Re: Title Position Off

[Lukas-Fabian Moser]

Am 22.01.19 um 02:13 schrieb Aaron Hill:

I forgot \with-dimensions-from was a thing:


#(define-markup-command (faux-raise layout props amount arg) (number? 
markup?)

  (interpret-markup layout props
    (markup #:with-dimensions-from arg (#:raise amount arg



Now that's immensely useful! Of course not for everyday use, but 
sometimes you want to tell Lilypond: Trust me, I know what I'm doing, 
trust translate it a bit with respect to the position you'd normally 
use. (Similar to the extra-offset property for grobs).


So, one might add:

#(define-markup-command (extra-offset layout props amounts arg) 
(number-pair? markup?)

   (interpret-markup layout props
 (markup #:with-dimensions-from arg (#:translate amounts arg

Best
Lukas


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Re: Title Position Off

[Jacques Menu]

Hello Reggie,

Why can't you just show us an MWE (Minimum Working Example) of your Lily code? 
That would make helping you so much easier!

JM

> Le 22 janv. 2019 à 04:57, Aaron Hill  a écrit :
> 
> On 2019-01-21 6:17 pm, Reggie wrote:
>> For your information, top-system-spacing has zero effect on my Score. I have
>> my margins set all to a basic .75\in and this top-system-spacing has no
>> visible change. Why is this? What causes top-system-spacing to not show any
>> change? How should I be a detective and solve this? :))
> 
> Is there any \markup above the \score?  If so, then top-system-spacing will 
> not apply.  Instead, what will matter is a combination of top-markup-spacing 
> and markup-system-spacing.
> 
> Consider the following:
> 
> 
> \version "2.19.82"
> 
> \paper {
>  #(set-paper-size "a6")
>  top-margin = 50\pt % eqv. to 10 staff spaces at default staff size
>  left-margin = 50\pt
>  indent = 0
>  tagline = ##f
>  ragged-bottom = ##t
> 
>  top-markup-spacing.basic-distance = 10 % staff spaces are the units here
>  top-system-spacing.basic-distance = 30
>  markup-system-spacing.basic-distance = 20
>  score-markup-spacing.basic-distance = 15
> }
> 
> ruler = \tweak color #red \tweak stencil #(lambda (grob)
>  (ly:make-stencil (ly:stencil-expr (apply ly:stencil-add
>(map (lambda (n) (let ((t (if (zero? (modulo n 10)) 0.3 0.1))
>   (x (+ 5 (if (zero? (modulo n 5)) 7 0)
>   (if (zero? (modulo n 10)) 3 0
>   (make-line-stencil t (- x) n x n)))
>  (iota 61 -20 '(0 . 1) '(0 . 0))) \etc
> 
> \markup { \fontsize #6 "top markup" }
> \new Staff { \mark \markup "after markup score" \ruler b'1 }
> \markup { \fontsize #6 "after score markup" }
> \pageBreak
> \new Staff { \mark \markup "top score" \ruler b'1 }
> \markup { \fontsize #6 "after score markup" }
> 
> 
> This replaces the whole notes on each staff with a bright red ruler measuring 
> in staff spaces.  You should be able to confirm all of the spacing distances 
> as specified in the \paper block.
> 
> 
> -- Aaron Hill
> 
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Re: Title Position Off

[Aaron Hill]

On 2019-01-21 6:17 pm, Reggie wrote:
For your information, top-system-spacing has zero effect on my Score. I 
have

my margins set all to a basic .75\in and this top-system-spacing has no
visible change. Why is this? What causes top-system-spacing to not show 
any

change? How should I be a detective and solve this? :))


Is there any \markup above the \score?  If so, then top-system-spacing 
will not apply.  Instead, what will matter is a combination of 
top-markup-spacing and markup-system-spacing.


Consider the following:


\version "2.19.82"

\paper {
  #(set-paper-size "a6")
  top-margin = 50\pt % eqv. to 10 staff spaces at default staff size
  left-margin = 50\pt
  indent = 0
  tagline = ##f
  ragged-bottom = ##t

  top-markup-spacing.basic-distance = 10 % staff spaces are the units 
here

  top-system-spacing.basic-distance = 30
  markup-system-spacing.basic-distance = 20
  score-markup-spacing.basic-distance = 15
}

ruler = \tweak color #red \tweak stencil #(lambda (grob)
  (ly:make-stencil (ly:stencil-expr (apply ly:stencil-add
(map (lambda (n) (let ((t (if (zero? (modulo n 10)) 0.3 0.1))
   (x (+ 5 (if (zero? (modulo n 5)) 7 0)
   (if (zero? (modulo n 10)) 3 0
   (make-line-stencil t (- x) n x n)))
  (iota 61 -20 '(0 . 1) '(0 . 0))) \etc

