 is released) to use the .htaccess file to redirect http://lilypond.org/doc/stable -- http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16 http://lilypond.org/doc/dev -- http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.17 When 2.18 is released, then the .htaccess file is modified to redirect http://lilypond.org/doc/stable -- http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16 Since this would be defined on the .htaccess, should be transparent to the user and requires no duplication of files. If you want to get really picky, there are still things I've seen using 2.12. I don't know that means we have keep track of what versions are packaged with what. After all, if someone posts something here that doesn't use 2.16 or 2.17, almost uniformly, it will be strongly suggested to that individual that they ought to update to the latest. 2. On old or unstable documentation include a link to the equivalent page in the stable version of the documentation. Generally, this does work - replacing the version number in the URL brings up an older version of the manual. If it is a 404, it must be that this page did not exist in the old version. If you're using an outdated version, it might make sense to download the appropriate PDF manuals. I believe the suggestion is to go in the other direction---if the search happens to drop you into an older version, provide a link to the most recent. The problem here, I think, is technical. Short of .htaccess or some other server-side wrapper (similar to what many free web hosting providers do) that will put a banner saying, This is not the latest version. Click here to go to..., because of the nature of updating the website, I don't know how practical this is, to go through and recompile all the prior versions of documentation to provide convenient links. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Reducing horizontal spacing
On 12/7/2013 2:16 AM, Janek Warchoł wrote: David, 2013/12/7 David Bolton davidkbol...@gmail.com: Janek, I also experimented with a context statement that matched the first documentation page, but I couldn't get it to work (see attached). That's probably because you are using LilyPond version that doesn't match the documentation version you're using. When i tried compiling it with latest development version, it worked correctly. hth, Janek Thank you for your help. I got a working version and updated the file on Wikimedia: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:The_eight_musical_modes.png David ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: A thought on Windows Experience
El 07/12/2013 15:48, Joseph Rushton Wakeling joseph.wakel...@webdrake.net escribió: I don't see why you assume that. There's no particular reason why you need an identical bundled install for every platform -- different platforms come with different expectations on the part of users, so it should be fine to have e.g. a Windows installer that bundles Lilypond with an appropriate IDE, whereas on GNU/Linux you just install Lilypond itself. +1 ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Schikkers List
2013/12/5 Federico Bruni fedel...@gmail.com: When you enter the fret number, the program can find the right pitch combining string + fret number (and taking the tuning into account). Hi Federico, How should this ever work? Thinking of modulations/enhormonics. -Harm ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