\markup { \fontsize #6 "top markup" }
\new Staff { \mark \markup "after markup score" \ruler b'1 }
\markup { \fontsize #6 "after score markup" }
\pageBreak
\new Staff { \mark \markup "top score" \ruler b'1 }
\markup { \fontsize #6 "after score markup" }


This replaces the whole notes on each staff with a bright red ruler 
measuring in staff spaces.  You should be able to confirm all of the 
spacing distances as specified in the \paper block.



-- Aaron Hill

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Re: Title Position Off

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Reggie,

> top-system-spacing has zero effect on my Score. I have
> my margins set all to a basic .75\in and this top-system-spacing has no
> visible change. Why is this? What causes top-system-spacing to not show any
> change? How should I be a detective and solve this? :))

Compile the snippet below.
Do you not see that the second page of the second score has more top padding?

Cheers,
Kieren.

%%%  SNIPPET BEGINS
\version "2.19.80"

\paper {
  top-margin = 0.75\in
  ragged-bottom = ##t
  top-markup-spacing.padding = #12
}

\header {
  title = "My Masterpiece"
}

\bookpart {
  \score {
{ c''1 \pageBreak c''1 }
  }
}

\bookpart {
  \paper {
top-system-spacing.padding = #48
  }
  \score {
{ c''1 \pageBreak c''1 }
  }
}
%%%  SNIPPET ENDS



Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: Title Position Off

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Reggie,

> Is there a way to only adjust the first page top-margin

What I suggested will do that, because top-markup-spacing (essentially, the 
"first page" top spacing) is independent of top-system-spacing (essentially, 
the "second and subsequent page" top spacing).

Cheers,
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: Title Position Off

[Reggie]

Kieren MacMillan wrote
> Hi Reggie,
> 
>> Nothing is above my title. I have a normal Piece of music. I
>> would like to have my title move UP vertically only but not move my 
>> music
>> at all. The top system and beyond is just fine.
> 
> Then you need to decrease top-markup-spacing (to reduce the gap between
> the top margin and your title) and compensate by increasing
> markup-system-spacing (so that the first system stays where it currently
> is).
> 
> Still no need to involve custom titles.  =)
> 
> Hope that helps!
> Kieren.
> 
> 
> Kieren MacMillan, composer
> ‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
> ‣ email: 

> info@

> 
> 
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For your information, top-system-spacing has zero effect on my Score. I have
my margins set all to a basic .75\in and this top-system-spacing has no
visible change. Why is this? What causes top-system-spacing to not show any
change? How should I be a detective and solve this? :))




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Re: Title Position Off

[Reggie]

Aaron Hill wrote
> A side commentary, if you would not mind.  You have posted a few times 
> asking for features that seem to show a focus on WYSIWYG-style 
> activities.  You are probably used to using tools that let you click and 
> drag items around on a virtual paper, placing things wherever you see 
> fit.  This is very un-LilyPond, which is almost certainly why you are 
> experiencing frustration.  To use LilyPond is to learn and adopt a new 
> way of thinking about music engraving.
> 
> Arbitrary positioning of items is not something typically done in 
> LilyPond, although there are some ways to facilitate the task.  Since 
> this is not the "normal" (as LilyPond defines it) way of doing things, 
> it must be expected that you as the user will have to do the lifting, 
> however heavy it may be.
> 
> My point here is that you may stand your best chance at success by 
> taking a step back from the work you are doing and reconsider your 
> approach.  If I looked at my music and said, "I think the title is too 
> far down on the paper", my experience tells me that the solution is to 
> change the spacing between the top of the paper and the header block.  
> The \paper block has top-margin and top-markup-spacing to adjust for 
> this.
> 
> -- Aaron Hill

I don't mind no that was really actually helpful to hear you say thank you
yes I believe you are correct. My eyes are open now. Sorry. Is there a way
to only adjust the first page top-margin or must I do what Kieren suggested
which is "" then you need to decrease top-markup-spacing (to reduce the gap
between the top margin and your title) and compensate by increasing
markup-system-spacing (so that the first system stays where it currently
is).
 ""

Sorry thank you.




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Re: Title Position Off

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Reggie,

> Nothing is above my title. I have a normal Piece of music. I
> would like to have my title move UP vertically only but not move my  music
> at all. The top system and beyond is just fine.

Then you need to decrease top-markup-spacing (to reduce the gap between the top 
margin and your title) and compensate by increasing markup-system-spacing (so 
that the first system stays where it currently is).

Still no need to involve custom titles.  =)

Hope that helps!
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: Title Position Off

[Aaron Hill]

On 2019-01-21 4:35 pm, Aaron Hill wrote:


\version "2.19.82"

#(define-markup-command (faux-raise layout props amount arg) (number? 
markup?)

  (let* ((sten (interpret-markup layout props arg))
 (xex (ly:stencil-extent sten X))
 (yex (ly:stencil-extent sten Y)))
(interpret-markup layout props
  (markup #:with-dimensions xex yex (#:raise amount arg)

\markup { Some \faux-raise #1 "\faux-raised" "text" }
\markup { Some \raise #1 "\raised" "text" }
\markup { Some \raise #1 "\raised" "text" }
\markup { Some \faux-raise #1 "\faux-raised" "text" }



I forgot \with-dimensions-from was a thing:


#(define-markup-command (faux-raise layout props amount arg) (number? 
markup?)

  (interpret-markup layout props
(markup #:with-dimensions-from arg (#:raise amount arg


-- Aaron Hill

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Re: Title Position Off

[Aaron Hill]

On 2019-01-21 3:30 pm, Reggie wrote:

Karlin High wrote

On 1/21/2019 5:02 PM, Reggie wrote:

I literally want just move up the TITLE and not touch anything
else.


Could you attach an image or PDF showing the form of your current
layout? I'm curious about what is currently above the title.


You confuse me. Nothing is above my title. I have a normal Piece of 
music. I
would like to have my title move UP vertically only but not move my  
music

at all. The top system and beyond is just fine.

His raise markup answer does not do that sorry but it's wrong. It moves
music as well somehow. Why can't you just show me in the manual where 
it
teaches us how to move title TEXT only up or down? No commands I found 
does

exactly that. You?


The "somehow" you wrote above indicates that you have not yet learned 
how LilyPond handles objects and layout.  There should be no mystery as 
to why raising a markup adjusts things the way it does.


Raising a bit of text in markup only moves it "upwards" relative to the 
other elements within the markup.  However, this changes the overall 
vertical height of the entire markup.  As such, LilyPond must 
accommodate the extra height.  This forces the rest of music further 
down the page.


Why not shift the markup upwards?  Well, there could be things there 
already.  And by things, I might mean the top of the paper.


If you really wanted \raise to shift an item without changing the 
height, consider the following hack:



\version "2.19.82"

#(define-markup-command (faux-raise layout props amount arg) (number? 
markup?)

  (let* ((sten (interpret-markup layout props arg))
 (xex (ly:stencil-extent sten X))
 (yex (ly:stencil-extent sten Y)))
(interpret-markup layout props
  (markup #:with-dimensions xex yex (#:raise amount arg)

\markup { Some \faux-raise #1 "\faux-raised" "text" }
\markup { Some \raise #1 "\raised" "text" }
\markup { Some \raise #1 "\raised" "text" }
\markup { Some \faux-raise #1 "\faux-raised" "text" }


Before you go off and actually use this hack, be sure you have 
acknowledged the major drawbacks.  The first line clips the bounds of 
the image and the last line overlaps the third.  This markup command 
works because it lies to LilyPond about the actual extents of the raised 
markup.  As such, LilyPond has no way to avoid clipped or overlapping 
stencils.




A side commentary, if you would not mind.  You have posted a few times 
asking for features that seem to show a focus on WYSIWYG-style 
activities.  You are probably used to using tools that let you click and 
drag items around on a virtual paper, placing things wherever you see 
fit.  This is very un-LilyPond, which is almost certainly why you are 
experiencing frustration.  To use LilyPond is to learn and adopt a new 
way of thinking about music engraving.


Arbitrary positioning of items is not something typically done in 
LilyPond, although there are some ways to facilitate the task.  Since 
this is not the "normal" (as LilyPond defines it) way of doing things, 
it must be expected that you as the user will have to do the lifting, 
however heavy it may be.


My point here is that you may stand your best chance at success by 
taking a step back from the work you are doing and reconsider your 
approach.  If I looked at my music and said, "I think the title is too 
far down on the paper", my experience tells me that the solution is to 
change the spacing between the top of the paper and the header block.  
The \paper block has top-margin and top-markup-spacing to adjust for 
this.


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Re: Title Position Off

[Karlin High]

On 1/21/2019 5:30 PM, Reggie wrote:

Nothing is above my title.


Sorry, communication failure. I was thinking that moving the title up 
will quickly reach the top of the page, and there must be something 
about the layout I am not understanding.


How about using annotate-spacing to show the available dimensions that 
can be adjusted? Which one should be changed to get the result you want?




% BEGIN
\version "2.18.2"
  \header { title = "My Title" }
  \paper { annotate-spacing = ##t }
  \score { c4 }
% END

--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

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Re: Title Position Off

[Aaron Hill]

On 2019-01-21 3:02 pm, Reggie wrote:
And actually you are incorrect that command pushes all systems down in 
my

Piece so I literally want just move up the TITLE and not touch anything
else. This is not possible I can't see it yet. Sorry but no. Your raise 
does

not only move title it bothers my music.


If you move the title upwards, then there will be more space between the 
title and the following score.  But space has to come from somewhere.  
Do you want it to come from the space *before* the header?  Then you 
need to subtract that space.  Is there nothing above but the page 
margin?  Then you need to shrink the margins.


-- Aaron Hill

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Re: Title Position Off

[Reggie]

Karlin High wrote
> On 1/21/2019 5:02 PM, Reggie wrote:
>> I literally want just move up the TITLE and not touch anything
>> else.
> 
> Could you attach an image or PDF showing the form of your current 
> layout? I'm curious about what is currently above the title.
> -- 
> Karlin High
> Missouri, USA
> 
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You confuse me. Nothing is above my title. I have a normal Piece of music. I
would like to have my title move UP vertically only but not move my  music
at all. The top system and beyond is just fine.

His raise markup answer does not do that sorry but it's wrong. It moves
music as well somehow. Why can't you just show me in the manual where it
teaches us how to move title TEXT only up or down? No commands I found does
exactly that. You?





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Re: Title Position Off

[Karlin High]

On 1/21/2019 5:02 PM, Reggie wrote:

I literally want just move up the TITLE and not touch anything
else.


Could you attach an image or PDF showing the form of your current 
layout? I'm curious about what is currently above the title.

--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

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Re: Title Position Off

[Reggie]

Kieren MacMillan wrote
> Hi Reggie,
> 
>> How is it possible to simply? move a title of a piece vertical up?
> 
> %%%  SNIPPET BEGINS
> \version "2.19.80"
> 
> \bookpart {
>   \header {
> title = \markup "My Default Title"
>   }
>   \score {
> c''1
>   }
> }
> \bookpart {
>   \header {
> title = \markup \raise #15 "My Higher Title"
>   }
>   \score {
> c''1
>   }
> }%
> %%  SNIPPET ENDS
> 
>> Why is this not possible without custom headers
> 
> It is!  =)
> 
>> it's too complicated
> 
> Really?  ;)
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Kieren.
> 
> 
> Kieren MacMillan, composer
> ‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
> ‣ email: 

> info@

> 
> 
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I kindly ask you to show me anywhere in the Manual that states that is how
to raise the Title of your Piece please? I coule not locate it anywhere. I
thought markup was markup and title was title. Is everything markup?? :))



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Re: Title Position Off

[Reggie]

And actually you are incorrect that command pushes all systems down in my
Piece so I literally want just move up the TITLE and not touch anything
else. This is not possible I can't see it yet. Sorry but no. Your raise does
not only move title it bothers my music.



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Re: Title Position Off

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Reggie,

> How is it possible to simply? move a title of a piece vertical up?

%%%  SNIPPET BEGINS
\version "2.19.80"

\bookpart {
  \header {
title = \markup "My Default Title"
  }
  \score {
c''1
  }
}
\bookpart {
  \header {
title = \markup \raise #15 "My Higher Title"
  }
  \score {
c''1
  }
}%
%%  SNIPPET ENDS

> Why is this not possible without custom headers

It is!  =)

> it's too complicated

Really?  ;)

Hope this helps,
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
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‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Title Position Off

[Reggie]

How is it possible to simply? move a title of a piece vertical up? Without
moving the systems below first or any systems? I don't want to mess up
markup-system-spacing.minimum-distance or
markup-system-spacing.basic-distance or so on. Just move a title up Y offset
something amount without effecting anything else. Why is this not possible
without custom headers it's too complicated :( Can you help me solve this
thank you!!



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